The End of A B O R T I O N in Oklahoma?

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I would say if the authorities didn't want us involved in the public square, they ought not to have crucified

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Jesus in the public square. Use humanistic principles. It's the same idea. It's the same end.

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I would say, what's the problem with stardust bumping into stardust? In the cosmic picture? None.

00:21

There's no problem. In the cosmic picture, it won't matter. No, Mr.

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President. You are not protecting reproductive freedom. You are authorizing the destruction of freedom for one million little human beings every year.

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I'm sorry, my friends, but I am tired of seeing Jesus presented as a weak beggar.

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He is a powerful savior. And the gospel is not a suggestion.

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It is a command. Reverend Huller, don't you sympathize with that?

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I sympathize with every single human heart wishing to know the one true and living God, but I believe there's only one way that that can happen through Jesus Christ, and the gospel is about repenting of sin, not celebrating it.

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The threshold of an amazing adventure. We will explore the spiritual abyss.

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You have not experienced this before. What's up, guys?

01:43

Welcome back to the Gospel Heard Around the World. I am Jeff. They call me the Ninja.

01:49

Yes, they do. Yes, they do. They. Yeah, they. They do.

01:55

That's Luke the Bear. What is up? That's Joy the Girl. Hello. You're listening to the Gospel Heard Around the World, Apologia Radio.

02:01

Let someone know, y 'all. Go to apologiastudios .com to get more. A -P -O -L -O -G -I -A studios .com.

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When you go to apologiastudios .com, you get access to over 300 radio and podcast episodes. You can sign up for All Access and partner with us to make everything that we're doing possible across the board.

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And we're grateful to all of you guys who have been All Access partners with us for so very, very long. You have helped us join together with us to make everything possible to bring the gospel to the ends of the earth in so many different areas, whether it's

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Mormonism, whether it's the Watchtower, whether it's atheism and secularism, whether it's with an out -of -control government in the area of abortion, whatever the case may be, you've been a part of all that.

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And when you're All Access, guys, at apologiastudios .com, you get access to our

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TV show, our after show and Apology Academy. And guess what? Dr. James White just finished one apologetics course at apologiastudios .com

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for All Access, and we just found out that he is committed to do what, Pastor Luke? Do his church history course, which is apparently some famous thing.

03:04

We have people messaging us all the time, is he going to do the church history course? Yes. The answer is yes. Yes, church history is going to be at Apology Academy, so if you guys want to get that and get involved now with us in ministry, partner with us, allaccessapologiastudios .com.

03:18

And that brings me to something real fast, let's just do this, touch us quickly, Joy. You did, with Joy, on Sheologians, which you can get at apologiastudios .com

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or sheologians .com, right? Yeah. I don't think that that domain would be taken by anybody else, right?

03:33

No. Considering Luke made it up, right? Yep. That's right. So you just did a two -part thing with Dr.

03:40

White on Muenster, Germany. Cheese? Oh. Muenster, Germany. Did you know that Parmesan cheese is only technically

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Parmesan cheese if it's sign -sealed and delivered from the region in Italy?

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Yeah, it's like champagne. It's only champagne if it's from the place in France. Everything else is a knockoff.

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What's it called? Parmesan? Parmesan. When you pull Parmesan cheese off the craft, they're like, you ain't eating

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Parmesan cheese. I think it probably says something like Parmesan style cheese or something like that.

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Do you know when you see those enormous wheels of Parmesan cheese, that with all the little stamps on the side of it and everything, that's legit.

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That's legit. Like they might have at Fogo de Chaux. They do have it at Fogo de Chaux. And what's special about Fogo de

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Chaux? Well, we'll talk about that in a second because I want to do that. It's the next thing we're doing. So tell everybody so that they go listen to it because it's really, really good.

04:36

Tell everyone about what you did with Dr. White on Sheologians. Well, first of all, I'm going to apologize because what I realized is that the jacket that I'm wearing is the exact same color as the background of our set.

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And I'm totally blending in right now. You are. You're just a floating head. Let me see this.

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I am. I'm a floating head. Talking head. Oh, that's cool. Good thing your hair is blue. It's like a perfect match.

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Like it's the exact same color. It goes well with our pagan symbol up here. Yeah. It's not really.

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Calm down, flat earthers. And I have beers. So we had

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Dr. White on. Every once in a while, Sheologians, we like stories.

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We believe that stories are important. And so every once in a while, we'll tell a story that we like.

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And so we had Dr. White on and he told us his favorite crazy church history story, which was the

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Munster Rebellion. And it involves cults and polygamy and people who say they can talk to God and they can't.

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And they can't. And insane, insane battles that you would never believe, 13 against 500 and that sort of thing.

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Wow. And so we released on Monday, we released the first part and then we did a second part where he kind of wraps up the story.

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And then we talk about some application and stuff like that. So the second part is going to be coming out this next

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Monday, which is, I don't even know the date of next Monday, but if you're watching this right now, next

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Monday. And according to Dr. White, the second episode is when it starts to get weird. But I don't know if I agree with that estimation, but because it's already weird, but it's a great story.

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You'll be shocked. You haven't heard anything about it in your entire life other than like after you hear the story, you won't just think cheese when you hear the name

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Munster. Right. Yeah. And he was saying it could easily become a movie. Oh, yeah. Like why hasn't

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Hollywood made a movie out of this? It should be like a there should be like a little docuseries thing on it where they do just...

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The Munster cheese tapes? Yes. Yeah. That's it. Yeah. Good name. Good name. I don't know when that cheese actually started being a thing.

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Was it before or after this event? Does anybody like Munster cheese? I don't know. Really? I do. Do you? Yeah. That's what they put on the

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Hawaiian grilled cheese in Kauai. Yeah. Oh, that is true. Very, very good. Yes. But yeah, so I highly recommend.

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Obviously, I'm going to highly recommend because it's the show I do, but I think that it was a particularly entertaining show and I recommend that everyone go listen to it.

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It's called Sheologians. You get it at apologiastudios .com or at sheologians .com. Make sure you guys check out that show with Summer Jaegermeister and Joy Hunter.

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It's really hard for me to get those names right because I've had them a certain way and now we have marriages and all these different things and so it makes it hard on me.

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Sorry. Technically, they're both Hunter. Yes. That's right. Yeah, that's right. Very good. Isn't that amazing? It's so weird.

