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Should your church have Vacation Bible School? Is it just a way to invite pagans to church? Mike and Steve discuss on today's show.
Welcome to No Compromise Radio, a ministry coming to you from Bethlehem Bible Church in West Boylston. No Compromise Radio is a program dedicated to the ongoing proclamation of Jesus Christ, based on the theme in Galatians 2, verse 5, where the Apostle Paul said, �But we did not yield in subjection to them for even an hour, so that the truth of the gospel would remain with you.
In short, if you like smooth, watered-down words to make you simply feel good, this show isn�t for you. By purpose, we are first biblical, but we can also be controversial. Stay tuned for the next 25 minutes as we�re called by the Divine Trumpet to summon the troops for the honor and glory of her King.
Here�s our host, Pastor Mike Abendroth.
Welcome to No Compromise Radio ministry. My name is Mike Abendroth and with me today for the behind-the-scenes look, pulling back the curtain, the inner workings of No Compromise Radio, Pastor Steve Cooley.
We�re going to give you a complete tour. We�re going to take you behind the curtain, as it were, show you exactly what we do. Steve Ignore the man behind the curtain. Mike Yeah, just if you�ve got your camera set up, your screen, as we project these images to you, just want you to know that that�s our producer back there in the booth.
Got our writers over there in that other room. They�re just busily Steve Sound technicians are over there. Mike Yes, it�s outstanding.
Steve Well, the thing is, I hate to announce it to all you guys on the air. It�s kind of odd and awkward to do that, but you�re all fired. Mike Wow. Steve Everybody but Steve. Mike Ow. Steve Palau. The reason Steve just said that is because I was in Mount Hermon this summer and I went to hear Luis Palau.
Anyway, he didn�t say anything, Steve, that was anti-Christian.
Mike Well, that�s such a relief.
Steve. Yeah, that�s a good way to start that whole deal out. Anyway, he was talking about the second coming, and basically his message was he read John 14, part of it. He read 1 Thessalonians, a part of that, and he read 1 Corinthians, a part of that, and then just talked the rest of the time not about the text.
I thought, what�s Mount Hermon paying him for that? My kids could do it. No study, no preparation, no anything. I�m not saying there�s anything wrong with reading a Bible, Scripture reading, but Scripture reading to me is different than you teach a message.
Mike Well, maybe that�s what was in the contract. Luis, we just want you to read some Scripture. Steve Oh, okay.
So, the Czech Republic has asked me to go do an expository two-day seminar on Ephesians, expositing Ephesians. So, you know what I think I�ll do, Steve? There�s 10 one-hour slots in two days. That�s kind of the European thing.
They�re going to just try to get me for everything that they can. I think I�ll just read the Scripture the whole time, and that�ll help me on my prep time. Mike. That�ll just fill it up.
It�ll take very little prep time. As a matter of fact, you know, maybe we could just memorize a chapter phonetically in Czech.
Steve I wish I knew how to say yes in Czech. I�m thinking about Chekhov or something, but he�s Russian. Mike It�s probably �ja� or �da� or something like that, you know. Steve I think you�re probably right, but I can�t remember.
I have some old Czech crowns. I think croons, croonings, crowns, I don�t know what they have for money, but I think I�ve got some old ones. Mike Croners. Steve Croners. It�s like when Kim and I went to Honolulu once and said, �Well, let�s go out tonight and just see the town.
And so we saw Don Ho the 29th. Oh, Don Ho�s playing. I thought he died like five times. So it was Don Ho the 6th, I think we saw. Mike Wow. Steve Yeah. He was quite the crooner.
Mike. What�s going to happen when they get to Don Ho the 8th? Don Ho the 8th, I am. Steve. Remember the 8th? Yeah, I am. Hermits, Hermits.
Mike Yeah. Steve See, I do know that because I wouldn�t have known it, you would have known it, but I only know it because I saw them free at the boardwalk. And the lead singer, is his name Hermit? Mike No.
Steve Peter Noon. Mike Noon. Yeah. He threw a CD out and my sister, I meant my daughter caught it. Mike Wow. Steve Greatest hits. Mike Wow. Steve Who would know? The other thing I want to talk about, Steve, just off the top of my head.
