Timothy Brindle: New "Fault Lines" Album, Shai Linne, BLM, LGBTQ+, and Q&A from Listeners DMW#228

Hey, it's a live up on the drop episode. Let's go in 2013. Black Lives Matter is established. Claiming black lives are systematically ravaged. The hashtag is movement.

Oh, there it is. Welcome back to another episode of dead dead walking podcast. Guys, if you've been listening for a while, you're going, wait a minute. That's not the intro. Well, it's because it's a special intro.

I say this every week. We got special guys on, but we got a special guy on. We got a new album drop episode and we wanted to talk about it. It's Timothy Brindle. But before we get to him, of course, we got to talk about our sponsors because they help us go to conferences, bring you guys content.

They support the show. Look at, I ain't doing this to retire, right? I'm a real estate broker by trade, but it does help when we have guys that are reformed brothers in the Lord. They own businesses. We want to help them out.

They help us out. Jacob's supply. It's that time of the year projects are in full swing. And you know what that means. You got to make the trip up to Jacob's supply. Listen, they do ship nationally, but I've had guys that come up 12, 14 hours away.

They have building supplies at 30, 40, 50 off cheaper than a Home Depot, cheaper than Menards, cheaper than wherever you're going to get your, uh, you know, refrigerators and your roofing and your decking and your barn dominiums.

They have it all. They're like a Menards, but 50 off. Think about it that way. They got PVC decking, composite decking, treated decking. I mean, it's all, like I said, 30, 40, 50 off their Cortec flooring.

We got called by their competitors and they said, Hey, you gotta quit saying how cheap that stuff is. We can't get it that cheap. And he goes, Hey, they give me a good price. Cause I buy more than anyone else in the United States.

So Jacob's supply is a brother in the Lord. He's building something great in temperance, Michigan. They do ship ship nationally. You can check them out at jacobsupply .com or call them at 734 -224 -0978.

Or Hey, as always click on the link below, we got to support our brothers building stuff in the kingdom. So with business out of the way, I want to introduce this gentleman. Timothy Brindle is a pastor in the PCA.

He is also a senior stewardship officer and a lecturer in Old Testament at Westminster Theological Seminary. We're going to get along great where he completed the master, his master of theology and master of divinity degrees.

Timothy has been making Christ-centered hip hop since 2003, which we're going to get into a little bit today. He recently released his 11th project called Fault Lines, the album based on Votibachum's book.

He's the author of the unfolding book and four part acoustic theology for kids series with Jonathan Gibson, Timothy and his wife. I want to make sure I say this right. Floriana. Is that what it is Tim?

Floriana. You are quite close brother. Sorry, Floriana live in Southeastern PA and have nine children, including one in heaven. It's Timothy Brindle. Welcome to the podcast sir.

Thanks for having me brother Greg. Praise the Lord for us being dead men crucified with Christ,.

But now raised up to walk in newness of life. Let's go Ephesians two. I love it. Absolutely. So first of all, can you give a little more on your bio if you wish to for listeners who may not have heard of you?

I'm sure they have, but we've got some listeners that might be new or might be new to you. So anything I missed in that bio that you'd like to add? Bro, that was a nice summary.

Thank you for that. Yes. My main ministry and priority is my family, my wife and wonderful children. We have four boys, four girls. But then along with that, serving in the local church as a pastor at Olive Street Presbyterian church alongside of my close friend, John Orlando, excellent minister and man of God to serve with.

And then yes, also continue to work for and have ministry with Westminster Theological Seminary where I was just blessed to study God's word at.

Brother Greg. Yeah. So I wanted to have you on and talk about the new album, Fault Lines, the album. The book is by Vodia. Vodia is awesome. I bought that a few years ago. I think it hit the nail on the head on what was going on in America.

We talk about that kind of stuff here on the podcast quite often. And then when I saw this album coming out, I went, holy moly, this is going to be insane because I got turned on to you through, I think it was a David and Goliath or something like that, a song about that.

And I'm sorry. Look at me, I'm 42. When I was in my twenties, I lived in breathe music. Now I've got a business to run, a family to raise, right? I can't remember all that stuff, but I just remember years ago going, gosh, I wish some preachers preach from the pulpit on some of these reformed rappers do on their songs because it was just, it's so rich, theologically rich.

And I got to listen to the album over the last probably two days. I'm impressed with it. I mean, melodically, it sounds good. Lyrically, it's always solid, but I wanted to talk to you about it. First of all, why this album and why now?

