September 12, 2018 Show with Dr. George Scipione on “The Battle for the Biblical Family”

Live from the historic parsonage of 19th century gospel minister George Norcross in downtown

Carlisle, Pennsylvania, it's Iron Sharpens Iron, a radio

platform on which pastors, Christian scholars and theologians address the burning issues

facing the church and the world today.

Proverbs 27 verse 17 tells us, iron sharpens iron, so one

man sharpens another.

Matthew Henry said that in this passage, quote, we are cautioned to take heed whom we

converse with and directed to have in view in conversation to make one another

wiser and better.

It is our hope that this goal will be accomplished over the next hour and we hope to hear

from you, the listener, with your own questions.

Now here's our host, Chris Arnton.

Good afternoon, Cumberland County, Pennsylvania, Lake City, Florida and the rest of humanity living on the planet

Earth who are listening via live streaming at ironsharpensironradio .com.

This is Chris Arnton, your host of Iron Sharpens Iron Radio, wishing you all a happy Wednesday on this 12th

day of September 2018, and I'm delighted to have as a very first -time

guest today on Iron Sharpens Iron Radio, Dr. George Cipione.

He is director and adjunct professor at the Biblical Counseling Institute of the

Reformed Presbyterian Theological Seminary in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania, and today he is going to be

addressing the theme of one of his books, The Battle for the Biblical Family, and it's my honor and

privilege to welcome you for the very first time to Iron Sharpens Iron Radio, Dr. George Cipione.

Thank you.

It's my privilege and honor to be here.

Great.

Well, although we have had other faculty members of the Reformed Presbyterian Theological

Seminary as guests on this program, for those of our listeners who have not

heard those guests and know little or nothing about Reformed Presbyterian Theological Seminary, why

don't you let our listeners know something about that institution?

Well, it's the Stoic covenanters that were at the

seminary.

Yeah, they dismissed Robert Gagnon, didn't they?

Yes, he's gone now.

He was just the last remnant of

the denominational seminary.

The Stoic covenanters, they sing...

Exclusively.

Exclusive, yes.

And for anybody who wants to investigate that seminary to find out more about it, you can

go to rpts .edu, rpts .edu, and hopefully I

will remember to announce that information later as well.

Well, since you are a first -time guest, Dr. Cipione, what we normally do when we have a first -time guest

is we take a portion of the time to have that guest give a summary of your

testimony of salvation, the kind of religious atmosphere you were raised in, if any, and what the providential

circumstances that our Sovereign Lord raised up in your life that drew you to

himself and ultimately saved you.

She got saved when she was 15.

Yes, the church where I was saved in Amityville, Long Island, in the 1980s, was

at the time in the Conservative Baptist Association.

Well, there it is.

That's where it was.

And

the

pastor

said,

long

story

short,

and I'm Italian.

I had no idea.

Really, the

doctrines of

grace, or hearing the doctrines of grace at Westminster in Philadelphia.

And uh...

Praise God.

And when did it become apparent to you that God was calling you into the ministry?

That's a very good question.

And then you obviously realized that you had certain either interests or

gifts in the area of counseling, which led you into that field as well, if you could explain that.

Yes, well, that was part of it, like, you know, being mentored by Jay Adams.

Praise God.

And you used a phrase that some of our listeners might be unfamiliar with,

a phrase I believe it may have been coined by Jay Adams, but I'm not certain if he coined it or not.

But, Newthetic Counseling.

If you could explain how Newthetic Counseling and the counseling that you

personally subscribe to today, and also the

ideology of counseling utilized by CCEF,

if you could share with us how those views, they might not all be identical

to the 21st century, I'm not sure, but how those views differ from your typical

Christian counselor that may either consciously or unconsciously be using

more pop psychology and secular ideology than he or his

counselees are aware of.

Okay, good, good.

But that was what he had developed, and that had...

Praise God.

And so, Dr. Adams and CCEF and you

are basically still all basically saying the same thing in regard to the

ideology of counseling?

Yes, I think there's...

We'll stick with scripture, we

can create an application.

Great.