I listened to a sermon the other day by someone and after the guy said broken and brokenness about seven times in the first 10 minutes, I had to turn it off. Mike I�m just broken. Steve For the broken, this is for all the broken people.
Mike If you�re suffering from brokenness. Steve Because we�re all the lonely people. Mike Yeah.
What is with the America, you know, thing we got going on?
Steve I can�t stand it. Now, do the scriptures teach that God can be a stronghold and a fortress to those who are weak? Does God put together broken, humpty-dumpty kind of people and give them shalom and wellness and wholeness and all sidedness?
I get all that. But it�s this wimpy, namby, pamby, but brokenness. Mike What becomes of the broken hearted? Steve I don�t know what�s the next line of the lyric. I couldn�t stand it. It�s a local guy.
Everybody�s broken. Here�s another sermon to get you through the week.
Tomorrow�s Monday. Mike Who had love that�s now departed. Steve Oh, that�s the next line? Mike Yeah. Steve Steve, I should have known.
I should have known you could do that. It�s almost time for a message moment, but I want to get back to this broken thing. Mike. Okay. Sorry. Steve. How about preach Jesus Christ? And if you want to say people who are weary and heavy laden, Jesus can give them rest.
Rest for their souls. Rest for their conscience. Rest for their bodies. Eternal rest. Sabbath rest. I can get all that, but this, you know, I got to just get you an injection of cortisone spiritually so you can limp around for another week until you come back because everybody�s broken.
Steve, it�s, you know what I think of? I think of the Grinch. All the noise, noise, noise, noise, noise. Give me Jesus. And you know you�re hearing a good sermon when they�re talking about who Jesus is instead of this is for all the broken people.
So, Pete. Well, yeah, I think the only time we should talk about broken is when, you know, we�re over the Lord�s Supper and talking about, you know, the Lord�s body.
Steve If Ted wants to do a linguistical analysis on No Compromise Radio, I hope he doesn�t hear the word broken very much unless we�re talking about our mixer. Mike I�m just broken. Steve This is for broken people and our brokenness in our lives.
And even when they say it, Steve, they sound like some kind of shrink. It�s for broken people and we�re all broken and we all are just so needy. Pete And do you know what a church like that is.
Going to look like? A church like that is, I�m not slamming women, I�m just saying that a church that teaches like that is going to be 75 women in the congregation. Steve Immature women. Pete Yes. Steve Because mature women don�t like that either.
Pete Right.
Steve. It�s immature women. Steve, do you think it�s fair to say that if you are an expositor like a Sproul or a MacArthur Pete Or an Ebendroth. An expositor. Steve. Oh, you know what, thanks for filling in what my mind was thinking.
Pete. That�s why I�m here. Steve. Oh.
All right. Let�s see. What else do we have for a, I�m almost going to call it an angel moment, for a message moment.
All right. Let�s see what. Pete. Are you the messenger for the message? Steve I am.
Pete. Okay. Steve. Now, let�s see. What�s a passage that we�ve been preaching lately?
Pete I don�t know, but can we do something next week out of Fractured Fairy Tales?
Steve. That would be so classic.
Pete. That�s what we need is the sound from that, right? Steve. Do you know what?
Pete Fractured Fairy Tales. Steve That�s a different song. Pete Yes, it is. Steve All right. Tell me something else that�s happening with you. Tell me why they should be coming to the IBS class here.
Pete Oh, well, we�re going to have a class on free will. It�s going to be Dr. Norm Geisler versus Dr. Gene James White. Steve In this corner. Pete That�s exactly right. I�m reading through Chosen But Free by Geisler with his so-called �moderate Calvinism� of view.
Steve Which is no Calvinism at all. Pete Right. I mean, it�s what we would think of as basically one-point Calvinism or four-point Arminianism. The only thing he agrees on is once saved, always saved.
And then we�ll be discussing James White�s excellent book, The Potter�s Freedom. And, you know, I really have been struck, I�ll just quickly say this, I�ve really been struck by just the logic and the reason that Dr. Geisler applies and the lack of Bible that he applies so far.
