October 27, 2015 Show with Simon J. Robinson on “The War Against Worry”

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Live from the historic parsonage of 19th century gospel minister George Norcross in downtown

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Carlisle, Pennsylvania, it's Iron Sharpens Iron, a radio platform on which pastors,

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Christian scholars and theologians address the burning issues facing the church and the world today.

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Proverbs 27 verse 17 tells us, Iron sharpens iron, so one man sharpens another.

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Matthew Henry said that in this passage, we are cautioned to take heed whom we converse with and directed to have in view in conversation to make one another wiser and better.

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It is our hope that this goal will be accomplished over the next hour and we hope to hear from you, the listener, with your own questions.

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Now here's our host Chris Arnton. Good afternoon

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Cumberland County, Pennsylvania and the rest of humanity living on the planet earth who are listening via live streaming.

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This is Chris Arnton your host of Iron Sharpens Iron wishing you all a happy Tuesday on this 27th day of October 2015 and I'm very excited that we have for the very first time on Iron Sharpens Iron our guest today

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Simon J. Robinson and today we are going to discuss his book

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The War Against Worry, a 31 -day strategy. Simon J.

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Robinson has been in pastoral ministry since 1988 and he is the author of eight books including

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Improving Your Quiet Time and Growing for God. He engages in an itinerant ministry teaching the

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Bible in Europe, Asia and the United States as well as being a police chaplain and leader of the work of redeeming our communities in Chesterfield, England.

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He and his wife Hazel have two adult sons and three grandchildren and it's my honor and privilege to welcome you for the very first time to Iron Sharpens Iron, Simon Robinson.

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Hi Chris, it's an honor to be here. Yes it's an honor to be here, an honor to have you here on the program and our guests, our listeners are immediately going to be struck by the fact that you are not a citizen of this country, the

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United States obviously. Tell us something about where you're from and your upbringing and how you came to Christ.

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Yeah well originally I come from near London, a little place called South Ed on Sea which is a great town to be in, but now we live in the north of England.

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We live near Manchester, that's the main city most people know, but the town's called Chesterfield. It's in a very pretty area called the

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Peak District and we've been there for about 12 years but we've lived kind of all over the UK. We've lived in Portsmouth, we've lived in Nottingham and we seem sort of fairly settled in Chesterfield at the moment.

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My heart's in New York I think as I'm here. We've kind of taken to this city. Yeah great, amen.

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Well I love my native homeland which is

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New York myself, although I live in Pennsylvania now I do miss all my dear friends over there on Long Island and I appreciate your sending my heartfelt appreciation to Pastor Doug McMasters and the folks at New Hyde Park Baptist Church for informing me about your conference and giving me the information to set up this interview with you.

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That's great. I've just realized I told you where I come from, I hadn't told you I've come to Christ yet.

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That's right. It was back in South End I became a Christian and I was brought up to go to church but when

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I was in my teens I realized that going to church wasn't enough, that wasn't what made me a Christian.

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I needed to come to Christ. I do distinctly remember being in an organization called the Covenant as a youth organization and a man called

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Duncan Layden was speaking and he told me, he told all of us about God's love for us.

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He told us that we were far from God and sinful and that we needed to turn from sin and trust in Christ and I kind of made an outward response that day.

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I was interested but it was about a year or so later when I truly turned from my sin and trusted in Christ and I've been following him ever since and I was about 14 when that happened.

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And from there how did you know that you had the call to be in ministry? It was actually soon after I became a

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Christian. It started off with a conviction. It was a bit like Jeremiah talks about the fire within him that was burning it but just this conviction which

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I tested. I talked to people about it and I got involved in different kinds of ministry and in South End, South End is a seaside resort and in those days there used to be an organization called the

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Faith Mission. They used to come down to South End every year. They seemed quite a bit older, they probably were only a few years older than me but they seemed ancient at the time.

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I was about 14 and this team of young people came down and they were very kind and encouraging and I shared with them my call to the ministry.

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So they used to put me on the little podium to give evangelistic talks which was real experience because you've got people walking by and shouting abuse, some people listening and it was an opportunity to start to see if I had that gifting.

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And then I did talks at my youth group and then I started doing local preaching when

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I was about 17 and the call grew and grew. Eventually I went into the ministry in 1988.

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And describe something about the churches that you are affiliated with.

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Well the first church I was at was a church in a little village near South End called Great Waker, an evangelical church and they really are a great group of people.

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I still keep in touch with them. Great gospel witness in the village there and they were really encouraging and supportive and still do encourage me and it's good to hear.

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Some of the people who were young there, who were children there have gone back and are teaching the

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Sunday school and leading the church and have become Christians during that time. So that was really thrilling. Then I went to a city,

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I went to Portsmouth which is a city on the south coast of England with a big maritime history and I was minister of East Eastern Evangelical Free Church for 10 years.

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And that was a really great 10 years and what's been really heartening about that is hearing from people who were growing up during that time.

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I went back there recently to preach because the minister who succeeded me has moved on and there was a young lady came and she said

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I don't know if you know this but I became a Christian during the time there and you know look back to those times as when you know

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I learned a lot about the gospel and about following Jesus which was really thrilling.

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We had a lot of students come through the church and one of them he's living in Canada now.

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He married a Canadian girl and he was involved in ministry among French speaking people in Paris and then he moved eventually to Quebec and he's teaching now but still very involved in his church.

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So it's just thrilling to see what God had done in people's lives through that time and again I keep in touch with them.

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They were a great bunch of people and then I moved on to Chesterfield to Wharton Evangelical Church.

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I was there for about 11 years and that was a really blessed time and during that time we acquired three grandchildren as well.

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Two of them were born in Chesterfield and we'd seen a lot of blessing in the church.

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A lot of people come to Christ and that's actually where I first started to get my links with the police.

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I had great opportunity to talk to police officers about Christ. It all started when they had a mobile centre just opposite the church and we said just come in and we'll give you a cup of tea.

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In England everyone gets a cup of tea and we got friendly with them and started building up links.

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We invited them to come into services and they invited me to be their chaplain which I'm still doing.

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I left that church about 18 months ago or a year ago and involved in some different kinds of ministry at the moment.

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Well we are also during this program going to be promoting two events that you are involved in in New York.

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First you're going to be at the War Against Worry book launch event that's this

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Thursday October 29th 7 30 to 9 p .m. at Neighborhood Church of Greenwich Village in New York City and that's on 269

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Bleeker Street in New York City. For further information you can call 212 -691 -1770 that's 212 -691 -1770 and their website at the

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Neighborhood Church of Greenwich Village is ncgvnyc .com

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which stands for Neighborhood Church of Greenwich Village New York City ncgvnyc .com.

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Then on Reformation Day which is this Saturday October 31st our guest today

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Simon Robinson will be speaking at the New Hyde Park Baptist Church which is located on 635

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New Hyde Park Road in New Hyde Park Long Island New York and for further details on that those events you can call 516 -352 -9672 516 -352 -9672 or you can visit

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New Hyde Park Baptist Church's website at nhpbc .com

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nhp for New Hyde Park bc for baptistchurch .com nhpbc .com

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and I will also be giving you information on how to get a hold of Simon's book and other information as we continue with this interview.

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Well this is a very practical and needed book that you've written

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Simon, The War Against Worry. I have to admit to our audience that Christ's command to be anxious for nothing is probably the sin

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I commit more often than anything else. Violating that command is the sin

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I commit I think more than anything because I do worry quite a lot. And what was the reason what was the thing that propelled you to write this book?

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Well I'm like you I'm actually a worrier by nature and I think sometimes we're kind of wired in different ways and some of us are more prone to it than others.

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It doesn't mean that it's safe that it's right to worry but I think some of us struggle with it more than others and I've always struggled with worry.

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I mean I distinctly remember worrying about what would happen if my father lost his job and I was so worried

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I actually went and asked my grandparents if they'd help us with money if he lost his job and I was only six at the time.

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I'd worry for the whole of the family and it was I think I first began to decide

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I've really got to get a hold of this about 20 years ago and I went to Martin Lloyd -Jones and Matthew 6 you know the studies on the

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Sermon on the Mount and you know Martin Lloyd -Jones was saying where the answer is in Jesus' teaching here and I found that so practical and helpful and from then on you know

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I waged war I declared war against worry and it has been a fight over the years but one of the reasons

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I wanted to write this was to encourage other people as someone who struggled with the issue that it's possible to overcome worry.

