The American Churchman: Finance Capital: Is it Biblical?

And welcome once again to the American Churchman podcast. One day early. We usually stream Tuesdays, but because of scheduling conflicts and difficulties, actually, I'm not. I'm not sure if this is related to the fourth or it was just your work schedule, Matthew.

We're doing it on Monday, though. So here you go. Yeah. Yeah. How was your fourth? My mind was good.

Was yours like, oh, mine was a mine was good, too. We just you know, I'm not really with my family in Tampa this year. So I just, you know, hung out with my my fiance. And, you know, we we hung out with some of our friends and all that would, you know, cook some food.

We were able to, you know, have some cigars with some people. She didn't smoke any cigars, though, but it was a good time. You know, I got to hang out with her and her brother and a buddy of mine was in town visiting his brother who I hadn't seen my buddy in like a year.

So it was really nice to be able to see him catch up. But it was it was a good, good time, good and patriotic, good patriotic time.

You saw fireworks.

I did. Yeah.

In the distance, we didn't have any ourselves. So but it was nice.

Gotcha. Yeah. We have the end of our street. So if you go to the end of my road, you're on the Hudson River and there's a walkway that is really popular there and the state runs it. And so they have a budget and they put on a pretty good firework show.

And it's funny as they're doing it. You can see in the distance two other firework shows. So you got to enjoy three of them, which is really cool. And we smoked some meat. We had some ribs and pulled pork.

And we're actually doing a birthday party. This we're hosting again this week. So I broke the bank and I decided to get a brisket, which I don't know if you ever if you buy beef brisket, especially. It is very expensive.

Like, oh, I can imagine. Yeah.

Yeah. And I'm I'm like trying to I might write it off. I might do a video on how I smoke brisket. And then, you know, it's part of the YouTube channel or something that I do. So do it. You got to justify it somehow.

It's so good, though.

So anyway, we had a good time and had some friends over, had some family over. And I love the fourth. Fourth is one of my favorite holidays. If I was trying to debate, is it my favorite? Probably not.

Christmas is Christmas is up there. Christmas, I think, is my number one. But after that, I know you're supposed to say Easter or Resurrection Sunday, but I do think the fourth is my favorite season because everyone's just like relaxed.

You just get into a vacation mode, even if you have a lot to do. Everyone's just kind of kicking it back. And they know at least that one weekend they're going to be chilling. And for the next two years, I think it's going to be on the weekend.

So it'll be, you know, this is Friday. I think next year it's Saturday. And then a year after that, it's Sunday, if I'm not mistaken. But anyway, yeah, yeah. So I hope that everyone out there who's streaming with us had a good fourth of July.

And we have a lot to talk about today. And I was just talking to Matthew before the podcast. We're probably not the best two people to talk about this subject, but maybe that makes us better to talk about it because we're coming at this from somewhat of an average guy and not a finance Wall Street person, which I've in my time, I've heard a lot of Wall Street people, financial investors and so forth, talk about the topic we're going to be bringing up, which is fractional reserve banking and inflation and whether or not the system that we participate in is just or sinful.

And there's an article on TruthScript that we're going to be discussing. By the way, I should mention, if you like the program, if you like what you see us talk about, then you want to support TruthScript.

You can just go to TruthScript .com, scroll down to the bottom and there's a donate tab where we are 501 C3. There's also a submit tab or I think it's submit, submit an article if you want to write for us.

But that's the organization that our podcast falls under. So check them out. We have a men's retreat coming up and it's going to be great. So music and masculinity, music and masculinity. .com, if you want to sign up for that.

Anyway, let's get into the article a little bit here. And I'm kind of curious to see what comments we have during this, because I think they might add a lot to this particular conversation. But the article is a biblical financial stewardship exploring an alternative.

And this particular article is a little bit longer. Some of our articles are longer. This is one of them by William Fullington. William Fullington is, I'll click on it, a ruling elder with Grace Covenant Reform Church in Clovis, New Mexico.

He's also a Nelson Nash Institute authorized practitioner and founder of Reform Finance LLC. So he is definitely working with money. And this is established to enable families and churches to take control of the banking function to the glory of God.

So I'm assuming William would probably want people contacting him if they have questions about this. There's just going to Christian conferences. I don't know if you've seen this, Matt, maybe before we get into the article.

There is a lot of enthusiasm today on alternatives to try to get us out of the system we're in, whether it's Bitcoin. I don't know if you've run into the Bitcoin people like and they are a tribe. They are people.

