Purchasing Church Growth

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Welcome to No Compromise Radio, a ministry coming to you from Bethlehem Bible Church in West Boylston.

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No Compromise Radio is a program dedicated to the ongoing proclamation of Jesus Christ based on the theme in Galatians 2, verse 5, where the apostle

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Paul said, "'But we did not yield in subjection to them "'for even an hour, so that the truth of the gospel "'would remain with you.'"

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In short, if you like smooth, watered -down words to make you simply feel good, this show isn't for you.

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By purpose, we are first biblical, but we can also be controversial. Stay tuned for the next 25 minutes as we're called by the divine trumpet to summon the troops for the honor and glory of her

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King. Here's our host, Pastor Mike Abendroth. Welcome to No Compromise Radio ministry. My name is Mike Abendroth, and I am glad to be your host today for the next 24 and 1 1⁄2 minutes.

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Now, I've received requests to make the show longer, but we have a little deal around here. 24 and 1⁄2 minutes are free.

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So you get that for free. Well, with a bumper, it makes it a little bit longer. 28 minutes or something, 28, 30? Intro, outro, close.

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But if you'd like me to do more shows, then you're gonna have to pay because this is supposed to be just kind of a hobby, a ministry extension.

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And this isn't a pity party. I, for the most part, like No Compromise Radio, but the problem is it's just every day.

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So thankfully, on Mondays with one of the sermons, I get a day off. Saturday, Sunday, of course, a day off, and then four shows a week.

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I try not to do too many reruns, but some of the reruns are kind of fun, so.

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All right, don't forget, Pat Abendroth, Behold the Lamb Conference. I'll speak just once,

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I think, or maybe Q &A too. October 4th and 5th, and then

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Pat preaches here Sunday morning, October 6th. You can register at bbcchurch .org.

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We have a cool new website, bbcchurch .org. Thank you to Mr. Reddy and the crew for that. And you can register for that conference here in 2013.

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All right. When one Abendroth isn't enough. Well, what do I have on tap today, on call, on,

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I don't think I'm supposed to say on tap. You record over that. I did get something from my friend over at Do Not Be Surprised Ministry, Erin.

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I should tell you, you should go there sometime. DoNotBeSurprised .com.

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And she said, I probably need this when I come back from my vacation. Church leader insights, resources, and tools.

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Special offer for ministry resources. So I always like offers. I like ministry. I like resources. I like specials.

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Reach more people with this free resource. Grab it today. But the way it's spelled, it makes it seem like this free resource, grab it today.

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It's called grab it today, or is it, do I grab it today? Let Nancy, sorry.

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Let Nelson Searcy show you how to grow your church this fall with a big day.

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A big day is a proven way to cooperate with how God wants to grow your church.

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Well, I was in California this summer and the church that I first preached at, it's a different name now than when

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I preached there. I don't think they changed the name because I preached there. So it was disconnected. I actually was married in that church.

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My wife and I were married there June 6th, 1989. I think

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I preached there in 91, 92, something like that. They let their worship pastor go.

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I know, I don't call them worship pastors, but I think they called it worship pastor. Worship leader, song leader, contemplative prayer leader.

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I think it was called the worship leader. And their pastor, I think, taught on it the next week. And basically, if I remember my facts correctly, that the elders got together and said that anything less than 20 % growth, and I don't mean maturation of the saints, we want you to mature.

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You can read Ephesians just in a cursory fashion, and you can understand that God wants you to mature.

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If you read 1 John, you can understand that when you first are saved, you're like a little child. Then you grow in maturity to the stature of young men, and then you're a father.

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And so we grow as Christians. I am not against immaturity. I'm just against immaturity when you should be mature.

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In other words, every one of us is growing. Every one of us is learning, becoming sanctified more and more as we live out our faith and God's working in us and through us.

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So I'm not, I don't think immaturity's bad. But for the church leadership to say that growth, numerically, that's what they mean, has to be 20 % or this is unacceptable, and then we get rid of our worship guy.

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I think that's bad philosophy, and I think if they're gonna get rid of anybody, it should be getting rid of people who don't have a high view of God from the pulpit and don't preach a high view of Christ expositionally.

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Forget the music, but that just shows you the state of the church where it's about the music. And you can go back to Rick Warren's Purpose -Driven

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Church and quickly find out that the style of music you decide to have at church will determine all kinds of stuff, blah, blah, blah.

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Well, 20 % growth, off a gross, off a net, 20 % growth is the only acceptable thing for this particular church.

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Maybe they think it's for every church, I don't know. So what do you think of that? I think, well,

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I'm not so sure our church has grown 20 % in the last year. Actually, two more families just moved away, one to Hawaii and one to,

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I don't know, some other place. And another one down to Florida here in the next couple months.