It�s been disheartening, I think.
Steve Well, that�s pretty much given me no desire to read the Message Bible now. Pete Laughs. Steve All right, what�s on our desk today? All right. How about this, Steve? Steve VBS, Vacation Bible School.
Pete Yep. Steve John Dawson, the Patio Daddy Cook, one of our other stalkers that regularly writes. Pete Also known as listeners.
I mean, we have five listeners out there, you know, on the internet. I think we ought to treat them nicely. Steve I think we just got a couple new ones from Pueblo. Pete. Did we? Steve Laughs. Pete. The Milagro Christian Church, which is neither Milagro nor Christian.
Steve I think Milagro is a Cuban cigar. That�s what I think that is. Pete You know, it might be a brand name, but I think it means something else. I don�t know. Maybe it means like immigrants. That wouldn�t surprise me either.
Steve Uh-oh. Then I have to retract that because I don�t want to get in any way, shape, or form close to that. So, Vacation Bible School, John writes, and he says, �VBS season is upon us. So, by the time this airs, it�ll probably be 2013 vacation time summer, so we can do this.
Is VBS biblical? Is VBS worthwhile? Is VBS just a glorified way of inviting pagans to church, or is it somehow different? I�ll admit that I�m not a fan of VBS, but I know that God can and does work through even the foolishness of VBS.
Pete You know what it means? Steve No. What�s Milagro mean? Pete Miracle. Steve Seriously? Pete Yeah. Miracle. Steve Well, maybe that is a Cuban cigar then. Pete Hmm. Steve Hmm. Okay. Milagro. Okay. Pete It�s a Milagro.
Pete What was that Star Trek episode where they had two different, they had a saying that they couldn�t figure out in the next generation? I don�t know. I�ll have to do that another time. Okay. VBS.
Let�s start with the first one. Steve I can�t wait for that show. Pete Oh, yeah. Is VBS biblical? Steve Is VBS, well, you know, it�s funny that you say that because, you know, the question is often asked, �Is VBS biblical
Pete Answer?
No. I can�t find anything in the Bible about it. I checked even the Coptic translations, couldn�t find anything. I checked the Vulgate, couldn�t find anything. Vacation. Take a vacation from the Bible school.
Steve. The closest thing I can come to really is when Jesus was teaching the disciples because they left their jobs to go on vacation. Pete. Oh, really?
Well, I looked up the word vacation not found in the Bible. I looked up the word biblical not found in the Bible. Steve Vacation is not in the Bible. Pete No, and biblical is not either. Steve Then why do we get vacations?
Pete I have no idea. Steve Okay. Pete Maybe school. Maybe the school of Gamaliel or something. That�s it. There�s Tyrannus. Steve Yeah. Pete School of Tyrannus. Hall of Tyrannus. Yeah. So, that�s easy.
That�s the first one. Vacation Bible school. Steve In a certain way, solo home school is in the Bible. Pete Oh, you know what? That�s actually Latin. So, just watch your P�s and Z�s and your Z�s. Pete Okay.
Is vacation Bible school biblical? So, we wouldn�t say it�s biblical, but it�s not anti-biblical either. Is it sinful to do? Steve No. Pete No. So, okay. Is it worthwhile? Well, if you�re a struggling single mom, you want to have your kid babysat for five days in a row.
Steve That is very worthwhile.
Pete That�s worthwhile to me. Steve Sure. Pete Yeah. Steve I�m not a single struggling mom, but, you know, here�s really the issue. The issue is, is it worthwhile to present an outreach like that to a local community in which kids come in and hear the Bible maybe for the first time?
Is that worthwhile? Pete That�s worthwhile.
Steve I think it�s worthwhile. Pete I think that�s worth any effort. Let�s disclose for full disclosure purposes, Steve. Do we have vacation Bible school here? Steve. Who? Us? Yes, we do. Pete All right.
So, we have a VBS here, and so we think it�s worthwhile or else we wouldn�t put all the manpower hours in it, woman power, humankind power hours. Is that what you�re?
Can I say that here? No compromise? Steve. Mostly woman power, but yeah.