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So speaking of Kauai, you mentioned Munster cheese and Kauai. One might say I know my exit cheeses.

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Yes, you do. Yes. Very good. So, we have a thing going on right now. You can participate in right now at Apologia.

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Wait, actually, where's it at? ApologiaKauai? ApologiaKauai .com backslash Meatfest2019. ApologiaKauai .com

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backslash Meatfest2019 and what it is, is a very special thing we've done every couple of years right here at Apologia Radio and that is

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Meatfest and this is Meatfest 2019 and what it is, is you can participate with us in ministry and you'll participate with us in our church plan on the island of Kauai.

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It is in desperate need, desperate, desperate need for a solid gospel proclamation on that island.

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There's cults and the occult all over the island. It is not just a vacation spot. Let me just say that again.

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It is not just a vacation spot. It is wide open for the gospel. It's an amazing opportunity. We've planted a church there.

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God's doing big things there. We're very excited about the future and you can partner with us in bringing a solid church to the island of Kauai and the way you do that is you go to ApologiaKauai .com

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backslash Meatfest 2019 and when you do, all you do is you give towards the work and mission of Apologia Kauai and when you give for every $25 that you give, it goes into a special thing where we want to blast and gift, give away a very special thing to two very special people.

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We're going to, for every $25 you put, it goes into there and we're going to just randomly select two people. The last time we had somebody come from Canada and the other time was from Seattle.

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Seattle, that's right. And what we do is we bring you out to Arizona. We fly you out, all expenses paid.

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We put you up in a nice hotel. We bring you to Apologia Studios, give you a tour. You get to meet all of the staff here at Apologia and you get to participate with us in an episode of Apologia Radio and then we take you for the cherry on top.

09:39

We take you to a place in Scottsdale called Fogo do Chão. It's a Brazilian steak restaurant, meat restaurant that come with meat on swords and they slice off onto your plate all these amazing, delicious meats and you have to have a card that has a green light and a red light and you do need to use it because they will not stop.

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You'll end up with a pile this high on your plate. Or if you just keep it in red, they're not going to bring you anything. That's right. And they have the amazing

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Parmesan cheese wheel there. Amazing. Amazing. Yeah, they have that.

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Yeah. So when you give, you're giving towards the work of Apologia Kawaii and we want to bless people and give away a gift to two people.

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We'll fly you out anywhere in the United States of America, which does include Alaska and Hawaii for those of you guys who are concerned about that.

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We will bring you out and give away all that stuff to you just to bless you. And most importantly, when you give, you're giving towards the mission of Apologia on the island of Kauai.

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And I just, we could do a whole show on the opportunities that are there for the gospel. So do it today,

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ApologiaKawaii .com slash Meatfest2019. And yeah, that's, that's about that.

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You see, this is cool. All the people today from all over the place listening. We got a lot of states.

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Irish. We got, yeah, there's multiple countries like Ireland, India, Lebanon, South Africa, UK, Maricopa.

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That was a joke. Maricopa. Nice. That was for you Dusty. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. All over a bunch of states.

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Michigan, Indiana, Oklahoma. Yeah. Yeah. I lost people from Oklahoma state. And just real fast.

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Kenya. Responding to our live audience here. First of all, thank you guys so much for loving us and blessing us being encouraged.

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We have a very important guest on today. We're about to introduce. So get ready for that. Very important. We need you to share this episode because what is happening right now in Oklahoma is so huge.

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It is so important. And we have to work together as the church, no matter where you're at to make this happen. But just a quick thing to our

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Willie Mays fan here. He said, Apologia Studio, I've emailed you two separate times with a question and you've never answered. I need answers.

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I just want to apologize. Just so you know, we receive hundreds of messages a day across all of our platforms and emails.

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We just don't have the ability to get to every one of them. We promise you we're not trying to ignore you.

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It's just we are limited. We only have a very small staff here and we only have a certain amount of fingers.

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Well, if you emailed the contact email, then I'm the one person here that reads.

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If you Facebook, generally that's Luke. And he's the only one that handles those.

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Just because that's what we have. Our main responsibility is pastors of Apologia Church.

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But we're also managing numerous other ministries, but our main ministry is to our families and to Apologia Church.

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And so we just received a message and one thing, the person was like, I got kicked out of my church. I need you to call me right now.

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I need you to call me right now, Pastor Jeff. I got kicked out of my church and I just apologize. I can't,

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I cannot. So we love you all. We're blessed by you. And let's talk right now about something so important.

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We need you to be with us, partner with us in this, share this content. You've got to be a part of this. Many of you guys know what we're going to start the first half of the show on this subject and do another half here on end times discussion stuff.

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Yes. But we, you know that we have a main focus and mission at Apologia Church to equip the church globally.

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It's happening globally, but specifically nationwide in the United States to equip the church to go and bring the gospel to where the killings are taking place, to save lives.

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God has saved thousands of lives through the ministry of End Abortion Now, through raising up local churches.

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We have taken care of all their needs. We have provided all the free training, all the free resources just to bless these churches so they can start their own mercy ministries with the gospel at the abortion mills, telling the truth about abortion, bringing the gospel into conflict with it and saving lives and providing for the needs of these mothers and fathers.

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So that's one aspect of End Abortion Now is just bringing the church into conflict with abortion. The other aspect of End Abortion Now is to bring the gospel into conflict with abortion at the legislative level and to fight for justice for the preborn.

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And so many of you guys know that we've been trying to raise up churches for that mission as well. This year we started going to city councils, and I'm going to play some of that for you guys after we talk to Senator Silk.

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We've been going to city councils and raising up churches across the country to do the same. It has happened a number of times now to demand justice for the preborn, an immediate end to abortion, and to bring the

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Christian worldview and the gospel into conflict with the culture of death. So there's a lot of elements to this.

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There's shaping the mind of the culture, changing the mind of the culture that we're trying to be involved in. We're going to be training churches this year to start their own media ministries to come into conflict with abortion nationwide.

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All of these things are happening. We're spinning a lot of plates here, but I want you to hear this. All this talk about bringing the gospel to the abortion mill.

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That's one aspect. It cannot just be that. It can't just be that. That's where the killing is taking place.

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It needs to be that, but there's a much larger mission afoot. And that is that, of course, we have to engage the culture at the media level, in the public square, across the damn internets, all that stuff, but we have to do it at the legislative aspect as well.

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And we have a brother in Oklahoma. His name is Senator Joseph Silk, and he is my hero.

