What came first the chicken or the egg

In the shotgun ground it's the full brick. My disciples blasphemy for the blasphemy with the protocol wracking me like a black city. So sane doesn't bother you. That's cause he already got you killing gotta rise and his enemies be scattered.

Boy you're looking at the victim. For the lord i give the credit to gospel affiliated woman. The apostle alliterated greed with the sword i put ahead of you. How many times will i forgive you. Times. Seven seven hundred and seventy.

Seven times seven still ignoring what the devil do. Stepping on his neck when the devil come and i catch him with divine weapons like.

Opening Banter and Technical Setup

All right what's up ladies and gentlemen. We are live welcome to open air theology. As you can see i am by myself. I fire the other two jokers. No for real though pastor haps had to do some counseling and we all know our local hero braden is a firefighter and so this is one of the thursday nights that he had to go and fight fires.

So y 'all be uh praying for pastor haps be praying for pastor braden. So my name is jeff. I am the pastor one of the pastors of covenant reform baptist church here in talahoma tennessee. So if you're ever in our area we'd love nothing more than to have you come worship our god and savior with us.

Framing the Question: Does Regeneration or Faith Come First?

So the the last time we were on live was two weeks ago and there seemed to be a little bit of confusion with um with the last portion that we talked about with faith and regeneration and stuff like that and so i kind of want to come back and revisit that.

And then we also received a message from a lady who did not understand our position with faith and and how it like our position with faith and regeneration and how that works with human responsibility and so we'll look at that at the very end i see brayden's watching.

So what's up pastor brayden. I love you brother. So let's get started and we'll just see how it rose. So i've kind of got some things set up different. If you was in my house you would know that i have a very small study desk but i have like three big huge desks that i use to work with like when my rebinding my bibles and so i'm kind of having to uh because i don't have enough room for my computer my ipad my phone which i'm watching for messages and to have a bible and this microphone keeps me from looking over at the bible really well so it's a struggle and so i got me a a you know one of those tv dinner trays i guess you would call it just something like you fold up if you got your if you got the couch and you can pull up and and eat.

So i got one of those pulled up next to me uh yeah with my bible. So i'm kind of trying to position myself a little different to where i can not to move the mic so much and i can read the scriptures. So first we just want to look at uh i know the title of it what came first the chicken or the egg and i feel like that's a lot of times what we're saying whenever we're talking about regeneration and faith and so the idea is what came what came first regeneration or faith.

Now there's going to be many who say that faith comes first faith comes before regeneration but uh those in my circle and i'm speaking about the reformed circle would say that that regeneration uh precedes faith that that regeneration comes first that regeneration is what brings about faith.

And so that's my stance and that's what i'm going to attempt to prove over here. So if you ask me what came first the chicken or the egg well it's the chicken all right what came first. The regeneration or faith.

Salvation by Grace Through Faith and the Gift of Faith

Uh regeneration now we are saved by grace through our faith. So our you know through our faith we are saved but we need to look at how is it that we are able to have this faith. So before we even read the scriptures and i probably mentioned this last week i just want to talk about faith for a minute.

So faith is not um i think in my opinion there's different levels of faith right. So like the faith that it took me to sit in this chair like it didn't really take a lot of faith right. It's it's it's a pretty expensive desk chair you know uh the two two hundred dollar range and uh you know it's got legs that will hold me.

I'm not that big of a guy it didn't take a lot of faith for me to relax and to get comfortable and sit down in this chair as i was bending my knees you know just to let it go right go else on it and um so now when we say faith that's not the kind of faith that we're talking about when it comes to a christian belief.

Um now let's say that there wasn't a chair here like there was no way that i could prove there was a chair and yet i went all elsa on it and let it go and you know like that's the kind of faith that we're speaking about with christianity because we're telling people that uh there was a man um i'm gonna try to lay this out as i'm not going to be very theological when i lay this out.

So we're telling people that that that a baby was born around 2 000 years ago and that this baby was actually deity that that that god entered earth through the and he embodied this child right. The creator entered creation the infinite became finite and that this child grew up in this life that he lived as he was growing up he lived in perfect obedience to the father and therefore him doing so is how you and i receive righteousness his his righteousness comes to us.

And that he and that he was put to death on a roman cross and that this death that he died was for our sins. So the life that he lived was uh was substitute for us and the death they died was a substitute for us.