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So I wrote this book not as someone from a distance saying you know you mustn't worry this is what you should do but someone who's been a fellow struggler to come alongside them and saying look you know

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I want to encourage you it's possible by obeying Christ's Word and with the help of the

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Holy Spirit that you can overcome worry and actually the way the book first began was

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I was speaking at an event in England it was a I don't know if you call them house parties over here but it was a special event and everyone was staying in this really nice conference centre over the new year break and I gave a talk about about worry from Matthew chapter 6 and there was such a big response and people were saying can you send us the notes

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I thought well maybe I ought to do more about this and my good friend Jim Holmes who was also my colleague in publishing talked to me about this and I was telling him how encouraged

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I was and he said do you know I think you can help a lot more people by putting this into print and we came up with this idea of writing a book that that gave it to people in bite -sized chunks so that over a period of 31 days they could look at the scriptural principles about worry and and pray them through and do some practical things and and overcome this this problem and also you know whenever it comes up again they can always go back to these things and it's all born out of my own my own struggles and the solutions

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I found from the scriptures. Well that is definitely a subject

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I think that a lot of our listeners if not every single one of them can relate to you on and before we even get into some of the practical help that you provide in the book distinguish between worry and healthy fear obviously

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God has placed within us a right fear there are all kinds of fears that we should have the fear of God is the beginning of wisdom as the scriptures tell us and even the fear of doing things that will endanger our life we have a natural instinct to fear certain things and of course a learned fear that we have been taught since we were children to fear certain things we would be foolish to venture into certain activities without fear and a guardedness and an alertness of what is happening around us and so on tell us about what is the difference between that kind of fear and the worry that you speak of yeah that's a really good question

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Chris well I think healthy fear is something that will warn you off it and then once you've taken the direction it's put you in then it's done with we've just been in New York City today and I mean

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I love New York you know and I in fact I think I'm going to cancel my flight and stay here

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I keep saying but I do have a healthy fear of the traffic there you know of walking out when that when that big red hand is on there and try to sneak across because I know you know

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New York drivers are very busy they drive very fast and I could well be under a car so there's a healthy fear that tells me you know just wait and don't do that in fact

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I had a bit of a healthy fear today because we wanted to go down into the city today and I knew

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I needed to be back to talk to you and when we were looking at train times to get back to Long Island here there was one that could have got us in an hour later but I had a healthy fear and I said to my wife

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I think we're going to get that early one you know so we've got plenty of time and that was something

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I acted on we got the train early it was done and it's not something that's going round and round in my mind.

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Worry is actually you know when we pick something up in our mind and it goes round and round and round and round and you know we think we find a solution it says yes but what about this and then what about that so it's just something that just keeps draining our mind with no solution and tries to anticipate everything that could possibly happen without really finding any solution so our life is dominated by what we think might happen.

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And by the way I'm going to announce to our listeners our email address here so that they can join us on the air with questions of their own for you about the war against worry and our email address is chrisarnsen at gmail .com

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c h r i s a r n z e n at gmail .com please include your first name your city and state and your country of residence if you live outside of the

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USA that's chrisarnsen at gmail .com well you say this is a 31 day strategy and tell us about how you develop this into a month -long preparatory uh schedule in order to rid yourself of worry or at least as much as humanly possible yeah well chris what i wanted to do is i wanted to instead of getting straight to some practical points like it was a kind of christianized self -help book i wanted it to be centered on god so i start with you know god's plan god's eternal plan that we're part of his his seal of ownership on us because i wanted people to have a god -centered view and actually to see the call that god has on their life to be effective for his kingdom and then how worry actually makes us ineffective for his kingdom because we're so consumed with our needs so i i sort of drip these truths in over the days are getting these truths in our hearts and minds you know that that god has his eternal plan is christ he's called us to himself he's put his seal of ownership on us and then getting down to the teaching of jesus know that he talks about having little faith which means actually all right as far as it goes but we're not trusting god for our day -to -day needs and of course the teaching in matthew 6 and how to have peace but also how to be alert for the way that that our enemy can actually use our propensity to worry to to take us away from god and actually lead us into temptation so i've tried to sort of tackle every sort of area i can think of and basically i collated all the scriptures that have really helped me over the years um and and put them into this 31 day plan and wanted a whole enough focus to be not on ourselves but on god and on serving him and being effective for his kingdom you know on topics like this that are issues that every human being faces everyday practical advice that you hear very often from televangelists and radio evangelists and so on you will very often hear the most popular of the speakers giving this advice to everyone now uh this is not the kind of thing that you can approach a non -believer with and tell them to stop worrying if they do not have the covering of christ's blood and are redeemed am i am i right i mean you can't tell the lost to stop worrying when in fact they have a lot to worry about don't they yes in fact there's a rival book about worry i don't know if i should if i should plug it really one of the things i was quite impressed with this book is it was um and if you if you want to put a book in an unbeliever's hand his one is very good very good i think it's called um living without worry it's a very good book but it takes a kind of it's different angle to me in the sense that it's in a bigger chapter it's not the 31 day strategy but in that book he says well there is something you should worry about um and that's that's hell that's you know eternal punishment and i think you've got a point there because you don't want to we don't want to dish out self -help um and just say well you know this is how you get your best life and these are the principles but actually it's about living for the glory of god so i guess if i you know if if a believer put this book into the hands of an unbeliever you know i hope that you know that they it would be a tool but they'd say well look these are the principles in god's word have helped me but of course they they help me in so much as i'm as i'm god's child and i can only put these into principles these principles into practice because as god's child you know i've got a new nature and have the holy spirit that helps me to put this into practice but i do take your point about tele -evangelist and i mean i won't say who the person was but i compared him side by side to a secular self -help person and actually i couldn't see any difference except it used slightly christian language in the in in the preacher and that's that's something i really did want to avoid and yeah that's a very good thing to avoid i think yeah but it is i mean it's it's it's very sad when you see people rushing after these things and then that and again that was one of the things i wanted to do is just get people back to the word of god and the means of grace well uh tell us about the big picture that you uh open up your book with well the big picture yeah i take that from uh uh ephesians i mean i think ephesians is it's a wonderful book because it's uh like all the books in the bible are but in thinking about worry um i i found it so helpful because when you think of the context that this was a group of christians in a city that would have been quite hostile to them there was that massive temple dedicated to diana which must have made them feel under threat somewhat and the theme of the book is about you know god being glorified in christ and and all that god has done in christ um and the big picture is this the eternal plan that god has in christ that that we've been brought into that he's predestined us uh that he's cleansed us by the blood of christ that will be renewed and and part of the ultimate new creation and we need to see our lives in the context of of that god's plan that the trouble is i find with a lot of these books that i've read and about god's plan for your life now it's about you know god's plan for your marriage god's plan for your job and i'm not decrying these things and saying they're not important but the bigger picture is you know god's plan for eternity for us that we'll be you know standing before him as righteous and part of that eternal kingdom and um we're on road to that now and we need to live our lives in the light of it and we do have a listener already who has a question we have susan in newville pennsylvania hi susan uh she asks uh i am plagued with fear of the damnation of my children because none of them are yet born again uh is this appropriate for a christian to be plagued as i am with these fears for the eternity of my children and if this is not normal or appropriate for a christian to be plagued in such a way how do i overcome this very real fear that sometimes cripples me well that's a very good question susan and uh you know i'm sorry that it's crippled i i think what at the heart you i mean it's a genuine concern we should all be we should all be concerned about the eternal future of our children but i think it's when that the problem is when we feel it's something that we're in we have to be in control of um one of the things i say about worry in the book is that um a lot of it is rooted in our desire to control things um and i think it's absolutely right for you susan to be concerned deeply concerned about the eternal future of your children but in the end you know it's god who does that work in the heart and he's your heavenly father so what i would encourage susan to do would be to bring these things to a heavenly father and consciously relinquish control and say well lord you know i'm help me to be part of the solution here you know to pray for my children to be a good example to them as someone who's a christian to have opportunity to speak to them at the right time but lord you know you're the one who works in their heart and to kind of turn that anxiety into prayer and just bring it to christ and bring it to the heavenly father and say well father please work in their heart and i think i you know i'd encourage susan every time you know there's that sense of it crippling to to remember god's a heavenly father he's the one in control he's the one who works in hearts and just to continually present it to him and he'll never tire he'll never tire of hearing that presented to him because he's a heavenly father and he knows our needs and he knows our cares um and i would encourage susan as well you could to pray with someone else about this to have you know someone who could sort of buddy up with her and encourage her and pray for her children but also pray for her as she struggles she struggles with this don't don't carry on your own and uh we do also have another listener with a question a listener obviously using an alias lamb lamb lamb lamb yes from nassau county long island new york uh lamb lamb says first of all thank you for writing such a book that's easy to understand with day -to -day examples that's close to heart like a friend questions from reading the excerpt provided on your website this is seemingly for christians as the seal of the holy spirit was addressed on day two so will this book be beneficial to non -christians and how can non -believers relate if so that's a good question well i think it goes back to what you were talking about earlier chris in that um really i mean to put principles of bible into practice and we need to be god's children and we need the help of god's spirit but i would say it it could be a good tool for witness to say look you know these are the principles that as a christian help me to struggle with worry and you know i'd like to give this book to you uh so that you can see them and and tell you more about the person jesus who has given this teaching um i mean there is of course there is common grace um and you see i find it interesting actually when i i've heard people talk about worrying they've said you know take one diet day at a time one step at a time and that all comes from jesus and from his teaching so there is that element but of course that it is he's talking about god's big work in us but i think it i think it could be a tool a tool for witnessing as well and by the way uh susan and lamb lamb uh you are receiving a free copy of the war against worry a 31 day strategy by our guest simon j robinson and this is compliments of the publishers and uh anybody who writes to us uh during the program with a question good enough to be read on the air uh as long as we still have a supply uh you will receive a free copy as well so please give us your full mailing address when you email your questions to chris arnzen at gmail .com

