Economic Ethics (Poverty, Money, Vocation)

Sovereign Grace Family Church

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September 17, 2023

00:08: Well good evening everyone.
00:10: We are continuing now with our study of this introduction to Christian ethics and we are in week seven which I have entitled money ethics.
00:26: We have already looked at several ethical subcategories.
00:33: We have looked at in our third week we looked at life ethics which included abortion, reproduction, and genetics.
00:41: In our fourth week we looked at death ethics which was Brother Burt's class.
00:45: He taught on suicide, euthanasia, and capital punishment.
00:50: Week five we looked at war ethics regarding pacifism, just war theory, personal protection, and defense.
00:59: And last week we looked at sexual ethics including marriage and divorce, fornication, adultery, and polyamory, and alternative lifestyle issues such as homosexuality and transgenderism.
01:16: I do want to make a small correction to something I said last week.
01:20: I said when I when I defined fornication I defined it a little more broadly than maybe I should have.
01:29: I included a lot under the banner of fornication.
01:34: I would say that the the word pornea which means sexual immorality can have a broad scope but typically fornication is defined as sexual interaction before marriage or outside of the bond of marriage.
01:49: And I defined it a little more broadly and I just want to tighten that up a little bit.
01:52: Typically when we talk about people fornicating in the English that refers to people having sexual relations outside of the bond of marriage.
02:03: And so I want to keep that sort of within that within that framework.
02:06: And is there can fornication be expanded out? Possibly but but it's in its simplest terms we need to keep it in that.
02:15: And so tonight we're going to be moving into an area that has a lot of debate and discussion and a lot of disagreement.
02:30: And I will not be surprised if some of you perhaps have some differing opinions on some of the things that we're going to talk about.
02:38: But I want to remind you that some of these things are not hard and fast rules but rather are principles that we are seeking to understand.
02:49: And I want to remind you also that when we talk about ethics and we talked about this in classes I think class two.
02:56: We talked about the dual idea of virtue and principle.
03:07: The virtue is that which is good.
03:10: So virtue represents goodness and the principle is the practical application of that virtue.
03:21: So we say the practice of that goodness.
03:26: So for instance if a virtue is that life is sacred that's a life is good then then the principle would be murder is wrong.
03:39: Right? Because murder is the is the is violating the virtue.
03:43: Right? That's the principle that we get out of that and we could we could move that into a stronger or a different idea say you know if if private property is good then stealing is wrong.
03:57: And that's going to sort of go along with what we're going to talk about tonight because part of what we're going to talk about tonight in regard to money ethics or might we might say the ethics of economics and that might have been a better title for the class economic ethics is the question of does the Bible assume the right of personal property.
04:18: Is that a virtue that the Bible describes? Well I would argue that it is because we are told in the Eighth Commandment thou shall not what? Steal.
04:30: The Eighth Commandment thou shall not steal which assumes the virtue of private property because if if private property wasn't a virtue then it wouldn't be wrong to steal.
04:42: You see how that works you see how the principle and the virtue become how we begin to analyze our ethical situation.
04:52: Well tonight we're going to look at three parts I always break my class into threes it's just a habit of mine maybe it's part of being a good Baptist I always have three points.
05:01: We're going to look at three things we're going to look number one at poverty as a virtue and I should put a question mark after that and if you're writing notes you can certainly feel free to add a question mark because I want to it's really a question is poverty a virtue so that's that's our first one.
05:17: The second one is we are going to look at three specific economic systems which are socialism communism and capitalism but we'll get to those when we get there and then finally we're going to look at the biblical understanding of work and vocation the biblical understanding of work and vocation but before we move forward because I always forget and I want to not forget let's pray.
05:49: Father I thank you for this opportunity to study this opportunity to teach and I pray Lord that as I seek to teach that I would teach in accordance with your word and your will that you would keep me from error and guide us into all truth according to your word by the power of your spirit and I pray this in Jesus name Amen.
