Next Week: SJW's, Victims, & Sheologians

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00:39

Hey, what's up, guys? Welcome back to Next Week with Jeff Durbin. I'm Jeff Durbin, and let's get right into it.

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So we have a special guest on the show today. He's one of my favorites. He is a pastor at Christ Church in Moscow, Idaho, not

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Russia, Moscow, Idaho, where they've received now a record snowfall. Hey, tell me about how the global warming's working,

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Toby Sumter. Yeah, well, thanks for having me on the show. And yeah, February has loaded us with a hundred -year record of snowfall, like way over 60 inches or something.

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That's amazing. That's amazing. Well, I can't - I thought you all should join us. Yeah, I can't relate. No, everything's just Arizona desert here.

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And actually, we're heating up. I think we're in the 80s next week, possibly. So yeah, and that's why we all live here. So hey, guys, if you haven't got a chance to check out

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Toby Sumter yet, make sure you do so. I would check him out on YouTube. Check out wherever you can get his stuff.

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Let me just do that now. Just get out of the way, Toby. Where can people go to get your stuff? You can find me at my blog, tobyjsumter .com.

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I am also involved with CrossPolitik, the podcast and show, crosspolitik .com.

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And Christkirk, Christkirk .com is the homepage for Christ Church here in Moscow.

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Awesome. So hey, Toby, I wanted to have you on because I think it's important for us as ministers of the gospel to engage with cultural issues, the things that are happening around us, and not just pithy things.

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And I want to talk about, there's a popular movement, social justice warriors, people who are talking about quote -unquote justice in a really peculiar way.

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There's a popular view of being a victim. That seems very popular today. And you gave a talk recently on that whole concept of being a victim.

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And you talked about how we have a perfect victim, Jesus. So bring us into that discussion,

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Toby. I think that you're the best guy to do it. Wow, well, I don't know about that, but I will give it my best shot.

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I would, you know, we can look at something as recent as the Jussie Smollett incident.

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Okay. Many people have been following that as this crazy situation where a guy apparently staged his own assault.

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Right. The facts are still coming in, and it's a little bit, a little hard to read, but at least the initial read is that this guy staged his own assault.

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And I think that's a great example, though, of actually pointing out what's going on in our culture. Somebody thought that they would be, they would get some kind of benefit from being a victim.

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Right. And so they staged their own victimization, perhaps, is what it looks like.

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Right. And so I think even that setup is a great example of, so somebody thought this would actually help them.

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Somebody thought this would be useful. Use the word social justice warrior, social justice movement. One of the key terms that's being thrown around in some of the literature, and I think it's getting a little more popular, is the word intersectionality.

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That's right. What's that mean? Intersectionality is this idea that depending on how much you've been victimized, you sort of score extra points.

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And so if you think of it in terms of intersections, you might have different layers of victimhood.

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And so if you're female and not male, you're not part of,

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I don't know, the dominant sex, even though there's more women in the world than men, but don't let that bother you, then you're victimized because you're female.

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But also, if you're a black female, you're not part of the dominant white culture, so you're even more of a victim.

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And if you're a black female lesbian, then you've been triply victimized and so on.

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And so there's various ways of basically trying to count up victim points. That's right. And the more victim points you have, this ultimately kind of goes back to a very materialistic view of the world, but such that every time you hear the word empower, you ought to spit.

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And the reason is because the whole idea of empowering is the idea of trying to, in some way, it's

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Marxist, it's materialist. And the idea is that you've been gypped, you've been ripped off by the culture, and we need to give you that power back.

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And which basically results in a high priest culture. Okay. And the high priest is those who have the most victim points.

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This goes all the way back, ultimately, though, to the Garden of Eden. Really? God, you know, there's sin enters the world,

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God shows up and says, what happened? And Adam says, it's the woman you gave me.

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Yeah. He immediately plays the victim. Yep. It's not my fault, it's not my responsibility.

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This woman, and he blames God, right? This woman you gave me. He plays the victim card, trying to somehow manipulate

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God. I mean, this is crazy. But in some way, trying to avoid his sin.

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We see the same thing with Cain and Abel. Right after Cain kills his brother, God shows up and says, where's your brother?

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And Cain says, I don't know. Why should I know where my brother is? That's right.

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Am I my brother's keeper? And immediately, again, evades responsibility and is playing the victim.

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I'm just ignorant, I don't know what's going on. Why are you blaming me? And so I think running through the story of the

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Bible and then running through, I think, the rest of history, there's this sinful instinct that we have to evade responsibility, claim victim status.

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The problem is, is that none of us are actually innocent. We all are guilty of some sin, even when we are actual victims in some sense.

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We've all sinned, and the wages of sin is death. And the thing that I've wanted to point out to Christians in particular is that I think there's a, we need to be aware that we are tempted to play the victim card too.