Explain a little bit, because I feel like there's a theme to it.

The Origins of the Fault Lines Album

Greg, I was blessed to get to know Vodi Bakum over the last several years. It's funny, I first bumped into Vodi in 2015 at the Gospel Coalition Conference. This was before TGC canceled The Good Reverend Doctor, unfortunately, but because of his truth speaking.

And at TGC, I was like, wow, you're Vodi Bakum. Can I get a picture with you? And he said, wow, you're Timothy Brindle. Can I get a picture with you? And it so happened, Vodi was already familiar with my music, him and his son, Trey.

And we stayed in touch some, and then we did some conferences together first in 2017. It was especially in early 2021 when I was wrestling through things such as critical race theory and how to make sense of it.

These are things that really were a challenge for my family and I and for our local church and for the community, especially the Christian hip hop community. And I just felt Vodi's book, like you said, really hit the nail on the head.

But Vodi and I were invited to speak at a couple events together in early 2021 by Wrath and Grace. And Jay, Johan Haneo from Wrath and Grace, he asked me and Vodi, hey guys, how about Tim puts Vodi's book into an album?

What do you guys think? Vodi and I agreed. And it took three years to complete it. And on one level, you could say, Greg, that the three years, it was worth that amount of time to really sit on and really process and work through the intricacies and complexities, but then also how widely applied and critical race theory, critical theory, critical social justice is.

And so to be able to spend a long time thinking on those things, writing on them, seeking to perfect the album as much as I can, humanly speaking as a sinner, and to be able to run it past Vodi and do so with a great group of brothers, Wrath and Grace.

Shout out to Aaron Warner, also known as Nobody Special, the producer of all the beats, him and brother Leo from Jesus Wannabes, who did a lot of the mixing and mastering. And even we did a heavy metal hip hop song on there.

And he did some of the guitars on the BLM song that you just played the beginning. It was just a joy to do it. And so, yeah, that's really how it came together was through my relationship with Wrath and Grace and doing, I guess now four or five events with Vodi in the last three or four years and being able to connect with him when he came to the States and really trying to bring the content of Fault Lines, which exposes the critical social justice movement and critical race theory, but trying to do so through music, through lyrics, and especially to, I would say, the Christian hip hop genre, which has really become, I think, affected by unbiblical thinking in many of these areas,.

Brother Greg. Yeah, I feel like it has. You go back 10, 15 years and that genre of Christian rap, or even more specifically that reformed Christian rap, had a very different feel to it than it is starting to emerge right now.

So I think the album is much needed. I absolutely love all of the acronyms we have, titles like TRC, the Resistance of Christians, CRT, Christians reject this, you know. We do sell a t-shirt on our shirt called, and it says, Teach CRT in School, Christian Reform Theology.

So we're tracking the same there where we like to toy with those because that's a serious issue, you know, BLM, blatant lies multiplied. So even the album titles have a theme. I've got to imagine you're saying it's taking you three years and you don't seem like, and your music definitely doesn't reflect this, like you just lay something down and you might not know too much about it.

I feel like you dive into it, you study it, you look at it from every angle, and then you're creating a song out of that with lyrics. Is that kind of what happened on some of these subjects too, to where you probably had a head knowledge of it and understood them, but you probably took a deep dive on some of these subjects?

Yes, Greg. You know,.

Voti's book was huge. The Fault Lines album, in a few of the songs, it lays out Voti's instruction, his teaching from Fault Lines, the book. For instance, songs like BLM, blatant lies multiplied, basically go through, Voti has a section on the Black Lives Matter movement, unpack that.

The song called False Narrative, comparing the deaths of George Floyd and Tony Timpa, Breonna Taylor and Sierra Meyer, Dylan Noble and Philando Castile. So some of those songs follow. It's really putting Voti's book in those particular chapters to lyrics.

Same with the song CRT, the way Voti breaks down critical race theory. But then some of the other songs are taking principles, biblical principles that Voti teaches and exposing the critical social justice movement, and sort of my take or contribution, as Voti puts it, the way that he described it is, it's my contribution to the discussion, but sort of still in line with his book.

And in that regard, zooming in on melanin, how the reality is, there's one created human race in Adam. And we've all been given melanin by the Lord, brown pigment, skin color, but to various degrees. And all of this was embedded in Adam, in his DNA.

And so there really aren't multiple races. So melanin gets into that, as well as the true narrative, which is really sort of like the biblical theology of race or ethnicity, sort of how on the Unfolding album, I trace themes from the Old to the New Testament.