06:11: So we're gonna look first at poverty as a virtue.
06:16: In the latter part of the 20th century with the rise of television and radio ministries the church has been confronted with the false teaching known as the health and wealth gospel.
06:35: The teachers of this movement propose that if you have enough faith you will always experience a healthy physical life and an abundant financial an abundance of financial success.
06:51: This is sometimes also called the name-it-and-claim-it mindset appealing as it is to some but it is I would testify to you or at least I would argue to you I would believe I believe that the health and wealth movement or the name-it-and-claim-it movement is a heretical movement and the reason why I make that claim is because it teaches what I believe is a very dangerous understanding of the expectation of the gospel that if one believes the gospel and they have enough faith that that faith will have the byproduct of health and wealth or what we might call abundant prosperity.
07:43: And honestly those who those who believe it often call it the prosperity gospel because they believe in this idea of prosperity.
07:54: Well there is another end just like we often talk about the two ditches right we'll say there's a if you're going down the road there's a ditch on either side well on one side you have the health and wealth ditch well on the other side there is something that I am calling the poverty gospel.
08:24: So if on one side the health and wealth we call the prosperity gospel on the other side there is a ditch which I'm identifying as the poverty gospel and here's on the TV you'll see these are two extremes the health and wealth gospel says that the sign of faithfulness is abundance.
08:46: If you are faithful you will have an abundance but the poverty gospel says the sign of faithfulness is lack.
08:57: You might say I've never heard that well it's not real popular in America but there are those who believe it there are those who believe that the demand on every Christian is voluntary poverty.
09:12: In fact throughout church history there have those have been those who have claimed that Christianity requires an abandonment of any personal wealth.
09:25: Think about the monastic movement what what is the monastic movement where men would go into monasteries and they would take vows to become monks and what was one of the vows that they would have to take a vow of poverty a vow to live without any creaturely abundance without any creaturely comfort that this idea that to get close to God to truly serve God to truly enjoy the benefits of faithfulness to God one had to have lack right he had to have poverty and I argue or at least I'm going to argue that both of these are two extremes of wrong thinking yes sir the what now nuns well yes the Roman Catholic Church does have its monasteries and it has its a place is like like you're thinking of like the habits or not habits what they wear that the what are the nun where the nuns live what are they called yeah there's a word for it is it not okay maybe it is maybe but but I'm thinking you know you know what's you know huh convent thank you a convent you know what's on my mind is the sound of music you remember the sound of music the the woman who lived there with the other sisters right and so the convent thank you for the helping me with that word the most commonly cited passage in regard to the poverty gospel teaching is the passage where Jesus speaks to the rich young man if you want to open your Bible I want to actually look at this passage we're going to go to Matthew 19 looking at verses 16 to 22 Matthew 19 verses 16 to 22 and it says and behold a man came up to him saying teacher what good deed must I do to have eternal life and Jesus speaking said to him why do you ask me what is good there's only one who is good if you would have life keep the commandments verse 18 he said to him which ones and Jesus said you shall not murder you shall not commit adultery you shall not steal you shall not bear false witness honor your father and mother and you shall love your neighbor as yourself now time does not allow me tonight to get into the intricacies of that Jesus does give him a very interesting response basically calling him to fidelity to the law and specifically the second table of the law which would be the treatment of others we talked about the the Ten Commandments being table one it's how we respond to God love you know having other guys for the Lord don't make any idols not use words they've been vain the second table of the law do not murder do not steal do not commit adultery those are the that's the second table of the law and Jesus tends to focus on that here and we could we could discuss why at another time but the key here is the response of the rich young man it says in verse 20 the young man said to him all these I have kept what do I still lack it's interesting thing that when the man is confronted with the law of God he sees himself as one who is virtuous he sees himself I've kept I've never committed murder I've never lied apparently because he said he never bared false what I've kept all these commands what do I lack Jesus said to him if you would be perfect go sell what you possess and give to the poor and you will have treasure in heaven and come follow me when the young man heard this he went his way sorrowful for he had great possessions now I want to just add real quick the immediate follow-up is verse 23 and Jesus said to his disciples truly I say to you only with