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And we need to refuse it, because every offer to play the victim card is ultimately as an offer to lure us away from Jesus.

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But Jesus is the only perfect victim in the history of the world.

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He was sinless, and he freely offered his own life in place of all of us sinners.

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And I think in many ways, that's actually why we like to play the victim, why people are tempted to play the victim, because we wanna be like Jesus.

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And ultimately, we want to be our own Jesus. And so we wanna, we try to earn victim points as an attempt to justify our existence, an attempt to justify why we act the way we do.

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Well, I was victim. I had to yell at my daughter because I was so tired and I got fired that day.

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Or I had to lie, because, you know, and we justify. Right. But we can't save ourselves, we can't justify ourselves, because ultimately, we deserve death.

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We deserve the death penalty, because we're sinners. The wages of sin is death. God in his grace offers

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Jesus. Jesus willingly offers himself. And so, and he's a perfect, innocent victim.

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He's the Lamb of God, who takes away the sin of the world. That's right. What this does is completely turns the whole victim culture on its head.

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And so you get Paul saying crazy things like this in Romans 8, where he says, for as it is written, for your sake, we are killed all the day long.

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We are like sheep for the slaughter. That's pretty victimized. And he says, but in all these things, we are more than conquerors through him who loved us.

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And then he goes on to say, I'm persuaded that neither death nor life or angels or principalities or things present or things to come may, are able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus, our

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Lord. And so, I think this is just a wonderful word to Christians, don't take the bait, don't take the victimhood.

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And even in the sense that you are like sheep gone to slaughter, God says, steward, steward that.

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If you're in Christ, then you have nothing but gratitude, joy, because your sins have been taken away.

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And now in Christ, you now have actually been given a status of conqueror and rather than victim.

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That's powerful, man. So Toby, what do we do in the situation before us where we have people faking victimization, people learning whole college courses on how to be the perfect victim and how to find out how and where you are a victim and sort of putting up on a pedestal all the victims and celebrating the victimhood and all the rest, the

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Me Too movement and all the rest. How do we address that in a way that's healthy, that's biblical, that's just, in a way that doesn't go the way of the evangelicals that act like God's justice and his law doesn't really matter today.

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God's not concerned with justice today. Because you see the problem is, is like you have on the one side, people with social justice warrior mindsets that really have a perverse view of justice and victimhood.

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But then you have, of course, God's law, which is the perfect law. His God's standard of his own character.

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It's the disclosure of his own character. It's his own standard of justice. And God's law does have a focus upon victims' rights in God's law.

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It's a big concern for God. And it is, of course, today, it's a concern for God. He's not changing. And so God does have actually a perfect concern for justice today and for victims.

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So how do we actually address this in a way that's actually whole, meaningful, coherent, and biblical in light of the fact that you have

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Christians today, people that love God and love his word, that'll say, you know, God's not concerned today with standards of justice.

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He's not concerned with justice in society. But then you have the polar opposite view of people who go the social justice warrior, the neo -Marxist way, and they start doing things like Me Too and all the rest.

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How do we actually have a balanced view? Yeah, well, I think, so we wanna lead, we wanna start with the gospel and we wanna lead with the gospel.

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But I think what we need to do is we need to read the whole Bible and we need to read what the Bible actually says about the gospel.

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And what the Bible says about the gospel is that God was establishing justice in the cross.

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Yes. And so we have to start there. And it's really important that we start there because otherwise when we move on to talk about applying justice in the world, we'll get it upside down and backwards, even if we are all about the

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Old Testament. But if we start at the cross, we need to recognize that in the cross, God was dealing justice.

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And he was establishing justice in the world. He did justice by paying the penalty that our sin deserved.

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And it was not one ounce more and it was not one ounce less than what needed to be paid.

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It was perfect and complete justice for the perfect and complete remission of the sins of God's people.

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But when God does that and he sets us back up on our feet and he washes us clean and he clothes us in the righteousness of Jesus or what we could call the justice of Jesus, we're not just saved to stand out here in the cold in Idaho or out there in the heat in Arizona.

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We're clothed in the righteousness of Jesus in order to become ambassadors of his righteousness.

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Second Corinthians five, Paul says that he who knew no sin became sin for us so that we might become the righteousness of God in Christ.

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And he's talking in that episode in that section, particularly about the ministry of the gospel, which proclaims the wonderful justice in the cross, but then also proclaims the righteousness of God in us.

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And so Ephesians two is another place where he says that we were saved by faith, through grace, that faith is not of yourself.

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It is a gift of God so that no one can boast. And then he says, for we are his workmanship created in Christ Jesus for good works.

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And so we're not saved by good works, but we are saved to good works. And good works are just works, righteous works.