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Lots of people come and go and move. And if you're near an Air Force base or a military base, especially those people come and go.

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I'll never forget my professor at Master Seminary telling me that he was very discouraged because he was pastoring, administering by a base, a military base, and he'd get these great families that would come in, and then they'd be gone within two years.

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And then he realized that he was helping train and helping mentor and disciple, he worked with the men, young men and older men for gospel ministry and other churches.

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And he was working for the sake of Christ Church Universal, knowing that in the local church, they would move on.

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I think studies are probably about, you know, in 15 years, 70 % of the people you know in your local fellowship are gonna be moved on.

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Some will die, some will leave, some will get transferred, et cetera. Well, we want growth in churches.

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And so if someone says, Mike, do you like church growth? The answer is yes. Here's how I like church growth. I like it when people preach the gospel and the

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Spirit of God sovereignly grants regeneration. When he saves, he makes people born again.

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And so that kind of growth is great. That's why when we have baptisms, we rejoice because baptisms remind us that God still saves over and over and over in the pastoral epistles,

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God, our Savior, God, our Savior. You read Titus, God, our Savior, why? Well, of course he's our

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Savior, but if you're an elder, if you're a pastor, if you're a ministry leader, it's really important for you to remember that God saves people because it is discouraging to be in pastoral ministry often.

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It is depressing, it makes you downcast because you have your own sin and then you deal with other sinners and then you're like, well, what's ever gonna happen?

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But God is a powerful God, a Savior. And he, at his own good pleasure, by his own free will, grants salvation to people as he pleases.

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And so I like that kind of church growth, don't you? So if someone says, are you into church growth? Well, my answer is evangelism church growth,

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I love. Could there be anything richer, sweeter, more wonderful?

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And then we get to see evidence of that in baptism. Baptism doesn't make them born again, but they are made born again by the

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Spirit's working. God causes them to be born again, 1 Peter chapter one, verse three. And then we see the evidence of their salvation via obedience slash baptism.

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So just to get that straight, what about other kinds of church growth?

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Well, do we like to see people mature in Christ and learn about the faith and say yes to righteousness more and sin?

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They say no to more often. We like that kind of growth. Everyone wants that. Will we increase in our understanding and knowledge of the will of God when we can, if you will, if you allow me to say, parse our salvation?

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When you first get saved, Jesus loves me, Jesus died for me. That's about all I know.

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Well, I mean, I would know that He was raised from the dead and I would know that I must believe in Him and He's the

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Savior and He's the only God. I don't mean that, but you just, about the atonement, you basically know

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He died in your place, that's it. Then the facet of the diamond becomes, facets become clearer and you study the scriptures and you learn about reconciliation.

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Enemies, now friends through Christ. You learn about redemption, redeemed from the slave pit of sin, bought with a price, a ransom price, the precious blood of Christ Jesus.

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Then you learn about propitiation and how with other gods and goddesses, the fake ones, the people had to try to placate their gods and goddesses.

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They would give them offerings. They would give them a daughter. They would give them a baby.

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They would give them fruit. You can go to different restaurants now and you can see in some of the restaurants, little cat goddesses put up there, your favorite little fast food places.

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And you see that there's some oranges there, never eaten, of course. They're eaten later by the owners, but they're fruits put out to placate the gods and ask the gods for favor.

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Well, only Christianity has God placating himself,

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God satisfying his own wrath. We don't do something to earn God's mercy.

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God is merciful. We don't do something, then God becomes gracious. God is just gracious.

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And so you begin to parse your salvation and you learn and grow and that's what we want. We want it so we're not tossed to and fro by various doctrines.

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We're learning, we're imitating God and we're having Christ -like minds.

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And I don't have to go on about this because you, No Compromise Radio Land, you know this. But what about growth where we have to get, let's just be honest, more goats in the congregation?

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Oh, because they like the goat band and they like the goat goatee and they like the goat swag and they like all the goatishness of the church.

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I think Vance Havener talked about the goat stuff, goat land, goat land. I'm one, come all to goat land.

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Versus, of course, sheep land. We are not sovereign. We are supposed to be faithful, 1

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Corinthians chapter four. As stewards, we must be found faithful and so we're just supposed to do what the

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Lord says and then through His means, He grows the church. He builds the church.

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As MacArthur says, why would we be in competition with the Lord? He is the one who builds

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His church. This isn't my church. Sometimes I have to correct myself but I know at least theologically and mentally and most of the time

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I catch myself, I don't say Bethlehem Bible Church is my church. First of all, that would be not correct.

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Second of all, I don't want it to be my church because this thing's too big for me to handle and I don't mean numbers of people but one person's soul's too big for me to handle.

