December 15, 2020 Show with Dr. Tom Ascol on “Announcing the Institute of Public Theology”

Live from the historic parsonage of the 19th century gospel minister George Norcross in downtown

Carwile, Pennsylvania, it's Iron Sharpens Iron.

This is a radio platform in which pastors, Christian scholars, and theologians address the burning issues facing

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Proverbs chapter 27 verse 17 tells us, Iron sharpens iron, so one man sharpens

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Matthew Henry said that in this passage, we are cautioned to take heed with whom we converse and directed to

have in view in conversation to make one another wiser and better.

It is our hope that this goal will be accomplished over the next two hours, and we hope to hear from you, the listener, with

your own questions.

And now here's your host, Chris Arnzen.

Good afternoon, Cumberland County, Pennsylvania, Lake City, Florida, and the rest of humanity living on the planet

Earth, who are listening via live streaming at ironsharpensironradio .com.

This is Chris Arnzen, your host of Iron Sharpens Iron Radio, wishing you all a happy Tuesday on this 15th

day of December 2020.

And I'm thrilled to have back on the program a returning guest, Dr. Tom Askell, a

dear friend of mine for many years.

He is an author, a conference speaker, and president of Founders Ministries, in addition to being

senior pastor of Grace Baptist Church of Cape Coral, Florida.

And I'm so honored that he has selected my program to declare some very

exciting breaking news on Founders Ministries that was such a secret, I don't even know what it is.

And it's my honor and privilege to welcome you back, Dr. Tom Askell.

Thank you, Chris.

It's good.

And yeah, we have tried to...

In

fact,

I...

Well, before we give everybody the exciting news,

for the sake of those who are unfamiliar with you, I'm confident that the majority of our

listeners know who you are, but I do frequently not only have non

-reformed people listening, but even non -Christians listening on occasion.

So why don't you tell our listeners about Founders Ministries first and foremost.

Again,

back

in

conferences,

we can

find

out,

get

it back

up

to

speed.

And now tell us about Grace Baptist Church of Cape Coral, Florida,

which is a church that I have known about probably as long as I have been a

Christian, which goes back to the mid -1980s, having been raised Roman Catholic and

rescued by the mercy of God and his sovereignty

out of that false church and giving me eternal life.

And Grace Baptist Church of Cape Coral was a church that would frequently come up in

conversation at the church where I was saved, Calvary Baptist Church of Amityville, which

later became, after a merger, Grace Reformed Baptist Church of Long Island, and now the church where I'm a member in

Carlisle, Pennsylvania, Grace Baptist Church of Carlisle, the

founder of that church back in the 1950s was, after he had

left Pennsylvania, a long -time member of Grace Baptist Church of Cape

Coral, and that would be Ernie Reisinger.

But if you could, tell us about Grace Baptist Church of Cape Coral, Florida.

I sure will at first.

That's right, I heard that the brothers had disagreed.

I'm sorry, what were you saying?

I said there's a funny story about that because his son is still in our church, and he's Don Reisinger.

He didn't get his Ernie Reisinger.

But yeah, he was a dear friend.

When I

came, without

guidance

and help,

I resigned.

I tell people that I

was a pastor, so it was just like a match made in heaven, you know, that God put us

together.

And I've been able to stay here since Nation Today,

that tolerated me for nearly 35

years.

So that tells you all that you need to know about them, if you know me.

I've raised a family of

almost 14 grandkids in the

church faithfully.

He wants to find out more about Grace Baptist Church of Cape Coral, Florida.

You can go to their website, which is truegraceofgod .org, truegraceofgod

.org.

And please send my greetings to my very dear friends, Frank and Carmen Gilberti,

who were precious, very important friends of my late wife's

and mine, when they were living on Long Island.

When Frank was a deacon at First Baptist Church of Lindenhurst, Long Island.

And there are a lot of precious memories that I have of fellowship with both of them.

And I know that they are members there now in Cape Coral.

And if I'm not mistaken, I think the son of one of my dearest friends,

Pastor Rich Jensen of Hope Reform Baptist Church in Coram, Long Island, New York.

I believe his son is a member there, or at least was.

Yeah, Rick was a member.

We still have contact with him.

He's still faithful in Christ.

And so we miss him, but...

Amen.

Well, I don't have a drumroll sound effect ready.

Yeah, well, Chris, thank you so much for having me on and letting me be on this particular day.

Today announcing

Christian

Educational

Public Theology.

It's the outgrowth of...

And particularly with the Founders Online Study Center.

What's happened is we've had people...

Well, you guys started...

Wow, that is some coincidence.

Just about 30 seconds ago, Jim Ellips sent me an email.

Did he really?

Yes.

He'll remember the conversation.

And that was long before Puritan.

But God's

done it again.

And people have come to us and said, you know, would you guys do something?

Because now what's

happened is

Ideologies,

a Synodoc

project that now has

two

episodes,

committed to not

any air

thinking

biblically.

And people appealing that we actually started talking

about a year ago or a little less.

