Season 5 Is Here!

Welcome to Have You Not Read, a podcast seeking to answer questions from the text of Scripture for the honor of Christ and the edification of the

Saints. Before we dig into our topic, we humbly ask you to rate, review, and share the podcast.

Thank you. I'm Dylan Hamilton. And with me are Michael Durham, Chris Giesler, Andrew Hudson, David Kasson.

We are happy to be back after a summer break. Oh yeah, and we will be starting this season by first letting you know what we did with our summers, what we did with ourselves, what we thought about it, some of the stuff we did, read, how we grew, and then we'll be answering a question at the end of this podcast.

But we'll go ahead and start with you, Michael. What did you do this summer? I'm trying to remember. It went by really fast.

No, I really enjoyed hanging out with my family. We have a pool that we, you know, put up and then put down.

So I spent a lot of time cleaning the pool and playing with my family. And my youngest is now three years old, so he had a blast with that.

And we rejoiced in my oldest son starting his full -time job as an electrician and helping him with that transition and just kind of seeing him grow into that.

So we were very thankful for that. Just recently teaching my second -born to drive.

So we're doing driving lessons after a summer of finishing up the written side of driver's ed.

So just keeping up with my children who are all getting older and have changing needs and rejoicing in being a father.

My wife and I are just very thankful to the Lord every day for the for the blessings that we have in our family and the way that he has continued to answer prayer and lead us along.

So it's been it's been good. It's been a good summer. It kind of went by rather fast, but I thoroughly enjoyed it.

I was I was ready for the heat. I was actually looking forward to it. An Oklahoma blistering summer.

We did not get that. We got a cold rainy June and a very mild summer. So it was interesting.

Yeah, if you wonder what winter is gonna be like. Yeah, all the old -timers around here are saying it's gonna be really bad.

Yeah, so this one's this summer's been kind of crazy.

I'm just a lot of family stuff going on. A lot of different events. Some good, some bad.

Started beekeeping. So that's pretty fun. Really enjoying that. Hoping to expand the hives.

Get some more in different places. And renamed my house Blue Cheese because it has mold in it.

So working on that. And yeah, it's been very busy. And our oldest daughter got her first cell phone.

So that's been a challenge in itself and trying to figure out how to lock it down, keep her safe, do all that kind of stuff.

And then just to have the the fun of getting a text from her in the middle of the day saying

I miss you or here's a funny cat picture or whatever it is. Different stuff. So it's fun to see her personality just in the home but then how she communicates in written form.

What she finds humorous. So that that's been really fun to see that happen. And then she's communicating with grandparents and stuff like that.

So those relationships are getting stronger. And then the challenges that brings with the oldest having a phone and the younger's not.

And how to work through those things. But Sam's getting bigger. He's a full -on boy.

Just wants to headbutt everything. And so I'm loving it. It's great. Yeah so I had an online college course that I did.

Which meant I could basically do it from anywhere. And during the time over the summer, my family took an opportunity to go down to Panama City, Florida.

Specifically Tindal Air Force Base. We had not been there since the hurricane that came through.

And it is still evident that this place is recovering.

It was a good time being there. Got to go to the beach. Four out of the five days we were there.

So it was great. Thank the Lord for that opportunity. We also did this because my daughter, my eldest daughter, she's turning 16.

And her pops gave her slash our family. Her Mimi who's passed away.

Her old car. And so we took a detour from Oklahoma to Florida to drive up to the

Nashville area. And spent about a week there. Took the car and now we had two vehicles driving.

Emily and Juan and myself and my daughter, my eldest daughter and the other. And so we took this 2000 -ish era

Saab and drove it from Nashville area to Oklahoma City.

And so it was quite the journey. I thank the Lord that he, you know, preserved this vehicle.

And all of us together to be able to get back to Oklahoma City. And now I'm driving it to make sure that it's good to give to her.

She has been practicing. I know all about this teaching how to drive. What a strange thing it feels like that I'm recalling what it was like for me to learn how to drive.

And here I am sitting in the passenger seat. My how our lives go by. But it's been beautiful.

And I thank the Lord for what he was able to give us this summer. Well I am,

I'm really glad to be back in the studio with you guys. I have missed this.

The summer is always a busy, busy time for me.

It is, I think, you know, in the in the travel industry when most people are on vacation, you know, it's summertime and then of course on the holidays,

I think that's when we make like 70 % of our revenue. So it's, you can imagine, it is a busy, busy time from about the middle of May to about the third week in August.

So I was incredibly busy. But in the end of April, beginning of May, my daughter graduated from high school.

I'm incredibly proud of her. And she graduated from home school. And it was a home school co -op, but they actually had a full graduation ceremony.

And my wife's side of the family was able to come, including our, her aunt, thankful for.

And my side of the family, that was an interesting dynamic to say the least, knowing that my side of the family does not know, understand, appreciate or agree with our, our stand on many issues.

But they were proud of her. And Elizabeth got her first job, you know, her first full -time job in W -2.

And I was explaining taxes to her. And she now understands why I complain about them so much. And it's just, we were working at Taco Bell over the, over the summer.

And I said, all right, now that you finished up your job at Taco Bell and you're heading off to college, how nice are you going to be to fast food workers from now on?

She said, Oh, very nice. Very, very nice. It's like, okay, they work hard. There are people that do that job six days a week, 12 hours a day to feed their families.

So you'd be nice to them. They're working hard. And then we, we caravanned in our, in two cars, my, the car that my daughter has, and then our family, family, family van, the family truckster.

And we caravanned those out to Lynchburg, Virginia. So Elizabeth could start her freshman year at Liberty.

And we were able to have a number of really good conversations. There are aspects of that school, the church that she's going to be going to that are different from most of the people at this table and, and just the way that I raised her.

And we were able to have very adult conversations, everything from hermeneutics to unvoiced assumptions.

And although I have disagreements perhaps with my father -in -law and the church that he serves in,

I am incredibly grateful for that group of believers there, especially, especially the older crowd.

They love her. They, they, she has spent summers with them. They, they were so excited to hear that she was going to be coming and going to Liberty, and they were just ecstatic.

So she had this group of older people that just love her, want her there.

And she has this, this, this church family that will, will be there for her. And that's, that was really very important to us.

She is thriving and we're, we're very happy. My wife and I were able to take a very scenic drive back.

We spent some time in Pigeon Forge, Gatlinburg area. We did go to Dolly Parton's Stampede, which

I highly recommend. It is fantastic. It's so much fun. Just Americana and watching, we watched this, this girl ride, ride two horses, you know, stand on two horses and jump through a, a flaming hoop of fire.

It was just fantastic. It was, it was great. And then we, we didn't kind of want the, the, the trip to end.

So we stopped in Eufaula, Lake Eufaula, just like, it's less than an hour away.

