WWUTT 780 Q&A Hymns vs Pop Praise, Homeschooling, and Marians?

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Responding to questions from listeners about singing hymns or pop praise songs, what a typical homeschool day looks like, and who are the Marians of the Immaculate Conception. Visit wwutt.com for all our videos!

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How can we talk to our church about going in a direction of hymns rather than the pop praise songs?
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What does our typical homeschool day look like? And who are the Marians of the Immaculate Conception?
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The answers to these questions, When We Understand the Text. This is
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When We Understand the Text, a daily Bible podcast that we may grow together in Christ through the teaching of his word.
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Tell your friends about our ministry by visiting www .utt .com. Here once again is
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Pastor Gabe. Thank you, Becky. You're welcome. So I happen to catch from Josh Bice on Twitter that the
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G3 rates are about to go up. Oh, yeah. So I think it's next week, sometime next week, it'll cost you a little.
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Oh, really? Right. It'll cost you a little bit more than if you get registered this week.
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So go to g3conference .com. That's the letter G, the number three conference .com
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to register. It's in Atlanta. It's in January. The theme is missions.
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The speakers are fantastic. Yes. And we hope to see you there. We are wanting to put a booth together for G3 and the conference has given us booth space, but that costs a little bit more than just your regular admission into the conference.
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So we've been asking listeners if you could help us put a booth together and get us to G3 by going to our website, www .utt
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.com. Click on the Give tab, follow the instructions. All of the money that you give goes to our church.
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Right. So we have our church that's managing that money. It's not me and Becky. Right.
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Like, yay, thanks for sending us money. Although we do appreciate that you sent us money. We do, very much appreciate it.
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So whatever you give is going to be tax deductible since it's going to a nonprofit organization and the church will help us arrange what it is that we need to get down to G3.
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If there's any leftover, it will go toward future conferences. Right. And I've already had a few people contacting me by email going, is there any chance you're going to be at such and such a conference?
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Right, I'm sure. I'd like to see you there. That would be nice. If we get the chance to be able to do that,
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I'm sure there are some other conferences. I would like to try out our booth at the
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State Southern Baptist Convention that we've got coming up in October.
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Oh, right. So I'd like to have a booth put together by then, yeah. And that way I can raise awareness about when we understand the text, even within our own association, the
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Kansas -Nebraska Convention. So that would be like a dry run. Right. Sort of a thing. And we wouldn't take money that we're currently raising for that.
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The church would pay my way to go down there. But so any conferences we got coming up in the future, we have a chance to either meet listeners and viewers or get the word out about what and.
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About what? About what? So that's what that money will help us do.
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www .tt .com, click on Give. And since this is Friday, we take questions from listeners.
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Yes, we do. You can send your questions to whenweunderstandthetext at gmail .com.
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And today I've got three questions. I think we're staying stateside this week. I don't think we go abroad with any of these questions this week.
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That's all right, it's a pretty country. It's right, from sea to shining sea. Yes. As America the
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Beautiful goes. So this first one is from California. This is Christian in Simi Valley.
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He says, good afternoon, Pastor Gabe and Becky. Well, for us, as we're recording this, it's at night. Right, but thank you.
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But yes, good afternoon to you if you happen to be listening to this in the afternoon. Thank you for your ministry and all that you produce.
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You have been very helpful in teaching me and my family sound doctrine and correcting our faulty beliefs.
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Hey, I needed help in that. Yeah, me too. At a point in my life as well. Whenever I get the chance,
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I try and refer you to family and friends as I believe your teaching is very clear and biblical.
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Thank you. My question for you and Becky is about addressing worship at my church. I attend a good size church in Southern California.
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That's not surprising. We have a worship pastor and many people who serve on the worship team and I'm good friends with several of them.
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My concern is about the songs we sing. We sing many songs from Bethel, Hillsong, Elevation and Jesus Culture, the heretical quartet.
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Aw, that's funny. Technically, it would be a trio because Bethel and Jesus Culture really are the same thing.
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Are they really? Yep, it's same church, same organization. I've talked with a few of my friends about it and they just dismiss it and say, those are the only producers that people actually like or listen to.
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Whenever our church sings a classic hymn, the congregation gets louder and the praise is elevated far above what the normal pop songs get.
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I was wondering how I should maybe go about addressing the worship pastor or other people about it. I don't wanna cause division or stir up strife.
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I'm just concerned for where our church is heading and that people will be misled and see the use of those songs as endorsements of the teachings from those churches.
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Thank you for all that you do and I'm grateful for you both. Well, I wanna answer your question directly on how you can talk to people at your church about this and that would be simply with gentleness and respect.
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Right, most definitely. You need to pray and ask for wisdom. If you are able to, talk to some people at some other churches that are maybe a little bit more grounded and reformed in their teaching and their soteriology, maybe you can even find a church that has gone through this before.
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Right. Just search blogs. Search online to find some blogs where people have written about, our church used to be like this, but we realized the music needed changed and we've now gone in this direction.
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Right. And contact the writer and see if you can set something up either in exchange by email or you can talk by phone.
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Well, you guys went through this. What kinds of things did you have to confront? What did you approach? How did you go about those conversations to see this kind of transition and this change happen in your church?
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Right. And they could really help you with wisdom in how to raise this issue.
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We kind of had that issue in our church, not really because I was the worship leader.
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Right. So. You kind of had control over that. Yeah, I did. I mean, almost full control over that.
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And so where my convictions went, that's where the music went. So there never really was a.
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Confrontation. Yeah, not related to the music at all. At the most,
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I would hear from someone on occasion, can we play something a little bit more upbeat that we can clap our hands to?