But not only did he die but three days later he came about the grave proving to me who he said he was the great i am god yahweh. Okay. And that he walked around after his resurrection for 40 days and that he ascended into heaven and he is seated at the right hand of the father.

That's the message. Right. That that someone is to believe someone is to put their faith in someone is to put their faith and trust that the life that jesus lived he lived for them. And the death that jesus died was in their place.

All. Right. Listen what i just explained is something that i cannot prove. Right. Like there's well you can't say hey he's right over here. Let me go let me go introduce you to him. Right. It's a message by which we're saved.

Like like through this message you're either saved or you're not. The bible is very clear that those who believe this in their heart and profess this with their mouth that he is lord and that god raised him from the dead they shall be saved now.

Well no. And the bible is very clear that every one of us we have fallen in adam we have died with adam. That we're born god haters. We shake our fist at god we're masters of our own universe. Right. He man.

And uh um and then there comes a point to where you hear the gospel and you go from not believing not understanding to believing. And nothing could change your mind. Right. That's a different kind of faith.

That's a faith that we are not born with. This is christian faith. This is the message that christians are to proclaim. If if your church isn't proclaiming this message find another church. If you are a preacher and you're not proclaiming this message repent.

Read your bible. The message is that jesus christ lived the life we could not live died the death that we should die. And that. And that people are to believe in him. The believe that jesus is the christ the messiah that came down from heaven.

So how does somebody get that faith. Now i want to begin in ephesians and we'll look at verses eight and nine. And then we're going to circle back to verse one and kind of do a brief walk through all.

Right. So when you look at ephesians chapter eight i mean excuse me chapter two. Verse eight says this. For by grace you have been saved through faith. So the writer is speaking to the church at ephesus and he is telling them how they were saved.

For by grace. Grace is something that you don't deserve. For by grace you have been saved through faith. That you are saved through your faith right here. And this is not of your own doing. It is the gift of god.

So the nearest antecedent to the and this is not of your own doing it is the gift of god. Is faith all right. You're believing you're trusting this message of what jesus christ has done is not of your own doing.

It is the gift of god. You're believing in jesus christ is the gift of god. Like like i don't know what else you want me to say. Like i shouldn't even have to break this down exegetically it's plain and it's simple.

And yet and yet people say no i i when i believe then i'm saved. Well let's just look at it. Let's say the nearest antecedent was grace. And this is not of your own doing grace. What you're saved by is not of your own doing.

Well i agree with that too. You're not saved by your own. You're not saved by your own doing. You do not beg god to grace you. But it says. For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is the faith here is not of your own doing.

It is the gift of god. Now let's to verse one. Let's let's see how we were before the grace of god. And the faith came so in you still the same you that's in verse a. And you were and you have been saved.

Look at verse two. I mean chapter two verse one. And you same you same church same group of people were dead and your trespasses and sins in which you once walked following the course of this world following the prince and the power of the air the spirit that is now at work.

And the sons of disobedience among whom you once lived in the passions of your flesh carrying out the desires of the body and the mind and were at nature children of wrath like the rest of mankind. But god being rich in mercy mercy is you getting what you don't deserve.

But god being rich in mercy not giving you what you deserve but because of his own great love in which he loved us even when we were dead and our trespasses right here made us alive together with christ.

By grace you have been saved. And right here listen and raised up with him and seated us with him in the heavenly places in christ. Jesus when you are saved by grace through faith. This speaking right here of the first resurrection you and i are seated with christ in the heaven.

And some kind of a already not yet right. Peter speaks about it when he's talking about the inheritance of our resurrected bodies. So paul's not crazy verse seven. So that in the coming ages he might show the immeasurable riches of his grace and kindness toward us in christ.

For right here by grace you who were dead in your trespasses and sins walking according to the flesh the sons of disobedience. For by grace you have been saved through faith. Remember faith is not of your own doing it is the gift of god not a result of works.

So no one can boast. So this faith that you have when i believe that you're given by the grace of god it's given to you so that you cannot boast so that you cannot say yeah. I believed i believed good for me.

I'm a good old boy all right. So let's real quickly go to the gospel of john. Let's look at chapter six and don't be throwing no calvinist card at me because i'm not even talking about calvinism. I'm talking about regeneration regeneration.