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chris arnzen that's c -h -r -i -s -a -r -n -z -e -n at gmail .com and we will be sure to send you out a copy as long as we have some left by the time you send your question in and it has to be a good question relevant to the topic it can't be can i have a free copy of the book that is not a good enough question it has to be a good question good enough to be read on the air and we're going to be going to a break right now so we look forward to uh hearing from you and your questions for simon robinson after these messages so don't go away we'll be right back with the war against worry attention coin collectors and investors long island galleries of wading river new york has brilliant uncirculated 19th century morgan silver dollars for only 54 per coin with free shipping and handling for a limited time there's a 40 coin limit so order now while supplies last call 888 -260 -8111 888 -260 -8111 visa mastercard discover and american express welcome price is subject to change so call now at 888 -260 -8111 888 -260 -8111 if you prefer ordering your brilliant uncirculated 19th century morgan silver dollars by check mail it today to long island galleries 9 susan drive wading river new york 11792 that's long island galleries 9 susan drive wading river new york 11792 remember they're only 54 per coin with free shipping and handling and a 40 coin limit new york state residents must add sales tax long island galleries is honored to sponsor iron sharpens iron radio see the long island galleries display ad at iron sharpens iron radio .com

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charles haddon spurgeon once said give yourself unto reading the man who never reads will never be read he who never quotes will never be quoted he will not use the thoughts of other men's brains proves he has no brains of his own you need to read solid ground christian books is a publisher and book distributor who takes these words of the prince of preachers to the mission of solid ground christian books is to bring back treasures of the past to minister to christians in the present and future and to publish new titles that address burning issues in the church and the world since it's beginning in 2001 solid ground has been committed to publish god -centered christ exalting books for all ages we invite you to go treasure hunting at solid -ground -books .com

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that's solid -ground -books .com and see what priceless literary gems from the past or present you can unearth from solid ground solid ground christian books is honored to be a weekly sponsor of iron sharpens iron radio thriving financial is not your typical financial services provider as a membership organization we help christians be wise with money and live generously every day and for the fourth year in a row we were named one of the world's most ethical companies by the ethosphere institute a leading international think tank dedicated to the creation advancement and sharing of best practices in business ethics contact me mike gallagher financial consultant at 717 -254 -6433 again 717 -254 -6433 to learn more about the thriving difference we know we were made for so much more than lending faith finances and generosity that's the thriving story welcome back this is chris orange and if you just tuned us in our guest today is simon jay robinson and we're discussing his book the war against worry a 31 -day strategy if you'd like to join us on the air with a question of your own our email address is chris arnzen at gmail .com

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c h r i s a r n z e n at gmail .com and please give us your entire address because we are going to mail you a free copy of the war against worry if you are one of the few that get to our program with a question before it concludes and we still have the supply left as long as your question is good enough to be read on the air and relevant to the topic we apologize to the overseas listeners and listeners in canada the free book giveaway is only good for those living in the united states due to shipping costs we have a sponsor that ships these books out free of charge for us and they cannot be overwhelmed with overseas and canadian shipping costs so we apologize for that but we do still look forward to getting your emails with questions so you can participate in the program no matter where you live and that's chris arnzen at gmail .com

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chris arnzen at gmail .com and we will also keep reminding you about the information about the two places in new york where simon j robinson will be speaking this week on thursday and saturday and sunday so we will be repeating that information a little bit later but the what do you mean by god's property in your book the war against worry uh well i think that's that's the fact that god has put his seal of ownership on us um as it says in ephesians that and one of the things i've been trying to do with this chris within this book is to to turn the whole thing upside down because we we tend to think about me my problems and my worry and say actually you know we're god's property and we need to see everything in the light of that because jesus said seek first the kingdom of god and all these things should be added to you get that in perspective and then worries kind of fall into place and if we're god's property then god will give us everything we need need to continue to live for him yeah well uh the fact that we are god's property is something that um that continues to get me through the rough trials in life and i've had my share of them of course there are millions of people who have had far worse in their lives but i know that my belief in particular redemption and unconditional election and the the fact that god loves me as an individual and not just a faceless sea of humanity it seems that do you think that that many modern evangelicals and others water down what the what god's love is for his children when they present a picture of god that basically loves every individual who has ever lived and ever will live in the same way and at the same depth and it doesn't matter if these people will wind up in heaven or hell god loves them all the same doesn't that seem to water down the way god loves not only his children but the way christ loves his bride yeah i think that's a very good point and i mean we talked earlier on about tele -evangelists and uh i mean unfortunately in the uk that they're far and wide now on the on the digital channels that we get but when i watch them it just seems to be you know slightly christianized form of self -help that's accessible to everyone and i think we're coming from a completely different angle to say as you say that you know god has chosen us uh in that particular redemption that christ has has died for the sins of his people and that's a precious thing uh to focus on all that all that god has done and and and how precious we are to him as his bride and also you know when we think about god's big picture we think about being part of the bride presented perfect to christ i love those in june and the verses at the end of jude that we often have as a benediction at the end of the service season about about um how god will present us to himself pure and spotless and perfect and that always fills me with hope and encouragement and spurs me on i do want to read a second question by lam lam uh from nassau county long island lam lam writes years back i encountered with the wife of a very conservative pastor who kept emphasizing reading the bible will help everything which is absolutely true in majority of sense however on one hand in some cases counseling help is needed i see that christians who managed to memorize and understand the scriptures but still worry and even to a point of depression what is the gap over there well that's a very interesting question lam lam i think uh you can accumulate knowledge and i mean bible memorization is is fantastic but it's it's knowing how to put it into practice and i think from you know christian perspective with counseling is what what we're doing really is we're helping people coming alongside them you know to put god's word into practice uh when i was with my good friend jim holmes a couple of weeks ago he was in touch with people who were involved in the there was a big conference in louisville for the association of biblical counselors um and i do love you know their emphasis on on just getting people back to the word of god and helping them to to think biblically because we we need to get our our mind in line with with god's word and know how to put it into practice and counseling is great to help us do that where i'm wary is when um i don't know if it's it's quite so popular now but 10 20 years ago some christian counselors would try and fish around in your background and say well you know you worry because you know your mum fell over when she was carrying you or something and they'll drag something up from the background or she fell down the stairs when she was carrying you and that's the root of your worry but i think it's you know it's it's simply helping someone put the word of god into practice and there are some great people who can probably talk more about that who are involved in in counseling but that's that's my kind of layman's perspective on it uh what do you mean by the unshakable kingdom it's well i'm thinking of you know these verses in hebrews you know that talks about the the kingdom that's to come and that while everything around us i mean the world is changing so much um in europe i mean we have this we have this incredible situation with this this huge migration of people that's shaking europe to the core really because um we've never known anything like it and it's countries you know like greece with their economic problems are saying and we can't we can't cope with this and you know we can see systems and governments crumbling but god's kingdom never changes god's kingdom is firm and sure we're part of that kingdom we know it will be fully established that um christ return it in its unshakable everything else isn't god said in in uh in the old testament and he brought it in hebrews uh he said you know that i will shake heaven and earth i will shake everything but uh in hebrews we were told let us be grateful for receiving a kingdom that cannot be shaken and uh just want to repeat our email address it's chris arnzen at gmail .com