True narrative does that. And then wanted to add a song on the LGBTQ movement. That's the song called SSA, as that acronym, Same Sex Attracted Christian, but we reword it, the adjusted acronym, Satan's Sexual Atrocity.

And that's because the enemy uses critical theory, which divides people up as oppressed or oppressor. And he not only does that with race, but attempts to with gender and sexual orientation, often CRT and BLM does this too, uses the race as the Trojan horse to bring in the LGBTQ movement.

So I wanted to address that in light of Vodi's new book, which he just released June 1st, just in time for Pride Month. And it's called, It's Not Like Being Black, How the LGBTQAI2 Plus Movement Hijacked.

The Civil Rights Movement. Yeah, they certainly did. And that is a whole nother episode in and of itself. A question for you that I would like to see if maybe you can put your finger on it, because I'm still puzzled.

I have some theories and I know ultimately what it is, but why do you think the Western Christian church has been bamboozled by things that are so blatantly true, right? So you have these truths, these big truths, and I think this is why we fell into the COVID stuff after a few months, most sensible people could see what it was.

The Black Lives Matter movement, I mean, you could tell what that was in that, you see people buying million dollar houses and misappropriating funds. And we knew what that movement was. You see the biological truths within the LGBTQ community.

We have these truths that are right in front of our faces, yet the Western Christian church, and I would say the liberal progressive, and even coming into the mainstream now, evangelical church, falls for these lies and chases after these lies, even though the truth is in front of their eyes.

And I'm saying a truth that is a natural truth sometimes. You don't even have to be a believer to understand the difference between a man and a woman. We've been given a common grace that allows us to discern that.

So even they're claiming to be a believer, even an unbeliever cannot see this, but they wholly accept it. What do you think that move is and why that is?

One thing that comes to mind, Greg, Satan, he even comes as an angel of light. Satan has been a master craftsman at using half-truths or hijacking movements where it's filled with lies, but there's enough truth or a change in language, redefinitions.

And so this goes back to how classical Marxism with Karl Marx had more of a focus on the economic class of the owners, the business owners, and the employees as they oppressed for a suppressor. But then cultural Marxism with Gramsci and those in the Frankfurt School, they took the Marxist idea and they tried to apply it more to culture.

And there was this concept of hegemony, those who have the power in its power of knowledge. And so one of the goals with cultural Marxism is those from the Frankfurt School came to the States in the 1930s fleeing Nazi Germany, but they went into the academy.

And we just see that it's trickled down. It's schools, not only like Oxford and Cambridge, which at first were training ministers of the gospel. So likewise in America, Yale, Harvard, in Princeton, and so on, these were institutions that used to train ministers in sound Christian reform theology.

But the cultural Marxists got in and along with other liberalism, has God really said, is the serpent's perpetual perennial question that he's been uttering through his children since Genesis 3, right?

And then so these things have trickled down. The church has always struggled with worldliness. And so when Christians hear things like justice, oh, racial justice, that sounds really important. I don't want to be about racial injustice.

And the enemy uses enough linguistics and he uses history. So the fact is the United States of America does have a history of real racism. And of course, there's still real racism today on all fronts from all peoples.

So he can make use of those things to leverage them so that then people begin to interpret present events through the lenses of the past. And then instead of trying to understand justice biblically or racism biblically, it's using the world's redefinition.

So with cultural Marxism, there was an attack on language and definitions to try to redefine concepts and knowledge and then make it experience-based. My experiential knowledge is there's no such thing as objective truth in Christians, even though they don't, I think, consciously buy into it subconsciously.

How I feel in my experiences and my emotions is how I begin to understand things. These are some of the ways I think that the church has bought into these.

Lies, Brother Greg. Yeah, no, so true. And I think I agree with you too, with probably one of the best tricks that Satan has ever pulled was to make you think he comes to you like a horror flick. He's got the pitchfork and the horns.

He is absolutely comes as an angel of light. He was made of music. He thought he was better than God. There's a guy named Bobby McFerrin, I believe, and he does a demonstration with a pentatonic scale with a group of strangers all around the world where he will jump on stage and he gives them the note and the people say it, and then he jumps over and he gives them the second note.

Just by giving them two notes, he can jump along the scale and create a whole song and intuitively people understand that scale without knowing why. They go in thirds up the scale, down the scale. He's singing a lead.

He's jumping all around and no matter where he goes, he can go all the way down, all the way up. And he says, you know, this is everywhere I go. It doesn't matter where I'm at, Europe, Africa, United States, down in South America, everyone understands this.

