Debate Matt Slick David Robinson (LDS), Does the Bible teach salvation by faith or works?

My name is Russell East, serving as station manager for AMA 20, Christian Radio, 1039 and 95 .3 Truth Network. It's a pleasure to be with you this afternoon, and so I just want to encourage you, after the debate's over, to join us across the street from Weber State at 3701 Harrison Boulevard, where we will continue the discussion.

We have a little bit of pizza coming over, and so a little bit of refreshments, and just some more time, additional time to talk about the things in this afternoon's debate. So you're all welcome to join us there.

I want to get my phone number out, because at the end of the debate, there'll be some time for you to ask a question. So I'm going to give you my number, so you can text me the question, and then I'll just read them as I get them.

So I'll give this number again, but the number is 801 -645 -7433. And so you can say if it's for Matt or for David, just designate that in your question. That number again is 801 -645 -7433. So if I could direct your attention to your program, does anybody need a program?

Does everybody have one? I'll direct your attention there. By way of introduction, I'll start that in just a moment. I'll start it off with a little bit of introductions, and I'll pray, and then we'll turn things over to start things up with Matt.

Okay, so our first participant in this afternoon's debate is Matt Slick. He's the radio host of Matt Slick Live. It's a nationally syndicated radio program. He's the founder and president of CARM, Christian Apologetics and Research Ministries, and counterculture ministry.

David Robinson has served two full-time missions for the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. He's served 27 years as a tour guide at the Church History Museum. I just wanted to mention that David is not speaking formally as a representative of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, but he will be presenting the viewpoints of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.

So, as to the rules, you can see on the program, I'll be trying to do my best to keep track of times and so forth, so it should be a very good time to get some good perspectives here on what the Bible teaches.

As you can see, our title for the debate is, Does the Bible Teach Salvation is by Faith Alone or by Works? So, with that, let me pray, and then we'll begin this afternoon's debate. Let's pray. Lord, thank you for giving us this time.

Thank you for the friends and family that have gathered here today. Lord, this time is committed to you for your glory, so please intervene and speak to us through your word. Speak to us this afternoon, make things clear, and help us to keep talking and asking questions and getting to the bottom of this very important question.

We commit this to you in Jesus' name. Amen. And with that, let's welcome both of our participants, Matt Selig and David Robinson. Matt, we'll go ahead and have you begin with a five-minute introduction.

Hello. How are you all doing out there? Good. Great.

How are you doing? Good. I've got a few questions. How many of you listen to me on the radio? Oh, yeah. Do I sound or look like what I sound like? Yes. One guy said I'm supposed to be about this tall, fat, big glasses, and bald head.

So my last name really is Slick. I was born with it and learned to run as a kid. I've moved 40 times in my life, and I did apologetics. I started back in 1980, just want to let you know. And I want to quote to you, and I paraphrase a little bit, but I want to quote to you what got me started in apologetics.

What got me started 44 years ago. I was at a Bible study, and I met this friend, I'm still friends with him, his name is Charlie Spine. So Slick and Spine used to hang out. And he wrote this poem. In all these affidavits and all these indictments, it is all the devil, all corruption, false swears, all hell boiled over.

You burning mountains rolled down, your law before I will come out on the top at last. I have more to boast than ever any man had. I've been Lord of keeping church together since the days of Adam, neither John, Paul, Peter, nor Jesus ever did such a work as I.

The followers of Christ ran away from him, but my followers, Latter-day Saints, never ran away from me. That was Joseph Smith, History of the Church, volume 6, page 408 -409. I got so mad at that quote, I snatched a paper out of this guy's hand.

And I said, who said this? And he said, Joseph Smith. I said, who's that? And he said, the founder of Mormonism. And I said, well, Mormons are Christians, but this guy's not. He said, no, they're not Christians.

And I said, yes, they are. He said, no, they're not. I said, why aren't they? And he told me what they believe. And I went, what? That started me studying. So now, the CARM website, how many have been to the CARM website?