They're very into Bitcoin and they want you to be into Bitcoin and they see all the strengths. I had I think it was Jonathan Song was the guy's name, but he wrote a book called Thank God for Bitcoin. And I had him on a few years ago.

And a lot of the guys who have read his book are very into Bitcoin. And then you have guys. There was one guy at a conference I was at recently who said you can actually and I never really looked into it, probably should have.

But who's got time? But anyway, he had this whole strategy for writing off a lot of your groceries and just your living expenses if you incorporate your family. I don't know how that works, but I've never heard of it.

It was the first time. But there's certainly an interest out there in trying to find alternatives that get us out of the system that we're in, which obviously has inflation and investments that go south when the stock market takes a dip.

And it just feels like sometimes you're trying to get ahead and you can't. So have you run into any of those Christian alternatives? You know, the budget alternatives, that kind of thing.

Dave Rand, yeah, not necessarily. Yeah, no, I mean, I know like a few guys that are super into Bitcoin. And then I also it's always nice to talk to these guys sometimes, because when you do, you realize, wow, I'm not as smart as I think I am in certain subjects.

I'm sure, you know, if I just like put like a modicum of research into it, I can maybe like get a broad understanding of how it works and all that. But it's just the enthusiasm they have. And then you also see their lifestyle and the freedom that they have is, you know, it's interesting to see like how they make this sort of thing work in an alternative way.

Like I know one guy and he's very into all the Bitcoin stuff. Like he'll do conferences and things like that. He'll lead seminars and like he's explaining it to me. And he's like, you know, I've never had so much like financial freedom before.

And, you know, a lot of these guys are, you know, they're big believers in it because they see like this the system, you know, the, you know, you could call it like a few different things like the, you know, the banking system and all that in the global American empire is like the way that everything operates now is like part of the way they control you.

And so through pursuing that, you know, these are like through pursuing that you can have freedom away from that. And a lot of these guys are our guys as well. You know, they're not all just like crazy crackpop libertarians of, you know, I have my my rainbow flag, my rainbow flag and my weed and my my AR -15 and the government better stay off.

Like, you know, they're not all like that, though. They all do have their libertarian bends and like preferences, of course, because that's part of the way they get into it is through this libertarian pipeline.

And they they come out that way. But no, I know a few guys that are really into it. So.

Yeah, I think also the homesteading is another avenue people go. I was talking to John Moody not long ago, and he was saying something like, look, you can write off, you know, whatever it is, 30 percent of or not write off, but you aren't taxed, I should say, you know, on 30 percent of your groceries, if you just do some simple things, if you have like two acres, right, just grow certain things, keep some animals and you just you're not taxed, it's straight profit.

And it's it's not something that you're. Maybe thinking in terms of because we're so used to thinking in terms of everything with a price tag, a dollar amount. But obviously, you're buying value is what's important.

And and so I'm interested in some of these things. I like to hear guys talk about some of this stuff. There's there's certainly personality types that often run with. So so like the guys who are into Bitcoin, I've noticed tend to be very minimalistic.

I don't in general, when you meet them, they tend to be more minimalist, minimalist, they just don't they like to be. On the go, they like to have the flexibility also of a lifestyle where there's a lot of travel and that kind of thing.

And the guys who are more like the homesteaders aren't as much like that, right, because they got to stay in a fixed location. And so and there's overlap in these worlds as well. So, I mean, it's a fascinating thing.

I'm no expert on it, but I think this article will be interesting to talk about because it does think outside the box a bit on some of this. And it gets into something that I know you are interested in and I am, which is what does the Bible teach on the subject of money and finance?

And that's something I think all Christians should be interested in, whether or not they're interested in Bitcoin or homesteading or any of the alternatives out there to the fractional reserve banking system we have.

So let's just read it and we'll talk about as we go and we'll read comments. If you guys have comments out there, we'd love to hear from you, especially if there's finance guys, you know, more than us.

I'm trying to stretch back like 20 years into my economics classes to remember all of this. But it starts out with a quote from Thorsten Poliate, and it says, from a Christian perspective, one could consider the acceptance and spread of fiat money.

Fiat money is just government issued legal tender, right? So the dollar as a grave sin, a reflection of the flawed state of humanity separated from God and leading a misguided life. Fiat money stands for deceit, false testimony and the insidious plundering of some by others.

Now, that seems pretty out there, and I think maybe he wanted to open with that provocative line so that he could then argue to that point. So he says modern financial systems built on fiat money, fractional reserve banking and inflation violate God's law, eroding stewardship and enslaving our neighbors through deceitful wealth transfers and dependence on these systems to provide our need for finance.

