One Strange Stone — Jim Cymbala

Romans 9 and the Strange Stumbling Stone

Turn in your Bibles with me to the book of Romans. Romans 9. Let's turn to one of the most difficult chapters in the whole of Scripture. Any preacher, any commentator, expositor will tell you Romans 9, some deep waters.

But all Scripture is given, inspired by God for our edification and learning. So we're going to learn from Romans the ninth chapter. We're going to read at the very end of it. Romans 9 verse 30, okay?

And I'll bring you up to speed on where Paul got, how Paul got to where he is. But let's start reading in verse 30, okay? What then shall we say? That the Gentiles, who did not pursue righteousness, have obtained it.

A righteousness that is by what? Faith. But Israel, Jewish people, who pursued a law of righteousness, has not attained it. Look up at me for a second. Now, let's read that one again. What shall we say then?

That the Gentiles, anyone who's not a Jew, who did not pursue righteousness, have obtained it. A righteousness that is by faith. But Israel, who pursued a law of righteousness, has not attained it. Why not?

Because they pursued it not by faith, but as if it were by works. They stumbled over the stumbling stone, as it is written. And then he quotes from two places, merges two passages together from Isaiah.

I'll tell you about that later. See, I lay in Zion a stone that causes men to stumble, and a rock that makes them fall. The one who trusts in Him, who's Him, the stone, will never be put to shame. Let's read that passage again there.

See, I, who's I? God, lay in Zion. What's Zion? The very place where God's people are. A stone that causes men to stumble, and a rock that makes them fall. That's odd. And, or but, the one who trusts in Him, which identifies the rock, Jesus, the stone is Jesus, will never be put to shame.

Now, the name of this message you can get in a tape form at the end is called, One Strange Stone. And I want to talk about the fact that some good things, excellent things, have a double-edged sword to them, and can end up hurting people.

Good Things With a Double-Edged Effect

This is commonplace in life. For example, yesterday, like every other day in the city, I am sure, although I don't know this for a fact, but it's just a matter of course in our city. Many, many people were rushed by ambulances to hospitals across our land, and in the city, to get there just in time.

Mothers were helped giving birth. People got surgery just in time. People stabbed or shot in some violent activity got help, maybe just in the nick of time. Bleeding was stopped just in the nick of time.

And if you just go back to the pioneer days when our country was being settled, sometimes the nearest doctor was 150, 200 miles away. And there were no automobiles. An ambulance is an automobile, and it can get you there faster than walking or running can.

Now, unfortunately, as great as the automobile is, yesterday, at a terrible corner in Richmond Hill, in Queens, near 103rd Avenue, two cars hit. There was an accident. Nobody was arrested, but an accident occurred, and a car jumped up onto a curb from the collision where a mother was waiting with her two children to cross.

And a four-year-old boy died. As of the news last night, the mother was alive, and the six-month-old child was in stable condition. But the same car, in the form of an ambulance that helped so many people, the same car brought death to a boy.

Yesterday, while the city is undergoing still an alert for don't waste water because our reservoirs are low, we want rain, we want storms. There was some rain this week, which everybody was happy about, the city officials.

But yesterday, in Appalachia, southern West Virginia, into Virginia, flash floods occurred by some very strong storms, and seven people died from too much water. Here, we're asking for water. They got so much, seven people died from water.

You can't live without water, but water can also kill you. If it comes too much at the wrong time. And that's what Paul is talking about here when he talks about one strange stone. Now, in the ninth chapter of Romans, he begins to tell about how he has a burden for his Jewish heritage, his Jewish people.

And from there, he talks about the fact that God's promises have not failed even though the Jews rejected the Messiah, because the true Jew, he says, is not one biologically, but it's the one who has the faith of Father Abraham.

From there, he goes into a passage about the inclusion of the Gentiles into the church. That even though Jesus was Jewish, the twelve apostles were Jewish, and Paul was Jewish, he's now writing to the church in Rome, which was made up of Jews and Gentiles.

So he's saying, God's plan for the church, which is different than Israel, God's plan for the church has both Jew and Gentile in it. And he said, those who believe and who have become children of Abraham are not just Jews who believe, but Gentiles who believe.

This gospel has reached to you. And from there, he goes into the strange paradox that just at once you were disobedient Gentiles to God, but now you've received mercy. And now they have been disobedient for you to be included, and God is working with both people.

