December 10, 2025 Show with Mykola Leliovskyi & Ron Jones on “Updates from a Ukranian Christian & Advancements in the Spread of the Gospel”

Live from historic downtown Carlisle, Pennsylvania, home of founding father James Wilson, 19th century hymn writer George Duffield, 19th century gospel minister George Norcross, and sports legend Jim Thorpe.

It's Iron Sharpens Iron. This is a radio platform in which pastors, Christian scholars, and theologians address the burning issues facing the church and the world today. Proverbs, chapter 27, verse 17, tells us iron sharpens iron, so one man sharpens another.

Matthew Henry said that in this passage, we are cautioned to take heed with whom we converse and directed to have in view in conversation to make one another wiser and better. It is our hope that this goal will be accomplished over the next two hours, and we hope to hear from you, the listener, with your own questions.

And now, here's your host, Chris Arnson.

Good afternoon, Cumberland County, Pennsylvania, Lake City, Florida, and the rest of humanity living on the planet Earth, who are listening via live streaming at ironsharpensironradio .com. This is Chris Arnson, your host of Iron Sharpens Iron Radio, wishing you all a happy Wednesday on this 10th day of December 2025.

Mykola Leliovskyi’s Ministry in Ukraine

I'm thrilled to have both a returning guest and a first-time co-host with me today on the program. First of all, we have for the third time on Iron Sharpens Iron Radio, Mykola Leliovsky, who is professor of biblical theology and hermeneutics at Ukrainian Baptist Theological Seminary, pastor of Lviv Central Baptist Church in Lviv, Ukraine, and founder and director of Journey Christian Publishing.

Today he will be addressing updates from a Ukrainian Christian on advancements in the spread of the gospel in that war-torn country. It's my honor and privilege to welcome you back to Iron Sharpens Iron Radio, Mykola Leliovsky.

Thank you so much. It's an honor and a privilege to be with you again.

And I understand that congratulations are in order because of the birth of your son. And that took place, I believe, if I'm not mistaken, on November 29th. And if you could please tell us the name of this little boy.

Yes, that is correct. He goes by DJ, which stands for Arthur Jack.

And nothing exotic about that at all, but a great name. And you've got to tell my listeners why you named him specifically Jack. Why was that in his name?

I mentioned earlier that it was after Jack Bauer, but all the cool American action heroes are named Jack. Jack Bauer, Jack Ryan, Jack Reacher.

Well, we are all praising God here in the States who know you, that you are still with us after what's going on in Ukraine as far as the Russian invasion of Ukraine. And we'll be picking up on that later on during the main part of our program.

But first of all, let our listeners know something about the Ukrainian Baptist Theological Seminary. Now, I don't know if that's the same seminary where you were previously teaching under a different name or if it's an entirely different school.

It's a different school. So, a lot has gone on in the almost three years since we last spoke on the show. I've moved town. I've gotten married. And as you've mentioned, our child was born. And before, I used to serve the Lord at Grace Bible Seminary in Kiev, Ukraine.

But since I've moved, it's a different school. It's with the biggest conservative evangelical denomination in Ukraine, the Baptist denomination.

Here.

So, I served there as a professor and the dean of graduate and online studies. It's a blessing to serve the Lord with my gifts and to impact the lives of students.

Amen.

Now, tell us something about the church where you are now pastoring, Lviv Central Baptist Church.

Yes. So, as we moved into this town, I really wasn't familiar with many churches here. But this church is close by to our place, and they welcomed us with open arms and been able to build good relationships with the people there.

And actually, they asked me to join the pastoral team not too long ago. So, it's a blessing to be a part of what God is doing there as well.

Praise God. And last but not least, tell us about Journey Christian Publishing.

Yes. So, that is also something that was started after we've talked last time. So, because of the war, there's been a shift in Ukraine from Russian language resources and books towards the Ukrainian language.

And with some encouragement from some friends and actually your listeners that I got to meet after we've talked last time, I decided to start a publishing house and like a medium.

Yeah.

Resource ministry to flood the market, so to speak, with good, God-honoring, solid, reformed literature and resources.

Well, praise God. Now, are these primarily reprints of older works from history that are being republished in Ukraine or the Ukrainian language, or are they new works by you and other contemporary authors or a combination?

I guess you would say a combination. We're trying to do books that have not been published previously in Ukrainian language or in Russian language, for that matter. Because even though Russian language is not popular, I mean, people still understand it and would use it if they would find it useful.

