Having the Lord's Presence With Us Always — Zac Poonen

It's a great joy for me to be here with you, brothers and sisters. It was a great honor when God called me out of my job to serve Him in India for the last 50 years. I've lived in India all my life. And the Lord has called me to teach His Word and plant churches in the villages and the cities of India.

And our emphasis has been to plant churches according to the pattern we find in the Acts of the Apostles. Free from the rituals and traditions that have accumulated in Christianity over 20 centuries. And we've seen in the last 40 years that God is the same as He was in the first century.

And the way the Apostles did His work in the first century, we can do today. And we can even do it in India, which is one of the poorest countries. And I've seen that in the poorest villages. And also in some villages where there were no church for 2 ,000 years.

It's not by any technique. It's by what we've been thinking about the Lord being with us. If you would like to look up our website, our church is called Christian Fellowship Church. So the website is cfcindia .com.

Christ's Presence With the Emmaus Disciples

So I want to turn first to Luke 24 in verse 28 and 29. Luke 24, verse 28 and 29. The verse we've been looking at since yesterday evening. This happened after the resurrection of Jesus. And it says when He came to the house in Emmaus of these two disciples.

He acted as though He would go further. Why did He act as though He wanted to go further? And it says in the next verse, they urged Him. That means when they said, please stay with us. He said, no, I think I'll go on.

They said, no, we want you to stay. They urged Him. I don't know how many times they urged Him. There's something for us to learn there. When He saw that they really wanted Him, then He stayed. It's the same way He deals with us.

We can be satisfied with things other than the presence of the Lord. Yesterday we heard from Exodus 33. Where the Lord said to Moses, I'll send my angel with you. And I will drive out all your enemies.

Now, most people would be quite happy with that. I mean, there are so many people nowadays testifying about seeing angels. They're excited when they see an angel. And somebody else testifies they saw two angels.

Somebody says they saw three. But Moses said, no, not even a hundred angels. We want your presence, Lord, to go with us. We don't want to just see miracles. They'd already seen multitudes of miracles for 40 years in the wilderness.

It's a wonderful thing when we come in the Christian life to the place where we are not satisfied with just miracles. We can see miracles and not have the presence of the Lord. Jesus said that in the last day, many will come to Him.

And they will say, Lord, we did miracles in Your name. We cast out demons in Your name. We prophesied in Your name. Those are some of the greatest miracles. And the Lord says, I will say to them, I never knew you.

Depart from me, you workers of iniquity. And what was it those people had? Miracles. But they did not want the presence of the Lord. They did not urge Him, saying, Lord, stay with us. We're not satisfied with miracles.

There are many like that today. The presence of the Lord is not there. In the church. But there are many other wonderful messages and sermons and miracles. The Lord spoke through Jeremiah to Israel. In Jeremiah 29, verse 13.

You will seek me and find me only when you search for me with all your heart. If you are satisfied with mere answers to prayer. If you're satisfied. If you're satisfied with seeing a few angels. And some miracles that you can testify about to others.

You will never have me. My presence will not be with you. Dear brothers and sisters. Even if you never see a miracle in your life. The presence of the Lord is the most wonderful thing that we can have in the new covenant.

The New Covenant Privilege of God's Presence

They couldn't have that in the old covenant. We read in the tabernacle, the glory of the Lord rested on the most holy place. The tabernacle had three parts. But God dwelt in the most holy place. And there was a veil there.

You couldn't go in. You could do a lot of other things in the other places. But the Lord was saying through that veil, you cannot come into my presence. I'll give you manna from heaven. Not for one day, but for 40 years.

I'll heal your snake bites. I'll do miracles for you. But you can't come into my presence. I'm too holy. The children of Israel experienced the most wonderful miracles for 40 years that anybody's ever experienced.

I mean, if you got manna from heaven one day in your life, you'd be testifying about it for the rest of your life. But they got it every day for 40 years. Straight from heaven. And yet the Bible says God was not pleased with them.

What did they not have? They did not have the presence of the Lord. There's no group of people in the entire Old Testament who experienced as many miracles as those Israelites in the wilderness. But they didn't have the presence of the Lord.

