Ephesians 4:29-32 Applied to Christian Communication, A Hack-Job Video, & Francis’ Unorthodox Views

Alpha & Omega Ministries

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00:33

Greetings welcome to the dividing line. It's yeah, it's working. It's it's functional and the whole nine yards.

00:39

It's good to be with you. It's Tuesday, I think yeah, it's Tuesday, and we've got a lot to get to on the program day some book stuff first Let's do some geeky book stuff first My keeping my my friend

00:56

Jason Lyle's book keeping faith in an age of reason I still love that headless dude there it cuz

01:02

I know who that is. Everybody knows who that And it's and the bowtie. Hey, you know

01:09

You know how that's not me in the bowtie. It's too bland It could be

01:14

Jim Renahan Jim Renahan would wear a bowtie like that fact. That's almost too flashy or anything, but It certainly can't be me.

01:21

We know who that is, but keeping faith in an age of reason Jason Lyle all sorts of stuff on This this would go

01:29

I'm gonna put this right here I'm gonna eventually put right down there and you put right next to encyclopedia of Bible difficulties because that's where that needs to go and what's different about it is that Jason identifies the logical error involved in the alleged contradiction type stuff, so Let's just say

01:51

I'm doing a lot of Christmas presents. It'll have Jason Lyle's name on them People you'll be getting

01:57

Jason Lyle books, and I may I may also be picking up a few of these In fact,

02:03

I wonder if I could get him to sign them put it up there so you can see it the early church father's daily readings edited by Nick Needham now

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I have mentioned brother Needham to you before and I don't want to get you know anymore if I say

02:23

I like anybody They're in trouble because there's various people who will do exposes on them and everything else but Brother Needham, and I met oh goodness

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You know the first time That I really I don't think it's first time we had met

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But it was the first time I really started getting a sense of just how funny Nick Needham could be really started realizing.

02:49

This is a really neat guy was the exact same afternoon and That I got a message

02:57

About a guy that was attacking Calvinism on the internet as if that's unusual

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But that I should take should check out and the guy's name was Ergon Kanner So this would have been 2005 yeah, so 2005 so good 12 years ago

03:18

Dr. Needham and yes, we're talking about the nickname. I should have brought his books in I'm sorry But the four volumes well,

03:25

I've shown them to you on the program before I don't yeah I don't have many in here right now, but the four volumes set 2 ,000 years of Christ's power

03:32

Dr. Nick Needham. Here's the early church father's daily reading readings nice little short little thing if you wanted to add some of that he just had this come out from Christian heritage books and You know,

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I'm looking I'm looking at this here I guess they sent it directly to me because I don't

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I don't see a signature anyway, I want to get back up to Inverness and that I can get him to sign sign it directly, but Nick Needham great guy and He said he's pretty busy the next couple weeks grading papers because he does teach up there in Inverness But we're gonna have him on to talk about this book and about his series on church history and just church history stuff in general and Just because he's a cool, dude, so Nick Needham Early church father's daily readings just just came out

04:32

I've been mentioning stuff on Twitter and Facebook that some of you just go.

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What are you talking about? I'm just gonna have to ask for your patience Over the next couple years as I'm working on this

04:45

PhD in textual criticism Sometimes I got to talk about what I'm reading about for example

04:52

A critical examination of the coherence based genealogical method in New Testament textual criticism by Peter J.

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Gurry. Dr. Gurry is teaches here at Phoenix Seminary and This is a

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Braille publication. It's not a huge long thing It's just over 200 pages

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This is next on my on my reading list is the compilation of basically his dissertation on CBGM and the

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ECM Volumes which all look like this. This isn't a technically an ECM volume, but this is the

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It is a part. Well, actually it is a part, but it's not ECM is

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Editio Critica Mayor It is the currently being produced out of Munster Major critical edition of the

05:47

New Testament It is obviously not intended to be

05:54

Nestle Island or UBS. In other words portable I didn't bring it in here, but I have the

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Books on acts that just came out and it's four volumes Now two of those volumes are extra information so but acts itself is two volumes long and The general epistles came out first.

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And so you've got acts general epistles. I think John is next I hope John is next.

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I wish it would come out Soon, but I sort of doubt that it that it will When it's all done, it's going to be

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Huge, it's not gonna be portable. It's going to be obviously a library type thing because it's ridiculously expensive but The Methodology That is being used in the analysis of the readings is

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What this book is about coherence based genealogical method. I am not in a position as yet because it would

06:57

It would take the production of Numerous graphics and a lot of other stuff to even begin to try to explain what this is all about, but I let me just very basically say that for many years

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We have been saying someday We'll get the computers involved in Helping us in New Testament textual criticism and immediately a lot of people go.

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Oh, man, that just sounds That Sounds all wrong. I don't want computers determining my

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New Testament readings. Okay. Okay. Look no other work of antiquity

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Presents us with the mass of information the New Testament does none one of the biggest problems that we have as New Testament textual critics is the fact that we have a

07:54

Huge amount of information not just the Greek manuscripts, even though that would be enough 5 ,818 is a lot

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But we have the Latin manuscripts and we have Boheric and Coptic and Sahitic and all the rest of this stuff and trying to Coordinate all that information and put all that information together is

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Extremely difficult to do and so I Understand when people go,

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I don't know if I want computers involved with this, you know, okay, I get it but You know, we're using it for all

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I mean The next generation, you know when I was that I preached on Sunday at Apologia Church in the afternoon and the guy

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Who read the scripture text did it from his iPhone and nobody batted an eye

08:53

We're getting used to that kind of thing it might be a little bit different still Make a long story short

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What we've done for a long long time and I'm not gonna spend a lot of time on this But we've done for a long long time is we've looked at Manuscripts and we've basically used a 70 % agreement on key variations platform to identify

09:17

Various manuscript families and the assumption is that they're related to one another if in these key areas of difference they they agree well

09:26

Once you can start digitizing these manuscripts So that you know what their?

09:34

readings are You can start looking at things such as what it's called pre genealogical coherence

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Where you're just simply Looking at the the broad spectrum of manuscripts as a whole how much they do they agree with one another in Toto it turns out.

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It's about 87 % Absolutely identical and So, I mean,

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I mean that in and of itself Demonstrates that all the people have theories that well, you know, no one really knows the

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New Testament you said or I said It's just has been proven by computer analysis to be absurd

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But then you can take those numbers and once you start Seeing manuscripts that agree 95 % 97 % now you're starting to get in the point where you can start tracing

10:27

Not genealogical relationships of Manuscripts but of texts and you see in CBGM The text is the wording not the manuscript and that's really hard for a lot of people to wrap their minds around How do you just differentiate between the two but you can have?

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For a long time when we've talked about this. I've mentioned manuscripts 1739 1881

10:51

We know these are like 10th century manuscripts that Were copied from like 2nd or 3rd century exemplars.

10:58

So even though they're way down here their text is way up here and so What this basically

11:12

Okay, I'm getting too much of it and I'm sorry because that's what I'm dealing with and when you're trying to wrap yourself nobody in in my era when

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I learned textual criticism in Bible College the seminary this this didn't exist.

