Matt Slick Bible Study - 8/9/2017 - Mormonism Pt. 5

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August 9, 2017

04:18: All right, we're on? We're on now? All right, we're on now. All right. So having just cleaned my glasses,
04:26: I will now pray. We'll start on Mormonism. and so we'll pray.
04:34: We're gonna go through some more of what the quotes. We'll do some witnessing tips.
04:40: These aren't gonna be stellar witnessing tips, but there's things that you can learn. And then we'll take a break and then we'll do
04:45: Q and A as normal. So let's pray. Lord Jesus, we ask that you'd bless us.
04:51: We ask that you would anoint the words, anoint this time, that you would just provide your spirit upon us, upon this time, this teaching.
05:01: Lord, I ask that as Mormons, as they look at the video, as they consider the quotes, that you might condescend to use them, to bring them to a true and saving knowledge of who you are, that they would give up their works, righteousness gospel, and that they would believe in a true and living
05:22: God. Lord, we just ask that you would bless it. We give all of this to you and we trust you.
05:28: And we just ask this in your precious name, Jesus, amen. All right.
05:37: So we'll continue on paragraph 171 here. And so it says in the book of Mormon, now we did interesting quotes from the articles of faith.
05:47: We've done interesting quotes from Joseph Smith, from Brigham Young. So here from the book of Mormon, and this is what it says.
05:54: And behold, he shall be born of Mary at Jerusalem, which is the land of our forefathers.
05:59: That's almost 710. So the book of Mormon said that Jesus will be born at Jerusalem. And of course we know from Micah 5 .2,
06:07: Jesus was born in Bethlehem. And what they've done is they said, well, Jerusalem means the county, the larger region.
06:14: It's not what it means. It's never what it meant. It means Jerusalem.
06:19: But this is just them trying to cover their tracks. Well, why is this significant? Well, the book of Mormon is supposed to be the most correct book of any book on earth.
06:28: And a man can get closer to the precepts of God by following it than by any other book. History of the Church, volume six, page, no.
06:38: Volume four, page 461. And so if it is so perfect and so great, then why has it got that mistake in it?
06:46: Now, here's something else. Now, a lot of times Mormons, they'll say, I'm bashing them. I go out and I look for them.
06:54: I attack them. And they say, just leave me alone. We're not bothering you. Oh, really?
06:59: And I have to say, you started it. Look at this. This is 1 Nephi 14 .10.
07:05: Behold, there are saved two churches only. The one is a church of the Lamb of God and the other is a church of the devil.
07:11: So I ask them, which church am I in? And they have to say, I'm in the church of the devil.
07:18: Okay. So you're saying that what I believe in is from the devil, from Satan. This is what you say.
07:24: This is what you guys teach in your churches. This is what you guys start with. And you go out and say, there's an apostasy, which means everything
07:30: I believe in is false. But don't tell me that we're the ones persecuting you. You're the ones persecuting us.
07:37: You're the ones doing this. And then 2 Nephi 2 .25, Adam fell that men might be and men are that they might have joy.
07:45: Wow. That's, you know, the celebration of sin. And of course, 2
07:51: Nephi 25 .23, for we know that it is by grace that we are saved after all we can do.
07:59: And of course that is pride. And it's not me just name calling. It's not me just trying to be mean.
08:05: It's pride to say that you're saved by grace after all you can do. Now notice what it says.
08:11: That is by grace, you're saved after everything you do. Now Romans 11, Hebrews 11 .6,
08:17: no Romans 11 .6, Romans 11 .6. If it's by works, it's no longer by grace. So grace is the unmerited favor.
08:27: That's what grace is. But all the cults always mess up on grace. Now grace is getting what you don't deserve in a good way.
08:37: And we get forgiveness. We get the fellowship of God. We get to enjoy his presence.
08:45: That's by his grace. We get the forgiveness of our sins by grace. Nothing we do earns it.
08:51: Even though the Mormon church says we earn it. Nothing we do earns it. But notice what it says.
08:58: You're saved by grace after all we can do. Well, I always like to ask the Mormons, have you done all you can do?
09:04: And of course they say, well, actually some say yes, they have done all they can do.
09:13: And you know, it reminds me of the sinless perfectionists. You know, yes, I've done all I can do. I don't sin anymore.
09:19: I'm keeping the law. I've done, you know, it's the same thing. Yeah, I'm not gonna just, I'm gonna see a Mormon who says yes to this and the sinless perfectionists, just put them in a room together, you know?
09:31: You know, give them the verse. You're saved by grace and faith after all you can do. You're doing all you can do, both of you? You're doing all you can do? And you know, you're doing all you can do.
09:38: You know, it's pride. Now think about it. You're saved before the infinite holy
09:44: God after, by his grace, after everything that you can do. I'm sorry, but that's just not the gospel of God.
09:54: It's not the gospel of scripture. We could go through various verses in Galatians chapter two and starting at verse 16 through 21, talks about if, on the basis of, if, but 221 basically says that we don't nullify the,
10:17: I have to remember this. It's been a long time since I've quoted it. You don't nullify the word, the truth by the grace.
10:23: Now, if righteousness comes by the law, then Christ died needlessly, that's Galatians 221. So if we are saved or forgiven based on anything we do, then why did
10:37: Christ need to come and die for our sins? Because it would be based on what you did. And that's the argument that Paul's giving there. All right, this is also a very good verse,
10:46: Moroni 10 .32, which the underlined portion says, if ye shall deny yourselves of all ungodliness and love
10:55: God with all your mind and strength, then is his grace sufficient for you. Now notice the theme here, 2
11:01: Nephi 25 .23, Moroni 10 .32, the issue of relating works and grace, that grace is what basically in Mormonism makes up for the stuff you can't do.
11:14: You try, you're sincere, and God knows your best. He knows you're trying. Now, this, unfortunately, is taught in a lot of Christian churches.
11:23: The same idea that God knows the sincerity of your heart, you're trying and he'll make up the difference.
11:30: This is taught in churches today, and it's a false gospel, it's a false doctrine.