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You know, that's about the most. Yeah. Kind of objection that I would hear. And it was usually from somebody who had a little bit more charismatic background.
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They just wanted something a little bit more uptempo. Not all the songs had to be low and mellow and dry.
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Right. And I get that. We can sing, I'll Fly Away. Yeah, I love that song.
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Or an upbeat version of Nothing But The Blood, which is usually the way that I do that song. But we sing almost exclusively from the hymnal.
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And that really isn't because that's our conviction. It kind of happened by necessity.
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I got sick and tired of having to reset that projector. Oh yes. Every other Sunday. It was a bit ridiculous.
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It was obnoxious. The technology failures drive me crazy when the tech doesn't work.
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And so sometimes, you know, the old saying of keep it simple, stupid, really is like the best way to go.
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Especially when it comes to a church service. You don't have to make this so complicated.
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Keep it to where all of the congregation together can lift up their voices in praise to God.
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Because that really is what the music in a church service is supposed to be for.
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Right. It's all of us singing together, songs and hymns and spiritual songs, making melody in our hearts to God.
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This is what we read in Colossians chapter three, verse 12.
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I'm going to start in verse 12. With Paul saying to the Colossians, put on then as God's chosen ones, holy and beloved, compassionate hearts, kindness, humility, meekness and patience.
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So as you approach this issue, that's the attitude that you need to have.
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And pray and ask the Lord that you would be able to approach this with humility, meekness and patience.
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Right. Knowing you're not going to change anybody's mind right away, but it's going to take a little bit of time.
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Bearing with one another, verse 13. And if one has a complaint against another, forgiving each other as the
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Lord has forgiven you, so you must also forgive. Right. Paul wrote in Romans 15 that we who are strong have an obligation to bear with the failings of the weak and not to please ourselves, but for the benefit of our neighbor, for his good to build him up.
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And so you need to be thinking about this from the standpoint of the Holy Spirit is impressed upon you something that you've probably come into as you are growing in spiritual maturity.
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Right. And the rest of your church isn't there yet. Right. So you need to approach this humbly.
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This is a measure of grace that God has given to you, apportioning to each person, the measure of faith that they have as we read in Romans 12, three.
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And so you need to know that you're not going to change anybody's mind right away. You're just kind of giving them something to think about at this moment.
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Planting a seed. Yes. Yeah. Just, I'm going to put this out there. You're going to like mull over it or whatever you got to do.
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Research it in the Bible. Feel, pray about it. See if you feel a conviction and we'll come back to this.
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You know, the comment that you make in your email about how the congregation sings louder when you're singing the traditional hymns, as opposed to the more poppy songs that come from the popular churches.
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There's actually an aesthetic reason for that too. And I'll come to that here in just a moment. I've even got a hymnal open next to me here so I can provide you with an example.
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But that might be the way to break the ice on the conversation. Hey, has anybody ever noticed that the crowd, the congregation actually sings louder and more intensely and is more into the music when we're singing the traditional songs than when we're singing the stuff by Hillsong and Elevation?
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Yeah, that's a great way. Just kind of plant that seed and maybe that starts the ball rolling on having those kinds of conversations.
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You are going to offend people by opening up this box.
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Oh yes, most definitely. I'm just going to tell you that right now. For some reason, they defend this. It's incredibly personal.
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I don't really know why. I don't get it either. It's music. Yeah, I've always with my music and we've talked about this on the podcast before.
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Maybe it's the feelings that they attach to the song. Yeah, could very well be that. So you're kind of knocking at their feelings.
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Yes, if you're criticizing the song, you're criticizing something that in their heart they feel connects them with God.
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Right. Which doesn't. That could be. Yeah. Could be. I mean, not that connects them to God.
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I'm saying that could be the reason why they're feeling that way. They're so easily offended by it. Yes. And I've talked about this on the podcast before.
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I've always just had a connection with my music in the sense that it's my music. I don't expect you to like it.
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I like it, but you don't have to like it. So that's why I listen to it. It's my music.
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But some folks just have a, they have a very personal connection with stuff. And there was a point where I just couldn't stand it when somebody said, oh
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Gabe, you got to listen to this song. I'm like, no, don't tell me that. Because I'm not going to like it and you're going to get offended by it.
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Yeah, that's true. So I just nod, okay, right. I see why you like that song.
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Yes, that's terrible. I know, that's probably a terrible response.
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But anyway, so taking this very patiently and not expecting something radical in the very beginning, but slow and steady, patient, humble, meek, with forgiveness in your heart toward one another, they may react kind of outlandishly toward the suggestions that you're making about the music, but you can't respond the same way.
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You have to be the cooler head. Even when the conversation goes in the direction of people really personally getting offended, being the person to go, okay, let's scale it back.
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We've talked about this a little bit. We've put some ideas on the table. So for now, let's table it and we'll come back to it again later.
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And then you're kind of moving on with the conversation from there. I mean, you got a worship pastor you mentioned and that term in and of itself, not a very good term for the worship leader in the church.
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Because the guy who's preaching is just as much the worship pastor. This is true.
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As the worship pastor is. So he's your music leader. You got somebody in your church that's leading the music.
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He's putting some of his own personality into the songs that are being chosen.
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As disconnected from his own biases as he probably wants you to believe that he is and the music that he chooses, his personality is still coming out in the music that's chosen.
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I'm still picking all the music in our church and my tastes are certainly in the songs that are being picked.
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I'm looking for things that are doctrinally sound and will even go with the message that I'm preaching on that day.
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But nonetheless, I'm not so prideful to say that, yeah, but I'm completely unbiased in the songs that I pick.
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You know, that would just be silly. He said that he was friends with some of them. So is like a friend setting, like away from church a good idea or should he like meet them at church and have like an official meeting or?