difficulty will the rich person enter the kingdom of heaven again I tell you it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich person to enter the kingdom of God so here is the passage which is almost universally used by those who would demand a poverty gospel they would say that see if you want to follow Jesus you have to sell everything that you have you have to give away everything that you have and come and follow Jesus but I want to give you a few thoughts from this passage and I'll put them up on the board for you first thing Jesus does indeed tell this person whoever he is Jesus does indeed tell this person to sell all that he has and I put the second thing this is indeed a person who is owned by his wealth and that is something we have to consider why did Jesus command this young man to give away what he had well we see in the very next line is that the young man loved his possessions and when it came to choosing between Jesus and his prosperity his possessions he chose his possessions so he was indeed owned by his wealth Jesus knowing his heart knew where his heart lied number three Jesus knows how to get to the root of our idolatry which really is the issue here number four this is a situation which deals with an individual's issues it is not a universal command and that and number four is key to this this indirect interaction between Jesus and the rich young ruler is not a universal command there are several people that Jesus interacts with who could be seen as being people of wealth I would just right away say it's likely that Nicodemus was a man who had at least some financial wealth he was that he was a religious man he was a man of good stature and good reputation we know that Jesus also had interactions with others who had wealth and it was not a universal command that all of them would give away everything that they have so it's important to understand the individuality of this command number five there are certainly others in this man's condition who need to do as Jesus commanded him and so I would never tell a person that it's not incumbent upon them to to sell what they have if what they have is their God but that's hard for me to know because I'm not Jesus I don't know the hearts of men but there are times where people seem obviously in love with the things of the world and it would be a good idea to point out the fact that yes it seems as if you in fact are in love with what the world provides and the Bible says that's a dangerous thing so those are a few thoughts that I just wanted to share from that passage and and and specifically verses 23 and 24 where he says only with difficulty will a rich man enter the kingdom of heaven I do point out that Jesus isn't lying there he is saying something true that great wealth does have the power to become great idolatry and I will share an anecdotal reality anecdotally in my life going out and sharing the gospel I tend to find this again you may have a completely different experience my experience does not make the rule I'm just simply sharing my experience and yours may differ but I tend to find when I am interacting with people who have nothing or very little that they tend to be more willing to hear a gospel message than people who have an abundance because people who have an abundance don't feel like they have a need now again that may you your mileage may vary that's in that you're right as they say you may have experienced differently I've never dealt with a lot of people who had a lot of money but the the people that I I basis on is like when I go out into the when I go out into communities as I'll go and walk neighborhoods and hand out gospel tracks and talk to people when I go to certain neighborhoods in certain communities that may feel a little less affluent maybe just by virtue of how old the houses are how things look people tend to be more welcoming than when I go to houses where there tends to be more affluence in fact I'll often get a do not solicit no don't knock on my door kind of unwelcoming and again that could be an experiential thing but Jesus does make the point he says it's with difficulty that a rich man will enter the kingdom of heaven why because possessions have the power to possess us I think that's the simple rule is that possessions have the power to possess us and so we have to be at least cognizant of the fact that while I don't believe the poverty gospel is correct there is a sense in which prosperity if it is our focus and our seeking after always is prosperity then it can become quickly idolatry now I want to share with you a different passage and why I think this idea of poverty as a virtue is not biblical necessarily and this is from the book of Acts if you want to turn over to the book of Acts chapter 16 and go to verse 13 in Acts chapter 16 we have the story of the Apostle Paul meeting a woman named Lydia very familiar with this story probably it says and on the Sabbath day we went outside the gate to the riverside where we suppose there was a place of prayer and we sat down and spoke to the women who had come together one who heard us was a woman named Lydia from the city of Thyatira a seller of purple goods who was a worshiper of God the Lord opened her heart to pay attention to what was said by Paul and after she was baptized and her household as well she urged us saying if you have judged me to be faithful to the Lord come to my house and stay and she prevailed upon us now there's several little key things in this passage that we learn I'll put them up on the board