Pete. And actually what we try to do is we try to get as many men as we can, those who have been laid off or something, they don�t have a job, they work at night, because we�d like to have some manpower here as well.
And so, to me, Steve, the issue of vacation Bible school is what is the curriculum and who are the teachers? So, if you have teachers who want to teach the gospel and they know they�re not trying to go for Bible stories, morality, and therapeutic deism, then that would be good.
And then if you have curriculum that�s not the watered down kind of curriculum, we would like that. So, Steve, did you know you can have a curriculum through the mail and you can either get the Protestant or Catholic version of that said curriculum?
Steve. Awesome.
Well, that really speaks to the biblical fidelity of the content.
Pete. It�s usually something fun. I think kids should have fun. It�s usually something with bright colors and some music that the kids sing along with. I think vacation Bible school is great. I think my kids would like to come.
I don�t think my wife minds a little vacation from it. My kids would like to come, and it�s all about what is taught by the teachers and what the curriculum is. Lots of churches that I know, Steve, make up their own curriculum because the prefab stuff from David C. Cook or some other big company, it�s just too watered down.
It�s VeggieTales Part 2.
Steve. Yeah, I mean, you know, you get it from Carrie Underwood, you get what you get. Oh, sorry, she doesn�t do feed, does she?
Pete Well, the one that we used this year, though, is the exception, and I found it quite hard hitting. It�s the Donald Trump VBS because the kids need to make some money and learn how to tithe. Steve You�re fired.
Pete So, here�s a suggestion. Let�s see. Let�s go back to this. Is it biblical? No, but it�s not anti-biblical either. Is it worthwhile? Steve We think so. Pete I think it�s good for our church to be able to ask their friends and neighbors and other people who maybe don�t know the Lord or even they do but go to another church, �Oh, we�re having a vacation Bible school, and we really are focusing on the Bible, we�d like to have you come.
And so then we have, I think it�s a man every time, I could be wrong, that gives the main message that day. So there�s all kinds of like theme things that they have, but it�s the main message of the day, and it�s the gospel message, and Steve, I don�t know if you knew that I did this, but every year I meet with the VBS teachers ahead of time, and then I talk to them for five to ten minutes and tell them that if you don�t preach the gospel, and then I describe what the gospel is and talk about Christ and Him dying for our sins and being raised from the dead and substitutes for the atonement and the response with repentance and faith and all those kind of things, if they don�t teach that to the kids, they�re fired.
Steve Whew! Fired from their volunteer job. That�s rough. Uh huh. Steve Can they get unemployment for that? They can get a pink slip from that. So my point is, using language of, I wouldn�t say it�s hyperbole, but just using intense language.
Well sure, wanting to stress a point. Yes, yes, okay. That this is what the gospel is, make sure they understand it, and then encourage them that this could be life-changing for kids, and Steve, don�t you think an additional benefit for Vacation Bible School would be having church people serve and minister and get to preach the gospel?
Absolutely. I was going to say that because, you know, the place is really, literally a beehive of activity during that week. How would you know? You stay at home that week.
Well, that�s why. Yeah. And actually, actually, I was. We tape shows during that week.
I think I was sick because I was supposed to do the gospel message and I remember just telling Sunita I couldn�t do it on Wednesday morning and going, you know, do you have a backup because I can�t talk.
So, that was bad. That would be bad if you can�t talk. Yeah. They shoot horses, don�t they? Yeah. And that�s basically the position I was in. I mean, it�s like, you know, being an athlete and you can�t run or being a preacher and you can�t talk.
Those things just are not good. Well, I think next year we�ll use the new Vacation Bible School curriculum, the Lolo Jones High Hurdles. Nice!
Yeah. That�ll be great. And Allison Felix 200 meter run and then the Dan Boudica, was that his name? The guy who, the high diver who got saved a couple years ago. Oh, I didn�t know about him. Yeah.
My wife was reading about him. Okay. So, Vacation Bible School in general, if you�ve got the right teachers and you�ve got the right curriculum, my advice is if you buy prefab curriculum, why don�t you buy it from Answers in Genesis?