So we strive to provide a new wave of resources, introduce them to new theologians, new pastors, new authors, but some old ones as well. So it's a good mix, I think.

Great.

Ron Jones’s Testimony and Mission to Ukraine

Well, I'm looking forward to our discussion today. I'm also thrilled to introduce to my audience a first-time co-host with me. His name is Ron Jones. I met Ron months ago. Perhaps he can even be more precise on exactly when we met.

It might have been over a year ago at the local Christian Businessmen's Connection Wednesday gatherings at Fay's Country Kitchen here in Carlisle, Pennsylvania. And I really began to quickly like this brother and admire him and respect him.

And I thought it would be perfect for him to be a co-host today, especially since he has experience as a missionary in Ukraine. Ron Jones is an American businessman and missionary to Ukraine, where he moved with his wife and children in 2018 and established Business Lab Ukraine, but evacuated with his family in 2022, just three weeks before the full-scale invasion by Russia began.

And it's my honor and privilege to welcome you for the very first time to Iron Trip and Zion Radio, Ron Jones.

Thank you very much. I've been looking forward to joining you today. And yeah, we've known each other now for probably a little more than a year, year and a half, maybe two years. But good to have just good Christian brothers and fellowship that we do on Wednesdays.

And when you told me about Mykola joining you on this podcast, my ears perked up because I love Ukraine. I love our brothers and sisters there. And so I'm happy to join you today and happy to serve as your helper and co-host.

And we have a tradition here on Iron Trip and Zion Radio, whenever we have a first-time guest or co-host. In your case, we have that guest or co-host give a summary of their salvation testimony. And that would include any kind of religious atmosphere in which you were raised and the kinds of providential circumstances our Sovereign Lord raised up in your life that drew you to himself and saved you.

So let's hear a summary of your story.

Yeah, yeah, well, you know, I am I am a blessed man that God has always been near and dear to my heart. I was born and raised here in Carlisle, Pennsylvania, born into a Christian family and was raised all my life in a loving Christian home.

And so God really kept me from a lot of dangers, a lot of bad roads that I could have went down. But his preserving hand was just guiding me along the way. I will say, you know, at some point, I think around 13 years old, I remember one one Sunday night at church, the pastor making that call.

And I really began to recognize the fact that I'm a great sinner and I need a savior. And so I made that dedication at 13. And of course, through life and as I've grown up through the years, there's been different challenges.

And I really began to recognize, really in my college years, in my early 20s, a point at which no longer could my beliefs be based just upon what my parents thought or what they taught me. But I had to know that I know that I know what I believe and why I believe it.

And it was so during those college years and God really took me through some journeys of deep investigation into scripture and different things to really understand fully the salvation that he gave me.

So, yeah, it's been great, a great blessing, a great heritage to have that God has kept me and he has blessed my family and blessed all of our journey since then. And so I can I can do nothing but give him grace.

Amen. Now, why among all the countries and nations on the planet Earth, did you have a burden on your heart for Ukraine that led you to the mission field there back in 2018?

Well, you know, shortly after turning 13 years old, I remember praying in our church. It was in the 80s and we would have missionaries come and we'd hear stories of the Communist Soviet Union and how they persecuted Christians.

And I remember my church praying, dear God, if you want me to be a missionary, I'll serve you. But please do not send me to the USSR. They're killing Christians there. Whatever you do, don't send me there.

Of course, you know, you're not supposed to pray a message like you're not supposed to make a request like that, because God always has his way in the end. And and I guess it was what really sparked my interest was in 1991, when I was in college, I was able to take a trip to the former USSR literally six months before the iron, before the Soviet Union collapsed.

So it was in the summer of 91. And we were in mostly just Russia at that point, but it was it was just a part of the USSR at that time. And I fell in love with the Slavic culture and the Slavic people.

And little did I know, but that journey, that that trip in 91 kind of set a trajectory for my life to always have a heart and a love for those people. And so there's a lot of a lot of years between there, but up until the point then in 2018, where we actually had the opportunity to go and serve there full time, I did make several trips to Ukraine starting around 2005 or 2006.

As God opened doors, we would go over there and serve on short term basis. And then eventually in 2018, we made the full time commitment.

And you launched a business while there to use as a vehicle to evangelize the Ukrainian people in addition to serving them with a business.

Yeah, yeah, well, it wasn't so much a business, but it was a marketplace ministry and we called it Business Lab Ukraina, Business Lab Ukraine. And it was to our main vision and mission was to help business people become better Christians and to develop Christians into godly business people.