again it's a thought number one Lydia is a woman of substantial wealth it seems based on the fact that she sells purple goods and purple goods were expensive and based on the fact that she had a house capable of housing guests and later according to church history in the book of Acts and other places hosting a church so not only did she have a household capable of hosting guests but she had a household that would be able to host a house church so the assumption is Lydia is a woman of prosperity in fact I have heard prosperity gospel preachers who will use Lydia just like the poverty gospel will use the rich young ruler and say see here Jesus told him to sell everything that means you have to sell everything and on the other side you have the prosperity gospel people who will say see Lydia was a prosperous financial or a businesswoman and so therefore God wants you to be a prosper prosperous financial business person well that doesn't fly either it doesn't just because Lydia was affluent doesn't mean we're all going to be affluent that's not the case she was affluent become before becoming a Christian but here's the thing we don't see we do not see the Apostle Paul calling her to repentance of her affluence we don't see him calling her to repentance of her of her wealth in fact number two Lydia's wealth is used for supporting traveling believers and hosting a church number three Lydia is nowhere commanded to abandon her wealth for poverty and number four there are others like her who use their wealth for good and were therefore never commanded to abandon it Nicodemus Joseph of Arimathea and even though I mentioned these in the notes the women who traveled with Jesus you remember that passage in the Gospels which says that the women were actually the ones who often met the financial needs of Christ in his ministry now how is that well the only way it could be was if these women were had some form of financial prosperity they had some form of financial success to be able to support Jesus in his ministry and I bring this up because here is an important reality if every Christian were impoverished there would be no Christian business owners there would be no Christian philanthropists or givers there would be no Christian ministries that would be flourishing because there would be no one to give money to those things I remember one time I'll never forget this it was at a conference Dr.
25:06: R.C.
25:07: Sproul was speaking so it was many years ago before he died I remember sitting in the audience and he was giving an appeal for giving now you all know R.C.
25:21: Sproul he was not a he was not a man who was a health and wealth preacher by any stretch of the imagination but he wasn't afraid to ask people to give if he wasn't afraid to say hey our ministry has a need we're wanting to do this thing and we're going to need some gifts and this way said I can't quote directly but I can give you the gist of it he said we need partners to give to our ministry and we need some partners who can give over a million dollars and I was like oh yeah I'm not the partner I'm not the guy you're asking but I know that he knew that there had to be some people who were listening whether they were there in the audience or whether they were hearing this via internet or radio he had to know that some of the people who support his ministry had the capacity to give that amount and they were able to do so because they had been prospered in some way by God and so I think about missionaries what do missionaries rely on missionaries rely on people giving what do you have to what do you have to be what do you have to do to be able to give you have to have you have to you have to be able to have something to give something right and so the idea that we're all to simply give everything away not have anything not not do any kind of storing up or saving to be able to do that I think is a misunderstanding of what the what the Bible teaches it's a it's a it's an extreme you have again the two extremes the two ditches another thing about the poverty gospel is the danger in a poverty gospel is that it creates a form of salvation by works because it can lead to believing that there is virtue and discomfort and therefore a Christian can never enjoy the blessings and the benefits of God's creation they have to always be impoverished uncomfortable and in lack to have any kind of genuine spirituality and probably the most problematic issue in the poverty gospel is that it removes as I said the possibilities of Christians building businesses becoming employers and establishing companies which can benefit others many of you are familiar with Christian businessmen who have benefited many people's people like Truett Cathy who started the Chick-fil-A franchise and he did so as trying to be a Christian businessman JC Penney who were familiar with JC Penney stores JC Penney was originally the store was originally called the golden rule store was the golden rule do unto others as you'd have them do unto you and so there is a benefit of having Christian businessmen Christian community leaders and there's a sanctifying presence in an ungodly world when you have these men and women who have this prosperity when you have your Lydia's in the world so when it comes to this first issue of prosperity as a virtue I ask this question can a Christian be both faithful and wealthy I think the answer is yes even though the Bible says it's hard it can be but the second thing is can all Christians handle the temptation of wealth and the answer