And so we, we, we spent one more night just on the road cause we, we enjoyed the time. So it was just a, it was, it was a, it was a busy summer and I was able to take some time off, but that of course, front loaded

September. So that's, that's the cost, but it was, it was, it was a good summer, very productive and just proud of the work that my, my daughter has done and that she's continuing to do the first year as a nursing student.

Well, I'm thankful to hear everybody's summers have gone well and there's been ups and downs just like for me and everyone else around the table.

We have done a lot of adding to our household this summer. We've had kittens come in, we've had ducks come in, we've had chickens come in.

And then we're also pregnant with our fifth, another little boy that is coming in January sometime.

So we've done a lot of adding around our house. I've bought tons of books that I haven't got to crack yet.

And they're just stacking up on the other books that I haven't got to crack yet, but they're gonna, they're, they're there for a reason. They're going to be opened up when

I'm not working as often as I am, but we're, we've been asking for less busy times, less time away and more money in.

That's the magic formula, right? Trying to, trying to add time to your life and do it without losing loads of, loads of liquidity in the bank.

So that's what we're, we've really been asking the Lord for through this season because we've just been stretched to the limit on at least the time.

So we've been really working hard and hustling and our boys have watched us and grown and done the same thing.

And our little Meadow is now walking and enjoying her mobility and ability to get into cabinets with her older brother,

Charles. She could, she would live in there if she could, and Charles would lock her in there if he could.

So they really are a perfect team when it comes to getting stuff out of the cabinets and causing mayhem, but it's been working out really well.

I'm very appreciative. I know, I know I'm glad to be back in here, but I'm also appreciative for the breaks that we have too, because, you know, we spend two to three hours here and I know it's not many nights per month or a week, but that kind of stacks up when you're already away from the house quite a long time working.

So I'm, I'm thankful for the breaks, but I am glad to be back with you all here and to be answering the questions that are sent in to us and hopefully we're, we're going to continue to do a good job.

So we'll go ahead and get into that question asking since I wrapped up my portion there and if I can find it, here it is.

Question sent in to us and it's tangential to a lot of the other questions that we've been sent this summer.

So we're going to try as best we can to wrap in some of the points or questions from all the other questions that sort of pertain to this tangentially.

But we're going to ask this specific one because we think it addresses an argument that is current, especially within the

Southern Baptist Convention, the arguments going on there. But we, we would also like to touch upon those other things that other questioners have sent in to us over the summer.

So the question reads, why should women not be pastors? I'm very conflicted about this issue.

I've heard distinctions made between elders and pastors and was wondering if this had something to do with the topic.

Michael, you want to start us off? Yeah. Okay. So this question is asked a lot, has been asked for a lot of different folks, especially if you're a part of a denomination or a church movement that begins to incorporate more and more women in official positions of leadership in the church, either as teachers or deacons or pastors, elders, and so forth.

And the question comes, well, what does the Bible have to say about that? How are we to understand, is this good?

Is this bad? Obviously, these women love Jesus, and they're trying to do these things out of a very heartfelt desire to honor the

Lord. I went to a, my undergraduate was with a

Christian university where they were actively training women to become pastors. And so my homiletics course, there were women in the group getting up and practicing preaching, you know, alongside the guys.

And I roomed with a man who, he was engaged to a woman who was going into the ministry.

She was going to go, you know, pastor a church somewhere. One of my best friends there, she went off to become a staff pastor somewhere.

So I've thought a lot about that question. And one of the things that is encouraging is when we read the scriptures, we are given a lot of clarity as to the answer.

We're not left in doubt. We don't have to wring our hands at all. We can rest in the,

I think, the obvious and clear answer from the Word of God. So a couple of places to think about.

Now, we're just going to think, first of all, about women being a pastor or an elder, the idea of them having not just a title, but the role in which they are instructing men using the

Word of God, bringing the authority of the Word of God upon the lives of men in the church.

Is that something that they should do or anything that looks like it? Right. So, 1

Timothy chapter 2, in verse 8, Paul says,

I desire, therefore, that the men pray everywhere, lifting up holy hands without wrath and doubting, in like manner also that the women adorn themselves in modest apparel with propriety and moderation, not with braided hair or gold or pearls or costly clothing, but which is proper for women professing godliness with good works.

Verse 11 says, Let a woman learn in silence with all submission, and I do not permit a woman to teach or have authority over a man, but to be in silence.

Now, this verses 11 and 12 there in 1 Timothy 2, the same sentiments, the same idea is going to be repeated in 1

Corinthians 14. The reasoning of what's said in 1 Corinthians 14 is based on something that Paul says in 1

Corinthians 11. And the reasoning that he says this in 1 Timothy 2, verses 11 and 12, is given next in verses 13 through 15.

So, let's listen to that. So, here's his reasoning. Here's why he says what he says. Verse 13, For Adam was formed first, then

Eve. So, this is the order of creation. Paul sees a hierarchy in creation based on who was formed first.

So, what you'll notice is the more likely... So, the more often your denomination or your church has women in pastoral leadership, having authority over a man, doing the roles of ministry that the

Bible sets aside for men, the more likely your church is pretty weak on the doctrine of creation.

There's a general correlation. I'm not saying it's an exact correlation, but there's a general correlation of churches that are set...

Well, we just agree to disagree about your take on Genesis 1 and 2, or Genesis 1 through 11, the early chapters of the

Bible. For some people, it's just symbol, it's myth, and it's meaningful, but it's not historical.

And then other people think it's historical, and we just agree to disagree about that. Chances are, if you belong to a denomination or a church or group like that, they're more likely to have women in leadership.

One of the reasons why it's very practical, Paul is grounding the sense of roles with men and women in the church in the historicity of creation.

Further, he says, verse 14, and here's another reason, Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived fell into transgression.

Nevertheless, she will be saved in childbearing if they continue in faith, love, and holiness with self -control.

So, yes. Quick clarification on when it says authority in verse 11, isn't the word there a little bit different than when

Christ says, by what authority do you think I do these things? In what way?

That one's like, the one I've had pull up, it said, to usurp authority, as if the man's authority was a given.

Yeah. It has the idea of autonomy. Okay. So, it has the idea of, it's combining the idea of autos with another idea of,

I'm gonna work this myself. It has the idea of, I'm gonna do this myself. Thank you very much. I'm not gonna let you do it. I'm gonna do it.

So, the, and that's in verse, yeah, that's verse 12. So, the second reason is,

Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived. Now, again, this is back to the historicity of Genesis. Okay.

What happened and how did it happen? Okay. Remember that God, in the course of the scriptures, puts the blame on who for the fall of humanity into sin.

Who gets the blame? Adam gets the blame. Whereas, when we read the historical account of what happened in Genesis, Eve is tempted by the serpent and then she sins, but then she gives the fruit to her husband who was with her and he ate also.