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c -h -r -i -s -a -r -n -z -e -n at gmail .com i do have an anonymous listener in georgia who says that the church where i am a member frowns against the use of medication for depression one of the things that has led me to the deaths of depression is a daily worry that seems to overwhelm my life at times there seems to be no particular urgent reason for me to worry but yet i am still plagued by this fear and worry and anxiety is it correct or appropriate for a christian to take medication for this type of a thing that that's a very good question and thank you anonymous listener i know there are shades of opinion on this and i do tackle this in the book from my personal experience um um but i was advised um by a doctor when i was in a very very difficult situation uh to take medication and i she was a christian doctor and i really didn't want to do this and she said well simon god has given people the ability to make this medication and your problem is partly physical because one of the problems you know with depression and worry is that chemicals seem to sort of go into overdrive i'm talking as a layman here um and i found i'm speaking from personal experience i'm not on the medication now but i found that the medication actually kind of stabilized those things it wasn't the answer but it did deal with some of the symptoms um and and it and while it was dealing with those symptoms you know i kind of addressed the core things of well you know how i was approaching things and how i was thinking um and i and i think sometimes we can be quite harsh on people who struggle with depression and you know i've i've in my 30 years as a pastor i've met people who've struggled deeply with depression and um and that's that's nothing to be ashamed of i mean charles haddon spurgeon after that terrible incident uh you know in the music hall where he was preaching and uh people were killed in a when someone called out fire fire he sometimes he was noticed well to be in such a depressed state his deacons actually used to sort of almost carry him into the pulpit sort of pushed him in the pulpit and martin luther i mean martin luther really struggled with depression so the good godly people have struggled and we see people like elijah in the bible who've struggled with it and medication isn't the answer but you know it can be a help and within a common grace it's it's not something i think we should shun i do know there are some christians who think differently i was having a discussion with someone um where i've just been and uh you know they say well is this integration is this is bringing secular thinking into into the way you deal with things but i i think it's it it's you know a doctor's advice it deals with some of the physical effects it helps to stabilize us um but it doesn't give us everything we need you know we we need to come back to those principles the lord gave us and and seek his help and the encouragement of others as well encouragement support of other christians do you think though having said that everything that you've said that uh sometimes people are rushed too quickly to the doctor into the pharmacy to take care of things like this all right that's a very good point chris yeah i i think you're right i mean i resisted it for a long time and i i got off off fitness as soon as i could and that's why you know i say it's not the answer and uh my doctor he was a christian was a christian doctor and she it was some time before she suggested this and you know she you know she didn't push me into it but i i don't know what it's like in the united states i've noticed when i've been here that there's even been adverts about antidepressants so it might be different we have a different system there that um you know we probably have to sort of get it through i don't you get it through prescription or get it over the counter i don't know how it works here but i i think yeah we it's good to to actually resist for a bit and think well do i really need this and to think it through and not and not be rushed into it maybe even get a second opinion on it just out of curiosity i don't know if you are aware of what his view on that was but do you know anything about what dr martin lloyd jones uh thought about that because of the fact that he was not only a pastor but he was also a medical doctor wasn't he well he's interesting you say that because my wife and i were having a conversation about martin lloyd jones today um i can i can tell you a a story of um a friend of mine my mentor he's now with the lord a pastor was he was he was a good friend of martin lloyd jones he never let us forget that he was a good friend of mine so i have got a shake of the hand that shook his hand but he said martin lloyd jones was talking about someone who was teaching and saying teaching about mental illness and saying mental illness doesn't exist and he said martin lloyd jones sat down and he said that man is quite wrong that man is quite wrong and one of the most helpful books i've found in christian ministry has been his book on spiritual depression and you can see the doctor and the pastor coming out in him there um and i can't remember if he if he would address issues like this but certainly i i think he he really takes a very pastoral line um but but sees you know that that mental illness yeah it is an issue um and you know can't can't be just sort of swept under the carpet and and people shouldn't be made to feel ashamed of it i don't i don't know what else he'd written about him mainly the spiritual depression he tackled themes like that i don't know he i think he had a bit of a difficult time at a low period himself i think but he certainly talked about different people who struggle with depression the interesting thing is that there's a banner book um it's called i think it's called the puritans and their successors and it's it's actually a collection of papers that the doctor gave at the westminster fellowship and there is actually a very good one on this subject in it and he talks about um some of the medical things that might be behind them and he feels that spurgeon's he thinks that spurgeon's depression probably was rooted in gal he thinks there was a medical reason and i might have people writing this i'm misquoting him and i apologize if i have but my take on what i've read of him is that um is that he sees you know there's sometimes often physical things that actually affect our mood and we need to recognize that and i think that was one of the things he talked about spurgeon that obviously spurgeon wouldn't have been aware of such a diagnosis but it's worth like worth seeking out i mean anything by him is worth reading that's a very interesting book full of full of practical papers he gave at that fellowship of ministers uh what is your book on one of the roles and titles of christ the good shepherd yes that's right i tackle that that that or not the tackle is not the right word but i i encourage people to think about jesus as the good shepherd and i mean that's a theme that runs right through the bible and i think sometimes we kind of rush into this image i mean i come from england and you know there's this this kind of image of greenfield you know the shepherd with a sheep but we live uh near the country and actually sheep are really the most i think i think sheep must rank among the most stupid animals i've ever seen someone in my old church he said he actually found a sheep lying on its back and it couldn't roll itself over and he had to actually sort of turn it over and hold it to steady its legs so it could walk along again and so it's not surprising that that image is huge now that we all like sheep have gone astray but we find it um psalm 23 you know the lord is my shepherd there's that beautiful passage in ezekiel where god talks about the leaders who were shepherds who abused the sheep and saying he would be the shepherd there there's many other references in the prophets and of course jesus fulfilled that saying that he's the good shepherd who cares for his sheep and lays his life down for the sheep and that's a precious thing to think you know my life is in his hands um you know lord is my shepherd i shall not want he makes me lie down in green pastures the interesting thing about the green pastures as well and when i was in israel at once i noticed there was a shepherd in in the desert and i and i said to the two leader why is he in the desert with them and he showed me in the distance there were clumps of grass and he said what the shepherd does is take them to those clumps of grass clumps of grass that are around and it made me realize a bit more about the lord is my shepherd it doesn't mean it's always green fields but actually leads me to places where he feeds and sustains me amen uh the uh the chapter look at what god has given us tell us something about that uh yeah well i mean god has blessed us with with so many things and i think one of the things that we tend to do when we worry is we we focus on what we haven't got you know what we think we might not get and we forget about all the great things that god has given us one of the verses that's that's really blessed me recently has been a verse from micah that says um i watch for the lord uh and i wait in hope for the lord and i i i've been memorizing that verse and meditating on that verse and i've been looking out for different things the lord's lord's doing throughout the day you know that just the ways the lord provides and cares for me and that actually really encourages me and i think well why do i worry about my future when i can see god provides for my day -to -day needs and god has done so much this day i think that there are so many things god does each day we we're not even aware of them and it's like psalm 103 talks about you know looking at god's blessings and not forgetting them and i think we need to do that sometimes just stop and recount one of the things i'd recommend was is the discipline of journaling and i love to just journal and just jot down different ways you know the lord has blessed me and opened doors today and they they far outweigh the things i worry about amen let me uh repeat our email address if anybody would like to join us on the air it's chris arnzen at gmail .com

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c -h -r -i -s -a -r -n -z -e -n at gmail .com uh you can join us on the air with a question for simon j robinson if you care to have your own question answered uh god has not finished with me yet that's even a bumper sticker tell us about that yeah well i'm one of my my favorite verses in the bible is philippians 1 6 that says you know that talks about that paul is confident that he began a good work will bring it to completion in the day of christ jesus and actually that's the same book in which he tells us which paul tells us not to be anxious about anything but in everything by prayer and supplication with thanksgiving to bring our knees to god and he's talking to people actually who are quite worried about him because you know paphroditus has been over to to bring that gift to to paul um and you know with questions from the church there and they're clearly anxious about what's going to happen to paul um and paul is concerned for them he's paul's not anxious but he's concerned for them you know he can't be with wishes he could but he's confident that that god will finish his work and and that's that's such an encouragement to all of us i think that um god's not going to give up on us and that actually is quite an important weapon in our war against worry because we know god will finish what he started uh and he might need to take us through difficult he will need to take us through difficult times but we can be confident of that we do have another anonymous listener in cumberland county pennsylvania who says one of your other listeners asked is it appropriate to be plagued with fear over the eternal destiny of your children what about when it's your own eternal destiny is it normal for a christian to have much worry about whether or not they are truly saved is that a sign that you are not saved at all that's that's a very good question now um i think one of the really good books to turn to there is one john which talks about our assurance i mean it under the bible says you know examine yourself to see whether you're in the faith but it you know to go back to the just the basic command of the gospel you know have i have i turned to christ do i trust in christ totally is my hope totally in him in fact if my hope is totally in him well you know there is no need to to worry for my eternal like my eternal future because because i know i trust in him now i think sometimes um one of the issues is is is that we have an enemy you know who is the accuser he's called the accuser of the brethren and the first thing he said we read in the bible is is did god say one of the things i often have said as a pastor to people that you can tell the litmus test between whether it is our enemy trying to unseat us and unsettle us or god convicting us is that when it's god he will lead us in a direction and it would deal with it and we'll walk with him you know godly grief at least repentance if if god is convicting us about our eternal future then you know he will bring us to christ you know we'll come to christ we'll uh we'll trust in him and that that is it you know we'll have that assurance if it's satan he's just wanting to snatch that away and i think you know christians are plagued with these things it's going back to those principles in one john you know about trusting in christ about seeing you know he we have an advocate with the father um and and focusing on the cross so you know it's always good you know just to to to check our hearts um to see if we're in the faith but it's it's that total trust in christ that we need that's a that's a very good question and a another listener in lyndon hearst long island new york cj says to segue off of that last question that someone said uh that someone asked uh isn't it true that a true christian can be plagued with fear of not being saved because they are being taught unbiblical theology yes i mean the proverb says you know what a person thinks so he is and i think one of the problems are the problems we've got is that there is so much you know through the internet and through the the people we see on tv there's so much being fed to us uh and an emphasis i mean that the emphasis of much of what i've seen is you know get your best now get your best now and and the measure of god's blessing is how much you've got and i think actually these these actually do a lot of harm and unsettle a lot of people um and so it's it's it's important you know that we get our our theology straight and our thinking and our thinking in line with that with that theology yeah i can recall years ago when i was on a uh religious journey if you will before i came to faith in christ i believe it was a part of god drawing me when i was investigating different churches this would have been back in the 80s um i was fairly regularly attending a pentecostal church and i don't want to broad brush my pentecostal brethren i'm not saying that they're all like this i know in fact even some pentecostals who are calvinists but i can recall vividly remember at this church that you would have people going forward at an altar call for salvation every sunday oh yeah and these were these were members of the church yeah yeah i i mean i i would have the same convictions that you do about altar calls i think that's the trouble that that kind of you know the kind of theology you know you must come to the front and you must you must you may should do this and you must do that it can become actually quite works orientated as well and it's actually you know not the danger is we're not looking to the person of christ yeah we're going to be going to another break right now if you'd like to join us on the air with a question of your own send an email to chris arnzen at gmail .com