is no yeah so I think there's again that line can it be done yes true Kathy JC Penney it can be done and can be done well and but that doesn't mean that everyone can handle that yes sir you had your hand up yeah it's interesting too that you mentioned the Old Testament because if we do walk through the Old Testament there certainly are many people in the Old Testament who had prosperity but then they also had their their share of difficulties yeah yeah absolutely so that takes us to the end of our first point and that is the question of the as I said the question of is poverty a virtue I would say poverty is not necessarily a virtue poverty is not necessarily a virtue you can be faithful and be wealthy and I think that I think the other thing and I don't have this passage maybe Bert you might remember this off the top of your head but there's the passage that says Lord do not give me poverty that I'm that I might steal and give me wealth that I may not seek you what would you have it okay Proverbs 30 verse 8 through 10 and that's what it says basically right I don't want to be so poor that I feel the need to steal and I don't want to be so wealthy that I don't seek after God right so so that proverb almost almost screams for a blessed middle class the blessing of the of the of the benefit of the middle class right and so when it comes to financial ethics I think that there's there's benefit and looking at it with a balanced perspective but now we get into the next question and that's the question of okay if we believe that's true if we believe that that that there's there's there's an there's a virtue and and having your needs met and not being impoverished but but but but going about the world having our needs met doing the things that we need to do to meet our needs the next question is is there a system that the Bible supports that would inherently be virtuous towards the meeting of individual needs and so we come to the question of economic systems economic systems and the three are socialism communism and capitalism there are other economic systems we do not have time to go through every one and even underneath these systems there are sub systems sub categories such as like laissez-faire capitalism and things like that the different different types of capitalism you have free market capitalism things like that and so we do not have the time to dive into all of those but I have some thoughts about these that I want to stress as Americans we live in one of the most prosperous nations around the world when considering the poverty gospel in our previous section one might consider that even the poorest Americans are often better off than a large part of the rest of the world many Americans live in air-conditioned homes drive cars carry cell phones own personal computers and it's been said that the average American dishwasher consumes more calories in a day than the average person living in the third world more food travels through the the dishwasher being washed out into the sewage and I think that there's likely some truth to that I saw a picture from the 80s I think this this past week it was a picture of Boris Yeltsin Boris Yeltsin bleep Prime Minister of Russia right am I remembering that correct but he was he had visited America and he was he was walking through an American grocery store remember this you saw that huh yeah and but he said he was amazed and he lamented how his people in his country had nothing compared to this all of the variety and all of the abundance available to them I have a friend Matthew Henson I think he's the one who posted that he said this he said if you've ever passed one grocery store to get to another grocery store he said you're better off than so much of the world you don't even realize it that you have the choice to get to bypass the Winn-Dixie to go to the Aldi or to bypass the Publix to go to the other store you you don't realize just how blessed we are and even though we're currently facing probably one of the most severe bouts of inflation that I can remember in my short lifetime it's still a an amazing place that we live that at any moment any one of us could simply get into a car go over to a grocery store and buy food and it's in abundance so we asked the question what is the reason for the higher standard of living which has existed in the United States and many would attribute the success of the American standard of living to our economic system and America is supposed to be even though we're gonna argue in a sense that it's not always it's supposed to be seen as an example of what is known as capitalism some might argue free market capitalism but as I said there's some different views on how we understand that but at least an understanding of capitalism and that simply stated is the idea that people have the right to produce and sell goods according to the principle of supply and demand that's what capitalism is it is that people have the right to produce and sell goods according to the principle of supply and demand if a person produces a product which is in great demand they can charge more and if there is a larger supply than there is a demand the price goes down and so the the balancing act of capitalism is trying to keep the supply meeting the demand but not to be overly supplied that way you can keep the prices where they're beneficial and yet competitive one of the virtues often proposed by proponents of capitalism is that it promotes three things I don't have these on the board but I'll write them for you it promotes