And so, there's a responsibility that Adam bears being formed first.

There's something innate in the created order where Adam is bearing responsibility for his wife that the buck stopped with Adam, not with Eve.

And because of that, because of that hierarchy that is intentional in creation, that this same kind of creational relationship should be honored.

This kind of dynamic should be honored within Christ's church. And some of the practical reasons for that we're gonna see in Corinthians.

But when it says, nevertheless, she will be saved in childbearing if they continue in faith, love, and holiness with self -control, what's the concern?

The concern is, well, if she was deceived by the serpent and brought all this terrible thing, then what good is a woman?

And for a lot of people, yeah, what good is a woman? Like the image of woman is marred.

Yeah. She's the one that brought sin into the world. It's the way it is because of her. Right. So someone's gonna be like, well, isn't woman a big problem then?

And I would say that the only people that hate women more than misogynists are feminists.

And part of that is because they resent with a capital R the idea that God created women for a particular purpose that is full of nurturing and full of life -giving relationships.

So when it says she will be saved in childbearing, that's not talking about your sins are forgiven and you're going to heaven saved.

Paul uses the term saved in more than one way. This is how do you preserve womanhood?

How is womanhood going to be cherished and preserved and not be lost? Well, like Doug Wilson said the other day, women are the kind of people that other people come out of trying to get humorously at the point that women are different than men.

He's pretty good at that humor bit. So when we see this passage in 1

Timothy 2, there's not any confusion at all. It's not Paul saying women should learn in silence and with all submission in the church.

He's not saying that because that's a popular thing for him to say. He's not saying it because it reflects the times in which he lives.

He's saying that because it's based out of creation's design and because of the historicity of Genesis, what happened, how it came about.

So to underscore this, as soon as we get that clarified about who's supposed to have authority in the church, we get into 1

Timothy 3, which again, Paul's not writing with chapters and verses here. He's just continuing the flow of thought.

Then we have a description of, if a man desires the position of a bishop, he desires a good work.

Then there's descriptions about the idea of an overseer, an episkopos, an overseer, which is used as a synonym in the same idea as presbyteros, which is an elder, and with the same kind of synonym of to pastor.

There are passages in the New Testament that blend all of these together, and there's no distinction between them.

An overseer is an elder is a pastor. So if a church says elder so -and -so and elder so -and -so, biblically speaking, based on the context of all these passages in the

New Testament, it's the same thing as saying pastor. It's the same thing as saying bishop or overseer. There's no distinction between those.

So talking about if a man desires the position of a bishop, well, then he should be the husband of one wife, so on and so forth.

Then the same things with deacons, talking about deacons and then their wives.

So it matters how men lead their families.

So we see the qualifications for elders and deacons, and then we see those same types of dynamics given to us in Titus.

So before we go to Corinthians, what are your all's thoughts about the question, especially concerning how we understand this, women in ministry, elders, deacons?

JS I thought it was interesting when you talked about that women are saved through childbearing. One of the other questions was something about why do you not let women speak?

Is this just your way to keep them silent? And I thought how interesting that they think that the only way to have a voice is to be a man.

And the things they have them do is, when they'll have children, you need to go out and climb the ladder, you need to have this position, you need to have a speaking role, you need to be in charge, that that's what it means to have a voice.

And that's not the case. When we talk about Titus, and he tells older women to teach younger women, and the things that the older women are supposed to teach are geared towards a particular thing in the home.

And so, as an example, my wife and I are going through some difficult things with our house right now, but she's not silent.

I rely on her to know how the kids are doing. I need her input to know how to best guide and love my children and direct them.

She's not seeking those things. Some of it is that they don't want those positions.

There's a certain type of mindset that seeks after that authority.

Authority comes from God, and it's delineated, and it's given for certain roles. And she's not seeking that role.

She's happy to play her role, and I'm happy to play mine, because of what God has given to us in his word.

Yeah, we definitely rely on our... As a husband and as a father, I am absolutely in need of my wife's voice.

I need to hear from her. I need to see how she's doing. I want to hear how the kids are doing. I need that very much. And even if we disagree,

I still need to hear what she has to say. But this is not to say that no one's in charge, okay?

One of the challenges we have in our current cultural context is that those who value power above all will then interpret anybody who has more power than me as, that's a problem, that's wrong.

And that if somebody has more power than somebody else, that there's something wrong here. And if the

Bible is instructing us and saying that there's a hierarchy, that husbands have authority over their wives, that in the course of a church, that there's supposed to be male leadership in the church, and that the women are to rely on their husbands and submit to their husbands, that there's something fundamentally wrong here.

Why would somebody think that that was fundamentally wrong? It's because they value power above all. You just hit on it.

The same people who would say that willing subjection equals inferior are the same people who would say that Christ is not

God incarnate. How could he be subject willingly to the father and yet be equal?

These are things that bear upon each other. Yes, they do. They absolutely do.

And we are told in 1 Peter 3 that husbands are to dwell with their wives with understanding, giving honor to the wife as to the weaker vessel.

Now, someone who hears that says, well, the Bible's demeaning women. Only if power is your prime value.

The Bible does not demean women by acknowledging that they're different than men, that they're the weaker vessel, and by telling husbands to honor their wives, remembering who they are, live with them in an understanding way, because you're co -heirs in the grace of life, that your prayers may not be hindered.

Love your wife in the proper understanding way, because she is different than you. But somebody hears, well, women are to keep silent in the church or submit to their husbands and that they're weaker.

If you hear the Bible demeaning women in all those statements, then your value system, the presuppositions of your value system don't match with God's value system.

And that's what has to be addressed first. Michael, you had touched on it.

Would you go into a little bit more in the passage in 2

Timothy, specifically 1 9, excuse me, 1 Timothy 1 15, it talks about saved through childbirth.

That is the same word, the Greek word sozo, it's still the same word that Paul uses in 2

Timothy 1 9, where he says, you know, God saved us and called us to a holy calling. Saved.

Cursory, you know, Google search to say that there's multiple meanings to this word when

Paul is saying that a woman is saved through childbirth.

In what sense? The healing, the made whole, because he's referencing this fall that Eve was deceived and Adam, who bears the brunt of it as the man, because that is his role.

He is provider and protector and leader. The buck stops with him. So he is the one ultimately responsible.

But how, in what sense is a woman saved through childbirth in reference to Eve, if we're keeping it in the local context that Paul has here?

Yeah. So one thing, I read through all of Paul's letters, every instance where he used the term save.

So I've read through all of that, his use of sozo. Okay. Half the time, it's very clearly, he's talking about born again, sins forgiven, filled with the

Holy Spirit, eternal life. It's very clear. And Paul loves to talk about that salvation. The other half of the time,

I would say a quarter of that. So one quarter of the time he uses the term, you could probably go either way.

