F4F | Hearing the Voice of God Part 1

The Claim That Christianity Is a Relationship and Not Religion

Welcome to another installment of Fighting for the Faith. My name is Chris Roseborough. I am your servant in Jesus Christ. This is the channel that compares what people are saying in the name of God to the Word of God.

Now, have you ever heard somebody, a pastor, a preacher, a teacher, a conference speaker, a self-proclaimed prophet, prophetess, apostle, or apostolate, tell you that, well, Christianity, it's not a religion, it's a relationship.

And because it's a relationship, you have to have two-way conversations with God. And if you're not hearing the voice of God, then you should question whether or not you're even a Christian. If you've ever heard that, yeah, go ahead and hit the subscribe button down below.

Don't forget to like the video and ring the bell so that you can be notified when we update things here like that. We're going to be doing a series on hearing the voice of God, and we're going to prove definitively that what is meant by hearing the voice of God is not you hearing the still small voice or some audible voice or God speaking into your heart or things like that.

And this is going to be a multi-video segment, so it's going to take us a few episodes to kind of tease this all out because the biblical teaching behind this is extensive. So if you're looking forward to a deep dive, you've come to the right place.

And what we're going to do is we're going to start off by setting up the problem, if you would, by listening to three different false teachers. It doesn't matter who they are, but each of these you should put on the mark and avoid list.

It doesn't matter who they are because the goal here is to teach you this regardless of the pastor or preacher or prophet or apostle who's teaching these things. By the way, there are no modern-day prophets or apostles.

Just want to make that clear. So let me whirl up the desktop here and yeah, by the way, that's a photograph of a church I shot in New Mexico. It's a derelict church now, Sunset, a trip I took back in September of 2020.

We were social distancing. Anyway, let me pull this up and we're going to start off, we're going to head over to Awaken Church, Awaken Church. They are formerly C3 Church San Diego. This is Becky Heindricks.

And we're going to listen to her talk about hearing the voice of God kind of anecdotally as she relays to us a story that took place in her family. And we'll note that what she's saying is kind of standard fare within evangelicalism.

And again, we're setting up the problem right now. So let's listen.

I know Pastor Dan was just sharing this at our Cherish Nights this last week. And she had shared this with me a while back. And so we've started to implement this in our household. Now we always sit down for family meals.

We're actually really good about that. And we always, how was your day? How was math? What was this? What was that? And you know, you always get like the one word or like one liners with like zero expansion and you're just like pulling teeth to get information from your children.

So Pastor Dan recommended a while back, why don't we start asking our children, like, what is God speaking to you about? What is he encouraging you with? What is he challenging you on?

So note, she's assuming that God's going to speak directly to you. Does the Bible teach us that God's going to speak directly to us?

We begin to make our children aware that God is a part of their daily lives, that he is actually speaking to them so they can develop a relationship with him.

So that they can, quote, develop a relationship with him. Now a little bit of a note here. The phrase, Christianity is not a religion, it's a relationship, was originally coined as a phrase that distinguishes Christianity from works-based religions.

The issue is, is that the relationship that we have is not best exemplified by comparing it to a romantic relationship or even a friendship. Instead, the proper way of understanding a Christian's relationship to God is one of father and adopted child, who used to be under the dominion of darkness and a slave to sin.

But what has happened is, is that in our day and age, when evangelicals talk about hearing the voice of God and developing a relationship with him, oftentimes the way they describe God turns Jesus into like a bearded girlfriend who gets angry if you don't text him to let him know that you're going to be five minutes late for Bible study.

That's a problem. That's a huge problem and a lot of confusion. And the way it's being used today, this idea, Christianity is not a religion, it's a relationship, the way it's being used today is a far cry from the way it was originally being used to distinguish it from a religion by which you do things in order to be saved by your obedience, your good works, or fill in the blank.

You get the idea. But that's not how it's being used anymore today.

So they can learn God's voice and start applying things in their life.

And so we sat down this—. Now I'm going to back this up, and I want you to note here that she's not expecting her children to hear the voice of God in Scripture, at least not primarily the way she's describing it here.