Zion, the Church, and the Stumbling Stone

Then he goes to a still stranger paradox about this stone. Listen to it again. Look at my face. Behold, I, God, lay in Zion. Now, let's stop there. Zion was a hill in Jerusalem that was across from Mount Moriah where the temple was.

And Zion, Mount Zion, or Zion the hill, on Zion's hill, that was the site of David's palace. Not the temple, that was built on Mount Moriah, but the site of David's palace and where the court leaders of Israel met.

Now, the spiritual meaning of Zion is, in the Old Testament, it's where God's people are. Zion stood for Jerusalem, the heart of God's people. In the New Testament, it's used of the church. It's used of the work of the gospel, where God is moving and building his church.

That's Zion. We make up Zion today. So, this is strange, brothers and sisters. I, God, lay in Zion, not among the Muslims or the Buddhists or the Hindus. I lay in Zion a stumbling stone and a rock of offense.

But whosoever believes in him, the rock, we know the rock is a person, Jesus, will not be put to shame. That means, literally, when it's quoted from the Old Testament, it means won't make haste or get agitated by fear.

So, let me get this. God says, but why would he do that? I lay in Zion a stumbling stone and a rock of offense. That people, here's a speaker down here, you can't see it, it's a monitor. That people will be walking and go, oops, and trip and fall.

Who put that there? God says, I did. In Zion. But then he turns and then he says there's another side to that. But the stone is a person and whoever puts their trust in him, that person, will never be ashamed.

Will never make haste. Will never get agitated. If you could just hold the children, please, as quiet as possible. Wow, that's a loud one. So, now, let's, why would God do that? Who wants to put a stumbling stone?

I thought God is constructive. I thought God helps people to walk. I thought God is for enabling people. Well, let's look for a second, just look at me. I'll give you the references. If you like, write them down or get the tape and they'll have them on there.

But listen. Here are the verses that he quotes from, both from Isaiah. The first verse that he refers to is Isaiah 28, 16. Now, look at my face and listen to this. This is what the sovereign Lord says.

See, I lay a stone in Zion. But listen how different it is here in this first passage. A tested stone. A precious cornerstone for a sure foundation. The one who trusts will never be dismayed. Now, that sounds more like it.

Now, that is, that's off the hook. Listen, this is what the sovereign Lord says. See, I lay a stone in Zion. A tested stone. A precious cornerstone for a sure foundation. You know, you can't build on sand, you gotta build on a stone, a rock.

The one who trusts will never be dismayed. But, how come it's different in Romans? Well, he merges it together with Isaiah 8, 14 and 15. Now, listen to this. And he will be a sanctuary, speaking of the Messiah, for both houses of Israel.

He will be a stone. Here we go, here we go. Now we're cooking. He will be a stone that causes men to stumble. And a rock that makes them fall. And for the people of Jerusalem, the city of God. He will be a trap and a snare.

Many of them will stumble. They will fall and be broken. They will be snared and captured. You know what? I can't understand this. The Bible is schizophrenic. I don't get it. God says, I lay a stone in Zion.

A sure stone, a foundation stone, a precious stone, a tested stone. The stone is a person and everyone who trusts in him will never be discouraged or dismayed. I got that. But Paul says, no, but the other side is true.

God says, that same stone is a stone of stumbling. It's a rock of offense where people will get offended and say, no, no, I'm not going. Not if you say that, I'm not going. Stone will become a trap and a snare.

And many will fall. And many will be trapped. What is God doing? Is he into saving or is he into trapping? Is he into laying a foundation for me or is he into tripping me up? And the stone, in all these cases, is a person.

The trap is a person. The snare is a person. And that person is Jesus Christ. Well, how could that be, Pastor Cimbala? I thought Jesus came as the savior of the world. Didn't say, you know, until you did this day, a trap is born.

A stumbling stone is born. No, that's not what the angel said. So what's Paul saying here? Well, Paul says it's a tested, precious cornerstone for a sure foundation. Anyone who trusts in him will never be ashamed.

Yet, also, a stumbling stone, a rock of offense, a trap, a snare. Many will stumble. They will fall and be broken. They will be snared and captured. All of it, all in one stone. And that stone is Jesus.

So, as they say, south of the border. Que pasa? What's happening here? Now, here's another one. Listen to this. Psalm 118 verse 22 says this. The stone the builders rejected. Here we go with that stone again.

The stone the builders rejected has become the capstone or the headstone of the corner. You know when you see an old building? They still do it now. But when you see a real old building. I was in an old church in Chicago that Pastor Toledo and Chrissy moved into.

