Panel Discussion At Revival Forum 89 — Leonard Ravenhill

Why don't we begin by introducing each of these individuals, for those of you that came in late to the conference, and for anybody that will be watching by video, here in this end and just joining us this morning, actually, is Ralph Satera.

God used he and his brother as tools in the revivals that began in the early 70s in western Canada, and then ultimately ended up in lay couples going out across Canada, making a major impact back in that decade.

In addition, he was strategic in founding the Canadian Revival Fellowship. So Ralph Satera is based out of Mansfield, Ohio. Manly Beasley is a leading Southern Baptist revivalist, has conducted, I believe you told us for what, 30 years, Manly?

Thirty-five years, revivals throughout the world, actually. Leonard Ravenhill, a well-known author, a number of books on the topic of revival, strategically used of God in promoting growing up with children, giving them a vision for revival, and calling the church of this generation and this era to revival.

Bill McLeod was a pastor of the Church of Saskatchewan, Canada, where the revivals in the 70s began, then God called him out of that church and began to travel again throughout the world, proclaiming the message of revival.

Then on the end, Dale Faisenfeld, the founder and director of Life Action Ministries, and leading revival ministry for some 18 years. God has brought together, I believe in my heart, by his doing and not ours, even being here this week.

To have these men here this week at the same time, I'm confident they have never been together at the same time anywhere that I'm aware of, and from our perspective, these men have had a great impact on our lives, that have motivated us and stirred us before the Lord by his Spirit, just using them as tools in the whole cause of revival.

Perhaps much of the insight that I know Life Action Ministries has gained over the years has come from the heart of God through the heart of these men. Let me begin the question that would have to be on your heart, and you probably all have a burning in your heart to address anyways, but what key truths or emphasis do you believe the church in North America needs to hear and respond to today?

The Church Must Respond to Revival Truth

What key truths does the church in North America need desperately to hear and respond to today? You're going to narrow it down to several. What would they be? Can I start off? Sure can. You said respond to.

I like that word. I think in the ministry of revival and in the pastoral ministry, the tendency is to let people off easy and merely be maybe satisfied to just share truths and lose the sense of urgency of response.

And I feel that as we minister these truths, it's not enough for people to know that they have heard something good from the Bible, but there needs to be a sense of urgency in our spirit that there has to be a response to every truth that God is trying to share with His people.

So I like that. Respond to. That needs to say something to us the way we minister. If I were to boil down some key truths, I would start out with the character of God. I believe that His attributes, His holiness need to be utmost and foremost in the hearts of our people.

You see, I'm convinced that revival starts in the character of God, not in merely man having his own needs met or trying to find a utilitarian God who can just supply everything we have to have in life.

Rather, revival must flow from the character of God. And when we start there, then something very deep can take place. And that bears with it the fear of God or fear of judgment because of sin. I don't believe we as Americans have much fear of God in this day.

So the fear of God and the Lordship of Christ, the reality of the truth of the Lordship of Christ must be supreme. Then from that perspective of God and Christ being supreme, then we begin to see ourselves as a spirit of pride being the biggest sin that we're committing.

The spirit of pride, which basically is a God complex or a God philosophy where we think we are as big as God. And if ever there's a problem in our nation, it's that spirit of pride. Revival begins in the character of God.

When we see that, we begin to see our sins and we begin to recognize how devastating the self-life is. And we relate to those truths. And then I would probably say to tie it together, let's not forget the tremendous ministry of the Holy Spirit.

That it is not just to deal with the negatives of getting rid of those things, but then the positive, the power of God to anoint our lives and to fill us with God himself. And that's why I personally believe that the truth of being filled with the Spirit and walking with the Spirit must not be elevated above and beyond merely another scriptural or spiritual principle.

It is beyond that. It is the very source of the power through which everything else in our lives must take place. And in the day where we have shied away from the ministry of the Holy Spirit because of the extremes, God keep us from going the other direction and losing sight of where the real source of power is.

I think since that question is at the foundation probably, it would be good if maybe each of you could respond to it. What is the greatest need for God's people, the church, to hear and to respond to?

Maybe you want to underline something he said, highlight it, expand on it, emphasize it. Maybe something else came to your mind. What would the rest of you as Revivalists perceive to be the greatest need in the church today?

Becoming Before Doing: Holiness as a Living Demonstration

Well, I couldn't add anything to what he has said. And so, the best thing I think I can say is that we need to teach the people to learn how to be before they start doing. And of course, what he said is preparing us to be.