11:37: All right, I use this a lot with Mormons, 3 Nephi, excuse me, sorry, 3
11:43: Nephi 19 .18, they did pray unto Jesus, calling him their Lord and their God. And I do this when
11:51: I talk about the true Jesus approach, which we're gonna get to in a little bit. When we get through the quotes,
11:56: I'm gonna give you some witnessing techniques, and we'll come back to this verse. All right, so now what we're gonna do is go to the
12:02: Doctrine and Covenants. Now, folks, just so you know, I could spend an hour, two hours just going through quotes of the
12:08: Book of Mormon. There's a lot of stuff, and this isn't a super deep course. I could teach on Mormonism for six months every
12:16: Wednesday and go in and really teach you, have you do homework and really learn, but that's not what we're doing here.
12:23: So just a sufficiently deep study to get you to understand what's going on.
12:31: So here's what the Doctrine and Covenants says. It's one of the scriptures of the Mormon church. Notice the underlined section here,
12:38: D &C 130, the only true living church upon the face of the earth. Okay, so let's read the whole thing.
12:44: And also those to whom these commandments were given might have power to lay the foundation of this church and to bring it forth out of obscurity and out of darkness, the only true and living church upon the face of the whole earth.
12:56: So the Mormons are saying that their church is the only true church. Now, whenever I hear that from any group,
13:02: I say, oh, another only true church, because people are saying that they're the only true church.
13:10: The Roman Catholics, our church is the only true church. The Jehovah's Witnesses, ours is the only true restored organization of God on earth, et cetera.
13:19: And whenever you hear a group say, they're the only true church, what they're saying is they're the only true earthly organization with authority that's vested in it.
13:28: And that salvation is somehow tied up to membership and association with that church.
13:34: That's what you hear. That's what you should be hearing when you hear, we're the only true church. All the stuff that goes along with it as well.
13:41: Hold on a second. Hey man,
13:48: I'm teaching a video series right now on Mormonism. Are you there?
13:56: Oh, it's on the Bluetooth. So you can watch online, all right? Okay, I'm gonna hang up and turn this off.
14:06: So my bad. All right, folks, sorry about that. But I get paged to answer questions at different venues and stuff.
14:16: All right, let's go on. Now, this is something that's really interesting because the Mormons say, don't bash us, don't bash us.
14:22: But look what it says here, number 179. Call upon your enemies to meet in public and private.
14:28: That's what it says. Wherefore, confound your enemies. Call upon them to meet you both in public and in private.
14:35: And in as much as ye are faithful, their shame shall be made manifest. Wherefore, let them bring forth their strong reasons against the
14:42: Lord. So they're commanded to do this. So, you know, I'll reference this sometimes to the Mormons. You're commanded to talk to me.
14:50: No, there's contention here. Well, Jude 3 says contend for the faith. You're supposed to do this, so what's the deal?
14:57: I'm not talking to you. Okay, thank you very much. And so look at this.
15:03: This is D &C 8421 through 22. And without the ordinances thereof and the authority of the priesthood, the power of godliness is not manifested to men in the flesh.
15:13: For without this, no man can see the face of God, even the Father, and live. So the natural question to ask is, how did
15:23: Joseph Smith see God the Father when he didn't have a priesthood bestowed upon him at that time?
15:29: Now we call that a theological oops. Now check this out.
15:37: D &C 130 and 21. There is a law irrevocably decreed in heaven before the foundations of this world upon which all blessings are predicated.
15:47: And when we obtain any blessing from God, it is by obedience to that law upon which it is predicated.
15:55: Let's continue. The Father has a body of flesh and bones as tangible as man's, the
16:01: Son also, but the Holy Ghost has not a body of flesh and bones. D &C 130 verse 22. Then he shall be gods because they have all power and the angels are subject unto them.
16:14: Verily, verily, I say unto you, except ye abide my law, ye cannot attain to this glory. So you have to keep the law, celestial laws, what it comes down to in order to become a god.
16:25: Joseph Smith, and verily, verily, I say unto you, Joseph Smith, that whatsoever you seal on earth shall be sealed in heaven and whatsoever you bind on earth in my name and by my word, sayeth the
16:39: Lord, it shall be eternally bound in the heavens. It's getting quite a bit of authority to, wow.
16:49: Quite a bit of authority to Joseph Smith. Joseph Smith, the prophet and the seer of the
16:55: Lord has done more, save Jesus only, for the salvation of men in this world than any other man that ever lived it.
17:03: More than Paul the Apostle, more than Moses, more than Abraham, more than John, Peter, James.
17:11: No, Joseph Smith has done more. See folks, when you abide in deception, you become comfortable with deception.
17:26: When you abide in a lie, you become comfortable with the bedfellows of lies.
17:34: When you start elevating a man like this, who was involved in the occult, who boasted he did more than Jesus to keep a church together, history of the church, volume six, page 408, 409, who obviously stole many writings from the
17:54: Bible and put them in the Book of Mormon, who taught false doctrines in the
18:00: Book of Mormon and a DNC, who had lots of wives, at least 35, at least 35.
18:10: Some of them quite young and women who were married to other men while they'd married
18:15: Joseph Smith so that they could be sealed for time and eternity. What does that mean? It means they would fool around, they would have sex.
18:24: And so he would do these kinds of things. And so when
18:30: Mormons, they give themselves over, what they're doing, they're giving themselves over to Mormonism and the spirit of Mormonism.
18:38: They're giving themselves over to the idea that Joseph Smith restored the gospel, which hasn't been lost.
18:44: That he saw the Father, which the Bible says can't happen. It teaches works righteousness, which the Bible clearly condemns.
18:52: When Mormons do this, something happens to them, spiritually, emotionally, mentally. Spiritually, they are blinded.
19:00: They cannot receive the truth. Emotionally, they become dedicated to their master,
19:07: Joseph Smith, their master. And they'll say, Matt, you are so wrong. We don't serve Joseph Smith.
19:12: Yes, you do. I talk about this with Mormons. I'll say, look, why do you believe
19:18: God is an exalted man from another world? You say, well, because the Holy Spirit bore witness of that to me.
19:23: No, he didn't. Where'd you read that? Well, in Mormon writings, what
19:30: Joseph Smith said, right? So you believe this based on what Joseph Smith said. And so earning your salvation, the forgiveness of sins by, where'd you get that?
19:42: From what Joseph Smith said. The three degrees of glory from what Joseph Smith said. That the gospel was, the true church was lost because Joseph Smith said it was.
19:54: I'll go through a bunch of stuff and say, this is what Joseph Smith said. You're believing what he said. You're following Joseph Smith.
