The Descent of CNism into the World of Candace Owens

You know, I just used the end of 2025 as sort of a, just a,

I wasn't trying to be prophetic. I wouldn't make those types of claims.

I just said last year that by April when the big conference took place, there'd be a lot more clarity as far as positions, and that by the end of 2025 the lines would be drawn.

Well, here it is, December 30th. We've still got one day to go.

It could get crazier. It might. I'm now a

Mossad agent, and I'm getting paid off by Israel. And if that's the case, would someone please tell me what bank account the money's going into because I don't have a clue.

I ain't seeing any of it. So I'd like to find out because, hey, you know, that'd just be wonderful.

The world has gone insane. And there's a guy, yeah,

Michael King, two hours ago just tweeted,

I didn't have James White and Doug Wilson becoming apologists for Talmudic Judaism on my 2025 bingo card, but here we are,

I guess. I mean, maybe these people don't exist.

Maybe there's just one guy out there and he's dying laughing at the insanity of it all.

Because you can't take any of this seriously. I mean, honestly, what color is the sky in these people's world?

Yeah, I'll get back to that in a moment. Because I want to talk a little bit. Here's the evidence.

Y 'all want the evidence? Okay. There. Just pull these out of my library.

They've been in my library. I wonder if there's a date in here. 387.

Oh, look at that. Oh, it's cool to find old notes that you wrote, you know, 40 years ago.

387. So, wow. Right, getting close to 40 years on that. So, March of 1987.

This is the Mishnah. This is one of the volumes of the Mishnah.

Sincino Talmud. There it is. There it is. The Sincino Talmud. Yeah, same sticker.

So I'm figuring this was probably still 87 as well,

I would assume. There's some notes in here, too. Oh, yeah.

Because, see, those of us who do actual apologetics actually engage the other side and have been doing it for decades, which, according to Eric Kahn, was irrelevant when

I did it, too, by the way, if that's another story. We have to engage the best the other side has, and that means, for example, digging into what

Jewish tradition was in Tanniatic Judaism and Second Temple Judaism, to be able to respond to Roman Catholics, for example, who use

Matthew 23 and the Seed of Moses as one of their arguments against Stola Scriptura. And so that means getting into what the

Jewish tradition was and, you know, where did the tradition about dedicating your goods to the temple and therefore you don't have to support your parents, you know, where'd that come from?

It's in the New Testament. You need to know these things. And I realize that most of these guys have never gotten to that level in anything they do, so they don't really know why you do that.

But that's why, yeah, I not only have both the

Mishnah and the Talmud, and if you don't know where these came from, the

Mishnah was codified about 250 years after Christ. Then you have the commentary on the

Mishnah called the Gemara, and that collects, and there's not just one version, there's variations.

And so you've got the, when you put the Mishnah and the Gemara together, you have the Talmud. And so this is original source material.

I have, I don't know how many bookshelves in my office, of original source material on Islam, commentaries, the key commentaries,

Ibn Ishaq, and volumes and volumes and volumes of the Hadith in my library.

And for some people, for some really benighted, dull

Christians, they think I shouldn't have that. That's bad. You shouldn't talk with Muslims.

They're bad. And now, evidently, you shouldn't study Judaism. So, when

I took seminary classes, and I collected a relatively small, but not bad, library of Jewish resources, including things written by Jewish scholars,

I was doing that primarily for New Testament background material, not so much

Old Testament, but New Testament background material, especially in the Gospels, to understand something about Second Temple Judaism, which is relevant to variations that try to attack

Pauline theology, the federal vision, stuff like that. All important stuff, stuff that I was dealing with.

And these guys don't even know what this stuff is. They've never dealt with it, wouldn't know what to do with it if they did. But anyway, so,

I've got to remember to tell you about these books before we get done. I will never remember to do so.

Anyways, so, some of us, when you engage in apologetics in a wide range of topics, and you want to do so well, you need to do so in depth.

And that's what we've been doing for a long, long time. How in the world anyone can come up with the idea that I am promoting the

Talmud? Where have I said a word? I asked a guy, I said, promoting

Talmud, I'll wait, show me where I did. They're not going to come up with anything.

Could be a bot, or most of these guys, they make stupid statements and then they run off into the darkness, get a different account, come back with their three followers and do it again.

That's happened all the time. So I just, when evangelical dark web, who has a very long history of being wrong about pretty much everything.

When evangelical dark web put up a graphic, and how could

I, well, I'll just describe it to you.

It's the more you know thing from the PBS stuff, remember years ago?