It's an older building. And right on the corner, there's a capstone, a cornerstone that gives you the date it was built. You ever seen that? So, now, Psalm 118 verse 22 says, The stone, not the enemies rejected.

The stone the builders rejected. In other words, some builders are building a building and somebody brings a stone to them, Pastor Bolstad. And the builders, the ones in charge. In this case, the religious establishment says, We're not using that stone.

No, no, no. You know what? We're not building with that stone. That stone does not fit into the building that we want to build. And God says, No, you don't fit into the building I'm building. That stone is the cornerstone.

The stone the builders rejected has become the cornerstone. The thing that made the builders stumble and reject, God says, You might reject it, I'm building on it. Ah, listen. More light is coming. Listen now.

Jesus as the Rejected Cornerstone

Listen. Don't praise the Lord so much you interrupt me, okay? Now, Matthew 21, 42. Listen to what Jesus says. Jesus says, He said to them, Have you never read in scriptures, The stone the builders rejected.

He's quoting now. From Psalm 118. Has become the capstone. The Lord has done this and it is marvelous in our eyes. In other words, they were sizing up Jesus. And they were looking for a Messiah. But when they looked at Jesus, Were you from Nazareth?

You were a carpenter? You're eating with sinners? You're hanging around Mary Magdalene? Can any good thing come out of Nazareth? No way. And the people began to follow him, But the religious establishment said, No way.

And Jesus said, You're fulfilling it. It's written. The stone the builders rejected. You're the builders. You're the religious leaders. The stone that you reject. God is making the cornerstone. Oh God, this is marvelous in our eyes.

The religious experts didn't know the cornerstone, When it was standing right in front of them. What an awesome warning to all of us. Now, the plot thickens. Peter goes on to say this, In 1 Peter 2, 7 and 8.

Now to you who believe, Here we go. Now we got something concrete. Now to you who believe, Christians, This stone is precious. But to those who do not believe, The stone the builders rejected, Has become the capstone.

A stone that causes men to stumble, And a rock that makes them fall. So Peter says, The church has been built on the rock, Christ Jesus. And to you that believe, You know how precious and sure it is. What a wonderful stone.

But the very stone that you rejoice in, The builders have rejected. Not only rejected, They trip over it. They stumble and they fall. It becomes a trap and a snare to them. So, what is this two-edged sword, This double stone, This strange stone?

It's the only foundation, But it's the stumbling block. That's who Jesus is. Jesus to everybody in this auditorium, Is either the precious cornerstone, Or in the end, He will be a snare and a trap to you.

He's God's capstone, Or he's rejected by the builders themselves. Remember what Paul said in 2 Corinthians, About his ministry of preaching the gospel. He says, As we preach the gospel, We're the odor, We're the smell of life to some, And what are we the smell of to others?

Death. What do you have, two different sermons? No, listen. Same sermon about Jesus. Some smelt it and went, Oh, salvation, thank you. Others, I rejected. And in doing it, They got damned. Life, Death.

Same message. Same stone. Remember when Jesus was brought at 8 days old, Into the temple, To be circumcised, And Mary and Joseph brought him in, And who was the name of that? Anyone know the name of that older man, Who was moved by the Holy Spirit?

Simeon came, And he took the child, And as he was prophesying over the baby, He said to the mother, You see this child? He is for the rising, And the falling, Of many in Israel. Through him, So many are going to be raised up, And gain salvation, And enter the kingdom of heaven.

Righteousness by Faith Rather Than Works

But also through him, Oh, so many will doom themselves. Because the rock, Which is the foundation, And the capstone, Is also the stumbling stone. So now let's close today, By applying this. I've given you wonderful verses from the word of God, But let's apply this.

Let's start in the primary sense. That's the best way. Scripture interprets scripture. So let's just look at the application here. Paul says, To lead up to this, He said, Isn't this something? Isn't this strange?

The Jew, The Gentiles, Were not looking for righteousness. They were just, Had multiple gods, Sleeping around, Just living terrible lives. They were not even looking, For any, They didn't have the law, They weren't trying to live a godly life.

And he says, They found a righteousness, That comes from God, Which is by faith. They weren't even looking for it. And it came. And like little children, They said, What? He died for us? We violated his word?

We're sinners? Yeah, We are. We're that hopeless? We're just depraved? And our righteousness, Is like filthy rags, To be more literal, Excuse me, The menstrual rags of a woman, At that time of the month.