Pandemic hit where I was.

And from

that initial methodology,

and it's

good for myself,

the church,

man...

The best radio voice in existence.

Oh, I know it.

I know it.

I always hate to speak after him, you know, because nobody hears what I say.

I mean, if I speak at the same time that he's speaking, I

sound like a girl.

So anyway, but Jared's just a wonderful brother.

He's been a faculty member.

And then we're going to have Tom Nettles, who'll be one of the founding faculty members as well.

Praise God.

A dear friend of mine.

One of the founding faculty members is Vody Bauckham, my dear friend, now in Zambia, and is the

founding dean of the African Christian University there.

He'll continue in that role, but he will serve as one of the founding faculty members of the

Institute of Public Theology as well.

I'm going to be the founding president.

He's my vice president.

We have some...

You can go

to the

websites as well.

Du Bois Bible College in Louisville, associated with Southern Seminary.

We've got Mark Coppinger.

He retired from...

Chad Vegas, who is the founder...

Oh, yeah, he is extraordinary.

I heard him preach at a Banner of Truth conference two years ago.

And I immediately approached him afterwards and I said, not only do I have to get you on my show, but I have to get you to

speak at one of my biannual pastor's luncheons, which he agreed to do.

And it hasn't occurred yet because of COVID hanging everything up.

But I hopefully will get him out here from the West Coast over here to Pennsylvania to do

that.

Well, Chad's an amazing man.

He started several...

Including Radius International...

Missiological organizations I know about.

Oh, yeah.

Yeah, James.

World Readers in God.

That

he's

now

past...

Exegy,

really,

21.

Will open registration...

Live in Cape Coral...

Liverpools...

It'll be about a 66

-hour theological training.

It's to

understand the

gospel,

to see

how

the

gospel

relates

to every area of life, and to know what God's

people...

Christ above all earthly powers.

That's our theme.

We want to see Jesus Christ exalted and recognize that his word is relevant to everything.

You know, early on in some of the discussions that I was having with people, I

said, look, here's what we want in terms of instructors, teachers, professors at this institute.

We want men of strong confessional.

I couldn't be more excited for great good.

Now, again, the name is the Institute of Public Theology?

That's correct.

And if you could explain exactly what you mean by public theology.

Yeah, we

mean theology that has

shoe leather

endeavors.

We believe the Bible speaks to every relationship.

To do that, we

couldn't have

anticipated it last year at this time, but it has happened.

And what we've discovered in the face of those challenges is that too often, in too many ways, many of us were just simply

not prepared.

And consequently, we got knocked off course and disoriented by

some of those challenges.

Well,

we

want

to try

to...

You know, if you had said those very things,

you know, just a few years ago, I might have even thought in my head,

as well as many people listening, that's just a lot of

lofty talk.

But the way that our nation is spiraling down

into a very scary and dark realm, I do not

put it past the realm of reality and

realistic

fear that within our lifetimes, our lives may be actually in

peril by preaching openly the gospel and also everything that

the Bible would command us to declare publicly that today, as it is,

could very easily get you fired from a career that you have.

Even a career that in some way is affiliated with conservative

evangelicalism.

It could get you blackballed from being hired.

It could have you shunned by neighbors and family members.

And who knows how much more severe this is going to continue to spiral out of control.

Yeah, Chris, you're exactly right.

And I've talked to those.

I

mean, I can

hardly keep up,

try to

find

another

job.

It's turned

down promotions

because, with

the

contrary,

people

have not known

these things begin to evaporate.

Take disciples.

Learn how to do this.

Amen.

Well, we're going to our first break right now.

And if anybody would like to join us on the air with a question for Dr. Tom Askell.

And our sphere or our spectrum of questions that we will accept could be

on any theological or doctrinal issue.

Obviously, it would be most relevant if it involves Baptist theology and history.

But obviously also, since we are primarily announcing and spreading the word about

the new Institute of Public Theology, you can ask questions about that.

And basically, anything you want that you would ask of any

pastor or specifically theologian or historian from a Baptistic and

Reformed background.

Our email address is ChrisArnzen at gmail .com.

C -H -R -I -S -A -R -N -Z -E -N at gmail .com.

As always, please give us your first name, at least your city and state of residence and your country of residence if you live outside the

USA.

And please only remain anonymous if your question involves a personal and private matter.

Let's say you disagree with your own pastor over some theological issue.

Perhaps you're a pastor.

You have come to embrace something that puts you at odds with your own fellow elders or the denomination where you pastor.

Whatever the issue is that would compel you to remain anonymous because it's a personal and private issue, we would obviously

grant your request.

But if it's just a general question on theology, on history, on the Institute of Public

Theology, on founders' ministries, if it's just a general question, please give us at least your first name, your city and

state, and your country of residence.

Don't go away.

We'll be right back with Dr. Tom Askle after these messages from our sponsors.

I'm Dr. Joseph Piper, President and Professor of Systematic and Homiletical Theology at Greenville

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Welcome back.