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This is this is late 90s and Really starts coming out and starts becoming

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Utilized only within the past decade or so. And so Most of us are behind the curve on this one and I'm just trying to catch up basically

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But there are certain canons that it's based upon and one of the canons is that the scribes

11:51

Attempted to accurately copy their manuscripts. Well, what happens if you have a manuscript with a scribe?

11:58

who is More free or Feels the freedom to engage in at least some kind of stylistic editing what happens that manuscript and Can you use

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CBGM to identify where that happens in a particular manuscript in comparison to others?

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That's what I'm having to deal with with p45 because p45 that seems to be what the scribe did at times so it's fascinating stuff and I can see the

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CBGM has the possibility of really impacting positively

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New Testament studies the resultant text and It's it's exciting stuff, but it is it's not just sort of natural to think about it.

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It's it's tough stuff. So Working through stuff like that That actually is where the vast majority of my time is being spent right now all of you who actually think that I am the puppet master

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Right Running off these telling these people to go do this and other people go do that.

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Don't have time. Don't have time The only time I have to even be listening to you know today.

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I listened to the Bible thumping wingnut thing with Jordan Hall and The only reason

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I was able to do that is I did it. I did a Thing this morning sometimes you got it.

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You got to play with numbers to keep things interesting so today I did 5k run and A 5k row and what's 5 plus 5?

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It's 10. So I did a thousand crunches and what's 5 times 5? 25 so I did 25 kilometers on bike

13:44

Yeah, I don't know. You got gotta come up with something See play with numbers or something, whatever Uh But that's the only reason

13:51

I had the opportunity to do that is I put it on my phone put my Trek's air open ear headphones on and Tried not to fall over at some of the comments that I heard but it didn't

14:05

I wasn't riding in the dark So it wasn't all that big of a deal anyway So That's about the only time

14:13

I get to Listen to this. I haven't I turn the TV on to watch one thing I record

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I haven't even watched a news program. I'm seeing stuff on Facebook that there's stuff going on I listen to the briefings.

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So I hear some things there, but I Think my blood pressure is actually a little healthier that I'm not watching news very much.

14:34

I guess Jeff Sessions was 24 -7 on Fox News today. I don't know why but I turned it on and that was going

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I don't know So there you go. That's what's going on with that Um Before we go

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To a couple things that I want to review. I would invite you having talked about some geeky stuff to Look to your scriptures if you have if you a lot of people are driving you can't do it.

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I'll be reading it for you This text was

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I was directed this text this morning by a Pastor friend and I thought it would be I think good to remind ourselves of these things we are having a

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Discussion dialogue About how it is we should behave even amongst reformed people in Engaging other individuals and how we present our faith and Some people are suggesting specifically

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Jordan Hall that Presenting Reformed theology with Not with a quiet tone or with effeminate.

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He's used the term effeminate effeminate Calvinists Namby Pamby Calvinists this kind of language but actually presenting the doctrines of grace in a gracious fashion as a

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Showing recognition that I myself needed grace That I am

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NOT better than someone else in other words not being an arrogant snobbish Calvinist, which

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I've been accused of many many times and I'm sure there have been times when I have been and I realized that we live in a day where any kind of Confidence in objective truth

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Will be seen as arrogant by the people of world not even talking about the people of world

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I'm talking about amongst Christians here. How should Christians treat other Christians?

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How should we as if if we believe that the doctrines of grace are biblical?

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How do we present them to others even those who would? Claim the name of Christ and yet oppose these doctrines.

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Well as We think about that There there's a lot in Scripture About how we should communicate with us, you know ever notice that it and I I'm gonna be straight up front with you

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I think a lot of people involved in apologetics Tend to shy away from these texts

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Because they are so convicting Because they

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Provide so much. They shed so much light on our motivations and It So I think we just avoid them.

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So we know that When Paul wrote Timothy The elder is not to be quarrelsome with gentleness

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Correcting those who are in opposition if perhaps God might grant them repentance These are this is a biblical command and this is specifically about people who are in opposition and There are a lot of people who say hey if they oppose these truths

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We don't have to worry about how we treat them. We can treat them disrespectfully We can we can we can insult them.

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We can we can misrepresent them. It doesn't matter We're just we can do whatever we want

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So There's lots of places we could go we could talk about, you know, James and and what he says and we can talk about specifically how the elder is supposed to behave and how he's supposed to control his tongue and and And what it means to be respectful and all the rest that stuff

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But for all Christians as we interact with one another Paul's words in Ephesians chapter 4 is what

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I was pointed to And I think it's fitting to consider what is said here because as we as You and I communicate and there's different ways of doing so on the

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Internet today I'm committing I'm communicating by video for some of you people by audio for others

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Maybe a little bit of both you know this morning I When I listened to that episode

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That was a video episode, but I listened to the vast majority of it rather than watching it just was more convenient

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And there wasn't it's not like there was anything being shown on the screen that necessarily required your your attention but also as we

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Tweet as we tweet longer with 280 characters now as we

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Post on Facebook as we put pictures and videos even as we make memes For example, do you have what

20:10

I'm sending you right now? Here's a here's a meme that was posted by pulpit and pen and You know the top of the meme says how do moderate

20:26

Calvinist respond to a Dorotean Calvinist who says that our minion ism is heresy according to Calvinist history.

20:34

He is in caged age I'm appalled hyper Calvinist. My favorite man crush apologists would never do that Do you think the toes of Ravenhill and Wesley were not saved?

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He is ungracious the so ungracious I am tired these kinds of Calvinist did the thief in the cross know all the five points, etc, etc and you see the you know, the crying weeping at the bottom and and So on and so forth and then notice the term the the wording at the top

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There's increasing reason to believe that James White has named Alvin Omega ministries after himself. Okay So this is a meme posted by pulpit and pen

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Alvin Omega ministries Was founded when

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JD Hall was about what 10 something like that and And We were reaching out to Mormons and others when he was but a child and we had the name

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Alvin Omega ministries and We felt it was fitting because it seemed to be the

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At the time in our experience and dealing with Mormons and Jehovah's Witnesses primarily

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To be such a fitting Refutation of all the false teachings that these groups presented about the person of Christ and so This is meant to be demeaning insulting

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It is obviously Has no intention of being honest, but you see the mindset amongst many people today is as long as it's a meme

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You can lie about someone to make a point and that's okay So you saw the absurd meme that Steve Camp posted

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Of the three guys dancing in Keller's Church, but he put

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Linda Sarsoura's face, Yasir Kai's face, and my face on the people that were dancing and this is just It's childish.

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It does it does memes Generally unless they're really really well done come across as extremely childish and certainly

22:43

Steve Camp's memes have been extremely childish and comments along those lines but It seems like we have the idea that it's for example,

22:54

I noticed for years that The television programs I could never watch any of them, but yet you just catch snippets of them the cartoon television programs

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Hit a gutter level of Sexual innuendo and and humor long before The the ones with real actors in them could because the idea is well, it's cartoon

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You can't really can't really take that seriously so we can go ahead and push the envelope a whole lot more with that and and be much more disgusting with that than we

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We can anything else and and it just seems like we have that same attitude Even amongst

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Christians is that you as long as you can meme it then we we're not we're not accountable for it.