That's what the literal Greek means. And the Gentiles said, Yeah, that's right. We are a mess. And he died for us? It means someone had to die? That's how lost we are? Yeah, I received that. I received the gift of that salvation.

They weren't even looking for it. So Paul says, Isn't that something? He said, The Gentiles, Who weren't looking for righteousness, Found righteousness, By faith, And the Jews, Who had the law, And had the Bible, And were saying, Yes, this is what God said, I gotta try to do this, I gotta do this better tomorrow, And you know what?

I'm better than those people, Because they don't even have the law, Those low lives over there. But I gotta get more. And he said, They never found the righteousness. They never found it. They were doomed.

Because they tried to find it by works. They tried to earn something from God. So the message of the gospel, Which was, Believe and you shall be saved. Just come the way you are. God will change you. Just believe on the Lord Jesus Christ.

He died on the cross. He was ripped apart for you. And by His stripes you're healed. He was wounded for your transgression. That message was a message of hope. And the church was built on it. But to those who wanted to earn their salvation, And who were self-righteous, It was a stump, Stumbled.

They said, Wait a minute. Who do you think you're talking to? We think we're some kind of animals? What is this stuff? All have sinned and come short of the glory of God. I'm not a sinner. That whore is a sinner.

That crack addict is a sinner. Hey, you know how I grew up? You know how my parents raised me? I'm a good person. Listen, I heard that on Oprah Winfrey. If you just live a good life, God takes care of everybody.

And I live a good life. Come on, how many have ever heard that? What's this? Jesus died. His blood. Why do you have to talk blood? What's blood? What are you bringing in nasty things? His blood. He had to die for me.

I'm that lost. Yeah, sure. No, listen. I'm living a good life. And I'm going to study more and live a better life tomorrow. But I'm going to pick myself up by my own foot straps. I don't need this miraculous conversion stuff.

You must be born again stuff. You just do the best you can. Am I right? Look, everybody do your best you can. You know Pastor Zimbal, you really insult me. Because you're talking to me like I'm some vagrant.

Look, I work. I pay my taxes. I'm raising my children. I'm working overtime so they can go to private school. Who do you think you're talking to? What do you think you're talking to? Like some sinner?

Still in the stumbling. They're trapped. Snared. The same message that brought life and salvation. That same message. They're trapped. They're trapped by it. The Jews would not receive it. Am I right Pastor Bogstad?

They would not receive it. What do you mean? What are you talking about? My righteousness is like the menstrual rags. You know what? That's very insulting. It's like the time here about 15 years ago in this building.

They brought a guy forward who had been drinking. He'd been drinking a lot. But they brought him forward. They said he won't leave until you pray for him. So I was very, very tired. And it was late at night.

And I said, What's your name? And he said, Archie or something. I said, Alright Archie, I want to talk to you about your life. And he's just like this. You know, his glazed eyes and his breath reeked of alcohol.

And he's like this. And he's just filthy dressed down the street. So I said, Look. And I would quote him from the King James which I stopped doing from that moment on. I said, Jesus loves you. Jesus wants to help you.

He can change your life. Because the Bible says, If any man be in Christ Jesus, he's a new creature. And he went, Wait a minute. Did you just call me a creature? I said, No. He said, No you didn't. What do you think?

I'm a creature? Why? Because I'm a little down on myself right now? What am I? A creature like Dracula, Frankenstein? Does that mean I'm a creature? I said, No. That's a verse. Creature means like creation.

He said, No. You call me a creature. Why? You got your fancy suit on. You're not a creature but I'm a creature? Well, he misunderstood the meaning of a word but this stone of stumbling. Do you all get what I'm talking about?

The gospel Jesus to one is the foundation of a new life. Hallelujah. But to another person it's the thing they stumble over. It's happened in this building all the time. I spoke to a congressman from the United States Congress about 15, 18 years ago and as I was sharing the gospel with him he turned to me and said, I've heard that before.

He said, Look, I'm a lawyer. I can't accept what you say. You mean just believe and you're saved. You don't have to try anything or change or do away with things. You just come the way you are and believe.

I said, That's exactly it. You confess your sins and you believe God does the changing. But you're saved the minute you put your faith. He said, No. No, no, no. He said, Look, you're naive or you're a religious fanatic.

I know how life works. You do good, you get paid. You don't do good, you go to hell. Makes sense, doesn't it? Does that make sense? But it's not true. Because all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God.