liberty individualism pardon me and equality now I know yes sir I know that there are people who are probably not fans of capitalism who are losing their minds right now when I say that capitalism produces liberty individualism and inequality but understand what we are seeing in many places and where we don't see these things is we're not seeing capitalism on display we are seeing other forms of economics making their way in like for instance when monopolies have their way and they come in and they they make it impossible for there to be any genuine market oh goodness what's the word I just lost competition any genuine market competition through monopolies or when the government makes it impossible for the small business to be able to do something because they they tax them at a rate that is impossible for them to achieve but the higher bigger businesses can do that and so there are all kinds of issues that come into play but ultimately when I say that it promotes liberty equality and individualism is based on this idea capitalism is based on the idea that any man with a good idea and the discipline to work hard can become a success that's the the idea any man with a good idea and the discipline to work hard can become a success because he's free to work hard produce a product and live off the wages that that product produces that's the idea behind capitalism now other economic systems have been employed around the world with varying degrees of success and failure and as I said the two most commonly known are socialism and communism socialism is defined as an economic and political system where the ways of making a living are owned by the workers who run them and the people who depend on them so socialism is based on the idea that factories offices the means of production are owned by the workers that there is not a owner who has the power but that the ownership is shared that's the idea of socialism is that the workers are the essentially the owners communism is different in that communism is a system where all property is public and people work and are given things by the government according to their needs so in this in this system it's not owned by the workers but rather it is owned and run by the government and a good example of this is I watched a video of something that occurred in Russia remember I mentioned Russia earlier well this was a more recent video where the current Russian leader Vladimir Putin was very unhappy with the way a company was being run in his country and he simply went in and and got rid of everyone and changed everything because he had the power he had the authority to go in and simply make that change it wasn't owned by them and had the power the government could do whatever the government wanted to and so the Russian leader simply made his change now the motto of communism is from each according to his ability to each according to his need from each according to his ability to each according to his need so mark you have certain abilities you know I know one thing you can paint because you did some painting for me once so you have an ability to do painting right and Burt you have an ability you have an ability to teach well that's a need that society has needs society needs men who can paint society has needs of men who can teach so you're going to give that to the society and as a result of that the society is going to meet your needs with whatever it is you do need whether it's clothes or food or shelter or whatever and so from each according to his ability to each according to his need those who promote these systems claim that capital capitalism allows far too much power to be given to those who own the wealth and therefore to ensure equality wealth must be redistributed that is a key concept is the redistribution of wealth so here's something to consider we have three systems here the first two systems are based upon community the third capitalism is based upon individuality so you have socialism and cut and some people have a real hard time with the difference between socialism and capitalism or communism and I'll say this socialism is communism without guns but it doesn't last long socialism almost always inevitably becomes a authoritarian socialism or a a communistic form yes yes even though America is as I said is based on capitalism capitalism has not it's not we don't have a true capitalism even even now even it don't no matter where you live whether it's Florida Georgia whatever because it's not all based upon supply and demand because sometimes certain supplies are artificially changed and things like that the government can come in and make decisions that affect all kinds of issues and supply lines can be interrupted by government choice like for instance let's take oil for example there is no reason why according as far as I understand and I could be wrong about this but as far as I understand there's no reason why America should not be oil independent meaning that we should be able to produce enough oil to supply our needs and be able to sell oil to our people based on what we can produce through Alaska and through the United States to be able to produce and manufacture and and have enough oil for what we need but the problem is the government has changed so many laws because of the pursuit of things like green energy and and and conservation of power things like that that they have like like the certain pipelines have been cut off no more no no more government allowance for that which means we no longer have access to that oil that