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So the things that we we put up on The internet

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I believe fall under the Words we're going to read here from Ephesians chapter 4 and that means

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I have to Be submissive to these words as well as anybody else

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Paul says Let no Unwholesome and that oh,

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I wasn't actually going to do that. Don't really have it set up for that I Mean, I guess

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I can just put on top of the other one and then it'll be close, but that wasn't my intention But anyways, let no unwholesome word

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Proceed from your mouth And that term unwholesome

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You'll notice BDAG Defines that as bad or unwholesome the extent of being harmful bad evil in a moral sense and so There This should not this should not just be as we are speaking with one another but as we are

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Typing on Twitter and typing on Facebook So proceed from your mouth would include

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Be typed by your fingers Dictated by Siri or whatever

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But opposite of that only Such as is good for The the need of the moment the the good for edification according to the need of the moment so in other words

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You should always be looking to build up in whatever situation you see

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Even if you feel the need or the desire to address a particular subject Address it in such a way as to build up not to tear down That's not always easy to do

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But that needs to be the first thought across your mind is only such a word is as good for Advocation going in the moment so that it what in order that it might give grace

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To the ones hearing. I think that if I were to Explain the

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The reason that there are so many Self -professing Christians who are

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Coming after me now Because of the way that I seek to engage in the debates and the dialogues and the public

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Exchanges that I have the opportunity to do with Islam or anybody else is that my desire in those encounters is

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To build up to edify the Saints To open a door for the gospel for those who are not in the household of faith

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But that I want my communication To give grace to those who hear now to those who who don't hear

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I I've never been able to know what I can do for them there are going to be those who do not as you said there those do not have ears to hear and They're on both sides the of the aisle on the the other side of the my debate opponent and even on my side

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There are people is don't have ears to hear they their minds are made up. They're not listening For whatever reasons

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I can't I cannot concern myself about them and when they write to me and insult me

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And so I I just have to leave it to the Lord and say Lord you will be done. I did the best

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I could and nothing I can do for this particular individual, but So that it will in order that it might grant grace to the hearing ones and The only way

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I know to do that is to get myself out of the way as much as possible and that means that there are times when certain of your opponents are going to Personally attack you to try to drag you into that situation

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Now it's different when you're not in a debate when you have more time and if it's possible to Do it what

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I'm trying to do right now. I'm trying to edify I'm trying to take what would be looked at as a negative situation.

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We have Christians attacking other Christians we have people behaving badly on the internet and giving the faith and Reform theology a really bad name.

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I mean, they are just fulfilling the standard stereotype of Calvinist as being mean ugly

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Graceless people that just want to win Theological battles and get their theological swords rich with Arminian blood and So it'd be really easy to just go.

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Oh, I'm just gonna give up on the whole thing And I'm just this is just ridiculous and I'm you know Never gonna try to talk to anybody again just become silent.

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No, I want to try to edify to encourage to try to in some way shape or form be a voice for a biblical position and What I'm saying in this situation is in a debate

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The temptation is to be so concerned about Me and how

29:58

I look that you get in the way of the actual position. You're trying to present to others and so you want to speak a

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Word that is good for edification according to the need of the moment and that's where you need the

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Spirit's assistance and I am NOT saying That everyone has to respond exactly like I do we're gonna

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I'm gonna show you a video here in a few minutes That was put out promoted by pulp and pen attacking me

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It's it's it, you know, it's grossly dishonest and it's you know, cutting things up and ignoring context It's it's mean -spirited and that's what you expect.

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I mean, we we just understand that sort of the essence of the pulp and pen thing but What you see there is my

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Trying to say that from my experience This is what I've experienced.

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This is what I'm trying to do I'm not saying that Dr. Theodore Zacariades should

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Speak like I speak. That's not what I was saying In fact listening to the

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Bible Thumbing Wingnut thing. They just completely missed the point. We weren't talking about tone We weren't the tone police If you can't tell the difference between you know, they're saying was

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I just love a Calvinist that speaks of passion I've spoken with passion about the doctrines of grace again longer than JD Hall's been involved in ministry

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Everybody knows that that's just again It's just a fact that that you can ignore facts if you want

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But it's just a fact have no problem with being passionate. I was passionate in presenting

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Romans 9 against Layton Flowers But the difference is it's one thing to be passionate

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It's another thing for your passion to become what you're communicating so that you are

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Diminishing the force and effect of what you want to communicate which is the truth of God's Word and what happened in that debate is

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Not that I well, I I did disagree with particular things, especially Theodore was saying I'm a

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I'm a compatibilist I'm concerned about some of the directions that their views are going.

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I certainly affirm the London Baptist Confession what it says the necessity of Affirming the reality of the human will but it's enslavement to evil and sin

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But there was so much they said which was true And it and it echoed many of the things that I've said to Layton Flowers over and over again now, of course, they take the position that and JD Hall took the position in the interview that Layton Flowers is a god -hater.

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He's he's a lost man needs to be saved And I don't take that position he might be

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But that's not my call. That's not I I don't claim to have whatever this miraculous gift that JD Hall claims to have of Discernment, whatever that is.

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I've never found that in the New Testament, but the ability to read hearts remotely over the internet. I Don't remember that was

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I thought he was a I thought he was a sationist but if you actually believe you you have that gift you must be a continuationist, but But anyway,

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I don't have that gift and so I have to go with what a person actually professes and If Layton Flowers is a god -hater

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Then I am more than happy to allow time to demonstrate that and the final judgment

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I sort of think God's view on this is best and I don't want to get myself in the way of that and God has a way of exposing these things over time and So I'm gonna take the position

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Layton Flowers claims Inconsistently That he is saved by grace alone through faith alone.

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I realize he's inconsistent at that point No two ways about it, and I do believe that he has

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Dangerously wrong ideas. I believe he's been forced into that I think there's background stuff here that some people are not even taking into consideration.

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I think he's been Basically asked to take a role in Southern Baptist life in the

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Dallas area, Fort Worth area Think of the schools there. Think of the people there he's been tasked with something and As a result, he's definitely, most definitely, that Karashio, by the way, it's ex -Nihilo

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The maker of the video we're gonna look at didn't know what that was. But anyways, it's Karashio ex -Nihilo

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And when he says that we are creating something by our own wills, yeah, I Indefensible But it's not a damnable heresy because I know a lot of Christians don't even know what

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Karashio ex -Nihilo is And so to be wrong about that not the issue

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It's real simple there are some Calvinists that are willing to look at people like these

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Like Layton Flowers, like Jonathan Pritchett and say God haters. I don't care what they say.

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They're lost That's that's their perspective. That's where they want to go and It has a result in how you approach them.