Well, I'm going to give our listeners our email address if you would like to ask a question of Dr. Scipione on his

book, The Battle for the Biblical Family, and any other area involving Christian counseling,

that would be fine as well.

Our email address is chrisarnsen at gmail .com.

C -H -R -I -S -A -R -N -Z -E -N at gmail .com.

And please, as always, give us your first name, at least, your city and state of residence, and your country of residence

if you live outside the USA.

Please only remain anonymous if your question involves a personal and private matter.

And obviously, since we have a biblical counselor on the program that

would lend itself to people wanting to ask personal and private questions, so you may feel

free to do so.

But please don't be anonymous unless it is a personal and private matter.

Well, the book that you have written, The Battle for the Biblical Family, why don't you tell us

what the catalyst was for you to write this book to begin with?

Okay, I'll give you a complete honest answer.

I'm God's child and I have to be honest.

Well, I want to read just a few endorsements for this book so our listeners have

an idea of who has been applauding it.

First of all, we have James Neuheiser, Director of Counseling at Reform Theological Seminary.

He says, what makes this book unique is its covenantal perspective as it deals

comprehensively with what God's Word says about the family.

And that, as I said, is James Neuheiser.

And we have Samuel Ling, President of the China Horizon Professor Emeritus of

Systematic Theology at International Theological Seminary.

He says, Scipione lays out the biblical, theological, and cross -cultural foundations for

rebuilding the family, God's way, and gives practical strategies church leaders and

families take up and read.

And then we have Jerry O 'Neill, President of Reformed Presbyterian Theological Seminary, where Dr. Scipione

serves on the faculty.

Scipione fills his book with personal anecdotes.

Reading the book is almost as good as hearing him teach.

And that is the book that we are addressing, The Battle for the Biblical Family.

Published by our friends at Cross and Covenant Publications, who have been very good to Iron Trip

and Zion Radio and our listeners.

Well, this book is, as you know, broken up into five major

sections.

The Family, Why Bother?

The Family, Does God Care?

Is the West Best?

Where's the Battle?

And what's the strategy?

If you could begin on The Family, Why Bother?

What did you mean by that section of the book?

Well, I think God says...

And what do you mean specifically?

This may seem like a no -brainer, but I'm sure throughout Christendom, you might have different answers to this

question.

But what do you mean by the biblical family?

Yeah, the biblical family...

And obviously the next key word in your title, what is this battle about that you're speaking of?

Well, I mean in 2018, you know, one day

after...

We are going to our first break right now.

If you would like to join us on the air with a question of your own, our email address is chrizarnsen at

gmail .com.

That's C -H -R -I -S -A -R -N -Z -E -N at gmail .com.

Please, as always, give us your first name, your city and state, and your country of residence, if you live outside the USA, and only remain

anonymous if your question involves a personal and private matter.

Don't go away.

God willing, we'll be back right after these messages with more of Dr. George Sipioni and the battle for the

biblical family.

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Hi, Bill Johnson here.

I'm executive director of John MacArthur's media ministry, Grace to You, and I'm also an occasional

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So I'm delighted that my friend Chris Arnzen and I will be heading down to Atlanta for the G3

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My name is Steve Lawson, founder and president of One Passion Ministries, as well as teaching fellow for Ligonier

Ministries.

I serve as professor of preaching and oversee the doctor of ministry program at the Master's Seminary in Los Angeles.

I would like to recommend the church where one of my preaching students, Andy Woodard, serves as the pastor.

It's called New Covenant Church, NYC.

They are a reformed Baptist church that meets in midtown Manhattan.

You can find their service times and location on their website, which is www

.ncc .nyc.

They believe in a sovereign God who commands all men everywhere to repent and believe the gospel.

If you're looking for a church that believes in expository preaching, which is simply biblical preaching,

in New York City, I'd like to recommend that you visit New Covenant Church, NYC.

Again, their information can be found at www .ncc .nyc.

Have a great day.

Chris Arnzen, host of Iron Sharpen's Iron Radio here.

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Hello, my name is James Renahan, and I'm the president of IRVS Theological Seminary in Mansfield, Texas.