You're not quite sure. A case could be made. But then another 25 % of the time, he's just talking about being delivered out of a bad situation, like from shipwreck.

When Paul talked about being saved from shipwreck, he wasn't talking about his sins being forgiven. Okay. So in this context, what does it mean?

And there's been a variety of interpretations on it. One of the main ones is, okay, because it's talking about Eve, ultimately because of the promise of Genesis 3 .15,

we see that salvation comes by the birth of the promised one, the seed.

I find this compelling because, of course, we love that truth, but I don't see how it actually fits with what

Paul was saying exactly there. It seems really loose. A little bit later on in 1 Timothy chapter 4, when he's writing to Timothy, he says in verse 16, take heed to yourself and to the doctrine.

Okay. Continue in them for in doing this, you will save both yourself and those who hear you.

Now, does that mean that we save ourselves by having real, pure, careful doctrine?

Is that what Paul is saying? Is he meaning that our sins are forgiven, our station in heaven is secured by our having really pure doctrine and that we save others?

As a pastor, as I'm preaching, as I'm teaching, I make sure others go to heaven by my ability to make sure that they have really clear doctrine, if I can catechize them well, so on and so forth.

Is that what he means by that? I don't think that's what he means by that, given the context, his concern that many make a shipwreck of their ministries, of their lives, and so on, because they've got bad doctrine.

You know what? Bad doctrine ruins lives. Bad doctrine ruins lives, and people end up in horrible situations.

And so, having sound doctrine, having good doctrine actually gets a lot of people out of a to Timothy about being a pastor.

So, likewise, in this context, in 1 Timothy 2, what does it mean that, nevertheless, she, who's the she?

Verse 13 says, for Adam was formed first, then Eve. Eve. Here's Adam, big figurehead, all -mankind.

Here's Eve. Why did Adam name her Eve? She brought forth.

She's the mother of all the living. That's why she was named Eve, and it's a very honorable name.

And so, she's the mother of all the living. Mother. Then, verse 14, Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived fell into transgression.

So, we're thinking of the woman. We're thinking of manhood and womanhood. What are the roles of manhood and womanhood in the church?

What does that look like? So, that's what he's talking about. We're talking about these big icons,

Adam, Eve, man, woman. Nevertheless, she, meaning who? Woman. The whole archetype, woman.

Womanhood. How is womanhood preserved? In childbearing. As she continues in faith, love, and holiness with self -control, this is what womanhood is to look like.

This is God's plan for women whom he has made in his image, that this brings glory to him. This is a good thing.

How many times do we need to reiterate in every generation that it's a good thing that God made women to be women, and that they're not the same thing as a man?

That's a good thing. It makes me think, like, in the culture we're talking about, and there's this feminism, and men and women are equal.

Okay, that's not even defined. Like, what do you mean by equal and all of that? But by childbearing, our culture is very much against the role that women should be playing according to the

Bible. But then, when you look at the people that embrace that or what's coming up out of that, that the men honor them, because that role, like, half of the human race can't produce babies.

We just can't. We can't do that. It's not physically possible. And it's like, you can do that?

Yeah, you do that. I'm going to make money. I'm going to go provide for these children. You do this amazing thing that I can't do.

Let's make that agreement. We'll call it marriage or something. I don't know. Well, and originally, how did

God design it? All of human society was captured by this vision of marriage. God made

Adam, and then he made Eve, stand out, stand along, made her from his very own flesh and blood, brought her to the man.

For this reason, a man shall leave his father and his mother and be joined to his wife, and the two shall become one flesh. All of human society is understood within the context of that original marriage.

And if we don't understand what marriage is about, the fact that there's hierarchy, that there's roles, that there's differences, and it's good, it's a partnership for it to be fruitful and multiply and fill the earth, if we don't wrap our heads around this being glorifying to God, then we're going to have unhealthy human society, unhealthy life, bad families, bad communities, bad nations, all the way down the line.

To the degree that we dishonor God's design for men and women, and to the degree we dishonor marriage, the worse everything gets.

And when we're looking at how the dynamic of marriage relates to everything in life, the way that the woman relates to the man, and the way that the man is to relate to the woman, and how they're to raise family together, that this is

God's basic plan, that we're to honor and call it good. Are there exceptions to that?

Yes. There's sin, there's problems, there's tragedies, things don't work out. We can look at all of the exceptions, but that doesn't change the rule.

And there are exceptions because of what the rule is, what the norm is. We should celebrate the norm of marriage and family, because that's the way

God made the world and called it very good. And so, that has an impact on how we do church.

And so, what does that look like? If there are roles in a marriage, and there are, and the wife is to submit to her husband, then what does that look like in the life of a church?

Okay. Well, proper order is called for. Now, this is where...

So, 1 Timothy 2 talks about women are to learn in silence. And the person, one of the folks that put a question is like, is this what you're doing to keep the women silent in your church?

Yes. I would say, first of all, we're being...

Well, let's look what the text says. I want to encourage women to follow Christ in our church, and what does

Christ want them to do? Well, as a church, which is the bride of Christ, we want to be submissive to Christ and what he says.

So, what does he say? That's what we're going to do. Yes. So, if he says in his word, this is how you do it.

The men are protecting out front, they're leading, they're the ones teaching, and women do not have authority over men.

Older women teach younger women. We're going to be submissive in our posture towards Christ and do that.

It's not a power struggle. It's not a seeking after that. It's a, we want to be faithful in our role, in our relationship with Christ.

I'm glad he mentioned the power issue, though, because that is really at the base of all this, and that you also, going back to the original question, the questioner said,

I'm confused about this. And we talked a little bit off mic about, well, some people struggle with the

Greek between elders and shepherds or pastors. And I'm glad you brought in the

Greek as those things being synonyms, because that is what brings up a lot of confusion to people who have not even come across this.

But the power, seeking after power, seeking to usurp the authority, that is kind of the root of the cultural issues that we have, right?

Like we can say, all our cultural issues are feminism, all the isms that have come about.

But really, they're just another way to usurp some sort of authority. I thought of this verse, and I don't know if you guys in reading this take it to mean this.

In Genesis 3, right after the fall, what he says to Eve, he says to the woman, he says,

I will make your pains in childbearing very severe. With painful labor, you'll give birth to children.

Your desire will be for your husband, but he will rule over you. I've taken that to mean your desire will be for your husband's position, for his authority, but he will rule over you.

There'll be some animosity in that relationship. The hierarchy there is strained because of the fall.

Yes. So, your desire will be for your husband, he shall rule over you. The very same turn of phrases used in Genesis 4, when

God said, warned Cain, said that sin is crouching at the door and his desire is for you, but you must master it. Okay, so it's the same dynamic.