It says the more you know that it has the Star of David. And the comment is the

Antioch declaration was the first step to embracing the Talmud. That's one of the stupidest things

I've ever heard in my life. We're talking low IQ here, very, we're talking dumber than a wet shoelace

IQ here. What? I would love to see someone try. And I said, well,

Doug Wilson said there's things in the Talmud that are good. There's a whole lot of quotation of the

Old Testament in the Talmud, you brilliant person. And Jesus never said that every single thing that the

Jewish leader said was wrong. Did he? I mean, this is the same shallow echo chamber thinking that made people go nuts when

I had a dialogue with Yasir Qadhi, which I'm doing again in January, by the way, they just lost their mind.

You can't do that. He's a, he's a Muslim. And we don't like who he's associated with.

And so we can't hear anything. And we don't want to hear anything. And we don't want to learn. We don't want to know. We don't want to be able to communicate with people.

We just, we just want to live in our little caves and, and throw rocks at each other. Wow, amazing.

It truly is amazing. The Antioch Declaration has something to do with the

Talmud? Who are you, Candace Owens? I mean, seriously, haven't you seen her just floating off into Nuttyville?

She can take any 12 facts from the Wendy's menu and come up with a conspiracy theory about space aliens in Brazil.

And so can you people. It's just like, what? Okay. Rich is falling into the trap too.

Anyway, I see this stuff and I'm like, what, but, but how do you, where did reason go?

Where did rationality go? Where did, where did logic go? It's gone.

As soon as you jump onto the, it's all the Jews bandwagon, anything goes, anything goes.

And I'm just like, you've got to be kidding me. So yeah.

And then today, have you seen this? So Joel Webben posted a little while ago,

Friday, January 2nd, 12 p .m. Eastern time, Christian nationalism meets

America first. And it's a, oh, you haven't seen this, huh? And it's a screenshot of Joel Webben interviewing

Nick Fuentes. Yep. Yep. Yep. The foul mouthed, absolute ignoramus when it comes to anything of a

Christian worldview. I mean, this, this is one of the most despicable men

I've ever seen in my life. I've unfortunately had to listen to him talking about wanting a 16 -year -old girl as his wife.

And the reasons why, the man is vile with a capital V and a capital E at the end.

And Christian nationalism meets America first. We are talking disaster here.

And who, and who posts this, but Dale Partridge. Dale Partridge, the, here

I am. Me, me, me too. Me, me, me too. It's so sad.

I mean, the stuff that this guy posts, I mean, he's a rudderless ship.

It's just wherever the wind blows. Whoa, that's the new thing now. Whoa, that's a new thing now. I've seen him go through 14 different iterations in just the past couple of years.

It's just, it's just astonishing. And we're, we're going to be behind that. And is this the guy, is, is

Partridge the one doing the thing with Webbin about doing a book or something on Israel or something?

I don't know. Like I said, if this is how 25 is ending, 2026 is going to be,

I'm going to need to put a seatbelt on this chair. Because it's just going to be unbelievable.

Unbelievable. So, yeah, good luck finding the pro,

I guess if you say for these people, the mindset with these people, and believe me,

I know this mindset because I've encountered it in regard to Islam.

If every Muslim is 100 % evil, every

Muslim source is 100 % evil, it has to be. If you acknowledge, for example,

I have said many times, Islam is closer to biblical Christianity than Mormonism ever could be.

Why? Well, this requires rational thought. This requires that you not be a

TLDR person. Too long, didn't read. So if it's more than two small paragraphs, too long, didn't read.

In other words, my attention span is not that deep. My IQ is not that high. I am a meme -driven person, and I'm just going to run with it.

I want my emotions taken care of. I don't want to have to think. So that's where I'm going.

Do you have those lights changing color behind you? When I do that in the

RV, you get angry with me. And now you've installed lights behind you that change color.

They were blue a little while ago, then they went green, now yellow. Where's the coogee?

He said that's never going to happen. I want everyone to mark that one down. So first of all, these are nice lights.

These are professional lights. You think you could get better lights in an

RV? Well, it depends on how much time I have. Sorry folks,

I've got to see all this stuff. I've got these constant distractions out here. Trying to stay focused is not easy at all.

Someone's trying to boot Ilhan Omar. Good, good. The woman is an absolute catastrophe, an invader.

I'm sorry. When you put your hand up and swear to take an oath to serve the

United States government, and you don't mean a word of it, you need to understand something. Oaths only have meaning in a particular worldview.

Oaths mean nothing to a Somalian. Their worldview has no way of even understanding what that's supposed to mean.

Have we not seen this enough? Have we not been ripped off to the tunes of billions and billions and billions and billions of dollars already?

You don't get it yet? People go, oh, you sound like a Christian nationalist. No, that's what they're tapping into.

They're tapping into the utter corruption of our entire system because we've abandoned any kind of meaningful

Christian worldview. They're right about that. You don't turn around and then turn everybody into a victim and do the victimhood stuff that the left does.

