I Don't Agree With Your God

Apologia Utah

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00:05

excuse me I heard you talking before that you were LDS and then and then you were kind of looked at the

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Christian God or the Bible and you said that you deconstructed your faith can I might

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I ask how did that happen or why? Everything was given to me and I just started looking at everything.

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Initially I just left the LDS church and then

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I just kind of like deconstructed like the whole idea as well.

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I'm open to the idea that there could be a change the way

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I live, what I do and how I live my life.

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There isn't a change based off of whether I believe in a God or not. I'm still trying to be a good person.

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I'm not a good person because I believe in God. I'm just a good person because I think that's the right thing to do. So can

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I ask you just based on your worldview, what is a good person? It's a bit similar to like Christian beliefs, you know.

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And I think that there's a lot of similarities. Have you ever taken a good person test?

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No. Like a psychology test? It's a good person test and it's just based on the

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Ten Commandments, right? So we go through the Ten Commandments. I'll ask you some questions. You tell me your answer.

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And then I'll ask you if you still think you're a good person. And it's just like an exercise. Yeah, I think based off the

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Ten Commandments.

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What about like so basic things like we all know like I don't think you should lie.

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Would you agree that lying is wrong? I think it's a situation. So honesty is a good thing.

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Therefore lying would be wrong. Oh yeah.

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If somebody knocked on my door with a gun and was like, where's your wife? I'm gonna lie to them.

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But that's different. That's actually different than what the Bible teaches. The Bible says you shall not bear false witness against your neighbor.

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So that's like lying, trying to deceive one to get over on them. Okay, yeah. So in that case

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I agree with that. Okay. You know what's funny is we all agree with that. But at the same time, we all would say that we've lied multiple times.

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Would you agree with that? It's funny though. I think kind of differently.

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Like when you grow up, it's like don't lie. Don't tell yourself. Like if your mom asks you if you took an extra cookie, don't say no.

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You know, it's like that whole thing. Whereas I view lying as like just like kind of more stuff like that.

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Do you think though that you've lied based on what you would call someone else a liar for doing? Oh yeah,

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I've been hypocritical for sure in my life. Like that's something I'm working on. Yeah, I've for sure done that multiple times.

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So what about stealing? Have you ever stolen anything regardless of the value? Went years later and went and gave the store a few quarters for it.

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Yeah, I think besides that, stealing was like pounded into my head like that's wrong.

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Sure, sure. I don't steal. Okay, what about, so you would agree that you have stolen.

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Yeah, yeah. You've agreed that you've lied based on, so you've broken those.

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So the reason I ask is because you mentioned that you think that you're a good person. But I believe that a lot of us, what

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I do also is I make up standards based on what I would think of myself as.

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So I make up standards to make myself look better because I don't want to think of myself as being a lawbreaker.

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So the problem with that is everybody has an arbitrary standard of what's good.

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You might find a murderer, right? He's totally justified. Yeah, because like, no.

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I think there's times when you can justifiably murder someone. And what I always like to point people back to is apart from an outstander outside of ourselves, we all have arbitrary standards for what is good, what is loving, what is right, what is wrong.

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Yeah, for sure. And for me, and for, I believe that in absolutes.

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Do you believe in absolutes? Like that some things are absolutely right and absolutely wrong.

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Like you should never ever rape someone. That's an absolute.

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So I believe there are absolute standards. And the only way that any of us can have an absolute standard is if we have an absolute truth.

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And I believe that the scriptures, the Bible, is the only thing that can give us an absolute truth, an absolute standard for judging morality.

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If not, we all have standards of our own, right? So I think, I think I agree with you that like everyone has their own standards.

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I just, I think it's okay.

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But you do, you believe in biblical principles, right? Like thou shalt not steal, thou shalt not murder. Well, yeah, but that doesn't mean that idolation doesn't mean that it's like...

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Where do you think it came from? There's people who like say there is a

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God and say that he did write the Bible. I disagree with so much of what God did in the Bible. I think that these things are good and they were the first ones to set, right?

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I just take the good things and leave the bad stuff. So here, but here's what, here's what I'm trying to get you to realize.