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You don't you don't approach these men as brothers. You're not going to seek to Exhort them to be consistent with the

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Word of God. In fact, you should just treat them as unbelievers And and call them to repent you can't you can't exhort them from the

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Word of God you can't resort Can't you cannot engage them as Christians. It's going to it's going to be a very very very different type of conversation and You're gonna have a pretty small little group and but a lot of these guys like that They like to have the small little group because we all look alike and I can be a really big fish in a really small pond that way

36:04

If that's your perspective more power to you, I Don't want to be a part of that personally and and that's why you are doing the things that you're doing and taking shots and stuff, but and I want to very strongly differentiate myself from that kind of perspective and So maybe they would say well, this is this is only about Christians.

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And so we don't need to worry about this We were talking about we were talking to unsaved men who are actually heretics And so we don't have to worry about whether it'll be give grace those who's here.

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I want Layton Flowers to hear with grace and To recover from the imbalance

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That is very plainly a part of his theological stance right now. I'd like to see that happen and Sometimes that takes years

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I Again, I've been doing this for a long time next year 35 years

37:05

Alpha Omega Ministries Since we were founded. I'm doing the math right? Aren't I 83 October of 83?

37:12

Yeah, so next year 35 years and We were just rich and I were just talking. We've got all these

37:18

Mike Beliveau gave us all these slides we just got to get into the one of those places and Put up some type of a page or something with what we had hair and big glasses type stuff and Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, you had the

37:35

Magnum PI mustache going and the whole nine yards Yeah, and look at those satin baseball jackets we had

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We you know, we ought to do them again The retro satin baseball jackets with the

37:49

Alpha Omega logo on them I bet you we could move a few of them if we did it'd be sort of fun What were you talking about?

37:55

Oh, yeah, I've been doing this for a while and I have had people come to me literally 20 years

38:03

Down the road and say you're not gonna remember this and sometimes they're right and sometimes they're wrong but you and I tangled over this and Man I wish

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I had listened to you back then and I've I've come to see you were right and it's changed my life and I'd rather hope for that for Layton Flowers Than to switch on the flamethrower and turn him into a crispy critter and make sure that he never ever

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Listens to what a reformed person ever says again and feel much better about myself in the process.

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I've I've got the long view I want to I want to extend that grace and for some people that's being namby -pamby and feminized and and and sissy and these are these are literally terms that Jordan Hall uses

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He literally talks about effeminate sissy. These are he types him out. He actually says them with his mouth

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I I'm not making this up It's stunning at times

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So that it will give grace to those who hear and then you you have

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You have a command here in in chapter 30 do not grieve

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The Holy Spirit of God by whom you were sealed for the day of redemption. I I don't think that Putting that verse right in between two verses about how we control our speaking in tongues is

39:35

I did not say speaking in tongues just in case anyone was is concerned and Unfortunately given the video we're gonna look at somebody would actually take that out and turn me into a raving charismatic.

39:48

I'm sure but Given that these two verses are

39:54

Specifically about how we speak man. I'm gonna tell you something. The only way that you can obey this command is through the work of the

40:03

Holy Spirit of God and when we do not Obey these commands is

40:13

That how we're grieving the Holy Spirit of God So Paul gives a reminder do not grieve the

40:19

Holy Spirit of God By whom you were sealed for the day of redemption. He is he is that that seal

40:29

Standard term that was used for the seals on business documents and things like that. I also found Ephesians He had used it back in Ephesians chapter 1

40:37

We are sealed with the Holy Spirit of God into the day of redemption let all bitterness piquilla

40:45

It's let all bitterness and thumos a tumult wrath or gay anger crowd a

40:57

Clamor the loud banging noises of a of a of a rowdy crowd blasphemia slander there is a

41:09

From a from a biblical perspective We should talk about blasphemia book

41:16

It's not Facebook. It's blasphemy a book It's blasphemy book and see we normally think of blasphemy as speaking against God, but in this context

41:27

This is slander. This is to speak against people Pulpit and pen slanders people that graphic I showed you earlier

41:36

Attributing to me The idea that I'm the Alpha and Omega. That's a lie.

41:42

It's blasphemy in this It's a violation a direct violation of Ephesians 431

41:48

It needs to be repented of Now, I don't know if there's anyone any longer that has any

41:55

Influence in Jordan Hall's life to call him to repentance for his violation of Ephesians 431

42:01

But that's what he did that's that's just that's straightforward and so it's slander

42:11

These things are to be put away from you and it's plural. Obviously, it has application each individual, but the church as a whole

42:20

Together with all kakiya now normally kakas is just something which is bad or something like that, but what's wonderful about the

42:29

Greek language and about lexical semantics is When you recognize

42:35

Context and utilization of words in context when you put together picria through moss or gay crowd gay blasphemy up and kakiya, then you you're obviously if you were to take what we're called the semantic domains of all of those words and See where those domains crossover with one another

43:00

We're talking about intentionality in speech and So this is malice.

43:09

This is speech specifically with the Non -redemptive intention of causing harm and The command is these things are to be put away from us which means if we need this command that means

43:35

It's far too easy for that abiding sin to cause us To not only engage in these things, but then to defend these things

43:46

To come up with reasons why we should be doing this. It's a manly thing to do you see these things were put away from us

43:58

Instead We are to be clay stoic Kind ice

44:04

Alelu's to one another we are to be you

44:10

Splunk Noi Tender hearted and Cut examining.

44:19

I how twice you hear that term caris Forgiving toward one another

44:27

Just as also God in Christ has forgiven you and really when you boil it all down when

44:40

I am speaking to a person in a debate if I truly want them to experience

44:52

God's forgiveness as I so Desperately recognize my need for God's forgiveness

45:01

It's going to change everything about that encounter if my first thought is that I Have to win this debate

45:13

Because of whatever reasons you can you can make them as Highfalutin sounding as you want, but unless I but if I have any other motivation

45:28

You're going to end up with a mess You're gonna end up with a mess But as long as I truly want that other person whether Christian or not to know

45:39

God's forgiveness in Christ Jesus, it's gonna change my attitude my answers my terminology

45:47

My willingness to go toe -to -toe With insults

45:56

How far I will bend over to communicate to make myself clear to hope for the best and To keep the audience in mind because I want the same thing for them.

46:08

I want the same thing for them and So I Think these words, well, they're right there in front of us.