But when Jesus died on Calvary, that veil was rent. And the Holy Spirit was saying, now you can have what nobody in the old covenant could have. Now you can say, Lord abide with us and he'll be with you.

In the Old Testament, the glory was on top of the tabernacle, like a pillar of fire. And then later on in the temple. But that glory departed from Israel. If you read sometime in Ezekiel chapter 10, you see how the glory went to the gate of Israel.

And then outside the gate of the temple. And it finally went away. And then the Lord showed Ezekiel in prophecy. In chapter 43, that God would bring that glory back. That was a prophetic reference to the new covenant age in which we live.

The glory that departed from Israel would come back into the church. And now the glory will not be just in the most holy place. There is a lovely verse in Ezekiel 43 in verse 12. It says, this is the new law of God's house.

It's not only the most holy place which will be holy. The whole area of that mountain will be most holy. Unlike the Old Testament tabernacle. In other words, it will not be just a special area of your life that will be most holy.

In Israel, six days they did their ordinary jobs. But the seventh day was holy. But now the Lord is saying, the whole area, every day, every day of our life is going to be most holy. That is the new covenant.

Where we can dwell in the presence of the Lord, not one day a week. But seven days a week. Where we can dwell in the most holy place in the presence of the Lord, seven days a week. Where we say, Lord abide with us and He'll be with us every day.

Not only in our church meetings. But in our secular jobs. In our business. That the Lord can be with us. When we play games. In our homes as we bring up our children. That the presence of the Lord will be there.

They could never have that in the old covenant. I mean, if you went to an Israelite and told him that you could have the presence of the Lord in your home every day. They'd say, oh no, that's only in the temple, in the most holy place.

We can't have Him here in our home. Do we realize what a tremendous privilege it is to have the presence of the Lord in our home every single day? In our business place. In our office, in our factory.

That the most holy place is in our home now. That we can bring up our children in the most holy place. This is a tremendous privilege. Because Jesus now says, where two or three are gathered in my name, there I am.

There I am in the midst. Listen carefully. Matthew 18, verse 20. Not where two or three gather together themselves, but where two or three are gathered together by the Holy Spirit. The Lord is in the midst.

Can you imagine how it will be if we live in our home, just two, husband and wife, with the Lord in the midst? Can you speak an angry word to your wife if Jesus is there between you? Can you fight with your husband if Jesus is there between you?

Why do we fight? Why do we lose our temper at home? We can have a text on the wall, the Lord is the head of this house. He's not there. He is not there. If he is there, can you imagine you're fighting with your wife or husband?

We wouldn't even do that in the presence of another human being. Supposing you and your wife are having a heated argument. And you hear the doorbell. Doesn't the argument stop immediately? Because a man has come.

And you're peaceful again. But after 15 minutes he goes away. And the argument continues. Because now we see it's only Jesus here. Who cares for him? We don't fear God. We fear man. No wonder the Lord is not with us.

We can imagine he's there. We can quote Matthew 18, 20 and say, Lord, you are here. If he were there, we would speak in a different way. We would obey the command which says, let your speech always be with grace.

That is in Colossians 4, verse 6. Let your speech always, always means 24 hours, be with grace. How is that possible? Only one way. By the power of the Holy Spirit. There is no other way. It's not by gritting our teeth and doing yoga or something like that.

Testing the Ministry of the Holy Spirit by Christ and Scripture

What does the Holy Spirit bring to us? Today there's more talk about the Holy Spirit than there ever was for many centuries. But there's so much confusion concerning the ministry of the Holy Spirit. The thing that's helped me in my 57 years as a Christian, that I see Jesus himself as the perfect example of a spirit-filled man.

So, whenever I see people doing different things saying, this is the ministry of the Holy Spirit, I look in the Gospels and say, did Jesus do that? If he did not do it, then I don't want it. I have a four-fold test for the ministry of the Holy Spirit.

Number one, did Jesus do it? Number two, did Jesus teach it? Three, did the apostles do it? And if it fails on those four, I say, I don't want it. I don't care who says it's the Holy Spirit. So, let me speak very frankly.

I don't want to criticize anybody. But sometimes we are so afraid of speaking the truth, because we don't want to hurt anyone. But the truth does hurt sometimes. But it's not the knife of a murderer, it's the knife of a surgeon trying to remove a cancer from the body of Christ.