There's a sense in which the temptation, the continual recurring temptation of the woman will be to usurp the position of her husband, but in a larger sense, women will say,

I want to be a man. Now, I don't see anything given our society and the trajectory of the last 100 or so years that disproves that.

Everything has been going towards, well, we need to be just like men, valued the same way as men, treated just like men, have all the same, and why is that?

Is that something that is good and honorable, or is that something that was problematic and is nothing new, because we see it all the way back in Genesis chapter 3?

And so, that is the challenge, is to say, okay, well, why is there a concern?

Why is there a concern? Why is there a problem? Oh, we look around and we see that your podcast is all male, all men.

We see that you don't let women get up and teach on Wednesday nights, Sunday nights. You don't let women teach the mixed

Sunday school classes. You don't have women up in your pulpit, not even on a Mother's Day. We don't let mothers baptize their children, even in the baptistry, and give a short message from the waters.

It's all men, men, men, men, and what is the natural assumption given our cultural context that that's a problem, that that's bad, that shows it's unhealthy, that's a dangerous place for women to be, it's toxic, don't go there, that's a big problem.

But the values that are informing that and saying that's all red flags, it's all bad, where did you get that idea?

Did you get that from the scriptures? And there are some, well, we're all made in the image of God. Yes, we are.

And what does God have to say about that? That is not a broad notion you can just fill in, wash over everything.

The problem is the image of God is something very specific, full of rich detail, and it's not something you can just say and then stuff in there, whatever you want it to mean.

With liberalism. And enchant it with Marxism. You're bringing up the idea of value, like what we value.

So you listed off all the things and the men. So then they see that's what's valuable.

That must be the valuable thing, so we need to be there. Versus the verse that you mentioned is we are to honor lives as the weaker vessel.

Now, this idea of value, and this is something that I've heard it put, but I've got a teapot and I've got a cast iron skillet.

The teapot is weaker. Does that mean it's less valuable? No. But am I going to take the teapot on a hiking trip up in the mountains or do

I need a skillet for cooking? What am I doing with it? It depends on the context.

Am I serving tea? Then I want the china, the tea set. But it's weaker, but that has nothing to do with the value.

That's a different category. Yeah, I agree. It's interesting, the Genesis story, you see

Adam's response. He says, the woman you gave me,

Adam's blaming his wife? No. Adam's blaming God. He has left his authority, he has abdicated his authority, and isn't it understandable, even predictable, that if men abdicate their authority, then someone's going to fill it.

And who's going to fill it? Well, in this case, Eve was being autonomous. If you're not going to be filling your role, then

I'm going to do it. In Isaiah 3, 12, he says, as for my people, children are their oppressors and women rule over them.

Oh, my people, those who lead you cause you to err and destroy the way of your paths. And this is, when it uses the word err there, and I think it says

Adam wasn't deceived, Eve was deceived. And when men abdicate their positions of authority, typically, they're not deceived.

It's just their sin. They're seeking after something they shouldn't willfully. But when women assume those positions, it's easy for them to be manipulated and deceived into doing things.

So, when we come to 1 Corinthians 14, I want to also backfill this with 1 Corinthians 11, just to give a practical look in terms of proper order in the church.

Why does it matter that in the home, there is hierarchy that the woman is to submit to the man, and the man is to love his wife as Christ loved the church, and she's to respect her husband and all things?

Okay, fine. There's this dynamic in the home, and a lot of people affirm this by using words, they're not looking for pure equality, but the fact that we're made differently, that we have each a role and we both contribute in our way, but there's still a hierarchy.

There's somebody leading and somebody following. But they don't see how that translates to the life of the church.

And for a lot of people, they think, well, every distinction that you have, everything that makes you who you are in Christ should be parked at the door when you come into the church, and there should be no idea at all that we're from any kind of different culture.

We should have some sort of multiculturalism, pluralism, where everybody should be thought of as exactly the same, and it even comes down to male and female, and anything else would be denying who we are in Christ.

Well, we've gone through those passages in Galatians in Sunday school, and it's not talking about eliminating our creational differences, but eclipsing all of our things that could divide us in the glory of Christ and we unite in Christ.

But that doesn't mean we get rid of who we're made... That glorifies Christ that he saves men and women. It glorifies

Christ that he saves people from all the different tribes and dialects. That brings him glory. In 1

Corinthians 14, Paul is laboring for order in the Corinthian church. He doesn't want confusion.

In fact, he says in verse 33 of 1 Corinthians 14, God is not the author of confusion, but of peace, as in all the churches of the saints.

He's just explained that at this time, Corinth, Two -Port City, all kinds of people coming in there, if somebody is speaking in a language that they never learned before by the power of the

Spirit, speaking in a language that they did not themselves know and several other people there didn't know, someone needs to be there to translate so that the whole church is edified.

And the unbelievers seeing that as a sign, they're edified too. They're like, oh, wow, the Holy Spirit has empowered this person to preach in a language, in the heart language of somebody else.

They could hear the gospel in their heart language, just like Pentecost. Exact same thing. But also, what about those who prophesy?

What about those who proclaim the truth of God? Well, verse 32 says the spirits of the prophets are subject to the prophets, meaning what?

Very similar to what James says, do not let many of you be teachers because you're doubly accountable.

Anything that I say, I preach and teach, somebody comes up to me with the Word of God in hand or memorized or whatever, or just alluded to, and they say,

I don't think that was right. I think you're off here. I don't understand this. If you said this over here, then what about this over here in the

Bible? That's right. That's proper. That is absolutely the way it needs to go down.

If I got it wrong, if I said something wrong, or if somebody, maybe I didn't, but I wasn't clear, or they just need to learn something, that conversation needs to happen.

But what happens when someone's wife comes up to me, her husband kind of tagging along behind him, and she comes up to me, or she comes up to one of you guys after you get done teaching, and she's like, starts to say, like,

I don't think you were right in this, and here's why, and she starts listing out why. Now, that's not proper order.

Okay, why not? Because she's to be submitted to her husband, and she needs to be asking him about that. And if he is a

Homer Simpson goober, who's only heard the Bible occasionally, and he doesn't know a lot about the

Scriptures, she still needs to ask him. And if he says, I don't know much about that stuff, honey, then she's going to say, you need to go talk to the preacher, which is the right thing for a wife to tell her husband.

He's like, you need to go talk to the preacher. I'm not going to talk to him, you talk to him. And then discipleship happens, and men are raised up to lead in their families.

That's the optimal thing. This is why he says in verse 34, let your women keep silent in the churches, for they are not permitted to speak, but they are to be submissive, as also the law says, meaning this is not a new thing, it happened in the old covenant too.

Verse 35, and if they want to learn something, let them ask their own husbands at home, for it is shameful, see that word shameful, that's from chapter 11, it's shameful for women to speak in church.