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And so when God saves us, deals with our sin, he establishes us in this world and he gives us particular callings.

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And those callings are things like father, husband, mother, wife, child, student, teacher, a business owner, pastor, elder, governor, judge, police officer.

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He gives us these assignments in this world to do good, to do right.

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And so I would say back to the original question, absolutely there's ditches. There's a certain kind of mainline evangelical ditch that says,

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I'm all about Jesus and the cross and getting saved. And I can't be bothered with worrying about culture and politics and justice.

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And justice, yeah. And then there's the other side that says, but there's wrong. And so me too, and victim, and the social justice warrior stuff.

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And so the answer to it is the gospel. And in the gospel, we find that God saves us to good works.

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He gives us particular assignments. And so what we need to do is go back to the Bible and say, I'm a dad. So how do

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I work out justice in my home as a dad? I'm a mom. I need to read the Bible and find out how do

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I deal out justice as a Christian mom in my household? I'm a pastor, I'm an elder, I'm a deacon.

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I'm a civil magistrate. I'm a police officer. I'm a captain, I'm a whatever you are.

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And so there are standards of justice that God gives us, but all of that is built on the cross where God made us right with him.

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Awesome. Man, that's awesome, Toby. Dude, thank you. Hey, just give you this. Let's address this.

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Why do social justice warriors suck? Why does neo -Marxism suck? Because they don't actually care about justice.

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Well, that's weird. It's in the name, dude. It says social justice warrior. Yeah, they're liars. Yeah. Here's how you know they don't care about justice because what they're actually interested in is mobs.

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And mobs don't establish justice. And so what the Bible requires is two or three witnesses.

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The witnesses must be cross -examined. Right, right. There needs to be due process.

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False witnesses need to be punished with the very same punishment that would have happened to those they were falsely accusing.

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Yes, yes, yes, yes. And so when we fail to do those things, what we find out is people who don't care about that don't really care about the truth.

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And if they don't really care about the truth, they don't really care about justice, which means they don't really care about protecting and helping real victims.

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And so that's my problem with them is they suck because they don't care about people who have actually been wronged and harmed.

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Yeah. And God who made us and God who made this world understands our proclivities, understands sin, and gave the law to us so that we would know how to do justice and how to do righteousness in this world, how to protect the innocent, how to defend the voiceless, and how to execute justice on those that have done evil.

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And so they don't really care about justice because they don't care about actually establishing truth carefully.

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They're just mobs with pitchforks and no real victim should trust them. Yeah, that's right.

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And I assure everybody watching right now, this is, I'm sure, the very first time you've ever heard two pastors talking about how much social justice warriors suck.

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So, yeah. All right, guys, Toby Sumter, Christ Church, Moscow, Idaho. Make sure you guys get to know him, download his stuff, listen to him.

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Toby, we'll catch you again on another episode, I'm sure, brother. Thank you for joining us today. Thanks so much, Jeff. Absolutely. All right, guys, thank you so much.

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Stay with us. Be right back after these commercials. ♪ Don't you worry about a thing ♪ ♪

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We were born to break ♪ All right, guys, welcome back.

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Welcome back to Next Week at Jeff Durbin. I'm Jeff Durbin. That's Luke the Bear. That's Joy the Girl. And that is Summer Yeager.

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Yes. Yes. So these two over here do a show called Sheologians. You guys can get that at sheologians .com.

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And we're here today talking about some important stuff. So what should we talk about? Should we talk about how Summer doesn't actually fit in her seat?

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And - Well, you should probably clarify that. I fit in the seat. It's because her legs are short, not that she's like too big for the seat. I need a pillow.

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Yeah, sorry, let me try that again. Let's restart the show. No. We had to put a pillow behind Summer so that her feet would touch the floor.

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Okay. No, don't leave, Zach. Don't leave. We had to put a pillow there so her feet fit the,

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I almost said fit the floor. It's been a long day. Yeah, it's been a really long day. We're glad you guys all joined us live here on Facebook.

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Make sure you guys hit all the buttons and share everything. So we were just on talking to Toby Sumter and it was great, great interview.

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He's a beast. He is a beast. He is. Not like in a bad way. Not like in a

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Nebuchadnezzar kind of way. Healthy way. He's a healthy beast. Kind of beastly way. I love his blog. Yeah, his blog.

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I've actually never read it. You have to. I just listen to his sermons. Oh. The message that you talked to him that inspired that interview was really, really good.

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Straight fire. Yeah, absolutely. What's the name of the message again? I don't remember. Never mind. It actually had a weird, no, it was a weird title.

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It was like building a godly city or something. Yeah, it was, yes.

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But I think that was it. You wouldn't think it had anything to do with that talk. Okay. Yeah. Right on. Hey, so what do you want to talk about today?