Remember earlier i was talking about you know faith being the work of god. And and john chapter six verse 28. So jesus had been had fed the multitude with bread. Man with bread and fish. A miracle took place.

There wasn't enough bread. There wasn't enough fish. Jesus provided he he uh he stretched the loaves. He stretched the fish. Like i get it just it. Sometimes it makes me think you know like i was working in construction.

So i did roofing for 25 years we used to mess with uh with uh the newcomers. I know i was messed with when i first started. But you know like go get the shingle stretcher or you know something like that.

But but jesus you know he took the portion that they had and he and he made these these few loaves and i think it was one or two fish. I haven't i don't feel like going through and reading reading it.

But um this few loaves and just very little fish. And he took it and he was able to feed thousands of people. And so these men come to him and they say they said to him verse 28 what must we do to be doing the works of god.

So they see jesus doing a work of god and they want to be able to do it. They want to be able to do what jesus is doing. Jesus answered verse 29. This is the work of god that you believe in him whom he has sent believing in jesus christ is the work of god.

And yet we see in ephesians chapter 2 that this belief this faith is given to us. It's granted to us. And i don't have this in my notes. But i know everyone knows it go. You know romans chapter 10 verse 17.

So faith comes from hearing and hearing through the word of christ. So how does a person get faith. Faith comes from hearing and hearing the words of christ. Paul said to the galatians did you receive the spirit by works of the law or by hearing in faith.

Excuse me. So so the way that a person is saved reconciled uh romans chapter 5 verse 1. Therefore having been justified by faith we have peace with god. So my attention is well not that my um let me find out where i'm at.

Okay. Yeah yeah. So what i'm saying is is that faith is given to us and faith. And by faith we will by grace through faith we are saved. And that gets me back where i got off track and i need to get back on my notes.

As you can see i just got a little i don't have much notes. It's just something to carry me through all right now let's go to john chapter 3. John chapter 3. Um i think uh i think i was listening to steve lawson and steve lawson was preaching and uh he said something which me and steve lawson would disagree on what i'm about to talk about.

But steve lawson was talking about george whitfield and that a woman asked george whitfield why are why do you keep saying that you must we must be born again. And whitfield replied because woman you must be born again.

And steve lawson's way of saying it you know it's it's really it's really hilarious. But i was listening to steve lawson today on the subject of regeneration and i come to realize that i do disagree with steve lawson on on the subject of regeneration on the new birth.

So so i was listening to a paul washer sermon. Y 'all probably heard me tell this story like i i talk so much at different places. I don't know what stories i've told where whatever. But paul washer uh was was preaching one time and and he said that he was a younger man.

He's just getting you know becoming a christian. I don't know if he's in a ministry yet but he heard a man preaching on uh you uh uh walking in the spirit. You must walk in the spirit walk in the spirit.

And paul said that this gentleman this this preacher this evangelist just kept saying those words you must walk in the spirit you must walk in the spirit. But he never told him how or or what it looked like or or you know how is someone to walk in the spirit what does it look like for someone to walk in the spirit.

So he didn't tell them the uh the formula all he are or what it actually is. He just kept saying to walk in the spirit. And so paul approached him and he said sir i really liked your sermon but you never told us how to walk in the spirit.

And the gentleman got pretty upset with paul. And then paul said that he had a big old guy behind him. I don't know if you've ever met paul washer but he's a big old guy so i can't imagine how big his guy was that was behind him.

And so uh and the guy behind him said sir you didn't tell us how. And and he kind of end the story there. And so i want to talk to you about being born again but i also want to get but i also want to tell you what i think it is.

Um and uh and i'm and and i'm just coming at it from a covenant theology perspective um and it and you can disagree with me. That's fine. Um but i don't think you'll have a better interpretation. And if anyone wants to debate this issue i i have a platform let's do it.

Um but john chapter three. And i just want to give it a a read through and probably just some brief commentary. Verse one. Now a man now there was a man of the pharisees named nicodemus a ruler of the jews.

This man came to jesus by night and said to him now right here where it's talking about by night. I personally don't believe it's talking about him sneaking around. I just think it's telling us you know what part of the day it is.