That's what the right's doing now. That's not where the solution lies. Okay? So, by the way, before I go to the

Eric Kahn, Doug Webbin stuff, let me say something about this

Talmud Israel stuff. And it is going to be mentioned in here. Whether it was in Webbin's stuff or Kahn's stuff, they're basically the same thing.

I don't talk about Israel. Here's two books.

Two books that I need for next year's work came in the mail over the holidays.

Thomas A. O'Meara's Mary in Protestant and Catholic Theology. Some good stuff on Calvin and stuff in there.

And Fran O 'Rourke's Pseudo -Dionysius and the Metaphysics of Aquinas. This, if you can't sleep.

Okay? This kind of stuff that I'm dealing with. Okay? These guys don't deal with stuff like this.

This is not in the library. I have no idea why anyone would, because they don't deal with these areas at all.

They may try to rely upon other people who do, but they're not going to do it themselves. They don't have the background. They don't have the linguistics. They don't have the background to any of it.

So, this is where I'm having to be right now. And I don't have time.

I cannot keep up with the TPUSA, Candace Owen, Charlie Kirk, conspiracy theory, all the rest of this kind of stuff.

I don't have time for it. This is all going to go the way of the world very, very quickly.

I'm trying to work on stuff that would actually have meaning 20, 30 years from now, maybe, something like that.

Anyway, so, I don't sit here and talk about the

Jews, and I don't talk about Israel. And so, it's very clear that in different sectors of what's broadly called evangelicalism, there are certain borders you're not supposed to transgress.

So, yeah, I understand dispensational premillennialism has a big commitment to blessing

Israel, and you see all this stuff, and all these people that went over to Israel recently, and Huckabee, all the rest of this kind of stuff.

I don't believe any of that stuff. Where have you ever heard me promoting that?

I was raised with a lot of it, but never really to that level. But I'm not into any of that stuff.

When October 8th, was it 8th? 7th? 7th? 8th? Whenever that thing happened a couple of years ago.

Remember, a couple of days later, I got into a lot of trouble because I sat here going, how could the most advanced society in the

Middle East, with surveillance, drones, satellites, everything, at least the people who pulled off the

Hezbollah pager stuff, they had spies in the highest reaches of the

Iranian government to allow us to take out those nuclear sites. These people, they've got spies in our own government.

How did they get caught absolutely flat -footed right before an election that Netanyahu was going to lose?

And he was going to lose it. Who's still in charge there? Netanyahu. Years later.

And I raised a simple question. How could this happen? I mean,

I'm sitting here going, I'm not sure about all this. I mean, I'm not over there.

You see all this stuff on the news. Who knows anymore? How much of it's AI? How much of it's just a simple lie?

How much of it is suppressing knowledge? I don't know, and you don't either. That's the important part. I know that I don't know.

You don't know that you don't know. That's where it gets dangerous. So I don't trust

Netanyahu. I don't trust the Israeli government. But the Israeli government isn't a

Jewish government. Not in the sense of, it's certainly, this is not relevant to the vast majority of the

Israeli government. The Israeli government is secular. I've been to Tel Aviv.

Tel Aviv is a secular city. The San Francisco of Israel, as far as homosexuality is concerned.

So it's a secular state. And therefore, it's going to be Israel first.

And if you live in Israel, and you want to be Israel first, that's up to you. By the way, if you live in the

United States, you cannot be Somali first. Okay, that's just wrong. That's called being a traitor.

Anyway, so, do I trust

Benjamin Netanyahu? No. No, I don't. He seems to have consolidated power well past when he would have been voted out.

And so, what does that have to do with Gaza? It could have everything to do.

It might have nothing to do. I don't know. You don't know either. Everybody's got theories. Everybody's absolutely certain about this, that, or the other thing.

But, I'm not one of these people that sits here and...

When I view Judaism, it has historical interest to me.

Especially in the formulation of the Mishnah and Talmud. As to tracing the accuracy of traditions that can help us to interpret the

New Testament. What traditions existed at that time. But, outside of that, the book of Hebrews tells us, it's passed away.

It's passed away. And, as development continued in it after the time of Christ, it's always development away from its

Old Testament roots and its fulfillment in the Messiah Jesus. So, even when people started going, it's not

Judeo -Christian, I always understood that Judeo -Christian was simply talking about the interface in the fact that we have a

Bible that has two sections. The Hebrew Old Testament, and yes, it was written in Hebrew, for all the

Lulu's that think otherwise. And, the Greek New Testament, which quotes extensively from the

Old Testament. And so, Judeo -Christian is not a religion, it's not a mixture, it's a recognition that much of the

Old Testament is repeated in the New Testament, and therefore things like, oh, I don't know, monotheism might be a

Jewish concept and a Christian concept at the same time. See, this is how rational people think.

This is not how conspiratorial people think. And so, they see Judeo -Christian, and now that's, oh, it's a new religion.