20:00: You know, praise to the man. That's the hymn they sing in their churches, praise to the man, and they exalt
20:05: Joseph Smith. They're following Joseph Smith. They're following what Joseph Smith said
20:11: God said. They even follow what Joseph Smith said about the testimony of the spirit because Joseph Smith said that would occur.
20:18: Everything is about Joseph Smith. Not Jesus. And that's why they are so deceived.
20:29: And so what we have here is, you know, a brief examination of Mormonism.
20:37: What we're gonna do now is go into witnessing tips and I'll intro that a little bit, but we've gone through a lot of slides, over 120 slides so far here.
20:50: Going through and showing you, and by watching the videos, I urge the
20:56: Mormons to check everything I'm saying against scripture. Check the quotes and ask yourself if you're being good enough to keep yourself right with the infinitely holy
21:07: God. Now, I know people who say they do that in the Christian churches. The guy
21:12: I debated last night, Jesse Murrell, he says that he's able to not sin and that's what keeps you right with God.
21:21: People say that. Yeah, they say, if you lose your salvation, it's because you broke the law of God, you sinned.
21:27: Well, then the corollary is, you keep it by keeping the law. Simple. No, faith is what saves you and true faith means you keep the law.
21:37: Yeah, keeping the law. So when I ask people, I'll say, look, are you saved by grace alone, through faith alone in Christ alone?
21:50: People who can't answer yes to that probably aren't true Christians. There could be people who are ignorant and they just don't know.
21:59: The fact is, the true gospel is that Jesus Christ is God in flesh who died on the cross for our sins. He bore our sins in his body on that cross, 1
22:07: Peter 2 .24. He was imputed with our sin. He bore it, sin's a legal debt.
22:13: 1 John 3 .4, and you can look at Matthew 6 .12 and Luke 11 .4.
22:20: Jesus equates sin with debt in those last two verses. Paul says, Jesus canceled out the certificate of debt,
22:26: Colossians 2 .14. Our sin is an offense against God.
22:32: And the only way our offense against God can be taken care of is by trust in God.
22:39: Only God is able to keep the law perfectly, which is a requirement according to Deuteronomy 27 .26,
22:46: which Paul quoted in Galatians 3 .10. And only Jesus, who's God in flesh, is able to do exactly what is necessary always.
22:55: So when I say that I am guaranteed going to heaven, I'm gonna be with God, I'm saved.
23:02: It's not arrogance because I'm not depending in any way upon anything that I am saying or anything that I'm doing or any intention in my heart that would keep me saved in any way, shape, or form.
23:17: I am instead depending completely and totally in what Jesus has done, His keeping of the law,
23:24: His sacrifice on the cross, and only what He has done. And that's why I can say I'm going to heaven because it doesn't depend on me, it depends on Him and He's perfect.
23:33: That's the difference. It's not arrogance on my part. And I can say it's humility on my part, see how humble
23:40: I am? No, the idea of showing humility before God is, it's not me, it's all you.
23:46: And that's what the truth is. And Mormons are not capable of keeping the law.
23:53: They're not capable of doing this. And the reason they have this false gospel is because they have a false
23:58: God. Whenever you have a false God, you have a false Christ. Whenever you have a false
24:04: Christ, you have a false gospel. They always go hand in hand, always.
24:10: In Christian science, God is a divine consciousness that you get in tune with.
24:16: Therefore, Christ is the perfect manifestation of the Christ consciousness. Salvation is right thinking.
24:24: In Job's Witnesses, there is no trinity and Jesus is an angel who became a man. And so, because He's not
24:30: God who kept the law, He's an angel who became a man and kept the law, He only did it in the court of them for 144 ,000 people.
24:37: The rest of you only get to go on paradise earth if you do enough kingdom work.
24:44: And so, salvation is based on works and that's what they say in their Watchtower Bible and tract information that you must obey the law of God in order to be saved.
24:54: We have Roman Catholicism. Now, they have a true doctrine of God. This is what's interesting. They have a true doctrine of God and true doctrine of Christ, but because they don't trust the word of God, then they've added to their salvation in their works.
25:07: And we've gone over that before here. I've talked about that as well. Groups routinely that have a false doctrine of God will end up having a false gospel and they're lost.
25:20: And this was the case with Mormonism. Now, Mormons, if you're listening, please understand, I'm not, I don't hate you.
25:28: I was never wronged by a Mormon. One jerk Mormon once threatened me once, but whatever, there's jerks everywhere.
25:36: You know, it's no big deal. But, you know, the reason that I do this is because I read the
25:46: Bible and Mormonism does not agree with scripture and therefore it's not true. And if you die believing in Mormonism, you're gonna go to eternal damnation.
25:56: That's just the way it is. I don't care about your feelings. I don't care about your testimony. I know you put your feelings, your testimony above the word of God.
26:03: And that's your downfall. The word of God is above your feelings. And I don't care what you say.
26:09: I have a testimony and I can bear testimony. I can bear stronger testimony. My testimony does not agree with your testimony.
26:20: And so what? The truth is found in the word of God. What did Satan do with Eve in the garden?
26:25: Genesis chapter three, verses one through six. Did God say? Down in God's word.
26:31: She altered the word of God. Satan then contradicted the word of God. And then she went and went after her testimony.
26:40: Because what she did was it felt good. She sensed in her spirit, in her mind, in her whatever, that this is a good thing.
26:49: And so she ate of the fruit. She went with her feelings and sin entered. She didn't trust
26:55: God's word. And that's what Mormons are doing all the time. They're trusting their feelings that they say is from God, but they don't know.
27:03: Just because you feel it doesn't mean it's true. And so because of it, they are entrapped in a lie.
27:12: Believe God came from another planet. He has a goddess wife and they have sex and have them make spirit babies.
27:19: And that you can become a god of your own planet too, potentially. So technically
27:25: Mormons are worshiping an alien because an alien is a life form from another planet. So an alien, that's where it is, an alien from another world, came to this planet with his mate.
27:38: And so the Mormons worship this man who could have been a sinner on another planet, came to this world and they worship him as their
27:48: God. They're worshiping the creature. Instead of the creator.
27:55: Because the creature is something that is made by God. That's what a creature is.
28:01: In Romans chapter one, verses 18 to 31, God condemns people who worship creatures. And God is the only supreme being who never was, excuse me, who never was born and who has always been,
28:14: Psalm 90 verse two, from everlasting to everlasting, you are God. He was never a man on another planet. And there was never a time when he was a sinner.