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c -h -r -i -s -a -r -n -z -e -n at gmail .com please include at least the city and state where you live in the country where you live if you live outside the usa and if you are not writing about something personal and private please give us at least your first name but you may remain anonymous if it is a private matter you're asking about and we do have a few more copies of the book to give away so if you live in the united states and you have a question give us your full mailing address we're going to be right back after these messages so don't go away we have a an hour left to talk about the war against worry a 31 day strategy with our guest simon robinson i'm james white of alpha omega ministries the new american standard bible is perfect for daily reading or in -depth study used by pastors scholars and everyday readers the nasb is widely embraced and trusted as a literal and readable bible translation the nasb offers clarity and readability while maintaining high accuracy to the original languages which the nasb is known for the nasb is available in many editions like a topical reference bible researched and prepared by biblical scholars devoted to accuracy the new topical reference bible includes contemporary topics relevant to today's issues from compact to giant print bibles find an nasb that fits your needs very affordably at nasbible .com

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from the uk and he is going to be in new york uh this thursday saturday and sunday first he's going to be at the neighborhood church of greenwich village in new york city on 269 bleaker street those services are from 7 30 to 9 p .m

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i'm assuming simon is at p .m uh the the about 7 30 p .m

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that's right yeah 7 30 to 9 p .m and the phone number for more details is 212 -691 -1770 212 -691 -1770 and the website is ncgvnyc .com

01:04:49

and that's that's going to be a really good event so it'd be great if you're in this area it'd be great to see you there yeah there's going to be a talk and there'll be opportunities for questions and copies will be available of simon's book for a book signing and once again the website uh the acronym for neighborhood church of greenwich village ncg neighborhood church of greenwich v for village nyc new york city .com

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ncgvnyc .com and then on reformation day which is october 31st also more popularly known unfortunately as halloween that's this saturday uh simon will be speaking at new high park baptist church on 635 new high park road in new high park long island new york which is on the border of nassau county in queens new york and he is also going to be speaking on sunday november 1st on maximizing your time alone with god at the new high park baptist church at 9 15 a .m

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for their sunday school and the worship services are at 10 30 a .m

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and 6 p .m uh in fact on the saturday event uh they're going to have a barbecue so uh make sure that you try to attend that as well as it's 5 p .m

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and the service begins at 6 p .m on saturday which is uh reformation day as i said october 31st for more details go to the new high park baptist church website nhp for new high park bc for baptist church .com

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nhpbc .com their phone number is 516 -352 -9672 516 -352 -9672 and i would also like to quickly give simon's own website just in case the time runs out and i forget it's simon j robinson .org

01:06:54

simon j robinson .org yeah not on the site there's a link to uh cheaper in dozens which is where you can get the book in the united states if you're not if you're not lucky enough to get the free copy uh you can order them from there and that's that's the best it's a great site cheaper in i'd really recommend it to you now this is a kind of an interesting phrase that you've come up with for a british author kosher cares now maybe you've been visiting new york too often for you to come up with that title yeah well obviously you must people must realize kosher you know we we we use that term quite a lot in the uk actually really it's okay yeah that's kosher i think probably because we use that quite a lot kind of tongue -in -cheek way to say yeah that's okay it's a kosher thing to do um and there are some things you know that that we we actually do need to care about in the right way as i said earlier on you know worry is when things go round and round and round and round in our mind and we don't come to any solution we just come up with more and more problems and that kind of healthy fear is when we're alerted to a danger or something we need to do we act on it and then we just then we carry on and there are some things that you know we we need to be concerned about it we need to be concerned about our families we need to be concerned to keep our finances in order we need to be concerned for our health you know to watch out for things that we need to go to the doctor about so there we should worrying uh is one thing but to not worry doesn't mean that we don't care about things now and that was a balance i was really eager to to get into the mix there when i when i wrote the book and uh the uh stop the rot now that's more of a british phrase if you could explain that yeah well it's when one our thinking really sort of goes in the wrong direction and you know we're thinking of things and outside of the bible we're thinking in negative unhelpful ways and it's really addressing you know where is this thought pattern coming from and challenging those kind of thoughts with the bible you know so if we say oh well you know what's going to happen to me and my life's in ruins well that that can't be true because you know the bible says that god works all things together for the good of those who love him that the bible says that the lord is our shepherd it's challenging our thoughts with these things that that stop the rot that these thoughts bring in and the way that they turn us away from the lord and make us ineffective for the kingdom of god and let me repeat our email address is chris arnzen at gmail .com