Wow. Seriously? Okay. That's just dumb.

That's the only way to put it. It's just dumb. So, when

I talk about the Jewish people, look, there's great argument in Romans 11 about what's being referred to when all

Israel will be saved. Well, what does that mean? And there have been Reformed people that have said it's ethnic

Israel, there have been Reformed people that have said it's spiritual Israel, there's Reformed people that have said it's somewhere in between, a mixture, depending.

I'm not going to go to war over something like that. But I don't see,

I do believe that there has been the great divorce, and natural

Israel, the state of Israel, I do not for a second believe that 1948 is biblical prophecy, and that's why

I disagree with Michael Brown about all this stuff. When I questioned what happened in Israel, he contacted me. He was not happy with me about that.

It was one of the last times we had any contact. He was not happy with me about raising questions about what had happened.

So, I'm not one of these people saying, well, we need to bless Israel. No, I see no biblical connection, anything in scripture, with the national state of Israel today.

Nothing. So, saying I'm on the payroll of Israel or something?

And then it's always, well, you know, you did a debate, you know, like 15 years ago with Michael Brown, and Michael Brown goes to Israel, and Michael Brown does it.

It's like, really? What did we debate? We defended the Trinity. Then we debated each other on Reformed theology.

Then we did a debate against homosexuals, against homosexual ministers. We've debated each other more often than we've debated on the same side.

But you're friends, so you just got to hate those Jews, huh? Okay, I guess that Jew hatred thing actually sticks more than you all would like to admit it actually sticks.

Yeah, so let me just be straightforward for everybody. Mike Huckabee is not calling my phone number, okay?

He ain't asking me for my advice. Yeah, Rich is checking the phone.

Nope, nothing from Mike Huckabee. I don't believe any of that stuff. I don't.

I don't even agree with Reformed people that think that there's going to be some kind of national restoration of a nation state.

I don't see it. I see the church as the fulfillment. That's not replacement theology, that's fulfillment theology.

I'm not even getting into that right now. I'm just simply saying, people who sit here and say these stupid things, why do you say stupid things in public?

What motivates you? Why don't you have any concern for honesty, rationality, logic, truth, anything like that?

It's truly astonishing to see what's going on today amongst people who at least, if you're just some secular wacko and you don't believe there's objective truth, okay, that's your thing.

But if you're honestly, call yourself a

Christian, then you maybe want to be thinking about this kind of stuff. I don't know.

So, yeah. I'm having a thought here. I recorded my lesson this morning.

I'll be putting that out tomorrow. And it was a lot of Romans 11 you were just talking about as well as Romans 12.

One of the things that I kind of came across was referring to 2

Timothy 2 .16. Because I was talking about this group and a lot of the stuff they're throwing out so much.

They go into their echo chambers and they talk amongst themselves and they come up with grand ideas and suddenly it's all fact.

And verse 16, it just nails it. Avoiding godless and empty chatter.

It's what these guys do every time they get on the internet. They just sit there and type godless and empty chatter for it will lead to further ungodliness.

2025, folks. That's just described 2025 for these guys. And their word will spread like gangrene.

This just... It's exactly what they do every single day.

And we've been saying it now for years. Well, and we're seeing it. How it infects churches.

How it infects churches. It infects people. It takes them over like gangrene does.

Alright. So, on Christmas Day. On Christmas Day.

Joel Webben, who I guess I'm seeing. And I'd have to spend a whole lot more time online than I'm currently willing to spend to keep up with everything.

But other than the Nick Fuentes thing, which evidently has already happened. Which again, shows that much spiritual discernment.

Hey, unless... Hey, I would love to see him go after Nick Fuentes for all the wacky stuff he does.

I... And says how he behaves. All the rest of it. I don't expect that.

But that would be wonderful. That would be great. But, on Christmas Day. A woman,

I don't even have the thing here. A non -Jewish Christian woman put up a post that pointed out that this guy that was arrested for planning a violent attack on a synagogue in Ogden, Utah, lives only six minutes away from Refuge Church, which is where Brian Salve and Eric Conner live.

Now, as I said in my response to Joel Webben, the appropriate response to a post like that is to say what evidence do you have that this young man had any contact with, knowledge of, was influenced by Refuge Church as a whole or any individual that's a part of it.

Now, I don't know the answers to those questions. Maybe he did. I don't know. I have no earthly idea.

But the rational, logical, Christian response is to go, what evidence do you have or is this just simply unfounded speculation that can be dismissed?

Joel Webben's response to her was four words.

I guess one is a contraction, so it maybe accounts for two. The response was, silence,

Jew, it's Christmas. Quote, unquote. Silence, Jew, it's

Christmas. Now, a lot of people noticed that.

I don't know how you couldn't. It is obviously on any rational, biblical or spiritual level completely indefensible.