This is Chris Arnzen, your host of Iron Truck and Zion Radio.

And our guest today for the entire program is Dr. Tom Askle, author, conference speaker, president of Founders

Ministries and senior pastor of Grace Baptist Church of Cape Coral, Florida.

Today, we have been announcing for the very first time publicly that the Institute of

Public Theology will begin classes in the not so distant future.

And we are also welcoming questions on theology, doctrine, church history, and other

things related to the Christian faith, and probably primarily from a Reformed

and Baptistic point of view.

And our email address is ChrisArnzen at gmail .com, C -H -R -I -S -A -R -N -Z -E -N at gmail .com.

As always, give us your first name at least, your city and state, and your country of residence, if you live outside the

USA, and only remain anonymous if your question involves a personal and private matter.

And if you could, Dr. Askle, repeat when you expect to be offering these

courses.

We're opening up registration.

Our first course, the time frame we're

operating on, we've got more information.

We have an anonymous listener who says, I have very dear friends

who are black folks, and it is a very touchy situation to bring up my

differences over what has been called the woke movement.

Do you have any counsel on how to disagree with loved ones and friends and

acquaintances without initially getting them to think immediately that you are a racist, and

therefore they're not going to hear anything else that you have to say?

Yeah, that's a great question.

And

it's a

problem

to be

afraid to say.

And yet,

because

these ideologies

are not,

I mean, you're not a racist.

I heard you were a racist.

Well, no, I'm not a racist.

We could sit around and we'd learn that about one another far better than just

Robin DiAngelo, white fragility.

Well, you

don't

have to

have the basis.

You can have that kind of non -threatening disarming conversation.

Oftentimes, some real good result on these

issues.

And we've been able to maintain, we've been able to

have those kind of, I think

if you can affirm some of their concerns,

they

come

to those that

I've become

sectionality.

And I think it might be helpful for you, if you could spend a little time giving a

summary definition of all of those buzz phrases that you just listed.

In Marxism, cultural Marxism that can be

traced back to some of the disciples of Karl Marx,

were because Marxism failed.

Karl Marx saw the world, he believed

that his was an economic theory.

So he saw the world in terms of the haves and the have -nots,

the bourgeoisie and the proletariats, those who controlled the mechanisms

at the bottom, the

have -nots.

Everybody would be the same.

There would be a revolt dissipated.

It didn't happen because in

Trinities, a

bunch of

disillusioned

Marxists

applies to every relationship.

And those

who built all

the desks are

for

right

-handed

possibilities

that can be brought together to say, well, this makes you part of the oppressive class.

It's possessed, and it

applies to race along racial lines.

It applies to sexuality along queer.

Determine the

number of, if you're a black woman,

if you're a black lesbian, if you're a black trans,

in your life, greater.

All of life is viewed in those terms,

where you've

got the

oneness of the

human race being created in the image of God.

So we

are full

identity.

The redemption in Jesus Christ in Galatians 3, 28, there's

neither male nor female.

So the gospel is antithetical to this way

of viewing the world in this way and those who want it.

And after we return from our midway break, which we are entering into any moment now, I'd

like you to address my own question.

And it relates to the question of our anonymous listener.

I have had conversations with people that have sided with the woke movement,

and I have had them define racism

early on in the conversation, because I try to point them to the fact

that this movement is really a catalyst for racism.

It's just got a different target.

But we'll have you react to that in a more detailed way when we come back from our midway break.

And folks, this is our longer than normal break in the middle of the show, because Grace Life Radio,

90 .1 FM in Lake City, Florida requires of us a longer break in the middle of the show, because they

use this time to localize Iron Trip and Zion Radio to Lake City, Florida, which

is a requirement of the FCC to localize their programming geographically to the area

where the station is located.

So please be patient with us as this break is a little longer than the other breaks in the show.

I also use this time wisely.

Please, especially if you're listening on a recording of this program, listening to a recording, please

don't fast forward through the commercials.

I know that sometimes you may have to do that, but don't always do that, because I'm hoping that as many

of you as possible respond to our advertisers so that they will know that

their money is being spent well and that people are being blessed by this program and that people can

use their services and their products and so on.

So this way, they'll be more than likely, our advertisers will more than likely remain our advertisers, which is

necessary for us to exist, because the majority of our funding to remain on the air comes from our advertisers.

So please try to respond to them as much as possible, even if it just means thanking them for sponsoring this show.

We'll also send in your questions to Dr. Tom Askell on any wide -ranging subjects

regarding doctrine, theology, and even the Institute of Public Theology that we've announced for the first time

publicly today.

Our email address is chrisarnson at gmail .com.

Chrisarnson at gmail .com.

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Hi, this is John Sampson, pastor of King's Church in Peoria, Arizona.

Taking a moment of your day to talk about Chris Arnzen and the Iron Sharpens Iron podcast.

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James White of Alpha Omega Ministries and the Dividing Line webcast here.