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He's my hero. I mean that. Flattery is a sin. Everyone knows that. I believe that. And he is my hero.

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I am so encouraged by this man and the work that he's doing. I'm just going to play you a quick clip here to introduce you.

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This was from two years ago. This was Senator Joseph Silk on the news.

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And by the way, it is frustrating to no end that this is so hidden by the media.

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When you look up Senator Joseph Silk on YouTube, you should see thousands and thousands and thousands and thousands of videos and support and newscasts and everything else.

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And it's hard to find because it is silent. But this is from two years ago. Senator Joseph Silk did

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SB 1118. You might remember that we did some stuff to try to support Joseph Silk from our end over here.

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We tried to expose Tony Lounger, the vice president of National Right to Life, and his worldview, which is inconsistent with the

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Christian worldview and the issue of justice. We tried to make sure everyone understood this is where this is coming from. Tony Lounger was killing the bill that would have ended abortion in Oklahoma.

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This is from a newscast from two years ago. And here you go. Senator Silk says he's aggravating yet on the

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Senate floor. He now has less than 24 hours to fight for the idea that life begins at conception.

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And at 10 weeks, just at 10 weeks, those kids, they look like babies. They have feet, fingers, toes, everything.

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If it becomes law, Bill 1118 would allow for no exceptions to abortion, no age related distinctions and calls the procedure a homicide.

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When you take that life, it's classified as first degree murder. Whoever performs the abortion that intentionally kills that human embryo.

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But what about when the life of the mother is at stake? It still wouldn't make it legal. Even worst case scenario of a ruptured fallopian tube, there's a procedure that can keep that mother completely fine.

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So that was SB 1118, and it was stopped by people in the pro -life movement, believe it or not, that is the case.

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The pro -life movement is on a general course to not end abortion completely, to not do away with it, to not abolish it, to end it, to criminalize it.

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They are seeking to incrementally work their way down, but they're not pursuing ending abortion and just outright criminalizing it.

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So we are on today with Senator Joseph Silk, who has presented SB 13 in Oklahoma right now, and we need to find out how to help him.

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So Senator Silk, thank you for joining us on the show today. Thanks, how are you guys doing? Very very very good.

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More importantly, how are you doing right now? What's happening in Oklahoma? Well we are just continuing the fight.

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Senate Bill 13, as you've described, would actually call for the abolition of abortion in Oklahoma real quickly.

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It just defines life beginning at the moment of fertilization and offers that life equal protections just like any other life has.

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And we've been fighting in the Senate. They have now confirmed, as of yesterday, that the Health and Human Services Committee Chairman will not hear the bill.

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I talked to him. He did not give me any specific reasons. They're just trying to kill that bill.

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The Catholic Archdiocese has came out against the bill, and then just today the

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Baptist General Convention of Oklahoma has released a statement and a statewide letter saying that they also oppose the bill.

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This is absolutely incredible, Senator Silk. We have organizations that profess to be pro -life and believe that life begins at conception.

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They profess to have a Christian worldview, and they are not pursuing the end of abortion.

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Senator Silk, why? They value the court's opinion over essentially natural law and the law of God.

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One of the things that Senate Bill 13 does is it does offer nullification rights to the legislature and the executive branch if the court throws out

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Senate Bill 13 as unconstitutional, which it is constitutional because it protects life.

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It offers the right for the executive branch and the legislature to essentially say, thank you for your opinion,

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Supreme Court, despite what you say, we are going to protect life. A lot of these pro -life organizations and church institutions can't get over that fact.

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That's really the way that our republic is supposed to work. The courts were never allowed to just rule whatever they wanted and have the last word, but that's a lie that they've bought into.

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The other main thing that they're held up on on this bill, Senate Bill 13 repeals every single piece of pro -life legislation that has been put on the books over the past 43 years.

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They're very offended by that, but what they don't understand, and I've spoken to them, I've spoken to the pro -life groups and the churches and the statewide church organizations,

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I said, you do realize that if Roe v. Wade were overturned today, abortion would still be legal in Oklahoma because you have all this pro -life regulation and legislation on the books.

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We have to get rid of it, and they just can't get over the fact that we're actually abolishing abortion and not playing the regulation game.

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So this is important for all of our listeners right now around the world. I need you, if you've checked out for a minute here,

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I need you to come back and listen to something very, very critical. This is critical, and it comes as a surprise to many people, people who, as Christians, we all say, well, we're pro -life.

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That's our team, right? We're the pro -life team. You need to understand this. This is so critical. It is an endgame kind of thing.

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Everything is hanging on this. We say that Roe v. Wade needs to be overturned. No, it doesn't.

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That's not how our country works. Of course, it's a bootleg court opinion. It's fallacious from the 70s.

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It goes against what we know about biological science. Of course, we know about the law of God, the word of God, most importantly.

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But Roe v. Wade is not a law, and our country's founding documents state explicitly who creates law in our country, and it's not the

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Supreme Court. Congress makes laws. So what Senator Silk is saying here, if you didn't catch it, is that the states have the right, according to our governing documents, to be able to govern themselves and to oppose unlawful decrees like what we have in Roe v.

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Wade. We do not have to yield to an unrighteous, unlawful decree and decision of a court in the 1970s.

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The states have the right to uphold the law. And when you think about what's happening in the states with these pro -life organizations,

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I need you to hear me on this, because this is critical. And it's a shock when you find out.

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If Roe v. Wade is overturned tomorrow, the states that have these pro -life regulations are still going to have abortion in those states.

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Why? Because the pro -life legislation, because the incremental pro -life legislations that actually allow for abortion at a certain level, those become state law.

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And they hang there so when Roe falls, the state goes, well our books say that you can have an abortion at 16 weeks, at 18 weeks, at 20 weeks.

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And interestingly, who wrote that legislation? Who approved it? The pro -lifers. The pro -lifers.

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Did you hear that? I hope that that peels back the curtains and the eyelids for a moment to see, oh my goodness, this has been pursued wrongly.

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And wouldn't you know it, if we actually started fighting against abortion on a basis that was a faulty basis to begin with, that the

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Supreme Court gets to create law, and therefore we have to sort of fight against that, then of course all of our methodologies are going to be wrong because it's on the wrong foundation.

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The states have the right to oppose this higher court's opinion when that opinion itself is unrighteous or unjust.