46:19

They're right there on the page of Scripture They're just as authoritative as anything else unless you suffer from hyper red letterism

46:25

And some people do suffer from hyper letterism and We have to obey them we have to obey them

46:36

So with that in in mind I Was directed to This I Just saw it

46:51

Before the pro just before the program started and it was in one of this it was in a really Annoying form didn't even have a pause button on it but thankfully if you if you right -clicked it it had a download link what oh and I download link and So I was able to grab it and That way we can start and stop it

47:12

But I want you to we're gonna look at this as a as an example of blasphemy a

47:19

Violation of Ephesians chapter 4 sinful action on on the the net and Those of you who saw

47:30

The first I think this is from the first part of the review of of the debate you'll recognize just the

47:39

It would be humorous, but for its intention Utter disregard for context just let's not worry about what was really being said

47:49

Let's let's put up. Let's put a little something up in the up in the top To make it you know

47:57

You know we're gonna set the theme up there Whether that's what was actually being said whether that's fair or anything

48:08

The Internet has just filled this kind of stuff and I happen to be the object of this one But I think it's educational to just be able to recognize

48:17

Just how far whoever this was went and JD Hall knows what it is He's won't he was won't say because this he doesn't want

48:24

James White fanboys all over them That you could do this to anybody

48:31

You could do this to absolutely anyone it's really easy to do it doesn't didn't doesn't take much much effort

48:38

The problem is when you're doing it in a theological sense then it involves you in Violation of Ephesians 4 which we just we just looked at so let's let's take a look at at this

48:51

It's titled 8 4 0 7 4 sort of like species for Star Wars the unconquerable

48:58

Pride and hypocrisy of James White well, we don't want to poison the the the well too early.

49:05

Well, yes, I guess we do So right from right from the the start and we've got the warp core back there and something

49:11

I think there's jealous about the work or person. I think I should have turned the warp core up today What do you think I think it should have should have done that?

49:17

Yeah, okay That now let's let's look up the top

49:33

His debates are the standard so I Made a statement and it is an

49:44

Absolutely true statement and they will not refute the statement. I say them as I made the statement that In my opening statement in my debate with Layton flowers

49:53

There is more exegesis than there was in the entirety of the debate that took place I stand behind that I Challenge whoever made this or Jordan Hall to refute it.

50:04

They can't and they know it They absolutely know it Jordan Hall talked about the fact that he was really impressed

50:13

Really really impressed That the reform debaters in Houston did not use notes or at least

50:21

Sonny didn't and that is impressive That's Great in my debate with Layton flowers.

50:29

I didn't use any notes either. I Stood in front of the front of the podium with the Greek New Testament live translating from Romans 9 and Laying out an exegetical case from Romans chapter 9 so that means it was 20 minutes of solid direct from the

50:51

Greek text exegesis How much of that did you get in? How much exegesis was offered in the cross -examination where people are yelling over each other

51:04

None You didn't and we're talking about exegesis here. We're not talking about just reading a

51:10

Bible verse. We're actually talking about Relating that verse and its content to what comes before and after Following the argument, that's called exegesis.

51:22

That's not what we got in that debate. I Stand be beside it. But what you've done is if you start off by poisoning this he's a hypocrite and he's arrogant

51:32

No, it's a fact Has nothing to do with arrogance. It's a simple fact

51:37

I never said my debates are the standard and I never implied that you have to do it the exact same way

51:42

I do I do say That however you do it and whoever you are

51:50

Whether you're it was even said well Theodore is Greek and so that's the way they are I know another guy who makes an excuse for his wrathful

51:59

Inability to control his tongue on the basis of what nationality he is. I'm sorry

52:04

The Holy Spirit of God doesn't care what your nationality is You have certain biblical commands

52:12

So there are parameters you don't have to do it the exact way I do but you do have to seek to edify the hearers

52:20

You do have to to do that in light of the need of the moment to give grace to those who are hearing

52:26

You do have to those terms gentle. I you know JD Hall can do what he wants with those things.

52:32

He can't change the Greek language. They have a certain specific meaning And they don't mean wimpy, but they don't mean flamethrower either

52:41

They're specifically precluding that aspect of things. So there you go instead of Exegesis, I mean, let's let's just be honest

52:51

There is more exegesis in my opening statement in the debate in Dallas than in the entirety of the two hours of this debate

52:58

There's no question about that. That is that is that's just a fact. That's that's that's not opinion That's just pure fact and it is and if you want to dispute that You've got the videos

53:13

Dispute the facts You can't So if you don't like facts, well, I'm sorry if you don't like facts, you know, that's that's that's troubling

53:21

But if you don't like facts There may be a problem with you at that point But you just compare just take the time listen to Romans 9 debate.

53:31

They'll both be frustrating But Which one actually accomplished anything?

53:38

The I think the choice of this incredibly annoying sound in the background is Specifically, I think there's a reason for it

53:47

Well, it's meant It's not it's not meant to help you listen fairly

53:54

It's it's it's meant to be annoying and that's exactly why it was chosen You're being played with at that point

54:01

So you're not actually listening it's just got this strange noise in your in your in your yeah.

54:07

Yeah. Yeah, that's exactly it is You know, whoever did that's purposeful. It's very purposeful very clear

54:15

And we're just exposing it because we you know, we have the opportunity to do so who knows when the future we won't have that opportunity but we have the opportunity to to do so I think

54:25

The the greatest all -time zinger and in 161 debates for me. Oh, I'm sorry

54:31

I Get the distinct feeling that there is someone that's feeling somewhat inadequate out there

54:40

I Specifically I'm talking about a Situation and what was the context again?

54:48

The context was there are times When statements happen in debates and I have a little experience.

54:56

Sorry for that I guess that makes me arrogant for having been doing this for years but I have a little experience in this and I was talking about the kinds of debates and If you're looking to get your zinger statements in if you're looking to to take those shots

55:14

It's very different than if you're trying to seek the edification of the audience, but sometimes things just happen sometimes someone just Walks right into a statement.

55:24

I've walked into statements and other people have walked into statements So evidently they don't like the fact that I know how many debates

55:31

I've done. Oh, I'm sorry I bet JD Hall knows exactly how many statements he's done.

55:36

In fact as I listened to his interview on Bible Thumbing Wingnut, he Constantly was talking about the debates.

55:43

He's done by name with who he was debating a lot more than I did Hmm strange so far.

55:49

I've certainly learned to clarify that over the past number of years

55:55

I want to leave something behind that is going to be worthwhile for decades after I'm gone It it disappeared but up on the corner it flashed for decades.

56:06

I have no earthly idea Somehow this makes me arrogant that I want to do something that will have relevance after my life.

56:18

There you go. I Don't know maybe the maybe the person put this together will actually come out from hiding and Explain their motivations for this doubtful

56:32

Well, we're gonna hear hear a section here Well, I would say without question that Layton wandered directly into Harrison.

56:40

Okay, so I Specifically and and you know, it's really strange here is in the

56:47

Bible Thumbing Wingnut thing right at the beginning It was obvious that JD wasn't up to speed on What I've said about the debate

57:00

What was going on and so it was pointed out to him That instead of reviewing the debate

57:06

Layton Flowers has been reviewing the review of debate. That doesn't surprise me at all He's been he will do entire programs

57:15

About our debate 18 months ago, and he's still doing it. I mean talking about getting stuck in a rut

57:23

It's it's all he's got I mean, I feel sorry for the guy but Doesn't surprise me, but what was fascinating was

57:30

JD Hall's response was well, of course, he's doing that because James White's review would be so positive toward him.

57:37

I Obviously didn't listen to my debate because I was attacked by other people. How dare you talk about Layton Flowers?