Taking Up the Cross and Following Jesus

How many are happy that even though you haven't done good, you're saved by the grace of Jesus Christ today? Let's put our hands together and thank the Lord. So, listen. The foundation stone is the stumbling stone.

But let's go further with this. Because even when you become a Christian, there are basic truths that cut both ways. Not just justification by grace through faith. Jesus said, If any man would come after me, let him deny himself and take up his cross and follow me.

Now, to the person who understands that, you realize, my life belongs to Jesus and I have no plans but to do His will. Even as it's written about Jesus. Hold the children, please. Even as it's written about Jesus, I came to do Your will, O Father.

In other words, the very foundation of being a Christian is to follow Jesus and take up your cross and follow Him. And the cross is something that you deny yourself on. Jesus didn't enjoy going to Calvary.

It wasn't physically nice. But as part of God's plan for His life, He accepted the cross and by doing that, He brought salvation to you and I. He fulfilled God's mission for Him. And Jesus said to all of us here, Do you want to follow me?

Then take up your cross and die to what you like and follow me. Because whoever loses his life will find it and gain it. And whoever holds on to his life and finds it will... Now, to some people who have made great sacrifices for God and learned that there's a joy unspeakable and full of glory when you do that, they have used that as a foundation stone.

That is a stone of rejoicing to them. They can tell you, people in our own church, Pastor Simba, I used to want to have my way and then I realized that what Jesus was calling me to was the right way. But that same stone of foundation, that same capstone to another person who might be sitting here today is, Hey, Pastor Simba, please, get a grip on yourself.

I don't mind a little talk about God, but taking up some cross, denying myself, that's the way you believe. No, I don't believe that. It's in the Bible. No, that's your interpretation. It must mean something else.

Because anything I don't agree with means something else. That's how a lot of people read the Bible. Anything that doesn't hit me right, it must mean something else. So they stumble over it and they say, No, no, no, no, no.

Listen, I got my plans. I went to college. I got my plans, my will. This is what I like to do. This is what I want for my family. Ah, but to be a true follower of Jesus, He said, If anybody comes after me, let him deny himself and take up his cross and follow me and you'll have a peace that passes all understanding.

And you'll have a rest because you'll know this is not my thing I'm doing. This is your thing, Jesus. And if I'm doing your thing, you got to take care of me. How many say Amen? But if I'm doing my thing, I got to take care of myself.

The Necessity of Being Born Again

So I'd rather have you take care of me. So I'll do your thing. Ah, but to another person, it's, Please. Please. Let's go further. Jesus said you must be born again. Doesn't matter what your background is.

Doesn't matter if you're a Baptist, Anglican, Pentecostal. You know what that means? Zip. Oh no, but my family grew up and I got sprinkles as an infant. Zero. Zero. Zero. Only thing that water did was get you wet.

Jesus said, You must be born again. You have to have an inner transformation. Look at me everyone. You got to have an inner transformation of your life. You got to have a personal experience with Jesus Christ.

Forget the Baptist thing or the Pentecostal thing or the Brooklyn Tabernacle thing. The question is, Have you been born again? Do you know what it is to have your life changed? Have you become a new creation?

That's what Jesus said. Now to some, that is the most wonderful capstone, foundation stone. Yes, Jesus can change my life. He can absolutely transform me and make me into what He wants me to be. There's supernatural power in the Gospel.

Oh, thank you Jesus. But to another person, it's, hey look, you know my wife gets carried away with this stuff or my husband or whoever. But you know, look, I didn't grow up that way. Yeah, but I don't care how you grew up.

Jesus Will Not Compromise With Sin

And I don't care how I grew up. Jesus said, you must be born again. To one person, it's a foundation stone. To another person, it's a stone of stumbling. Let me give you one last one that hits a little closer to home, which I'm very concerned about as we move on here with the Lord into new facilities and yet more people coming.

Very hard to keep track of people when you're a pastor, but that's what shepherds are supposed to do as musicians come. Did you know that Jesus will never make a treaty or an alliance with any sin in your life?

Did you know that the minute you have something secret and hidden, Jesus starts to work on you? Now, that's because it's like a cancer. And what good doctor would say, oh, there's a cancer growing, but because nobody can see it, I'll just leave it alone.

I don't want to bother you. I don't want to do surgery and like cut you open and take out those cancerous cells. That would be nasty. No, a good doctor says, that thing could kill you. It's coming out.