The Word of God says, If a man desires the office of an overseer, he desires a good thing.

Do you have the desire to serve Jesus Christ in pastoral ministry?

Twenty years ago, the Institute of Reformed Baptist Studies at Westminster Seminary, California was born.

For those two decades, these institutions worked together to train men for ministry in Reformed Baptist

churches.

It has been a wonderful partnership.

Now we have advanced our school into an independent seminary offering a full program of courses leading to

the Master of Divinity degree.

This is IRVS Theological Seminary.

We believe that the scriptures of the Old and New Testaments are the inspired and inerrant Word of God, that Jesus Christ

is God in the flesh who came to save sinners by his life, death, and resurrection, and that the task of the church is to

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Do you sense a call to serve Jesus Christ and his church as a pastor?

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That's irvsseminary .org, two S's in the middle.

I hope to hear from you soon.

God bless you.

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And we are now back with our interview with Dr. George C. Scipioni,

and he is discussing his book, The Battle for the Biblical Family.

Our email address is chrisarnson at gmail .com, chrisarnson at gmail .com.

And please give us your first name, city and state, and country of residence.

We have a listener from Mechanicsburg, Pennsylvania, Gordy, who says, How

can we most effectively guide our children in their understanding of and engagement with

people who are in the LGBTQ camp?

It's getting harder and harder to remember that acronym.

Sure. Expanding every day.

Yeah.

Only by the...

Well, thank

you, Gordy in

Mechanicsburg.

And you have won a free copy of the book, The Battle for the Biblical Family by our guest, Dr.

George C. Scipioni.

Compliments of Crown and Covenant Publications.

And you can swing by, since you're so close, to Cumberland Valley Bible Book Service,

cvbbs .com.

Since you're so close to them geographically, they're right on North Hanover Street in Carlisle, Pennsylvania.

Why don't you swing right over there tomorrow, or sometime this week, and pick up your copy, which

will be waiting there for you, so you can spare them the expense of mailing the book out to you.

And we thank cvbbs .com again, and Todd and Patty Jennings, the owners,

for shipping out our winners.

They're free copies of Bibles and books that they win by sending in questions to our guests on this

program.

You said something that I wanted you to clarify a bit.

You were talking about the fact that we cannot be friends of the world that

can mean different things to different people.

Obviously, Jesus was a friend, and is a friend of sinners.

Jesus ate with prostitutes and tax collectors.

And from my understanding of the New Testament, the only ones that we are not to be seen

eating with, especially in public, are those that profess to be our

brothers and sisters in Christ, who have fallen into

egregious, perhaps scandalous sin, and they are unrepentant over those

sins.

But as far as your neighbor, who's an atheist, an agnostic, a member of a

false religion, aren't we to befriend people like that so that we can cultivate

relationships with them, and be better ambassadors for Christ to them,

bringing them the gospel as well as being just good neighbors and friends and

loving representatives of God in their lives?

Yes,

venues

were

not

to

become

re

-opinionated

like

that.

Yeah, you just jolted in my memory here the connection between

the Reformed Presbyterian Theological Seminary and someone who I'm about to mention, Rosaria

Butterfield, whose husband, Pastor Kent Butterfield, is a graduate of

Reformed Presbyterian Theological Seminary, and he is actually a covenanter or a member of the

RPCNA denomination, a pastor in that denomination.

And Rosaria, for those of our listeners who don't know who that is, and if you don't, I strongly urge you to go up

to the Iron Sharpens Iron Radio archive, ironsharpensironradio .com,

and if you type in the name Butterfield into the search engine of the

past shows podcasts section, where the recordings are archived, you will see

several interviews come up that I urge you to listen to.

But she was a lesbian.

She was not only a lesbian, but she was a very leftist, a very strongly

leftist tenured professor.

I believe it was Syracuse University.

Yes, she taught gay and queer studies.

Yeah, and she was led to Christ by the neighborly friendship

of a man that she thought that she was going to hate, had something to do with a

conversation sparked by a newspaper article, and I believe it was the pastor that wrote a

newspaper article, and Rosaria was responding to it.