57:44

they were absolutely attacked by those hyper Calvinists and and I'm just like really

57:53

You didn't listen to what I said and that I spent the vast majority of my time actually playing Layton Flowers comments and responding to that while I did have criticism for the

58:02

Reformed guys too, but I didn't spend nearly as much time on them as I did trying to make something positive

58:09

Come out of a shouting match Evidently you're not supposed to do that.

58:15

So so I said that Layton Wandered directly into heresy

58:21

When he talked about notice the it says here creation X It's called creatio ex nihilo

58:29

Whoever you are that made this up you could have googled that it has a specific theological meaning to it fairly well known

58:38

It means creation literally out of nothing but it Technically actually means into nothing at least as it was used in its original formulation

58:49

But yes, I I said that That he does this

58:54

Then they're going to take another clip from a different context and try to put the two together to accuse me of being inconsistent

59:03

Those who actually watch the program know this is called Category error ignoring what it is.

59:10

I'm talking about very common You know it this is you know, sort of childish type argumentation

59:17

But this is what we have on the net. This is this is the easy way of doing it is Hoping you know, if you've got people and look they're gonna be people watch this

59:26

They're not gonna take the time to watch what I actually said, and so I'll believe it so you can blaspheme

59:35

Dishonestly and You know there will be judgment someday I Can I can trust in them?

59:42

Saying that we create creation ex nihilo. I Mean, that's just that's just bald heresy.

59:50

No question about it Don't don't even cite that they do the other side did

59:56

In calling them heretics. Well according to Calvinist orthodoxy, that's heresy. Now was

01:00:01

I talking about the same thing? No That's 20 minutes later different context

01:00:07

We are talking about the standard by which something is considered heretical.

01:00:13

I Said that saying that our wills create something for our she acts in the helo would be heresy

01:00:20

Biblically speaking not according to Calvinist orthodoxy we were in a

01:00:28

Lutheran Church Talking with Southern Baptists about free will if you're going to accuse them of heresy base it upon Scripture which they themselves kept over and over again saying don't talk to us about the confession talk to us in the

01:00:45

Bible But then when they make the accusation of heresy they did on the basis of quote -unquote Calvinist orthodoxy now, maybe that was a misstatement on Theodore's part

01:00:53

But that's what I was talking about see how easy it is to ignore context when you're dishonest

01:00:59

When you have the wrong motives for what you do when you're sinning in what you're doing. It's really easy to do

01:01:04

I mean we see this in political stuff constantly Has no place

01:01:11

Within Christian discussion of these issues none whatsoever. None whatsoever. Well, that's not gonna get you very far with these folks, but view my respectful response to Norman Geisler as Namby Pamby And yet I can assure you okay, so notice what

01:01:30

I said entire church had been found because the potter's room yes Yes, I Churches where the leadership of that church either

01:01:44

As when they were in seminary that book introduced them to reform theology in the midst of it being attacked by the school around them and So when those people graduate they founded churches that are reformed to this day.

01:02:02

Yeah That yeah that that has happened other churches Because of that controversy have reformed and become reformed because One of the pastors or the elders as a group met studied said, you know

01:02:22

Because it was such a strong contrast between the two perspectives Especially for people that the church was already in a

01:02:30

Norman Geisler type Calvary Chapel ish Perspective it was particularly strong for those people if that's all they'd ever been given to see a strong reformed response to that and So yeah, that's true

01:02:48

God use that doesn't make me anything special. It just means that God has used that I don't think that's what

01:02:53

Norman Geisler intended to happen But I've used as an illustration many many times of the fact and that's what

01:02:59

I was using as illustration here was I Did not respond to Norman Geisler the way that Sonny and Theodore responded to Leighton Flowers and Jonathan Pritchett Nowhere in the

01:03:15

Potter's freedom. Do you you see me treating Norman Geisler, even though believe me believe me

01:03:23

The personal attacks upon me by Norman Geisler have been unbelievable unbelievable

01:03:32

Still didn't do it and as a result That was blessed

01:03:38

So was my response to Norman Geisler who has spent many more years than Leighton Flowers Opposing reformed theology.

01:03:45

So I guess that makes him a God hater too according to The standards being used

01:03:52

Does that make my response to him Namby Pamby then why'd the Lord bless it? You see my concern is and what

01:03:59

I would say To Sonny and Theodore is I again,

01:04:08

I Want what we do here to have a long -lasting impact.

01:04:13

I don't want it to just simply become irrelevant the day after I'm gone and the more it's attached to some persona and some blustery

01:04:28

Bravado The less life it's gonna have it's not gonna it's not gonna have value in the long run and I want what

01:04:38

I do to have value in the long run if you don't well, okay, that's between you and Lord I'm just simply saying that I think what will have value in the long run is that which is gracious and that which is

01:04:53

Done with gentleness and meekness and an eye to the glory of the Lord There I know of entire churches that have been founded

01:05:02

Because the potter's freedom is a pulpit and was going. Oh, yeah Man, didn't let them drag them off the subject.

01:05:09

Oh man and get some popcorn out snap. That's great Anyone I guess I didn't like the fact that I was quoting from what he said.

01:05:16

Did you not read the article? That's what he was saying. He said I wanted to get the popcorn out snap.

01:05:22

He used the term snap That was that was what JD said, yeah, have you read JD Hall stuff recently have you and he's back with a vengeance

01:05:29

He was gone for a little while some of us know why and and some of us predicted that he was gonna be back

01:05:36

Back with a vengeance or back with vengeance both And and we knew it was coming.

01:05:41

I knew it was gonna happen. We knew it was temporary thing But have you read this stuff? So I was quoting him

01:05:51

So, I guess I guess that was meant to be a shot But anyways presents that to me in a debate and I have enough time.

01:05:56

I'll shred it and that's not that's not arrogance in my part That's simple facts Okay, what's wrong with that?

01:06:06

Again if if that's untrue demonstrate its untruth But there are there are arguments

01:06:15

That will be shredded in a debate because they are just grossly fallacious arguments And that's why well, for example

01:06:25

Do forgive me for being able to provide examples from 161 debates, but I guess there's something wrong with that But when

01:06:34

I debated Graham Codrington on homosexuality in Johannesburg, I Did find fascinating that he did not present the view of Romans chapter 1 that he had presented on his blog and I truly believe that the reason he did not do so is he knew

01:06:53

That as long as I had any time to respond at all That perspective would be torn apart What's wrong with that?

01:07:01

What's wrong with making that statement? We're not told but again if you just if you just throw throw a

01:07:08

Few words up in the corner like here right now. We have the standard again throw a few words up in the corner to Try to do what you're trying to do here this type of so almost meme video is meant

01:07:23

For people who don't think clearly For those who are easily manipulated

01:07:30

It's really obvious but the only people who want to Manipulate people in this way are are not people that you really want to follow.

01:07:39

They're there. They are manipulative themselves They are dishonest and this is or put this together.