And that's the way Jesus is. If you have a secret life, if you have a secret anything, secret attitude, resentment, if you have a secret practice, if you have anything, the very thing that makes people who really love the Lord rejoice, oh, Pastor Cymbala, you know how much he loves me, whom the Lord loves?

He also, he even corrects me. By the way, how many of you here since you've been a Christian, you've drifted and you've done things that are not right and the Lord got after your case real quick? Come on, wave your hand at me.

The Lord ever got on your case? Yeah. Okay. So, but did you know to another person? Listen, Pastor Cymbala, who do you think you're talking to? Nobody's perfect. You know, we had this tragic case involving Pastor Bogstaff just a few weeks ago.

One of our pastors was interviewing a couple to get married and this couple went through, I guess, the appropriate interviews. But the thing got handed over to Pastor Bogstaff for some reason right close to the wedding just a couple weeks ago, a week away.

So Pastor Bogstaff met with the couple because he was going to do the wedding and something troubled Pastor Bogstaff. That's this man right here for those of you that are visiting. So something, something bothered my friend and he began to pray.

Something's wrong. So he said to the couple, Are you two living together? You have separate addresses. You're not living together. No, we're not living together. So then he couldn't get any peace. Am I right?

So he began to pray and the Lord began to trouble him. So he called them in again. Are you two living together? There's something. I'm very troubled. Is everything right? Because if we're going to get married, we've got to do this right before the Lord.

No. Yeah, everything's right. And we're going to have nice flowers in the wedding and, you know, boutonnieres. This is what people think about when they get married. It's so ridiculous. They're worried about the little presents that everyone's going to get at their plate.

Strain at a gnat and they swallow camel. So my friend is really troubled. So he goes to pray Pastor Bogstaff and God, you know, is just really bothering him. Suddenly a call comes in from a relative from another state of one of the parties.

I think the man. And says, You know what? Not for nothing. I'm not a Christian, but you ought to know this. They're both living together. And it's really a shame to us. So Pastor Bogstaff calls me. It's Wednesday.

The wedding is scheduled for Saturday. Invitations, church, Pastor Bogstaff officiating. Pastor Bogstaff said, Pastor Symbol, what do we do? I said, Well, you're not doing the wedding and I'm not doing the wedding.

We'll have nothing to do with this wedding. Do you have this guy's cell phone number? Yeah, I have it. So I said, Stay on one line. Remember Pastor Bogstaff? I had Pastor Bogstaff on one line. I have two phones at home.

Two lines. The other one I had and I had got the cell phone. So Pastor Bogstaff could only hear what I was saying. He couldn't hear the other person. Hello, is this so and so? Yeah. Who is this? On my cell phone.

This is Pastor Symbol. You remember me. Your friendly little preacher. Oh, hi Pastor Symbol. Praise God. How are you? Hey, I want to ask you something. Didn't Pastor Bogstaff ask you twice? Haven't we been going through a procedure?

You living together? Because we just got a call from your sister, whoever. You're living together. You're living together, right? You lied to my friend, didn't you? You lied to us. We're trying to do right before God and you lie like a rug.

No, no, Pastor Symbol, you don't understand. No, I understand very well. Is your sister lying to us? No, yes, it is true. I said, you know what? You're a very crooked person. You're a crook. I wouldn't marry you for a million dollars.

And he's not going to marry you. No, no, no, you don't understand. I said, no, I understand exactly. You're crooked. You're a liar. What do you think? We're going to lay our hands on you and God's going to do some magic while you're lying and sleeping and fornicating with this woman?

What kind of pastor am I? Pastor Bookstaff will tell you I said it. What kind of preacher am I? What kind of poor excuse of a minister am I? How many months have you been visiting our church and you didn't get that through your head?

Well, I just got a letter from them, I told him last week. And this man is very upset with me because they went ahead and got married, right? He's very upset with me. I am very disappointed by you, me and my wife, that you lifted your voice to me.

Now, I didn't call him a snake, like Jesus called people. I didn't call him a brood of vipers, did I? I didn't call him a whited sepulcher who has nothing but dead men's bones inside of him. I didn't call him a hypocrite, all of those things Jesus called people.

I didn't use any of that. I just said, you're a crook. He said in the letter, and you know what, you lifted your voice at me. I thought you were a man of God. Man of God, I wish I could have climbed through that phone, man of God.

So listen, did you know what? Jesus is not making a treaty, and if we're going to be honest, we'll never make a treaty. I love all of you as God is my witness. Pastors, do I love them? Pastor Byrd, do I love the people?