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I can't save people. I can't give people spiritual gifts. I can't indwell them. I can't illuminate them.

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I can't energize them. I can't do all kinds of things. I can just point them to the one who can.

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That's all I can do. As an undershepherd, that's exactly my role as an undershepherd, pointing to the great shepherd, the great physician, the great overseer and bishop of the soul.

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So I don't want it to be my church. That's why when churches, frail though they may be, not perfect though they aren't, when they just do what

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God calls them to do, faithful in gospel ministry, faithful in expository preaching, faithful in trying to live out some of the one another's,

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God blesses and he doesn't bless us because we're doing all these things.

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He's already blessed us and then in light of that, we do these things and he's just building his church. He builds through means, yes,

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I know that. See how careful you have to be when you talk. You always have to explain everything. This could be an 18 minute show but you have to give all your spiritual disclaimers, theological disclaimers so people don't write and say you misspoke, et cetera.

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What's the other word? Fusillage. Fusillade. It's hard to do radio, especially after you haven't been on for several weeks.

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So church growth as a concept, as a movement, as a coined term, church growth, meaning almost the end justify the means and whether it's consumerism or pragmatism or psychology or how do we get unbelievers in the church?

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How do we get more visitors in the church? How do we get more decisions for the church? How do we just get more people and more money?

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And I guess there's probably some good motives lodged in there someplace. See how nice I'm being today.

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Where do you say if we had more people, we'd have more money and if we had more money, we could support more missionaries and more outreaches.

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See, I'm close enough to leadership that I understand that. Now, our elders don't talk that way but when you have more resources, you can do more things but here's what we don't wanna do.

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We don't want to bypass God's way of growth. God's way of growth is not pragmatic.

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It's not driven by consumerism. It's not market driven. It's not ends justifies the means.

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It's not this kind of thing where I have church leader insights. You will learn in the 75 minute downloadable resource every step necessary to plan, implement and preserve the fruit of a successful big day.

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How to use big day to turn an inwardly focused congregation outward. How to attract more people to your church.

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I think 1 Corinthians 1, doesn't it help me with that? How do I attract people to the church?

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How do you attract unbelievers to the church? Well, here's how I would do it if I was a marketer. I would read 1

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Corinthians chapter one and then say, how do we get rid of the cross? How do we get rid of substitutionary atonement?

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How do we get rid of sin, substitute, sacrifice, language?

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Because that's offensive to people. That's how you would do it. Now they're never so bold or brash to say such a thing but that's what would have to happen.

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1 Corinthians 1, 18, for the word of the cross is folly to those who are perishing but to us who are being saved, it is the power of God.

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Jews demand signs, the Greeks seek wisdom, modern Americans and Westerners today seek entertainment, feelings, felt needs but we preach

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Christ crucified. Of course, he's been raised from the dead but this is the stumbling block that Jesus, the

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Messiah, the King of the universe would be crucified on a tree.

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He, some King, a stumbling block to Jews. You can read 1

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Peter two to learn more about that, the offense and folly, our foolishness, it's moronic to Gentiles but to those who are called both

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Jews and Greeks, Christ, the power of God and the wisdom of God. So if you wanna get more unbelievers to church, the answer is simple, get rid of the cross and that's exactly what people have done whether they've tangibly gotten rid of the physical cross in the church, churches have done that or they just don't talk about the cross or they minimize the cross or they do what 1

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Corinthians 1 17 says that people could possibly do.

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Paul says in 1 Corinthians 1 17, for Christ did not send me to baptize but to preach the gospel and not with words of eloquent wisdom lest the cross of Christ be emptied of its power, void of its power.

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There's a way to talk about the cross via eloquent wisdom and probably through market -driven strategies as well that empties the cross of its power.

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So I know these people would not say get rid of the cross but in essence, that's what's coming to the forefront.

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It says here, church leader insights, you will learn how to maximize and increase the prayer life in your church, programs to reach the lost, enlist more volunteers, maximize your preaching, what to do after the big day to preserve the fruit.

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So of course, if you want the evangelism seminar, you can get that for only 25, normally 99 .95.

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So for you here listening to WV &E, listening to No Compromised Land, Tune In Radio, I think we're carried now by Brandon House's Situation Room and Worldview Weekend, if you have a church that says our number one goal is we've got to have growth, it's all problematic and downhill from there.

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That can't be the goal of the church. What is the goal of your church? The goal of your church is to honor the

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Lord Jesus Christ, to promote Him, to preach about Him, to sing about Him, to be faithful to what

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He calls you, the church, to do, that's written in scripture. And think about this, how great is it that the

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Lord adds to the church? Read Acts, the Lord adds to the church, the Lord adds to His church, and many times it's after there's something bad that happens,

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Stephen gets killed, the Lord adds to His church. I think the refrain, maybe six times, the

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Lord adding to His church, or language similar to that, it's all the Lord's prerogative. Plus, I want the

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Lord to do it because if I do it, then my converts are going to be false converts, not real converts, converts that won't last.