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You know, kind of like a long time ago there was a situation where, you know, black people were allowed to be enslaved, right?

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Didn't the states have the right to oppose such an idea at that point? Or how about today when we have like Colorado, California, Washington, Arizona, all these states saying, no, we'll ignore federal drug laws because we're the sovereign state of Colorado.

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We're the sovereign state of Arizona. And our people's medical needs, that's what we're going to focus on.

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Their needs. Not what this federal drug law has. So we're going to oppose this higher thing here because of our people here.

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Now what's interesting here is that we do it with marijuana, we do it with sanctuary cities for undocumented immigrants, but interestingly, we don't seem to have the courage to do it with the pre -born children that are being murdered in our midst.

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Senator Silk, how can we help you right now? I was just with you last week, we got some stuff out there that was seen by I guess hundreds of thousands of people,

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I suppose, and I know that a lot of emails went to Senator Smalley asking him to hear immediately SB 13, we're in a new place now, so what can we do to help you?

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So there's two things today, because as of today, like I said, the Baptist General Convention of Oklahoma came out in opposition to the bill, which has literally fractured the

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Baptist churches in our state. I have a list of Baptist pastors that I have to call back, because they're like, what is our state convention doing?

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So I would say to all the listeners, because this is a worldwide issue here, it's just Oklahoma at the front lines, so everybody needs to be engaged here.

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Basically just Google Baptist General Convention of Oklahoma, get the executive leadership contact information, email them, call them, get on their

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Facebook page, do everything you can to let them know that the world is watching what the

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Baptist General Convention of Oklahoma just did, and we do not approve, because we want to protect life.

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The other thing is our group, our boots on the ground group here in Oklahoma is called Free the States, you can see them on freethestates .com,

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they've done a lot of work with you guys in the past, and so get on and support them and encourage them, and we're going to keep pushing it.

25:37

Okay, thank you Senator Stokes. So Baptist General Convention Oklahoma. Right now we have 150 people watching live, and many, many, many more are going to see this.

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Let me just encourage everybody who is watching live, or you're watching this later on today, to the thousands of people that are going to be on here and watching this, let me encourage you right now to partner with us, right now, with Senator Stokes, to actually put hands to all that we say, constantly, right?

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It's evil, it's an atrocity, it's murder, we need to stand up for these children. Let me ask you to not be about mere profession, but actually put some hands right now to this issue, and right now, do what

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Senator Stokes said, go to Google, look up Baptist General Convention Oklahoma, look up the leadership, and you start sending emails, and then get 15 people of your, 15 of your closest

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Christian friends, get them in on this with you, and extend this, and start messaging, and honestly, be respectful of course, but say, how dare you?

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Yeah. How dare you? How dare you not support Senator Stokes and this bill that would actually do what we always say is what needs to be done?

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How dare you not support? How dare you not protect? We need you to actually be faithful with your commitments, and so, that's important.

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These are moments, everyone, where we see internal contradictions, we see internal tension and contradictions that we have to actually start doing something about.

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Be courageous, brothers and sisters. Let me just be very frank with you here, and I want to let you guys talk to Senator Stokes, so think about what you want to maybe ask here.

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You know, it may be that we've held these children in our arms. It may be that.

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It may be that we've actually held children who were literally seconds away from being dismembered in our arms, or I've been preaching over a pulpit with little girls running around my church that were about to be slaughtered, and because of the gospel proclamation, that didn't happen.

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The mom turned away. It may be because I've kissed and hugged these little kids that we are so passionate about that, but let me encourage you, let me encourage you to enter into this with us, because it's worth your whole life.

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When I held my first baby in my arms that was saved from death in an abortion mill, Carmelo, it changed me.

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It changed me forever, and it ought to change you as well to consider that there are thousands of children alive today, alive today, because of this work of bringing the gospel into conflict with abortion, being consistent

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Christians and actually doing what we say we believe and engaging in this.

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I want to encourage you to right now participate. We need you. I'm not asking you to get involved in petty, partisan political issues.

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I'm not asking you to put signs in your yard for a particular figure. I'm asking you to partner on principle, on what is righteous and just.

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You need to pray for Senator Silk. Pray for this hero. Pray for this man.

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Pray for this brother, this Christian who is standing up for what is right, and he is doing what is glorifying to God and what is right for these children.

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He's a hero. You need to support him. He's the kind of man that I know, I trust with all my heart, is going down in the history books.

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This will be part of history, and we need your help. This is where you get to be a part of it, brothers and sisters. So I actually,

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I've received this question multiple times this week, and I will tell you what my response was, but I was hoping you can give an official response as the sponsor of the bill.

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So the question I keep hearing is, well, is there an exception for the life of the mother if you have to choose one or the other?

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My response is always, well, that's a false narrative that's put forth by the pro -choice movement.

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The answer is that you try to save both lives. But as far as officially, from how it's worded in the bill, could you give an official response to that?

29:36

Yeah, so it's not only a false narrative that's put out by the pro -choice movement, it's actually a false narrative that our churches and our pro -life movement is putting out.

29:45

Because essentially, when it comes to, in case of the life of the mother, that exemption, that doesn't exist. So whenever they carve out that exception, they're talking about tubal pregnancies and ectopic pregnancies.

29:57

And since 1917, they've been able to transfer, they've had successful transfer process where they transfer that child to the uterus where it needs to go.

30:08

So there's a huge line of medical checklist that they need to do to save and to value both the mother and the child's life.

30:18

Unfortunately, default practice is if you're diagnosed with a tubal or ectopic pregnancy, they just go in and kill it.

30:25

But specifically to Senate Bill 13, Senate Bill 13, all we did is we took some other medical terminology that essentially charges the doctor and mandates that they exhaust all life possibilities for both mother and child.

30:42

That's what they have to do. And whatever those medical procedures are, they just, our medical community has got to start valuing both mother and child's lives equally.

30:51

Yes. That's awesome. I appreciate that. I mean, that question always hits home with me, personally. Reason being, my grandparents were missionaries in the jungle in Africa, and my mom was actually an ectopic pregnancy and, you know,

31:04

God miraculously moved her into the right position and she was born healthy. And so when I hear someone say, you know,

31:10

I've known, we've known women that, you know, they had that happen and the doctor said, well, you have no choice.

31:16

You have to abort the baby and they give her a pill, you know, and was like, no, no, no, that's not, that's not true. So I'm glad to hear that.