I think that�s what we end up doing, right? You buy it from Answers in Genesis, at least it�s solid, it�s conservative. I think we did even bump that up a little bit and I�m not necessarily trying to slam Answers in Genesis because I�m not trying to do that, but it�s kind of an intro level stuff.
So, we are a maturing church and we�re not a new church and so I had them torque it up a little bit on the theological acumen stuff, but in general you�re going to be able to trust Answers in Genesis.
That would be my suggestion. Well, and it�s always going to have fun stuff like dinosaurs in it. Who doesn�t like dinosaurs?
Totally. And if Roger�s listening, then I don�t want him to have to email me from Answers in Genesis. I think he probably is listening. All right, let�s see. It says, �Is VBS just a glorified way of inviting pagans to church or is it somehow different
Well, we have VBS for lots of reasons, Steve. One is for our own kids and they can have a little vacation. It is a rough, you know, patch of summer if kids aren�t gone for a long time and they have something to do and you�re there for the morning and I don�t think it�s a glorified way to ask pagans.
I think it�s fine.
A, it�s not glorified at all, but B, it�s not asking them to go to church because it�s not on a Sunday. It�s not a church service. No.
Yeah. No. Is there any reason why we wouldn�t want to have a VBS? It would be sinful if you didn�t?
No, it wouldn�t be sinful. I think the only reason, I think maybe there was a year where we questioned it. I mean, if you can�t. You don�t have the volunteers. Right. If you don�t have the volunteers or if you can�t find a suitable curriculum or you don�t have somebody who has the time to put one together or to modify, you know, one, you know, then you�re just, that�s just the way it is.
I mean, I remember one year they basically had to redo everything and this wasn�t from Answers in Genesis. It was somebody else, but they had to redo the whole thing. Well, that�s a lot of work. So, you know, there�s that and, you know, you need sets and all these kind of things, but it really is a great opportunity for the body to come together.
I mean, we actually don�t have a Sunday night service the Sunday before just so that they could set it all up because it�s a lot of work.
So, well, in general, I like VBS and if you�re a church that you pre-buy, you buy curriculum pre-packaged from, you know, for your Sunday school, then you�re used to that kind of thing. But I�m trying at this church, at least with you, Steve, to not have pre-packaged curriculum when you get in the upper grades.
So, like third grade on up. Even K -2, I don�t think Wes and Stephanie use pre-packaged curriculums. And if they do, it�s some.
Pete. Well, here�s a clue, too. You wouldn�t want to, you know, like go to Sam�s Club or Walmart or something, you know. Oh, look, they�ve got VBS stuff here. Woohoo! You know? And if it�s coming from Salt Lake, that�s a warning.
Steve I won�t tell you who this is because I don�t want to shame me, but I was at the Dallas Seminary Conference at Mount Hermon because it�s the best conference at Mount Hermon. Mount Hermon, sadly, doesn�t have the greatest speakers anymore.
But Dallas Week, you�re going to get at least faithful exposition.
Pete. What about a NOCO conference right there? Steve. That would be great.
I don�t think many people would show up, but maybe. Pete Okay. Steve Maybe the guy up in Sacramento would show up. Maybe Jesus would show up. Pete Sweet. Steve And if Jesus shows up, I�m with it. So anyway, there was a Purpose Driven Life Bible cover on a Bible right there, and I was talking to the main speaker that evening, and he was walking out.
I said, �By the way, you forgot your Bible And he looked down at it. He didn�t really laugh. You would have laughed, but he wouldn�t have laughed. Pete Yeah. I would have laughed. Steve Yeah. It was a message.
The whole week was on eschatology. Now, does that strike you as odd for Dallas Seminary to do an eschatology week?
Pete Not at all. I mean, they could do an eschatology year. I mean, you know, they�d get into all the.
Steve I think they could probably do 70 weeks of eschatology. Pete Oh, no doubt about it. Yeah. No doubt about it. Steve And I think. Pete Go ahead. Pete They�ve got all that stuff wired. Steve And I have to tell our listeners that, you know, just to drop a few names, the guest speaker, the guest singer, rather, was Steve Green.
Pete Hmm. Steve Presbyterian Church of America, going to school at Covent Seminary, the singer. And he and I struck up a friendship, and I went bike riding with Steve Green.