And this pastor and his wife bombed Rosaria Butterfield

with love, invited her over their home, and her original

name, I believe, was Rosaria Champagne, if I'm not mistaken, her maiden name.

And she was led to Christ by this family through their love and through their

inviting her over their home to dine with them, and then they eventually, when she got saved, they introduced her to Kent

Butterfield, and they got married after her salvation.

And, of course, repentance from the whole lesbian and left -wing agenda.

But that is a remarkable example of a godly friendship

extended towards a very lost individual.

She has three books that I know of.

Yes, I'm looking right at it right now.

And that's her... That's her...

Well, there you have a very, very happy ending, to put it mildly, in regard to someone being

brought from darkness into light for eternity through a friendship.

And so, in regards to Christian parents who have

children, when do you think that, parentally,

those children should be given permission to have friends that are lost?

Obviously, the Bible doesn't give age numbers for a lot of things.

It's not that detailed a blueprint.

But I'm assuming, from what you said, that you would not want your little children spending a

lot of time with the children of lost neighbors then until they are of an older age.

And is there an older age, or do you determine that by the behavior of your own child or children?

I

think

it's

in

the...

Oh, so you wouldn't mind, or you wouldn't disapprove of a Christian family with young

children having the neighbor's children, who are the lost children of lost

parents, over the home to, you know, spend a sleepover with your children?

A sleepover is a little different.

I mean, I'd want to know these kids real well.

I mean, my...

Well, we have to go to our midway break right now.

The midway break on Iron Trip and Zion Radio is longer than the other breaks because Grace Life Radio, 90 .1 FM in

Lake City, Florida, requires of us a longer break between our two major segments because they air

their own commercials and public service announcements to localize Iron Trip and Zion Radio to Lake City, Florida.

So please be patient with us as we take this longer than normal break.

And I ask you to use this time wisely by writing down questions for Dr. Cipione, which you can

email to chrisarnson at gmail .com.

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to chrisarnson at gmail .com.

Chrisarnson at gmail .com with a question for Dr. George Cipione on the battle for the biblical family.

And please give us your first name, city and state, and country of residence.

And only remain anonymous if your question involves a personal and private matter.

Don't go away.

We'll be right back after these messages with Dr. George Cipione.

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My name is Steve Lawson, founder and president of One Passion Ministries, as well as teaching fellow for Ligonier

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I serve as professor of preaching and oversee the doctor of ministry program at the Master's Seminary in Los Angeles.

I would like to recommend the church where one of my preaching students, Andy Woodard, serves as the pastor.

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They believe in a sovereign God who commands all men everywhere to repent and believe the gospel.

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in New York City, I'd like to recommend that you visit New Covenant Church, NYC.

Again, their information can be found at www .ncc .nyc.

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Hello,

my name is James Renahan, and I'm the president of IRBS Theological Seminary in Mansfield, Texas.

The Word of God says, If a man desires the office of an overseer, he desires a good thing.

Do you have the desire to serve Jesus Christ in pastoral ministry?

Twenty years ago, the Institute of Reformed Baptist Studies at Westminster Seminary, California was born.

For those two decades, these institutions worked together to train men for ministry in Reformed Baptist

churches.

It has been a wonderful partnership.

Now we have advanced our school into an independent seminary, offering a full program of courses leading to

the Master of Divinity degree.

This is IRBS Theological Seminary.

We believe that the scriptures of the Old and New Testaments are the inspired and inerrant Word of God, that Jesus Christ

is God in the flesh who came to save sinners by his life, death, and resurrection, and that the task of the church is to

honor and serve the triune God in all things.

IRBS Theological Seminary is dedicated, by God's grace, to preparing godly ministers who will be committed to

these doctrines.

Do you sense a call to serve Jesus Christ in his church as a pastor?

Why not consider IRBS Theological Seminary?

You'll find more information at irbsseminary .org.

That's irbsseminary .org, two S's in the middle.

I hope to hear from you soon.

God bless you.

