Special: Responding To False Witness

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I want their faith to not just be something that stands but something around which culture can be built.

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We want students who can think critically about arguments but also about the culture around them that can then speak clearly to it and that also have the ability to influence and shape because of the power of their message because that's really what the gospel does the gospel throws down all the arguments against it it speaks to the hearts of people it influences and it changes.

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TV show you get the after show including Apologia Academy and you partner with us in ministry bringing the gospel around the world.

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Welcome back everybody I want to thank you all for joining us today I apologize for the nature of the episode today again we've tried to avoid this for many many many years and we have a solid history of that and we're just at the point where we have to actually expose this stuff publicly appreciate all of you guys staying with us

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I know it's a long episode today but we wanted to make sure that you can all see for yourselves and listen for yourselves and let's just start with this again this is last night

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Tim did an episode where he lied to his listeners and this is at about 36 and a half minute mark somewhere around there this done should

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I stumble again you come to me hey guess what I just thought of this they never came we came to me in the first place

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I came to them that's not funny that my sin wasn't funny

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I I had sinned against them I I was sinning against them they didn't confront me on my sin let's also be clear that he was he was sinning against us for years years and no response back from us no public retaliation no episodes going back and forth slinging mud again we have not wanted apology a studios platform to be that kind of platform the typical discernment type ministry thing where there's the back -and -forth character assassination fighting amongst brothers those sorts of things we've wanted to avoid that and we have a long history of avoiding those sorts of things in the past and it's unfortunate and fortunate that we're here now so if you guys are just catching up with us about a five -year history of abuse a five -year history of abuse lies slander we have

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Tim contacted us in 2017 he confessed in this phone call you're going to hear it in a moment here to his sin to purposely misrepresenting us to being motivated by sin by jealousy and by pride and then he makes a commitment in the confession itself he makes to us he makes a commitment to contact me through an open line and I give him an invitation to do so he did use that so he knows where to go to do it he did use it about a year ago when we had

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Ben Shapiro on a year ago or so I forget when that was and we talked and he didn't blast me online for it so I'm thankful for that but then he didn't do it anymore and this year he started up again and so for everyone who's catching up on the timeline no private recourse we did contact him before asked for the name of his pastors and elders to have this mediated in local church context which is

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God's way and he utterly refused then and he utterly refused now my private conversation with him this past Friday you guys all saw the screenshots

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I don't even know how many times that was that I asked for his elders and his church information and he refused utterly refused to give it

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I also back in August after being made aware of comments Tim was making about me on a podcast or a patreon phone call or something like that I made his board member aware of his breaking his his confession of sin he's back at it again

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I shared it with his board member that he says that I should share it with and the response we I got was that he wanted to mind his own business so that's where we're at we have had no private recourse we've tried that for almost five years private recourse has been rejected the pastoral oversight has been rejected public sin in a perpetual state over and over and over again with a man who has a history of dishonesty lies misrepresentation slander and so of course the confession of sin and the record and witness of it all has been placed online on the same platform that he is sitting on for the purposes of accountability because we have no other recourse there is no recourse with the church there's no recourse with with his ministry and organization there is no recourse for the victims so we made it available to you so that you can be a witness to Tim's behavior okay so I'm just gonna play this in case you haven't heard it in terms of being able to hear for yourself the confession and I just want to make sure

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I get the timing right here so forgive me just for the moment I look at this I wrote down some time stamps here so this is from where he contacted us remember after about two and a half years of abuse and lies and misrepresentation he contacted us we have no private recourse for the church none he will not give it up and so we were we had it recorded as a public witness or a witness permanent witness to our behavior and his behavior and comments hey it's nice to hear your voice

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Jeff yeah man you too I am I am

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I'm repenting I'm seeking reconciliation for my wrongs

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I have purposely misrepresented you guys to make my points

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I've made fun of Marcus behind his back and I've made a video making fun of Marcus and that was sin

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I made too much of post -millennialism and your position of post -millennialism

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I think I was like a caged stage pre -suffer and just not a post -millennialist

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I'm still not but the way we the way