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Either way. If you're part of some sort of committee at the church, which is connected with the music and you can raise this in a formal setting, that would be the most beneficial in terms of moving the church in a particular direction because you're putting something out there on the table that people from several different areas or departments are having to think about rather than just having one -on -one conversations with those who are only involved in the music.
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Because when it comes down to it, the music that is being sung in the church is supposed to be congregational.
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It is absolutely not to be exclusive to whoever is leading the music or whoever plays in the band.
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So going on in Colossians 3, verse 14, above all these put on love, which binds everything together in perfect harmony.
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Hey, we get some music terminology coming in there. And let the peace of Christ rule in your hearts to which indeed you were called in one body and be thankful.
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Let the word of Christ dwell in you richly, teaching and admonishing one another in all wisdom, singing psalms and hymns and spiritual songs with thankfulness in your hearts to God.
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Now notice at the end of verse 15, Paul said, be thankful. At the start of verse 16, let the word of Christ dwell in you richly.
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Then he talks about singing psalms and hymns and spiritual songs and then comes back again to with thankfulness in your hearts to God.
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So bookending that instruction to sing psalms and hymns and spiritual songs is the command to be thankful.
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And when we are singing those praises to God, we are expressing our thanks unto the
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Lord with hearts that are full of the word of Christ because that's verse 16.
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Let the word of Christ dwell in you richly, which causes you to teach and admonish one another in all wisdom.
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So you know how to encourage one another. You also know how to correct one another wisely according to the instructions of the word of God.
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And it also stirs within you with this thankful, delightful heart unto the
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Lord to sing psalms and hymns and spiritual songs. And this is not just as a congregation expressing thanks together to God, but you even come to teach and admonish one another through the music that's being sung because that's in context with what is being said here.
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So there's teaching in the music in addition to the fact that we're lifting our voices together in praise.
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And then finally, verse 17 is a kind of close the section out whatever you do in word or deed, do everything in the name of the
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Lord Jesus, giving thanks to God the Father through him. If your church goes in a direction of evaluating even the music that you sing, according to what is said in the word of God, eventually you will weed out songs from Bethel Hill song,
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Elevation in Jesus Culture. Very true. Because they are not writing their songs according to what's in the word of God.
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Now there are a few, there are a few that you can hear biblical passages come about in the lyrics and things like that.
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There are a few of those, but for the most part, that's not the kind of thing that's coming out of those churches because they believe the
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Holy Spirit is giving them new revelation. And so that's what they're writing into their lyrics. They're not writing what comes out of the word of God, they're writing what the
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Holy Spirit is telling me right now. And that's what I'm writing into my music. As you become more grounded in God's word, you will become less and less attached to those songs and songwriters that are not writing lyrics according to the word of God, but rather the word that they hear in their own head.
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It could be just an easy go -to also. Like the worship pastor picks them because it's an easy.
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It is. It's convenient. Certainly. It's right there. Right. Everybody knows that it's catchy.
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Yeah, he's hearing it on Spotify. Yes. He's hearing it on K -Love. Right. He's hearing it in his
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CCLI feed that he might be getting. The promotional CDs that get sent to churches because Christian, you mentioned that you attend a pretty large church.
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Well, churches above a certain number certainly get noticed by those folks who are these music distributors.
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Oh yeah. And they wanna give you those bands. Bethel, Hillsong and Elevation, they've got money to burn.
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Right. So there's a lot of money pushing these songs which ends up in these churches and then they make money off of that.
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Right. So that's part of the reason why these songs are so commonly heard and therefore sung in these churches.
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It's not just because they're well -written songs because a lot of them are not. Right. It's because there's a lot of money behind them.
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Right. And those money, those monies, those songs have been pushed into the hands of worship leaders in a lot of these larger churches because money has been pushing those songs in that particular direction.
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That makes sense. And the thing about these songs, okay, so you mentioned before, I'm gonna come to a little bit more technical explanation on why these songs are so popular but you don't hear the congregation singing with them.
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Yeah, I'm gonna read straight from the email. Whenever our church sings a classic hymn, the congregation gets louder and the praise is elevated far above what the normal pop songs get.
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So the pop songs are popular because they have been chosen and written according to a particular formula that organizations like K -Love and probably also
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CCLI are looking for to push to those churches because they know that that particular sound, that particular way that the song is structured, this certain riff, this certain melody, this certain earworm.
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How many ohs it has. Yeah, this certain hook. We know that these are the things that people like.
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So they write those songs according to that. But what they're writing according to is what people are saying in a very informal atmosphere about the songs that they're listening to.
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Whenever they test people about these things, they're not testing them in the places where they typically sing or listen to music.
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They're not testing them in their car. They're not testing them in their living room or kitchen or something like that.
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They're testing them in this room, in this auditorium, which is why the term for this testing has been known as auditorium testing because there's a person that'd be sitting in an auditorium, they've got a little box in their hands and they turn a dial a certain way to indicate whether they really like the song or they really don't like the song.
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Oh, right, right. And so based on this method of testing, that's how we've come about the certain pop sound that K -Love has.
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And every single song seems to fit that exact sound. You know that when you turn on K -Love or The Fish or Way FM or any of these other stations, you're going to get the same sound no matter what
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Christian station that you listen to. It's because they're all following the exact same testing results to determine which songs are the most ear catching and ear pleasing to be played on the radio.
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So people like the songs and they gravitate toward those songs because it's what they like to hear.
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That doesn't necessarily mean people like to sing them. Right. It just means they like to hear them.
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That's so true. So that's why in church, it seems like not as many people are singing along with the pop songs, but people are singing with the hymns.