28:23: Never a time he did anything wrong. He's always been God. But in Mormonism, the
28:29: God that they teach is an exalted man from another world who could have been a sinner, who has a body, flesh and bones, genitalia, fools around with his wife, makes spirit babies that don't have human bodies.
28:41: And if you pay a 10 % tithe of your income to the church, cash, and you go to the temple ceremony, you have the potential of becoming a
28:50: God of your own planet. This is entirely unbiblical.
28:57: And you're believing in a false gospel. And if you don't repent of it, you're gonna die. You go to hell for eternity.
29:03: There's no hope. You better examine this stuff. And don't trust your feelings because feelings are deceitful.
29:10: Bible says in Jeremiah 17, nine, the heart is desperately wicked, deceitful. No man can trust it. Don't trust your heart.
29:16: Trust the word of God. That's what I'm gonna say. All right, at this point, what I'm gonna do is just get into some witnessing tips.
29:26: And there's a lot that could be said. I could do a few weeks on these. I'm not going to. This finish up tonight, we'll be done with the
29:32: Mormonism thing. I'll give you some things that I've used sometimes or just some basic stuff.
29:38: And it's not stellar. Folks, if you're gonna witness to Mormons, don't think these things, wow, this is the slick approach.
29:46: It should work. It's not like that. I'm gonna give you some things that you can use and use them prayerfully with wisdom and gently, of course.
29:55: Context is king. Always examine the context of any verse that a Mormon might quote to you out of the Bible. You'll find it when examining context.
30:03: Usually the Mormon has misapplied the verse. Here are some examples. James 1, five. But if any of you lacks wisdom, then let him ask of God, who gives to all generously and without reproach, and it'll be given to you or to him.
30:14: Mormons routinely misuse this verse to justify praying about the Book of Mormon. Is there anything in the verse that says pray about any book or pray about truth?
30:23: It doesn't say that. It says if you lack wisdom, what's wisdom? The proper use of knowledge.
30:29: Where do you get knowledge? The Bible. But the context is speaking to the 12 tribes of Israel that are scattered abroad.
30:36: Just read what it says in the context. In other words, James is addressing those who are already followers of the true and living
30:43: God. They're not praying to see about the truth of some book in the future.
30:50: They're talking, he's talking to the believers already. So it can't be praying about things to see if they're true.
31:01: Not what's going on here. Nothing in here says pray about something to find out if it's true.
31:07: It's not what it is. Wisdom is not that. It's not praying about something to see something if it's true. Wisdom is something that occurs in you.
31:15: Wisdom is something that you do. It means you have a right ability to make choices. It doesn't mean it's revelatory information that comes about some book.
31:25: All right, Matthew 5, 4, and 8. Therefore, you are to be perfect because your Heavenly Father is perfect. And they use this to use the idea, support the idea that you could become gods.
31:37: But when you look at the context, starting at verse 43, the context is God lets the sun shine in the good and the bad.
31:45: He loves both. The context is about loving everybody equally. Therefore, be perfect as your
31:50: Father in heaven is perfect. Now there's lots of stuff we could go to, but this is just to show you, it's just these things.
31:57: Just read the context. Just read what it is. So if you're talking to a Mormon, they say, well, this is verse such and such in the
32:03: Bible. Oh, great. Can I check that out? Where does it say that? Let's read the context.
32:09: Just stop and read through it. And I'll tell you, two things usually happen.
32:14: One, they misapply the verse. And two, they stop quoting scripture. Because after one or two, maybe three of these, when you keep saying, well, what's it say?
32:26: And they find out it doesn't say that, they stop quoting scripture. They don't want to go to the Bible anymore and be proven wrong.
32:35: All right. Here's another thing. In Mormonism, the law, we've already gone through this just a little bit ago, but I'm gonna go through it again because it's important.
32:45: That through the atonement and by obedience to the principles of the gospel, mankind might be saved. Doctrine and Covenants 138 verse four.
32:52: Obedience to the principles of the gospel. Oh, wow,
32:58: I just got a typo in there. Sorry. What you do is you apply their own law to them. Ask them if they're being good enough according to what their scriptures teach.
33:07: Just ask them, you being good enough? I mean, what are they gonna say? Yeah, I'm being good enough. Well, I guess pride is okay with you.
33:17: Is that, is pride inside the realm of good? No, okay. So you're not being good enough?
33:23: Okay. And, you know, as we've already gone over just a little bit ago, you know, 2 Nephi 25, 23, you're saved by grace through faith after all you can do.
33:31: I like to ask them, you know, are you really, you know, doing all you can do? And they'll say, well, yeah.
33:39: And I'm gonna hammer them on this issue of the pride. But sometimes they'll say, well, I'm trying.
33:46: You say, okay, you're trying. So you're not doing all you can do. You're not doing all you can do, are you?
33:54: Well, yes, I am. Okay, let's go over this again. So you're not doing all you can do.
34:01: Because if you were doing all you can do, you wouldn't have to try anymore because it meant you would have accomplished it.
34:07: If you failed with something, you didn't do what you could have done. You're not doing all you can do. So they're carrying the law.
34:15: Get up on their back and jump. Let the weight of the law break them. And of course, we already went to Moroni 10, 32 earlier.
34:23: The same issue. You say, you know, if you deny yourself of all ungodliness, then is God's grace sufficient for you?
34:30: Have you denied yourself of all ungodliness? I've had Mormons say, yes, I have. Then I just say, you ever repent?
34:37: Yes. Then you haven't denied yourself of all ungodliness? Yes, I have. Do you ever repent of anything?
34:45: Yes. Let's go over this again. If you denied yourself of all ungodliness, there's nothing to repent of because you denied it.
34:53: And I've had some of them say, no, the intention of denial. Doesn't say intention. And then that's what happens.
35:00: People modify the text to make it suit what they want. And this is difficult for them.
35:06: It is, because they know they can't do it. So, you know, ask the
35:11: Mormon if he's done all he can do, just like you said. And Moroni 10, 32, we already talked about that. And then go to D &C 82, 7.
35:20: I, the Lord, will not lay any sin to your charge. Go your ways and sin no more. But until, excuse me, but unto that soul that sinneth shall the former sins return, saith the
35:29: Lord your God. So if you are perfect and you keep the law and you deny yourself of all ungodliness your whole life, and you sin once, any sin you've committed comes back on you then.