If you defended that, I don't even know how to talk to you. If you said it, I don't know how to talk to you. Someone wisely grabbed a bunch of screenshots of the

Stone Choir Boys, likewise saying, shut up,

Jew. That's what they do all the time. Shut up, Jew.

Shut up, Jew. There's no other way of reading silence, Jew, than using

Jew as an epithet. It's an insult. You detest the term

Jew. And if you can defend that, I'm not talking to you anymore because you and I, we're not even standing on this anymore.

You've gone someplace, I don't know where. You can't find that in here. You can find

Paul saying, the Jews did this to me and the Jews did that to me. It's the same guy who said he'd be willing to be anathematized for their salvation.

So don't even touch this thing and speak like that. Don't even do it. Don't even pretend.

It's vile. Absolutely vile. Silence, Jew.

Shut up, Jew. This is what we've come to in certain sectors of what was once called

Reformed Christianity. And so all

I did when I saw it the next day was, well, still a few days left in 2025.

And I was referring to the fact that I had said, well, 2025, I think by the end of the year, we're going to see some real windstorm.

Well, my oh my. Joel Webben wrote a response.

Not shocking. At least he's not quite as wordy as Leighton Flowers. I'm not sure there is anyone as wordy as Leighton Flowers.

So I'll give Joel that much credit. I did read, by the way, that they're no longer going to be posting his sermons online.

They're not posting it publicly anymore. I don't know.

If he's going to be palling around with Nick Fuentes, maybe that's, I mean,

I think it's a good thing one way or the other, but, you know. Silence, Joel. Yeah, silence,

Joel. Yeah. He writes, the woman

I'm responding to is a constant defender of Israel. Oh. Okay.

That explains all of it, right? I mean, that's good enough to call somebody a Jew, right?

No, it's not. Not in any rational world. Not in any mature world. On the playground, maybe.

But not in a mature world. Including supporting the genocide in Gaza and the murder of innocent

Palestinian babies. Well, I am quite certain that he can give us posts where innocent

Palestinian babies, she's going, get them, all right. Yeah, doubtful. In addition to this, she was literally insinuating that Brian Salve and Eric Kahn were responsible for a young man who was plotting violence against a

Jewish synagogue, and she did this on Christmas Day. Okay. Like I said, what adults do, what people with some semblance of maturity do, is they respond the way that I said.

Where is your evidence? If you're insinuating that we had anything to do with radicalizing this guy, encouraging him to violence, anything like that, look.

Utah, folks, I know most of you don't understand this. Utah is spiritual zanyville.

Okay. You can find anything in Utah. Especially, I mean,

Salt Lake's bad enough, but you get into some of the outer areas, it gets even weirder.

So there could be all sorts of radicalizing influences in a place like Ogden, Logan, Provo, though it's going to be more secular in Provo, because university and BYU and stuff like that.

But you get down to Cedar City and things can get really crazy, but it'll be more right -wing crazy.

Anyway, there's anything up there. So it would be very easy to go, okay, yeah, this guy was six minutes away from our church.

That's where he lived. Got any evidence that we had any connection with him? Have anything from his computer where he had us bookmarked and download our files?

There's the rational, logical way to do it. And then there's the, I want clicks and I want to be seen as edgy web.

And that's what Webben did. Okay. In other words, her consistent allegiance is to the

Jewish people at the continual cost of Christians. Oh, wow. How fast did we get there?

How fast did we switch from, yeah, I said silence Jew. But now you need to understand

I'm the victim. And I'm standing up for great things.

And I'm standing up for the Christian people. And I'm standing against people whose allegiance is to the

Jewish people. And give me a break. You could have just apologized.

You could have just said, oh, wow, I'm sorry. That was just completely out of line.

And it's indefensible. No, he's going to double down to that till his dying day or until he repents.

One of the two. Additionally, for those who are still confused why reform ministers such as Dr.

James White are constantly instigating online fights with other reform ministers.

Oh, Mr. Pot, Mr. Kettle's calling. What are you talking about?

You don't think you instigated this? You don't think when you publicly put silence

Jew that that was you thought that was going to go by quietly? No, you didn't. It was on purpose, Joel.

And you know it. You know it. You instigated this.

You started it. You guys are the ones doing all the conferences and pushing this stuff. You know it.

Stop lying. It's obvious. Some of us are trying to deal with other important stuff that you know nothing about and never will.

We're trying. I don't want to be talking about this stuff. I really don't.

But I had the misfortune of one speaking at one of your conferences. So we're sort of connected.

Not anymore. The obvious where I stand now, isn't it? But you all call yourselves reformed.

This is a cancer in the reformed churches. And when a man who calls himself a minister on Christmas Day can say to a woman who professed to be a

Christian, silence Jew. I'm not going to sit here and be quiet about it. And you knew

I wouldn't. That's why you did it. That's why you did it. You're the instigator.