31:23

I mean, I figured that was the case. I just didn't know what the language and stuff was in the bill. So thank you for that, Senator Silk.

31:29

Yep. Joy? I was just going to ask you to maybe, so we just asked people to partner with us, partner with you and, and make contact with people that aren't hearing this.

31:47

But maybe if you just want to explain the benefit of, of a person, a legislator or whoever receiving a flood of support to hear a bill like this.

32:01

No, that's, I mean, there's a, there, it definitely gets attention. So, so with Senate Bill 13 and I know

32:07

I did, you know, some interviews with Jeff when he came, came here, it, that got attention.

32:12

It got Senator Smalley's attention. Unfortunately we had some higher level leadership that came in and essentially

32:18

I think they told him we're not going to hear this. And so the same thing with not only legislators, when they hear the people, massive amounts of people saying the same thing, such in this case, we have got to stop abortion.

32:33

And they hear how different that narrative is than the pro -life. It really is very, very impactful, but legislators, but not here in Oklahoma, now we have to change.

32:42

Now we have to get the church on board. Cause, cause in Oklahoma, you know, Bible Belt area, the, the

32:48

Southern Baptist General Convention in Oklahoma holds a lot of weight. And the same thing with that leadership.

32:53

If we now start taking this message and saying, listen, BGCO, you guys have got to make a, just a stance that your, your church convention believes that abortion should be ended immediately.

33:06

Their leadership needs to hear that. And when they adopt that, that gospel truth about life beginning at conception and the state government actually upholding justice, they're going to, it's going to be a lot, they're going to be more powerful and more effective to actually get into the churches and lobby the legislature.

33:21

And it'll be a, it's kind of, it's a constant education cycle, but the massive amounts of emails and calls that both the legislature, the

33:29

Senate can receive, but also the Baptist General Convention Oklahoma leadership, it's very, very impactful.

33:35

Yes. Senator Sokol, how much time do we have left in terms of to keep working through this?

33:41

I know I saw some billboards go up in Oklahoma, which I was very encouraged to see, that can can sort of put a name and a face to what is holding all this back for Oklahomans and Christians to know like, okay, where do we need to direct our responses and our commentary?

33:56

I thought that was a very effective strategy. But how much time do we have left? So the bill to work through the regular legislative process, we've got until next

34:07

Thursday, so essentially a week to have to give that bill a hearing. So that's why it's so important for everybody to continue to stay engaged, even though the chairman has said,

34:17

I'm probably not going to hear that this year. There's nothing that makes it dead. I mean, it's still alive.

34:22

It's still still well. So we need to continue the pressure on the Senate leadership, Oklahoma Senate leadership and find all our contact information on OKSenate .gov.

34:31

But then all I mean, during that week, if we can keep the pressure on the Baptist General Convention of Oklahoma and see if we can continue to gain support from them and pressure them, we've got a week.

34:41

However, that does not mean so. If we miss the deadline at any time throughout the legislative session, so until the end of May, Senate leadership can bring a bill and basically they don't have deadline requirements.

34:54

They don't have committee requirements. They can bring a bill directly to the Senate floor for a vote. So we'll have to continue to engage them and keep pressure on them until the end of May.

35:04

But then even if it didn't get heard in Oklahoma, Senate Bill 13 will stay alive and well.

35:10

It'll still stay, stay, stay Senate Bill 13 until next year's session. So we'll can if it doesn't get a hearing this this year, we're going to work throughout the year to continue to educate and educate and push and push and hopefully grow the movement even more.

35:25

So when we go in the next year, we still have Senate Bill 13 and we'll pound it next year as well. I was just going to say,

35:31

I actually just we saw kind of how this whole process works yesterday here in Arizona.

35:37

And I hadn't really observed this. So it's a bit of a lesson for me. So for those those of you that are listening and wonder how this works.

35:45

So we actually there was the Democratic side here in Arizona tried to get a bill read that would allow botched abortion babies to sit there and die.

35:57

Basically, that was the bill like that they were trying to put forth. Thankfully, it got squashed eight to two in the in the

36:05

Judiciary Committee. But what I when I was watching this process, just just how silly some of this stuff is sometimes the two people that that said we should we should have a hearing on this.

36:19

They didn't even necessarily agree with the bill. They just said out of respect to the sponsor, we should at least listen to it.

36:26

And so that but that's how this whole process works. You know, so like everybody else was like, no, we're not going to listen to this bill. It's stupid, ridiculous.

36:33

Why would you even present this? But then it's stuff still can get heard just because of that, you know, just because of politics is what it is.

36:40

And I know, Senator, so you probably know better than than we do how that stuff works. But I know it's very eye opening for me yesterday, kind of observing the process.

36:48

Absolutely. All right, Senator Silk, we are in this with you. We are prayerful for you. And we are looking forward to just continuing to support you and do what's necessary to to uphold justice for these these children in Oklahoma.

37:02

And we're grateful for your time today. Thank you. Thanks for coming on today. Yep. I'll stay in touch.

37:07

We'll see you. Thanks, brother. Thanks, brother. Thanks so much. All right. So there you go, guys. Now, you know, sort of what the status is.

37:13

And I'll just say, of course, we have these shows running live just as a response to Brian. I said

37:19

Brian Gunter. Yeah, that's why I was going to respond. There you go. Really important here, Brian. Context, context, context, context.

37:25

When you say that what I said isn't true in terms of the pro -life legislation in the states that would keep abortion legal outside of Roe by saying, but in Louisiana, we have a special law where that wouldn't be the case.

37:38

Understand that I'm not speaking about every single state. We're talking about the states that have pro -life legislation that would keep abortion legal despite Roe, because it is written in such a way as to say that abortion will only be legal in our state at this level of weeks.

37:55

Not every state is Oklahoma or sorry, Louisiana, my friend. And so what we said stands and you can research it yourself.

38:03

We're not talking about every single state in the union. We're talking about the pro -life legislation that explicitly legalizes abortion in that state at a state level with state law at a certain level.

38:15

And so by saying that's not true, Jeff, that's false because Louisiana, Louisiana has the special bill that protects all human life.

38:22

Well, we're not talking about Louisiana across the board. We're talking about the states that have pro -life legislation that keeps it legal.

38:27

And this is so vitally important to get. Senator Silk has to put legislation in that ultimately says it's criminalized, it's ended, it's homicide, and we're going to actually erase this pro -life legislation.