It's it's the beginning of a new day. The days at that time were evening first then then morning. I mean from evening to evening was one day. And so when he said he came to him at night this could be talking about speaking of a new day.

I don't believe there's something secret going on here. Where was that rabbi. We know that you are a teacher from god. For no one can do the signs that you do unless god is with him. Jesus answered him truly truly i say to you unless one is born again he cannot see the kingdom of god.

So right here nicodemus who came to him by night said rabbi calls him rabbi we know that you are a teacher that comes from god. For no one can do the signs unless that you do unless god is with him. Now i believe jesus here is.

It's him saying no. You don't know that i'm a teacher from god. And you can't know unless you're born again. Listen nicodemus this man came to jesus by night. Rabbi we know that you are a teacher come from god.

For no one can do these signs unless you do unless god is with him. Jesus answered truly truly i say to you unless one is born again he cannot see the kingdom of god. He is saying no. You don't know unless you're born again.

You don't know. Only those who are born again know that i'm a teacher from god. You don't know nicodemus. And notice what he says unless you're born again you cannot see this is with your eyes the kingdom of god.

Now if you're now if you can conjure faith in order to be saved that means that you can see the kingdom of god before you're born again. Oh that doesn't make any sense. That doesn't make any sense at all now.

So i'm coming at this from a perspective again from a covenant theology perspective. So i believe in order to enter the new covenant one must have faith in jesus christ. So the entrance into the new covenant is faith.

Right. And so and i believe as a reformed baptist that the sign of the new covenant is baptism. You enter your you enter the new covenant by faith. And the sign is baptism. Right. I think most reformed even presbyterians would believe.

But i think there would be some some nuances here and there. Now the kingdom. The kingdom is not the covenant. But it's like you know it's like my right hand and left hand holding hands. Right. Because you cannot see the covenant.

Even when you're born again you cannot see the covenant. Right. But you are a part of the kingdom. So so how. How did old covenant people enter the covenant. They were born. How did they enter the kingdom.

They were born right now after they were born. After they have entered the covenant entered the kingdom they received a sign circumcision. So old covenant earthly kingdom people were born into the covenant.

Into the kingdom. New covenant. And kingdom of heaven people kingdom of god people enter the new covenant by being born again. Jimmy i'll try to answer that sign a little later. Let me get this done. I mean i'll try to answer that question a little later.

I didn't mean to say sign. Um uh so same thing's taking place. Oh covenant earthly kingdom people they entered the covenant at birth. They entered the kingdom at birth. Then they received the sign. The male child would receive a sign new covenant in order to enter the new covenant in order to enter the king to even see that there is a kingdom to enter first you have to be born again now in order to enter this kingdom i think you have to be given faith.

Right. So so i believe that grace is a forensic transaction. So this is what i believe when it says you're saved by grace you are given forensic transaction. You are given a forensic transaction. And i believe that faith is an ethical transformation.

This is something that you don't have. And now you do. And so i believe. And i'm gonna continue reading in just a second. I'm just gonna give you a little layover. So i believe that when a person is born again they are given faith like there's there's nothing uh you know mystical about it.

There's it's it's you go from not believing to believing. Here in the gospel you know faith comes by hearing hearing the word of god. You are saved by grace. This is your your being saved is is the uh regeneration grace.

Grace is the regeneration. You are saved by grace regeneration through faith. And that is not of that. Through this regeneration god gives you what you don't deserve faith. And by this faith we enter the kingdom of god all.

Right. So let's with that in mind let's go back and read it again. And we'll continue to read. Now a man of the pharisees named nicodemus a ruler of the jews. This man came to jesus by night and said rabbi we know that you are our teacher.

Come from god. For no one can do the signs that you do the signs that you do unless god is with him. Remember jesus is telling him here in verse three. No you don't know. And jesus answered truly truly i say to you unless a man is born again he cannot see that is with your eyes the kingdom of god.

Nicodemus said to him how can a man be born when he is owed. Can he enter a second time into his mother's womb and be born. Jesus answered truly truly i say to you unless a man is born of water and the spirit he cannot enter the kingdom of god.

Notice this. Nicodemus knew what it meant to be born. He knew what it meant to be in the kingdom of god. Why. Because nicodemus is an earthly uh he's a part of the earthly kingdom people. He is a hebrew.