I see people pushing people down nowadays and saying it's the Holy Spirit. Jesus lifted people up. He never pushed people down. He didn't do it. He didn't teach it. The apostles didn't do it. The apostles didn't teach it.

I don't care who does it. I'm not here to judge them. God bless them. But I don't want it. For me, the Word of God is the only guide I have on this earth. So, how was it with Jesus when the Holy Spirit was with him?

Let me read you a verse in Acts chapter 10 and verse 38. This is what Peter spoke to Cornelius. And he says, you know Jesus of Nazareth. Acts 10, verse 38. God anointed him with the Holy Spirit and with power and he went about doing good.

That's the first result, it says here, of being anointed with the Holy Spirit. I say, Lord Jesus, I want to be like you. I want you to abide with me. And if you are with me, you will make me do what you did in the power of the Holy Spirit.

It says, when you were anointed, you went everywhere doing good. Even if I am no gift of the Spirit, Lord, help me to go around doing good. Why do you covet the gifts that will bring you honor? Why not seek this gift of the Holy Spirit to go around doing good?

And to do good in such a way that your left hand does not know what your right hand did. That nobody knows that you are the one who did that good. I believe Jesus did good even before the age of 30. Even when he was a carpenter.

He must have helped poor widows and so many other people with different needs. It's not written in Scripture. Because Jesus wouldn't talk about it. He would not let the left hand know what the right hand did.

That is the mark of a person with whom Jesus is abiding. All of us can't heal the sick or do miracles. But is there a single believer sitting here who can say, I don't know how to do good? Why do we look for the spectacular things?

Jesus went about doing good. I want it to be written about me at the end of my life that I went everywhere doing good. That I didn't do bad to anybody. Even if I did that in my old, stupid, unconverted days.

But from the time I got light I went about doing good. That will be a wonderful testimony if you have that at the end of your life. It's not the only mark of being filled with the spirit but it's a very important mark.

The fruit of the spirit is goodness. And not only that. It says he delivered those who were oppressed by the devil. Acts 10 38. There are many people all around us who are oppressed by the devil. Some are demon possessed but almost everybody is oppressed from the outside.

And here it says the people are oppressed. Jesus set them free. And you can set them free with a word. For example discouragement. That is a result of the oppression of the devil. And sometimes it requires only one sentence to encourage a person.

The bible says that prophecy, one part of prophecy is encouragement. In the old testament prophecy was predicting the future. In the new testament it is encouragement. And challenging people. And building them up.

You don't have to predict the future now to prophesy. There are very few like Agabus who may do that. But most of us can encourage. Very easy. When you write an email you can add one sentence at the end, encouragement.

Or you speak on your phone and end with a line of encouragement at the end. You may deliver somebody who is oppressed by the devil. It's a ministry everyone can have. And then finally it says here in Acts 10 .38 Jesus was anointed with the Holy Spirit.

He had power. Power to do what? To do good. To deliver people who are oppressed by the devil. And then it says thirdly because God was with him. God was with him. Although he himself was God. He came to earth as a man for our sake.

And lived with our limitations. So that he needed the anointing of the Holy Spirit just like you and me. And then God was with him. And God can be with us. Like we pray Lord abide with us. So we see something from this verse.

That it is through the power of the Holy Spirit that the Lord can abide with us. So my dear brothers and sisters don't get turned away from the ministry of the Holy Spirit because of the confusion and extreme things that people are doing around us.

We need the power of the Holy Spirit. Then God will be with us just like he was with Jesus. And we shall also encourage others and deliver them. But how shall we ensure that he's going to be with us? His name is Holy Spirit.

Holiness as the Evidence of the Spirit's Presence

Unclean spirits make people unclean. Evil spirits make people evil. What does the Holy Spirit do? Just make a lot of noise. There was a brother who came to our church service one day. He was from another church which had a different teaching on the Holy Spirit.

And in our church we believe in clapping our hands, raising our hands, raising our voice. But that's not the main thing for us. This brother came from a church where they make even a louder noise than ours.

So he said, Brother, you don't have the Holy Spirit here. I said, how do you know that? Do you see how I talk to my wife? Do you see how I handle my money? How can you say I don't have the Holy Spirit?

