The Persons of God, Pt. 1 (02/13/2005)

In recent days, we've been talking about the way that God exists.

Some people call it the Trinity, some people call it the Triunity. I think we'll call it the

Trinity because that's what it's best known as. And we began our study with an

Old Testament and New Testament study of the unity of God. If there's one thing that God made clear in his revelation of himself to the

Old Testament saints and the Israelites was that he is one

God and there is no other. He says there is no other savior. He says he will share not his name with another.

He says there was none formed before me nor no other God formed after me.

And so that is the background of this study and has to be because it is the way that God himself has revealed this to us in time.

He first revealed himself to us as one God. And this was in the light of a world that had become so polytheistic that everyone except the

Jewish people in that time believed that there were many, many gods. And so we studied with that background.

And we began to study in the New Testament some of the things that the

Bible said about the Lord Jesus comparing it to what it says about Jehovah in the

Old Testament. And we find that the Bible says Jehovah is the one Savior.

And then the New Testament says that Jesus' very name means God who saves or Jehovah who saves.

And his title, Emmanuel, means God with us. We talked about some of the scriptures such as 1

Timothy 3 .16 which says Jesus was God manifest in the flesh. That tells us who he is.

He is God manifest in the flesh. We talked about some passages in Colossians where it sums it up this way.

It says that Jesus was all of the fullness of the Godhead in a body.

And we talked about Isaiah 9, 6, and 7 where it says he's the everlasting father.

Very interesting verses to look at with the backdrop of the historical teaching on the

Trinity and the different creeds that you can go and read. And we're going to take a look at some of those this morning.

But what we want to begin to study this morning is to try to grasp an understanding of what is meant by the three persons of the

Godhead. What did they mean by this and what did they not mean by it? What does the Bible mean by it and what does it not mean by it?

And does the Bible teach it? That is the question. So let's have a word of prayer and we'll begin.

Father, we thank you for this day. We thank you so much for bringing us together to worship you and to think upon you and for you to teach us the meaning of many scriptures that we will look at today.

Lord, we thank you that you are our teacher and you can give us the sense of your word because you're the author of it.

And we know that you know the heart of God and the mind of God and you know our heart and mind.

And Lord, we thank you that you're among us today and within us to teach us your word. We pray in Jesus name.

Amen. Turn with me first to Matthew, chapter 28, verses 18 through 20.

As you study the history of the development of the doctrine of the Trinity, there are many around us today, especially among the

Messianic Jewish people who will argue that the Trinity was created by Constantine.

What would that be around the year what, 325, something like that, 312. The problem with that argument is that you can go back to 150 years after Christ and you can find them speaking of the same thing.

Remember the quote we gave from Tertullian last Sunday and a few Sundays before that, he was 150

AD, well before the time of Constantine. So Constantine did not invent the terminology that the fathers used.

In fact, these men were living so close to the time of the apostles that Tertullian's life only missed the end of John's life by about 50 years.

And so there's not any time to have a loss of understanding in what the very apostles taught and even what

Jesus himself taught. And so it's carried to us through each century from one church father to the next, and it does develop somewhat.

And the main reason there's a development is because there is a battle going on with heresies. There were heretics known as the

Gnostics. There were heretics known as the Arians that came along a little bit later, but it's all very early.

I mean, all this happened within the first three and 400 years after Christ. And so the church fathers were writing things and bringing their best minds together to word things in such a way as to battle against the heretics.

And what was interesting is they would write a certain creed of what the church believed. And if they weren't very, very specific with their words, the heretics would take the same creed and say, well, we believe this.

We believe this. Yes, we can. We can accept this because they wanted to be part of the whole thing.

They wanted to mix in and not be cast out or killed in that day. So they said, oh, yes, we can accept this.

So if they didn't get the words exactly right, they would write a creed that those who didn't even believe it could say, well, yeah, that's right, because they would play with the words.

They would redefine the words a little bit to say that they could accept that creed as well.

And so that battle is going on. And that's why there's a progression towards more and more specific language to try to describe how

God exists. And I still think Tertullian in 150

A .D. did a marvelous job and really all of them built upon that.

And of course, he was merely building upon what the apostles had taught and what Jesus had taught.

So that's how it develops now. We've spent a great amount of time discussing the unity of God and the fact that there is one

God and only one God. All of the church fathers believed that except for the

Aryans, who were branded as heretics and the

Gnostics, who were also branded as heretics because they were that was a good brand for them to have.