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I know what I want to talk to them about. Well, yeah. Well, since we talked about victimhood with Toby, I actually have a fun, a little fun victimhood news story.

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Is this a Your Mom joke? It's not. Okay. Not a Your Mom joke. This is a real story.

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So you guys are all familiar with Hezbollah. Hezbollah. I'm sorry? Hezbollah. Hezbollah.

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Hezbollah. You know, tomato, tomato. Hezbollah. Hezbollah. Hezbollah.

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He said Hezbollah. I'm nervous. Hezbollah. Hezbollah. Hezbollah. Hezbollah. I'm not familiar with what you're talking about.

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This is not fair because your dad's like an expert on Islam, so. Oh my gosh. That doesn't mean. Okay. And there's a backslide for that,

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I think. So. Hezbollah. Whatever you want to call it. Yes. So we all know that they're a terrorist organization.

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Can we agree on that? Sure. Okay. So Britain actually just recently, I just saw this today.

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Britain classified them, finally, as a terrorist organization. Good on you, Britain. It's already been like that in the

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U .S. for a while. But they plan to ban all wings of it in England. So this is a real response from whatever you want to call them.

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They said it's an. Hezbollah wings? It's an insult. That sounds like a Buffalo Wild Wings new flavor.

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Hezbollah wings. Hezbollah wings. Did you?

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They are really spicy. They will kill you, they're so hot. No, they said it's an insult to the feelings and sympathies in the will of the

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Lebanese people that consider Hezbollah, Hezbollah. Hezbollah. Hezbollah, Hezbollah.

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Again, whatever you want to call it. Anyways, their feelings were hurt. That they were called a terrorist.

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That they were called a terrorist organization. Sure. Feelings, so now they're like terror flakes.

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Did they actually say that though? No, they really said that. Terror flakes. They're terror flakes, yeah. So they have feelings and they got hurt.

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They matter too. Because they matter too. Well, that's the number one sin. This is the victimhood conversation.

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And that's perfect. See, it's up to you to find the perfect connection point. I just can't say the name right, but you know. Yeah, the perfect connection point.

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If you could just work on the pronunciation. But the connection point is perfect. We're talking about victims. I mean, it did, the way you're pronouncing it does sound like Ebola, which also kills a lot of people.

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That's what I was saying. That's what I was saying. I was thinking vaccines. Did I get my Hezbollah vaccine? Yeah. Stop, you don't want to hurt their feelings.

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It's just a measles, changes the functioning of your body. Hezbollah. You can't talk about vaccines. I'm not here to talk about vaccines.

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That's the next plague, yeah, the Hezbollah virus. Yeah, yeah. So anyways, that was my story.

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I just found it interesting that they have feelings too. Yes, that's good. That's an interesting standard they live by.

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That's right. It must. Yeah, I mean, apparently the people they're chopping their heads off. People that they like to create victims don't also want to be that victim.

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Yeah, well, they also feel like that's okay. Yes. So, interesting. So, they need a victim too.

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Speaking of Hezbollah, and the vaccine. And the virus. And all that. And everything else.

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The terror it brings. The two, yes, the two of you spend a lot of time doing a radio program called

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Sheologians, a podcast, Sheologians. And you guys talk a lot about intersectionality and the

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SJWs and all those things. But you guys do it, I think, in a much better way than you see often with the conservative talk shows and things like that, radio programs, and those clips you see online where people sort of just diss sort of the whininess of the

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SJWs. The conservative channels will always diss the whininess of the SJWs. Sort of just general mockery.

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Some of it well -deserved, and it's fun to watch. But you guys are examining it from a more biblical perspective.

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And you're doing it as two Christian women, young women, who are engaged in this culture that is obsessed with being victims and intersectionality.

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So, let's have that conversation. Well, I think that like you mentioned, sort of the conservative group that reports on whiny

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SJWs tends to be of a certain age. And so, to them, like millennials and social justice warriors are just kind of whiny.

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They're like, you've never had to work a physical labor job. You've never had, like it's an experience that they just can't possibly understand.

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So, to them, they're just like, they're ungrateful, they're entitled. Everything that every older generation has thought about every younger generation ever in the history of everything.

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But it really is a lot more than that. Being a victim is, it's like a currency in our day and age.

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Like you, if power has been taken from you or if something's been done to you, it sort of gives you this like card that lets you do and substantiate anything that you want to do.

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Which like terrorism, they've taken, they're like, oh, we do what we want.

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It's like, we're a group of people. We don't, we have our own subjective view of what's right.

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We think we can kill people and that's all fine. And our feelings are hurt.

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Yeah. It's similar. It doesn't really matter what you do. You can kill your baby.

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You can assume and slander. You can assume people's thoughts and intentions and meaning in what they're saying.