He is an israelite. He is a jew. He is under the old covenant. He entered the first kingdom by being born. Jesus is telling him that that's not good enough in order to enter the new covenant the covenant of grace this new kingdom this new covenant.

You must be born again. Nicodemus is saying what do you want me to do. Jump back into my mom and come back out and notice what jesus says now. I know a lot of people they take this as as to talking about baptism.

But actually i think it has more to do with what's taking place in ezekiel 36. I believe. Um uh and we'll go there in a minute. Um jesus answered truly truly i say to you unless a man is born of water and the spirit he cannot enter the kingdom of god.

So you know the water here could be. I'm just i'm not saying that i'm settled here but there's things that the water could be. I know where i lean to. I lean to a natural birth. And so because i lean to a natural birth because it's coming off of the heels of him saying that do i go back into my mother's womb.

So this excuse me. So this could be the earthly an earthly birth. And then he speaks about a spiritual birth. The bible always has this comparisons of the earthly versus the heavenly. Right. Like let me let me pull up my last message.

That i did. Uh let me pull it up real fast. Yeah right here. So uh the earthly kingdom people the jesus the heavenly kingdom people the church. O covenant. Earthly new covenant. Heavenly earthly sanctuary speaking about the temple.

Heavenly sanctuary speaking about the temple that's in heaven. Adam earthly christ heavenly. Our natural bodies are earthly. Our resurrected bodies will are heavenly. And the bible does this over and over and over like i could have a bigger list than that.

For anyone asking questions i can't get to your questions just yet. I will try to at the end i will do my best. And if we have to carry on to next week we will do so. Um but i have to get through these notes first all.

Right. So in ezekiel it talks about it talks about removing the heart of stone. That god removes the heart of stone gives you a heart of flesh sprinkles you with clean water. And that he puts his spirit in you to obey his law.

And so as as reformed believers reformed thinkers we believe that this is talking about regeneration. That he removes our heart of stone that he gives us a heart of flesh that he sprinkles us with clean water.

So that could be what the water is talking about and that he puts his spirit within us. So that's an interpretation. And i do think that that it goes along with regeneration. I just i just because of the context of nicodemus speaking about going into his mother's womb for a second time.

I believe that the water here is speaking about a natural birth. But then these are spiritual birth. The natural birth uh it's you know him speaking about nicodemus entering into the old covenant. He entered the covenant by birth.

The and then it says in the spirit unless you're born again from water and the spirit meaning that you have to be born by birth and by the spirit. So in order for nicodemus to know that jesus is a teacher from god not only would he have been born by natural means which he was but he would also have to be born by spiritual means.

And that is given faith to believe. Right here it says that which is born of the flesh is flesh. Think earthly. That which is born of the spirit is spirit heavenly. Do not marvel that i said this to you you must be born again.

The wind blows where it wishes. So the word wind and spirit here is the same word. So it's kind of like playing a play on words where it wishes and you hear the sound. But you do not know where it comes from.

You don't know where it comes from or where it goes. So it is with everyone who was born of the spirit. Nicodemus said to them how can these things be. Jesus answered him are you a teacher of israel. And yet you do not understand these things.

Truly i say to you we speak of what we know and we bear witness of what we have seen. But you do not receive our testimony. If i have told you earthly things and you do not believe how will you believe if i tell you heavenly things.

No one has ascended into heaven except the one who has descended from heaven the son of man. Right here listen to this. And as moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness this is the earthly. So must the son of man be lifted up the heavenly that whoever believes in him may have eternal life.

So he tells you right then what it looks like to to see and to enter the kingdom of god it's that you have eternal life. And it's those who believe in him. So what i believe that the bible teaches on is regeneration.

I believe that you know regeneration is how it's grace. This is god giving you something that you don't deserve. You didn't do anything to receive it. He gives it to you. You're saved by grace. And in that grace you are given faith that you that that the faith you're.

I mean that this regeneration is us being born again and given faith we are new creations in him. Now we are still saint and sinner. Right. We're we're. We're sin and saints. Uh but we're a new creation because we're no longer sinner all.

Right. We're not fully saying we're not fully center. But we're kind of a a a mixed bag of cookies all right. So that's just kind of the my mind of thinking right. You're saved by grace through faith.