What does that mean? It doesn't mean that they're not supposed to pray, doesn't mean they're not supposed to sing, doesn't mean they're not supposed to say hello and greet one another warmly and so on.

The context is what? The context was the spirits of the prophets are subject to the prophets, order, meaning speaking out and challenging and so forth.

But if she there's a problem, if she detects it, because women can be very discerning in the Lord, they can be very discerning and like, hang on a second, that doesn't sound right, that sounds off, how many times my wife has been very discerning and heard something, and then she asked me about it.

Well, that's the way it's supposed to happen, that helps me grow in the Lord when she does that. Now, after he says, now you think

Paul is just going with a cultural line, you think he's just agreeing with how things were done back in those days. Look what he says in verse 36, after he says, it's shameful for women to speak in the church.

Now look what he says in verse 36, or did the word of God come originally from you, or was it you only that it reached?

If anyone thinks himself to be a prophet or spiritual, let him acknowledge that the things which I write to you are the commandments of the

Lord. Okay, this is where we've got to be careful that we don't get more spiritual than God, that we are on a higher spiritual plane than our

Lord Jesus Christ. Paul says, if you all think you're more spiritual than what

I've just told you about women being silent in the church, prophets, subject to the spirit of the prophets, and that if someone's speaking in a language that they have never learned and needs to be translated so everyone is edified, you think you're more spiritual than that?

You think you can go against these laws of order in the church? You think you can go against that? He said, just remember, this is instructions from your

Lord Jesus Christ, and you're not too spiritual to follow him, are you? So to me, that's a challenge to say, hang on a second,

I think the shepherd knows how to shepherd us. I think the good shepherd knows what we need in the life of the body, and that we should be on his side of things when it comes to proper order in body life, in worship.

So, Dylan? I was just going to ask, is this a decent principle for anyone who's out and about in public or on the web, probably don't get into an argument with somebody else's wife without him being present?

Yeah. So as a pastor, I've not always done this well.

I feel like an immediate need to try to answer people and to encourage people and to shepherd people,

I think that's an immediate need. That makes sense. But I haven't always done it right. I should, and I've learned over time as the

Lord's been working in my heart about this and changing me is a woman, even if she brings her husband into a counseling situation, which is where I always insist on, and I never counsel a woman by myself ever, ever, unless it's my wife.

But when she gets done saying all these things that she has to say, I look to the husband and say, well, what do you think, husband?

And I let him talk. And then as he talks and as I detect, and I often do, good biblical sound reasoning of what he's saying,

I build on that and just affirm what he says and expand on that a little bit and just encourage that. Because I want her to go to him.

I don't want her running to a Bible answer, man. I want her to run to her husband and that he gets stirred up to learn and to lead, because that's what our shepherd says is the best for the church, the best for the families.

And what he says in 1 Corinthians 14 is based on what he'd already said in 1 Corinthians 11. Now, someone in the questions had said something like, well,

Paul also said that women are to wear head coverings. And so we know that his insistence that women don't teach in the church is also culturally abound in old fashion.

And nobody does that right. Nobody does a head covering thing. So why are you not letting women? I've been hearing this for a long time.

Like I said, my undergraduate was with folks that said the very same thing. And we have a whole episode on the head coverings thing in 1

Corinthians 11. So y 'all can go listen to that. I encourage that. But the basic run of it is this.

1 Corinthians 11 says that God gave long hair to a woman for her covering.

And that if she is shorn, meaning she's presenting as a man, she might as well be shaved and she needs to get a covering on that head.

As it was common in Corinth to do, as it was you also found with cult prostitutes or whoever, that they would have very short hairstyles.

They'd be presenting themselves as men. And it says, might as well just shave your head. Might as well just be. And he says, does not nature teach us that that is a shame?

Shame. It goes back to that same idea of shame. So he says, in that case, they should have their heads covered.

And it's a shame if men have a covering. The idea is culturally presenting as women, as the cult prostitutes were prone to do.

Male prostitutes presenting themselves as women. Hey, do we have a problem in our culture today about men presenting as women and women presenting as men?

And doesn't nature teach us, doesn't creation itself teach us that that's a shame? And so we're told in 1

Corinthians 11, don't let that happen. Don't give in to that. And it's disorderly if you let that happen.

Now, what if a woman is presenting as a woman, but then she starts trying to take authority in the church?

Paul uses the same word. That's a shame. That's a shame. Because she can present as a woman all she wants, but if she's still trying to act out as a man, then that's improper.

That's not the way it's supposed to happen. And it's not good for her. And it's not good for the church. It's not good for anybody. It's a shame.

So people that maybe have not visited our church, in our church, the women present as women and men present as men.

Amen. And granted, some of these questions are a little trollish, and we know that.

But the women in our church are not completely silent, and they're not completely uninvolved in the worship service.

Can you talk a little bit Is it proper? Is it good to have women singing up on stage?

Absolutely. I mean, look at the passage in 1 Timothy 2 and 1 Corinthians 14. Read it carefully.

In regards to Paul saying it is not good for the women to speak in church, it's a shame if she does that.

Let her learn in silence. Notice the careful consideration that he gives to what he's saying.

There's nothing there about praying. In fact, women should pray. And we're told that when they pray, they should have their heads covered, meaning that they should present as women as they pray.

Their prayers are good. Obviously, all of us are to sing. The whole family, the whole household is called to sing.

Before instructions are given to husbands, wives, parents, and children in Colossians and Ephesians, all of us are told to sing and encourage one another in our singing.

And so women sing out loud. Women pray. Women definitely greet.

Women teach the children. We have older women teaching younger women. If all of the women in the church took this out of context and took it in the worst way possible, our church would be very, very quiet.

But our church is very lively, very lively with all manner of encouragement, all manner of exhortation, all manner of good things going on.

Do we have women teaching men? No. Do we have women giving the message?

No. Do we give titles of authority to women? No. Are women vitally and vibrantly in the work of ministry in the church?

Yes. But we're not coming at this whole issue of, well, because women aren't platformed and given positions of power and titles, this means that there's something fundamentally immoral and wrong with our church, because we're not starting with that presupposition.

I think, Andrew, you had brought up Phoebe that people bring up as an example. See, here's a titled female.

Sure. Would you let me read the passage? Yes, please. Sure. This is from the

King James Version, Romans chapter 16. So, the term servant in the

Greek is where we get our term, even our title deacon, the diakonos. But we have the term in the

Greek being used of all kinds of people as servants. Does that mean a title?

No, it doesn't mean a title. It doesn't mean that she's been entrusted with authority in the church and she has authority over a man.

And this passage has been bloated with all manner of really creative eisegesis until,

I think, the most recent one I heard was that Phoebe was the actual one who delivered the entire message of Romans to the church.