Although God has brought me all over the globe for many years to teach, preach, and debate at numerous venues, some of my

very fondest memories are from those precious times of fellowship with Pastor Rich Jensen and the brethren at Hope

Reform Baptist Church, now located at their new, beautiful facilities in Corham, Long Island, New York.

I've had the privilege of opening God's Word from their pulpit on many occasions, have led youth retreats for them, and have always

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I do not hesitate to highly recommend Hope Reform Baptist Church of Corham, Long Island to anyone who wants to be

accurately taught, discipled, and edified by the Holy Scriptures, and to be surrounded by truly loving

and caring brothers and sisters in Christ.

I also want to congratulate Hope Reform Baptist Church of Corham for their recent appointment of Pastor Rich Jensen's co -elder,

Pastor Christopher McDowell.

For more information on Hope Reform Baptist Church, go to hopereformedli .net.

That's hopereformedli .net or call 631 -696

-5711.

That's 631 -696 -5711.

Tell the folks at Hope Reform Baptist Church of Corham, Long Island that you heard about them from James White on Iron

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I always enjoy our time.

You, I have to tell you, one of the better interviewers out there, and I've been doing this for 30, more

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Every day at thousands of community centers, high schools, middle schools, juvenile institutions,

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We are rural and urban and we are always about the message of Jesus.

Our mission is to have a noticeable spiritual impact on Long Island, New York by engaging young people in the lifelong

journey of following Christ.

Long Island Youth for Christ has been a stalwart bedrock ministry since 1959.

We have a world -class staff and a proven track record of bringing consistent love and encouragement to youths in

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Help honor our history by becoming a part of our future.

Volunteer, donate, pray, or all of the above.

For details, call Long Island Youth for Christ at 631 -385

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Or visit liyfc .org.

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As host of Iron Sharpens Iron Radio, I frequently get requests from listeners for church recommendations.

A church I've been strongly recommending as far back as the 1980s is Grace Covenant Baptist Church in

Flemington, New Jersey, pastored by Alan Dunn.

Grace Covenant Baptist Church believes it's God's prerogative to determine how he shall be worshiped and how he

shall be represented in the world.

They believe churches need to turn to the Bible to discover what to include in worship and how to worship

God in spirit and truth.

Grace Covenant Baptist Church endeavors to maintain a God -centered focus.

Reading, preaching, and hearing the Word of God, singing psalms, hymns, and spiritual songs,

baptism, and communion are the scriptural elements of their corporate worship, performed with faith, joy,

and sobriety.

Discover more about Grace Covenant Baptist Church in Flemington, New Jersey at

gcbcnj .squarespace .com.

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Or call them at 908 -996 -7654.

That's 908 -996 -7654.

Tell Pastor Dunn that you heard about Grace Covenant Baptist Church on Iron Sharpens Iron Radio.

Thriving Financial is not your typical financial services provider.

As a membership organization, we help Christians be wise with money and live generously every day.

And for the fourth year in a row, we were named one of the world's most ethical companies by the Ethisphere Institute,

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business ethics.

Contact me, Mike Gallagher, financial consultant, at 717 -254

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Again, 717 -254 -6433 to learn more about The Thriving Difference.

Lending faith, finances, and generosity.

That's The Thriving Story.

We are excited to announce another new member of the Iron Sharpens Iron Radio advertising family,

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Greetings in the matchless name of our Lord Jesus Christ.

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In Psalm 139 verse 14, the psalmist offers praise to the Lord like this.

I praise you because I'm fearfully and wonderfully made and wondrous are your works that my soul knows

very well.

He saw God's goodness and mercy, kindness, and the beauty in what God has designed

and he has erupted into praise.

In any crisis or problem, brothers and sisters, our only fallback position is to trust God's

design.

And once we do, there is nothing for us to do but to erupt in praise to him.

When the whole world is searching for a solution, God in his infinite mercy has given us what we need to

address this illness.

Which can be pretty serious.

Such is the beauty of his design.

Knowing that design, how can we not erupt in praise to our great God like the psalmist did?

May God bless you and give all of us wisdom to see greater things in his design.

Thank you.

Charles Haddon Spurgeon once said,.

Give yourself unto reading.

The man who never reads will never be read.

He who never quotes will never be quoted.

He will not use the thoughts of other men's brains, proves that he has no brains of his own.

You need to read.

Solid Ground Christian Books is a publisher and book distributor who takes these words of the Prince of Preachers to heart.

The mission of Solid Ground Christian Books is to bring back treasures of the past to minister to Christians in the present and

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Solid Ground Christian Books is honored to be a weekly sponsor of Iron Sharpens Iron Radio.

And please never forget folks that solid -ground -books .com is also a vital sponsor of

this program.

If they were to discontinue funding our existence, we would likely go off the

air completely barring a miracle of God.

So please let them know how much you thank them

for supporting this program and help keeping us on the air by purchasing frequently and generously

from solid -ground -books .com, especially with Christmas coming up.