Following the exposition of the Westminster Divines, this article seeks to expose these systems as sins prohibited by the Eighth Commandment and contrast these systems with the duties imposed by the same commandment.

By tracing money's manipulation from central banks to market speculation, we uncover a system at odds with biblical principles. Yet hope remains. The infinite banking concept offers a practical path to reclaim control, give generously and find peace, aligning our finances with God's word.

Join us to explore why Christians must reject the ways of Wall Street and Jekyll Island. So that's the Federal Reserve and embrace a wiser alternative. So I want to stop there just before we even get into the arguments here and just get your take on this, Matthew.

I I'm a little uncomfortable with calling it sin or sins. How does he say it? He says that that follow it. Let's see these systems as since he says these systems are sinful or sins, I would just want to be careful there because I think I'm kind of still reacting to the social justice stuff where they would say things like our international trade patterns are that benefit certain classes of people or benefit America mean that everyone in the United States is sinful or everyone who's white is sinful or everyone who's A, B or C just because they allegedly benefit from a system, whether or not they do.

Usually it wasn't exactly true, but but even if it is true, I just have an aversion to that. Am I sinful by being going to to Walmart? Well, maybe I am with let's pick a mom and pop store, mom and pop store in our community.

We could all get behind that just about. And I go there and I use fiat money. I use the government issue dollar to pay for it. I have a very hard time calling that sin. I don't think scripture calls that sin.

In fact, even during Jesus's time, there was government issued money. Obviously it was precious metals and things like that. But there was the imprint of Caesar or some kind of cultural thing. I don't want to say that that's a sin.

I don't want anyone to be confused. I'm not saying the author is necessarily saying that, but it sounds like you could draw that conclusion. So that's my caveat. So what do you think of that?

Yeah, in regard to that, I think that there's like a few distinctions that need to be made, I guess, like with his with his article and the claim made there, his claim is specifically is that the system itself is sinful.

And so, you know, I know that may like click your, you know, your your SJW, you know, your social justice and the church radar may be going off. But the big thing with them was their understanding was that participation in the system was always like somewhat sinful in and of itself.

Like I've had conversations with people like that who would make that claim. And that sort of like follows like the leftist pattern of, oh, you're on colonized land, you're on indigenous land and you're participating in the system where the left will predicate the sins of you if you're even like operating within the system.

But I think that you can make the claim that the system is sinful without necessarily saying that every every single person who is a participant is committing a sin or themselves as like, you know, grieving sin on on themselves.

And like part of the way that you would sort of make this distinction is like if you have the opportunity to go after the alternative, which is more just in not doing that, you're doing like a sin of omission.

You can maybe make that claim. But everybody who's in the system, if this is just like the way that it's ingrained around you and you don't have any means or opportunity to make change in that regard, I would say that there's a lesser degree of sin perhaps that can be like put on you.

And at that point, you're just you're operating in a sinful world as is. And you're doing like the only thing you can. Something I actually thought of is that in one of Dabney's works, Dabney spoke about polygamy, and he was saying that like the entering in of the union itself, like of multiple brides is in and of itself a sin.

But severing that union as well, like through a divorce, is also sin. So what he was basically saying is that, you know, something which is entered into sinfully, if like, you know, torn asunder is also sin.

So, yes, this was entered into sinfully. And yes, these like the context he was talking about was evangelizing like these indigenous tribes and like whatever country or nation or whatever, that they're a polygamous society and how to Christianize them.

And like he was going on about how these people may be in these marriages, but part of the way and prudentially handling is not divorcing them. Of course, you prohibit the office of elder to them, but they need to be faithful to their wives because even though the union entered into was sinful, they need to steward what they've received.

And so I think that you can apply that sort of thinking in the same way right now, that if you're a participant in the system and it's like the only thing you can do right now, that you just need to be a good steward of what you've received, even if you're in a system which is not the best in and of itself.

That sort of is how I would say I would say that even aligns with what the author of the article is saying as well. And I also say that as someone who like I don't have like a hard set opinion on our current financial system and the banking system and all that stuff.

So I'm sitting here and I'm learning with you, but I think that like having that sort of framework may help guide us in discerning the truth behind like the claims here and things like that. I also I do like that.

This guy is a solid reformed fellow as well, who seeks to not only go through what scripture says, but even to give an exposition of how the Westminster divines view the Eighth Commandment. So, you know, I'm excited to talk about that as well and look further into it.