And it makes you think, wow, music is an extremely powerful thing. And, you know, if I was the angel of worship or music, maybe I would have a little pride and think, wow, yeah, I can induce people to do things.

You know how powerful music is. You're an artist. It can sway people, convince them. It can bring them together. It can pull them apart. That's why I think music like yours is so important because I think ultimately, and I think you would agree, the arts and music especially is for the glory of God.

He has given it to us to glorify him. So, um, I want to talk about the process a little bit of making and recording the album. I don't want to get too much in the weeds in case there's not too many tech guys out there.

You know, I don't want to start talking about two inch fat tape and Neve boards and all that. Uh, what, what was the process like for you? So you said it took three years. Do you start writing first? Do you lay some, some music down and then you get lyrics?

Do you kind of do it all at the same time? Stuff like that. Um, what's your process in writing.

An album? I'd love to talk about that, Greg. Um, what I usually do, Greg is, is find a beat first that I think goes with a particular theme. I maybe have a theme in mind for a song. Maybe a few rhyme schemes have already come to me or I've, I've thought on, um, or, or punch lines or concepts that I really want to break down, um, through a song and then it's to find tracks that go with it.

One of the blessings of wrath and grace is there's a producer for wrath and grace. Again, Aaron Warner, nobody special is producer name. This cat has an entire catalog or archive dozens and dozens and dozens of great beats.

And so with him, the question isn't, um, can I get a or it's which one should I pick? And so it's finding one that goes with a particular theme. And then there were a few times with this album where I already had a beat that I wrote to and recorded to.

And Aaron, as one who can just make beats so efficiently, he was like, you know what? I don't really feel, I'm not really feeling that beat anymore. Tim, check out this new beat I made, uh, while I was in the shower or while I was in my bed.

Maybe not while he's in the shower. Yeah. Um, and wow, Aaron, man, this bro, this joint, this is even better than, than, than the prior one, which I loved. So that's sort of the way it occurred. Okay.

Um, and so I, I, I kind of had the several songs that I wanted to write, um, as I read through Vody's book a few times and found it so helpful. And as I also was preaching in my own church on thinking biblically about race, if you go to timothybrindleministries .com, you can find that three part series thinking biblically about race and writing on some of these things for Westminster magazine.

That article is also on my website. It then made me want to put these things into songs, um, for the sake of God's people. And even though my primary ministry is preaching, teaching, and writing brother Greg, I still think, like you said, music is a powerful tool, powerful means that we can use.

It was created by God for his glory and hip hop. So happens to be very word based, very word centered, very speech centered. So you can pack in a lot of content with hip hop. Uh, and so that's one of the blessings that can be used for discipleship, for instruction, for catechesis, catechism, and so on.

Yeah, no, absolutely. Does.

Your, as a pastor, does your sermon prep kind of mirror album prep or no, is it totally different? Not the content I'm saying the process of what I'm going to be preaching on. I'm always interested in that when you find someone who's creatively inclined and also a pastor.

I would say that my.

Writing process for writing songs now, Greg, it follows my sermon prep planning. And so far as when I'm, you know, so the first thing I do when I prepare a sermon is I, I read it and translate it from the original Greek and Hebrew.

This is what we're trained to do at Westminster. And as you do so tons of things jump out at you from the text, both in the grammar and syntax and the themes and the way that this word is used in this passage and so on.

And the way that this writer uses this phrase, this passage from the old or new Testament and so on. And then finding the main point of the text, how it connects to Christ and his finished work. And then how that also applies to us in our practical life.

You know, not only the indicative of what Christ has done, but the imperative, what he calls us now to do through our union with Christ. And so, so now when I write songs, I might not necessarily translate a whole passage, but if I am expounding a passage or a particular theme, I'll first lay out maybe the main point and then the few sub points.

And so, you know, if you think of a three point sermon and how the main idea of the text is your main point of the text, and then you have your three sub points that you break down, it's very similar to writing a hip hop song where in the chorus, you're putting the main, the hook, it's your main idea, you know, the main point of your song, and then your three verses are basically your three,.

Your three point sermon. Oh, I like that. No, that works out. That's good. So about this relationship with, uh, uh, wrath and grace, how did that come about? Uh, how did, how did you, how did you find.

Those guys? Yeah. So Jay, uh, from wrath and grace, he's, he's had, uh, the wrath and grace company, uh, for over a decade and wrath and grace, uh, originally, you know, primarily a clothing company in a, in a, in a hip hop record label, um, making good Christ-centered reform hip hop.