And she read the whole thing to everybody, calling everybody to submit to the authority of Romans. She was the actual one who presented it.

So, I thought that was really interesting. But it also mentions Priscilla and Aquila in verse three.

We remember that Aquila and Priscilla brought Apollos into their home when they heard him teach because they knew that something was lacking.

You know, I bet Priscilla could discern if there was something lacking in Apollos. And I bet Aquila is like, you're right, honey, he doesn't get it, does he?

And they pull him aside and host him in their home, and they explain the way of God more accurately to him.

Anything wrong with that? Not at all. There's nothing wrong with that. To bring somebody into your home and you and your wife, husband and wife, sit there and encourage this person and exhort them in the

Lord, that is not what Paul is saying in 1 Timothy 2 and in 1

Corinthians 14. In what way is Priscilla exerting authority over men in the church by her and her husband hosting someone and having a moment of discipleship?

No way. And they're called fellow workers who risk their own necks for my life. My question is this, why are we so hungry to adorn women with titles of authority however way we can?

What are we trying to do? Why are we being...

It seems to do that. Because in our culture, we've said this is valuable. They don't have that, so we need to give them something.

Because we're not honoring what is honorable, there's a vacuum.

And so it's like, here's this title. I'd like to push back on the in our culture type stuff.

This seems outside of our culture. I know it has been since we've grown up, but we're thinking long generations.

Sure. Our heritage is not the feminism. It's not the usurping authority.

In fact, there's probably a millennium of something other than that, a patriarchy behind it.

This is something that is kind of... I guess I mean the juxtaposed culture versus in...

It seems... Biblical churches. Yeah. I'm just saying it's outside and it seems to be impressed upon and top down type of...

It's coming from somewhere that's not like a ground up. When I hear culture, it sounds like something that has just popped up naturally.

And I don't think that's the case for us either. Yeah. I would agree with what you said, Dylan. It's not something that...

Again, Paul says it's against nature. It's not in accordance with the way that God designed.

It's something that is artificial and imposed and forced. And it's a kind of...

It kind of goes along with the box of do -nots in Colossians 2 about how to have virtue by if you can check all these boxes, then you're virtuous.

But when we read the scriptures and if we were to read other passages, Ephesians 5 or 1

Peter 3 about the relationship between husband and wife, can we affirm that and can we rejoice in that?

Why would it catch in our hearts? Why would it bother us? Why would it make us angry to hear these passages where Paul says, let a woman learn in submission in silence in the church.

Let her ask her own husband, let her submit to her own husband. Why does that anger? I mean, to me, that's the more important question than why there are more women in visible areas of leadership.

The real question is why do we have problems with the Bible? And one last note is that guys like Matthew Vines and Wesley Hill and everybody who is pushing forward the gay pastor movement, they have explicitly said that the same hermeneutic, the same approach to used to put women into leadership in the church is exactly the same method that they use to advocate for homosexuals leading in the church.

There is no difference in the way that they approach that hermeneutic at all. Yeah, but I mean, it kind of plays into the devolution of order that you see in Romans 1.

You started like certain things, then you just go all the way down to the bottom of the barrel. And that's what we've kind of seen with the order in the church.

Yeah, and encouraging it too. Yeah, because you do have those who are cheerleading behind them, but aren't necessarily the ones in practice.

But I think we've kind of hit what we all could on this one without wearing out.

I hope this was edifying and encouraging to everybody who is listening, because you will come across these questions and you need to be prepared for those who are asking these questions in good faith, but you also need to be prepared for those that Michael was pointing out are there because they want to usurp the power and that's their main want and desire and their need.

So they may not listen to it, but those around them may be listening and they need to hear this argument from the scriptures as best as you can put it.

But we're going to move on to what we recommend for the week. Michael, we'll start with you. Okay. I got done doing pool maintenance every day, so I got back to my reading schedule.

And the first one out of the box this summer was The Servant of the Lord and His Servant People, tracing a biblical theme through the canon, written by Matt Harmon.

So if you were searching for it, it's just The Servant of the Lord and His Servant People. And this was really an interesting read, obviously tracing the idea of Messiah as the servant, but how interesting that His people are also called servants and how meaningful this is, especially when we go through the

New Testament, that our identity in Christ has us being called servants as well, that in our

Christ -likeness, we take on these very same... our imitation of Christ is in His role as the promised servant that so much is made of, for example, in Isaiah.

So it was a very encouraging read. Chris? Mine is a video on YouTube.

I think it's also on Canon, but it's Vodibacham. It's entitled

Engaging a Culture at War with God. And it's kind of his response to the

Charlie Kirk stuff happening, but wrapping up just some pastoral advice and also the idea of apologetics, like engaging with the culture biblically, and how do we talk to those that don't know

God or are actively at war with God? And I thought it was just very well -spoken, and he highlighted the things that needed to be highlighted.

So that was Engaging a Culture at War with God by Vodibacham. My dear brother lent from his personal library a book titled

The Majority Text of the Greek New Testament by Guiseppe Guarino, and it's an apology for the majority text.

I've been going through some desiring old manuscripts to do research and to do study.

And throughout my courses of study, when I come across old manuscripts and start learning about them, some of the oldest ones we have don't necessarily, as far as codices like Vaticanus and Sinaiticus and Alexandrinus, don't reflect the majority text.

But I was using those more so for their Old Testament passages. But after coming upon, well, where am

I as far as this critical text idea or eclectic text or the majority text? But the biblical idea of the veracity that witnesses convey before an assembled court or before the judge is the testimony of two or three witnesses.

And so I believe that the majority text position is the correct position for the transmission of what

God has said. And so there are a couple passages that I'm still working through that differ from the critical text or an eclectic text, but this was a great primer on the majority text, and I would highly recommend it.

That's interesting. I've always kind of been a critical text guy, so I might want to look at that.

I think, Chris, it's interesting, your recommendation. I, too, have a recommendation from Votibachum.

What a loss, but what an incredible legacy he has left in his family and everything that he has written and spoken over the years.

Everything from homeschooling to family.

I think one of his great quotes was, you can't send your children off to Caesar's household day after day and then be surprised when they come back as Romans.

So it was just fantastic. My recommendation was a book that I finished a little bit ago, about a month or two ago over the summer,

Expository Apologetics, Answering Objections with the Power of the Word by Votibachum.

It was written in 2015, and it's not an apologetics book, which is what

I was expecting. It's really a, it's almost an evangelistic book.

What he talks about is being able to respond to questions and explain your views in a winsome manner.

Now, understand that he's Reformed Baptist. He's very confessional and holds a three -fold division of law.

You know, he started with the Ten Commandments, all those things. His method isn't as important as the intent behind it.

Knowing what you believe and being able to share it in a winsome way. Now, he has chapters on the importance of teaching apologetics to your children using the old creeds, confessions, catechisms, good stuff.