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The hymns have been written to be sung with. Yeah, that's true.
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The pop songs have not been written to be sung with. Like if you take a pop song, I'm going to use one that's very popular and people do sing along with this song,
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How Great Is Our God from Chris Tomlin. It is an easy song to sing with.
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And so even in a praise and worship setting, you'll still have a lot of people lifting up their voices to How Great Is Our God.
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People just love this song. Right. Our seven year old son loves this song. Yes, he does. It's his favorite song.
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He wants daddy to sing it all the time in church. But if you open up a piece of music and look at the song, you'll notice something in particular about the structure.
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The last note in every phrase does not end on a beat. So beat meaning one, two, three, four.
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You're talking about a song in four, four times. So it's one, two, three, four, one, two, three, four, one.
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You know, you get what I'm saying, okay. So the last word of that song is, or I'm sorry, the last word of a particular phrase is not sung on a beat.
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It's sung on the off beat. Okay. And that's harder for people to grasp and sing along with.
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Even though I'm picking one of the easier pop songs to sing along with, it's still structured the same way.
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The last note ends on a half beat. It doesn't end on a beat. And that's very, very common among pop music.
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That's so strange. But you go to something like, okay, I'm gonna turn now. I think it's hymn number 98 in this particular hymnal.
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Come thou fount of every blessing. Everything in this song is either an eighth note or a quarter note.
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And the last note of every phrase is always on the beat. Or the last note will be a half note or something of that name that you have to hold out.
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You know what I mean? Right. So these songs, the hymns have been written a particular way to be easy for people to hear and sing along with.
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When you sing one line, you not only know how to sing the next verse the same way, you also know how to sing the next line the same way.
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Right. Because come thou fount of every blessing, this hymn in particular follows a structure of A -A -B -A.
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That means that the first line, come thou fount of every blessing, tune my heart to sing thy grace.
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That's A. The next line is also A. Streams of mercy never ceasing, call for songs of loudest praise.
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I've just sung the exact same melody twice. And now the B. And now B. Teach me some melodious sonnet, sung by flaming tongues above.
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Praise the mount I'm fixed upon it. Mount of thy redeeming love. Okay, now
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I sang that very fast, but that structure, hymns are written that way.
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Right. So that it's easier for the person to hear and sing along with. This is why the congregation is singing louder with the hymns than they're singing with the pop songs.
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Even though they like the pop songs, they're not written to be sung with, they're written to be listened to.
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Right. And to be pleasing to the ear. Hymns, I believe are pleasing to the ear as well, but that could just be a style thing.
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But more specifically, hymns are written to be sung with. And they don't all follow that AABA structure.
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It could also be ABAB. Right. Or it might be ABBA or something like that.
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But all that's just to say that a hymn follows a particular structure that a pop song doesn't. What do most pop songs follow?
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What's the structure that they follow? Verse, chorus, verse, chorus, chorus, chorus, bridge, bridge, bridge, bridge, bridge, chorus, chorus, chorus, chorus, chorus.
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You know, that's kind of the. And somewhere in there is an instrumental solo. Yeah, right. You gotta have the guitar solo in there.
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You gotta have the solo. So everybody's standing there like, yeah, do we keep our hands up?
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Do we put them down? Yeah, it's hard to look around now.
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I try as best as I can. I try as best as I can to leave all those, you know, music solos and things like that out whenever we're leading the congregation in music.
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I'm like, I'm not worshiping anymore. This is just weird. Yeah, these. Should I meditate? These songs from Bethel Hill Song, Elevation Jesus Culture, et cetera, these songs are written for the worship band.
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They're not written for the congregation. They are, yes. And so when you approach this conversation.
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It's like whenever they come in and are leaving, that's when you play that song in the back, that kind of song in the back.
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The background stuff. Yes, as opposed to the main. Yes, yes.
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We're singing along with Muzak. That's great. Sorry, no.
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So I start out by giving you help on how you can approach this conversation and then went in the direction of explaining why things were that way.
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I don't know that that explanation will help you. Right, in a conversation you mean?
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Right. Because a lot of my understanding of this comes from just my background in music and my background in radio and things like that.
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It's not necessarily because this is helpful in order to get the music turned a certain direction.
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Right. That just gives you an explanation as to why people are singing more with the hymns than they are with the poppy songs.
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They are written like pop songs. They're written to be enjoyed on the radio, not necessarily sung as a congregation. But that needs to be the emphasis.
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Why are we singing in church on Sunday? Right. Why do we even have the music? Right. It's because we as the church together are lifting up our voices in praise to our
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God who has saved us by the grace of his son, Jesus Christ, and he alone is worthy of our worship.
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What we are doing in church by singing is eternity practice because this is exactly what we're gonna be doing forever around the throne.
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All of the people of God from all time lifting up their voice with such a sound that it's thunderous in its praise the way
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John describes it in the book of Revelation. And so we're doing now in church what we're gonna be doing forever.
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Don't you want songs that are the most praising to God and the most inclusive of his people to sing those praises to God?
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Most definitely. So Christian, I hope that helps you out with how you can approach this particular subject.
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And we'll certainly pray for you. When we get to the end of the Q &A today, Becky and I will take a moment to pray for you in that conviction that you have and a desire to wanna see your church take that particular direction.
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I think it's a good conviction. Yes. And I hope the best for you as you approach these conversations.
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But again, in all of this, do it with gentleness and respect. Right. Next question comes from James in Utah.
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Pastor Gabe, I would love to hear your thoughts on theonomy, specifically the Bonson approach, reasons for or against.
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Also homeschooling. My wife and I have four kids, two, four, six, eight, two of which are currently being homeschooled and are interested to hear what material or programs you use and how you spend your typical school day.