He said, there's not enough noise here. I said, ah, that is the difference. Your trinity is Father, Son and noisy spirit. My trinity is Father, Son and Holy Spirit. I'm ready to make a noise but that doesn't prove that I have the Holy Spirit.

I saw a man in a Christian meeting once shouting and praising God. When I came near him after the meeting he was smelling of alcohol. So I realized that you don't need the Holy Spirit to make a noise.

You just got to get drunk. The Holy Spirit has come to make us holy. And if you're not interested in holiness the Lord will not abide with you. And you have to long for it. Jesus did not invite everybody to come to him.

What did he say in John 7, 37? If any man thirst, let him come to me. What if we don't thirst? What if you just like to come to Jesus like that? Just like that. You're not invited. He said, if anyone thirst.

Another verse. Very well known, Matthew 11, 28. 11, 28. Come to me. Not everybody. No. Those who are weary and heavy laden. And I will give you rest. I want to paraphrase those words. Jesus says, come to me those who are sick and tired of your defeated sinful life.

And I will bring you into the rest of God a holy life. But if you're not sick and tired of your sinful life don't come. You're not invited. I remember one man came to me at one of our church conferences.

He said, Brother Zach, I would like to join your church. I said, why? He said, I'm sick and tired of the church I belong to. I said, please don't come. Stay where you are. Because you come to us, you'll be sick and tired of us also after some time.

We're not perfect. We are pressing on to perfection. When you get sick and tired of yourself and your sinful life, then come. Because in our church we are a bunch of people who are sick and tired of our defeated life.

And the Lord is leading us from one degree of holiness to another to perfection in Christ. We have a verse in front of our pulpit in our church. Let us press on to perfection. That is saying we're not perfect.

But we're not sitting back. We are pressing on to perfection. We haven't reached the top of the mountain but we are climbing. And every year finds us a little closer there. And the Lord is with us. And our great longing is that the Lord will abide with us on that mountain.

You know, if you really desire the power of the Holy Spirit we must seek for holiness first. Gifts are important. I believe in the gifts of the Holy Spirit. We have demon-possessed people in the villages in India.

And we've cast out many demons. We pray for the sick and see them healed. If you can't cast out demons you can't work in the villages in India. You cannot work people. Because what do you do? Demon-possessed people don't need counseling.

They need deliverance. And they go in the name of Jesus. I have never in my life had to speak more than once to a demon to go. If I tell him to go once in the name of Jesus and the demon doesn't go I say, Lord, I need to go and pray and fast.

Something's wrong with me. How dare this demon say to me Jesus I know and Paul I know but I don't know you. We believe in the gifts of the Holy Spirit. But we also know Jesus had those gifts only when he was 30.

He exercised the gifts of the Holy Spirit for three and a half years. He lived a holy life for 33 and a half years. Do you see the proportion? The gifts of the Spirit for three and a half years holiness for 33 and a half years.

Teaching me one thing. I need the gifts of the Spirit. I sought for the gift of preaching when I was 22 years old for the gift of prophecy and God gave it to me. But what I learned from Jesus is that holiness is 10 times more important than gifts because he was holy for 33 and a half years and he had gifts for 33 and a half years.

That is the balance we need in our life. The devil's not afraid of a person who just has gifts. He's afraid of a holy person and he's especially afraid of a holy person who is really humble. Through the years I've heard many people preach holiness too.

Some of them are so proud. Their attitude is Lord I thank you that I'm not like other men. And they don't say that but when I sense that spirit in somebody I stay away. I say Lord I don't want that. That's the spirit of the Pharisee that looks down on others who are sinners.

Inner Purity, Joy, and Obedience

Jesus was not like that. I've come through the years to discover one thing I was a very defeated Christian when I was born again. I was defeated in my thoughts defeated in anger but I was born again. My sins were forgiven but I couldn't control my tongue I couldn't control my thoughts.

For years it went like that for 15, 16 years. Then about 42 years ago I said Lord I'm not going to preach anymore because I'm a hypocrite. I'm preaching things which are not true in my private life. Externally my life was okay.