Hi, I'm Buzz Taylor, frequent co -host with Chris Arnzen on Iron Sharpen's Iron Radio.

I would like to introduce you to my good friends, Todd and Patty Jennings at CVBBS, which stands for Cumberland Valley

Bible Book Service.

Todd and Patty specialize in supplying Reformed and Puritan books and Bibles at discount prices that make them

affordable to everyone.

Since 1987, the family -owned and operated book service has sought to bring you the best available Christian books

and Bibles at the best possible prices.

Unlike other book sites, they make no effort to provide every book that is available, because frankly, much of what

is being printed is not worth your time.

That means you can get to the good stuff faster.

It also means that you don't have to worry about being assaulted by the pornographic, heretical, and

otherwise faith -insulting material promoted by the secular book vendors.

Their website is CVBBS .com.

Browse the pages at ease, shop at your leisure, and purchase with confidence as Todd and Patty work

in service to you, the church, and to Christ.

That's Cumberland Valley Bible Book Service at CVBBS .com.

That's CVBBS .com.

Let Todd and Patty know that you heard about them on Iron Sharpen's Iron Radio.

And you can call CVBBS .com at their toll -free number, Monday through

Friday from 10 a .m. to 4 .30 p .m. Eastern Time.

That's when they typically man that phone line at 800 -656 -0231.

800 -656 -0231.

Mention Chris Arnzen of Iron Sharpen's Iron Radio when you're ordering at least $50 worth of merchandise

and you will receive free shipping on the entire order.

You will also receive free of charge the book From Pride to

Humility by Stuart Scott.

And please always remember to mention Iron Sharpen's Iron Radio.

Then I need to announce a couple of things that are going on in the community

that I hope that you can join me in attending.

The first is coming up right around the corner.

November 9th and the 10th.

That's the Quakertown Conference on Reform Theology.

This year the theme is The Glory of the Cross.

And speakers include David Garner, Ray Ortland, Richard Phillips, Timothy Gibson,

and Carlton Nguyen.

That's being held November 9th and the 10th at the Grace Bible Fellowship Church in Quakertown, Pennsylvania.

To register go to AllianceNet .org.

AllianceNet .org.

That's the website for the Alliance of Confessing Evangelicals.

Coming up in January 17th, which is a

Thursday, through the 19th, which is a Saturday, the G3 Conference returns

to the Georgia International Convention Center in College Park, Georgia, a suburb of Atlanta.

The theme in January is The Mission of God, A Biblical Understanding of Missions.

I will be there as well.

Manning and Iron Sharpen's Iron Exhibitor's booth, God willing.

And I hope that you join me there.

This is an exciting conference.

They're expecting between 4 ,000 and 5 ,000 people to be present.

And perhaps if the folks at Crown Covenant Publishing, Crown Covenant Publications, if they're

listening, perhaps they will get a bug in their ear to man their own book

table there or their own exhibitor's booth there at the G3 Conference.

It will be well worth anyone's while with 4 ,000 or 5 ,000 people there to register for an exhibitor's

booth in addition to attending.

For our Spanish and bilingual friends, the G3 Conference is having an

exclusively Spanish speaking edition of the conference on Wednesday, the 16th of January.

But for the English conference, the English speaking conference, that includes such

illustrious names as Dr. James R. White of Alpha Omega Ministries, John Piper, Stephen J.

Lawson, Voti Baucom, Mark Dever, Conrad Mbewe, who is my favorite preacher on the planet Earth

alive today.

He is the pastor of Kabwatha Baptist Church in Lusaka, Zambia, Africa, and chancellor at African Christian

University.

He will be there.

Tim Challies, Phil Johnson, the executive director of John MacArthur's ministry, grace to you.

Josh Bice, the founder of the G3 Conference.

Todd Friel of Wretched TV and Wretched Radio.

Stephen J. Nichols, the president of Reformation Bible College, the Bible College founded

by the late Dr. R .C. Sproul and Ligonier Ministries.

And many more are on that speaking roster.

If you'd like to register, go to G3conference .com, G3conference .com.