But I don't know if my comment there I said was help. I said was helpful, but I think that Dabney gives like a good paradigm when he's talking about polygamous unions there, at least.

Yeah, no, I think that's good. I think, yeah, that more could be said. Maybe we will say more. We do need to read more of the article here, though. Let's see why he says it's sinful. So he says on the value of money, money can have value in and of itself, as Carl Menger explains, money is simply the most salable commodity.

The value of money lies in its ability to be exchanged for other goods or services. In the United States, the unit of currency is the US dollar, which can be directly exchanged for anything we need. The stockpile of gold, silver or dollars is only valuable because of what it can be exchanged for.

A million dollars in a 401k is valuable only because you anticipate exchanging it for necessities during retirement. So obviously, this is the difference between the dollar amount and the buying power.

Buying power changes that you look at those old memes where it will show that the memes aren't old, but it'll show like the value of a penny in 1950 and what it could buy you. And then today, what a penny, a penny doesn't do anything.

So that's the difference between obviously the physical dollar amount and then the buying power. Every nation in the world operates with fiat money, which is a currency declared legal tender and not backed up by any physical commodity.

Its value depends on public perception and trust in the issuing government. The value of the dollar is manipulated through control of the money supply and interest rates. As Takano notes, fiat money is a currency of unlimited money violating a necessary characteristic of money, which is scarcity.

The supply is controlled by the central banks through fractional reserve banking. A 1951 pamphlet published by the Federal Reserve notes that the most important operation of banks, besides the safekeeping of money, is that banks can create money.

Fractional reserve banking is the system that allows this legalized counterfeiting. This system allows banks to retain only a fraction of their customers' deposits as reserves while issuing loans far exceeding those reserves.

A bank is a place where money is stored or accumulated, much like a snow bank is an accumulation of snow. Banking involves the storage and movement of money through credit loans and repayment. OK, so let's stop there.

Maybe there's two things at play here. So he's talking about fiat money, which isn't backed up by a precious metal, which obviously is different than Jesus's time. But at the same time, there obviously there is something there is some reason people are valuing the dollar.

There's a reason that even foreign tenders, legal tenders, are often tied to the dollar. It's the international unit of trade. And and I think that obviously the might of America's military, America's domination for the past 70 years in international affairs has led to this situation.

It's the stability of the American markets. You might think that's a funny joke, but it's compared to other countries, the United States has been more stable. And I've thought for years, we're near the end, we're in debt, we have inflation, something's going to break and everyone else is doing so much worse off, though.

So it's like it doesn't happen because we're still more stable. And it's really the good name of the United States that is backing up this currency, not in the force of American guns. So, yes, it's not backed up by gold.

And I would say that's incredibly unwise. But that's that's one issue. The other issue is this idea that banks can give out loans far exceeding the amount of money that they hold. And I don't know if you've ever seen the movie.

It's a Wonderful Life with Jimmy Stewart. But there's that moment where they have a run on the bank. Right. And everyone's trying to get their money out. And they can't because if everyone came at the same time to get their money out, the bank wouldn't have all the money because.

And George Bailey, remember, he explains to them, he goes, you can't do that because your money's in Sue's house and Sue's house, her money, Sue's money is in Ralph's house. And everyone's money is basically in these loans.

So if you it's not here. And and that's, I think, the second thing he's talking about is that this is, I guess what jumps out at me is like this is incredibly volatile. If you get into a situation like that, then you have a run on the bank that you this is obviously, you know, I think that movie was made with the Great Depression happening the previous 15 years or 20 years before that movie was made.

So it's like that's in the rear view mirror. People are thinking about that. And it's it's something that I know the greatest generation was very afraid would happen again, that there would be a run on banks and that the money wouldn't be there and banks would just start shutting down.

And then when they shut down, the question is, is the Fed or is the National Bank going to back up? Are they going to like like we saw in 2008 with these financial institutions that got the bailouts? You remember that?

Well, you probably I don't know if you remember that, but I remember it. And it was because the government just bailed them out. They just said, OK, we're just going to we're going to basically create money, right?

We're just going to issue the money, which devalues the currency. So this is incredibly unwise. It can land you in a bad spot. But in the it's like it's like sugar in the moment. It feels good. And it seems like, hey, you can expand your buying power here.

You can expand the kinds of things that people can put loans down on because you don't have to actually have the money in reserve there physically. That's that's what he's talking about. And I would agree those two things are very unwise.