I never fooled around with women. I always paid my taxes but my thought life that's the thing that disturbed me and my tongue control of my tongue and I said Lord until you make my inner life pure I'm not going to preach.

How will you be with me if I've got dirty thoughts? How can I say Lord abide with me and I'm thinking all these dirty thoughts? How can I say Lord stay in my house if I get angry with my wife? I read a verse which says rejoice in the Lord always.

You know the meaning of always? 24 hours a day 7 days a week Philippians 4 .4 Rejoice in the Lord 24 hours a day 7 days a week I said Lord it's not true. Not true in my life and that is not a suggestion.

There are no suggestions in the Bible only commandments. If it was a suggestion then I can say Lord forget it. But the same God who said you shall not commit murder also said rejoice in the Lord 24 hours a day.

How can I take one command seriously and ignore the other? Is it some lesser God who gave that command? Is this really the word of God? I'm convinced that many Christians do not believe that the Bible is the word of God from cover to cover.

I believe it and it changed my life and it's changed the lives of thousands of people in our churches because we have taught the commands of God and the Lord has been with us. Then finally the Lord met with me about 41 years ago He filled me with the Holy Spirit again and made the word of God which I preached real in my inner life.

I said Lord I don't want to rejoice just in the meeting and give people the impression that I'm very happy. 24 hours a day means that I will never be in a bad mood on any day at any time. So many things may go wrong in the world around me and it happens also there can be persecution from Christians from many people Christians and non-Christians and that's increasing in India now but we don't live in fear we can rejoice not in our circumstances but in the Lord.

Because God is still on the throne the devil was defeated 2000 years ago my sins are blotted out. God says I will not remember my sins anymore. Christ is coming back I'm ready to meet him. The most important things are ok a little bit of problems here and there maybe a little financial difficulty not serious because my father will still care for me.

We can rejoice in the Lord 24 hours if we do what the Bible says fix our eyes on Jesus. And then I read another verse when we say Lord abide with us. How do I know the Lord is with me. How do I know I'm in the presence of the Lord.

Confession and Forgiveness Restore Fellowship With God

Psalm 16 verse 11 and just by the way this verse was quoted by Peter on the day of Pentecost as belonging to Jesus as referring to Jesus on the day of Pentecost. Peter quoted this verse as referring to the Lord Jesus on the day of Pentecost verse 11 just one part in the middle of that verse in your presence Lord there is fullness of joy.

Lord abide with us. How do I know I'm in the presence of the Lord. There is fullness of joy. So many years ago I said to myself whenever there is not fullness of joy in my life I am not in the presence of the Lord for me it is a rule in my life.

If I slip up and I've lost my joy for a few seconds because something happened around me. I immediately say to myself I am not in the presence of the Lord right now because in the presence of the Lord there is fullness of joy.

So I immediately say Lord what did I do wrong. I want to confess my sin and the Lord shows us. We said it right and we come back into the presence of the Lord. Many years ago before I got married I had to go for a very minor operation in a hospital.

It was a very small thing but they had to put me under anesthesia and the doctor was a believer. Some days after the operation I found a very severe nerve pain down my right hand. This is about 48 years ago.

I went to a neurosurgeon. He examined me he said did you have general anesthesia sometime ago. I said yes. I did that in another hospital he said. Then something happened there when they lifted you up from the bed because you were not conscious they were not careful in holding your head up and it fell at an angle and you did not feel anything.

But something happened in your neck and that is what is causing this pain. And you will have to live with it for the rest of your life. And I was going to get married next month. You can imagine how I felt.

I was a Christian but I did not have victory over sin. So I wrote a very strong angry letter to that doctor. This is what you have done to me through your carelessness. The next morning the Lord said you have sinned.

You have no right to write a letter like that to him. Write another letter now and ask for forgiveness. He did not do that on purpose. I humbled myself. I said my dear brother I am really sorry for the way I wrote yesterday please forgive me.

You helped me. But accidentally it happened. It is ok. A day or two later this pain disappeared. It has never come back. There is a power in forgiveness. There are sicknesses I have seen in people that will never be healed with injections and tablets.

If you want the Lord to be with you Lord abide with us. Let me tell you the first lesson confess your sins and forgive others. Is there anybody whom you have not forgiven. The Bible says let us confess our sins and then pray for one another that we may be healed.