OK. Yesterday, it hit 163 million visitors. Wow. 163 million. So Christian Apologetics Research Ministry. And I'm going to tell you something. I'm autistic. I have Asperger's. And so the reason I bring it up is because it makes me write very succinctly to the point.

If you want to know what the Trinity is, you go there, you get it, and that much. You have to read 18 pages. And finally, the Trinity is. And you're not. So you can go, and you can read. You can check it out.

So go to carm .org, C-A-R-M dot O-R-G. I've written nine books, some science fiction stuff. And I've also written a humor book, which I, if you guys are, how many single guys we got in here? Single guys?

OK. We'll get my book, How to Woo and Win Women by Being an Obnoxious Jerk. It's on Amazon. It's on Amazon. No research necessary. I'm natural. It's all there. It's a great book. You can check it out.

And I've been on radio about 21 years now. So I'm doing that. Love debates. And I'm constantly, constantly on the internet, Discord, Pal Talk, Clubhouse, Facebook, dealing with, no offense, but the cults.

I deal with Roman Catholicism and its apostasy. I deal with Eastern Orthodoxy and its apostasy. And I talk about what the soteriological monergistic truth is of the scriptures based on the Trinitarian essence.

And I talk about that and other isms and istics. I love big words. Particularly when you date with your wife and you say something to her. You know, you say, so let's get going. And she goes, shh, shh, shh.

So I like big words. I'll be using a few. But if I do, I will tell you what they mean. All right? Sound good? You guys ready? Ready.

Want me to edit that for you? Fine. Yeah, hold it.

Hello, everyone. Hello. I can imagine that some of you have asked yourselves just who would be dumb enough to debate Matt Slick. Well, here I am. And I've been asking myself that same question. So I'd like to thank the Rocio Christie Club for putting this debate together.

Weber State University for hosting. Russi's for moderating. Matt Slick for traveling so far for this. And all of you for being here. Now, as far as this debate is concerned, I have to admit, I feel like a little kid who's been out playing sandlot baseball who suddenly got called straight to the big leagues.

And don't get me wrong. It's not like I don't debate religion much. I just never had a debate with actual rules. You see, some of my debates were judged on who could yell the loudest. And at times, I've done really good.

But don't worry. My wife made me promise I'd be on my best behavior tonight. Even still, I might get a little excited. My eyeballs will get big. I will not be as eloquent in my speeches, Mr. Slick. In fact, at times tonight, some of you might even think that I'm quite the, well, to keep it biblical, you might think that I'm just like Balaam's cocky ass.

And I'm okay with that. So I have a lot of friends who are evangelical Christians, including ministers. So what I have to say tonight is not an attack on any of you or your love and faith in Jesus Christ.

But it is an attack on the man-made philosophy of Solach and David. Faith alone. And some of the false teachings that evolve from that faith alone philosophy. So are we saved by faith alone or works?

Is this as if it has to be one or the other? And what are we saved from? Well, there's two deaths. The physical and spiritual. And they're both covered by grace. But through the atonement of Christ, the physical death has been taken care of.

And then everyone will now be resurrected. The spiritual death, which determines our eternal reward, it requires some effort on our part. So the physical death was taken care of over 2 ,000 years ago.

Jesus took upon him the sins of the world. While on the cross, he said, it is finished. He broke the chains of death and hell, allowing everyone to be resurrected. This is his free gift of grace. Jesus is 100 responsible for this.

There's nothing you or I can say or do to accept it or reject it or to merit it. We cannot attend the temple. You cannot accept Jesus as your personal Savior. It's his free gift. Jesus is the Savior of the whole world.

In 1 Timothy 2, the Apostle Paul says that God will have all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of truth. In chapter 4, he says that God is the Savior of all men, especially those that believe.

So just like the title of my favorite Clint Eastwood movie, everyone will be resurrected. The good, the bad, and the ugly. Which gives me hope. Now some have confused this gift of grace, and they made up a mathematical theorem.