Now she does recognize that God does speak in Scripture, but here she's talking about, in the context here, she wants her kids to hear God speaking to their heart. So let me back this up.

Listen again. That's a part of their daily lives, that He is actually speaking to them so they can develop a relationship with Him, so they can learn God's voice and start applying things in their life.

And so we sat down this week and I started the conversation, so what's God speaking to you about? What is He encouraging or maybe challenging or convicting you on? And my middle son says, God's been speaking to me about being brave.

I said, oh, that's awesome. Like why do you think that is? And he said, well, I've been reading lots of Bible verses and stories where all these people were so brave and they did like such awesome things for God.

So now I feel like I can be more brave, like I can lift my hands and not worry about what people are thinking about me. Oh my gosh, mom heart melt. And then my daughter, she's like, well, I still don't know what God's voice sounds like.

Mm hmm.

Does the Bible say that God's going to speak to your heart?

And I'm like, okay, so we had to explain, you know, it's not necessarily an audible voice, but He speaks to your heart. Like when you want to be kind to that person or reach out or do this, like that's God speaking to you.

She's like, oh. And then my oldest son's like, yeah, I got nothing. And then, and then my middle son, you know, in the harassing things they do as siblings says, oh, well, God should start speaking to you about not raging on Fortnite.

Now, by the way, the Bible says something very specifically about fits of anger and rage that these are the works of the sinful flesh. I would point you to Galatians five as an example of that. So the voice of God has spoken regarding rage.

And so it's weird that the expectation is that God's going to speak to his heart to about rage rather than them recognize God has spoken in his word about rage.

And then he goes, yeah, I should probably work on that. And then Henley goes, yeah, but even if you don't rage out loud, you still rage in your head. And so it's like, oh, wow, that's actually a good point.

Let's continue that conversation, Henley.

Now, again, I've pointed out in the past, I'll continue to point it out, the voice of God has spoken very clearly that what Becky Hendricks is doing, she's not permitted to do. This is a command of Christ.

I would point you to 1 Corinthians 14 in that regard. So she's clearly ignoring the voice of God in the scriptures. Next up is a fellow that you should put on your mark and avoid list if you haven't already.

It's Erwin McManus of Mosaic Church in Southern California. And here's a sermon titled Hearing God's Voice. And I'm going to note here that in the days ahead, we're going to release on the podcast at the version of Fighting for the Faith, a full sermon review of this sermon, as well as the sermon we're going to show you from Rick Warren from 2015 at the Hillsong Conference.

So look for upcoming podcast episodes where we will tear this apart. And I'll kind of say it this way, is if God really expected me to hear His voice, why is it that both Erwin McManus and Rick Warren in sermons on Hearing the Voice of God had to twist the scriptures, and I mean badly, in order to make it appear like God's going to speak to me, speak into my heart?

It doesn't make any sense. So we'll demonstrate the ways in which Erwin McManus twists God's Word in this regard. We'll also note the ways in which Rick Warren egregiously twists God's Word in order to make it appear that God wants to speak into our hearts.

And he even twists the prophet Haggai, or no, Habakkuk, and saying, here's the five ways in which you can hear the voice of God. It's unbelievable what Rick Warren will do. But again, those will be in the podcast follow-up episodes to this video.

So for those of you who want to go more in-depth, have a deeper dive, we're going to review this entire sermon on the podcast. But let me give you the setup for the sermon itself in this installment of Fighting for the Faith, and see if you can spot the problem.

And even if you can't, don't worry, I'll point it out. Here we go.

I think it was when I was in junior high, it was the first time we ever visited the mountains of North Carolina. I'm not sure why, but I've always had this romantic magnetism toward the mountains and that whole region of the United States, and where the Cherokee Indians used to roam.

And my brother and I and our family were there. But one time we went out into the woods, and one of the most terrifying things in the world when you're a city kid is to get lost in the woods during sunset, when you realize you're running out of light and you have no idea where you're going.

Everything looks the same. I've lived in cities all my life. I am used to signs. I'm used to street signs and directions carefully written out so I can know exactly where I'm going and how to get where I want to go.