38:42

Question, why do you think that Senator Silk has to do that? Because there's conflicting laws on the book that say that it's not homicide at this level.

38:52

And so, yes, we have to erase the pro -life legislation that was created in the bad methodology that says that abortion is legal at this level of development or at this weak level.

39:04

So, yeah, I was just going to say, I wonder how that would work here in Arizona, because obviously we know that there already is a law that's calling it murder.

39:12

They're just not enforcing it. So I wonder, I wonder how that would work if Roe, I mean, but then we have laws, you know, say like I have big enough hallways and a clean facility, but it's still on the books as murder.

39:22

So I wonder how that would work. Arizona is unique in that way because you have a law that right now is in force. It says abortion is criminal, but they're not upholding it.

39:29

So the pro -life movements have done. You can see it in the legislation. If you can think about in your minds here, you got legislation here that says abortion is a criminal act.

39:37

Right. And two years in jail, I think is what it says. Two to two to five years, I think, which is interesting. Homicides are only two years.

39:44

But you have that law. Then the pro -life movement has put legislation underneath it. Right. That doesn't just say, hey, this is illegal.

39:52

They say underneath it, they say it shall not be allowed and we're protecting life above a certain yeah, above a certain weak level.

40:03

Yeah. So it's interesting. That's like they acknowledge the law itself saying it's criminal. But the pro -life movement has put legislation attached to it that says and especially not after 18 weeks kind of thing.

40:13

You know, so it's sort of it's interesting how that game is played, but it's a faulty methodology because the states have a right to say, yeah, we're not going to kidnap an enslaved black people no matter what the

40:23

Supreme Court says. Yeah. Right. Are you seeing it? The states have a right to say we're going to do the just thing for our people and interpose between a bad court opinion and the people under our care in our district.

40:37

So we all recognize that, don't we? Don't we recognize it? Because where we're at in history after slavery, when we see ourselves back here, we look back at the evils of the of the old age and we say, how could they have ever tolerated such a thing?

40:52

And if we had somebody say today suggests that we're going to go back to that form of slavery and we're going to start kidnapping black people and enslaving them, that's fine to do.

41:02

I think every state would say, are you out of your mind or you know, and we won't even consider it.

41:08

I don't care what the higher court says or what the higher government says. We're resisting such a thing. Well, where's our courage with abortion?

41:17

Where's our courage to this degree? And I think we need to start actually being courageous as Christians and and being willing to make sacrifices.

41:26

The truth is, and I hate to say this, you know, the people who are in these political office offices oftentimes have large houses and families to care for.

41:36

And this is a job they need the paycheck. And we have to consider that there are other factors oftentimes that add to things not being done on time or justly.

41:47

And I'm not saying this is true of all politicians. There are people who just don't care. Like Senator Silk, I don't care.

41:54

I'm going to do what's right before God and uphold justice. And I don't care if I get reelected. There are heroes like Joseph Silk.

42:00

There's heroes like we have in Arizona who will say, I don't care to be reelected. I'm going to do what's right. That's why

42:05

I'm here. But there are people, let's grant it, let's be honest. I think it's fair to say we will all agree on this.

42:11

There are people in political office here that are there and they're making a good living doing it.

42:17

And they don't have any motive or anything. Well, it's their profession. It's just like we're all most people try to keep their job.

42:25

Yes. Most people. Yes. That's right. So that's right. Not an abortion. No. Yeah.

42:31

Oh, yeah. It was one. Sorry, Zach. Yeah, we're ready to quit. Yeah, that's right there. Yeah, we're ready to quit an abortion now completely.

42:38

We can't wait till we can't wait till we're done with an abortion now because abortion is illegal.

42:44

You know, it's interesting, too. I read a really cool story about one of our presidents after they were elected. They were they were elected.

42:52

They had the inauguration and the big thing. And then they went afterwards to go eat in Washington, D .C.

42:57

in this popular restaurant in Washington, D .C. But it was filled with people. It was filled with guests and they were all eating at the restaurant.

43:03

And he had to wait outside with his his staff for a table because everybody was everyone was there eating and having dinner at the restaurant.

43:12

And, you know, OK, you're the president, but you don't get to take my seat. Right. And he had to wait outside this fancy restaurant, nice place, like till you can get a seat before someone else had to finish the meal and paying it up.

43:22

They were like, OK, great. You're the president. Like, you know, I'm eating my steak and eggs, bro. Like it's just like we have really changed in our thinking here.

43:31

So, yeah, I was just going to say also in response to Brian's thing about Louisiana that the whole point is really is to say good on Louisiana for for doing that bill.

43:45

But right now it's completely pointless and meaningless. Why aren't you abolishing abortion completely now?

43:51

Because you have the ability and the right to do that. And that's what needs to happen. You know, so ultimately, we don't really care about the

43:58

Roe v. Wade stuff because I don't think it'll ever happen anyways. I think just politicians are cowards.

44:05

Sorry, not Senator Silk. He's not a coward. Right. You know what I'm saying? Like a lot of national on the federal level, you know, generally speaking, they're cowardly.

44:12

Well, just again, most people are trying to keep their jobs like most people.

44:17

No, you're absolutely right. They won't like even if they have a strong principle when it comes to their job, the the paycheck and the benefits and all that stuff tends to outweigh.

44:27

Yeah. Like your convictions. Right. That's not uncommon. Right. Just across the board. Right. Yeah. So the point is,

44:33

I don't we don't foresee that happening anytime soon. So don't sit around and wait for that. Get busy and just abolish it completely in your state.

44:41

That's right. And it does. It makes it it makes a difference because I mean, if you think even just, you know, legislators are consuming the same media as us.

44:52

Yeah, I'm sure they know they have some more inside information on what's happening at certain times, you know.

44:58

But, you know, if you were to just read The Washington Post or some news, online news source, you would probably think, oh, well,

45:10

I'm not going to stand up against that because people are pro -choice. But so them knowing the person who is in charge of your state or even on a smaller level, just them knowing that you are supportive of them can make a difference.

45:28

Yes, absolutely. Absolutely. So I wanted to play for you guys something here. You know, I don't think we're going to get to the end times discussion today.

45:34

However, I want you guys to know I just got this book and I'm very excited about. My buddies have actually endorsed this book.

45:40

So that says a lot about it. It is called In the Days of These Kings. And yeah, it's that fat.