A plus B equals C. Faith plus alone equals salvation. It's called the faith alone philosophy. And while it's a popular tradition, it is anything but biblical. Now Matt would have you to believe that by faith alone, salvation, and media.

Nothing else you can do. Oh, and us Mormons, we're going to work our way to heaven. As if I have that kind of power. Faith and belief are essential, but it's not an end-all. We still need to repent and be baptized, obey the commandments, and repent some more.

Our spiritual salvation is a process that we need to continue and endure. Not when it's convenient, but to the end. Through trials and tribulations. Knowing that it's after we do the will of God that we receive our reward.

Now because we're judged and rewarded by our works, we teach to be good and do good. And while I seek to be justified, I want a good and honest heart. Because there are so many scriptures that say that we can believe and still fall away, we need more than just faith alone.

We need to add to that faith so we don't fall away. Oh, I've got time. Thank you. Okay, well, there's a... Thank you. There's a good chance that I may offend someone tonight. Or some too. So whether you like my charming personality or lack thereof, it doesn't matter.

Tonight's debate is not about who is right, it's about what is right. So please judge the truth on the message given, not on the messenger given. Thank you. At this time, we'll have Matt give a 15-minute presentation statement.

Followed by a four-minute rebuttal by David.

Praise God, Isaiah 43, 7. Can't hear you. Can't hear me?

No. Use this one? Test it. Is this the one we're using then, Charlie?

Are you working it? What's that? Test one, two. There we go. Sound good? Better. Keep talking.

Better? All right. We'll do this one. If you speak into that mic, then you can be involved. Okay.

All right, so I do want to thank everybody for coming. And I know it's an inconvenient time on a Friday, but that's just how it worked out. What I'm going to do is read my opening statement.

It'll be more impromptu later on.

So our topic is, does the Bible teach salvation is by faith or works? So this is an incredibly important topic because it deals with the nature and extent of the atoning work and capability of God in flesh, Jesus Christ.

Now, the Bible is the topic, not to the Mormon or the Koran or feelings or anything else. Not the trustworthiness of anything like that. It's just what does the Bible say? I assert that the Bible teaches that salvation is by faith alone in Christ alone and that adding works to salvation is a false gospel and it results in damnation.

I assert that adding works to achieve salvation is in and of itself damnable. Now, in order for us to get through this, we've got to define our terms. I always tell people on the radio, what do you mean by this?

Define terms, define terms. The Bible is that set of books, 66, 39 in the Old Testament, 27 in the New. Salvation is being delivered from the righteous judgment of God and this includes forgiveness of all of our sins, justification, and ultimately dwelling eternally with God in peace.

This is for his glory. It is not, as some say, merely physical resurrection. Faith is, in the context of our debate, faith is the intellectual, emotional, and spiritual trust that a person has in the work of Jesus on the cross.

Now, by the way, just so you know, God grants that we have faith, Philippians 1, 29, and that faith is in Christ, John 6, 29. He gives it to whom he desires. Works, again, in the context of our debate, is the actions that are done by individuals, usually according to the Old Testament law.

Loving God, loving your neighbor, not lying, not stealing, not committing adultery, being good, doing things like that. Alright, we can get into a lot about that. And if you hear me on the radio, you know I can talk about this issue quite a bit, but I don't have time here.

So, what does the Bible say? Do we obtain salvation by faith or works? Now, notice, the topic is not a combination of faith and works. It is faith or works. I'm very technical, and so it's either this or that.

However, if you're going to have works, you also have faith. Okay, so I'm going to grant that. I'm not going to get into the minutia, but I'll grant that in relation to this topic, salvation, that those who do good works also have faith in God.

Alright. But is it our faith combined with our works that gets us saved, or is it our faith alone in God that gets us saved? Alright. Let's find out. What does the Bible say? In Acts 16, 30 -31, the Philippian jailer asked, What must I do to be saved?

Paul, in silence, answered, Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved, you and your household. In Ephesians 2 -8 -9, For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves, and it is the gift of God, not as a result of works, so that no one may boast.