And because you wouldn't want to take away from what he has, our brothers, teaching them how to be before they do. Because this is a society that really is motivated on do, do, do, do before you be. And you're not going to teach anyone anything if you're not that yourself too much.

And so with what he has said, I think we need a great deal of emphasis on being saints, living it, live out what we preach. And let our lives be a demonstration of that truth. Power to life's message.

Yes. Dr. Ravenhill, care to expand maybe, or greatest need in the church today?

Okay. I think the greatest need in the church today is to get rid of carnality. Rocking said, you don't have too much difficulty to get a man to go to the cross, your problem is to get him on the cross.

I've met many people who can't be the kind of a God. As to where, at the moment, they can't tell you the day or the time that they were born again of the Spirit of God. I've never met a person yet who didn't know when they had a crisis experience after that, and admitted he had it.

Judson, what founded a college on the west, east coast, he very definitely stands for that. There's a book that most of you may know, called the Deeper Experiences of Famous Christians. Every man God has used in history has had a crisis experience after salvation.

I don't care what his terminology is. A hundred years ago, Andrew Bonner, there were three Bonner brothers in Scotland, they were all marvellous preachers, all marvellous poets. And Andrew Bonner said, over a hundred years ago, I looked for the world and found it in the church.

I looked for the church and found it in the world. The church, average church has never been more worldly than now. The average preacher knows more about Channel 5 than he knows about Matthew 5. They're best informed.

If your local sports director can't work on his job, just call on the local pastor and give you a batting average of everybody. Tell you what they're doing on the ice, skating in Canada. You know, the biggest, these guys can't pull down strongholds and can't even turn TV off.

I believe we are so immature right now that God Almighty can't pull us through revival. I'm in historic revival. I don't mean this thing that begins 7 o 'clock Sunday night and finishes next Sunday night.

Who dares serve notice on the Holy Ghost? Dr. Tolson told me not long before he died, he said, Brother Len, I've accomplished something wonderful. I said, what is it? He said, I've preached myself off every convention platform in America.

Well, I'm just about too short of that. I've already got off every platform in Canada. About last year, I think I had invitations to about 12 conferences of prophets. The year before, I was invited to join 120 select men from all over the world.

They were going to meet for a prayer meeting on Mount Carmel. Well, I had a prayer meeting Friday nights. People drive four, five, six hours to come. We finish 10 o 'clock at night. They get home at three or four or five in the morning, even if it's snowing.

I said to my class, I thought, hey, I shouldn't be here. I should be on Mount Carmel. What do you mean Mount Carmel? I said 120 prophets. 119 besides me are meeting on Mount Carmel. I said, as a matter of fact, they're staying in the same hotel that Elijah stayed in.

Our ideas of revival are so distorted. Let me say this. Leckie is a secular historian, not a religious historian. He says when the bloody revolution swept over France and France was washed in blood, when they kicked the monarchy into the garbage can, when they put up the tricolour of red, white and blue and put on it, what was it put?

Liberty. Thank you, my secretaries there. Liberty, fraternity and equality. And then he says that river of blood was going to engulf England and two men stood up. No, three. Martin Lloyd-Jones said to me one day, why did he give so much credit to Wesley?

He wasn't the key of revival. He was. The key of revival was Charles Finney. No, no Charles. Who was he again? Whitfield. Whitfield, thank you. I thought he couldn't be American. I told Wilkerson face to face in my office, I said, neither you.

And at that time, Swaggart was going strong. Neither you, Swaggart, Billy Graham, anybody. You have no biblical authority for going to a city for one night and having a revival. You have big advertising, big crowds, big offerings.

You leave nothing behind. I don't care how long you stay. The result is not how many you pack them in. What's the result six months after? I went to a wedding a while ago, a celebrity wedding and people said, oh, what a wedding.

Oh, they're so happily married. Dear Lord, if you can't be married that happy that day, when would you be happy? I said, check on them six months after. Don't tell me what kind of a revival you had. Is he a revival?

Oh, we had a good revival. Six couples in our ministry got put back together. I mean, in our church. Let me say this and shut up, which will be difficult. I was thinking about the difference again between revival, true revival, thank you, and I thought you were going to take it away.

The difference between true revival and evangelism. It's good if there's a stir up in a church and marriages are put right. But that didn't go to the tavern across the road. It didn't stop the kids around the corner with brunch.