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I was asked this question several weeks ago, but I wanted to wait until you were on the broadcast so you could help me out with this particular answer.
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Sure. First of all, I wanna give a brief answer to the theonomy question. Go for it. I have not read Bonson. I have not read
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Rush Dooney. I am not an expert in understanding theonomy from that particular perspective.
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But theonomy is basically this. The word theonomy means God's law. When you break down the word, that's what it means.
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It's from Theo, which means God, and nomo, which means law. So theonomy means God's law.
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And it's basically the idea that all of our civic laws or all of our laws as a society should be based on God's law.
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And to put it more specifically, at least for me in particular, the book of Deuteronomy. Okay.
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For that's the law of God summarized before Moses sent the people of Israel into the promised land.
30:53
Right. Like as we were going through the study in Nehemiah, when they read the law of God, when
30:59
Ezra read the law to the people, and then the Levites explained the sense,
31:05
Nehemiah 8 .8. They explained the law to the people. Oh, right. It was specifically Deuteronomy, the second law, which is what
31:13
Deuteronomy means. So it's the law given a second time. Okay. It was that book that was being read aloud to the people and then explained to them.
31:20
And they were convicted in heart over what they heard, realizing that they had not obeyed that law.
31:26
Right. And so came into repentant hearts and a desire to want to follow God with all of their heart, soul, mind, and strength, not just as individual people, but as an entire society and as a culture.
31:37
Right. This is the way that we evangelize. We go out with the law and people are convicted when they hear that they've broken that law.
31:46
And then we give them the gospel. You've broken God's perfect law. You deserve death.
31:51
And that's what we read in the law. Most of the laws you're breaking, you would deserve to die for breaking that particular law.
31:58
But God has shown his grace through Jesus Christ who died for our sins.
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So if you believe in Jesus, your sins are forgiven and you have everlasting life. Right. So this is the way that we go out with evangelism.
32:12
Theonomy is the idea that our civic laws should still be based on what we read in Deuteronomy. I don't necessarily disagree with that.
32:19
What I don't agree with is the whole post -millennial reconstructionist view or this idea that we as Christians are making the world a better place.
32:30
Okay. And then the culture is gonna get to a certain place before Jesus comes because we have reconstructed society and the culture according to the law.
32:41
I just don't see that happening. That doesn't mean that I'm gonna change my approach. Right.
32:46
But I don't have any expectation that the world is gonna be that way by the time that Jesus returns.
32:52
Okay. We see things getting progressively worse, not getting better. Right. And Jesus himself said that the path that we're on is the narrow road.
33:02
There is never going to be a time where Christianity is true biblical
33:07
Christianity in particular, not just like the whole civic Christianity. Right. Where you have most
33:12
Americans saying, yeah, I'm a Christian, 80 % of Americans or something, but it's really only like 10%.
33:17
And then there's no fruit from it. Yeah, no fruit from it at all. Now this is the narrow road, true biblical Christianity. And we're never gonna see a time where the majority of culture or society or the world at large is gonna be following along with this post -millennial reconstructionist view.
33:32
I just don't hold that particular eschatology or view of the end times. But when it comes to our laws, yeah,
33:39
I do believe that they should be based on what it is that we read in the Old Testament in the
33:44
Mosaic law. To give you an example of this, I wrote a blog, it was in March and the title of the blog was what the
33:52
Bible says to Schlitterbahn and why they should be held responsible for a boy's death.
33:59
Schlitterbahn is a big water park. In Kansas City. Well, in Kansas City, yeah, for this particular instance that happened, it was in Kansas City.
34:07
Oh, are there more? Yeah, there's more of them. It's like a six flags. Oh, okay. So their main headquarters is based out of Texas, but you've got water parks that are all over.
34:15
Okay. So this, and to - I have a very small world view. Yeah. It's very limited.
34:22
Not world view, but view of the world. View of the world. World view, yeah. So anyway, look up that article because I talk about how
34:33
Schlitterbahn was indeed responsible for that boy's death and the responsibility is because of what's said in God's law, why they're responsible for that incident that happened.
34:46
And so it gives you an idea of how we take that law and we can apply it even to our civic laws.
34:51
And we should. The Me Too movement right now has this idea of everybody who's accused is guilty until proven innocent.
35:00
Right. But God's law is very much in favor of having to show guilt.
35:06
A person is innocent until proven guilty. Right. This is called due process. So just because an accusation comes about against somebody does not mean that we should automatically believe that accusation.
35:17
Right. Even if it seems plausible. Even if it sounds like the argument, well, I don't know. It sure sounds like that person is pretty believable.
35:25
I think they might be right. We have to go through the proper processes of determining guilt or innocence.
35:32
And that is absolutely what God's word says. It is in favor of this due process.
35:39
So this thing that's going on in the culture right now of an opinion comes. Oh, it's so terrible.
35:44
I can't stand the way that this has gone. Even as a culture, as a society, we had adopted the mantra of innocent until proven guilty.
35:52
Right. But right now in popular culture, it's not the way things are going. If somebody accuses you of anything, you're guilty.
35:59
It's instant gratification. Yep. I wanna see that person. Right. That even comes about in the way that we apply our biases toward a person's guilt or innocence.
36:09
Right. And so anyway, that's sad, the way that things are going in that particular direction. Awful, yeah.
36:15
But our worldview in that sense, in the way that laws are written and applied and carried out should be rooted in God's word, not rooted in our feelings.
36:23
Which is the way that things are going right now. So anyway, that's my take on theonomy. I think that for Christians, there is some level of theonomy that we will agree with or believe in, but that tends to be a pretty loaded word whenever we talk about theonomy, because it's so connected with post -millennial reconstructionism.