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You can do whatever you want. And as long as you're a victim, that's okay. Well, victimhood language is historically also a predictor of genocide.

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So if you look back at the genocide that happened in Ukraine around the 1920s, which this isn't really taught in schools because it's not popular, the way that the government was able to essentially starve 20 million of its people and shift power massively was to convince the younger generation that the farmers that were producing the food were making them victims.

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So because the farmers had all the wealth, they were able to convince the younger generation that they were being victimized by the farmers.

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So in turn, the younger generation supported the government coming in and taking the farms. And of course, when the government runs something, it runs as well as the

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DMV. And so the farmers died out and the land starved.

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Over 20 million people were starved out. You see the same thing in Nazi Germany, the victimhood language of the

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Jews are, they're taking all your stuff. They're making you victims. Well, now we can kill the Jews.

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And you see the same thing with abortion. The unborn baby is going to ruin your chances at life, essentially making you a victim of this thing that happened to you.

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And so therefore we can take the baby's life. So a lot of people, I think, have a very sanitized view of victimhood language.

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They think that they're speaking this way out of a care and a concern. But if you're not using

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God's standards to look at right and wrong, you can use victimhood language to really harm people. So it's popular today to be a social justice warrior.

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It's popular today to take courses, whole college courses, to train you to become a professional victim and to complain and you get extra points for how many different parts of victimhood you can claim for yourself.

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And it's the popular thing to be a part of that whole movement. Tell us about intersectionality.

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What exactly is interesting? Because there's a word thrown around. A lot of times people, I think, see it and see it a lot in conservative posts talking about it, but don't really understand what is it?

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Okay, so Kimberly Crenshaw was a critical theorist.

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She's a feminist and she did not believe that there were enough voices within feminism that were talking about feminism that wasn't white.

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And so she came up with this idea. If you imagine that your different identities that you can claim.

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So the only identity you can claim, well, is white and male. We get zero victim points, right?

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You're getting ahead of me. You're getting ahead of me. So typically your identities are gonna be around your gender, your race, your sexual orientation.

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And if you imagine these as a road, you're going down the road with your whiteness.

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I'm sorry, let's say blackness or person of colorness. You're going down the road, but you're also going down the road with another identity and that is your femaleness.

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So where this identity is going, but then your femaleness identity is going, where it crosses is an intersection.

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And when you have this intersection, you have to look out for more cars coming to hit you than someone who doesn't have this intersection.

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And that was Crenshaw's, that was the actual like analogy that she used. And so essentially it demands that we view people through a social identity and that we understand them as people who we cannot understand their experience.

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We cannot under, if you don't have that same intersection, you don't have the pain or the knowledge or the experience that those people naturally have.

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And so when we talk about, if you buy into intersectionality, which I would argue is actually a religion, because if you have privilege, that's the original sin of privilege, it has priests, you're not allowed to question.

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If you have a certain amount of intersections, you are imbued with knowledge that the rest of us don't have because we don't experience that intersection.

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So you're a priest, you cannot be questioned. There's all kinds of other things that would make me argue that it's actually a religion.

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So let's say the transgender, people that want to, if they're biologically male, but they feel as though they're a female.

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So that's an intersection they experienced that we don't. When they want to compete in sports. So let's say a biological male wants to compete in female sports.

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Intersectionality would essentially argue that because we don't understand that person's intersection, we don't understand their lived experience, which is the height of all knowledge, the lived experience that cannot be questioned.

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We cannot understand that person's life or their perspective.

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And if you question their lived experience, you are denying them as a person.

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That's why you'll see the transgender community arguing that when we do not see them for what they say they are, we are denying their very existence because we're denying their experience and your experience, your comprised experiences define who you are.

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So that's why the religion of intersectionality is why you cannot question someone's lived experience.

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You cannot question if a man who feels like a female is a female or not because you haven't experienced it.

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Does that make sense? Absolutely. So when you guys are engaging with this world of thought from a

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Christian perspective, how do you actually engage it? Not merely from a conservative talk show perspective, but how do you engage this world of thought from a

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Christian perspective? What's wrong with it? Well, I mean, for me, the pretty basic idea, she just said, what makes you is your experiences and a collection of social identities, which obviously we reject.

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We believe that obviously people are like a complex combination of things.

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Like we don't deny that there are different skin colors and two different genders.

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And of course we have these little things that make us different from one another, but if intersectionality is a religion, and I agree, that religion teaches that the identity that you should seek is in yourself.

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And obviously we know that that leads to death. Well, an intersectionality demands the sin of partiality.

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It demands that you can only know yourself and others through your ethnicity, your income, your social standing.

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So as Christians, we are not supposed to treat people according to their ethnicity, their social status, their income.

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We are supposed to treat people based on the fact that they're made in the image of God and God has commanded us to love them.