You guys, you know it. This is how you get clicks. I don't care about clicks for this. I really don't.

I would much rather be teaching about the incredibly negative influence of pseudo -Dionysus on the development of spiritualism and the monastic movement and mysticism in the medieval period and the influence that had on both

Protestants and Roman Catholics. And the huge influence it's had on Eastern Orthodoxy. I'd much rather be doing that kind of stuff.

Because it has a longer value to the church. But you all the ones,

Eric Kahn, I believe in response to this Joel Webben article, this

Joel Webben tweet, said, So if you think

I'm being rough, Eric Kahn thinks I'm disqualified, thinks our churches are disqualified, is calling for our repentance.

Okay? So when I say stay away from Refuge Church, there's a reason why

I'm saying it. Okay? They're the ones that have started all this stuff.

They're the ones that are going off the reservation. They did not believe this stuff five years ago.

They did not. They're the ones that have changed. Not us. We're right where we've been all along.

They're the ones that have gone off and they're doing... If you can defend, silence

Jew, you've lost it. You're off the reservation. You're gone.

You're the one that needs to repent. Okay? Straightforward. So, um...

Constantly instigating online fights. And yes, you can easily verify that James has been the instigator in every online spat with Ogden and myself.

Simply read the following. And then, I think this is pretty much the quote from, um...

From Eric Kahn. It's the same material. But...

And by the way, it's just a lie. We're not trying to instigate anything. I'm sick of this whole thing.

I'm sick of this whole mess. I wish you all would just shut up and go away. Really do. But, Dr.

James White and Michael Brown have been close friends for decades. And have debated each other for decades. And James White has never spoken about Michael Brown the way he has spoken about men like me.

Um... I've never heard Michael Brown speak like you. Okay?

You know, Michael's had some problems recently that I haven't gotten into because I don't have the time to read the thousands of pages that have been produced about it.

Okay? So, I've sat on the sidelines. I haven't said a word about it. But, you are the one that's trying to build a ministry on clerks.

You're the one trying to get young men to follow you. You're the one that's trying to get them doing the victimization thing.

You're the one playing with the Jewish stuff. You're the one dancing around the edges of Neo -Nazism.

Not Michael Brown. You are. Nothing I can do about that.

Don't you dare lie about me and say I've instigated that. I don't give you a second thought except that you talk all the time.

If you wouldn't do things like this, I wouldn't have to say anything about you. Dr. Michael Brown wrote a book called

Christian Anti -Semitism. In it, he defended the Talmud and denounced the church fathers, reformers, and covenant theology, all of which

James has claimed to affirm throughout his public ministry, and which I have debated against him about, which you could never do.

He would wipe the floor with you, Joel. And you know it. So, we didn't sweep any of that under the rug.

Multi -hour debates. Show me yours. All you can show me is

Nick Fuentes. All you can show me is you and your boys sitting around in a webcast saying really stupid things about church history.

Dr. Michael Brown works for FIRM, an organization founded and funded by the Israel I'm not sure what the

Israel is, to write American Evangelical Sunday School quarterlies, small group material, and Bible studies designed to get

Christians in America to support the Israeli state. James is a close friend of a literal Israeli operative.

Joel, that is one of the dumbest things you've ever written. You show a single bit of evidence that there is any connection, or just admit that you don't care about logic and you don't care about rationality at all anymore.

None. It's all the clicks. It's all just getting people to follow. The only people you want following you now are the people who are not going to hold your feet to the fire.

That's all you want. We talked on the phone, man. You know it.

I warned you. I told you about this stuff. Oh, I'm just trying to give these young men...

They're all you want. They're all you want. You've compromised. You've sold out. You've sold your soul.

I don't know if you can ever get it back. The point. Many think that men like Dr.

James Water are principled in their decision to try to destroy pastors like me. What did I respond to? Silenced you.

Does this remind you of anybody? Doesn't this remind you of how the left, after they say some wild, insane, crazy thing, respond like this?

We're the victim. He's trying to destroy pastors like me for saying silenced you.

Really? How do you look at yourself in the mirror? You know this is a bunch of baloney.

You know it's indefensible. And you're going to be the... You're the victim now?

Wow! Okay. They're not. Underneath all the theological and pietistic language, just another boomer who is sadly manipulated over the course of his life by Israeli propaganda showing indefensible bias against other ministers who simply believe

Judaism and Israel are a threat to America and the church. There it is. There's what Joel Webben is now.

One string banjo. Israel. Judaism. Oh wow!

It's the big thing! Isn't it funny? I came out of dispensational thinking.

I abandoned all that. So I guess they didn't do a really good job, did they?