36:46
Ah, okay. Anyway, so I said that was gonna be a short answer. That wasn't necessarily all that short. Here we get to the second part of the question.
36:54
James is asking about homeschooling. My wife and I have four kids, two of which are currently being homeschooled and are interested to hear in what material or programs you use and how you spend your typical school day.
37:06
Babe, the floor is yours. It's usually in chaos. Massive chaos.
37:13
Public school is probably a little bit more structured with their school day than. Yeah, but they get to send it home.
37:18
See, there's the difference, is that if you don't get it done in homeschool, you're still home. You still have to finish it at home.
37:25
You do, you do. And you still need the parents' help. So instead of the teacher hat, you now have the parent hat, which is still the same person in their minds.
37:33
And it's still the same pulling teeth kind of thing. So for the most part, you're gonna get like how you do in school, in public schools, you're gonna have the kids who love subjects and they're gonna work really hard at them.
37:47
And then you're gonna have the kids, same kids that don't like other subjects and they're not gonna wanna work at all.
37:52
On those particular subjects. On those subjects, yeah. And so it's, you gotta find the balance for your family.
37:58
And I've always said that every family is different. What works for my family might not work for yours at all.
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We are not morning people, as much as I had hoped to drill in my children.
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Our children are. No. Well, I mean, Annie's not. No, not the children that are being schooled right now.
38:18
The children who are not being schooled, however, are morning people. Well, of course, the youngest ones are always the morning people, right?
38:24
They are. And if you're full of curiosity. And so we use a gamut of different curriculum.
38:33
I think the main one is classical conversations. That is the basis, yes.
38:38
Okay. I mean, they've turned it into curriculum, but you still have to supplement the math and English and that sort of thing.
38:45
Right, so you gotta go outside what they have provided for certain things or the curriculum that they have provided.
38:52
Yes. You have to pull in other subjects which they don't do the curriculum for.
38:58
They don't do it as extensive as their state requires. Okay, okay. Yeah. So according to your state laws, you may have to do something or add something else in.
39:07
Right. In addition to what it is that you're doing with the particular model or curriculum that you use.
39:14
Right. Okay. But every year it's been something different because I just haven't found that niche that really works for the kids and gets them excited.
39:23
And - When it comes to math, there really may not be. Yeah, well, the kids do it naturally.
39:31
Like Annie is really good at multiplication tables and Zij is really good at adding in his head, you know, doing all the mental math.
39:40
But whenever it comes to actually like writing it out on paper, that's different. Yeah, I get that.
39:46
And Zij likes puzzles. Right, he loves them. And he loves to build. Loves to build, yes. But yeah, writing it out on paper, that's the part that he -
39:53
And so this year we've really been working on him writing, but I don't push him too much.
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I've done most of the writing for him, which he tells me what to write and then I will write it out.
40:05
And so - And he's seven. Right. And we've kind of compromised as far as that goes, but I've been making him do a lot more of the writing himself this year, just to kind of encourage him.
40:17
Because the only way they're gonna get faster is if they do it more often. Sure. So we do Saxon math, we do
40:23
CC and we do, we're doing Shirley English for, or Shirley grammar,
40:30
I think is what it is, for grammar, for English. Yeah. And he's doing IEW and -
40:36
You. Yeah, it's kind of, it's weird. Intelligence, English writing.
40:44
No, it's not writing. What is the IEW? I don't remember. Anyway. And then the
40:50
TWSS, that's all incorporated in the classical conversations.
40:57
You're sounding like a military wife now. IEW and CC and QRSTV. Yeah, right.
41:05
Yeah. I don't remember what the acronym. The military wives at our church is a, the acronyms that flow through our congregation.
41:10
But they're so long of names that it's just easier to remember the letters. That's terrible.
41:17
It's teaching, writing with sequence and I don't know.
41:23
Ba -da -ba -do -ba -da. Yeah, it's all in there somewhere. So how does a day look?
41:28
How does your typical day - Okay, so typical day is I want them to remember, first and foremost, to rely fully on God.
41:38
And so we start with Bible study or devotional. They've got their verses that they have to memorize.
41:45
We have catechisms that we do, songs. So that's all the first thing in the day. Yes, and we also throw in the things to keep them safe, which is our phone numbers and phone numbers of family members and close friends and also our address.
41:59
And so we do like the calendar and all of that together. And that gets us off on the right foot.
42:07
And then we do, I kind of set up a schedule, but it's kind of out the window at the moment just because we're so busy that it's hard to keep everybody.
42:18
Some days you may actually focus more on some subjects. Yes. And then the next day you're gonna come back to subjects that you didn't have the focus on the day before.
42:25
Right. And like, okay, we need to catch up on this. And sometimes I even take a Saturday and I'm like, hey, look guys, you goofed off all week.
42:32
Right. Let's get back to work. So you're gonna lose the Saturday because you're gonna have to pick up the school that you missed.
42:38
Yeah, and it really stinks because my schedule is like non -existent anymore. Like mine, personal, getting stuff done for myself.
42:46
But then that's when you call in the Calvary and you have some friends over and you're like, okay,
42:52
I need help. And because I mean, that's, you can't do it alone. Yeah.
42:57
You really can't. As much as you want to, and you shouldn't, it's relying on your fellow
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Christian friends and sharing the burden. It's just grown me so much closer to friends.
43:15
So like friends from the church that come over help you do some of the housework. Yeah. Or watch the kids and give you a break.
43:20
Or teach the kids sometimes. Or teach the kids, okay. It's just, it's really awesome to see it all come together.