Uh, but then also through, uh, Jay's love for the word and Jay's connection with other ministers of the gospel and, and, and theologians like Dr. Votie Baucom and Jay and Votie, very close friends. Jay actually wrath and grace does the booking for Votie.

Um, Jay, he reached out to me, man, it must've been in the early 2000 teens, probably 2011, 2012, to share how he was encouraged, uh, through our music, which was helpful for him in understanding reform theology and him getting plugged into the local church, being discipled by faithful godly men.

So just continue to stay in touch, did some collaborations and concerts. So I think probably, um, about a decade ago began to collaborate with Jay and wrath and grace through certain concerts or, or, or song collaborations.

And then it was in the, you know, I think by 2017, 2018 and 19, at least every year to, um, or at least every year doing a couple of conferences with Jay and wrath and grace. So that's sort of how we, uh,.

Got connected and became closer friends. Awesome. Yeah. So, uh, the album is called, uh, fault lines, the album. We don't want to confuse it with the book fault lines, the album, but follows it closely.

And obviously we're going to link up everything below to where anything that if you guys are listening right now and you go, Oh, where's that? Or where do I find his ministry or get the album? It's all going to be linked up by the time you guys listen to this.

Um, I'm streaming it on Apple and Spotify. Where else can people find it?

It's also an iTunes where you could purchase it directly from wrath and grace .com for 1199. Uh, have the, you know, the MP3 downloads and it has the lyric insert in there. So you can have all the lyrics as well.

And there's a few other materials in there as well. Like the album.

Credits and some other things, some things from Dr. Votie. Yeah. Is the, yeah. Is the purchase from the website still preferred? Because I've talked to some people and, and I don't know after they've reworked their kind of, uh, contracts with artists, the streaming doesn't really seem to support the artist.

It's not really in their favor. Is it still that way?

It's still that way, Greg, it's unfortunate. I remember in the early days with lamp mode, um, you know, my first several albums were released through lamp mode. It was a blessing, man. It was just CDs.

And you know, then MP3s came along, but still you, you usually had to buy that directly from, uh, the artists from, from the record label. And it was so much more helpful financially for the record label and the artist.

And so, yes, if you ask me, uh, how would it benefit wrath and grace and Timothy Brindle more financially, I'd say buy it straight from wrathandgrace .com. Wrath and grace also has an app that you can, you can download that app to your, your iPhone, um, or your Android and, um, and, and get it and eventually be able to listen to.

It through there as well. Awesome. Cause that's really what we want to be doing here too, is, is not just supporting because it's, it's good music. It's godly music. It's glorifying God, but I'm really big on supporting other brothers that are doing things.

Um, uh, we don't need to be throwing our money to the pagans and to the secular list. We need to be making sure we're supporting our brothers and sisters in the Lord that are actually doing and building things.

So I just had that thought because I've done that, you know, I'm going to go, I've, I've streamed it for this interview to listen to it over that. Cause it just released a few days ago when we recorded this, but I definitely will go purchase it too, to make sure we support.

And I would like to tell the listeners, go do the same thing, go to it. It'll be linked up below and go support it. All right. Just a couple more questions. Then I want to get into some Twitter questions that were sent in to us.

Uh, so with all the problems going on in, uh, the Western Christian church and in America in general, what do you think the biggest issues are that's facing the church? Not necessarily the country, but facing Western Christian church right now?

Is it multiple issues? Is there one that's glaringly bigger than the rest? What are your.

Thoughts on that as a pastor? And as an artist, Greg, I think there are multiple issues, but they can be boiled down to one or two. I would say the main problem I think facing the church is the enemy deceiving Christians, uh, with false ideologies with unbiblical worldview.

And there's a few places, uh, it's interesting in, in Corinthian second Corinthians, uh, where, um, Paul says in second Corinthians 11 to, to the Corinthian church, I feel a divine jealousy for you since I betrothed you to one husband to present you as a pure virgin to Christ.

But I'm afraid that as the serpent deceived Eve by his cunning, your thoughts will be led astray from a sincere and pure devotion to Christ. Well, what are some of the ways that the enemy, uh, seeks to deceive us like he did Eve?

Well, remember with Eve, it was questioning God's revelation, questioning the sufficiency and the truthfulness of God's revelation. Has God really said, and one of the ways he does that is through ideologies, which are essentially arguments, lofty arguments raised against that, that are contradictory of the knowledge of God in Christ.