33:21

But if you do not treat someone with partiality, then you are not, you're anathema.

33:31

You have to view people through the lens of all of these identities that we wouldn't even,

33:38

I wouldn't consider your ethnicity, your identity. I wouldn't consider your income, your identity, whether you're poor or you're rich, and we're commanded not to treat people according to these things.

33:51

But intersectionality demands that you may only understand yourself and other people.

33:57

So there's a lie that's propagated at the beginning of these movements, and that's like, we're looking for fairness. We're looking for just fairness, when that's in reality not what you get when you actually move through these things apart from the word of God.

34:10

The fundamental fairness in God's law brings fundamental fairness, like real fairness, equality, justice, those sorts of things.

34:19

But these movements always tend to take somebody, some group, some class, and to put them under the shoes of somebody else.

34:25

Like you said, and it's interesting, that's power. That's a powerful way to look at that, that it really is.

34:31

Yeah, well, and ultimately, the way that they achieve justice is by redistributing power.

34:37

So if the amount of power you're given or as valuable as your group is recognized, that is a part of your identity.

34:47

So if, for example, we're kind of split down the middle of the set today, historically, men have had it better than women.

34:58

So it sounds innocent enough for us to say, well, maybe we should make sure that the rights that you guys have are the same rights that we have.

35:08

And there are certain things that, of course, we would agree with, things that are actually just, anything that would involve,

35:16

I mean, you know, there are people that cite old laws where men were allowed to do whatever they wanted to their wife and it was fine.

35:23

Of course, those things, like, you know, if there's justice and making whole of a victim, then that's a different topic.

35:32

But actually what intersectionality is doing is it's assuming an inherent injustice.

35:41

There is a problem that we can maybe trace systemically. And so in order for us to be as valuable as you, there are things that we deserve.

35:58

Like, so the ultimate freedom that you guys have according to feminists is that you'll never have to be a wife and you'll never have to be a mother.

36:06

So if we can remove, so a wife is somewhat easy, right? Like just don't get married, which it worked because here we are and a lot of people aren't married.

36:17

A lot of women are promiscuous and it's fine.

36:23

That's what men have been allowed to do. Why not women? But it's obviously quite a bit harder and you have to have a severe ignorance of biology to take away the ability to have children.

36:34

So abortion is obviously the, it is the intersectionality.

36:41

It is their way of redistributing power to women because not having to have children means that you can get a higher paying job.

36:50

You can have a further education. You can have your, because you're a man, you have access to all these rights apparently.

36:57

Yeah, so abortion becomes the holy right of intersectionality. So, and that's an extreme example, but it is an example that we're seeing every day in this country.

37:06

Well, I mean, it's simple. If you take it away from the emotional abortion argument, you would never argue that fairness would be a white man stole from a black man.

37:19

What would make that fair? Well, if the white man gave it back, but with affirmative action and with these mindsets, what they're trying to do to make it fair is, okay, the white man stole from the black man.

37:31

So now we're gonna steal from the white man. Well, now everybody loses. And so if you, no one would say, well, the logical thing to do in this stealing situation is to do more stealing.

37:42

But ultimately things like affirmative action, abortion, all of these things, that's what they argue for.

37:47

They don't argue for things that are actually fair, things that are actually just. But it sounds nice to those who don't like what's happening to the people they identify with to be like, oh, you stole from me.

38:01

Well, now let's steal from you. It's Lord of the Flies. It's law and justice. Well, like, and there's obviously, and this has been debunked so many times that a lot of people aren't even talking about it, but of course there's like the age old wage gap thing.

38:18

The myth, the myth of the wage gap. So the thing, the truth is, is that like, so if there's a man and a woman that occupy the same position and a woman starts a family, she is going to take maternity leave.

38:31

She is going to very naturally and biologically have an affinity for her children and want to raise them and take care of them.

38:38

That is not a social construct. And so in that instance, it's not fair that she can't earn, she can't earn the same amount as the man doing the same job.

38:52

So in this perfect social justice world, the woman who works less hours at the same job as the man should earn the same because it's not fair.

39:04

She has things stacked against her like motherhood. Because motherhood ultimately is what keeps you from being a man.

39:12

Your biology is what keeps you from being a man. And it's at the cost of killing a child that you have to maintain that.

39:19

That's the redistribution there. It gets crazy. Obviously, paying someone who works less the same as someone who works the standard amount of hours, that's company, that's not, that is wrong.

39:32

That's wrong, it's not just. That's a violation to the company itself even. Right, yes. But what they should be able to get for what they're paying.

39:38

Yeah, and so it seems like some of it doesn't seem quite as extreme as abortion and people will say, oh, well, it's really not that bad.

39:44

But every single instance where when you're looking at,

39:50

I would say that the biggest goal of people who are in support of intersectionality is that redistribution.