He does talk about the Ten Commandments and the Ten Commandments itself being the moral law. I mean, you can sift through and wade through that, but he has this really great sermon in the back.

You know, how do you respond to people when he's talking about, this particular sermon's on homosexuality, where how do you respond to those?

He said, well, you know, you use Leviticus. And he talked about, you know, homosexuality or bestiality.

And he says, well, in the same book, they're talking about, you know, fibers in your clothes. And Michael has addressed this, not just in class, but also on our podcast.

The way Bauckham would go about it is talk about the threefold division of the law, ceremonial versus moral.

But the moral component is still there. We're talking about purity. We're talking about this is what

God wants for your life. Let me tell you about who you are as a sinner and who

Christ is as a great Savior and moves into that. But he uses the

Bible as the standpoint. He's not standing there on a beach saying, hey, God has a wonderful plan for your life.

You know, or, you know, hey, you got a 50 -50 shot here. Wouldn't it be better to just, in case you die today, have your fire insurance?

What have you got to lose? Jesus worked for me. No. You know, Bauckham would put you in a giant bear hug and body slam you.

And he could do it, too. So he's answering these objections or these questions.

And even with your own testimony before the world with the power of the word.

So I thought it was very fitting, especially since our podcast is Have You Not Read? And that is what

I think Bauckham was trying to do in this book. And I think

I've recommended I don't know how many of his books to friends over the years, and I think

I've done several on this program as well. But expository apologetics,

Bodhi Bauckham. Well, like I was saying off mic before we got rolling here,

I've been listening to a lot of stuff. I haven't been able to read that much recently, but when

I have been able to sit down and read, I've tried to get into my Lexham translation of the

Septuagint over the summer. But every time I pick it up and I read it, I have Charles picking up a book and bringing it to me.

And then Meadow, now that she's walking, she picks up a book and brings it to me. And at nighttime, I'm pretty tired.

So I'm getting through a few pages and I'm crashing. But one of the things

I sort of realized, especially at night, whenever I'm reading to the boys or when I get to read to the boys at night, their picks that we get to do, right?

Like everybody gets to pick a book and we're going to read a few pages out of it here and there. But they say a lot about my children and they show a lot of their personalities, their interests and their giftings by the books that they're bringing to me.

And I think the Lord has shown that to me specifically over this summer. And I'm just going to recommend, listen to those little cues.

Listen to those cues about what your children's interests are and what their giftings might be. Even at earlier ages, they can be helpful for you making decisions on how to counsel, lead, encourage into certain things because they're just really good at certain things.

We found out that Killian was getting really good at math for his age over the summer.

So we're trying to push that as along as much as we can and see if he can advance past his, you know, the generic grade level or whatever, you know, like that doesn't mean anything to me anymore in homeschool, but it is something that we're trying to, we're trying to really fill out with our kids.

And I think one of those ways is when they bring the book to you or they bring the suggestion like a type of content they want you to read or, or look at with them, there's some little clues there and I recommend everybody look at that.

What are we thankful for, Michael? I am thankful for my wife. I'm thankful for her encouragements and our, our custom with school.

We don't really ever take off from school for the summer. We just keep on trucking, but we have a routine where we gather together with our five younger ones every school day and we read the

Bible together and that's been really good. And so she's an encouragement in that and we do that together and I'm very thankful for that custom in our life.

Also thankful for my wife. As I mentioned before, we've got some difficult things going on and she's just handling it.

There are things that I have to take time to do and to take care of and to fight and to figure out.

And so it slows me down and I'm not always able to be present and she keeps things going.

She keeps those kids in their schooling, keeps them active, keeps them in the Word. She checks on me to make sure

I'm doing all right and it just keeps going largely because of her efforts and what she's doing.

And I'm so grateful that God has given me the helper that she is and that she is fulfilling that role, taking everything that she can and just ministering even outside of our family, the children.

She's watching them and then there's other people that she gets to minister to and talk to and it just keeps going instead of life grinding to a halt because of the problems.

We get to keep going and kind of make plans and look to the future. So I'm grateful for her.

I thank the Lord that we live in an era where people like to make public comments about all sorts of things, but I thank the

Lord for the ability to go back and look at those public comments and to compare it to what the truth is.

I really appreciate people's allegiances being spoken about, recorded, what they said happened about X, Y, or Z.

It really helps to categorize people into motivations when things change, when new information comes to light, and do they conform to the truth or not?

Has their mind changed or is this something that is about deception?

So I actually thank the Lord for just so much of the things that we talk about and lament about social media and things like this.

These are times in which public allegiances are very helpful for me. So I thank the

Lord for that. Just admit you're really into memes. No, no.

You've got some good ones. No, you've sent out some good ones. I am thankful for the younger people in our church, specifically the high school, junior high age.

I had the opportunity, and I rarely get to do this, but I was able to go to a cross -country meet, and I got to see some of our kids run and win and destroy the competition.

I was a runner in high school, and it was fun, really fun to be in that environment.

And I was excited, and I think that they could tell that I was excited. And then I had other kids from our church turn around and see me and go,

Mr. Kasson, oh, wait, guess what I did today? And I had a personal record,

PR, ran the fastest I had ever run in my life today. I was genuinely excited for her, and she should be proud of herself.

Absolutely, she should. And I'm thankful that they are disciplined enough to do these things.

I was very thankful to see so many family members out supporting them. And I was just very thankful to be welcomed, because mine's off to college now, and to be able to cheer for them and be welcomed like part of the family,

I was very grateful for it. And I was thankful for the opportunity, and even more thankful that the parents there just welcomed me in and were happy to cheer alongside me.

So I'm thankful for our young people and the many activities that they do. I'm thankful to the

Lord for contentedness. That's not something that I generate in and of myself, any way, shape, or form.

It's all of the Lord. Especially when I feel the tiredness, I feel the busyness, because I really do hate being busy, but I just seem to get busier and busier.

Especially when I've got children and wife at home that really do enjoy and adore my presence.

But the Lord has continued to supply me with a contentedness of where I am, where we are as a family, and just the time that we've been given.

I know we've talked about this before, about being thankful for the place that the Lord has placed you in is extremely important.

And that is, I think that the contentedness is the thing that's added in there. Once you're thankful for that, the

Lord is supplying you with contentedness about the present situation.

And it seems like the contentedness is being added as preparation for something.

I don't know what it is, but it makes it easier for me to be thankful for all the things that I'm not on a daily basis, telling the

Lord I'm thankful for this or that. So it goes down to smaller and smaller things, but a general contentedness being added,

I'm still very thankful for that, because it's not in and of myself. And that wraps it up for today.

We are very thankful for our listeners, and hope you will join us again as we meet to answer common questions and objections with Happy Knot Red.