45:46

In the Days of These Kings is the book of Daniel and Preterist perspective, essentially looking at the book of Daniel and the promises there that were fulfilled in the ministry of Jesus Christ.

45:55

And who wrote that? J. Rogers. So I've been talking to him. I was hoping to get him on today, but his schedule is a little conflicted.

46:01

So we're probably going to have him on next time. We're going to talk about how the book of Daniel actually demonstrates that Jesus is the

46:08

Messiah, because much of what we see in the book of Daniel was fulfilled in the ministry of Jesus Christ. And in that generation, it's powerful, powerful stuff.

46:15

If you love the prophecy discussion in terms of what prophecies does Jesus fulfill in himself or his ministry from the

46:21

Old Testament, you're going to love this book and this discussion. But let's go ahead and go into this. One of the aspects that we've been talking about is bringing the gospel and the word of God into conflict with not only where the killing is taking place at the abortion mill, but also bringing in a conflict at the legislature and holding them to account for what they're called to do.

46:45

Many of these people are pro -lifers, professing pro -lifers right there on the council, and they're not doing anything.

46:50

Yeah, right. It becomes sort of a platform. Hey, I'm pro -life, so give me the red votes. Yeah, right.

46:56

Can I have those? Because, oh, I'm pro -life. But you're like, wait a second. You said you're pro -life and you want to protect the unborn, but you're doing literally nothing except widening a hallway at the abortion facility.

47:05

Yeah, and we're talking, especially in in Oklahoma, you're talking about, like he said, the

47:12

Bible belt. You're talking about predominantly red votes. Yes. And still people won't hear this.

47:18

Oh, yeah. Yeah, yeah. Even though they would still like technically, according to their own logic, they would they would have the votes to maintain their office.

47:26

That's the key. But they're still not hearing. Yeah. Joy brings them. That's an amazing point, Joy, because what is interesting here and what

47:32

I think these people are so fearful about is if SB 13 makes it to the floor, you have predominantly pro -lifers like people that got elected because they're pro -life that are going to have to vote yay or nay.

47:46

And if they vote nay on a bill that criminalizes abortion or abolishes abortion, then everyone goes, hmm,

47:56

I thought, wait a minute. I thought you were pro -life. So this this is a gut check for all of these politicians.

48:02

And I would say they know it. They know that it's a gut check. And I think that's why everyone's fearful about having it fall to the floor, because now it's the gut check.

48:10

Now it's saying, did you mean what you said when you said you were pro -life? This is this is where the rubber meets the road, y 'all.

48:16

And the only way I think that we can actually communicate effectively in that arena is not with neutrality, not with republicanism, but with the gospel and the biblical worldview.

48:29

So what we've tried to do, and this isn't to highlight us or to glorify us in any way, it's just to try to offer you right now, hopefully some encouragement and maybe a little kick in the pants, friends.

48:38

This is yesterday at the Phoenix City Council. I mean, that's how we started doing this. Yes, just a little kick in the pants.

48:45

We all got a little kick in the pants. And that's what started. I mean, and now we have an abortion now and abortion and people across the like all over the world that are trying to end abortion and abortion.

48:56

Now is the thing, because, well, there's a little circle of people, but it would be Lisa Metzger, a woman.

49:02

She and she didn't come on the show intending to give us a kick in the pants. It just happened that way. It happened because the

49:08

Holy Spirit. And then we've got Marcus and babies are murdered here. And then especially rusty was the taking the pants, pulling them down.

49:17

He was more like a two by four to the face and using a belt. And yeah, it was it was it was a very different kind of before you play this.

49:25

This is a good example of what we're talking about. So there's the our

49:30

Phoenix vice mayor who wasn't has been endorsed by the Arizona right to life, right?

49:36

He's the one that every time we go and speak is like making faces and it's clearly annoyed by us and doesn't like that we're there.

49:43

And he's been endorsed by the big the big pro life movement here. Our group in Arizona.

49:49

Yes, that's a good point. All right. Here we go. So I'll play just a little bit of this. This is just to give an idea of what that looks like, how you can bring the word of God into this context and even the gospel and hold them to account.

50:03

Honorable representatives, hello again. My name is Pastor Jeff Durbin. I'm the lead teaching pastor at Apology Church and the head of End Abortion Now.

50:10

You'll remember that we've been before you on numerous occasions, reminding you of your duty to uphold justice and to protect the lives of the human beings in your district.

50:19

You have the moral duty before God and the people you represent to interpose between innocent human beings and their attackers.

50:26

Today, innocent human beings have been victimized under your watch. Your watch while you speak and legislate on issues that relate to justice and the preservation of human life.

50:35

You have been ignoring the most obvious issue before all of us. Mothers and fathers today have been ignored, have brought their little boys and girls into facilities within a few miles of where you sit, have paid professional assassins to dismember these children, have had them disemboweled, have had their heads severed from their bodies, have had them chemically burned and had their bodies put back together again on a tray to ensure that no pieces of these children are left behind in their mothers.

51:01

With respect, honorable representatives, Roe v. Wade is not a law. It is a decades -old, fallacious court opinion that is incontrovertibly refuted by the evidence of scripture as well as all modern biological science.

51:14

Courts don't make law according to the United States Constitution. Congress makes law, not the

51:20

Supreme Court. Arizona has a law, current, unchanged and in effect today. Arizona Statute 13 -3603.

51:29

Abortion is illegal in our state. You have a moral duty before God, the people of Arizona and according to the laws of Arizona, to uphold this law today.

51:38

We are all deluded if we believe that we have to accept the murder of unborn children because of a fallacious court opinion from the 70s.

51:46

It is unconstitutional, murderous and lawless. Other states have recognized their state sovereignty over issues that are less bloody.

51:53

Colorado, California, Arizona ignore federal laws about marijuana. Other states have created sanctuary cities for undocumented immigrants.

52:03

Where's your courage, friends? You can interpose by creating a sanctuary city for innocent unborn human beings today.

52:10

You have delegated power of judgment and legislation. Honorable representatives, I call upon you to wield it courageously and wisely.

52:17

There is another one with the power of judgment and who is the source of law. If you ignore these pleas of justice, you will not escape his judgment.

52:24

All of us have the appointed day where we'll stand before his court. Will you mark the calendar of history like those who said,

52:31

I know it looks like a person, it's not a person, it's a black man? Will you be marked like those who said,

52:36

I know it looks like a person, it's not a person, it's a Jew? This we all know is wicked. It's a wicked mindset.