40:00

It has to happen for things to be made right. And who knows how far that goes, really.

40:07

Because ultimately, if you make your own identity and you create your own value, and also you're the arbiter of how someone apologizes to you and how victorious you feel and how victimized you feel, then you could just keep going back forever and saying, well, now

40:26

I want your life. That's what's gonna make me feel better. Like, is all the men being dead? That's how

40:32

I'm gonna feel better about being a woman. You know, and it's just, it doesn't, there's not, it's run by people who are selfish and constantly bowing before the idol of themselves.

40:44

And it just, like, it won't get less crazy. It's interesting, because it's the madness of, like, we adopt an evolutionary perspective of the universe, and so we say that our ancestors were just stuff, like goop, bacteria, then fish, then apes, then here we are.

41:00

And so now here we're in this world, floating through the universe with nothing above us, no justice, no God, no ultimate standards, and so we gotta figure all this out.

41:08

But still, they have this yearning for there's a right and there's a truth and there's a justice and there's something more to us than just protoplasm on the surface of this rock, like, and so let's just, let's not go to Jesus for the answers.

41:21

Let's go to ourselves. And so when we say let's not go to Jesus, let's go to ourselves, we can't even say he has a penis, she has a vagina, that's a man, that's a woman.

41:33

We can't, so now we say, well, no, not really. I mean, if he has that, it's just an appendage.

41:39

I mean, it's not, like, identifying biologically, and then they go, oops, no, it is, but nevermind.

41:45

Never you mind, it doesn't matter if it's a. Well, and then you created, then you have to create gender and sexual identity are two separate different things.

41:52

Gender, sex, and orientation are no longer cohesive. Right, right. And it's not natural for women to have kids.

41:59

Right, yes, yes. Like, it's only a few select women that are built to have children. Exactly, exactly.

42:04

That's only, like, it's a total, that's how people think of it. And it's strange, too, because it's interesting.

42:11

I've been seeing over, over, over, it was your dad that, I think, in 2002, three,

42:17

I just kept hearing him talk all the time about, like, he's keeping a folder on his computer of, like, cultural decay, moral decay, and, like, we're on the fast track.

42:25

And I remember, and I've talked to your dad about this, I was like, I don't know that I really listened to you or believed you. I was like, no, maybe not that fast.

42:32

And it's happened much faster than I even imagined. And your dad tells me, he's like, I don't know if I believe myself. Because it happens so quickly.

42:39

Like, we're seeing, like, I'm seeing advertisements for things, like, you're a man, you want to breastfeed your child?

42:47

Well, here's this fake breast, and you can put milk in it, and you can breastfeed your child.

42:52

And it's like, how perverse is all this? Because it's interesting, from a

42:58

Christian worldview, you know, this culture today, social justice warriors, people who buy into all this garbage and nonsense and just stupidity, they want to war against the biblical worldview and the

43:08

Christian view of things, like, that's a man and that's a woman. Well, how do you know? Well, he has a penis, she has a vagina. Like, the sex difference there, like, and they want to war against that and say, well,

43:16

I don't like the male identity and, like, the man having a responsibility that's different than the woman, and that that being a good thing.

43:22

Like, we should celebrate that. It's good, it's great. It doesn't mean he's better. It's just what God gave him. That's what he's supposed to be like, right?

43:28

Like, protect his family. Like, it's good that he does that and not the woman. It's great that he's the one that should be the defender and the protector and the provider.

43:36

Like, that's a great thing. It's a beautiful thing. It doesn't mean that he's better than her. No, exactly. It means that's what

43:41

God said. I made you like this so that you take care of, and then guess what? There's elements to a female, specifically a mother, for example, that are glorious and you should celebrate that the guy's not like that.

43:56

Like, I personally think, and this is not just me saying it because I'm a Christian and I believe the Christian worldview. I think, because I have four children, my wife had all these children and breastfed them and loved them.

44:06

There were things that she would do with them and ways that she would nurture them that I'm like, praise God that they have her.

44:13

Praise God that they have her because I'm not really like that. And they need that so badly.

44:19

Like, I look at my grandson now and I see the way that my son is and his wife is, and I see just the distinctives between the two of them and the beauty of her as a woman and a mother.

44:30

It is so precious and beautiful and amazing. And not that my son even is not a loving and devoted father and nurturing.

44:37

It's just that the mom and the woman is so precious and amazing and wonderful. And it's amazing because the world looks at that now and is like, no, no, that's icky.

44:46

We don't want that. He needs to be able to do the same thing. And what I think is that's just so stupid.

44:52

It's so stupid. Like, the suggestion there is that, like at what point did Sage and Hope go to male and female class?

44:59

Did they ever go to that? So what you have to do when, like when you're in this vein of thought, you have to take things that are natural and make them into a social construct.