35:44: I ask him, how's that working for you? How are you doing with that? How is that perfection requirement with you?
35:52: Are you really good enough? Is your heart really good enough? I've done this with Mormon missionaries quite a bit.
35:58: Say, when you guys go home, I certainly hope you don't get killed on the way home by a drunk driver, because then you go to hell.
36:05: I don't want that for you. So, but when you're in the darkness of your room and you're thinking about things and you are, you know, you're just thinking about this jerk that you're talking to out here, you know, today, ask yourself, are you really doing everything you can do?
36:24: Are you really good enough? Because the answer ultimately has to be no. So let me give you the true gospel.
36:30: Jesus did everything. And that's what I'll do. I use that as a means to get into what the true gospel is.
36:37: Jesus did everything that's necessary. You don't have to do it. Well, is it okay to sin?
36:42: I didn't say that. It's just that we can't keep that law. Jesus did.
36:48: We're trusting in him, not ourselves. And that's essentially what it is. People will not admit that what they're doing, whether it's sinless perfectionism, where it's keeping the law, deny yourself of all ungodliness, is they're depending on their own ability to be right with God.
37:07: And this is a huge failure, particularly in the cults.
37:14: All right. So this is real basic. You guys have heard me go over things like this.
37:20: This is stuff that you just have to get in your head, just memorize a few verses, the locations, addresses. Don't have to have every word memorized.
37:29: You know, D &C 82 .7, your form of sins will come back to you if you sin again. I'm just paraphrasing it. You say that to them.
37:35: That's what it says when you're talking to them. Let's look. That's all you gotta do. And then you can witness to them.
37:41: So this is one thing. Now, something else you can do is use the Book of Mormon. And I use the
37:47: Book of Mormon with them. And I used to have, when I did a lot of encounters with Mormons in Southern California, I used to have a
37:53: Book of Mormon. And what I would do, pretend this is my book, you know, you read it this way.
38:00: So what I would do is I'd turn it this way. And so when I would look at it,
38:05: I had all the tabs. I made these little tabs that says one
38:11: God, things like that. You know, one God, that Trinity is one
38:16: God, God is unchanging, God is spirit, eternal hell and polygamy condemned.
38:22: Because these are the things I have. I'm gonna show you the chart. And this is the things that would have my Book of Mormon. And you could, oh, you got one?
38:29: Hey, you got one like that. Good. Okay, hold on a second. That's yours? Yes. She doesn't do it the right way though, but that's okay.
38:39: See, it's close. But see, this is what she's got.
38:45: So you can go back here to one God, open it up, and there it is. And that works.
38:50: Me, I'm more anal. And so I would have all the one God things in a line. And it would look like that.
38:56: What's that? It would look that way. It would look like that, okay. So it doesn't matter. But this works, okay.
39:02: And so I've got honey, bee, error, sins, return, flesh and bones, one God, Kolob.
39:08: So he has three things, yeah. And so what I would do with my Book of Mormon is I would just walk up to the
39:13: Mormon missionaries. Literally, I'd go, how's it going? I wouldn't say anything.
39:21: I'd hand them my Book of Mormon with the stuff in it, and they'd, and they'd start reading.
39:30: And I'd sit there for three, four, five minutes. I wouldn't say a word. And they're going, and they're just going through it.
39:38: I'm serious. It was very effective. I wouldn't say a thing. Maybe like, and they'd just, you know, the partner guy would go, and they'd be, you know, what about this over here?
39:54: And they would go through it. I would just, I'd just show it to them. Just go like that. They could read the tabs and go, anybody, prompt them, here, take a look.
40:04: Book of Mormon. And man, I'm telling you, they didn't know what to do with it after that.
40:09: It's a great witnessing tool. So here we have, you know, this is the stuff that's there.
40:16: Okay. So, now on the left, that's the
40:25: Book of Mormon stuff, and you can go right in there. But you can take, oh, that doesn't work. Okay. It's blurry.
40:32: Oh, because I walked in front and altered the focus. Next time I'll go behind the screen. All right.
40:38: Oh, this dude, get close to it, then walk backwards. They had, technical problem.
40:45: Okay. Did we get it? We got it. This is high tech. All right.
40:50: So I would suggest, let me mess it up again. I would suggest that you take this, do the tabs in the
40:57: Book of Mormon, like that. And then to write this, we actually put the whole thing in the back.
41:06: And so I did that to my Book of Mormon. I've used it so many times, it fell apart. I just got to do another one. Now I just witness on the web and internet.
41:14: But, so I would do that so much. I had my Book of Mormon, and I would hand it to them. I mean, I don't know how many Mormons, handled my
41:19: Book of Mormon. And we're just going through it and seeing this stuff. And I go here, after a while, hey, look at the back page.
41:25: And they'd look, I wasn't saying anything. You know, just look at the back page. And they'd see this, this whole chart.
41:31: God's increasing your knowledge, and yet he's unchanging. You know, and it was great conversations.
41:38: So once when I was in Southern California, I stopped some Mormon missionaries. And they said, we know who you are.
41:45: And I said, okay, who am I? You're that guy who beat up the other Mormons. And I said, guys,
41:52: I'm not beating anybody up. That's a lie. I didn't do anything. You know, it's just, that's just a rumor.
41:59: Okay. Never did that. That was said once. Another time, they said, oh, you're the guy.
42:06: You know what? You're the guy causing all those Mormon missionaries to leave the church, the home of their missions.
42:16: And so, I mean, just witnessing, not saying this was it, but I would talk to Mormons. And they were, they actually had a meeting in Southern California where they were told not to talk to me because it was doing damage to the missionaries, causing them to lose their faith and go home.
42:33: And one kid apparently killed himself. And so other missionaries started talking about how, hey, this guy killed.
42:43: You did this and he killed himself because of it. I don't know if it's verified because they made mistakes before.
42:49: But you know, if it's true, I'm truly sorry that something like that would happen. But it's not the fault of Matt Slick.
42:56: It's the fault of the cult that he's in as he finds out it's false. And then what happens?
43:02: You can blame somebody else. Blame the lie. Yeah. There's one time
43:09: I stopped two Mormon missionaries and literally I'm talking to these guys.