52:42

So is the idea that we can tear small human beings into pieces. There is hope.

52:49

Two thousand years ago, God became a man, lived a righteous and sinless life, died in the place of his people and rose again.

52:54

He has all authority today over you. He calls for your obedience. And there is salvation as a gift through faith in him.

53:02

I pray you find it, you turn to him for life, and that you grant these fatherless children the opportunity for the same.

53:10

So the hope is that we would start engaging these cultural issues from a consistently

53:18

Christian position, not pretending, not not giving up our commitments to the

53:23

Lord and to his word and having them in our homes and in our little churches, but not having them actually publicly. Have you noticed that the secularists, like they're perfectly happy to hold on to their atheistic or agnostic or secularist worldview in this arena?

53:35

And they're like, no, you need to play by our rules here. Let's say atheistic here, not Christian. How do you think we ever got there? Because Christians actually stopped holding on to the

53:43

Christian culture we were creating, the gospel culture we were creating, and step back and let it all happen. So we need to come into there.

53:49

And if you notice there, what we're trying to emphasize is, of course, the sin of abortion, the crime of abortion, but also the hope we have in Jesus Christ.

53:56

It's all those things. It's not mere condemnation. It's the hope you have in Christ, but the call to repent. And now let's do

54:04

Pastor Luce. I learned that day that Fox 10 News had a report about a man that spoke just after me, but had nothing to say about my comments.

54:13

This man shot one of your fellow fellow council women in 1997 and served 12 years in jail for attempted murder.

54:20

It was important for them to highlight this man, an attempted murderer, and rightfully so. But my question for the reporters or media that is that is here today, why aren't you reporting on the men and women in this state who openly murder children every single day?

54:36

The paid assassins that operate in plain sight without any repercussions. Contrary to popular belief, these so -called doctors aren't even legally murdering these innocent children.

54:47

According to Arizona Revised Statute 13 -3603, abortion is premeditated murder.

54:54

Roe v. Wade is not a law. Councilmen and women, why are you doing nothing to stop the

55:00

Holocaust and uphold the law? Reporters or media that are here today, why aren't you reporting the news?

55:07

To both of you, why are you ignoring the truth? Do you have no concern for the lives and well -being of your pre -born neighbors?

55:15

You can bury your heads in the sand, act like your hands are tied and attempt to ignore the bloodshed all you want.

55:20

But the truth is that you will stand and you will be held accountable to God.

55:26

He knows, and in your heart of hearts, so do you. You may very well be able to run from his judgment in this life, but at some point you will face his wrath.

55:35

This is not a joke and not something I recommend you take lightly. I am pleading with all of you to do the right thing.

55:42

Magistrates, you are God's avengers of wrath. Please uphold the law and punish these murderous evildoers.

55:49

Reporters, your job is to report the news, the real news, not the fake news.

55:54

By failing to report these plain -view murders, you are also complicit before God, your creator.

56:02

Please be courageous and do your job. Thank you once again for your time and attention. If you have any questions, please visit endabortionnow .com.

56:10

To God alone be the glory. And so there you go, my friends.

56:16

Is that from their feed? That is. Isn't that awesome? They leave it up. Yeah, they got it up.

56:22

Yeah, it doesn't go up until the next day, because they leave the live feed running until midnight or something like that, then someone cuts it out on their end.

56:29

So we will have those available for you guys up on Apologia Studios and our channel by the end of the day and tomorrow.

56:37

That's the plan at least, to be able to share those. Let me just encourage you with something. When you share that, it may have an impact on you, and praise

56:44

God that it does. We're grateful for that. But when you share that content, it's used by God to challenge people and wake his people up.

56:52

I can tell you that since we started doing this, going to the legislature and bringing the gospel in the conflict with abortion like this, it's now happening across the country.

57:02

Christian churches across the country now are actually bringing the word of God to their legislature and demanding an end of abortion.

57:09

Brothers and sisters, if we rise up as the church across the nation to do that, what would God do with that? I am so confident in the power of the word of God and his spirit in the gospel.

57:19

I believe that revival amongst his people can break out. And I believe that God can do amazing, miraculous things to change the hearts of people and to bring salvation and justice to our world.

57:31

So I'm hopeful for it. But it can't just be Joy the Girl, Luke the Bear and the

57:38

Ninja. It can't just be me and these guys. It can't just be Zach and Pastor Zach.

57:44

And it can't just be Carmen and Isaac in the background. And all the rest is Sage. My son is the administrative assistant.

57:50

It can't just be this little team here at Apologia. And I hope I'm not missing anybody. It's got to be all of us as the church of God across the world that are working together to do this.

58:00

So will you partner with us? Will you be a part of this? Final words, guys? I know we have guys are starting to do this around the nation.

58:07

Praise God. We've had Oklahoma. We've had New York. I don't remember where else. So forgive me if I'm forgetting you.

58:14

But I know there's been some other guys. Let's keep it going. Like we've been challenging everybody. Let's get someone in the top 10 cities in this nation doing this.

58:21

And let's get that prophetic vision going so the people will stop casting off restraint, y 'all. Yes. Don't forget to visit

58:27

Joy Hunter and Summer Jaeger's channel and page

58:33

Sheologians .com. You can also get it at ApologiaStudios .com. Check out that last episode with Dr.

58:38

White on Munster, Germany. Very exciting stuff. And then you'll be like on the edge of your seat waiting for the next.

58:44

Yes. Which is coming out Monday. Which is. Yeah. Make yourself a grilled cheese with some Munster.

58:49

Yes. And sit down and listen to the craziest thing that ever happened. Yeah. Right on.

58:56

All right. Love you all. Thank you guys so much for supporting us. Don't forget, you can support Apologia Kauai and possibly receive the gift of coming to Apologia, flying you out.

59:05

Nice hotel, visiting the studio, being on the show and going to Meat Fest 2019. All you do is partner with us in our church plant.

59:13

Go to ApologiaKauai .com slash Meat Fest 2019. And when you give, if you gave if you gave $100 towards the mission, you would have four.

59:26

And we're just going to you know, we want to gift and give stuff away. So we're going to randomly select two names. Last time it was in Canada and Washington.

59:33

Perhaps it'll be you this time. You get to participate with us in ministry. And we want to be a blessing to two of our supporters.

59:39

And so that's what's up. It will not last forever. So please go give today. Bless you all.