No, they didn't. So here's the big long woo -ha -ha from Joel and Eric Kahn is obviously pulling from the same material.

And evidently and I didn't bother to look at evidently there is a there's a link here to J .D.

Hall. I don't read J .D. Hall. I don't bother. And nobody else should either.

Disqualified. Done. Finished. Over with. But James White's friend

Michael Brown works for the Israeli government. He's a supporter of the Talmud. He wrote a book attacking anti -Semitism.

Christian anti -Semitism. Confronting the lies of today's church. He's literally taking money from Israel to push their propaganda.

Well, I don't know if Michael gets money from I don't know who he works for. I don't know who donates to his ministry.

No earthy idea. As I said, we don't. And if you say, well, you've got a friend.

Come on. This kind of argument. Well, you know, as long as This is

If you're trying to go for the same slice of the online community that's chasing after Candace these days, then go for it.

Go for it. I've had lunch with Yasir Qadhi.

So I obviously have something to do with Islamic extremism. And you can link me to the

Mormons, Jehovah's Witnesses, Roman Catholics, Jesuits. Oh my goodness, I have a friend who's a Roman Catholic priest. That must mean something.

I mean, you can do any of this stuff. As long as you don't care about truth, honesty, or rationality.

As long as you don't care, that's completely indefensible. As long as all you're going for is emotion, emotion, emotion, emotion, emotion.

Me, me, me, me, me. That's all you guys got. That's all you got. Doug Wilson was recently at AmFest has been defending the

Talmud. What do you mean defending the Talmud? I haven't seen any of this stuff. What do you mean? Is saying that there are biblical principles in the

Talmud, is that defending the Talmud? Is the new thing, do you have to say that every single thing said in the

Talmud is false? So like, like, you know, when the Book of Mormon says, the sun rose in the morning, we have to say the sun doesn't rise in the morning?

Or you're saying the Book of Mormon is good? What is this here? I've never seen any evidence that you people have done any meaningful background study in the

Mishnah, the Gemara, and the Talmud. None. So, what are you trying to say?

Why should I believe you? What's actually here?

I've never seen any of these people saying, you know, maybe the Talmud should be added to the

New Testament, or maybe the Talmud is this, that, what are they saying? Where have

I ever said on this program? You know, the Talmud has some good things from God in it.

I've never said anything like it. At all. It's a valuable tool to understand the development of Judaism.

The Mishnah, primarily, the Gemara and Talmud are too far removed historically to shed really much light on the

New Testament. But, the Mishnah is vitally important in understanding the

Jewish traditions that are referred to in the New Testament. Are you denying that? Is that somehow saying there's something good about the

Talmud? It's just like this is throwing paint around. You support the

Talmud! It's like, how do you deal with people like this?

They're no different than the crazed, rainbow -wearing nutballs on the left that you can't reason with them either.

Support trans rights! And then they punch you in the face if you even question the reality of it.

It's the same mindset. There's nothing going on. The switches are turned off. The lights have gone out.

And wrote an entire declaration, Antioch, to attack anti -Semites in his own camp.

Well, now we get to talk about what an anti -Semite is. So, if you dare say that Jew hatred might not be something that Christians might want to be involved with, then that means you're supporting the

Talmud? That might have flown at guns .com,

but Doug wrote a book defending a Dennis Prager -style narrative of modern Israel, American Milk and Honey.

Never read it. Sorry. Sorry, Doug. Don't have time for it. Not interested in it.

Don't know where it's going. Doug's been going back and forth with Eric on Twitter, which has been interesting.

The cross -politic team went to Israel. So did I. Oh, no.

I did. I did go to Israel. It was very interesting. And they didn't pay for me to go, either.

The cross -politic team went to Israel and has been trumpeting pro -Israel propaganda from its platform. I wonder what the pro -Israel propaganda is.

Doug and James teamed up with Joe Boot and Tobias to attack Joel Webben and Ogden over anti -Semitic memes and white boy summer videos most of 2024.

Yeah, we were sitting around. We were so bored. We had nothing else to do. We were like, you know, what are we going to do this year?

I don't know. You know, we're not really dealing with Islam or Eastern Orthodoxy or Catholicism or textual criticism.

We're not doing any of that stuff. So let's attack Joel Webben and the Ogden guys. No. Joel Webben and the

Ogden guys started giving evidence. Hey, I'm not the one that reposted white boy summer stuff.

You were. You guys were. You're the one posting videos and entire presentations presenting

Nazis and Hitler and all the rest of this stuff. By the way, who has debated the head of Stone Choir?

Me. Not you. Not you. You didn't do it.

I did. I had to sludge through that sewer. Hmm.

Why would I do that? Um. After Charlie Kirk's death,

B .B. Netanyahu went on a PR media tour, met with social media influences and talked about the need to push pro -racial messaging through American media platforms, his primary targets anti -Semitism, what he called the woke right, millions would be spent in the effort.