Titus 3 -5. This is a critical verse. A lot of people should memorize Titus 3 -5. He saved us not on the basis of deeds which we have done in righteousness. This is something Catholicism and Eastern Orthodox teach, and other groups.

But he did this according to his mercy. 2 Timothy 1 -9. Who has saved us and called us with a holy calling, not according to our works. And 1 Peter 1 -9. Obtaining as an outcome of your faith the salvation of your souls.

Clearly, the Bible teaches salvation by faith without works. That's what it says. That's what it says. Alright, now, justification is a part of salvation. Justification is a legal standing before God.

Now, in Romans 5 -9, Paul relates, he connects justification and salvation. He says, Much more than having now been justified by his blood, we will be saved from the wrath of God through him. So, justification and salvation are connected.

Justification is a legal standing according to the law. Salvation is being delivered through the righteous judgment of God. They both have to occur. They're concomitant. That means that they are related and simultaneous.

Alright? Romans 4 -1 -5. What then shall we say that Abraham, our forefather, according to the flesh, is found for? If Abraham was justified by works, he is to be boast about, but not before God. For what does the scripture say?

Abraham believed God, and it was credited to his righteousness. Now, to the one who works, his wage is not credited as a favor, but what is due. But to the one who does not work, but believes in him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is credited as righteousness.

There it is. There it is. Romans 3 -28. Amen. For we maintain that a man is justified by faith, apart from the works of the law. The works of the law are summarized by Jesus in Matthew 22, 37 -40 when he says, Love God, love your neighbor.

It's a summation of all things. Quoting Deuteronomy 6 -5 and Leviticus 19 -18. 18 -19? In the Old Testament, respectively. Galatians 2 -16 says, Nevertheless, knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but through faith in Christ Jesus.

Now, note what Paul does. He contrasts faith and words. He says, if not this, it's this. Done. Done. If you want to add words, if you don't have the true gospel, I'll show you why a little bit later. So, clearly, that's what the Bible says.

Now, at this point, I want to introduce a concept. Now, I'm a theologian. I love theology. I love teaching on the doctrine of the Trinity. And I could teach on the Trinity for a long time. I'd get into some really interesting stuff about it.

Don't have time here. But I want to show you something. Hopefully, this will make sense. It makes sense to me. If it doesn't make sense to you, tell me later, and I'll work on it. The Trinitarian God is an entirely unique concept in all of theological examinations.

And I've been doing this for 44 years. And I've studied hundreds and hundreds of groups. I've never seen anybody approach the Trinity. They've had three gods. That's not the Trinity. Or one god and three manifestations.

That's not the Trinity either. The Trinity is one being who's eternal, doesn't have a beginning, does not have an end, and he eternally exists as the one, only God in all existence, place, and time in a Trinitarian essence where the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit are three distinct, simultaneous, co-eternal persons.

I can talk about aseity, divine simplicity, inseparable operations, economic trinity, and ontological trinity. But I don't have time for all that. And I love doing that. So if you go across the street later and you go, please teach me about this trinity, I'm going to go, yes.

That's right. All right. Now, why is that important? Because in the doctrine of the Trinity, we have the second person, the Word, who became flesh and dwelt among us. So Jesus is God in flesh. They call this the hypostatic union.

He has two natures in one person, divine and human. He's still a man right now, just so you know. Okay? And ask me later why he was baptized, and I'll tell you why it has to do with him being a man, the high priest, and everything else.

Now, why is this important? Because Jesus, who's God in flesh, made under the law, Galatians 4 .4, for a little while more than the angels, Hebrews 2 .9, he's the one who fulfilled the law perfectly and never sinned, 1 Peter 2 .22.

So he did everything perfectly. I've done nothing perfectly in my entire life. I don't believe I've done a single thing that's been pure. That's my honest opinion of myself. I don't believe a single thing I've ever done is pure because I'm a sinner at the core of my being.

Try not to be, but that's just the way it is. Now, when you have God, he's the one who becomes one of us, and he's the one who lives the law perfectly, then he's done everything. He's done it right on his intention.