It didn't stop the folk up there in their love. There's a church. I've prayed for it. I've met the pastor once. His name is Jim Wright. And it's in St. Albans. And I think the church is the church of God.

Well, the right opposite them was a tavern. It was a noisy, wicked place, a threat to the whole community. So they needed extra room in the church. So they said, why don't we pray that place would be closed down.

That place is the most popular place in town. Well, as Del has said to us a few times these days, God delights in the impossible. Not the possible, Miller, the impossible. I'm looking for a revival that no man can stick his name on it.

Not even... Okay. He got the message. But what they prayed and prayed. And you know the tavern closed down. And the church did it over for school. So then they tackled a shop at the end of the road selling pornography.

Oh boy, that's the most popular place in town. Well, Lord, shut it up. He shut it up. Now that to me is revival. Dear Toto was right when he said true revival changes the moral climate of the community.

It doesn't just change the people inside church who get more loving and kind. You get a burden for the lost. You start raiding hell. Preaching that doesn't terrify the devil isn't worth a nail of beans.

And I'll tell you what. We're running out of preachers. Everybody's teaching. A guy came in my office, 22 years of age. Mr. Raiden, I have one of the best collections of tapes. I have over 2 ,000 tapes, $5 each.

He won't live long enough to hear them at an hour a time. We need preaching, some thundering preaching. Some men that have been with God. Like old Ebenezer Brown. Years ago in America, he said, I live six days a week in eternity, and I come down the seventh day to tell people what I've seen and heard.

Dear God, many preachers snatch something Saturday night, or they're preaching sermons they preached 50 years ago. I preach one or two sermons I've preached over 40 years, but they're reborn every time I preach them.

If they don't move me, they won't move you. The most perilous job in the world today is to be a preacher. The Church of Jesus is about to wake up, stand up, speak up, and shut up. So I'll shut up.

The Power of God to Use Ordinary Believers

Brother McLeod, what's on your heart in relation to the greatest need in the church? I'd agree 100 with what Brother Ralph said at the beginning, and he made a statement, too, about the positive as well as the negative.

And I was thinking particularly of the positive. Paul prayed in Ephesians chapter 1 that the Christians at Ephesus would know the exceeding greatness of God's power to us who believe. And I think there's a tremendous need in the churches for people to know what the power of God is, what the power of God can do.

Most of them are totally ignorant of this, and I think we need to direct our preaching to some extent to this area. A little one shall become a thousand, and a small one a strong nation. I, the Lord, will hasten it in his time.

That's the last verse of the chapter in Isaiah. The first verse of the next chapter says, The Spirit of the Lord God is upon me. And I think we need to challenge our people, particularly our young people, but all our people to understand, regardless of their age, really, God can use them.

Most Christians don't think God can use them. And they have this little humble thing, you know, God can't use me. Poor little me, God can't use me. They're absolutely right, he can't. He can, but he can't when they have that attitude.

I remember when Dr. Brock was with us in Saskatoon back in 71. He was, what, 84 then, I guess? 83. 83 and just on fire for God, you know. And right across the street from our church, there lived an elderly gentleman.

He was about 90, I think, not a Christian. And I asked Dr. Brock if he'd like to go over. And sure, sure, let's go, you know. So we went. And I wish I had a tape, you know, a movie of the thing. He stood there, and he presented the gospel to him.

Then he walked over to this man who was seated in a chair and said, Now, will you rise to your feet and take me by the right hand? And by that say, I am receiving Jesus Christ as my Savior and Lord now.

And the man said, I will. And he got to his feet and took Dr. Brock's hand. We're never too old to be used of God and never too young. By the way, in the early days, and Ralph will remember this, of the movement in Saskatoon, a kid about 10, remember, he came running up on the platform.

We were in St. Timothy's Anglican Church. The place was back to the door, and this kid came running up on the platform. I'm not sure, was it you, Ralph, or Lou, that moved away? And this kid took over the microphone and began to preach with tears, calling on Christians to get right with God and sinners to get saved, the whole thing.

And it certainly wasn't out of place. It was something that the Spirit of God did. And so we need to pray as Paul prayed that our people will come to know something and catch a glimpse of what God can do through individuals and through churches because I think it's very important.

Everywhere you meet people that are totally defeated, struggling with sin, God can't help me, struggling with a thousand things, and they don't think God can do anything for them. And we've got to shell them out of that somehow, blow them out of the water, and help them to see that God can do anything.