But in the woods, it was different. And as it got darker and darker and darker, you hear a lot of eerie sounds, by the way. You hear a lot of things walking that you cannot see. And I found that it was so difficult not only to not be able to navigate where I'm going, but even to find someone through sound.

When someone would say, I'm over here, I'm over here. It was as if the sound was coming 360 degrees. When someone was trying to guide me by their voice, I couldn't figure out if it was coming from the right, from the left, from north, from south, from east, from west.

And I look now and I think about how we have all these GPS systems and we have ways and all these different ways of traveling our way through cities. It kind of drives me crazy sometimes because whenever you have someone under 35 driving you, they don't even look at the road, they just look at the map.

And sometimes I say, hey, look, just look up the streets right there. You don't have to look at the map. But now it's not just a map that you see. Now you have someone explaining the map to you.

Turn right in 400 feet. Okay. So note, he's making a distinction about how we see and hear and the difference between visual and auditory learning instructions and things like that. That's the setup for this sermon on hearing God's voice.

In 200 feet, in 100 feet, turn right. And if you're like, I think my son Aaron, he turns it into a British voice so that she speaks kindly to him and with a little bit of sophistication. And I wonder when you're driving, are you paying attention to what you see or are you paying attention to what you hear?

Why is it either or? I say, yeah, I do. I pay attention to both. I think that there's a divide in some ways between being a visual learner, being an auditory learner. In fact, if I took a survey, I wonder how many of us would say, no, the best way for me to learn is I need to see it.

I need to look at it. And the best way for me to learn is I need to hear it. I need it explained or I need the sound. Because when you become a follower of Jesus, you almost immediately become a visual learner.

Now, here's the turn. So when you become a follower of Jesus, you almost immediately become a, quote, visual learner talking about the Bible. But watch what he says the Bible is for. You have a Bible.

You're told to read it. You start diving into it, meditating on it, maybe even memorizing it. And so you become, in many ways, a visual learner. You learn by reading the Bible, taking notes, writing down thoughts, observing applications, and then applying it to your life.

But the crazy thing about it—. The crazy thing. —is that even though as a follower of Jesus, you need to be good at being a visual learner. You need to dive into the Scriptures, listen to what God is saying, write it down, apply—.

You need to be good at that, man. You've got to be good at that. —to your life. But really, the Bible is not trying to heighten your visual skills.

What? So really, the Bible's not trying to heighten your visual skills. What's it there for then, Erwin?

The Bible's trying to heighten your auditory skills. What? Because in the end, what you see in the Bible isn't what's going to help you navigate your life.

Did you—. Seriously, I want you to think about the magnitude of that quote. What you see in the Bible is not going to help you navigate your life. Now, this is where I think coming up with a little bit of biblical text is going to help us out.

So we are going to go—. Let's see here. I've got so many things open here in preparation for our study today. I'm going to duplicate this tab. And what we're going to do is we're going to go to 2 Timothy chapter 3.

2 Timothy chapter 3. We'll do a bigger in-depth study on 2 Timothy chapter 3 as part of the bigger portion of this, of the teaching portion of this video. And again, this is going to be multi-segments.

It's probably going to take us two videos to get this all out. So note here, Paul talking to young Pastor Timothy. Yes, this is a pastoral epistle. And it's written to Timothy, who was a pastor of one of the congregations in the city of Ephesus.

And here's what he says, chapter 3, verse 14. But as for you, young Pastor Timothy, continue in what you have learned and have firmly believed, knowing from whom you learned it, and how from childhood you have been acquainted with the sacred writings, grammata in Greek, which are able to make you wise for salvation through faith in Christ.

Here we go, graphe is the Greek term here, graphe, writing. All scripture is breathed out by God and is profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for training in righteousness, so that the man of God may be complete and equipped for every good work.

So you'll note that Erwin McManus, what he just said, is a direct contradiction to what the Apostle Paul, who wrote this under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit, said in 2 Timothy, chapter 3, verses 16 and 17.

That should alert you that if somebody is going to contradict God's word straight on, while teaching you to hear the voice of God, that they're not teaching you to hear the voice of God, because he's directly contradicting the voice of God.