He's done it right by his hands. He's done it right by his word. And he's God, so he therefore has a sacrifice of infinite value to be able to propitiate the sacrifice that turns away wrath, to propitiate the wrath of God, 1 John 2 .2, 4 .10.

He can do that, and he's on, as a man, he can offer a sacrifice on behalf of people. That means he's done it all perfectly. It's finished on the cross to tell us, it is finished, John 19 .30. It is done, it's finished.

What do we do? Are we going to go to the cross? Are we going to crawl up to that cross where the blood of God himself is coming down, draining down the wood, draining from his feet, draining onto the mud?

Are we going to walk up there? Are we going to crawl up there? Are we going to take a list of our good deeds, our baptism, our communion, our going to church, our tithing, or whatever it is you do, and nail it to the cross next to that blood, and hopefully God the Father will accept not only the blood of Christ, but your works as well.

And the combination will get you salvation because that's what the other gospel is. And Paul says in Galatians 1 .89, he repeats it, if we, or an angel from heaven, should preach to you a gospel contrary to what we have preached to you, let him be accursed.

Amen. The gospel is a death, burial, resurrection. Only in the Trinity do we have the one who was offended also be the one who became one of us so that he could satisfy the law, so we could go to the one who's offended and ask him to forgive us of our sins.

Jesus is prayed to in the Bible, and I'll show you all kinds of stuff about that, where he has all authority in heaven and earth, Matthew 28 .18, and you can ask Jesus anything, John 14 .14, and he will forgive you of all of your sins.

You don't need a priest, you don't need baptism, you don't need good works, you don't need anything, because all of it is by the works of your own hand touched by your sin. If you are adding to that, to what Christ has done, then you're saying what you have done is not sufficient.

That's what you're saying. The Bible clearly teaches, if it's by grace, it is no longer the basis of works, Romans 11 .6. And Galatians 5 .2 -4, Behold, I, Paul, say to you, that if you receive circumcision, circumcision was a representation of the law.

I can teach on baptism and circumcision quite a bit. So he says, Christ will be of no benefit to you. I testify again to every man who receives circumcision, he's under obligation to keep the whole law.

And I can go on to James 2 .10 and Galatians 3 .10, which talks about the issue of if you're going to be justified before God and saved before God by anything you do under the law, then you are obligated to fulfill all that law.

But I'll give you a little bit of a hint. Those of us who have died with Christ, Romans 6 .6, Romans 6 .8, Colossians 3, 1 -5, if you have died with Christ and you have died to the law, Romans 7 .4, and when you read Romans 5 .13, the law has no jurisdiction over you if you have died.

We therefore are not under obligation to follow that law. We can do whatever we want as Christians, but you know what? I'm going to go up by the Lord Jesus Christ. I want to honor my wife. I'm going to honor him.

I'm not going to lie about him. I'm not going to misrepresent him. I'm not going to lie to any of you. I'm going to honor people because I'm saved by the blood of Jesus Christ. That's why I do what I do, for his glory, not for mine, not for exaltation.

Now, the Bible teaches salvation by faith alone and Christ alone. I've already gone through the verses. Ephesians 2, 8, and 9. Titus 3, 5. You're saved by grace through faith, not by works. It specifically says it.

Specifically. It says justification, which is a legal declaration of righteousness. So the one who does not work, but believes in him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is credited as righteousness.

This is the true gospel. This is what the trinity has given to us. But triads, or modal anarchism, or civilianism, or unitary universalism, and all the false theologies, and Islam, and everything that is out there, their gods are insufficient, and so their gospels are also insufficient.

They don't have the god dying for them. They have a god, or a prophet, or somebody else dying for them, and they switch the responsibility of the one forgiving, the one who's offended God, to a created thing, and they transfer it over, and it does not work.

I could expand on that a lot. This stuff gets me going. I'll tell you one thing. I'm going to end with this. I've got about a minute, two minutes. I've got a lot more I can say. When I was 17, when I was 17, I was involved in the occult, pornography, foul language, everything except drugs.