He fills the heavens and the earth. So that's a burden on my heart. Almost 20 years now, Del, of revival ministry. During that period of time, what have you seen in the church that indicates a desperate need for revival?

A New Vision of God, Sin, and Holiness

I'm the youngest here on this panel, and you're welcome, Dr. Ravenhill. And I guess all I can do is stand on the shoulders of the men who sit to my right. I would concur, and I think Ralph probably spelled it out in last night, Dr. Ravenhill, as you preached from Isaiah, there's a desperate need for a new concept of God.

We have humanized God, deified man, and minimized sin. And I think there's a desperate need for us to see the God that Isaiah saw in Isaiah 6. As Dr. Ravenhill preached on the glory of God and the holiness of God last night, I was overwhelmed.

And we sense the presence and the moving of God's spirit here in this place because we took, I believe, a glimpse last night of the living God and all of his awesome holiness and fury against sin. When Isaiah records there in Isaiah 6 in the year that King Uzziah died, I saw also the Lord.

It doesn't say he saw a convention or a program or a denomination or a new method. He said, I saw God, the living God. And when I caught a glimpse of the living God, the next thing that happened was that he caught a glimpse of himself.

And I don't believe that we're going to be able to convince most of the people in our churches of their exceeding sinfulness until they see a living God for who he is. When they see God as he is, then they can see themselves for what they are.

I cried over here at a chair last night and sobbed and wept and cried out, I believe I am probably more undone and in worse shape than most of the people in this auditorium. Those were not just words.

For the last few weeks, God has been showing me himself. And in the process, he's been showing me the total helplessness, the total powerlessness, the desperate condition of my life. And I believe that that comes when we see God for who he is.

We get a new concept of God. We get a new concept of self. We get a new concept of sin. He said, I am undone. I dwell amongst a people of unclean lips. And then we get a new cleansing. And God took that fiery coal off the altar and purged and cleansed.

And I believe the desperate need of this hour is for the purging fire of the living God to come through the church and through the hearts of men and women and purge us and break us and cleanse us and bring us to a new level of brokenness and humility and transparent honesty like we've never known before.

And in that cleansing and in that brokenness, get this, Isaiah got so close to the heart of God that he actually overheard God talking. You know what happened? God said, who will go for us? Have you ever gotten that close?

So broken, so surrendered, so cleansed, so humble, so dead to self that you literally overheard God talking? And God said, who will go for us? And Isaiah said, send me, Lord. We've got the whole thing in reverse in the church.

Our philosophy is win them, wet them, and work them. Get them won, baptized, and plugged into the machinery. God's order is not commission first. God's order is conversion and seeing God for who he is, then cleansing and brokenness, and then comes commission.

And I believe that those are the truths that God's got on my heart, Byron, in the church today, the need for the church. Characteristics of revival. Dr. Ravenhill talked about a change in moral climate.

He talked about brokenness, honesty, transparency. What other indications and characteristics would there be, evidence, if God were to send revival, whether it be in a local body, or whether it be in a broader scale, in a corporate sense, or even in a national sense of revival, what do you perceive as being some key indications and characteristics of God sending revival?

What changes will take place?

Revival’s Visible Effects on Communities

Well, in the Denver, the newspaper, the Denver Post for 1905, I forgot the date, it says that the spirit of God came on this city, and business closed down in the middle of each day. Business houses closed, everybody went to prayer.

I doubt if there's a person here that's seen revival. You've seen good meetings. But I mean, when God comes down, and as in the days, for instance, of Jonathan Edwards, you could look across the street, men's faces were drawn.

Spurgeon himself said, I had seven weeks of awful misery, under conviction at 15 years of age. Our kids don't have seven minutes. Come to the altar. They'd been to the altar 50 times. Every rally. A woman, I was preaching on the new birth, a woman came down the aisle, and boy, she was something big, her hair doing all that.

I said with my breath, Lord, if God gets hold of you tonight, you'll be a mess. And sure enough, when I said, come forward if you want to be born, men go in that room, women in this. I stayed an hour with the men.

The pastor knocked on the door. This woman came in. He said, will you pray with this woman for an hour? I said, well, if you stay. So he stayed. And as soon as she hit the ground, she burst into tears.

She said, Mr. Edwards, this is the 14th time I've come out of what you talked about tonight. Every time I come, somebody puts their arm around my shoulder and says, Jesus paid it all, dearie. He understands your tears.