Pete. He�s one of my top favorite tenors. My favorite one is Jerry Rag.
Steve And it was an amazing thing because when we were riding up these steep, you know, 15 inclines in the Santa Cruz Mountains, Steve�s voice as he sang in the mountains, it got higher. Pete Almost like a yodel.
Steve Yeah. He was, I actually, I should have recorded it, but I couldn�t get my iPhone out because of the ascent.
But he was actually yodeling. Pete. And eventually, he sounded a little bit like John Denver.
Steve. How did John Denver die?
Pete. A plane crash, experimental plane. They said he shouldn�t have died, but he did.
Steve Wow. Pete I guess he was also an alcoholic. Steve William Tyndale said, �I call God to record against the day we shall appear before our Lord Jesus, to give a reckoning of our doings, that I never altered one syllable of God�s word against my conscience, nor would this day, if all that is in the earth, whether it be pleasure, honor, or riches, might be given me.
In other words, pastors, Tyndale exhorted them by telling, exhorted you by giving a story about him. He didn�t utter one syllable that went against the word of God, and he studied, and I thought that�s a good charge for pastors who talk about brokenness.
Pete Not one syllable. Steve That�s pretty amazing, isn�t it? Not one single syllable. That�s good. Steve�s going to sneeze. Banner of Truth, I get that magazine. People probably want to know what good magazines we get.
We get Christianity Today.
Pete. Which is not necessarily good.
Steve On the credit side, on the debit side. Pete It would be my favorite thing, really good literature with pictures. Steve That�d be awesome. Pete Like USA Today, but it�s a Christian version. Do you get World still?
Steve No. Pete No.
Does that even exist anymore? Steve. Yeah, I think it does. Pete. Barely by the skin of my teeth. Steve. I just thought if I was going to get, you know, political stuff, I might as well, you know, really get good political stuff.
Pete. The Christian Science Monitor came to my door the other day. It was a neighbor�s, but I read it anyway. It didn�t seem too good.
And did it say, �Don�t go to your doctor� on the top of it? Steve. Don�t go to your doctor. Now, how�s your health been, Steve? Steve. It�s been, you know, pretty good. I have no major complaints. Just, you know, the typical aches and pains that come along with being a grandfather, you know.
Pete. All right.
So here�s what we�re going to do. This is coming into our fourth season at No Compromise Radio. So if you want us to be on this radio station, 760 VNE, EWVNE, why don�t you write to them? You thought I was going to say, �Send us money didn�t you?
Steve Well, I was hoping. Pete Yeah, but. As we say, we have a philosophy around here, we don�t ask for money and we don�t get it. So no, I�m not asking for money. What you should do is just email them and say, you know, �We�re glad that No Compromise Radio is on.
I think the show that we took over three years ago was a finance show. Steve Was it? Pete Yeah. So how does that go together? We don�t beg for money, but we took over the finance show.
Steve. That�s pretty ironic, I think.
When I first started, people would call up and they�d say to VNE, �We want that finance show back.
Pete. We really missed the finance show.
Steve Anything coming up in the future, Steve, that we should know about? Conferences? Carl Truman? Pete Yeah, going to have him this fall. Steve September 14th, Carl Truman here at Bethlehem Bible Church.
Pete Which is just amazing. Steve We�ve been trying to fill time for like.
Five minutes, haven�t we? Pete. Not really, no. Pete. This is what you call dead air, ladies and gentlemen. Steve Info at No Compromise Radio.
Pete Mike at NoCompromiseRadio .com. No Compromise Radio with Pastor Mike Abendroth is a production of Bethlehem Bible Church in West Boylston. Bethlehem Bible Church is a Bible teaching church firmly committed to unleashing the life-transforming power of God�s Word through verse-by-verse exposition of the sacred text.
Please come and join us. Our service times are Sunday morning at 1015 and in the evening at 6. We�re right on Route 110 in West Boylston. You can check us out online at bbchurch .org or by phone at 508 -835 -3400.
The thoughts and opinions expressed on No Compromise Radio do not necessarily reflect those of WVNE, its staff or management.