And we're going to get into what scripture says about this. But anything to add to that is I was my best explanation as a non economist.

No, no, I thought that was good. I don't really think I have anything else of value to add. I'm sure, you know, things will come. But yeah, I think we should keep going with the article.

All right, let's do that. All right. So it says this in demand deposit banking, money is stored with a bank and the depositor receives a receipt such as a check or a demand deposit. Instead of redeeming the deposit for cash, the depositor can transfer it to make purchases under a full reserve requirement.

The amount of claims issued by the bank equals the amount of money stored. Thus, if a loan is made, an equivalent amount is unavailable for withdrawals until the loan is repaid. In contrast, fractional reserve banking allows banks to issue more claims than the money actually stored.

Banks are required to keep only a portion of their liabilities, i .e. deposits as reserves relative to the loans they issue. Congressman Wright Patman described fractional reserve banking during a March 21st 1960 congressional hearing.

And this is what he said. If I deposit a thousand with my bank and the reserve requirements imposed by the Federal Reserve are 10 percent, then the bank can make a loan to John Doe of up to nine hundred dollars.

Where does the nine hundred dollars come from? It does not come out of my deposit of one thousand. On the contrary, the bank simply credits John Doe's account with nine hundred. The bank can acquire government obligations by the same procedure.

By simply creating deposits to the credit of the government, money creating is a power of commercial banks. He says the reserve is not an actual cash reserve, but an accounting reserve. The difference between the bank's assets, its loans and its liabilities, i .e. its deposits.

All right. So to sum that up or to simplify it, what he's saying here is that and I'm trying to process it as I'm saying this. He's saying that if there's a loan for sorry, a deposit for a thousand dollars, then that person who made the loan that the bank doesn't need to take from that one thousand dollars to credit to credit the loan they can take.

So they can. In other words, they can make an accounting ledger and the money is just there. They just have to say it. Boof. It's it's in existence essentially. Right. And this kind of system benefits the people who are really good at finance, who see I don't know if you've seen those videos, Matt, where someone will walk up to a famous, important person who's successful and they'll say, hey, how do you make the money you make?

And it's a popular thing on like shorts on Instagram and stuff. And so I saw this one. It was a it was a financier, I guess. And someone walked up to him and said, so you're driving a nice sports car.

You have a nice suit. You tell me about how much money do you have to have to have the lifestyle that you have? And he goes, oh, I'm in debt. You know, basically he's negatives. And he goes, oh, that's so bad.

And the guy goes, oh, no, no. I love that because that's really good because debt is how I make money. I make money off of debt. That's my bread and butter, essentially. So he says the larger the debt, the more I like it, because that means there's I'm controlling more assets.

And that's I know real estate a little better. So in real estate, obviously, right now the interest rates are kind of high. But if you get involved in real estate and you start buying houses, let's say, and you start taking out loans to make the down payments on houses, now you've got debt on top of debt.

Well, if the housing market, if you if you are really good in real estate and the housing market is going to go up or you're investing in an area that the housing market's going to go up, then that debt's really good for you, I guess, because you you're making a bet.

You're essentially saying it and it is a gamble in a way. It's an educated gamble. But you are saying, I think that in this area, the value of these properties is going to exceed the interest that I'm paying and the loans that I've taken out.

I'm going to outgrow this. And so there's a unique set of skills that people have in finance that they're able to navigate that. Whereas someone who, let's say, is not into real estate or not into the stock market or not into any of those things, just a blue collar guy who meat and potatoes, right?

He does electrician or something. That person is at a disadvantage in this kind of a system because it's his money, essentially, that's in these banks, in these financial institutions that's being traded around and it's being used for loans on larger commodities and that kind of thing.

So anyway, there's a certain class of people that I think this benefits this kind of system. And Edmund Burke even talks about this a little bit, that he says, look, you got your finance capital and he goes, if your country becomes finance capital, that's basically that's an international kind of person that can live anywhere and they're not really restricted by borders and allegiances to the land, to the soil.

He goes, if you're going to have a stable country, though, you have to have a landed gentry. You have to have people that actually have tangible assets that they want to pass down over the course of generations.

And so they're competing interests and they're not the same. Well, we've become less landed gentry, I would say, and more finance capital because people can take advantage of these things and and use them.

So that's putting my two cents in there. I'll keep reading unless you have something, Matthew.