43:15: Just one guy's looking at me like this. He's just kind of irritated. And his partner is just there and I'm talking.
43:22: And the guy goes, can I talk to you for a second? Yeah. He goes, over here buddy. The other guy didn't like that.
43:29: I walk over with him privately. He goes, this is for real. He said, you don't have to witness to me.
43:34: I already know the Mormon church is false. He says, it's false. He says, I know it's false.
43:40: I don't know what to do. I don't know how to get out. I said, really? I said, give me your phone number.
43:47: I'll give your number to somebody who'll contact you and we'll work it out. He goes, great. And so he did.
43:53: And his missionary friend didn't like that because you could see we were talking privately. And what I found out later was, yeah, he did.
43:58: One day, Jerry Bodine, who worked with Walter Martin, called him up.
44:05: That's what gave him the information and talked to him. And he came out and they took him to the airport.
44:11: He went home. And I think his dad was also leaving because he'd been working with his dad.
44:17: What about this? What about that? And dad's going, oh my goodness. And was realizing stuff. And so left. This works.
44:25: I mean, that is a formula, but you've got to get out there. Okay. So, all right.
44:32: I got other things I could talk about, just little anecdotes and stories. Let me talk about what I call the true Jesus approach.
44:38: And it's real simple. It's not, remember folks, this is not, this is the best way.
44:44: This is, this is a strategy that I use that's in my mind that I want to try and work with Mormons about.
44:52: The true Jesus is the Jesus of the Bible. The Jesus of the Bible is worshiped. The Jesus of the
44:57: Bible is called God. The Jesus of the Bible is prayed to. Why do I have prayed to in here? Oh, he's right up there in front.
45:03: I didn't hit the tab right. This is the second line. Jesus of the Bible is prayed to. Okay. The Jesus of the
45:10: Bible is worshiped. The Jesus of the Bible is called God. So this is my bad. I didn't edit this properly. Might do the format.
45:16: I do a lot of work, folks. Hope you guys are giving me a break. And he's already glaring at me.
45:23: Gosh. One little thing with a, okay. And so the Jesus of the Bible is prayed to, worshiped, and called
45:30: God. So I say to them, look, is the Jesus of the Bible, you know, is he prayed to?
45:36: And they'll say, well, yeah. And I'll show them. I go to Acts 7 .55 through 60. This is the account of Stephen being stoned.
45:43: And he cries out. Just look down there at verse 60. He cried out with a loud voice.
45:49: Lord, lay not the sin of their charge. And when he had said this, he fell asleep. Who was he praying to? He was praying to Jesus because he has a vision of Jesus and the
45:58: Father, but the glory of God. Not the God of the Father, the glory of God. And he was calling upon God saying,
46:05: Lord, Jesus received my spirit. That's verse 59. So he addressed Jesus and said,
46:11: Jesus received my spirit. So he prayed to him. Psalm 116 forward. I called upon the name of the Lord.
46:16: Oh Lord, I beseech thee, deliver my soul. And check this out. This is Zechariah 13, nine, where it says, and I will bring the third part through the fire.
46:27: I will refine them as silver is refined. I will try them as gold is tried. They shall call on my name and I will hear them.
46:34: And here we have in 1 Corinthians 1, 2, where the phrase to call upon the
46:39: Lord or call upon the name of the Lord is used of Jesus. And you can just check that out right there and look at verse two.
46:47: It says unto the church of God, which is at Corinth, to them that are sanctified in Christ Jesus, called to be saints with all that in every place call upon the name of the
46:55: Lord Jesus, their Lord and ours. So the phrase call upon the name of the Lord is a phrase out of Psalm 116, four,
47:02: Zechariah 13, nine, prayer to God. The point I'm trying to make, I know I'm going kind of quickly because we're running out of time to get through all this, is that the
47:11: Jesus of the Bible is prayed to. And I will often go to, at this point, 3rd
47:19: Nephi 19, 18, they did pray to Jesus, calling him their Lord and their God. Now Jesus in the
47:25: Bible is worshiped. Folks, let me show you. This is how many times I've done this. Matthew 2, 2, 2, 11, 14, 33, 28, 9,
47:31: John 9, 35 to 38, Hebrews 1, 8, or Hebrews 1, 6. So you see, I've done this so many times that I just got these memorized and not trying to show off.
47:42: It's just, I've really used this a lot with the Mormons. And I would just go through and say, well, he's worshiped.
47:49: And you can go to John 5, 20. There's ways of adding to this stuff.
47:54: This is the framework where he receives the same honor as a father, John 5, 20 through 24.
48:02: Well, okay, so I'll say, do you pray to Jesus? No, we pray through Jesus. Okay, but they pray to him,
48:09: Book of Mormon and in the Bible. But the Jesus of the Bible is true, right? They'll say, yeah. The true
48:16: Jesus is prayed to, but you don't pray to him. So your Jesus is not prayed to, but mine is.
48:24: Your Jesus is not worshiped equally with God, but mine is. And the
48:32: Jesus of the Bible is called God. John 20, 28, Thomas answered and said to him, "'My
48:37: Lord and my God.'" Hebrews 1, 8, but unto the son, he said, "'Thy throne,
48:42: O God, is forever and ever.'" Do you call Jesus your God? Your Lord and your God, just like Thomas did?
48:49: They can't say yes, they have to say no. So I'll say, let me get this straight. So the
48:56: Jesus of the Bible is prayed to, worshiped and called God. The Jesus of the Bible is the one who reveals the
49:02: Father and sends the Holy Spirit, right? Yes. So if you don't have the
49:08: Jesus of the Bible, then you don't have the truth, do you? How do you know you have the
49:15: Jesus of the Bible? The Jesus of the Bible is prayed to, worshiped and called God. But you don't pray to him, you don't worship him, equally with the
49:21: Father, and you don't call him your Lord and your God, just like you did in the Bible. So I ask him, so what makes you think that I should trust you?
49:32: That you say that you have the true Christ, but you don't even do what they did in the
49:38: Bible about him. Well, they knew him, and you don't even do this. So how is it you have the true
49:44: Jesus, by which you'll then know the true God and the rest of the truth? They can't answer, because there is no answer for him.
49:56: I've used this countless times. I could teach on this one for a half hour, but I'm just giving you the quick, quick and slick, so you can get in, because we've got a lot, we've got some more stuff to cover here.