Last but not least, if you love Iron Trip and Zion Radio and you don't want us to disappear from the airwaves, then please go to

IronTripandZionRadio .com, click support, then click, click to donate now.

You can donate instantly with a debit or credit card.

If you prefer a snail mail, you can also mail in a check the old -fashioned way to the address

that appears on your screen when you click support at IronTripandZionRadio .com.

As I try to always remember to remind you, please never siphon money away from your regular giving that

you're accustomed to to your local church in order to give to Iron Trip and Zion Radio.

Never put your family in financial jeopardy by giving to Iron Trip and Zion Radio.

Those two things are commands of God providing for your church and home.

Providing for Iron Trip and Zion Radio is obviously not a command of God.

But if you love the show and you're financially blessed above and beyond your ability to support your

church and home, then please consider helping us remain on the air with your generous gifts by going to

IronTripandZionRadio .com and then click support, then click, click to donate now.

If you want to advertise with us, send me an email to chrisorensen at gmail .com and put advertising in the subject

line.

As long as whatever it is you're advertising is compatible with what we believe, you don't have to believe identically with me to

advertise with me, but you need to be promoting something that is compatible with what we believe here, then by all means send

me the email to chrisorensen at gmail .com and put advertising in the subject line.

Whether it's your church, parachurch ministry, business, professional practice, or special event, we would love to help you launch

an ad campaign.

And the email is the same for sending in a question to Dr. George Scipione.

It's chrisorensen at gmail .com, chrisorensen at gmail .com.

And please give us your first name, city, and state, and country of residence if you live outside the USA, and please only remain anonymous if you

have a personal and private question.

We are discussing the battle for the biblical family with Dr. George C. Scipione today.

And Dr. Scipione, we do have a question from Bobby in Hartsdale, New York.

And Bobby in Hartsdale, New York says, I understand that many advocates of

nuthetic counseling frown upon using medication for one's

mental problems.

Are you in agreement with this?

Is there any time where medication is appropriate in your opinion?

If you could please expand upon this.

You have two hours?

Not anymore.

We did in the beginning.

Yeah, this is not an easy...

My mom died of alcohol.

And

would

not

help...

Oh, that makes sense to me.

So,

to

treat...

Going to eat...

As we get a label...

Find out what the...

They're not your

concern that

I

know.

Let's be...

Yes,

and I

wholeheartedly

agree

with

you about

people...

The necessity of people consulting their physicians when it comes to getting off of

drugs that they are already on, especially because I know of least two people that I know personally

that attempted suicide when they went off the drugs that they were on.

And it was...

So, there could be dangerous consequences to that kind of thing.

Well, if people say, hey, I threw all my meds away, I immediately say, please sign a letter

for if you fall over

dead, your family

to stop doing it.

We have Joey in Clifton, New Jersey.

And oh, by the way, I forgot to mention to Bobby in Hartsdale.

You've also won a free copy of The Battle for the Biblical Family by Dr. George C. Cipione.

So, give us your full mailing address.

So, CVVVS .com can mail that out to you.

Now, we have Joey in Clifton, New Jersey, who says, Dear Dr. Cipione, it was very good to

meet you and hear your talks at the last two ACBC conferences.

I'd like to ask you about a trend that has significant potential

implications for the family.

Specifically, it is the relentless attacks against gender complementarianism

to the point that traditional biblical interpretation is being challenged even within some reformed

circles.

I am wondering what your view is on this problem.

Related to this, do you think there will be an eventful doctrinal schism among the reformed over this issue

as feminist views gain traction, or will it continue to be avoided as many have sought to

do?

That's Joey from Clifton, New Jersey.

I'd be

in Dallas and,

yes,

I think

psychological excellence.

Yeah.

People need salvation.

They're confused on

the, be born again,

still believe

the

gospel,

LGBTQ.

How do you say that?

To me, that a woman, you

got

first,

you

say you

have no biblical,

it's not

beat out.

This is your response.

There's big

issues of

this,

complicated

things in

medical,

and

you gotta

explain to me, you guys

always say

they've

done

biblical.

Well, thank you, Joey.