we have and we have to purchase oil from elsewhere and we become dependent upon other countries right and therefore the price goes up and it's no longer really capitalism now because the government's interfering in that ability is that making sense well I don't think we're communistic but I think there are people who desire that there are people I mean think about Bernie Sanders I don't want to get too too deep into the politics today Bernie Sanders identifies himself as a democratic socialist which means he believes that there that capitalism is the problem and here's the most arrogant statement I've ever heard anyone say Bernie Sanders wrote a book he sold a lot and made a lot of money it was New York Times bestseller Bernie Sanders was asked about that about why he had multiple houses because he has multiple homes even though he decries capitalism he was asked about why he has multiple homes and he said to the person well if you write a book and it's a bestseller you can have multiple homes too so he was announcing the fact that he was through capitalism had made money but the whole thing he his whole stick is denying or decrying capitalism so the entire thing is it's it's it's sad to watch it's sad to watch but I do want to I want to go back to a biblical principle now I'm trying to get all this back to something simple we can sink our teeth into I mentioned earlier calm community versus individuality but from a biblical perspective what we have is private property versus communal property private property versus communal property capitalism is based on the idea of private property communism socialism socialism is based on the idea of communal property on its on its basis basic level so let me read to you I want to read to you this is going to be maybe the most controversial thing I'll read in this class because I'm going to quote from Ayn Rand yeah she's not a Christian I'm quoting from her simply because of this perspective on communism she says this there is no difference between communism and socialism except in the means of achieving the same ultimate end communism proposes to enslave men by force socialism by vote it is merely the difference between murder and suicide so she she believes that by taking away the individual right of private property that we are essentially putting our own neck in the noose now again you may have a thousand things you don't like about Ayn Rand but I think there is some truth to this issue and going back to the Eighth Commandment the idea of stealing the Bible in my opinion does support the idea of private property and when we give up the right of private property and give in to a communal property like like I don't know if you've heard this but it's very popular recently there is this this phrase you'll be happier when you own nothing that's this that true contentment comes from owning nothing so that again I think is something to consider one of the arguments for capitalism and against socialism is that capitalism inspires in initiative and ingenuity I remember having this conversation with a relative I have a relative who's a who is a avowed communist they just believe in it they believe that capitalism is deadly and destructive and I asked him I said in a communistic society what motivates a man to choose to be a doctor versus a ditchdigger and he said well a ditchdigger deserves just as much respect as a doctor this is the response that the church this family member gave and I responded I said it's not about respect it's about compensation it's not about respect I do respect the ditchdigger as much as I respect a doctor in the form of respecting a man for being a man ditchdigger works hard I respect that but I don't compensate the ditchdigger in the same way that I compensate the doctor and this is why so many doctors in other countries seek to come to a place where they can benefit from being doctors and lawyers and other things where they've had to put in so much you know how long it takes to go to school to be a physician how long it takes to go to school to be certainly different than skilled labor which is still valuable but the difference is the difference is met in the compensation right it inspires ingenuity inspires initiative and capitalism there's reward for creativity innovation which is not necessarily present in other systems why would someone aspire to create a business and produce goods if they themselves had no benefit self-interest and this is this is key let me let me finish self-interest is an important motivator and while ethically we might argue that self-interest is wrong it's not always wrong we talked about this in class one if you remember we talked about the different things that cause us to come to different ethical conclusions sometimes the Bible uses self-interest Jesus talks about do not do things that will or don't worry about the one who kills the body but worry about the one who killed your body and soul into hell right right like that's self-interest like I'm concerned about my soul there's a certain self-interest that's good now we shouldn't be selfish we shouldn't be unloving or greedy but self-interest is an important part of being able to be successful yes sir I was thinking, I kind of learned about Karl Marx in college and high school and I learned about basically his whole ideology came from the fact that he was an atheist, he was like very anti-christian, he was like, I'm going to get rid of, basically make a kind of system that's going to turn people away from God and Christ, basically.