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I handled our engagement with that was wrong saying that because you you include the kingdom in the gospel not just the salvation of souls and to say that that was a false gospel was was wrong on my part and I don't say that anymore it's interesting guys because skip ahead here to about 350 and you can hear a little bit more

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Aaron tattoos thing was wrong and men honestly you know

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I have disagreements with your theology I also am very envious of your ministry and that's a sin and we're on the same team and what we have our differences there's no sense me pointing in this war a spiritual war there's no sense of me pointing my gun at you we are on the same team and so we disagree on some areas that's that's not it's not important enough to to go to war at or for us to say things and Len and I were on the so there is the first part of the witness to the conversation with Tim again we record this recorded this because we have been abused by this man for years when we have no private recourse with his church or pastor we recorded this conversation as a matter of record and witness and I want you guys to hear now this is about 11 minutes and 25 seconds this is where we got to in the conversation by the way

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Tim admits that we freely forgave him graciously forgave him immediately it was there was no fight there was no art we were grateful to God God is our witness here

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Luke and I prayed about this for a long long time

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I want you to know how difficult it was to show mercy for years when somebody lies about you publicly through podcasts through a video through public posts it is very hard to show someone mercy when they are lying about you consistently and to essentially not reveal everything publicly and so we showed mercy and grace for a long time he contacted us we of course recorded it for as a witness and this is what he committed to this is 11 minutes and 21 seconds so yeah thank you you know you know you know what would help me is open lines like like if I catch wind of something that I disagree with I think

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I'd like to talk to somebody so what what do you have there you have a confession of sin purposeful misrepresentation that means lying motivated by jealousy and pride he says that throughout there you can hear it for yourself later in the conversation after we grant the forgiveness he then says in the future it would help me if I catch wind of something if I had open lines of communication here's what was said to him one of the three of you and get some clarification

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Tim I'll just be really honest and that we just don't have time for open lines we're moving into a position where Jeff is really busy and has to guard his pastoral time so he has an assistant now that people in the church have to make appointments with and so it'd be unfair to the members of our church if we gave you an open line and it's nothing personal against you it's just that we really have to guard

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Jeff's time as a pastor now with everything we're doing so if you if you mean though if you mean however like you'd like to be able to have a call for a question or something like that I can give you a route to do that so you can you can definitely do that like if you have a question about something bring something to our attention it's like hey what do you think of what

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Jeff's saying this you know he's saying this instead of going on and on a podcast and you know half understanding and trying to answer somebody's question it would be better to for me to get clarification that's what's the commitment instead of going online and doing a podcast with only half information what are you gonna do

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Tim you're gonna contact me for clarification so we have confession of sin and then a commitment in the future not to do that anymore

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I'm gonna contact you privately now you did it a year ago with Ben Shapiro and everything was fine you didn't do it this year when you started up this pattern of sin again you committed here to do so and you got full permission for it yeah and that and that's

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I think that's the order it should be done and I don't mean to stick a finger in a wound but just so you can kind of I could so it to say that I agree with you in the past when you know some stuff happened and we did get a chance to talk

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I think that's one of the things I said to you is you could have just called me and asked me before you went on and talked about it which

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I think that would be helpful so there's the there's the commitment and there's my granting

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Tim that access and I just want everyone to hear in that what Marcus was referring to there is because of our ministry and all the ways and all the areas we're serving and there's a lot of people that contact us on a daily basis messages emails phone calls those sorts of things and we're committed to our church body we're pastors of apology at church we're in front of our church body all day as a matter of fact today when we're done film when we're done with this we have an entire day booked with face -to -face with our members all day to minister to them to love them to encourage them to support them that's what we do all day and so Tim asking for access

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Marcus is like well wait our church body has takes precedence like they have to have access to Jeff and they have to have that and so like we just can't give you direct access and so but it was still granted to Tim still graciously granted to him even after all of the sin okay okay next

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Tim attempted over the last week when of course it's made known to him through private conversation that you're back at it again he attempted to minimize what he's been up to over the last couple of months by saying things like I was just offering a very gracious critique

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I never said I wasn't in critique Jeff again by the way brothers and sisters please hear me on this Tim's allowed to critique me anybody's allowed to critique me my teaching is public you're allowed to critique no problem misrepresentation right is the problem and misrepresentation purposeful misrepresentation and jealousy is what