So let me back this up and listen again to the quote in context. I'm going to go back 15 seconds.

Heighten your visual skills. The Bible is trying to heighten your auditory skills, because in the end, what you see in the Bible isn't what's going to help you navigate your life. It's not how you're going to figure out where God is actually guiding you, taking you, and moving you.

The Bible is there so that you can become an auditory learner. The Bible is there so you can see what God has done, so you can read what God is saying. But in the end, it's actually there so that you can learn to hear God's voice.

In other words, the Bible is there to teach you how to hear God's voice so that you don't need the Bible anymore. That's really what he's arguing for here.

You can identify the voice of God.

So that you can identify the voice of God.

And so if you're lost in the woods, God's not going to give you a written map to get you out of the woods. What God's going to do is he's going to call your name and teach you how to follow the sound of his voice to get where you need to go.

Throughout the scriptures, there's this overwhelming theme of the power of God's voice. And as a follower of Christ, you cannot navigate the life that God is calling you to unless you learn to listen, and you listen well.

So apparently, the Bible is not sufficient, and the whole purpose of the Bible is to teach you to hear God's voice so that you don't need the Bible. Really? Okay. Now, last example. This is going to go back in time a little bit, and you're going to note that this is going to go back to 2015.

Rick Warren spoke at the Hillsong Conference back then, and he's going to use his message from the Hillsong Conference for his sermon. And this was on July 7th of 2015. You can find this on the Saddleback Church's YouTube channel.

I'll say this, 15 years ago, Rick Warren was the pinnacle apex teacher of the moment in evangelicalism. Not so much today. I mean, the runaway bestseller book at the time was The Purpose-Driven Life, and everybody had to be doing The Purpose-Driven Life Bible study.

A lot of people still believe that Rick Warren is a solid Bible teacher. In fact, I have known for a decade and a half, he is not a solid Bible teacher at all. He is an egregious twister of God's Word.

And again, why would I learn how to, quote, hear the voice of God from somebody who is perverting and twisting the voice of God the way he does? But here's the setup from the 2015 Hillsong Conference.

And again, I want to make this clear. We're going to do an entire sermon review of this sermon as well, and make that available on the podcast in the days ahead, as part of the series that we're putting together on hearing the voice of God, so that you can do a deep dive on this.

Now listen, here's the setup.

The most important factor in your future is not your background. It's not your race. It's not your education. It's not the opinions of other people or what your parents told you. The most important factor in your future is hearing from God.

Now, in a weird way, I would kind of agree with him, but he's not talking about reading your Bible. He's talking about something different.

What does God say about your life? Now, the theme of this conference, Hillsong 15, is speak, Lord. We're listening. So last night, I just sat down and wrote out a few thoughts. And I want to talk to you this morning, and I actually want to invite Pastor Brian about halfway through this message.

That would be Brian Houston. Come up and share as we talk about hearing the voice of God. Nothing is more important in your life than you learning how to hear the voice of God and distinguish it from Satan's voice, other people's voice, and your own voice.

What biblical text says that?

Nothing is more important than that. So it's a great theme. The Bible is full of examples of God speaking to people.

I agree. There are many examples of that in the Bible, but never is that example held up as something that we should consider normative that we would experience then as well. But we still get to hear God's voice, and I'll explain why when we get to the Bible study portion.

So what's the problem today? Does God have laryngitis?

Has he got a sore throat? Why can't you hear God speak to you?

All right, so there's the question. Why can't you hear God speak to you? Watch what Rick Warren does. He's going to blame you for it.

On a regular basis. The answer is because we're not tuned in.

Yeah, see, God's talking, but we can't hear him. Now, I would point out just the absurdity of this. So God's talking to you, and you can't hear him because you're not, quote unquote, tuned in. What kind of powerless deity is this?

Now, in the past, on the podcast, I've, we have a voice that I use for the Holy Spirit, and we call it Vincent. And Vincent is the powerless Holy Spirit. He's really confused by technology, and he's never really able, he's never figured out how to communicate to most human beings, but he's figured out how to communicate with some.