01:07:45

You're a dishonest man or woman. Whoever you are I don't know again who it was Like I said,

01:07:52

JD Hall knows so ask him But you're being manipulative and dishonest and One thing you can certainly tell when

01:08:01

I'm in cross -examination. I don't lose track of the audience They're still my central focus.

01:08:07

Is that a fact or is that not a fact? That's a fact So so whoever this is doesn't like facts.

01:08:15

I said nothing about my debates being the standard I did say and I stand by the the assertion that You should keep the audience in mind and what

01:08:25

I was saying at that point was they lost the audience They didn't care if anybody could hear them as long as the other side could hear them the people they were arguing with They didn't care.

01:08:33

This was a Lutheran Church Not a single quote from the bondage of the will in the

01:08:39

Lutheran Church. Yee -haw. There you go reform side No concern whatsoever about tying them in Getting them on their side

01:08:50

Communicating with them. This was all just us against them. We're gonna nuke them. They're gonna nuke us and everybody gets to watch

01:08:59

Okay, if I'm arrogant and terrible for saying that's probably not the best direction to go

01:09:09

Yeah, so that just as written let him who boasts boast and Lord which of course is in a soteriological context

01:09:17

About the fact that it is by his working that you are in Christ Jesus. So it's pretty obvious that the

01:09:25

Context issue is pretty big in this particular person's So that was um, that was the video promoted on pulpit and pen and Oh, it's

01:09:43

If pulpit and pen wants to just keep hammering on their own credibility like that Okay, you'll laugh there's people in the

01:09:51

YouTube channel begging you to stop playing it because the music is so annoying Oh, well, okay, you can turn that down if you want to But there you go

01:10:06

Talk talk about setting one up, but that's that's that's what you did with that one and And and JD knew all about it because remember right the day of the review.

01:10:17

He specifically stated In Facebook or Twitter someplace on social media

01:10:24

That we are busy Putting together a video just from that review. So that's what it was

01:10:30

It's one of his one of his people if it wasn't him himself. It was one of his people that put it together and you know the problem is when you

01:10:40

You know if I didn't have access To the internet then you might be able to get away with it, but it's this video thing

01:10:48

That's just so easy to actually get to Yeah, Chad Daniels asking the same video editor.

01:10:55

Yeah, it's very similar, isn't it? Yeah, you never know. So anyway, there you go

01:11:05

I'm just simply going to keep suggesting to people that the best way to honor the doctrines of grace is try to be gracious and If that's what

01:11:18

I get from my efforts and that's what I'll get from my efforts and and there there you go now

01:11:23

Let's move on to some more Edifying things or just briefly. Anyways, we got a little time left if we do a jumbo today

01:11:35

Boy I'll tell you There's so much going on in so many of the groups that we've dealt with for many many years

01:11:47

There's stuff going on up in Salt Lake City that I might tell you about in the next program, but I Cannot imagine the stresses that exist within the

01:11:59

Mormon Church today The the guys down in Manti Cannot be happy with the leadership in Salt Lake The back door of the

01:12:17

Mormon Church has become a Cavern I mean the people they are they are losing people right and left and I don't know what's going on up there

01:12:30

But you've got the leadership signaling a friendliness toward the

01:12:36

LGBTQ Moniker cause perspective. I can't think of anything that would be more out of character for the

01:12:49

Mormon concept of morality and ethics than the entire

01:12:56

Homosexuality transgenderism, etc, etc stuff. I mean, I I can't think of anything and Yet It's it's almost like Something happened after Spencer W Kimball sort of sort of when the something switched and Well, obviously

01:13:21

It was never Joseph Smith's intention For the church to be run the way it is right now It was never his intention that the guy in charge would always be at 92 year old invalid

01:13:31

But that's the system that developed which clearly shows it wasn't a divine system but that system that is developed and so I Mean you could come up with a lot of conspiracy theories as to what in the world is going on and I imagine there are a lot of Mormons that have a lot of conspiracy theories, but Something's you're gonna see splits.

01:13:52

You're gonna see some some major splits in That in that church in the not -too -distant future.

01:13:58

I I don't know what kind of I But we will we will see but meanwhile over in Rome This article came out and it says papal confidant

01:14:19

Claims Pope Francis has abolished hell purgatory and heaven

01:14:29

October 27th 2017 in the important newspaper La Repubblica of which he is the founder

01:14:35

Eugenio Scalfari Eugenio Scalfari Sounds like you have to say it that way an undisputed authority on Italian secular thought last

01:14:47

October 9th returned to speaking the following terms about what he sees as a revolution of this pontificate in Comments by Francis that are derived from his frequent conversations with him.

01:14:58

So this is a guy who's a papal confidant Pope Francis quote Pope Francis has abolished the places where souls were supposed to go after death hell purgatory in heaven the idea he holds is that souls dominated by evil and unrepentant cease to exist

01:15:16

While those that have been redeemed from evil will be taken up into beatitude contemplating

01:15:23

God Observing immediately afterward quote the universal judgment that is in the tradition of the church therefore becomes devoid of meaning

01:15:32

It remains a simple pretext that has given rise to splendid paintings in the history of art nothing other than this end quote

01:15:43

The article says it is seriously doubtful that Pope Francis really wants to get rid of the last things in the terms described by Scalfari There is in his preaching however something that tends toward a practical overshadowing of the final judgment and of the opposite destinies of the blessed and the damned on Wednesday October 11th at the general audience in st.

01:16:03

Peter's Square Francis said that such a judgment is not to be feared because quote at the end of our history

01:16:09

There is the merciful Jesus end quote and therefore quote Everything will be saved everything end quote and then notice this in the text distributed to the journalist accredited to the

01:16:22

Holy See This last word everything was emphasized in boldface I've said

01:16:33

For many years the majority of the magisterium is minimally

01:16:40

Inclusivistic and a large portion of it is Universalistic and That's true at another general audience few months ago on Wednesday August 23rd

01:16:51

Francis gave for the end of history an image That is entirely and only comforting that of quote an immense tent

01:16:58

Where God will welcome all mankind so as to dwell with them definitively end quote an

01:17:05

Image that is not his own but is taken from chapter 21 of Revelation But from which Francis was careful not to cite the following words of Jesus quote

01:17:12

The victor will inherit these gifts and I shall be his God and he will be my son But as for cowards the unfaithful depraved murderers the unchaste sorcerers

01:17:20

Idle worshipers and deceivers of every sort their lot is in the burning pool of fire and sulfur, which is the second death end quote and Again in commenting during the

01:17:30

Angelus of Sunday October 15th on the parable the wedding banquet Matthew 22 1 through 14 That was read at all the masses on that day

01:17:37

Francis carefully avoided citing the following unsettling parts Both that in which quote the king became indignant sent his troops and had those murderers killed in their city burned

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End quote and that in which having seen quote one man who was not wearing the wedding garment End quote the king ordered his servants bind him hand and foot and throw him into the outer darkness

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There shall be weeping there and gnashing of teeth on the previous Sunday October 8th another parable that the murderous vine dressers

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Matthew 21 33 to 43 had undergone the same selective treatment and commenting on the parable during the

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Angelus the Pope left out what the owner of the vineyard does to those farmers who killed the servants And finally the son he will put those wretches to a miserable death

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Much less that he cite the concluding words of Jesus referring to himself as the cornerstone He who falls in a stone will be broken to pieces, but when it falls on anyone it will crush him instead

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Pope Francis insists on defending God from the accusation of being vindictive almost as if wanting to mitigate the

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Excesses of justice detected in the parable quote it is here The great news of Christianity is found a

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God who in spite of being disappointed by our mistakes and our sins Does not go back on his word does not stop and above all does not avenge himself

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Brothers and sisters God does not avenge himself God loves he does not avenge himself.