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Tim was guilty of before he confesses to it and he said that he wouldn't do it again and he would make sure that he had communication for me privately before he went and did podcasts on something that's

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Tim's sin he broke his promise years of abuse almost five and now we're at the point we are now where there's public exposure of his sin that's what this ultimately is he tried to minimize it saying

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I was very gracious my critique I was just saying like priests up like we need to focus more on like making sure the gospel is in there succinctly so I want you to know over this last summer

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Tim started publishing videos and in and closer to us too he started publishing videos about me with my picture of my face saying let's play what would you rather with Jeff Durbin videos like Jeff Durbin attempts to preach the gospel videos like I think

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I was wrong about Jeff Durbin there's just the videos and of course there was a patreon phone call that I was sent where he's also talking about me in that phone call no conversation was made between Tim and I he never contacted me to say

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Jeff kind of clarification like can I make sure I understand this like he said he would do here in the confession he didn't do that he just started going on and repeating the same pattern of sin that he had years ago that he had committed against us for years this particular video

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I'm about to play for you right now and if you guys have your audio turned down make sure you turn it up for this one just because I think he talks kind of low in it this is from August the 2nd of this year then title the video is

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I think I was wrong about Jeff Durbin I think I was wrong about Jeff Durbin and this is it about the 10 -minute mark here is what

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Tim said on August 2nd 2019 you can see it if you didn't haven't heard it already so to be gracious after exposing his failure on that particular podcast see because I know that Jeff Durbin knows the gospel and I know that he can preach it clearly so I went looking for a short clip a short clip of him presenting the gospel clearly so that I could put it at the end of the podcast like hey

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Jeff this is what you should have done this is what you should have done right here and I couldn't find one we have almost 1 ,200 videos up over 10 years of ministry countless examples of on the street evangelism gospel preaching street preaching speaking around the world preaching the gospel messages let me just say this brothers and sisters please hear me on this as a pastor with a man who has sinned against us for a five -year history this accusation is not a small accusation it cuts to the heart of who we are as a minister when you allege that the minister of the gospel you can't find in 1 ,200 videos you couldn't find it me succinctly preaching the gospel like you just you can't find it

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I tried I couldn't find it that is not a low allegation that is the heart of everything if let me just say this if I can't succinctly preach the gospel as a minister

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I'm disqualified to be a minister this is no small allegation

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Tim it's the same pattern of behavior and I want to add very very importantly here is that people saw this and you can read the comments people are

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I'm gonna read them for you in a second here so you can see it's not just Jeff's interpretation of hey Tim what you're doing is strange here but I want to say this 1 ,200 videos

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Tim if you type in Jeff Durbin and gospel in the search bar on YouTube they start coming up they all start coming up it won't take you very long with 1 ,200 videos to find it and at the end of this show brothers and sisters at the very end and culmination we're gonna let you see for yourself of just a day of Isaac going through some videos he just put together he just pulled together things and it's by no means exhaustive to suggest that you look through our videos and you could not find a video or a clip of me succinctly preaching the gospel is mischaracterizing me and our ministry

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Tim you're lying we've demonstrated that you lied to your listeners last night through your teeth to your listeners you abused them you disrespected them you lied publicly last night you were lying years ago you confessed to lying about us and you're lying here this was in August next so that was

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I think I was wrong about Jeff isn't that the same one doesn't he go on to say then because people say no actually here's videos of him preaching the gospel this is the same one it's well he challenges listeners listeners at the end of this if you can find videos of him succinctly preaching the gospel you know you find them and that brings us to the next video next one oh yeah the next video so the next video is

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Jeff Durbin attempts to preach the gospel note the terminology Jeff Durbin attempts to preach the gospel first and foremost

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I can't find a clip of him doing it succinctly next is he attempts to preach the gospel so in this he's trying to respond to people who essentially are criticizing him saying hey this isn't fair you know you're not being right let me read to you some of the comments here in under Jeff Durbin attempts to preach the gospel not that these are the the full standard but in terms of of how are people receiving this from Tim this person says here