You have also won a free copy of The Battle for the Biblical Family, so please make sure we have your full mailing

address in Clifton, New Jersey, so that cvbbs .com can ship that out to you.

We're going to our final break right now.

It's going to be much more brief than the last one, so please, if you have a question that you'd like to send in, do

it now because we're rapidly running out of time.

Our email address is chrisarnson at gmail .com.

That's C -H -R -I -S -A -R -N -Z -E -N at gmail .com.

Please, as always, give us your first name, your city and state, and your country of residence if you live

outside of the USA.

Only remain anonymous if your question involves a personal or private matter.

Don't go away.

We'll be right back with our final segment with Dr. George C. Scipione on The Battle for the Biblical Family, right

after these messages from our sponsors.

Gotta tell you, for my money, Chris Arnson's radio program is just the best.

Iron. Criticizing Iron.

I think that's what it's called.

This is Todd Friel of Wretched Radio and TV with Phil Johnson of Grace to You, inviting

everybody to come to the G3 conference, which has almost instantly become one of the best conferences in the country.

And it is.

It's a great conference.

I love it.

And Chris Arnson was there last year.

He's been there, I think, every year.

It's great to see him there.

You and I actually did some recordings in the lobby at that place, which is a highlight.

To me.

So tons of stuff going on.

Yeah.

Tons of great speakers.

And no matter where you are in the building, you will hear Chris Arnson's laugh.

And that's worth the price of admission alone.

If you would like to join Phil, me, Chris, and a cavalcade of great preachers.

So it should be a cavalcade of great preachers and me.

G3 conference dot com.

G3 conference dot com.

Paul wrote to the church at Galatia.

For am I now seeking the approval of man or of God?

Or am I trying to please man?

If I were still trying to please man, I would not be a servant of Christ.

Hi, I'm Mark Lukens, pastor of Providence Baptist Church.

We are a Reformed Baptist Church and we hold to the London Baptist Confession of Faith of 1689.

We are in Norfolk, Massachusetts.

We strive to reflect Paul's mindset to be much more concerned with how God views what we say and what we do

than how men view these things.

That's not the best recipe for popularity, but since that wasn't the apostles' priority, it must not be ours either.

We believe by God's grace that we are called to demonstrate love and compassion to our fellow man and to be

vessels of Christ's mercy to a lost and hurting community around us and to build up the body of Christ in truth and

love.

If you live near Norfolk, Massachusetts or plan to visit our area, please come and join us for worship and fellowship.

You can call us at 508 -528 -5750.

That's 508 -528 -5750.

Or go to our website to email us, listen to past sermons, worship songs, or watch our TV program entitled,

Resting in Grace.

You can find us at providencebaptistchurchma .org.

That's providencebaptistchurchma .org.

Or even on sermonaudio .com.

Providence Baptist Church is delighted to sponsor Iron Sharpens Iron Radio.

Chris Arnsen, host of Iron Sharpens Iron Radio, announcing a new website with an exciting offer from World

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Lynnbrook Baptist Church on 225 Earl Avenue in Lynnbrook, Long Island, is teaching God's timeless truths in

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That's 516 -599 -9402 or visit lynnbrookbaptist .org.

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Radio.

And welcome back.

We are now in our last segment of our interview with Dr. George C. Cipioni on his book The

Battle for the Biblical Family.

Our email address is chrisarnson at gmail .com.

We have Ronald in Eastern Suffolk County, Long Island, New York, who asks, is this

battle for the biblical family that you describe in your book not only a battle with

outside forces, not only outside of the church but outside of the home, but even a battle for the

biblical family under the roofs of Christian homes who may be either consciously or

unconsciously drifting into non -biblical models for family life?

Accurate to say,

you know,

somebody

gets

into

patronage.

Well, thank you, Ronald.

You've also won a free copy of The Battle for the Biblical Family.

Please make sure we have your full mailing address.

We have B .B. in Cumberland County, Pennsylvania, who wants to know, what do you think are the

primary areas that this battle is being lost by many

Christian families throughout the United States and abroad?

I

think

the

battle

would

be,

but...