43:27
So don't feel like your house is turning into a bunker when you become a homeschool family. Right. And invite those people in because then they can help back you up whenever your kids are misbehaving.
43:37
Because kids are angels all the time. No, I'm just kidding. But whenever they are disobedient, you have friends that are there and they know that your child is pushing your limits and so they can help what a mom say.
43:54
And that is so helpful. You have no idea that just those words alone go so much further in a day.
44:03
That. They've heard your voice and so they've figured out how they can ignore it. Right, sure, yes.
44:10
So then, which daddy doesn't let happen when I'm home. I don't let that happen. But then bringing in a friend who can be a different voice, they're listening to that person and then they can say, now what has your mom said?
44:22
Right. And so then it comes back to. Because they know, they know. They answer it right off the bat. I mean, it's just right there that they're like, oh, well mom said this, you know.
44:32
And it's like, oh, so you were listening. That's called disobedience, child.
44:38
Let's have a talk about this. Yeah, that's right. And then you bring it back to the Bible. There was a time a couple of years ago we were looking at getting a dog and I was hanging out with these little puppies and was talking with a woman about a puppy for our family and I was doing this to surprise
44:56
Becky and the kids. And so as we were talking about the dog, she was asking me, you know, do you want a male or a female?
45:02
And I said, well, let me ask you this. Which one is least likely to ignore my wife when she talks to it?
45:09
Because she's already frustrated that the children are not listening to her. We don't need a dog at home that doesn't listen to her also.
45:17
And it's really tough with littles too, because littles are. We have a one -year -old and a three -year -old.
45:24
Yes, and they are so inquisitive and they want to do the stuff but they don't know how to do this stuff yet.
45:30
And so I will read, I'll take little breaks from whenever the kids, the older kids are, you know, on a roll on what they're doing.
45:40
They know what they're doing. And so I'll take little breaks and I'll read them a book or I'll get them set up with,
45:47
I was really good about it whenever it was just Annie and I had Zachary as a little, and I make little quiet boxes for him.
45:55
Yeah, I remember that. And he had a different quiet box for every subject and he would just, they weren't necessarily quiet, quiet, but like I'd cut up a sponge and he'd be able to build with the sponges, the pieces and.
46:07
Yeah, when she calls it a quiet box, it was literally quiet. Yeah. When like wooden blocks that would fall to make a lot of noise.
46:14
It was little pipe cleaners and. Yeah, and I had little pom -poms that I would.
46:20
Little pom -poms, I remember those. With an ice, what do you call the ice tray? Like the ice tray, yeah.
46:26
The old fashioned ice trays, right? And so, and tweezers and they would pick up the pom -poms with the tweezers and they put it in the ice tray.
46:35
Now, sometimes it just ends up all over the floor, which is fine because then it's pickup time and then they learn to clean.
46:42
That's right, there you go. We also take days where it's home ec is what I like to call it.
46:47
And we work on our cleaning skills. We're cleaning the house today. And this is, you know, life skills.
46:53
So it's very important. I think the children are actually very good at cleaning the house. They are.
46:58
When you get them on it. They are amazing, yes. When I say company's coming, man, they are, bam.
47:04
Hey, people are coming over. That's right. They're like, and we can watch TV. That's right, but I can't watch
47:10
TV until the house is clean. Okay, let's do it. And company. And company's coming over. Seems to be a pretty terrific motivator.
47:16
Yes. So James gives you some idea of how homeschool works in our home and we appreciate the questions.
47:23
Sounds chaotic, doesn't it? Well, so did my explanation of theonomy there as well. So this next question is not something that I'm an expert in either.
47:32
It's something that I've heard about, but would not be able to give you all the specifics of it. So this comes from Daryl in Florida.
47:39
He says, hello, Gabe and Becky. I have a question for your podcast. Three weeks ago, my wife and I were blessed to have our first child.
47:46
Oh, congratulations. Congratulations. We have added a beautiful baby girl to our family and we couldn't be happier.
47:53
My question pertains to a gift that we received for our daughter in the mail from an out -of -state relative.
48:00
We received a card stating that our baby has been enrolled in the Association of Marian Helpers. I've never heard of Marian Helpers before, but from what
48:10
I've read online, it seems to be tied to Catholicism. I was wondering if you could explain what this group is and if and how
48:18
I should respond to it. Thank you so much for your ministry and God bless. Yes, I know what the
48:24
Marians of the Immaculate Conception are. I'm not really too clear on what they do, however.
48:32
So you can join, you can become a part of it, you can be signed up for it by somebody else.
48:39
But I'm still not really sure what the point of that is. So here is what they say on their website.
48:45
When you go to the link, who is a Marian Helper? It says,
48:51
Marian Helpers are men, women, moms, dads, grandparents, families, and even children who support the mission of the
48:57
Marian Fathers in various ways. They are people who, maybe just like you, are looking for ways to belong to something that is doing great good in the church and in the world.
49:08
But I can't say I know exactly what that is. I know that part of what they do is praying for the dead.
49:15
But I don't know that as a part of the Marian Helpers, if you're praying with them at a certain time of the day,
49:24
I think it's something like 3 a .m. and 3 p .m. So on those times of the day, if you choose that time of the day to pray, then you're gonna be praying with all the other
49:33
Marian Helpers at the same time. I'm not totally clear that's what that is, that's what they're doing, but I know that part of what it is that they do is praying for the dead.
49:42
So you're praying for those people who are in purgatory, that they would be delivered from purgatory and into heaven.