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I'm looking for videos that are brief short and to the point and when did Jeff say that's what his goal was for these videos somebody says excellent points if you look at turds videos he has viewer number spikes whenever he includes

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Durbin or someone else a little more well -known here we go next one you ask people to send in clips of him preaching the gospel and they do and you still find a way to discredit it laugh out loud this video is comical and somebody says absolutely nothing has been good enough somebody says

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I've lost all respect for you Tim you started quite well and now you're just a bitter Christian so here's the point

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I'm not going to go through all those comments just to make a point here it isn't just Jeff Durbin seeing what you're doing other people are saying

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Tim what are you doing here this is this isn't fair this isn't right what are you saying and in the point is is in this very video people sent him videos like just here some random videos and what he attempts to do as he goes through them is lie about what's in the video and he tries to move the goalpost further and further further down as people send him videos like here's a video

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Jeff preaching the gospel succinctly he continues to move the goalpost down the line because Tim won't just be confronted over his misrepresentation that's our experience with him so this particular video is

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Jeff Durbin attempts to preach the gospel and at 12 minutes I want you to hear what he says here this is very important he plays a video someone sent to him of me preaching the gospel on the beach very important memory told you he couldn't even find a video online of me succinctly preaching the gospel people start sending him videos like Tim like what are you doing you seem like you're a bitter

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Christian like what are you up to so he says here at 12 minutes listen to one video of me preaching the gospel on the beach it's 20 minutes long but you have to start at the 10 minute mark this was the suggestion from the people who sent it in was to be this is two people suggested this video the first 10 minutes is pretty much rambling and not the gospel okay so he has the video

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Tim did you think brother that people weren't gonna be able to go examine this did you think people were not committed enough to the truth that they wouldn't actually go and examine the video it is available right now for everyone to see for themselves and I encourage you guys to go do it it's called

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Jeff Durbin Jeff preaches the gospel on the beach Tim it's available for everybody to listen to and you said the first 10 minutes is rambling and not the gospel rambling and not the gospel well brothers and sisters

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I'm gonna play this for you a couple parts it's 10 minutes I'm not doing the 10 minutes I'll just do a couple parts here this is the two minute mark so it's it's in the first 10 minutes first this is the first 10 minutes

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I'm gonna play parts of this rambling this is Tim saying is rambling I want to ask you brothers and sisters please again this isn't about factions it's not about teams it's about just weights and measures

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Tim says he can't find videos 1 ,200 by the way of me succinctly preaching the gospel and he says that the first 10 minutes here is rambling

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I want to ask you faith if this sounds like rambling towards the gospel he actually says in one of his letters

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Galatians that he was so zealous to destroy the gospel and the

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Christian faith he tried to persecute the church he tried to destroy the faith he was a man who was very very dedicated very religious very strongly committed to his beliefs as a

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Jew ignoring everything the Bible had said of course about the Messiah and Jesus but he met the

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Lord Jesus alive from the dead on the way to persecute more Christians and his whole entire life was changed he went from persecuting

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Christians trying to destroy the Christian Church and the gospel to writing most of the

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New Testament so that was me actually about to read Romans chapter 1 to homeless people on a beach in Kauai preaching the gospel by the way there's videos also of us doing exactly the same thing and people coming to Christ in the video itself yeah because we're not preaching the gospel

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I guess succinctly enough and so that's me opening for Romans 1 and what did

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I mention there the Apostle Paul's experience and Jesus alive from the dead rambling there's something that I think needs to be pointed out here too there's a difference between a one -on -one conversation with somebody you know if this was just you with one person and you talked him for 20 minutes and it took you 20 minutes to get to the gospel that that's a different story then you're just literally we just sat up on the beach with a speaker and just preached to anyone that could hear there's there's a significant difference in in those two approaches and obviously you do what he says you didn't do but my point is like that should be taken into consideration here those are two different types of conversations right and when he says rambling

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I want to ask again is this really jaded to that term by now you probably had Christians here loving set apart for the gospel of God now

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I want to just hang on that word just for a moment there I'm sure better really that he wrote to a church he says Paul a slave of Messiah Jesus called to be an apostle set apart for the gospel of God now