Don't doubt it. Don't doubt it. I can't argue.

All I know is it doesn't have anything to do with looking at an ostensible

Christian minister who says silence Jew and defend that. You can't defend it,

Eric. Sounds strangely parallel to the key messaging of Reformed pastors and theologians all timed up perfectly.

It almost feels coordinated. Hey, it's Candace Kahn! There he is!

Candace Kahn! Woohoo! If you can't start connecting some of these dots, then you don't know that TPUSA killed

Charlie Kirk or there was a plane from Israel or whatever. I don't know.

But there's no reasoning with these people. They've jumped off the cliff with the whole thing.

I've spent an hour, and I wish I had the hour back. But the fact of the matter is, and you may be thinking the same thing, the fact of the matter is, this ain't ending at the end of 2025.

It's only going to get worse. And so the real question is what do you do about it?

Well, you better keep your eyes open. Because like gangrene, this stuff, once it gets its foot in the door, grows.

Grows fast. Really, really does. Keep your ear to the ground, especially with the young people in your church.

Because these folks use the meme approach. And sadly, all the data says the same thing.

Americans don't read books anymore. They don't read books anymore. It's all online, it's all electronic, and it's all short.

Attention spans of a flea. And when you think that shallowly, this kind of stuff and these kind of people will appeal to you.

And it's hard to deal with it. It's hard to respond to it. It really is. So, when

Eric Kahn says, I pray for full repentance and full restoration, it has been really hard to watch.

This is the same man who said a few months ago, speaking of Doug Wilson and I, that we had our moment of relevance during COVID, but that moment had passed.

So, COVID was 35 years into my ministry. What has

Eric Kahn done? Where's your 35 years, Eric? Where are your books?

Where's your teaching? Where is it? It doesn't exist. But you are so arrogant and so ungrounded that you'll make comments like that and then follow it up with this?

You want repentance. Toward what? The only repentance you should be calling for, aside from your own, is from Joel Webben for going silence to.

Because as I said when I responded to him at first, those are the words not only of Stonechoir and that vile perspective, but those were probably the words that were uttered by a self -professing

Christian as he pushed the last Jew into that building in the

Rhine River and locked the door before they burned the place down and killed everybody in it. Silence, Jew.

There's no excuse for it. There's no defense for it. The more you try to excuse it, the stupider you look.

Just stop and realize what we told you would happen to you has happened.

And if you keep doubling down, it's just going to become more and more and more obvious. That's all there is to it.

That's all there is to it. So, one last thing. We're out of time.

Totally, completely different subject. But I won't remember this. It won't happen.

But my fellow elder at Apologia Church, Luke Pearson, likes to give me really old stuff because he thinks

I'm really, really old. And I mean really old. Like, ancient and stuff.

Not just a boomer like Webben just called me. And so he gave me an ancient...

Uh -oh. It's Judean. Oh, no. Ancient Judean widow's mite.

So this is a little teeny tiny coin. I mean, it's minuscule.

But this was the widow's mite that's mentioned in the gospel. Put into the treasury in the temple.

It's almost worthless. Like a penny to us today. A widow's mite.

And it's the real thing from the first century. Yeah. This says...

Oh, gosh. Why do I use fonts? Why even bother with fonts that size? Circa 103 to 76

BC. So this would have been the century before the birth of Christ.

So there's a widow's mite that Luke gave me for Christmas.

So I thought I've got some other coins that I've been given over the years from like some of the

Roman emperors in the fourth century and stuff. It's really cool to see that kind of stuff. There's a widow's mite.

That's really small. That's very tiny. Anyways. Yeah. So Michael King did respond.

This is the guy who said, I didn't have James White and Doug Wilson becoming apologists for Talmudic Judaism on my 2025 bingo card, but here we are,

I guess. And I said, I'm sorry, but what color is the sky in your world? And he said, depends on the time of day, the angle of the sun, the sky, and the dust content of the atmosphere at the time.

That said, you're using rhetorical ploys to avoid the deeper issue. What deeper issue?

There is no deeper issue, Michael. You lied. You're deceived.

I hope you get undeceived eventually. Alright. Okay.

I don't know what the schedule for the rest of the week is going to be like. You'll be in Friday. Well, we'll see.

My wife might have to be picking things up. Who knows? Yeah, we'll see.

We'll see how it works. We'll see how that happens. We'll see what happens the rest of the week.

Thanks for listening. Sorry it had to be what it was, but there you go. Didn't dodge it.

And you guys really need to step back, take a breath, and go, what are we doing defending a statement like silence to?

Can't be done. Can't be done. And if I have to be the one to tell you that, I'll be the one to tell you that.

Thanks for watching the program today. We'll see you next year. Thanks for watching. God bless.