Please do a lot of your Christmas shopping at solid -ground -books .com.

And not only for your brothers and sisters in Christ for whom you are purchasing Christmas gifts,

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good, solid, biblically -based books from solid -ground -books .com so that the Lord

perhaps will use these books to draw them into an eternal relationship with Jesus Christ.

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And you're not only going to be doing them a favor through frequently purchasing books from them, and you're not only

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purchasing books from solid -ground -books .com an enormous favor because they publish

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Always tell them that you heard about them.

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Before we return to Dr. Tom Haskell, we just have some important announcements to make.

Tomorrow, Wednesday, the 16th of December, we have as our guest for the very first time, Dr. Philip Kaiser,

who is a board member at the Pickering Foundation of Biblical Preservation and also professor of ethics

at Whitfield Theological Seminary.

He's going to be discussing his book December 25th, Jewish Style, just in

time for the Christmas season.

So we hope that you tune in for that.

On Thursday, the 17th of December, we have returning to the program,

Ryan Denton, and Ryan is going to be discussing his book, Even

If None, Reclaiming Biblical Evangelism.

So we hope that you tune in for that as well.

On Friday, the 18th, we have returning to the program, someone whom I have always

loved to interview, one of my favorite guests, is Dr. Michael A .G. Haken,

and he is going to be discussing a book that he edited and contributed to, Strangers and

Pilgrims on the Earth, Remembering the Mayflower Pilgrims from 1620 to

2020.

And that's Friday, the 18th of December.

On Monday, we have something happening that has only happened once before in

the history of Iron Sherpa and Zion Radio, and that is, I have guest hosts filling in

for me in my absence, and that's only happened once before.

And this Monday, we have Dr. James R. White of Alpha and Omega Ministries, and Pastor Bill Shishko,

a very world -renowned name in Reformed circles, especially in the Orthodox Presbyterian

denomination, they were actually debate opponents years ago in a debate that I

actually orchestrated and emceed on infant baptism, Dr. White being a Reformed Baptist,

and Pastor Bill Shishko being a Pato Baptist, and it was a very memorable event that you could still see on YouTube.

Well, they're going to be co -hosting Monday's show, and I hope that you tune in for that as well.

Also, folks, if you love this show and you don't want it to disappear from the airwaves, please, I urge you to go to IronSharpAndZionRadio

.com, click support, then click, click to donate now.

You could donate instantly with a debit or credit card in that fashion, and if you prefer snail mail, an address,

a physical address, will also appear on the screen where you can send your checks made payable to

IronSharpAndZionRadio when you click support at IronSharpAndZionRadio .com.

You can also advertise with us as long as whatever it is you're promoting is compatible with what we believe.

You don't have to believe identically with me, but you need to be promoting something that is compatible with what I believe.

We would love to help you launch an ad campaign as quickly as possible because we are in urgent need of your advertising dollars.

Send those emails to ChrisArnzen at gmail .com and put advertising in the subject line.

We are in real urgent need of your financial help, folks.

Please help us remain on the air.

We have been hit very hard financially because of the hysteria associated with the coronavirus pandemic.

Many people in our audience have been hurt seriously financially, so therefore they are donating less

frequently or less amounts.

Not all, but many are.

And even some of our advertisers had to postpone advertising with us.

So please help us at this very important time.

Go to IronSharpAndZionRadio .com, click support, then click, click to donate now.

Also, folks, if you are not a member of a local Bible -believing church, I have lists of biblically faithful churches all over the

planet Earth, and I may be able to help you find a church, sometimes even right around the corner.

From where you live,.

No matter where on the planet you live.

I have helped already people in all parts of the globe in our audience find churches that they didn't even

know existed that are biblically sound, sometimes within just a few minutes of their own home.

So send me an email to ChrisArnzen at gmail .com and put I need a church in the subject line if you are in that

category, or if you need to help a loved one find a church, or if you're just going on vacation somewhere

and want a biblically sound church.

That's ChrisArnzen at gmail .com and put I need a church in the subject line.

That's also the email address to send in questions for Dr. Tom Askell and any question regarding

theology, doctrine,.

Church history,.

Or their new Institute of Public Theology at C -H -R -I -S -A -R -N -Z -E -N at gmail

.com.

And Dr. Askell, before we went to the midway break, I was saying that I have,

during conversations that have come up on the woke movement, when I have been having these

conversations with those that may claim, sometimes in ignorance,

to adhere to this movement, to support it, I've had them define what they think

racism is.

And very often you'll get an actually, an accurate definition.

You know, you will have people perhaps even quoting Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. by saying, well, that

would be like judging people, not according to the content of

their character, but on the color of their skin.

You're prejudging what people are as far as who they are and their

character, just because of the lightness or darkness of their skin.

And that of course would be racism.

Then I would say to them, don't you know that that is exactly what's happening with the woke movement?

It's just the target is different.

And if you could pick up from there, if you think that that is an appropriate methodology.

Yeah, well, that's exactly right.