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I want to just so this is at the three and a half minute mark this is more rambling this is more rambling me reading

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Romans chapter one so I talked about Paul seeing Jesus alive from the dead I'm reading

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Romans chapter one I'm reading from the text this is me rambling hang on that word just for a moment there

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I'm sure you've heard it the word gospel some of you guys are probably jaded to that term by now you probably had

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Christians here loving you and trying to serve you caring for your needs telling you about the gospel but I wanted to share with you what that word means it means good news

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I know some of you are lying here right now lying down on the ground struggling sad and broken and you feel like you're at the end of your rope you feel like there's no hope for you and I want to share with you that there is good news and not just good news from a man or a woman not just an inspirational message but this is good news from God so God's good news reading from Romans chapter 1

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I continue reading from Romans 1 there I'm just skipping ahead here guys because I don't want to do the whole 10 minutes with you but this is more rambling for me in the video according to Tim this is more rambling

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Jesus the Messiah Jesus who came into the world to rescue sinners to save them from their sins

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I know that you feel so there is six minute mark Jesus coming into the world to save sinners from their sin here are some of you guys lying here on the grass living here on the beach you feel like your plight is completely hopeless you feel like the life that you're living is hopeless and broken and dark and I want to encourage you to see that God loves sinners so much that he actually gave us the story of his salvation long before it happened

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God was coming to save sinners the Old Testament God's coming to save sinners this is the message of redemption the gospel talk about the resurrection this is six minutes in and this is the first 10 minutes of rambling again this is not about who your favorite person is this is about standards that God tells us to uphold as Christians God's standards

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Tim is lying again for us as a church it's been like I said almost five years of abuse we've tried private recourse we've tried the local church he utterly refused then years ago and now he committed to not doing this anymore and to contact me in the future if he had questions he didn't do that when

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I was made aware of all this stuff that was happening I tried to give the information to somebody on his board that he says he would want me to give it to the person was dismissive of it and now actually is trying to use that against us to say somehow that we're just sharing this like flowers out of a hat with people sort of a thing no we shared it first trying to get help from somebody that's in his ministry with them and they were just saying no it's best of my my own business and now you have

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Tim continuing a pattern that he had for years with us that we just showed him mercy over and didn't respond back to and fight with him over publicly and sling mud he's continuing that pattern all over again and in this video itself there are a number of videos up guys you can look at him yourself we're not going to play through all of them

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I just gave you two parts where he's misrepresenting and lying again again when he tries to mischaracterize it and say no

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I was just being gracious gracious and offering or critique I think you can hear for yourself that's not what he's doing he's not offering a gracious critique he's coming to the heart of our ministry saying that he can't find videos of us me succinctly preaching the gospel you're all gonna see differently in a moment here and then in a video like this when someone says hey look here's a video of him succinctly preaching the gospel he says well you know maybe the last ten minutes yeah but the first ten minutes he says that's just it's all rambling and not the gospel

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God coming as a man to save his people from their sins Jesus alive from the dead salvation reading the book of Romans is rambling

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Tim you are once again guilty of lying and I just want to say this whole thing is about integrity right yes and what

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Tim brother like what you've done what you've been doing these videos what you've done last week is ultimately attack the integrity of our ministry your videos that lack greatly lack integrity and honesty have now caused people to question our integrity which again goes back to that's the very definition of sewing discord among brothers but I have an honest question for you brother what are you trying to do what are you trying to accomplish like what is the point of doing these videos how is this benefiting the body of Christ how is this bringing honor and glory to our

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Savior wouldn't your time be much better served by doing what

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Jeff is doing by being out in the street and preaching the gospel somebody to somebody to people on the beach so I asked that honestly graciously and in love what are you trying to accomplish whose glory are you seeking and doing videos like this

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Thank You pastor Luke next somebody sent him another video and they're like look here's an example of Jeff succinctly preaching the gospel here it is anyway it was kind of awkward but we all do have to support our ministry oh by the way also he mentions

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I just want to say briefly look at the video yourself guys Jeff Durbin priest attempts priest the gospel 13 minutes ish he says it was weird because at the last 10 minute mark where I was preaching the gospel like calling people to repentance of faith he's like an ad came up and he was like it was just really weird like why is an ad coming up there we didn't do that that's