And so Vincent would say, Hi, this is the Holy Spirit, and I'm talking to you. Hello, is anyone listening? I think I'm broadcasting on the right frequency. Hello, I have things to tell you. I want to reveal your purpose to you and things and stuff.

Hello, is anyone out there? This is nuts. So let me back this up, and I want you to hear Rick Warren say it again, that why can't you hear the voice of God? It's your fault. All right? So God is apparently talking, but you can't hear him, and it's your fault.

Listen again.

Has he got a sore throat? Why can't you hear God speak to you on a regular basis? And the answer is, because we're not tuned in. It's your fault. We're not tuned in. What I want to do in this time this morning is a couple of things.

Quickly, just share the best example I know in Scripture of how to hear the voice of God through Moses. And then I want to invite Pastor Brian up, but I told him I was going to...

Where did Moses teach us how to hear the voice of God? Answer is, he never did teach us that, at least not the way that Rick Warren is going to intimate. If you pay attention to what Moses wrote, you will understand very clearly how to hear the voice of God.

In fact, we're going to start in the Old Testament with Exodus chapters 19 through 24. Won't read them in their entirety, but you'll see the idea here.

And I want to just discuss with him, how do you test an impression? How do you test an impression? Because a lot of you can't figure it out. Now, the longer you walk with the Lord, I've walked with Jesus Christ for over 50 years.

I know the voice of Jesus Christ. I know when he speaks to me, there's no doubt in my mind. The Bible says that hearing God's voice and being able to distinguish it.

Is important for three reasons. All right, so three reasons why it's important.

First, it proves you are a child of God. Jesus said, my sheep hear my voice.

Now, I want you to consider the impact of what he just said. He says that hearing the voice of God proves you're a child of God. And then he takes a verse from John chapter 10 out of context and says, my sheep hear my voice.

Therefore, if you're not hearing the voice of God and you don't know the voice of Jesus, you're probably not even a Christian. That's the implications of what he's saying here. Let me back it up, and then this will be part of how we tease this all out in our in-depth study.

God's voice and being able to distinguish it is important for three reasons. First, it proves you are a child of God. Jesus said, my sheep hear my voice. Out of context. The Bible tells us in the book of John, chapter 8, verse 47, he who belongs to God hears God's voice.

Okay, we'll take a look at John 8, 47 too.

He who does not belong to God does not hear it.

Okay, that's gonna... I'm gonna put a little timestamp here because I want to come back to this and note that how he's twisting John 8, 47.

Not only that, it protects you from mistakes. Job 33 talks about that. And not only that, it is the key to a productive life.

Anything... So the key to a productive life is hearing the voice of God audibly?

Have been able to accomplish in my life is by the grace of God and because I was able to discern what God was saying in that moment. Nothing is more important than you to be able to say, speak. Lord, I'm listening.

All right, nothing's more important than to be able to say, speak Lord, I'm listening. So these three different teachers, it's not about the teacher. Although I would say this, Becky Heindricks, Erwin McManus, and Rick Warren should be on your mark and avoid list.

Mark and avoid. They are not sound Bible teachers at all, period. But here's the thing. If your pastor's teaching these same doctrines, he is no better than Becky Heindricks, Erwin McManus, or Rick Warren.

That's the devastating part about all of this. This is not necessarily about warning people off from them. It's about warning people off from this false teaching. So let's open up the scriptures. And we're going to embark on an in-depth biblical look at hearing the voice of God.

We will also, along the way, look at what Jesus says in John chapter 10, my sheep hear my voice, and show what it is that he means by that, and definitively show you from scripture that it does not mean that Jesus is saying he's going to audibly talk to you in your heart.

Far, far from it, and the biblical texts make this clear. So all of that being said, let's go ahead and crack open a Bible, shall we? So let me see. Where do I want to go first? I really want to go into Exodus.

That's where I really want to go. Let's see here. There we go. That's Exodus 19. It's all the way over there. Exodus chapter 19, this is the place where we're going to begin. If you were to do a biblical search for the phrase, obey my voice, and look in the Old Testament, this is where it begins.