And what's happening today, it's a moving target, quite honestly,

that racism is prejudice.

Plus, if you're not in,

the Bible doesn't allow for that.

You know, the Bible doesn't give special,

another ethnicity

as commandments.

The idea of impartiality, where you show preferential

or reasons that are not legit,

look down on another person, partiality toward another person.

You write kind of, I love all women in our

church, but I love one woman above all the rest.

I'm partial.

Be allowing my partiality to be,

when you talk about racism today, you have to ask the question that you,

and there's a very popular book.

Well, I'm not a racist.

You automatically have identified yourself.

Now, does Kendi include Black, Hispanics, Native Americans, and Asians in that?

Well, yeah, it's people of color, but it's primarily people being

anti -racist.

Let me have you repeat that though.

Is he admitting that there are racists?

In fact, that every Black person is a racist?

Is he, is he saying?

No, no, no, no.

Oh, okay. That's my point.

No, no, no.

Can't be.

No, it's, uh, you know, again, that it's either anti -racist

or you're a racist.

I'm not a racist.

If you say that, you've identified yourself as a racist.

Hundred yards is.

Or just seven feet or so.

It might be closer to 10 feet or seven feet for me, but, but nevertheless, if you, if you change the

rules of definition.

Okay.

Well, uh, that's, uh, oh, the other thing that I very often have said, in fact, I've said it on this

program, is that this whole idea that

people of darker skin colors and certain ethnicities are

exempt from being identified as racist because they have been

a persecuted minority.

And therefore they legitimately can hold certain views

of suspicion and animosity towards Caucasians.

Well, I have pointed to the fact that the Jews

going all the back, all the way back to the beginning of their existence as children of Abraham

have been a persecuted people.

The Gentiles have persecuted, enslaved them, have

annihilated them.

And we could go on and on and on with how the Gentiles have treated the Jews horrifically

throughout, uh, history.

And yet, even though they were in that category of being an oppressed people, the

apostle Paul adamantly opposed the Jewish Christians treating

the Gentile Christians in a different light.

And if anybody could legitimately claim that they had certain

rights, uh, to have racist ideas being a persecuted people,

it would have been the first century Jews.

And yet this was a really serious, heretical idea

that was so heretical that Paul rebuked Peter publicly over, uh,

at least temporarily buying into this idea of basically the Judaizers.

You're exactly right, Chris.

This is, this is not some...

Get that right.

These other things, yeah, we're still going to have issues.

Okay.

We have a Joseph in South Central Pennsylvania, who said you were saying earlier

that you maintain good friendships with people that support the woke movement.

I was wondering how we can continue in a brother to brother relationship

with folks who support this movement when it is, if it is an offense to the gospel itself, I can

understand maintaining friendships, but can we continue to call these men and women our brothers and

sisters if they support this movement, since it seems to be a very violation of the most crucial

aspect of our faith, that is the gospel.

Yeah, well, and there are different degrees of that.

So I'm glad for the question because I underscored that anybody who buys into

and advocates critical race theory

and those who make the kind of demands that

are tragic,

it's tragic.

I think there are some are beginning

to advocate and what has taken them captive, but then there are others

who want to be as patient as I can be, the same way

that I do,

which they begin to say, no, this

is what I speak in

ways that are parted.

I've said multiple times,

sectionality is a part

of this mess.

It's right and good what ought to be

done, what ought not to be done.

You leave those parameters.

You're not operating on the basis of Christianity.

I think we're very much in the same situation that Jay Gresham Machen found himself in the early 20th century

with the modernist movement and the social gospel movement of his day.

All those battles made another religion

advocating this today.

Now, I'm assuming those that are not liberal that you're referring to, they must

then reject the affirmation of homosexuality that is

being strongly promoted by the more secular versions of this.

Yeah, well, again, it's a gradation.

You have a continuum.

And so, yes, that has been the case for many, but we're beginning to see even that.

Downplaying the serious.

Yeah, the

question is

how

that

perchance,

God.

We have a listener, RJ in White Plains, New York, who says, I hope I don't

make you too uncomfortable asking a controversial question, but since you are a Southern Baptist, I was wondering if

you think that the Southern Baptist Theological Seminary will overcome this huge hurdle in that many

seem to support this woke movement on their faculty.

Well, yeah, that is a controversial question.

It's a

good

about

critical

race

theory.

The provost of the seminary.

I am a racist and I struggle with white supremacy.

I will be a racist till the day I die.

Find racism or sinful partiality, according to the Bible.

He means something different than that.

Still a problem.

If he's not buying into CRT, he's using the very language and definitions.

So I don't know.

I

don't

allow to

encourage for all.

Now, are you aware of anybody that has a strong voice in opposition to these

movements we've been speaking of critically that is a part of the administration or faculty at the Southern Baptist Theological

Seminary?

Well, let me just say, I know that there are those in that one, but other

seminaries who are strongly opposed and who've tried to address some of these things.

Who've been outspoken about it.