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chris arnzen at gmail .com and we do have a listener from mechanicsburg pennsylvania harrison who says you were speaking before about medication and that it being appropriate for a christian is there a danger do you think of getting a loved one who has lost medication for their worry when the worry may be the very thing they need to drive them to their knees and to repentance and faith in christ well that's a very interesting question i mean what one proviso i need to put on all this is i'm not a doctor um and so you know i don't know much about medication but i think it's a very real concern there because we don't want to be insulated like in a bubble from the cares of life you know we don't we don't want medication to have that kind of effect and as i said you know it's it's a i think it from my perspective it was a short -term thing to address some physical problems that were associated with the stress i was under at the time um obviously that the loved one you know is that they are responsible for themselves when they they will be talking to their doctor so we would not necessarily be involved in in that conversation but i think it's important to say to actually bring that to them and say well look you know medication isn't going to be your final answer you know you really do need to come to the lord and seek his face about these things and continually you know bring that to people's attention obviously in a gentle compassionate and caring way not not one that actually sort of makes them more determined to go the other direction you have a chapter in your book titled little faith if you could explain further yeah well i i said usually i come from a place called south end on c which um which if you haven't visited i recommend it they do that they used to i don't they still do because the company could pull out but they used to do the best ice creams in the world company called ross's ice cream that uh but it's uh it's an interesting place south end um it's the driest place in england um it's got the most sunshine in england the world the english record for that but it's also got the longest pier in the world and the pier goes out about a mile and a quarter but it goes out so far but it doesn't go to the other side and that often makes me think about jesus's expression when he says you know don't you think that god will care about you if he cares for the birds if he cares uh for for the flowers won't he care for you oh you of little faith and i love the way that spurgeon expounded this and he said little faith trust god for eternal things but can't trust him for the needs of the day that you know we don't actually put our faith into practice in in everyday needs if we trust it quite with eternity well surely we need to trust him with the needs of today and so you know we need to see these opportunities for our faith to grow yeah i i think that sometimes we all uh are going through things that bother us very much but may seem comparatively to the outside world as trivial matters and we think we think that god doesn't care about the comparatively minor things in our lives uh but that's not true is it absolutely i mean it's not true at all no because you know god god we're told he knows that the number of hairs on my head i'm just sitting opposite looking at my friend doug and he had a big count on that one sorry sorry dad yeah um but you know god knows all about us and he cares for us as individuals and that that is a mark of god's sovereignty and god's greatness that you know the god he holds the university's hand cares for individuals like you and me i'm not close my mind when i think about that and look at god's word what do you mean by your chapter worry exposed well i think we need to see worry for for what it is i mean jesus talked about worry is that it's a tiring you know that um that worry can rule us because you know we're thinking about tomorrow we're thinking about our needs and and all our minds on that worry can actually rule our life um uh you know i've known people who've worked for years and years and they've lost so much and it's it's changed it's kind of affected how how they can they can be for god and his kingdom it sort of takes away our effectiveness of his kingdom and we need to see if what it is we need to see worry as as an enemy not just something that that's a weakness but something we need to continually war against us really is something of the flesh we do have another anonymous listener from new york uh a anonymous listener writes i have been plagued with worry over the faithfulness of my spouse and that is not because my spouse is giving any real indication of being unfaithful it's more because of my spouse's past in regard to sexuality prior to our marriage and prior to my spouse's coming to christ do you have any suggestions i fear even sharing with my spouse the frequency of my worry because i do not want to drive my spouse away uh viewing me as a chronically jealous spouse i need help about this that's a very brave question first i'd like to say to a listener to you that in new york i do love your city by the way i think it's a great place really love being in um well that that that is that's a very interesting question and i think the person is absolutely right to say uh they don't want to bring it too much to their spouse you know to to drive them away because actually these things can be kind of counterproductive and it is cultivating trust i mean this is coming into kind of an area of of sort of uh that someone who specializes in marriage might have been married for 33 years so i should have some knowledge of it um i don't know how long the person has been married but i think it is it's cultivating that trust i think you know the more you give trust to someone um the the more they respect that trust and um and then really i guess releasing releasing that to the lord and to say well lord you know i'm not in control of this person you know they're walking with you they've put their past behind and i and i trust you lord to work in their life and keep them to go on with you and i think that probably the best the best way of dealing with it is to encourage them in their walk with the lord and also you know to to grow in your relationship together you know to spend time with them to uh to grow in that love to deepen that love quality time you know date night sharing things sharing in god's word together praying together these things i think will will help it to a row but it's obviously a it's clearly a thought pattern uh that many people have struggled with and it's understandable but i think you know take it step by step and maybe it'll be good in confidence you know to talk to your pastor or to talk to a christian that you would really trust someone of the same sex of course that you could really trust with this and could help to pray you through don't carry it on your own you know we we're there to bear one another's burdens but i do think i think you're right in saying you don't want to bring it to your spouse i think you've you've hit the nail on the head there because that that could really hurt them because they could say well you know why don't you trust me yeah and sometimes don't you think that uh it may come from one's own self -righteousness they forget that they were delivered from a sin and a past life and they seem to be doubting the transforming power in someone else the transforming power of god in the life of someone else i mean especially when this person didn't according to the the statement the person isn't even giving any indication of unfaithfulness yeah that's a very good point chris and and i think that's another way you can tackle it so well look at what god's done in my life you know and god's at work in mine and i'm as much a sinner um it may be sinned in different ways but but i'm as much a sinner um and i and i suppose it's it's also it there's a danger also that we can become self -indulgent in these times and think well you know how do they me and what will they be doing you know how do they react to me when actually you know the law causes to lay down our lives and also to lay down our life forever for our spouse as well and to show that selfless love to them you know we live in a very dangerous age especially for children and do you have any advice for parents who are plagued with worry uh so much so that they they seem to be smothering their own children they they uh have too far strict restrictions on their lives on where they play and where they venture on their bicycles or if they're older uh maybe their curfews for their teenage children are abnormally early or whatever the case may be isn't there a time when the worry over the safety of your children which may have a good motive especially the obvious one which is love and concern for your children's safety but can't that be also counterproductive because very often don't smothered children rebel i think that's a very good point um it's getting that balance i mean we we we naturally care for our children we're naturally protective um but there's got to be that sense of letting go the root of one of the roots of worry as i've often said is is to try to be in control you know to try and control the environment our children are in to try and control things that that might affect their safety and at the end of the day you know god's the one who's in control and to to you know obey the bible and be be good parents to watch over our children but also to give them some trust but you know to have clear boundaries and also have lines of communication to say well look you know can you text me just text me to say you're okay just just you know give me a bit of latitude and do that just little things uh that might help to put your mind at rest but actually give also give them a sense that they're being trusted because at the end at the end of the day you know there's that day when your last child your youngest child walks out the door and and leaves home and that is a that is a sad day when the nest is empty but that's but every every day really is a step towards that and we have to gradually let go i know uh a number of people several at least that uh are uh fairly often overcome by panic attacks and one of your chapters is pre -empting panic if you could tell us about pre -empting panic yeah i think i think we're going into the fight or flight mode then i mean as i keep saying i'm i'm not a doctor i'm not even speaking as a lay person i'm from experience but sometimes you know the whole system goes into overdrive when it's alerting us to danger and it's it's really just getting still there's a lot in the

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Bible that being still before the Lord and one practical thing and i didn't want people to misunderstand me to think i was getting into some kind of mysticism but but actually just you know physical thing taking a deep breath just to slow yourself down and say hang on i'm just going to stop and i'm just going to wait on the

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Lord and Martin Lloyd -Jones used to call it addressing yourself uh in in the

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Lord and in fact it's some really good chapters in his book spiritual depression about that just just reminding yourself of what the

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Bible said and and stilling that sense of panic because panic just has us running around in circles when the

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Bible says be still and wait on God and that can be one of the hardest things i think of Psalm 40 and it says in it says i waited patiently for the

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Lord and literally David's saying that in waiting i waited for the Lord there's a double emphasis in the original language that that shows how he was you know determined not to run around in panic but to wait on the

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Lord and and it's it's not an easy thing to do when a whole system you know wants to flood us with adrenaline to deal with the danger because we you know we're fallen human beings

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God has created us you know so we're alert to danger but of course that's all affected by the fall and it has a tendency to go into overdrive you have a chapter titled the pursuit of peace explain that one further for us yeah well i took that from Philippians chapter four and that's always been a you know really blessed chapter for me a blessed passage for me uh how we can we we seek the peace of God through prayer and supplication with thanksgiving and he talks about the peace of God which guards our hearts and minds in Christ Jesus but i i love the way that it's step by step you know prayer and i think the prayer is more kind of general you know so worship thanksgiving you know remembering what

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God has done then bringing our petition to God and i know it's not it's not a formula so much but it's that process of actually to gradually come in working these things through before God and expecting him to give us that peace that only he can give you know the peace the path is all understanding and you uh excuse me you have uh a uh you have a title of a chapter which is watch out there's a lion about um which is the excuse i believe in the bible that those who are lazy uh when they want to stay in bed uh yeah well i was thinking more actually of peter uh where peter says that that the devil prowls around like a line thinking who he may devour and it's interesting actually that that i've been been in that chapter in chapter five um quite a bit the last few days but it's interesting in that chapter uh it's it's in the context of of him saying you know don't be anxious about anything but but cast your care upon the lord and he will sustain you um and in the very next verse you know we we're told to beware the devil's prowling about like a like a lion seeking to devour and i think there is that sense in which satan can play on our weaknesses now i know we've got to be careful not to blame everything on this on say you know people say the devil made me do it the devil's behind it and i'm not saying that but what i am saying is beware because the devil can use that propensity we have to worry to actually draw us away from god and seek to find satisfaction in things that aren't of god you know maybe self -indulgence overindulgence in eating or maybe even worse things you're looking at the wrong things or drinking or or drugs anything that takes us away from god and some very very serious and things that can damage lives and let me repeat our email address again it's chris arnson at gmail .com

01:25:29

chris arnson at gmail .com um going back to uh the mistake that i just made thinking that you were speaking about speaking about another verse in proverbs uh proverbs 22 i believe where the sluggard says there's a lion outside yeah i'll be killed in the streets and isn't that an example of how worry uh can have uh serious counterproductive uh you know impacts on people's lives and turn them into hermits and things like that exactly yeah it really does in inhibit us and stop us from doing things for god you know fear you know fear will hold us back you know hold us back from telling someone about christ because we're fearing about rejection some people as you say even even scared of going out of the door i had an auntie i mean she she wasn't a believer but i remember she wouldn't go out of her door on on friday the 13th in case it was bad luck but if you think of it rationally i mean the ceiling could have fallen in for it wasn't really rational but but fear could do that it can it can control our lives it definitely can and uh we're going to be going to a break right now this is actually our last break so if you have a question please send it now we have about a half hour left and our email address is chris arnzen at gmail .com

01:26:59

chris arnzen at gmail .com and we do have a few books left to give away and we look forward to hearing from you and your questions for simon robinson after these messages don't go away linbrook baptist church on 225 earl avenue in linbrook long island is teaching god's timeless truths in the 21st century our church is far more than a sunday worship service it's a place of learning where the scriptures are studied and the preaching of the gospel is clear and relevant it's like a gym where one can exercise their faith through community involvement it's like a hospital for wounded souls where one can find compassionate people and healing we're a diverse family of all ages enthusiastically serving our lord jesus christ in fellowship play and together hi i'm pastor paul balderman and i invite you to come and join us here linbrook baptist church and see all that a church can be call linbrook baptist at 516 -599 -9402 that's 516 -599 -9402 or visit linbrookbaptist .org