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YouTube it's just YouTube I didn't do that brother I didn't do it it's sort of like it's sort of another example of like it was a veiled shot it's like a shot like as though as though Jeff Durbin or Luke Pearson went here's the money shot yeah here's the money shot put the ad there we didn't do it

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Tim and if you had called me like you said you're gonna do or contacted me privately

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I could have easily told you that years of abuse years of slander years of victimization from you to us now happening once again so this is another example someone sent another video and just to show you how he moves the goalpost down the line okay then there was a second video what is the gospel of Jesus Christ two people also sent this one and interestingly enough this is a this is a fairly good gospel presentation however however if you have to go back four and a half years to find a clear gospel presentation you gotta anyway let me just it's a video out of 1200 videos what was the date on the video he's it's about four years and what was the one the one we just watched oh it was within the last year yeah yeah so okay we're gonna leave it there he then goes on the video you'll see to just say like the gospel for Mormons video someone's like well here's a video the gospel for Mormons and basically what he says is yeah but that's mostly anti -mormon stuff like that's just anti -mormon stuff like yeah

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I need a succinct presentation of the gospel kind of a thing and so brother Tim listen

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I want to just say as I've said you a number of times I love you I've prayed for you for years this man next to me has prayed for you we have asked

32:44

God for strength to show you mercy to be forgiving towards you you know that I've tried for years to have this your sin which you've confessed to mediated with the local church with authority and elders you know that I've tried you've lied to your listeners last night you lied to them through your teeth and there there's a there's a there's a problem here in that you will not allow people to know the truth and we have tried to keep this secret for a very long time for you and we've gotten to the point with no recourse whatsoever with the local church with somebody who's in your ministry with you to where we now we're at a place where we say well here's the putt here's the witness to what

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Tim has been up to Tim you're guilty brother and I love you and I'm asking for you to repent of this we'll forgive you again we will but you have to come clean

33:42

Tim with what you've been up to you have to be honest no more excuses no more excuses no more lying to people about what you've been up to the thing is

33:53

Tim I think I just want to say this to you what you've done is public people can examine this for themselves so when you say one thing and then someone looks at the video itself and I see they say that's not true you have to understand that you have to have enough respect for your brothers and sisters to not do that to them to lie to them and think that they won't see it and in a case like this again

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I want to apologize to all of our listeners we've never wanted Apology of Studios to have to do something like this and I'm sorry

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I am it has grieved us for days not that we're presenting the information there's vindication here but it grieves us that we're using

34:38

Apology of Studios platform when we could be preaching the gospel talking about serious issues as a church we can face together with the gospel we could be trying to save children through videos and content saving children we could be reaching the cults and what we're doing right now is responding to the lies the slander and misrepresentation of a man who's abused us for years and again if you guys are getting on to this for the first time clarifying go back watch again we're not

35:08

Tim's pastor he is not a congregant he lives in Pennsylvania he's refused more times than I can count or remember any private recourse to the local church we've asked for it for years going on five years in February and now it's public on the same platform he's sitting on as a witness to what he's been up to absolutely do you want to have any final comments and everybody

35:36

I'm about to show you guys one more thing as we depart here did he really say that that was full of anti -mormon stuff he said it was like is anti -mormon stuff okay

35:45

I gotta say this and this is not at all to break and us is only the boast in the

35:50

Lord brother do you know how many Mormons have come to Christ through that video and we made it into a track like we constantly get emails and messages from Mormons who watch that video and came to Christ through it

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I can't even remember Luke I know I know it's crazy and like I know we've in the last this year alone 2019 we've handed out about 10 ,000 of those ourselves our own church that's based on that and yes and we have those up on our store

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I don't even know how many tens of thousands of those we've sold that people are using constantly to to lead their

36:24

Mormon family members and friends to Christ so I that's that I don't know that's just silly that's a good point

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I didn't even think about and I guess not nothing else it's just because the Gospels in there we made that video by accident but yes we did we weren't even supposed to be inside the