50:09: These are difficult questions for the LDS. These are not, you know, stoppers, but they're good conversation things.
50:17: If the Book of Mormon is true, why do Indians fail to turn white when they become Mormons? They become white and delightsome.
50:25: Now, this is what it was in 19, prior to 1981. So what I recommend you do is go through, you know, bookstores, old used bookstores, look for Book of Mormons that are pre -1981.
50:39: You get, I've got some, and you can go to 2 Nephi 30, verse six, and see where it says, you know, by becoming true believers, they turn white and delightsome.
50:50: They turn white. If the Book of Mormon is true, then why has the Mormon church changed it?
50:56: And we've already gone through this earlier, and you can have your information ready and show them a whole bunch of changes.
51:04: Now, Gerald and Sandra Tanner, and I know Sandra, I've done cruises with her, went to Israel with her, and she's awesome.
51:12: And I met Gerald many times, he passed away, but anyway. So Gerald and Sandra did, they counted 3 ,913 changes in the
51:21: Book of Mormon. And she told me how they did it. What they did was Gerald had an original first edition of the
51:28: Book of Mormon. And she had, I forget which version it was, 1981, whatever it was. And literally,
51:36: I think they Xeroxed off every page. And then literally he would just read out of the original
51:43: Book of Mormon, and she'd follow along in the newer one. And then when they had a problem, they would document it.
51:49: They did this for the entire Book of Mormon. It took them a while. I said, really, that's how you did it? She goes, that's how we did it.
51:55: Okay. Now, how did Joseph Smith carry home the golden plates of the
52:01: Book of Mormon? And how did the witnesses lift them so easily? See, they weighed about 230 pounds.
52:08: Gold, with a density of 19 .3, weighs 1 ,204 .7 pounds per cubic foot.
52:13: The plates were seven inches by eight inches by about six inches. And so they weighed about 230 pounds.
52:20: Now, the Mormons have an answer for this. And they will do all kinds of things to get out from this difficulty.
52:27: And they will say that there was a Timbaga theory, which is an alloy kind of a thing, or that there was a lot of air between the plates and only part of the plates were discovered or revealed, not all of them.
52:43: They have all kinds of theories. And that, you know, okay, you could just work with them. And I'll say, so Joseph Smith then carried these plates?
52:51: Yeah, how much do you think they weighed? The lightest weight, Bill McKeever told me this from mrm .org,
53:00: Mormonism Research Ministry, mrm .org. Bill researches Mormonism all the time, full -time.
53:06: It's all he does. And he told me that the smallest weight, if I remember correctly, the smallest weight that any
53:13: Mormon apologist has ever gotten the plates to weigh was 40 pounds. Because they had to have gold in them.
53:22: And you have to have the ability for the letters to not mash.
53:30: And there's issues of air density, weight, the rings holding them on and holding them.
53:36: Because you do that, if you drop it, you could destroy a lot of the information because it's an old, soft, malleable thing.
53:44: He's got all kinds of information, logistics. Well, think about this. Joseph Smith ran with these plates for three miles.
53:52: He had a limp, incidentally, and he was knocked down and he fought off three guys who wanted the gold plates, because it's gold.
54:01: So have you guys ever run with a normal book? A big, this is a big one.
54:07: Just run. And if you were to do three miles while you're being chased, jumping over logs, do you think you might drop the book once?
54:16: I certainly have, and I used to get chased a lot in school. And it wasn't because I deserved it, because I was small and buck -toothed and they'll name slick and a new kid in the block and I'd get chased.
54:27: So when I was in school, I'd carry my books like a dork. And I'd go to physics and trig,
54:32: I loved it. And I'd get chased sometimes. It happened all the time.
54:38: So he's got these golden plates. And these guys are after him. And he's got a limp and he's fighting them off and jumping over stuff.
54:47: And the plates never dropped, because they had a problem.
54:53: It just doesn't make any sense. But like I said, Bill McKeever's got a lot of information on this particular thing.
54:59: And we'd go to Manti once a year. He has a wagon with the golden plates. And he says, lift the golden plates.
55:08: And they're not real gold, but they have the same weight. They're like 40 pounds.
55:14: He has two sets, 40 and I think eight years. I forgot. And when I lift them,
55:20: I mean, I do the sumo thing. And I get down and I lift with my legs because I don't want to hurt myself.
55:31: Of course I am old, decrepit. All right, let's go to number four. If Moroni devoutly practiced a
55:37: Mormon gospel, why is he an angel now rather than a God? Simple question.
55:44: Why do Mormons emphasize part of the word of wisdom and ignore the part forbidding the eating of meat except in winter, cold and famine?
55:50: Number one, Doctrine and Covenants. Why did the
55:56: Nauvoo house not stand forever and ever as it was said it would be in D &C? If Jesus was conceived as a result of physical union between God and Mary, how was
56:05: Jesus born of a virgin? How does that work? Actually, I do know how it can work technically.
56:15: There are some, how do I say this delicately? There are some ladies who were born with two sets of things down there.
56:25: It happens, okay. That's really quite a thing.
56:30: That's the only way I can think of it. So how did Nephi with a few men on a new continent build a temple like Solomon's while Solomon needed 163 ,300 workmen in seven years to build his temple?
56:43: And where is his temple? Can't find it. Why was
56:48: Joseph Smith still preaching against polygamy in October, 1843 after he got his revelation in July, 1843, commending the practice of polygamy?
56:59: God rejected the fig leaf aprons, which Adam and Eve made. Why do Mormons memorialize the fall by using fig leaf aprons in the sacred temple ceremony?
57:10: I mean, another question is God destroyed the temple veil in Matthew 27, 51. Why did the
57:16: Mormons put it back in their temple? There's all kinds of things. This is just, these are just 10 of them, all right?
57:22: I recommend that you use the King James when you talk to them. I quoted the
57:28: NASB so much, I just, I can't do both. I just quote the NASB and then they said, well, where is that?
57:34: Well, it's a look at the King James. So here's some of the verses I'd recommend you recognize or look at, learn
57:41: Isaiah 43, 10, 44, 6, 44, 8. There's more, but those will work.
57:48: In the Book of Mormon, Alma 11, 26, 29, there's only one God. And these, you know, these are on my website too.
58:00: Psalm 90, verse two, God's eternal. And then the Book of Mormon, Moroni 8, 18, for I know that God is not a partial
58:07: God, neither a changeable being, but he is unchangeable from all eternity to all eternity. How does that happen if he's an exalted man with another planet?