45:11

Because if they're natural, then that means that you can't do anything about it. It's hardwired into our biology.

45:17

But if it's a social construct, that means that we can lobby and we can petition and we can change things and we can make a little device that a guy uses to breastfeed.

45:28

He's not breastfeeding. He's pretending to breastfeed his child. Like you can't, that's like, that's it.

45:35

Like, it's so important that we call stuff out like that, because that is just like, that's the most insidious part of it is that stuff that is natural, that we know is natural, is being called a societal build.

45:48

But isn't it wrong that you have, in the Christian world, do you, say for example, like elders, pastors, like they're there to have authority, say within the church.

45:59

And there's explicit statements of a woman's not supposed to exercise authority over a man. But doesn't that make her now less than the man?

46:07

Doesn't that make her somehow like substandard kind of human? Doesn't that make her on the bottom of the man's foot?

46:14

Like, isn't that the Christian worldview really? It's just really just men ruling women. When people talk about - No, we're the glory of men.

46:20

We're told that. We're told that. It's funny because whenever people talk about that passage specifically, what

46:27

I instantly think of is also like right there in that same passage is the command for women to be modest.

46:34

And you don't hear a lot of Christian women going, well, God didn't tell me to like, that just makes me less.

46:42

Like, why is there a different role for me? Like, why am I being given? Like also in that same book, he gives women this specific warning to not be idle and gossipers.

46:52

And so it's like, he's giving a word to women specifically. He's saying, look, I know. And this is how

46:58

I made you. And it's not - I know what you're like. Yeah, and it's not anything against, it's like if when your kids sin, it's not like you're like, you just know, like you're a sinner and I hate you.

47:11

You give them little warnings. You know what their propensities are. And so it's so funny because there's stuff that people, like that passage just, it angers women.

47:25

And honestly, we don't even realize how much we've all grown up with this feminist line of thought, which is that there is a disparity with, if you can't do the same things, it means you're less than.

47:37

It doesn't mean you're different. It means that there is a, like a value difference. And that is because like everyone in this room, people at our church, we're to the point where we've all grown up with feminist psychology.

47:50

A lot of us were public schooled and that's like what we learned. And we don't even realize that that's what we, that's how we learn to evaluate worth.

48:01

I mean, I think it's, if it's good enough for Jesus, it's good enough for me.

48:07

I mean, Paul and you know, I mean. But that's pointing to your ultimate standard. I mean, what kind of a, what must you think of yourself if you view submission as a dirty word?

48:20

I mean, Christ submitted and humbled himself unto the cross. And then it was his glory.

48:28

And so our promise, Paul promises us in first Corinthians, that our glory is going to be found in our submission.

48:35

And if you're willing to look at what Christ did and be like, that's not good enough for me.

48:43

Your problem really isn't with anyone other than God. And so, you know, when

48:48

God, or when Paul talks, while God speaking through Paul, talks about the headship of man, you know how, what was the glory of glories in the

48:59

Old Testament? What was that? The glory of glories. Hey, are you talking about like.

49:05

I'm sorry, the holy of holies. The holy of holies. That's what I thought you were going. I was just saying holy of holies. What is that? That's the symbolize the presence of God.

49:12

Right, that was like the holiest place. And so in the Hebrew language, when you repeat words like that, you're emphasizing like, this is the most of the most.

49:21

Exclamation. Yes. So in that passage where Paul is talking about the headship of man and the submission of women and what that should look like, he talks about women in the same, that same structure as we are the glory of man.

49:39

Like you have, this is this glory, this is this glory, but women, they're up here, the glory of mankind.

49:48

And women miss that because that dirty word submission isn't there. So they hear that and they're like, oh, well this must say horrible things.

49:55

Or they hear they can't do something. This must say horrible things about women. But meanwhile, we're here to beautify and nurture and do all of these things that men cannot do.

50:05

Yeah. Men are not equipped to do. Right. So it's beautiful. And our culture would hear you say something like that if they didn't know the context that we're talking about right now.

50:14

And they would say, no, I don't like that. I don't like that there's something I can't do. Of course they don't, they hate God. I don't like that there's something that I can't be.

50:19

That's fine. Well, that's my point in bringing up modesty. Like if the Christian, if the faithful Christian hears a passage about modesty and goes, well,

50:26

I don't like that. What is the response to that person? Sorry, God commanded it.

50:32

He told you to be modest. So what? You've taken a very holy shot. And it's like right there next to women being in authority over men.

50:41

It's right there, but nobody wants to talk about that one. It's because it's so simple. But because of our weird feminist upbringing, we're making it more complicated than it really is.

50:50

She needs some head blowing. Shut your mouth. All right, so we're good with that, right?

50:57

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51:03

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51:13

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51:19

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