That is in James 5 confess your sins to one another and then pray and you will be healed. So whenever people ask me to pray for them when they are sick there is only one question I ask them have you forgiven everybody.

Is there anybody in the world who hurt you whom you have not forgiven. Do that right now silently. I don't want to hear it in your mind. Say Lord I forgive that person and I forgive that other person that relative of mine who cheated me.

People who got anger against their father and mother forgive them. Maybe some brother in the church some sister. Jesus said pray like this our father in heaven forgive us our sins as we forgive others.

And he said if you don't forgive others your heavenly father will not forgive you. That is in Matthew 6 you read verse 14 and 15 it is so clear. He doesn't say God won't forgive you. He says your father will not forgive you.

When he says God that can be referring to unbelievers but he is talking to his children. Your heavenly father will not forgive you. And supposing you die like that unforgiven. Are you going to go into God's presence.

Is there a second chance after death to get your sin forgiven. We must live every day in an attitude where we have forgiven everybody in the world. Then when we say Lord abide with us he will be there.

He will say here I am. And there will be fullness of joy in his presence. There is fullness of joy. There is another thing the Lord showed me you have the presence of the Lord with us all the time. Jesus said in Luke 16 and verse 13 he said there were two masters in the world.

Serving God Rather Than Money

Now if you were to ask the average Christian who are the two masters in the world 90 of them will say God and Satan. But Jesus said the two masters were God and money. Nobody thinks they can serve God and Satan at the same time.

But there are a lot of preachers who think they can serve God and money. There are plenty of them in the world today. But Jesus said you cannot let me read to you. No servant can serve two masters. He will hate the one and love the other or he will hold on to one and despise the other.

You cannot serve God and mammon. Mammon means money property, real estate wealth, gold, silver, everything. So what does that mean. How to find out whether I'm serving God or money. It's quite easy supposing.

There are two people standing here A and B and they both say Zak Poonen is my servant. He says Zak Poonen is my servant. He says Zak Poonen is my servant. How to find out. Well you tell them both of you call Zak Poonen so he calls me and he calls me the one I go to.

I am his servant. Now in some situations God calls you and money calls you the one you respond to. You are that servant. I have seen people in India who say they have a great burden to work among children child evangelism, fellowship.

And they work. And then they discover that you get a better salary if you work in radio ministry. And suddenly they lose their burden for children. They say I have a burden for radio ministry. Who called them there a higher salary.

A pastor works in a church. They love him. It's a small church. He doesn't get much money but he is building a good fellowship. But then he gets an invitation to a bigger church more prestigious, more money, more position.

And he says the Lord is calling me. I feel a burden to go there. All hypocrisy money has called him. The Christian world today is full of it today. Money has replaced the Holy Spirit. People seek for money in Christian work more than for the anointing of the Holy Spirit.

I come from a country which is filled with preachers like that always sending reports to Europe and America about the work they are doing. And those generous brothers in America and Europe think I am supporting a great work there.

I live there. I live there for 76 years. I know what's going on. I know orphanages which only exist on paper. There is no real orphanage there. This is what's going on in so called Christian work in India.

The name of the Lord is dishonored. People are not serving God. They are serving money. They don't need the Holy Spirit. They don't care if the Lord is not with them. So long as the money keeps coming in from America and Europe it's ok.

Who wants the Lord? Money is here. The bank account is full. This is the country I live in. 95 of Christian workers in India are like that. But when I say that to some of their supporters in the western countries you think they believe me?

I was in America once one American brother asked me do you know this particular person? Do you know this worker in India? I said brother be careful. He thought I was jealous of him. I said ok. A little later that man swindled him of 250 ,000 dollars.

He went there and he discovered he was living an immoral life. You think he was serving God? His reports were fantastic. Thousands converted photographs. It's easy to get photographs in India. We have so many poor people that if you arrange a meeting you can easily get 1 ,000 people.

2 ,000 people to come. Especially if you give them free food. God and money. Money has replaced the Holy Spirit. But it's not only money. Theological degrees have replaced the Holy Spirit. I'm not against theological degrees but I know that Jesus didn't have one.