So we worked from both ends. Those that are existing in the business world, we minister to them to bring the light of the gospel. And those that were mostly the youth of the church that were passionate about doing something entrepreneurial to teach them how to do business, how to run companies, but according to biblical principles.

Bible to School and Teaching Scripture in Public Schools

Now, tell us about this new ministry that you are currently working with, Bible to School.

Yes, God has opened the door since coming back in 2022. It was a difficult transition to leave the country that I love. And so for a year or two, we served as providing a lot of relief and support to ministries inside Ukraine.

So we raised a lot of funds over here. But this year I accepted a position and began working at an organization called Bible to School. And our vision and what we do is we teach the Bible to public school students during the school day.

Which kind of surprises a lot of people, because if you know the American culture, we think that that's not even possible to talk about religious things during the day. But there is a pathway that we've found to that.

And we use something called fellow release time, and we are able to get the children released to us for an hour a week. And so we hold these Bible classes across the nation. We're in four different states right now.

We have over 3 ,000 students that are enrolled in our classes, and God has been blessing them. We're growing and we're wanting to serve more and more kids to teach the public school students the Bible, but during the school day.

Now, I believe that the parents must be giving their consent to this. How do they know how to connect the Bible to school to get their own children involved.

In this?

Right. So what we typically, we will have a member that comes to us and says, hey, I want to bring this Bible to school program to my school, to my school district. And we work alongside them and help them develop their team of volunteers to be able to host the Bible to school classes at their own schools.

The caveat that we're able to do this through the federal release time is we have to do off school sites, so we have to take the children to a neighboring church or a community center. We have to, of course, not use any tax funds.

We don't use any tax money. And third, we have to get parental permission. And but here's the neatest thing, Chris, that I love about this ministry. Of the three thousand plus students that are coming to us, 52 percent are from or unchurched.

They don't go to church on Sunday. They are not taught the Bible in their homes. Yet these parents, they're like, hey, we know that we need to get spiritual impact into our kids and they allow us to take, they give their permission, we take their kids.

And it's a great unreached, an unreached mission field for us here to get these children who are not going to Sunday school, who are not hearing the Bible, but we get to do it during school day. So God's God's led me to Bible to school.

I'm loving what I'm doing. And we'd love to to see see more and more people involved with it.

Well, if anybody listening wants to learn more about Bible to school, go to Bible, the number to school dot com. That's Bible, the number to school dot com. And God willing, we'll be repeating that towards the end of the program.

Ukraine Before the Russian Invasion

Well, Micola, as you have said, it's been three years since you have been on Iron Trepans Iron Radio. And I was wondering if you could not only remind us about some things that have already occurred that we discussed during our last two interviews, but also obviously we want some updates.

And so perhaps you could bring us back to right prior to the Russian invasion of Ukraine and tell us something about how Russians and Ukrainians were getting along. In fact, our mutual friend, Dr. James R. White of Alpha Omega Ministries, I know, was going to both Russia and Ukraine teaching.

And there were students who were Russian, I believe, even in Ukraine, sitting at the feet of Dr. White's teaching. But you pick it up where we left off, then bring it to the point of the invasion and bring us forward to our current present day.

Yeah, so I mentioned previously that there was a time where Ukrainian and Russian got along just fine, basically referred to each other as brotherly nations. You could travel to Russia from Ukraine or from Russia to Ukraine without an international passport.

So I've taken advantage of that and traveled to Russia several times to be involved in ministry there. And we did have plenty of students from neighboring regions of Russia in Ukraine at our schools. And overall, I think it just seemed like the situation was pretty stable and we are enjoying relative peace and things were just getting better after the collapse of the Soviet Union, which brought the Great Depression into the former Soviet Union states.

But a slow recovery, of course, not without problems, but it led to a pretty stable, peaceful coexistence. But then, you know, the events of political events like the revolution or in Ukraine where the people did not support the president who changed, there was a referendum and the people wanted to kind of move towards the European Union and pursue more of Western values.

But apparently he was very pro-Russian. And so there's a lot of demonstrations and things like that. And Vladimir Putin took advantage of that in 2014, 2015 and annexed Crimea and began a kind of guerrilla warfare in the eastern part of Ukraine with two cities, two areas proclaiming independence from Ukraine.