And I'm grateful for, but I'm not intimately involved in

any of that seminary.

By some in those accountability structures who I do know are strongly opposed and are concerned that these

things not take.

And again, I hope and pray for their success and their efforts.

Now, don't you think a lot of this, as far as good

men who, when I say good men, I'm speaking of those that are

theologically and doctrinally sound, who are biblical inerratists and

even theologically reformed.

When they have a soft view of this,

where they're not adamantly affirming it, but they're not in any way criticizing or

condemning it.

Don't you think a lot of this is sadly an example of fearing men rather than

God.

They're so terrified of being labeled as racist, that they

just go along with the program, even if they have a gut instinct that is informed

by the scriptures and the Holy Spirit, that this is just wrong.

It certainly happens.

And I have talked to people.

You can never fear what we

desperately need.

Oh my, let me

just tell you about the end of this year.

You can order it right now.

Pre -order from founders, precisely for

the finally say, we

need to get this new

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God.

And so we have a whole section in the book, because if you

don't fear God, then you

will fear to maintain

throughout.

We have Harrison in Mechanicsburg, Pennsylvania, who asks, have you heard about

your fellow Southern Baptist, Rick Warren, having an upcoming event exclusively for black

people?

The only non -blacks invited are the spouses of black people that may not be black.

Yeah.

Somebody texted that to me this morning.

So that's the first, and that's all that I know of it.

But, you know, it just reminds me, I mean, I'm thinking, isn't that what the civil rights movement

out and did again in white?

I mean, this is ridiculous.

I don't know any more detail than just what you've read, because that's what was sent to me.

But I'll tell you, any Christian church, any Christian entity that says we're going to have a blacks only or a whites

only, and we're going to exclude everybody else

about that.

But whenever you start dividing along racial lines, I

need to know

more

about it.

But by the way, folks,.

If you, after this program is over, if you want to go to the archives of ironchirponsironradio .com,

I had an interview that I really enjoyed with an author named John Harris, and John is

spelt J -O -N.

He wrote a book called Social Justice Goes to Church, The New Left in Modern American Evangelicalism.

And you could hear that if you type in the search engine in the podcast past shows

section of ironchirponsironradio .com, and you type in the search engine John Harris, and again, that's J -O

-N Harris, that interview will come up.

And I'm looking forward, I would love to get you and Jared on to discuss your book at some point in the near future.

Oh, we'd love to do that.

Yeah, we hope.

It's supposed to, we're pushing it, but we're trying to get it out by the end of the year to at least be out of the

first part of next year.

It's been a labor of love, but it's been a real labor.

And the people who have read the, been very encouraging.

Oh yeah, I know Tom very well.

Okay, Tom has said, this book was needed yesterday.

Praying God will use it.

We're facing a new religion, and Christians today need to start thinking about this new religion the same way they think

about Jehovah's Witnesses, or Mormonism, or Buddhism, or Islam.

And folks, you can also type into the search engine at ironchirponsironradio .com's podcast past

shows section, the terms woke or social justice, and quite a number of interviews will

come up actually.

In fact, an interview that I conducted with someone that I was unaware of a

few years ago until Tom, my guest, Tom Askel, told me about this brother and highly

recommended him, Darrell Bernard Harrison.

He was on the program along with his podcast co -host, Virgil Walker.

Oh yeah.

And they were talking about this as well.

They're great.

In fact, one of your earlier questioners I should have asked about how

I could talk.

And they've dealt with all of these issues, publishing

their first book that'll be out early next year.

It's called, Do Not Be More Timeless,

and their insights on these issues.

Well, we're going to our final break.

It's going to be a lot more brief than the other breaks, but I would strongly urge you if you intend to

send in a question that you do it immediately because we're rapidly running out of time.

Our email address is chrisarnson at gmail .com.

Chrisarnson at gmail .com.

Give us your first name, city and state, and country of residence.

We'll be right back with Tom Askew after these messages.

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Lindbrook Baptist Church on 225 Earl Avenue in Lindbrook, Long Island, is teaching God's timeless truths in

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Our church is far more than a Sunday worship service.

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Hi, I'm Buzz Taylor, frequent co -host with Chris Ironson on Iron Sharpens Iron Radio.

I would like to introduce you to my good friends Todd and Patty Jennings at CVBBS, which stands for Cumberland Valley

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Todd and Patty specialize in supplying Reformed and Puritan books and Bibles at discount prices that make them affordable

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Unlike other book sites, they make no effort to provide every book that is available because frankly, much of what

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It also means that you don't have to worry about being assaulted by the pornographic, heretical, and

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Let Todd and Patty know that you heard about them on Iron Sharpens Iron Radio.

I'm Dr. Tony Costa, Professor of Apologetics and Islam at Toronto Baptist Seminary.

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It's such a joy to witness and experience fellowship with people of God like the dear saints at Hope Reformed Baptist Church in

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I hope you also have the privilege of discovering this precious congregation and receive the blessing

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For more information on Hope Reformed Baptist Church, go to hopereformedli .net.