No, you can keep on going ahead. I was just looking further into the article, though, where he talks about inflation and then part of what he's going to continue on to is the exposition of not stealing and the Westminster Larger Catechism question 99, which kind of like I think like I skimmed the article before the podcast, but I'm starting to see that basically like part of what he's going to indict our system with is that it's going to be theft as like, you know, theft is like what is happening essentially to perpetuate the system, given like how they're going to be handling the money and giving out these loans.

And not only the loans, part of what you'll say is part of what you'll see in the exposition of the Eighth Commandment is the prohibition on usury, which is, you know, like part of what is happens and loans is you see like a ton of usury going on.

So I'm looking forward to seeing what he continues on with there. But I'm starting to like follow his argument pretty well.

All right. So he says, and as Murray Rothbard states, who's a big Austrian libertarian economist, commercial banks, that is fractional reserve banks, create money out of thin air. This increases the money supply and reduces the purchasing power of all existing dollars.

When you take a loan from a commercial bank, you directly contribute to inflation. So I have a house, I've got a loan, I've contributed to inflation. Henry Hazlitt notes that the original meaning of the word inflation is increasing the quantity of money and bank notes in circulation.

Rising prices are not inflation itself, but the observable effects of monetary inflation. Historically, when Caesar clipped coins or mixed them with base metals to create more coins from the same amount of gold, he inflated the money supply.

When people noticed their coins were lighter, they demanded more coins for purchases. As the money supply increases, the purchasing power of money decreases because more dollars chase the same amount of goods.

This leads to higher prices. I think that's pretty straightforward. I think people get that. That's how inflation is caused, by the way. So and when the government borrows, I mean, that's the obviously the largest form of inflation.

That's when inflation really gets going. And the government, of course, you know, we just had this big, beautiful bill. That was one of the arguments against it was this is actually going to increase the debt.

This is actually going to increase inflation and these kinds of things. Now, you know, we won't we don't have to get into whether it does or not. But that's that was one of the arguments. Thou shall not steal.

The Eighth Commandment, thou shall not steal, presupposes the right to personal property. The Westminster Larger Catechism provides a deeper exposition of this commandment, outlining both duties required and sins forbidden regarding the sins forbidden.

It states the sins forbidden in the Eighth Commandment. Besides the neglect of the duties required are theft, robbery, man stealing and receiving anything that is stolen, fraudulent dealing, false weights and measures, removing landmarks, injustice and unfaithfulness and contracts between man and man or matters of trust, oppression, extortion, usury, bribery, vexatious lawsuits, unjust enclosures and depopulations, engrossing commodities to enhance the price, monopolies or cornering, unlawful callings and other unjust or sinful ways of taking or withholding from our neighbor what belongs to him or of enriching ourselves, covetousness inordinate, prizing and affecting worldly goods, distrustful and distracting cares and studies in getting, keeping and using them, envying at the prosperity of others as likewise idleness, man, prodigality, wasteful gaming, i .e. gambling and all other ways whereby we do unduly prejudice our outward estate and defrauding ourselves of the due use and comfort of that estate, which God has given to us, Matthew.

Yeah, one of my favorite things about the Westminster Larger Catechism's expositions of the Ten Commandments is we oftentimes say that, you know, the entirety of the moral law is held within the Ten Commandments.

And you may look at that and be like, yeah, but like, you know, there's lots of moral duties that we have and there's only Ten Commandments. Well, if you really want to know everything that's in the Ten Commandments, look no further than the Westminster Larger Catechism.

Yeah, so it's very detailed on everything that's included in the implications behind the command to not steal. There's not just that one command. It's like all of the implications which are drawn out, which is given to us as like,.

What is your duty?

What is something you ought not do? And something that I thought of while I'm reading through that list is, especially with the author's claim that the system is sinful and that Christians ought not to participate in the system, is something I thought of that was interesting, is something that I'm PCA, but my fiance and her family, they attend, well, my fiance's family attends an OPC church.

She's with me at the PCA right now. But is something that the OPC does, and I don't know if this is the case for every OPC presbytery or for every OPC minister, but they will oftentimes like pay like a pastor's mortgage, you know, get them a house and pay the mortgage for them in their effort to support them in their ministry.

And I wonder how the author would feel about the presbytery itself funding this, because in order to do that, they obviously, you know, they most likely need to get the loan and all that. I don't think they're, you know, they're paying the mortgage, so they're not going to be buying the house just like upfront and things like that.

But it's interesting because it's like, to what extent, if we accept all the premises of like what the author is laying out in the article, are like, you know, churches would be indicted by this, presbyteries would be indicted.