I don't know why I never did drugs. It never happened. I went to a church one day just to see about Jesus, that guy, whatever. No problem. And I end up walking forward to receive Jesus. Yawn, yawn. I'm bored.

Might as well give him a try. That's my attitude. And then, the Holy Spirit himself came upon me with such power that all I could do was throw my face to the ground and moan and wail in the agony of being in the presence of incredible holiness.

And this went on and on like waves, tidal waves upon my heart. Light beaming into my soul, exposing my sin, causing me to force my face to the ground or the carpet.

And moan and almost yell out.

The agony of being in the presence of incredible holiness. And then to the left of me, Jesus was there. Couldn't see him. Couldn't touch him. His holiness. His purity. I still remember to this day that was 50 years ago.

I still remember him. Remember his presence and his holiness. This is true. I've calmed down a lot since then. 50 years. And one thing I know. You want a testimony? I'll give you a testimony of Jesus Christ.

You don't add to what he's done. Amen. Because in his presence, everything you have is touched by sin. And the only thing you can do is bow down. And you rely on him. That's what it means to be justified by faith.

Faith in him. Because faith is only as good as who you put it in. Faith is only as good as who you put it in. And it's the Lord Jesus Christ.

Whom you must serve. You must serve him. You must glorify the Lord Jesus. Trust in what he has done. Not in yourselves. Not in any works. Not in any capability. Not sincerely. Not your baptism. These things are important.

But they do not add to the blood of God on the cross. That's why he grants you faith. That you be justified by faith. Not by your efforts. But by what he's done. Amen. Amen. This time, we'll have Lehman present a four-minute revival.

I'll clap for that, too. That was excellent. And I've got the wrong group here, because you guys are saying amen, and my people don't say that, so... Come on. Lighten it up a little bit. Um... No, that was really enjoyable.

And I loved his conversion story. And I hear that in all different religions. And it's wonderful. And I think God works in all different religions. Um... The one thing I wanted to say amen with Matt was when he says, if you add words, it's damnable.

It's damnable. You know, of all the people that always quote to me and say, hey, don't add or subtract. Revelation's 22. That's gonna be pretty well the theme of my talk today. Um... Justification. I mean...

Do I go there? I mean, I'm gonna go there. Okay. Um... Matt knows all these big words. I think if we were in the military, he'd be a Navy SEAL. I'm not even a weekend warrior. I dropped out of this very institution my senior year in college and started a lawn mowing business.

So, I don't know these big words. If you came here looking to see two intellects going toe-to-toe, you're gonna go home disappointed. Um... I'm sufficiently ignorant enough that I've never been accused of being an intellect.

I like them. They make for great conversations. But I'm more of a guy that goes with William Tyndale who said... How did he say that? He said that if he could finish translating the Bible, that a boy in the plow of the field would know more than the Pope.

Um... I used to mow lawns for a living, so I'd humor myself and say I was a lawn mowing boy. Um... I don't know all these big things, but I can read the Bible. And on justification, it never says you're justified by faith alone.

It never does. You can add it all you want, but I just... I've got a few things in James that says that by words a man is justified and not by faith only. You can work on that one. Matthew 12 says that by words you're justified.

I didn't bring my water up yet. And... it says that we believe we're justified. And then it says we're justified without deeds of the law. And that would be the law of Moses, and we agree with that, too.

And now he says we're justified by his blood. We agree with all of that. I love it. Love the Bible. Agree with all of it. Just not the, um... Go ahead. Go ahead. Oh... Oh, yeah, I'm almost out of time.

This is amateur hour, folks. Um... Anyways... I've got my presentation a little more set forth than he does. Um... But the key thing is is that, um... being saved by faith alone is adding to the Bible.

And we're gonna see how that's being added to the Bible. Um... Faith is a beautiful thing. I'm so glad we're not...

We're not living the law of Moses. If I lived the law of Moses I'd have been stoned a couple times already. Um... It's a terrible thing. It's a hard law to live. Um... Faith is where it is at. But it's not faith alone.