49:49
That's part of what the Marian Helpers do. Going on here in the explanation, many people find that something, quote unquote, is in the
49:57
Association of Marian Helpers. Officially established in 1945, the Association began as a small group of friends who believed in and supported the work of the
50:05
Marians. Now some 1 .5 million members strong, the Association is a spiritual benefit society that continues to prayerfully and financially support the priests and brothers of the
50:17
Congregation of Marian Fathers of the Immaculate Conception. And so of course, Marians of the
50:23
Immaculate Conception is the idea that Mary was born without sin. So the name of their organization or their fraternity, as it would be, is after a very false, lying
50:35
Catholic doctrine. Anyway, going on, what are the spiritual benefits of membership?
50:40
As a Marian Helper, you'll share in the benefits of all the daily masses, prayers, and good works of Marian priests and brothers all over the world.
50:49
In addition, you'll receive specific remembrance in the following ways. Now, that statement there, you'll receive a specific remembrance.
50:57
Receiving remembrance in the Catholic Church is remembering someone who has died or who is deceased.
51:04
So I'm not really sure how they apply that you receive a specific remembrance.
51:09
I'm not really sure how that works. So they go on to say, you'll receive a daily Holy Mass celebrated for Marian Helpers.
51:16
You'll receive a Holy Mass offered for members on the first Friday and first Saturday of each month. I don't know if that means that they're offering up Mass and you receive the benefits of that Mass because you're part of the
51:27
Marian Helpers. I don't know if that's what that's implying. A Holy Mass offered for deceased members on All Souls Day, a special Mass offered on each feast day of our
51:38
Holy blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. Anyway, so all of this is, it is very, very
51:43
Catholic. It's very mystic. It has no roots whatsoever in anything biblical.
51:49
And I would, if I were you, Daryl, I would contact that family member and just very politely say, thank you for the consideration that you thought of our little one in this way and that you did this gesture in kindness.
52:08
But this is not what we believe and we don't wanna be part of it. And maybe use that as an opportunity to share what the gospel truly is and that the
52:18
Roman Catholic Church doesn't follow it. The Roman Catholic Church infuses so many other doctrines that they claim has been revealed to them by God but is not rooted in God's word in any way, shape or form.
52:32
So just politely contacting that family member and saying, I appreciate your consideration. This is not what we believe.
52:38
It's not what we wanna raise our daughter understanding. You cannot pray for the dead.
52:44
As it says in the book of Hebrews, it is appointed for a man once to die and after that comes judgment. So you cannot pray anyone out of hell once they have or pray anyone out of hell or into heaven, you know, as it would be.
52:59
You cannot pray to Mary for as it says in 1 Timothy 2 .5, there is one mediator between God and men and that is the man,
53:06
Jesus Christ only. And so because of this, we don't share those beliefs and we can't be partakers in this.
53:13
So again, I appreciate the consideration but we can't accept it.
53:19
And we love you very much. And we love you very much. That's what Becky was waiting for me to finish that so she could add that in.
53:24
Yeah. So, well, thank you for your questions that you have sent to us today. Any other questions can be sent to whenweunderstandthetext at gmail .com.
53:33
Let's conclude with prayer for those folks who we've received questions from today.
53:40
Yes, please. Dear God, we thank you for the salvation that we have been given in Jesus Christ that we know through Christ and through faith in his finished work on the cross and resurrection from the grave.
53:53
We have an inheritance in his eternal kingdom. We have been adopted into your family as your sons and daughters.
54:02
And so likewise, having received this adoption, we've also received many brothers and sisters in the
54:08
Lord. And I pray that you would continue to grow us in knowledge of how we are to interact with one another in the body, responding to one another peacefully and in a spirit of gentleness and kindness and love that the peace of Christ would reign in our hearts, even in the ways that we talk with one another, our speech always seasoned with salt and always gracious.
54:36
And so as Christian is thinking about how he can approach people in his church about the music, how it's being done, how they sing together and lift up their voices to God, I pray that you would give him wisdom and that you would also give members of his church wisdom in how they receive what it is that Christian brings up with them.
54:55
They would have hearts that are receptive to the truth of the word of God and desiring that all their manner of worship would be according to what your word says, not what they feel or what they want a worship service to be.
55:09
Furthermore, we pray for James in Utah and the way that he is raising his children and thinking about homeschooling and how he and his wife can raise their kids and educate them, that you would give them wisdom in this as well, picking the right curriculum, structuring their day according to what's best for their kids and how they can point their children toward who you are and the wonderful gift of knowledge that you've given to us, that everything that we come to learn and know about in this world just points us all the more to the creator of all things.
55:45
And lastly, I pray for Daryl, appreciative of this family member who has extended this gift to him, but as he has to contact this family member and say that this is not what we believe and we can't be partakers in this, that you give him a spirit of gentleness and knowing how to respond to this family member, not just to turn the gift down, but also to extend the gift of the gospel of Jesus Christ, that they might turn from their
56:12
Catholicism and the corruption of God's word that the Roman Catholic Church has brought and instead would point them to the light of Christ that we have in the word of God.
56:23
We thank you for all your continued blessings upon us, your patience and your guidance that you give to us each day.
56:31
And we ask that you grow us all the more in sanctification, in maturity, in your son,
56:37
Jesus Christ. In his name we pray, amen. Amen. Amen.
57:04
So much to do.
57:47
Ooh, and so little time. Very little time. What do we do in the morning? I am taking
57:53
Annie. We are sleeping in, good idea. We have school and I'm taking
57:59
Annie for a mom -daughter, whatchamacallit. Okay, while I'm sleeping, right?
58:04
No, you have to do scoop. No, I gotta sleep. Scoop the children.
58:09
I gotta sleep. Sleepy time. Give the children some scoop. I think
58:15
Annie and I should take that mom -daughter time to sleep in. We both really want to sleep in.