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Or call 631 -696 -5711.

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Tell the folks at Hope Reformed Baptist Church of Coram, Long Island, New York that you heard about them from Tony Costa

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When Iron Sharpens Iron Radio first launched in 2005, the publishers of the New American

Standard Bible were among my very first sponsors.

It gives me joy knowing that many scholars and pastors in the Iron Sharpens Iron Radio audience have been

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Charles Haddon Spurgeon once said,.

Give yourself unto reading.

The man who never reads will never be read.

He who never quotes will never be quoted.

He will not use the thoughts of other men's brains proves that he has no brains of his own.

You need to read.

Solid Ground Christian Books is a publisher and book distributor who takes these words of the Prince of Preachers to heart.

The mission of Solid Ground Christian Books is to bring back treasures of the past to minister to Christians in the present and

future, and to publish new titles that address burning issues in the church and the world.

Since its beginning in 2001, Solid Ground has been committed to publish God -centered, Christ -exalting

books for all ages.

We invite you to go treasure hunting at solid -ground -books .com.

That's solid -ground -books .com and see what priceless literary gems from the past to

present you can unearth from Solid Ground.

Solid Ground Christian Books is honored to be a weekly sponsor of Iron Sharpens Iron Radio.

We are excited to announce another new member of the Iron Sharpens Iron Radio advertising family,

Banu Gadi, owner of three New York pharmacies, Lee's Drugs of Floral Park, Long

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Banu Gadi earned a doctorate in pharmacy degree and is very knowledgeable on the current coronavirus

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Please contact Dr. Gadi so he and his expert staff can give you proper guidance amid all the

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Welcome back.

This is Chris Arntzen and we have a first -time listener with a question for Dr. Tom Askell.

Adam in Akron, Ohio.

Well, he's a first -time questioner anyway, might be a long -time listener.

Have you heard of Carl Truman's new book, The Rise and Triumph of the

Modern Self?

It seems like Truman addresses many of the themes that give rise to critical theory and

homosexuality, such as issues of the psychological, the psychologicalizing, I

don't know if I'm mispronouncing that, psychologizing, I'm sorry, the

psychologizing of identity.

Yes, I have.

I've actually talked to Carl about the book and I'm about halfway,

probably going to be the best,

but we got to,

how did

we get

to a

plan's body

to

where we

now

are?

I don't

know.

Well, if you could, let us know what your full mailing address is,

Adam, in Akron, Ohio, so that we can mail you out a brand new New American Standard Bible,

since you are a first -time questioner, that will be shipped to you by CVBBS .com, Cumberland Valley Bible

Book Service, who ship out all of our winners, the free Bibles and books and other things that they win when they send in

questions for our guests.

And we always send out a new New American Standard Bible for first -time questioners.

So make sure we have your full mailing address in Akron, Ohio.

We have Lou in Sharpsburg, Georgia.

Hello, brothers.

Dr. Askell, are there beliefs regarding the first 11 chapters of Genesis

and eschatology that will be required of any adjunct professor at the

Institute of Public Theology in order to teach there?

Yes and no.

Yes, on Genesis 1 -11.

No on eschatology.

Now, obviously, there'll be some things that would be way out of bounds.

It seems that most confessional Reformed Baptists lean in the amillennial

direction, but Charles Haddon Spurgeon, who strongly held to the 1689 London Baptist Convention of Faith,.

From what I understand,.

Was historical pre -mill.

Right.

Yeah, so is my good friend Tom Nettles.

Well, we are out of time, so I want to make sure that we give our listeners your contact

information.

First of all, don't forget about Founders Ministries, where you can also find out more about the Institute of

Public Theology.

That's founders .org, founders .org.

And also, Grace Baptist Church of Cape Coral, Florida can be found at

truegraceofgod .org, truegraceofgod .org.

Do you have any other contact information or websites or anything that you'd like to share?

Yeah, thanks so much for that.

I always forget to mention this, but Jared and I do a podcast every week called,

We've Dealt With Issues of Law and Gospel.

We've dealt with the social justice issues repeatedly, and a

lot of what's going on about

that and help others in light of these.

Praise God.

Well, I want to thank you so much, Dr. Askle, for being my guest again, and I will

send you a calendar of dates so that you and Jared can both join me together to discuss your

new book that's coming out in 2021.

I would love to have you back on.

Oh, that'd be awesome.

We would love to come on, so appreciate your considering that.

And I'd love to have Darrell, Darrell Bernard Harrison and Virgil Walker on to discuss that.

I was talking to them just before I stepped on with you today, and man, they're so excited.

I'm excited with them about their new book that will be out, God willing, in the beginning of

founders .org.

Amen.

Well, I want to thank.

Everybody who listened today, especially those who took the time to write in questions, perhaps even more especially

to our first -time questioner, Adam in Akron, Ohio.

And I want you all to always remember for the rest of your lives that Jesus Christ is a far greater Savior

than you are a sinner.

Amen.