And then that kind of, I don't know, there was a red flag, but apparently Ukrainians didn't take it very seriously. And 10 years later, you know, it's a full scale invasion. I think I mentioned last time that there were rumors of it because, you know, they were amassing troops on the border of Ukraine.

And for many, it was just really hard to believe that that was going to happen because that made absolutely no sense for anyone. Anything that Vladimir Putin has said since makes also no sense for what his purpose is, what his goal is.

He claimed that he's trying to denazify Ukraine and protect the rights of the Russian speaking citizens here. But the sad part is that, you know, the eastern part of Ukraine, the southern part of Ukraine has generally been very warm towards Russia and very friendly.

And those are the areas that have seen just tremendous devastation. And many, many great cities have been flattened, you know, and just people have suffered so much. And those are the people who, who, if anything, would be kind of encouraging Ukraine to have an amicable, peaceful relationship, coexistence with Russia.

Now, why did that occur there then?

Well, because those are the neighboring, neighboring territories. And so, in my opinion, this is just my opinion and speculation, Vladimir Putin was greatly misled or just fooled by his intelligence officers or whoever the advisors were.

And it basically seems like they told him that if you, if you invade Ukraine right now, they will let you waltz right into Kiev and welcome you as a liberator and a new regime. And Russia would be supported by most people, just like it was in Crimea because he took Crimea without firing a shot.

Of course, you know, they had to create a phony referendum and pretend like, you know, that was the will of the people. But at least at that point, there was no, Ukraine didn't really resist and kind of took it very quickly and without much resistance.

And so I think that was his idea to just do this blitzkrieg attack and seize control of the capital. But as it turned out, you know, that definitely wasn't what they were able to accomplish. And Ukraine was able to withstand the initial attack.

And now this war has been going on for years with absolutely no foreseeable off-ramp in the future. At this point, there's really not a clear path to peace. And so unfortunately, you know. In this time that the war has been going on, there's been 10 million people leaving Ukraine, hundreds of thousands of people dying, soldiers fighting each other, there's civilian deaths every day because of the attacks with drones and missile strikes.

And so it's just it's just a really, really sad situation. It's it really shows kind of the ugliness of sin and the worst manifestation of war and people hating each other for absolutely no reason and fighting with each other.

And so until until Putin's imperialistic desires are satisfied, I guess we're going to have to put up with what's going on.

Now, I know that you are not a mind reader and only Christ truly knows the hearts and minds of men, but is there any kind of sense that you have been able to get? Whether the Russian people. Are really reluctantly doing this because they have to, or when you said that there's hatred, a mutual hatred towards each other over nothing.

How much of that is based in really genuinely believed ideology and so on?

Well, that's a good question. I don't think that I'm qualified to speak authoritatively on it. I mean, I hear that there are surveys done in Russia from just the population, whether they're in support of war.

And we hear numbers of upwards of 70 percent that they are supporting this war. But at the same time, I know that the propaganda machine has been just brainwashing people's minds, just like in Soviet times for the past 15 or 20 years.

I mean, if you think of it, there are people in Russia who are about 25 years old who haven't known anyone else in power but Vladimir Putin. Since he's come to power in 1999, he's been the sole ruler of Russia.

And, you know, just his authoritarian tendencies have been getting worse and worse and worse. Ten years ago or so, he passed these laws prohibiting evangelical Christians of evangelizing people on the streets or inviting people to church without a permit from the government.

And it's just been kind of initially, you know, in the late 2000s, he's kind of been posing as a figure who wants to bring Russia into the West. And he was open minded and, you know, kind of progressive.

But now he just looks like an old school KGB style dictator.

I was just curious, have things just progressively increased in the hostilities and the violence? Or has there been a lull, that kind of a thing?

So when everything happened, you know, I think people were just still recovering from initial shock. And I remember I've seen footage where Russian soldiers and tanks and armored transport are going down Ukrainian roads and they get lost.

And Ukrainian citizens are joking around like, oh, you know, do you need me to help you find your way? And so people weren't, Ukrainian people were not prepared to just, you know, answer with hatred what was going on because they just didn't believe, it just didn't make sense, honestly, like for Russia to come into Ukraine and start a war.

It just didn't make any sense because what was the goals? OK, so he's going to occupy entire Ukraine, the largest country, you know, in continental Europe. And what is he going to do with the 40 million population?

And so it didn't make sense. And so people were just kind of trying to use humor to, I guess, deal with that. But then as the attacks increased and just the brutality of the war really was on full display with just all the atrocities perpetrated by the military and attacks on civilian objects, whether intentional or unintentional, still caused tremendous damage to hospitals and schools and other things like that.