Never was faith alone. Never taught in the Bible. You can come up with all these scriptures and say, see this and see that and see that. But why don't we just stick with what's in the Bible? If you're a biblical church you need to look and read exactly what the Bible says.

Um... 30 seconds. I'm pretty well lost. Maybe by the next rebuttal I'll do a little better. Um... But, yeah. I'm ready to start my thing and so we'll move forward. Thank you. I say these things in Jesus' name.

At this time, David will present a 15 minute statement. So I meet people all the time that say they belong to a biblical church and that all of your teachings come from the Bible. And I'll ask them, would you belong to a church where some man cherry picks the scriptures and then tells you what he thinks God is trying to say?

Not what God actually says. And their answer is always, absolutely not. It has to be written in the Bible. You can tell what group of people I'm talking to, can't you? But when we compare their beliefs to what is actually written in the Bible, not only is it different, but quite often, it's exactly the opposite.

And we'll look at this later. So I'm going to share some numbers with you. And I'm going with the King James Version. The other Bibles have higher or lower numbers. But the results are the same. And since we can all agree that God is the author of the Bible, it's safe to say that God chose to use the word faith 247 times in the Bible.

He used the word alone 108 times. That's 355 times. So how many times do you think that God said we're saved by faith alone? And before you answer that, who do you think said it more? A little trivia.

Jesus or the Apostles? Most people think the Apostles. But they said it the same number of times. And this is a little off topic, but the sinner's prayer. A sinner's prayer, for you that don't know, it's a prayer that evangelical Christians can give.

It doesn't save them. It's just a way to talk to God and commune with God. And as part of the process, they'll accept Jesus as their personal Savior and a hell-bound sinner. But there were 650 prayers given in the Bible.

How many of those do you think were the sinner's prayer? And again, who said it more? Jesus or the Apostles? Well, they said it the same number of times, too. But here's where it really gets interesting, and I'm not evangelical.

Jesus and the Apostles said that we're saved by faith alone the exact number of times that Jesus and the Apostles said the sinner's prayer. I mean, unbelievable. What are the odds of that? Could this just be a coincidence?

I don't think so. Because when something this unlikely happens, we should seriously take note. And more important, just what is the message that God was trying to give us? Oh, and the number of times they said it?

That would be zero. Never. Not just never, but never ever. God never said that. And so my question to Matt will be, since Jesus never said the words faith alone for the Apostles, I'm curious. What's the name of the man who made up that philosophy?

And since it isn't written in the Bible, it would be nice to know what book it was first written in. You know, just the year, maybe. If it was written in the Dark Ages or the Renaissance, I don't know.

So before we go on, I want you to know I'm not an illusionist up here manipulating the Scriptures so you can't read that it says we're saved by faith alone. And as much as I'd love to tell my grandkids that Grandpa's a Jedi Master, you will not see the words faith alone in the Bible.

My side should allow it. It's just not written in the Bible. And to think that Martin Luther, probably the greatest proponent of the faith alone philosophy, said that this is the basis of your entire religion.

And it's not even written in the Bible. Unbelievable. Seriously, Matt, if we were up at a football stadium, somebody would be spiking a football. And it wouldn't be him. This alone should be enough to show that faith alone is nothing more than a man-made philosophy.

Especially if you believe in sola scriptura, the Bible alone. That all your teachings come directly from the Bible. But your teaching is if you have a prophet. And I'm a huge fan of modern-day apostles and prophets.

But if you're not, you should be extremely concerned. But I don't want to call the game just yet because when you take the teachings from this faith alone philosophy, it absolutely goes from bad to worse.

Now, because A plus B equals C, you know, faith plus alone equals salvation. At this point, it doesn't matter. You can say whatever you want. Jesus could command us, he could command all men everywhere to repent, which he did.

But this philosophy says you don't have to. It won't affect your salvation because you're saved by faith alone. Now let's look at two of these. First off, if you want to obey the commandments, but you don't have to, you're still saved.