01:27:55

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01:29:26

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that's solid -ground -books .com and see what priceless literary gems from the past or present you can unearth from solid ground solid ground christian books is honored to be a weekly sponsor of iron sharpens iron radio thrive in financial is not your typical financial services provider as a membership organization we help christians be wise with money and live generously every day and for the fourth year in a row we were named one of the world's most ethical companies by the ethosphere institute a leading international think tank dedicated to the creation advancement and sharing of best practices in business ethics contact me mike gallagher financial consultant at 717 -254 -6433 again 717 -254 -6433 to learn more about the thriving difference lending faith finances and generosity that's the thriving story survive we were made to thrive welcome back this is chris arnzen if you've just tuned to sin our guest today for the last 90 minutes has been simon robinson and we are discussing his book the war against worry a strategy and we also want you to know that there are two events coming up on long island and in new york city that we hope that you can attend that simon is involved in first he's going to be in new york city this thursday day after tomorrow october 29th 7 30 to 9 p .m

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at neighborhood church of greenwich village on 269 bleaker street in new york city and for more information go to their website which is ncg vnyc which stands for neighborhood church of greenwich village ncg nyc .com

01:32:32

ncgvnyc .com their phone number is 212 -691 -1770 212 -691 -1770 and also on reformation day which is this saturday october 31st and on sunday november 1st our guests will be at the new height park baptist church on 635 new height park road new height park long island new york and the saturday event includes a barbecue at 5 p .m

01:33:03

so why not call them for more details at 516 -352 -9672 516 -352 -9672 or visit the new height park baptist church website which is nhpbc .com