So in the chapter before second Corinthians 10, uh, Paul says, beginning with verse three, for though we walk in the flesh in these, these human bodies, we're not waging war according to the flesh that is even according to the sinful nature or who we were in Adam, because the weapons of our warfare are not of the flesh, but they have divine power.

It's the power of the spirit, resurrection power in Christ through the word to destroy strongholds. We destroy arguments. Notice that these strongholds, their arguments, their teachings, we destroy arguments in every lofty opinion, an opinion or, or a teaching that's, that's, that's boastful and lifted up against the Lord lofty opinion raised against the knowledge of God to take every thought captive to obey Christ.

And I think that with these ideologies we're talking about, such as critical theory, uh, that the enemy has crept in and that it's ultimately an attack on image of God, who we are as image of God. And so you see the attack when it comes to, uh, things, uh, a man made or a satanic version of race, uh, and all the implications with that.

But then there's the attack on sexuality and bro, it's ultimately an attack on the home. It's an attack on the family. And so here's where I would boil it down, Greg, I think the primary problem facing the church is the attack on biblical manhood and womanhood, who we are as those made in God's image as male and female, although we're equally image of God, male and female created to glorify God.

The way that a man glorifies God primarily is as a father and husband. The way that a woman glorifies God is primarily as, as a wife and a mother. And therefore there is a distinction in how we are designed, how we're created, who we are spiritually.

And I think this stuff connects to the ideologies, Greg, because the bottom line is, are we going to be men as you and I are men great to stand and fight against these things in truth and in love and in firmness?

Uh, are we going to allow these ideologies to ravage our churches and our families, our marriages and our children, or are we going to stand firm in Christ? So that that's how I would boil it down, bro.

Yeah, no, great answer. Okay. Last question in this segment, we'll move on. How can music in general or in all genres, how, how can music, what does it need to have or not.

Have to glorify God? So glad you asked that. We've been talking about this in our family worship time with our kids as we know, fourteens and, um, you know, uh, four teenagers, um, you don't have 14 yet or teens or teenagers is how should we think about music?

How would you think about secular music and so on? And there's two, two things that I think make music glorifying to God in Psalm 33. David actually gives a command where he says, play skillfully to the Lord.

Psalm 33, uh, verse three, sing to him a new song, play skillfully on the strings with loud shouts. So in order to glorify God, music should be done skillfully with excellence. So with artistic, uh, uh, ability and an aesthetic excellence, right?

Yeah. The Lord desires it to be done in excellence as he is excellent and great. Now, as those creating God's image, Greg, the unbeliever can play skillfully. They can make music excellently, right? But the other aspect comes next.

Notice, uh, it says two verses later, he, the Lord loves righteousness and justice. So in order for music to glorify God, it not only has to be done skillfully or excellently, what we can call aesthetic beauty.

It not only has to have beauty, it must have truth because righteousness and justice is living life in conformity to God's law, his truth. It's based on truth. The unbeliever can't ultimately do that, right?

Maybe they can to an extent, but it's going to be limited because whatever is not done in faith is sin as scripture says. And the natural man, first Corinthians two 14, he can't understand the things of God, their foolishness to him, but we have the mind of Christ, the Holy spirit person.

And so for that reason, really only the Christian can truly glorify God in our music by doing it, not only excellently, uh, in terms of beautiful aesthetic, it being well done, but then also based on the truth of his word, exalting a magnifying Christ as in accordance with the scriptures.

Yeah, no, so true. So many songs come to mind too, to where, you know, the love of a woman, a horrible thing that happened in my life. And you sing, these are a shadow of the truth. They're biblical truths.

God made man and woman and all those things, but an unbeliever truly can't understand those. And then in turn, like you said, with righteousness and justice, truly glorify God in those. So, um, yeah, right on, uh, let's shift gears here as we, uh, start to put bookends on this episode.

Uh, I had some, uh, listeners, uh, tag me and say, Hey, if you're having Tim on, could you ask him a few questions? Now, if you don't have answers for these say, yeah, I don't know. I'm sure. Um, or if you don't even want to answer him, that's fine too.

Um, but I said, I would ask them, uh, Noah wing on Twitter says, uh, where's he at? Is the PCA a denomination with a clean outside of the cup and a filthy inside, or have there been drastic improvements since 2018 ish.

So there's some, there's some, uh, stuff baked into that question. He's assuming some things, but, um, what do you think, what are your thoughts on that? Cause.