58:19: Verses on salvation, come on. Romans 3, 28, Romans 4, 5,
58:24: Romans 5, 1, James 2, 10. And of course, Moroni 10, 32, 2
58:29: Nephi 25, 23. So you're already starting to memorize some of these things because I'm repeating them so much. So these are just some of the things that we're done with that I'd recommend that you memorize.
58:45: Now let me just give a little closing something. A lot of times
58:55: Christians, if you're a Christian and you're watching this, not a Mormon, but a real Christian, sorry, but that's what it is. A lot of times
59:01: Christians don't want to really study that much. They don't think that they can do that much.
59:08: Let me tell you something. I want you to picture yourself looking into hell on the day of judgment.
59:15: And you see the flames and you see the souls, the people in these flames and incredible agony.
59:25: And you hear their screams. Do you think that if God said to you,
59:36: I can send you back in time and you can save one of them by witnessing, would you do it?
59:45: Yes. But let's just say that you go back and you've got to study for 10 years, 15 years.
59:54: And you talk to one Mormon and you studied a whole bunch. And only one
01:00:02: Mormon becomes a real Christian. Poof, you're back there looking and one less person is there and one more is with the
01:00:09: Lord. Now don't give me my Calvinism predestination stuff right now. But the issue is this, is it really worth it to you to study this stuff for the sake of your brothers and sisters who don't know who
01:00:25: Christ is? So that maybe even one more person might come to know who
01:00:31: Christ is. By the grace of God working through you because you were an instrument in his hand.
01:00:39: If your whole life is spent trying to witness and not a single person comes to faith, it's still not a wasted life because you've glorified
01:00:49: God and spreading the truth. And if even one person gets saved, that's an eternity of life of a person with God.
01:00:59: This is worth studying. Eternity is a long time to be wrong. Hell is a bad place.
01:01:07: Let me tell you, I'll end with this. June 19th, 1976. I was driving my 67
01:01:13: SS Camaro up Turnbull Canyon in Whittier, California. And two guys in the car with me, one in the seat, one behind me.
01:01:22: And one of the guys said, so what's so great about this place? I popped the clutch and punched it.
01:01:29: I woke up in ICU with a doctor sewing my eye back in place.
01:01:36: And I passed out. And over the months following, the memory came back of what happened.
01:01:43: And what had happened, not every bit. Put it together with periodic memories.
01:01:48: I still don't have all the memories get back. And the guys who were in the car with me who remembered some things, we put it together. As I accelerated,
01:01:56: I came around the corner, there was a guy in my lane. Just happened to be one of those coincidences. And I lost control getting out of his way over a canyon road.
01:02:07: I can still remember seeing the mountain side and not wanting to hit it and turn the wheel. And that's what caused me to,
01:02:13: I hit gravel and spun out and went over the embankment, went off the road. Boom.
01:02:20: And I still have scars from it and on my chest too. Took two years to recover.
01:02:27: Okay. So I was unconscious for two hours. Woke up, crawled out of the vehicle.
01:02:35: And was walking. I didn't know where I was. I didn't know what my name was.
01:02:41: I did not know what had happened. And I remember that. I can actually remember, because I've reviewed it so many times over the years.
01:02:48: I can remember being in the state of not knowing my own name. That's weird. Not knowing what had happened.
01:02:55: Not knowing where I was. But it was dark and there was a coolness on my face.
01:03:04: It was a full moon and I put my hand to my face and I could see the blood running down and dripping.
01:03:11: And I spit out stuff from my mouth. I don't know what it was. Teeth. And I had to go get a crown because of that car accident that broke this.
01:03:20: It's finally giving way. And I have woken up in a place in great pain.
01:03:30: My back was sprained. I have a deformed bone back there and they thought it was broken. It had complications.
01:03:36: Broken nose, broken teeth. Eyes swollen shut from the impact.
01:03:43: Blood dripping, running. They said, I'm making this up, this happened.
01:03:49: How would you have to wake up in a place like that? Alone. No one's with you.
01:03:55: These guys were still unconscious. By yourself. You're hearing wild dogs or coyotes in the background getting closer.
01:04:04: You realize your life is at stake and the next decision might kill you.
01:04:12: What do you do when you are utterly alone? Utterly by yourself. Without hope.
01:04:19: Not knowing what had happened. And in pain. I've been there and I remember it.
01:04:26: And I can only talk about it casually because it happened when I was 19. I'm 60. It took years before I could talk about without getting agitated.
01:04:36: You add flame to that and you have an idea of what hell is. This utter aloneness and helplessness with agony.
01:04:47: This is what the scriptures talk about. This is what's waiting for the Mormons. Mormons, if you're listening,
01:04:55: I don't want you to go there. You better find out the truth about Joseph Smith because you're following what he said.
01:05:01: And if you're a Christian and you want to witness to the Mormons, ask to be used. I have to warn you though, to be asked to be used means to be vulnerable, to being changed.
01:05:14: And that's not always easy. It's worth it. And it means studying. And then it means asking God to open the door at the right time.
01:05:20: And maybe through all the studying you do, he doesn't open the door for a long time.
01:05:26: And then once in a store, once in a pet store, once in a gas station, who knows?
01:05:33: You share something you've learned with somebody. And that's the key. Is it worth it?
01:05:39: Of course it's worth it. Eternity is a long time to be wrong. And we need as Christians to not sit around and do nothing.
01:05:49: We need to reach out as much as we can to bring glory to God and equip the Christians and try and reach the lost.
01:05:57: When you do it by studying, it's not easy, but it's worth it.
01:06:03: Just think of a soul. One more for God. Just save one more, one more.
01:06:10: All right. We pray, we'll take a break. And then we'll come back online in a few minutes and we'll do some
01:06:16: Q and A from anybody about anything. All right. Lord, thank you. I just ask you bless this time.
01:06:21: Thank you for the series that we've gone through on Mormonism. Thank you, Lord, that you've given us this information and that we're able to go through it and learn.
01:06:30: I just ask that you would, you would cause it to be seen and heard by those who need to see and hear it.
01:06:40: And that they would humble themselves and not put their trust in their own abilities, but to all, to all what you have done that they trust.
01:06:51: I look to you only. Jesus, we thank you for the time. We thank you for the truth.