This is not of your own doing. It is the gift of god. Regeneration precedes faith. Uh you must be born again. Unless you're born again you cannot see the kingdom. So unless unless you have been born again given grace to believe you cannot see the kingdom.

And then once you're given the grace to believe your faith is your entrance into the kingdom. You're saved by grace through faith. So when you put your faith in christ you enter the kingdom. That's the birth.

Romans 12:3 and the Measure of Faith

Right. All right. Now uh a gentleman a good friend of mine uh asked a question last week. I was hoping he'd jump on with me tonight. I sent him the link. I'm sure it's not that he doesn't want to. He's a busy man as we all are.

But he spoke he he he he spoke about uh every man has a measure of faith. So i want to look at that passage real quick. Gentlemen i'm really trying to answer the questions. I just got to go in order. Okay.

So he sent romans chapter 12 verse 3. I'm going to read verse 3 4 first because i was talking about this subject about how we're saved by grace through faith and how faith is the gift. And this is something that we don't conjure up.

He put romans 12 3 which says. For by the grace given to me i say to everyone among you not to think of himself highly than he ought to think but to think with sober judgment each according to the measure of faith that god has assigned.

Now he's not on here. So i cannot really you know go and um you know try to figure out what's he talking about you know like like what does he mean with this verse. But i can tell you i don't even want to tell you what i think he means because i i i'm not sure but i want to try to address this verse.

First of all this is paul writing to the church of rome. And verse one he says i appeal to you therefore brothers. So he is speaking to christians or or you know those that are a part of the church he's calling them brothers by the mercy of god to present your bodies as a living sacrifice like this is not something that you would say to unbelievers right.

This is something that you would say to believers holy and acceptable to god which is your spiritual worship. So this is us presenting our bodies as a living sacrifice holy and acceptable to god is a is our spiritual worship.

Verse two. Do not be conformed to this world. So he's speaking to christians telling them to not be conformed to this world but to be transformed by the renewal of your mind that by testing you may discern what is the will of god what is good and acceptable and perfect.

Then verse three. For by the grace given to me i say to everyone this everyone here is not everyone in the world. It's to the christians as he that he is addressing in rome among you everyone among you like it's like it's spelled out here not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think but to think with a sober judgment each according to the measure of faith that god has assigned to him.

So even in this faith this faith is not speaking of salvific faith but this is speaking of a different kind of faith. These these people are already saved and so the and so that was kind of my argument there.

I didn't really you know have any study. And i just you know two weeks ago i just said i don't believe that this faith is salvific that it's speaking of something else. And so that's just what i stand by also.

And that it's not speaking about everyone. God has not given everyone a measure of faith. What is talking about here. I think that this has something to do with our sanctification more so than our justification all right.

Human Responsibility, Faith, Repentance, and Church Discipline

And so then the woman who asked a question last week i can't remember her name. Please forgive me if you're listening she wrote a message and so she said that she was she understood what we were speaking about concerning regeneration and faith.

But she didn't understand how human responsibility fit into it which is a a good honest question. I want to thank you for the question. Um so i just want to read a verse man i must have swallowed something wrong.

Read a verse from john again verse 37. I like this verse because it gives the human responsibility as well as the divine providence. It tells us what god has done and what we are to do. Jesus says all that the father gives me.

So we see that we have to be given all that the father gives me will come and whoever comes to me i will never cast out. So i know a lot of reformed people uh you know they kind of well let's just say a lot of hyper calvinist people they'll kind of uh david points let me.

Uh let's see. Five one. Let me see. Oh yeah. Oh yeah. Five first john. Five one about being born again. Yes absolutely. I i think i used that in my message on easter being born again all right. So i was talking about human responsibility.

Yeah. Okay. So so so i believe the the the reform position is that we are saved by grace through faith. That we preach faith and repentance. So um and upon hearing the gospel uh i would say that the initial repentance is is you turning from self-righteousness the sin of self-righteousness and turning to the righteousness of god in christ.

Right. So repentance metanoia changed the way you think you go from not believing to believing. You go from shaking your fist at god to loving god. And and at first when this really when this really takes place you don't even know what happened.

You know man i you know one minute i didn't believe and the next minute i believe. And nothing can change my mind. At least that's how it was for me. Um so so if if faith and repentance is the human responsibility right now we so faith and repentance i would say is the same side.