Well, thank you, B .B.

You have also won a free copy of The Battle for the Biblical Family.

Please make sure we have your full mailing address.

C .J. in Lindenhurst, Long Island, New York, wants to know, how much privacy do

you think that our children are entitled to, especially in the day and age of the

internet, when all kinds of horrific, nightmarish consequences have

erupted in many circumstances when children are alone with computers?

But it's not just that.

It's many other things in life that erupt when children are left

unsupervised.

When do we cross the line between being loving, caring guardians of our children

to becoming obsessive and obnoxious parents, robbing our children of

any kind of private life?

I think you've already answered it in the question.

I think that's pretty eloquent.

In part,

you

have to

really think in

terms they

do not show on

the

internet.

Well, of course, there's also...

There are things that people can...

Parents can have software that prevents children from searching the pornographic

and other types of sites.

The kids today are getting so savvy that they're finding ways around it.

Well, I know that kids today, a lot younger than me, that are probably not even teenagers, some of

them, perhaps many of them, can use a computer more effectively and sufficiently than I can.

But that

becomes,

again, you

have to

know the

individual

child

and you just

need to...

Well, I'd like you now to have five or six uninterrupted minutes to summarize what you most want etched in the

hearts and minds of our listeners in regard to the battle for the biblical family.

One

for eight

hours

a

day

to

be

there

to

support

and be

left to

themselves.

Well, we do have time for a couple of more questions.

Let's see here.

We have Arnie in Perry County, Pennsylvania, who says, I see from the Crown and

Covenant Publications website that Dr. J. Adams wrote the foreword to your book.

I was wondering if you agree with Dr. Adams about the controversial subject of

forgiveness.

From what my understanding is, from his book From Forgiven to Forgiving,

Dr. Adams believes that forgiveness is only to be extended towards people who

ask for it and are repentant.

It is not something that is just willy -nilly to be declared upon people who have no interest

in repenting and do not even believe they are guilty of anything.

I think he's right.

Right.

And I actually agree with that.

I've read that book.

It's an excellent book.

And people, I think, on that issue, they misunderstand terms.

They think that if you are saying what Dr. Adams is saying, which we believe is what

the Bible is saying, that you're saying that we are supposed to be bitter and hateful and we're

always supposed to be waiting with open arms to forgive, are we not?

Exactly. In other words, free offer of the gospel.

And we are always to be praying for and demonstrating love for those who are, I

mean, even our enemies.

So that is not being ignored by not extending forgiveness.

No, we're to gently plead with them.

You know, I'm willing to forgive.

And I think that has a lot of connection to your subject of the biblical family because

don't parents have an obligation to even ask for the

forgiveness of their own children if they realize that they were sinful in

the way that they punished their children or the way that they lost their temper with their children?

Or otherwise, they have to humble themselves even to a little child and ask for forgiveness.

Of course.

Yeah, that's one of the fondest memories I have of my father who passed away in 1988.

As stubborn as he could be, he was a man that when

he lost control of his temper in some way, he was not a violent man, but if he yelled and used

vulgarity or profanity in his yelling or did something else that he

realized after he calmed down was wrong, I can remember him on a number of occasions asking for my forgiveness,

which is something that I will forever remember about him.

Well, I want to make sure that our listeners know about how to get a

hold of you.

First of all, the Reformed Presbyterian Theological Seminary's website is

rpts .edu, correct?

Yes.

And if you want to get a hold of the book, The Battle for the Biblical Family, you can go to cvbbs .com.

It's Cumberland Valley Bible Book Service.

And make sure you look for the book, The Battle for the Biblical Family, published by Crown and Covenant Publications

and written by George C. Scipione.

Do you have any other contact information that you care to give?

Well, if people have a particular question, you know, they can get a hold of me at

gcipione, all lowercase g -s -c -i -p -i -o -n -e.

Well, I want to thank you so much, brother, for being on the show today.

I want to thank everybody who listened, especially those who wrote in questions.

I want you all to always remember for the rest of your lives that Jesus Christ is a far greater Savior than you

are a sinner.

Amen.