Just say you're sorry. And she says, this is the 14th time. And if it doesn't work tonight, I'm through. We stayed an hour with her. Two years after I was passing that church, as I thought, left, and I said to the man that was driving me, I'd been in another church, there was a woman came out that last night.

She's a tremendous character. I said, she was mad at preachers and everything. And she said, if it doesn't take tonight, I'm through. What happened? Is that her coming out? And she was coming out with a Bible.

She's the finest character, the finest soul in who we have. Why? Because a miracle took place in her life. And she had to tell it. You don't have to train her. I was standing one day with Duncan Campbell and a nurse came.

And she said, there's been a big crusade in this city of London. Five of us went forward. My four nurse friends and I went forward. It didn't take five minutes. They said, take this liturgy home. She said, Mr. Campbell, nothing ever happened.

What do you do for follow-up? And it is Scotch Broadway said, Ah, woman, when the Holy Ghost speaks to people, you don't need to train them afterwards. God teaches them. But in our churches they do. People say folk in America are choked with the Gospel.

Most people in America have never heard the Gospel. There has to come a revival where people get miserable about sin. It takes away appetite. It takes away their interest in sport. Your husband thinks you're going mad.

Your wife thinks you're crazy. We haven't had Holy Ghost. We go to meetings and clap. Dear God, I've been to revival meetings. Three months after in that church, they're still trying to drag people out.

We're going to sing just as I am once more. Then, oh, nobody came. Just as I am once more. Just as I am once more. Come on. When a man's coming to the altar, you don't have to ask him. He's running. He's dying.

He's lost. He cries out with top lady, foul eye to that fountain fly. We're not preaching Christ. We're preaching forgiveness. We're preaching pardon. I was going to say this tonight. Let me say it here and quick.

Charles Wesley said, well, John Wesley says in his diary over and over again, I went to Leeds. I went to Sheffield. I went to Manchester. And what? And offered men Christ. We don't offer them Christ. We offer them pardon.

We offer them peace. Charles Wesley says, my heart is full of Christ and longs this glorious message to declare. Our hearts are not full of Christ. They're full of theology. We didn't step over the line.

Preach the Holy Spirit, but don't preach about gifts that were for yesterday. Listen, if you're going to go to the coming of the Spirit, you're not going to lecture him. You're going to take him as he says.

And people are going to be in miserable conviction as though they knew they had a thousand cancers. So you pray tonight for me because I'm going to be real hot, I hope.

Conditions That Prepare the Way for Revival

Now if we can cool off just a little bit. Let me say that the characteristics and what you can anticipate or the groundwork for God to work, it's very significant that in Saskatchewan, Bill will tell you that there was definitely a distress among the people, even economically.

There were hard times. God had been bringing the people to nothingness where their total dependence on human resources was stripped from them. And there was such a sense that something supernatural had to take place that they were candidates for that heaven.

Am I right, Bill? Absolutely. We had a recession like in the province of Saskatchewan at the time. They had about 950 ,000 people in the whole province. 40 ,000 left in one year looking for jobs. I had 100 people leave my church just looking for jobs, moving to other places.

And so the economic situation was very unstable. And the result was that God began looking up. And I really think that's what's happening in Western Canada again. We've had three years of drought. Thousands of farmers have gone bankrupt.

We've had the worst forest fires in history, both in our province of Saskatchewan. We had 205 forest fires burning when I left to come here. They said the whole north was just one big blaze. They airlifted 25 ,000 people, mostly Indians, out of isolated reserves.

Many places they couldn't even drive on roads where there were roads because of the smoke. And they were in there with helicopters and all this kind of thing. You know what's happening? God is answering the prayers of the ungodly.

They're asking God to damn the bush and damn the lakes and damn this and damn that. And God is doing it. And we're in rough times now. And I think God is... I don't know. Something's going to happen. I can just sense it.

Because everything's upside down there now, and these are things you can't control. So in the midst of that, the question was, what are the current conditions of the church? Well, we heard this morning, wealth.

Wealthiness is not Scripture teaching that as they increased, so they sinned. So easy. Wealth. I put down self-sufficiency, apathy, Revelation 3. Thou knowest not the condition. Adulterous situation.

Where know ye not that friendship with this world is enmity with God. Ye adulterers and adulteresses. The connotation is that we're married to another one rather than to the God of the universe. Powerlessness, compromising-ness, and prayerlessness in the true sense.