And so Exodus chapter 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, and 24, they work together as a unit. And in Exodus 19 through 24, you have the creation of the Bible, the very, very first pages of scripture that are written.

And this is vitally important that you understand this. This becomes the foundation of everything else regarding how the scriptures are built. And I want you to pay attention to what God says about obeying his voice and what it means in this context.

Exodus 19, 1 says, Now on the third new moon after the people of Israel had gone out of the land of Egypt, on that day they came into the wilderness of Sinai. They set out from Rephidim and came to the wilderness of Sinai, and they encamped in the wilderness.

There Israel encamped before the mountain, while Moses went up to God. Yahweh called to him out of the mountain, saying, Thus you shall say to the house of Jacob, and tell the people of Israel, You yourselves have seen what I did to the Egyptians, and how I bore you on eagle's wings and brought you to myself.

Now therefore, if you will indeed, and here's the phrase, obey my voice and keep my covenant, you shall be my treasured possession among all peoples. For all the earth is mine, and you shall be to me a kingdom of priests and a holy nation.

These are the words that you shall speak to the people of Israel. So note, God is not speaking directly to the people of Israel. Nope. He's speaking to them through Moses. And the idea then is, is that what Moses is going to write down, God is saying, you need to pay attention to it.

My voice is in those written words, and you are to obey my voice and keep my covenant. He's not expecting you to hear it inside of here. He's not expecting you to hear it while it's out there dancing on the winds, or a still small voice, or a radio station that you need to tune into.

Nothing like that. It's in the written words that God gives Moses. So Moses came and called the elders of the people and set before them all these words that Yahweh had commanded him. And listen to what their response is.

And all the people answered together and said, all that Yahweh has spoken, we will do. So God spoke to Moses. Moses wrote the words down. Moses took the words to the people. And the people said, all Yahweh has spoken, we will do.

The implication is, is that the voice of God is in the written text. So we continue. So Moses reported the words of the people to Yahweh. And Yahweh said to Moses, behold, I'm coming to you in a thick cloud that the people may hear when I speak to you, and that they may also believe you forever.

And when Moses told the words of the people to Yahweh, Yahweh said to Moses, go to the people and consecrate them today and tomorrow and let them wash their garments and be ready for the third day. On the third day, Yahweh will come down on Mount Sinai in the sight of all the people.

All right, so this is the setup. Now, as you read through what happens next, the assembly gathers at the foot of Mount Sinai, Moses alone ascends, and then this is where we get then the beginning of the writing of Scripture.

And it begins with these words, and God spoke these words, saying, I am Yahweh your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of slavery. You shall have no other gods before me. You shall not make for yourself a carved image or any likeness of anything that is in heaven above and that is in the earth beneath or that is in the water under the earth, and you shall not bow down to them or serve them.

For I, Yahweh your God, am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers and the children to the third and fourth generation of those who hate me, but showing steadfast love to thousands of those who love me and keep my commandments.

You shall not take the name of Yahweh your God in vain, for Yahweh will not hold him guiltless who takes the name, his name in vain. What's the first order of business in the Scripture as it's first being written?

The Ten Commandments, the law of God. And then if you, I'm going to scroll through this so that you can see this then, is that what happens next in the subsequent chapters is that it continues. Now, these are the rules that you shall set before them, and so God gives them rules about slaves, about marriage, about selling your daughter as a slave, about one who strikes a man so that he dies, you know, so there's rules about murder and manslaughter, curses, people who quarrel, people who strike a slave or a female with a rod.

And so, you know, these are the first words written in the Bible, that's what they are. And so, you begin to get the rules, the law of God written down, talking about what happens if a fire breaks out and catches thorns so the stacked grain or standing grain of a field is consumed.

A lot of very practical things are discussed here, and all these words were given by God to Moses, who wrote them down in a book and then brought them to the people. So, this continues through, you know, 21, 22, 23, 24, and then in 24, things change a little bit.

Verse 23, Moses came and told the people all the words of Yahweh and all the rules, and all the people answered with one voice and said, all the words that Yahweh has spoken, we will do. Did they hear God speaking in their hearts?