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He waits for us to forgive us to embrace us and Quote now if those words sound odd to you

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You don't know much about liberal South American Theology it wouldn't have been difficult to know that that's exactly what this man believed when he was selected

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Wouldn't you like to know what was really going on there? In the homily for the Feast of Pentecost last

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June 4th Francis argued as he often does against those who judge and in saying the Words of the risen

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Jesus the Apostles and implicitly to their successors in the church. He intentionally cut them off halfway through He quoted receive the

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Holy Spirit whose sins you forgive they will be forgiven stopping Omitting the following those you do not forgive they will not be forgiven

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And the fact that the truncation was delivered is proven by its repetition because Francis had made the exact same deletion of the words of Jesus on the previous

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April 23rd at the Regina Kelly I of the first Sunday after Easter Last May 12th as well while visiting

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Fatima Francis showed that he wanted to set Jesus free from his reputation as an inflexible judge at the end of time and To do this he warned against the following image of Mary now

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This is fascinating because this image of Mary is all over Roman Catholicism, I mean go read

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Liguri Francis de Liguri glories of Mary. This is on every page a Mary of our own making one who restrains the arm of a vengeful

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God one sweeter than Jesus the ruthless judge That's the quote from the

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Pope That is an accurate view of What is in Liguri, but Liguri has been made a doctor of the church and his books gone through 85 editions

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Hmm It must be added that the Liberty with which Pope Francis cuts and stitches up the words of sacred scripture does not concern only the universal

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Judgment deafening for example is the silence in which he has always shrouded Jesus' condemnation of adultery

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In a surprising coincidence this condemnation was contained contained in the gospel passage Which was read in all the churches of the world

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Precisely on the Sunday of the beginning of the second session of the synod of bishops on the family October 4th, 2015

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But neither in the homily nor at the Angelus on that day Did Pope Francis make the slightest reference to it nor do you make any reference to it at the

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Angelus of Sunday February 12 2017 when that condemnation was once again read in all the churches, so there's more stuff in regards to homosexuality so and so forth, but I I just don't know

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What Roman Catholic apologists can do in this context?

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What are they supposed to do? I mean you want on the one one hand as Roman Catholic to talk about the unity and We don't have all the problems you guys had because the solo scriptura, but you're sitting you're sitting on a powder keg

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This guy is not in harmony with any meaningful definition of Tradition But when the

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Pope says I am tradition as allegedly some Popes in the past have affirmed

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What are you supposed to do now and I've told the story many times Back when

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John Paul the second was Pope I sent It was what John Paul would do is like it's sort of like one year

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He threw out stuff the liberals and one year he threw out stuff the conservatives and the next year back to the liberals and next Year back to the concern.

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It's what he had to do to keep a very diverse organization together and so I had sent a

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Statement from John Paul the second in contrast with Mmm.

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It may have been the words. I think it was the words of unum sanctum Yeah, it was the words of unum sanctum. I think it's what it was

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Anyway, it's been a number of years I sent Roberts and Janice and Roberts and Janice's response was who are you to interpret what the church back then meant?

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And I'm like we know what the church back then meant look how they acted look out Look at what they did as a result of unum sanctum.

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Nope. Nope. Nope. Nope. Only the only the the modern church is infallible and can infallibly interpret the intention of the non modern church and So all you gotta do is read the papal syllabus of errors to know that what was that 1854?

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It's a name that's the number comes across my mind. I say it was 1854 It's only been a hundred and Sixty years

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Since the papal syllabus of errors anyone can read that document and then listen to Francis and go

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Those Pope that that Pope back then would have identified this Pope as an antipode and if this

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Pope was honest, he'd have to do the same thing in reverse, but It's not that he's dishonest.

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It's that he has embraced this concept which didn't exist back in 1854 Cardinal Newman's development hypothesis taken on steroids

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To the point where now you can just directly state that The church's tradition is living and therefore you can you can develop this tradition to where Look if if Rome is ever going to abandon

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Oh, it's 1864. Thank you. I'll go just happened to look over at the screen and it was in the 1800s and had a four at the end

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So I was fairly close 1864 If Rome's ever going to abandon its historical stance on sexual morality life

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Marriage She has sown the seeds of her own destruction in Her unwillingness to submit to sola scriptura

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Because once you give to the living magisterium the power and ability to Reinterpret the living tradition

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Objectivity is gone You've got new revelation call it what you want say.

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Oh, no, it's not a revelation It's just been it's it it has been implicitly contained You can change what you believe

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You can change what you believe. It's all there is to it and so I Would not want to be defending

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Roman Catholicism Roman Catholicism these days and it does make me wonder

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I haven't bothered to look But I I wonder what? Jerry Manatee is saying these days

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I told you so I Really wonder if if Jerry once in a while doesn't just sort of stop and go

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Where did I go wrong? I can tell you where you went wrong there. I can I can tell you where you went wrong and But man, he must be looking at this going told you this is coming and Yeah Someone in channel just says

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I look younger this week Well, thank you, I guess I don't know

01:27:06

Rich said you see people get angry with me about Taking shots at rich and you know what

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I do is I tell them you don't hear what he says to me Okay, you only hear my side and I get picked on for this

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So I just made that statement what I heard wafting through the not quite properly sealed door is you look pretty old to me

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So just just keep that in mind When and when you get you know, little well angry about what

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I say about about rich. So Anyways, alright folks. There you go All sorts of stuff today on a jumbo edition of the dividing line.

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Here's the plan for next for what will be here again I'm assuming Thursday Today's Tuesday.

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I'm not see I'm going to be I'm going to want the my Grace for the hearers.

01:28:02

I'm not going to say anything about rich not knowing what day of the week it is. Um, so we'll be here

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Thursday and Then next week you're actually going to come in just on Tuesday because next week believe it or not folks is

01:28:16

Thanksgiving week. Yeah caught up Snuck up on me, too so we'll do one program on Tuesday of next week and then all

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I can say is I hope it cools off By Thanksgiving.

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I remember one Thanksgiving. It was 84 So it could stay this way. We haven't had any cool weather here in Phoenix yet, and I'd like to break out a

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Coogee someday, you know, but I Love leather jackets, too

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But why I mean I get to wear it, you know twice a year and then it sits in the closet.

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It's sad But anyway Um, yeah, someone said I should have respect for my elders in channels, so That's that's true.