Prayer, Evangelism, and Spiritual Maturity

Now I want to relate to Brother Leonard Ravenhill for a moment along this line, because here's something that he probably has not heard from me, and that is that a number of years ago, Lou and I were having vacation in California, and we were asked by a pastor who heard we were out there to come and have some meetings.

And we said, well, we only have five days to be able to be with you from Tuesday through Sunday. And this was just the week before, so no time to advertise, no time to do anything, but for us to come in on Tuesday night and start to preach.

We preached for those five days from Tuesday through Sunday and had the privilege of seeing 50 people respond to God for personal salvation to meet the Lord. Well, that was wonderful. We were thrilled.

No advertising, nothing. Just went and started preaching. God be in work. Well, you say, that's one church and it's wonderful. We were called back to that same church a year later, and we said to the pastor, how are things going here?

Where are the people who responded last year? He said, you'll be interested in this. 48 of the 50 people who responded when you were here a year ago are in this church and are walking on beautifully with God.

I said, what made the difference? No evangelist, nobody in the ministry talks about percentages like that. What made the difference? And he said, oh, well, what we did not tell you was that a year or so before you came last year, Leonard Ravenhill was here in this church, and he taught our people to pray.

And he said some of the people in our church pray from 10 o 'clock in the morning until sometimes 1 o 'clock in the afternoon, two and three days a week calling on God for the salvation of these people so that when you came, all of those people that have been prayed for are now coming to the meetings and finding the Lord.

And then he said, because they had that kind of a spiritual burden of prayer and travail for those people, when you left, every one of those homes had one of our people in their homes praying with them weekly for at least six months, building them up in the Lord as newborn babies.

Why, after they had prayed for so long and interceded so long and saw the birth take place, you better believe that they were not going to let them go lightly. And I said, amen, there it is again. That prayer ministry, a sense that God has to do it, not human methods, but God on the scene, and then even the concern that now we want to help bear these newborn babes into spiritual maturity is a natural outgrowth.

It's not something forced. It's a natural outflow of parents giving birth to children and seeing to it they're going to be fed. Amen. The question that we were dealing with deals with what characteristics or indications would there be of God working in the next great move of God perhaps in the decade to come or whenever it is that God chooses to move across our nation.

What would be the characteristics of that move of God? Our staff met with Richard Owen Roberts. Those of you who are familiar with him, he has an 11 ,000-volume library, as I understand it, on the subject of revival.

He has read it all, as I understand, and we asked him that same question. And without blinking an eye, he said, the chief characteristic of revival, if it came to America, is that most of our church members would get saved.

And I have believed because I was a lost church member. I grew up in a home with a godly mom, an evangelist for a father, and I believe with all of my heart that the majority of people who are professing to be Christians in the church today are not born-again believers at all.

And one of the reasons it's difficult to have revival in the church today is because you are dealing with so many lost people. Revival is the equivalent of bringing back to life that which once lived.

And those people have never lived. They've never experienced the reality of God's life. I remember a statistic I read about the revival in Wales, if I'm not mistaken, that the critics of the revival in Wales, five years after the revival in Wales, some 100 ,000 people had professed faith in Christ, as I remember.

And five years later, the critics were still at it, trying to discredit the reality of the move of God. And one of their bits of ammunition was that five years later, they could only find 70 ,000 of the 100 ,000 still standing, still living for God.

So we're forced today, with the kind of cheap evangelism that we have going on in America, if we can find one out of 100 two weeks after the crusade is over. And I believe that one of the greatest needs of the hour is for genuine conversion to occur within the hearts of many of the people who are professors but not possessors of eternal life.

One of the characteristics also of revival, and by the way, I believe that more people will get saved, genuinely born again, accidentally, in the wake of a revival, a genuine move of God's Spirit, than all of our church services without the power of the Holy Spirit in them in this century combined.

Somebody said that in the unrevived state of the church, we are spending millions of dollars and multiple millions of manpower hours trying to convince a lost world that they need Jesus. But in the revived state of the church, empowered with the life of Jesus and the power of the Holy Spirit of God, lost sinners would be crawling over the saints desperate to find the Christ that we proclaim.

And so, in Wales, getting off of that subject, one of the characteristics, as Dr. Ravenhill pointed out, was that the moral climate was changed. Let's get practical. Where the rubber hits the road. How did it affect Wales?

I'm told that they presented white gloves to the magistrates, to the judges, because they had no cases to try. The policemen sat around with nothing to do because the jails were emptied. Crime just totally catapulted.