So now a typical Ukrainian, you know, is not a good Ukrainian unless he hates Putin and prays every night for, you know, for him to die. And so it pretty much goes for just the average Russian, you know, has become kind of when I was a child, you know, I was still from that generation that remembered World War Two.

And so we had this kind of common collective enemy in our minds, which was the Nazis, you know, that have occupied Ukraine for over three years and sent many people to concentration camps and things like that.

And so now I think in our collective memory for many, many years, you know, unfortunately, I believe it is very unfortunate that, you know, the Russian people will be this vicious enemy that was kind of the epitome of evil that, you know, brought so much suffering and pain to our land.

Now, before we go to our first commercial break, I wanted to know, have you lost any close friends, loved ones, family members?

I personally did not lose anyone who is related to me or who I've known very well. But there are, you know, students that I've known who have passed away. And there's six men serving from our church right now, our local church in the military.

God has preserved their lives for this point. But my fellow pastors and other churches have lost lost members and people in their families have also lost members.

OK, when we return, we're going to have Ron Jones, my co-host, chime in with his own questions. And by the way, Ron, you can feel free at any point during our interview to chime in with a question. You don't have to wait for me to announce that you're going to ask a question, but we'll have you we'll have you begin with questions when we return from our first commercial break.

If anybody would like to join us with a question of your own. Our email address is chrisarnson at gmail dot com. Chrisarnson at gmail dot com. Give us your first name, at least your city and state of residence, your country of residence, and only remain anonymous if your question involves a personal and private matter.

Don't go away. We'll be right back with Mykola Lolioski in an update on the spread of the gospel in Ukraine, in that war-torn country. Right after these messages from our sponsors.

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The Church’s Response to War and Grief in Ukraine

Welcome back. If you just tuned us in, this is Chris Arnzen of Iron Trumpet and Zion Radio, and our guest today is Mykola Lalioski, a Reformed Baptist pastor in Ukraine, and he's giving us updates on the spread of the gospel in Ukraine amidst the suffering at the hands of the invading Russians, and we would love to hear from you and what you have to ask at chrisarnzen at gmail .com.

Give us your first name, at least city and state and country of residence. Only remain anonymous if your question involves personal and private matter. And Ron Jones, my co-host, if you'd like to ask Mykola some questions.

Absolutely.

Well, you know, Mykola, I really appreciate what you had to say, and it echoes some of the similar feelings that we had living there. I remember, and I'm just sharing for instance or two with you, when we were ordered to evacuate by our missions organization, I remember driving across the city, across Kiev as we were heading to the airport to evacuate, and my wife just looked at me and she's like, there's just no way that Russia's coming.

That life had been continuing on, just like you said, Mykola, Ukrainians never really thought that Russia was going to invade. They just said, hey, you know, Russia's always been, we call it saber rattling, has always been kind of just throwing threats and this is just nothing new.

Yet, obviously shortly after we left, it became real. And one other observation, and I just share this with our listeners because I think it's interesting in how today's technology and instant communication and news effects, I remember literally arriving back here in Pennsylvania.

And once the invasion began, I had three children that we lived with, that lived with us here in Kiev, and they had many friends, and I remember, you know, they continued to maintain connection with all their Ukrainian friends, and we are, we were driving across town.

In fact, I hate to say it, but we were at the, we were at the drive-thru at the fast food restaurant and my daughter is FaceTiming, my 12 year old daughter is FaceTiming her friend in Kiev and all of a sudden I heard her friend come on.

She's like, oh, wait, wait. Okay. I got to go. I got to go because the sirens just went off and we've got to go turn off all the lights and we got to go hide in the bathtub. And the reality of that moment has stuck in my mind.

Just, just the tragedy that has all of a sudden just beset my brothers and sisters in Ukraine, it was just devastating. And even for my young children to be able to process that as, as they, unfortunately, we all saw the pictures and the witness, all of the atrocities that we've seen over the years, it's been terrible.

But Mykola, you had said something that was really interesting and I would like to get your, your thought on it. Cause this is some of the things I'm hearing from my contacts within the Ukraine. The evangelical community, although it is, I guess we call Ukraine the Bible belt, it's still not very large in Ukraine.

And that evangelical community always seemed to have good relationships with the evangelical communities inside Russia. And there was some, some back and forth of both the Bible school students and professors and, and that type of interaction.