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But if the Lord converts somebody, they'll be converted to the end, because it's a real convert, they are really born again.

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And so aren't you glad if you're a church leader, or frankly, if you're just in the church, the goal isn't growth.

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Most churches in America are 100 people or less.

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What does that tell you? Well, I've noticed that you can't really have a huge church, at least

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I can't, be a pastor of a church that's very big, because you can't get your arms around everyone.

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Well, we have plurality of elders, that's helpful. When the church starts to get, I think it was

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J. Adams who said, after 400, you can't really get your arms wrapped around everyone to minister to them effectively.

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Now, I know it's not the pastor's job to minister, as the sole minister, but even then, with elders and deacons and other faithful laymen and laywomen, it's hard to get your arms wrapped around that.

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So anyway, today, my name is Mike Abendroth. Yesterday, my name was Mike Abendroth. Today, we are talking about church growth, market -driven,

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George Barna, Drucker, Warren, Heibles, those kinds of market -driven things.

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I mean, I remember when I was in business school at University of Nebraska, I started off as a chemical engineer because all my friends were,

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I liked chemistry, and I quickly found out I couldn't do that. I had three other friends,

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Frank, Randy, and Wayne, they were all Kimmies, and they could do it, but I couldn't. So I quickly switched to business, and then instead of graduating in four years, it took me four and a half years, and I could get through business, everything except pretty much cost accounting.

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Was that cost accounting 308 at University of Nebraska? I think it was. That was the bane of my life, cost accounting.

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Well, marketing, I thought that was kind of interesting. Product, place, price, promotion,

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I think those are the four Ps of marketing, aren't they? Something close, it sounds pretty good. I would bet that'd be true, but I wouldn't bet a whole lot.

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And so how do you market the church? I think Gary Gilley writes a little book on that.

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The church, this little church went to market. You don't market spiritual things.

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Once you start doing that, you know it's game over. Now, churches can wise up, churches can not do that.

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I feel as a pastor, the pressure, when the church shrinks in size,

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I feel joy when more people show up and visitors come and stay.

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Of course, there's nothing wrong with that, but I don't grow the church. And whether this church goes, we went to two services a couple of years ago or a year ago, well, that's only because we had to.

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I wish we'd be back down at one service, not because I want people to leave, but because two services is a hassle and it hurts the kind of continuity of church folks and who's here, who's not, who have you seen, just kind of the church life, 8 .30

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service, 11 o 'clock service, yikes. But it isn't my church, so we're gonna turn people away, but we ebb and flow in size and attendance and giving and this and that.

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It's the Lord's business. My responsibility is to preach free, sovereign, distinguishing grace found in the person of Christ Jesus, God with us,

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Emmanuel. Here is your God and He forgives sins, guilt, grace, gratitude, sin, savior, service.

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Love God with all your heart, soul, mind and strength and love your neighbor as yourself as a response to your great salvation.

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You have a substitute, you have a redeemer, you have the one who crushed Satan at the cross.

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I mean, and the list goes on. And then if the Lord grows a church, He grows a church.

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What's gonna happen when we start getting persecuted because of the homosexual agenda and everything else and we can't say anything or we lose our tax breaks?

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We get fined, we get thrown into prison. Then what's going to happen? I'd say almost every evangelical church is going to shrink because those looky -loos, those hanger -onners, those who are not really real believers are really solid believers are gonna fall off.

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And then what? Then we'll have the real church, but it just might be smaller. Anyway, my name is

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Mike Avinroth. Today we've just been talking a little bit about church growth. You can write me at info at nocompromiseradio .com.

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I'll read every one and some I'll have people respond to like Ray, he might answer your email, but we'll try to respond to every email.

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So write us at info at nocompromiseradio .com. You can go to NoCo 90, No Compromise Radio 90 on the

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YouTube channel if you want to see a few of those. And don't forget October 4th and 5th, Pat Avinroth. No Compromise Radio with Pastor Mike Avinroth is a production of Bethlehem Bible Church in West Boylston.

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Bethlehem Bible Church is a Bible teaching church firmly committed to unleashing the life transforming power of God's word through verse by verse exposition of the sacred text.

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Please come and join us. Our service times are Sunday morning at 1015 and in the evening at six. We're right on route 110 in West Boylston.

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You can check us out online at bbchurch .org or by phone at 508 -835 -3400.

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The thoughts and opinions expressed on No Compromise Radio do not necessarily reflect those of WVNE its staff or management.