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You just said I would take the good things and leave the bad. But at the same time, you've come up with what is good and you've come up with what is bad.

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So therefore you've determined what right and wrong is based on your standards.

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Do you kind of see how that's like arbitrary in a bit? I just disagree with some of the stuff to say.

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And so I think that like... How do you give accounting for that though, I guess would be my question. Like, how do you say that stuff is not good?

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This stuff is good. That stuff is not good. Like, what is the standard that you go back to and say,

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I'm looking here and this is how I judge that this is right and this is wrong. Oh, like how do

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I kind of create my own standard type of thing? Yeah, so you're saying, you're saying I don't agree with this in the

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Bible. That's bad. And you're saying this is good, right? Well, it's lots of stuff. So like, I mean, this was added to the

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Bible later, but like homophobia type stuff. There's like one verse that people are like, oh yeah, it's from this. And it's like, it's something that like, yeah, just like little things like that.

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But I'll look at the other stuff and be like, yeah, like stuff Jesus taught that I already talked about. And be like, that's good.

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So I can agree with that. But overall, I'm just like the way I view my standards is just kind of separate from if there even is a

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God. I'm just like, hey, I'm going to do the best I think there is, you know, like weighing the options, each situation being like, is this hurting more people or helping more people, including myself?

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Is this a balanced thing? Is this coming from love or coming from fear? Stuff like that. And how would you know if it's coming from love or fear?

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Like, what is love? Love is like considering other human beings, not just yourself, you know?

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So, so I, and I agree. But what I would always say is you have to go back to a standard, right?

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And, and I would challenge you on the fact that you're saying, I would agree with this and I would disagree with this.

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But if our, if standards are absolute, if there is absolute truth out there, then it can't barely be what you feel.

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And I noticed, do you notice that the things that you do and don't agree with also correlate to the way that you live your life and the things that you do?

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Yeah, but I also change. But I can see how, like, because yeah, that would be an issue if I was just like, let me change my views to make myself feel better about what

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I'm, you know, make it more convenient, make it more, you know, kind of like lazy, and lazy for me to just feel better.

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Well, what I always tell people is, Romans 1 says this. It says that we all know

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God, the one true God, but we suppress the truth in our unrighteousness. That we claim to be wise, but we trade the truth of God in for a lie, and we worship and serve the creature rather than the creator.

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And what it's saying is, is that every single person knows

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God. We know there is one true God. We know what He asks of us, who He is, but we suppress

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His truth and we say, no, my truth for me is

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I am going to determine what good and bad is. I'm going to determine what moral and immoral is.

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And in fact, in Genesis, that's what Adam and Eve did, is they determined when the serpent said, you will be like God, what

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He's saying is, you will determine good from evil. You will know good and evil. And what happens is, is we trade the truth of God in for a lie for things that fit what we think is good and bad.

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The problem with that is every single person here has a different thought of what good and bad is.

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I think everyone's generally the same, though. Like, they might have, you know, minor, would agree that rape is never okay, and murder is never okay, and things like that.

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And I would agree. Yeah, yeah. But I think that, I don't know, I think that when it comes to... I validate and recognize...

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One last thing I'll leave you with. I would just challenge you to think the things that you've accepted and the things that you've denied and you've said that are good and the things that you said are bad, think about how you give an account for that.

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Like, where do you go to for determining that? Is it you, or is it the absolute standard of truth, like we've said there is?

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Because to me it sounds like you're saying, I feel that this is good, I feel this is bad,

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I agree, I don't agree with this, and then you would become the person who determines what truth is, what morality is, and that can't be true.

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And I don't necessarily believe... Is that absolutely true?

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That you don't believe that God would do that, or that what God has determined is true? I don't think that the

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Bible God is someone I would worship at all. But you've said that absolutely, so that's an absolute.

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So yeah, there are some things that, I don't know, the whole language, like this type of language and stuff,

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I don't even know. There's a lot of stuff I don't know, but yeah, I have to go. We'll get talking with you.

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Did you get any material or anything? I've gotten some last week when you guys were like... I hope you read it.

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If you want, I mean, this is kind of different. The bite model?

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If you read the stuff that we gave you, I will check out the bite model. And I grew up... I'll look into it.