01:33:18

nhp for new height park bc for baptist church .com nhpbc .com

01:33:25

and we do have another listener simon we have arnie in perry county pennsylvania who wants to know should a christian ever fear satan and the demons at all good question yeah arnie is it yeah um well i i think what we've got to do first of all is we've got to see it in the perspective that christ is triumphant you know that he's made a public display of satan on the cross as we're told in colossians and that he rules um i think it goes back to that issue of you know where is there a a healthy fear we're told that satan is like a a roaring lion seeking who may devour and we need to have a healthy fear about his tactics that should drive us to the lord but never never think uh that he has any power other than that which god has allowed you to remember he can't even put boils on on a man of god without god's permission if we look in the book of joe right so i think that's that's really important because i've heard sometimes people say um say ascribe power to satan that's not there years ago someone talked about um a leading christian who died and and another christian leader said well satan murdered them and that was a very worrying thing to say because it's ascribing to satan something that he doesn't have you know only god has the power to give and take life so we've got to get that balance and again it goes back to having good theology there uh and and thinking about that systematic theology and and how how the doctrine of christ prevails over this and on an earthly level though uh satan and his minions are involved in the murder of individuals aren't they like for instance with judas when he was involved in the plot to uh execute jesus even though this was a ordained act of god and jesus willingly laid down his life there were earthly elements involved that the lord used to bring that to fruition and it says that uh a demon entered judas yeah that's going off my expertise there but that's a very interesting point there but in the end you know if if if that what when that happened nothing that happened can be can happen without god sovereignly allowing that and ordaining that and of course god is not the author of evil but you know he he allows satan to do those things and overrules it for his own purpose and i think with all these things you've always got to have that that overarching belief in the sovereignty of god and uh you know he allows things he ever rules them there's his decretive will his permissive will um and we trust him in that but but i think we do need that healthy fear of being you know pulled away by satan and that kind of healthy fear should drive us closer to the lord to say well lord the best way to deal with that is is to be close to you uh yeah in fact the uh the the biblical account in luke's is that satan into judas uh do you believe that a christian a born -again believer in christ who is the temple of the holy spirit can ever be demon possessed no no i i don't like it not at all i know there was some teaching that came about i think he came to england about 20 years ago a guy was coming over in coughing out demons out of christians by i can't see that and if we've got the spirit of god within us you would obviously you know we we can we can quench the spirit we can we can sin but the the holy spirit within us wouldn't dwell alongside a demonic force yeah that's that's a theology that unfortunately is still very alive and well here in the states the deliverance went in england but i'm glad it went yeah very often the churches would be called deliverance ministries or something uh and as far as uh having a healthy fear about the demonic realm uh i i would assume you would agree that that healthy fear would prevent a christian from even dabbling in things that are involved with the occult even if they think it's just for fun or something like ouija boards and all that kind of thing yeah yeah i mean all of these things we we need to keep clear of because there can be you know there can be oppression i know that martin lloyd jones taught on this and again i think you'll find ian murray has written something about martin lloyd jones on on demon oppression um but it which which is well worth reading again that's my remit but i'd recommend that but i think yeah we've got to be very careful to steer clear of these things as it says in corinthians what partnership has darkness with light and just to keep in the light and i think aw pink was even involved in the occult before he became a christian all right well i didn't realize that i believe i read that in his biography by ian murray well that's interesting i actually i mean my personal experience before i was a christian we dabbled with ouija boards we were only we were only teenagers at the time and ignorant of those things but i there was a lot of of bad things surrounding that and um you know in the end it was you know i came to the lord and renounced those things my friend continued in those things i had a lot of very dark experiences through it and i think we need to steer clear they're not toys they're very dangerous we don't know what we open ourselves up to and uh you say in your book uh that uh we have to check out trust what do you mean exactly by that well check out who we're trusting because at the root of it uh you know worrying is is is that we we want to be in control of our lives part of the issue i think is you know it's the issue of you know who's who's lord of our life you know is it the lord is it jesus and we submit our life to him or do we want to run it ourselves and and we need to check out you know are we trusting in the lord are we trusting him for the needs of the day and it's all we want to say these things but it's actually when we we tested on these things well it's very interesting when i was on the on the way actually to to the america i've been here some weeks now i'm in my fifth week in the united states now and you know loved being here but on on the way um we we got caught in bad traffic on the way to the airport um and i started thinking oh dear we're going to make this plane and i thought one of the reasons you're going here is to promote a book about worry i myself think well you know if the lord wants me there he'll have me but i had to kind of check out my trust what am i trusting in my trust in the you know whether this driving gets there or whether you know one way or another the lord will get us to where he wants us to and uh of course you know even though jesus tells us to be anxious for nothing uh that doesn't mean we are to be careless especially when it involves other individuals and appointments we're supposed to be making we're not supposed to just shrug our shoulders and say ah who cares about being there on time you know i'm just trusting in god and and so forth i mean that can people can use their spirituality in a flippant way and as an excuse for just being careless yeah and i mean there's so much teaching in the bible about being you know being honest and reliable and good examples and good citizens and and caring for our families and it's important to to put those into practice and also in the bible is teaching about work you know that we're to work well uh we're we're to work as unto the lord and if we do as unto the lord then we'll keep our appointments and we won't be flippant about such things i know you brought it up a bit when you were speaking about job and the fact that the devil could not do anything to job without god's permission but uh explain a little bit in more detail what your chapter is titled who is in control yeah well that actually but that's more about um the issue of worry that it's us trying to control our lives and and um when you know when we're looking over every possible eventuality what we're going to do is try to control our environment around us and actually it's saying well you know my my life actually is submitted to you lord and so you know the future you know sufficiently today i'm going to face the challenges you give me today but but leave the future to you and you're in complete control and that's that's not an easy thing you know because we have this sinful human tendency to want to keep seasoning it back from god and and we have to put romans 12 into practice and be living sacrifices probably living sacrifices is they have this tendency to crawl off the altar so we have to get back on again and uh what do you mean by the fear factor uh well i mean fear uh fear is is related to worry and i wanted people just to to really see how damaging fear is um and to to be on the look of it and fear is you know we have those kind of big things that that seem to control us uh and seem to sort of dominate our thinking and and actually how we need to to deal with those things um and and submit our lives the lord and and and actually challenge those fears with facts because the trouble is um our our mind can go into overdrive you know we can start imagining all sorts of things and so we need to actually sort of challenge those things by the word of god and when i talk about deuteronomy 31 and how the people of israel go into the promised land and the lord gives them that promise so the lord goes with you he will never leave you or forsake you and that's something we need to use to address our fear you know the promises of the lord jesus promised the holy spirit will be the comforter and so one of the things i do often when i'm fearing is i actually sort of think well what is it i'm fearing i try and pin it down and i actually sort of bullet point the things and then you know i'll write verses in the bible that would address that you know am i fearing that that i'll be homeless well you know the lord's promised to provide for me and am i fearing um uh for this or that and i'll i think well you know what's the bible first addresses that so i challenge those fears with with the word of god and the promises of god yes and uh the bottom line is that we should be constantly reminded by the words of christ that our worry is not going to benefit us at all is it absolutely well my wife i mean i i say she we got this expression in england say she's a she's a wise old bird but she doesn't like me calling her old now you better be worried but she's a very wise lady and she said to me why did you know if you can prove to me that worry achieves anything that i might just give it a try well i've never been able to prove it to her so she hasn't given it a try but it is completely counterproductive because all it does actually is actually make us um make us less equipped to deal with the challenges that we face because here we spend all our time thinking about these things yeah and uh we're robbing ourselves of the joy that we could be experiencing to the fullest as christians in our walk with christ yeah now this is a interesting title unearthing our uniqueness explain that a little bit further well again one of the things i've been trying to do is to stand back and look at it from the perspective of god's eternal plan and to be god -centered and to see actually that that we're unique to god and that he cares for us i want people to reflect on god's love in psalm 139 is so precious about this you know it says before i was in the law before i was in the womb you knew me um and you you know everything about me how precious are your thoughts oh god and to get people to think about their uniqueness because we can just see ourselves as part of massive humanity but as you reminded us early on when we think of those you know great truths like particular redemption uh we realize how precious we are to the lord and that's a wonderful humbling thing uh our listener in nassau county long island lamb lamb writes back and says the book intends to be a 31 day process can one read it in one sitting and have it still be of help uh yeah definitely i mean there's there's many ways you can use it i mean it's designed so that you can you can pace it over 31 days you could do both you could read it all in one sitting and then you could do it over again in 31 days but it's whatever way is the most helpful for you but i think though to spend a day dwelling on those things to spend each day dwelling on those those those truths because there's always a verse at the beginning and there's um you know an exposition a reflection on the verse a prayer and then some practical things and it is worth going over the 31 days to do that but you still can sit and do it in one sitting as well so i if you want to do it in one that's fine but i'd still commend doing the 31 days as well tell us about your uh chapter that has a very famous title i think therefore i am yeah well that goes back to verse in proverb you know what a man thinks so he is and um it is so important to bring our thinking into line with the word of god i had a driving instructor and he used to say to me where you look is where you are which was a bit of a shame because i was looking at a tree at the time and he had to grab the steering wheel from me you know where you look is where you'll be in the next second and you know where where you'll see where you'll think is where you'll be and so it's it's vital uh that our thinking is framed by the word of god romans 12 talks about the renewing of our minds and that's that's really what i'm trying to do in this book help people to go through that process and uh what does tomorrow's world have to say in helping us in this yeah well tomorrow i don't know if you ever had the the program over here but there was a program called tomorrow's world that was very popular in the united kingdom and they look at different inventions that there may be some of them came to be and some of them didn't but but it's that that way that we always think about tomorrow and then it's tomorrow tomorrow my father i used to say to him he used to say tidy room and i'd say tomorrow dad tomorrow manana manana which is tomorrow in spanish manana is good enough for me and the trouble with worry is is we're always thinking about tomorrow and then the next tomorrow and then the next tomorrow and so actually a whole world is dominated by that and when jesus says sufficient is today and actually that's the one the core area the one key area i think is getting to grips with that sufficient is today and knowing the challenges and the joys that the lord gives us today the lord will bring us through the challenges the lord to give us the joys and leaving tomorrow in his hands uh isn't it true that uh that sometimes there can be a displaced a worry and fear uh the shouted from the pulpits of some churches who have an overly pessimistic eschatology and and really uh have unbound have an unbalanced approach to placing fears even in the hearts of christian and worry about the things that will take place on this earth i'm really glad you brought that up because actually that that was something as a young christian that gave me huge problems um back in 19 1980 uh just about the new year's eve uh russia had invaded afghanistan and i had a friend i was very young christian i had a friend who was a preacher and uh he had a overtly pessimistic view about the future um and he said well god's told me there's going to be a war and this is it and he spent all evening talking about that and actually i i was crippled by fear for for months and months by that and i think we we need to remember in the end you know we win we've read the last chapter of revelation yeah there will be difficult times but through all this we know that we're on the victory side and and that you know jesus will be triumphant so it's getting that balance i mean the other side of the coin is you you get this you know overtly optimistic view in that everything's going to be wonderful and go from better to better and of course we know that's not the case but we need to get that biblical balance yeah there's going to be good things there's going to be bad things but in the end we know jesus triumphs because he's already triumphed through the cross and the resurrection uh what do you mean by early morning anxiety well that's that's an interesting interesting question um i had i've been through and if you read the book you'll see the backstory but i went through a very very difficult time in fact i was in the middle of that time when i was in new york a couple of years ago um and i would wake up every morning feeling very anxious and it's actually something that's that's carried over i still wake up in the mornings with a with a feeling of anxiety and i i can't explain it you know i there's probably some kind of medical reason for it but a lot of people have said and the morning is the difficult time and and there's these these kind of feelings of anxiety because you wake up you know you you wake up with a jolt maybe from an alarm clock you're getting ready for today and your mind starts to think about some of the things you're concerned about in the day and your system reacts you know by flooding you with adrenaline and i i've found that i need to just bring my mind you know to the to the promises of god you know like um uh promises that great is your faithfulness new every morning i bring those verses to mind and and i think well i'm not going to add a narrative to those feelings but i'm just going to get up um trust the lord not depend on my feelings and depend on him but i i've been quite honest in that chapter about about the struggles that i've had with that i mean it doesn't happen every day but still every so often you know i find that especially when i'm about to get on the plane to go to america yeah i i'm not fond of flying either i do a lot of worrying in planes when i'm in them yeah the worst thing i find is the security actually i hate going through security nowadays uh the path to peace what is it well it's really following those those principles that we see in philippians and what the wonderful thing about the bible is it it's it's not rocket science it's so simple it's so accessible and paul gives us those principles you know be anxious about nothing but in everything by prayer supplication with thanksgiving let your request be made known to god and prayer is that general word you know which would come to god with that sense of awe you know supplications is you know we we're looking to him and seeking his face thanksgiving remembering the good things he's done and thanking him for it and then bringing our request to him in that context and we're promised peace and i think i said earlier these things they're not like a formula to follow but they're principles principles that help us to fix our minds on the lord and he gives us his peace because he he loves to do that he loves to give us peace because we're precious children and submit to god uh tell us about that chapter yeah well that chapter actually really gives the backstory of the kind of very difficult situation that we came out of in in my last church but last time we were here about two years ago there was a rebellion going on in the church and um a group were kind of determined to get me out and i you know dug my heels in and i thought no you know i must i must stay i must be in that and in the end my health deteriorated so much the doctor actually signed me off sick and i came to that verse in esther you know where esther um was going to go to uh to the emperor and she said well if if i die i die and it was submitted to god's will i thought well lord if actually you know you want me to to lay this aside and do something else then i submit to your will and that really gave me a sense of peace sometimes worrying i think is rooted in us actually sort of resisting something that is going to happen and we submit to god and say well i can't understand what is happening lord but i submit to you i'm going to follow you and trust you in that situation and accept what's going on not an easy thing to do you know there are times when i still struggle with it but i just keep coming back to those verses in esther sense of submitting to the lord yeah one of the one of the joys that i personally have received from my belief in the sovereignty of god over all things is the very fact that he is in control over all things and that everything that happens has a purpose in his mind and plan and i can't even understand how those who reject god's sovereign control over all things cannot be devoured by worry i mean even if there's a stray molecule that is not under his control i mean it's that i think is also a sign of his common grace that even with people who have horrible theology in spite of what they believe on paper to be true god gives them a a certain peace that he is in control behind the scenes yes yeah yeah i mean if i didn't have the the teaching from the bible at the sovereignty of god i think i think i'd go crazy i was actually i'm very privileged i was in florida um before i came here and at great emmanuel bible church pastor jerry rag is the pastor and they run a seminary there and dr i think his name is dr zemit uh was teaching i went into some of his classes on on theology about the sovereignty of god and it was things i've obviously read and studied before but it was just so refreshing to listen to them again and be reminded again and it was it was it was a theology section but i found you know it was of great spiritual value to me as well well i want you to just basically unburden your heart and leave our listeners with what you most want etched in their hearts and minds before they leave the program today simon well i would say i mean the key thing is you know the lord jesus christ to put his teachings into practice you need to be a child of god through jesus and you know there might be a listener here who's saying well these things are really good but what do i do and i i would say you know turn to christ and trust in him and and his his lordship is surrendering our whole lives to him and living for his kingdom and the key the key there is you know seek first the kingdom of god um and sufficient is today i think those those those two those two truths that jesus taught there i think they're right at the heart at the war against worry well i uh hope that you uh say uh hello to pastor kirk van der swag over at neighborhood church of greenwich village for me i will do oh can i also sorry to attract you there can i just say well i just like to thank actually while we're on here for jim holmes of great writing .org

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who's really helped me with this and being such a great person to work with and uh you know i just would commend the service that he gives to authors check it out on his website great writing .org

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great writing .org i also want to give the websites for neighborhood church of greenwich village again h i'm sorry ncgvnyc .com

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ncgvnyc .com that's for the neighborhood church of greenwich village where our guest is speaking this thursday and then also new hide park baptist church where our guest is speaking saturday and sunday that website is nhpbc .com