36:39

Gospels so succinct in that video it's in a three -page tract hmm so it's not in a 20 -page booklet it's in a track that we hand out right and and you're right we've lost count as to how many

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Mormons have come to Christ because of that because of that video guy and by the way Wade's over here he knows he's shaking his not in his head he hands it out every weekend yes every weekend he hands out that Mormon at Mormon wards around the valley it's yeah and and the amazing thing just just for fun and for those you guys are listening just just for a praise to God the story behind that video itself is pretty incredible Luke and I are heading out the door of my house to go get on a plane to go to Idaho yeah and all of a sudden we get being like a our plane is is canceled and so we're like what are we gonna do how are we gonna get there and then they were like well we can get you on this flight to Salt Lake but you have to stay tonight in Salt Lake and we were like whatever we have to do and so we ended up going to Salt Lake not having a plan staying in a hotel and when we got the hotel we're like where's

37:39

Salt Lake City yeah we never been there it's 2 in the morning it's 2 in the morning we're like let's go to the temple and make a video it was so cold

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Luke will tell you I'm such a baby with cold sure we had this first heat us up in the car blasting the heat and and I'm talking like throw up heat yes where it's like me you know

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Wade's laughing because he's built similar to me like I mean I couldn't even sit in the car it was so hot I'm like yeah

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I'm like nauseous and he's in here shivering yeah so they're heating me up first and then I literally just jump out of the car and what you see in the video for the gospel for Mormons is literally

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I had jumped up jumped on the car I run back Marcus has the camera on and I just walk up to the camera and I just start talking about the gospel and Mormonism and it was like all right get in the car and have you run home we got three hours of sleep we got three hours of sleep got to get another plane but that video is

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God it's his providence he did it and I can't tell you how many Mormons have come to Christ as a result of the video and the tracks glory to God and if you're an all -access subscriber you paid for that yes you help make it legitimately you help make it happen your your your partnership with this paid for that video yes brothers and sisters

38:50

I'm grateful that you guys listened I know I've apologized numerous times in this for having to use this platform to respond to misrepresentation lies and those sorts of things

38:59

I am terribly sorry and if I could have some final words here no factions even if you're a person that's impacted by our ministry for years and you love us no factions let's avoid slandering one another and the fighting let this be a record and a testimony to what

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Tim has done his lies his misrepresentation over five years let it be a record so that you have access to it to know no this is actually the truth

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I've seen with my own eyes I've heard it with my own ears I know the testimony I know it all let it be a record but do not allow this to be something that sows further discord in the body of Christ we are we are begging for that do not allow this to divide brothers and sisters in Christ this man sin is not worthy to do that do not let this man's pattern of sin be something that continues to sow discord in God's bride we don't want anything to do with that we want the truth of God to be used by all of us to bring to the world to transform the world that's what we want and I just want you all to know how hard it was for us to come to the decision to once and for all expose this to no longer keep his secrets and to use this this platform to do so thank you guys all so much for your love and for your prayers let's move forward please let's move forward with the gospel let's let's join together with unity and love for each other let's let's uphold with one another biblical standards of not accepting someone's case just because they say it the first person to state their case sounds right or true until another one comes to examine them and now you've seen it why do you not receive the accusation but unless it's on the basis of two to three independent lines of evidence because of situations like this you may not even know what's going on in the background what's been kept as an act of mercy towards this man for years you didn't know and now you know so one more thing we're gonna end with this

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I'm gonna play right now Tim's clip where he essentially says

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I looked I couldn't find any clips of Jeff preaching the gospel succinctly we're just gonna play a montage by the way this is by no means exhaustive by no means exhaustive it's just a quick montage that I Isaac put together yesterday

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I hope you guys are blessed by it and I hope more than anything it demonstrates a problem with some of the claims that have been made and again let's just pray the

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Lord for unity and let's join together to preach the gospel let's go save cultists let's go save babies let's go reach our culture for Christ let's join together and worship together before our

41:46

God who saved us from our sins all right guys thank you so to be gracious after exposing his failure on that particular podcast see because I know that Jeff Durbin knows the gospel and I know that he can preach it clearly so I went looking for a short clip a short clip of him presenting the gospel clearly so that I could put it at the end of the podcast like hey