The Gnostics believe this, just to put it in the simplest form, they believe that God was one and they stress the unity of God so much that they said that everything else is other than God and so that everything else, therefore, is evil and unclean.

Therefore, the human body being one of those things is evil and unclean and therefore Jesus Christ could not possibly have truly dwelt within a real human body, nor could he have really died, nor could he have really resurrected or ascended, let alone ascend into heaven in a real human body.

So they did not believe in the literal manhood of Jesus Christ, nor did they believe he was

God, nor did they believe he had a literal body, nor a literal resurrection, nor ascension.

So that was fairly easy to battle because the scriptures just ripped that apart so easily.

The Aryans, on the other hand, were a little more difficult because they believe that Jesus, they would use the same words.

For example, they would say that he was the first begotten of God or the only begotten and they'll say that he was begotten before time and all those things are true.

The fathers believed the same and used the same words. Sometimes they meant different things though because the

Aryan actually really believed Jesus was a created being. So where did the

Jehovah's Witnesses and Mormons get their doctrine from? Was it new? Did they create it? Was it some new revelation from hell, although they think it would be from heaven?

No, they grabbed it from the first, second, third century when these heresies already existed. The Aryan heresy is nothing different than Jehovah's Witness.

And the Mormons believe that Jesus is the brother of Lucifer, that he is an angelic created being.

And so those were some of the heresies that existed in these church fathers. You had fathers on the west, which became the

Church of Rome, and then in the east, the Eastern Orthodox Church. And in both places, they would even come together and try to write down how

God exists. Now they wrote about other doctrinal issues too, but this is what we're studying. So we focus in on what they said about the existence of God.

They were battling these heresies. So we talked strongly about the unity of God.

The church fathers believed strongly that God was one God. Now the

Aryans considered the church fathers to be heretics because the Aryans said that the church fathers believed there were three gods,

God the Father, God the Son, God the Holy Spirit. And the Aryans were so strong in the unity of God that they could not bear to think that way, and they felt that that was heresy.

And so the fathers, and even going back as far as Tertullian, were very, very interested in showing that we believe there is one

God. They would always state that there is but one God. And then they would go on to try to discuss the distinction between the

Son, the Father, and the Holy Spirit within the background of that there is one

God. So now that's what they believed, but how to say it is another thing.

It's very difficult. How can you say there is one God, but there are three persons,

Jesus, the Father, and the Holy Spirit? And even today we have to be careful with the terminology because I believe that the word person has changed even from the day that the fathers were trying to use that word into the modern usage today, or at least our understanding of what a person is today is so different than what the

Greeks and even the Latin scholars would use in the Latin language to describe the word person.

So we'll talk about that a little bit. But they did believe that God was one God, we know that.

They believed that there was some distinction between the Son, and the Father, and the

Holy Spirit, and yet no distinction in essence. That they were made out of the same stuff, so to speak.

That they were truly God. They called it very God. So make no bones about that.

They believe there's one God, but that God subsists as three distinct persons. Well, let's look and see if we see any evidence in the

New Testament of the distinct persons. Let's talk about the persons.

Matthew 28, 18. This was one of the main verses used by the church fathers to battle the

Arians, but really not so much to battle the Arians as to battle the group that were called the

Modalists. And they're like the Jesus -only group today in the United Pentecostal Church of today.

They would call them Jesus -only. They believe that the unity of God is so strong that there's no way you can have three persons.

And so the fathers had to battle both sides, you see? They had to battle the side that believed there were three gods, or multiple gods.

And then they had to battle the group that said there's no difference, it's just Jesus -only.

Or it's just the Father -only. Or it's just the Spirit -only, but you can't have all three. They were battling both sides of that issue.

To battle the side, the group that said there cannot be three, they used this verse in other passages

I'll show you, Matthew 28, 18. And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given to me in heaven and in earth.

Go ye, therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the

Son, and of the Holy Spirit, or Holy Ghost, it's a translation of the

Greek word spirit. Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever

I have commanded you, and, lo, I am with you always, even unto the end of the age.

Now Jesus himself taught the three persons. Now I'm going to come back and define the word person before we finish, because that word itself is what

I believe confuses the modern church more than anything else. Because when we think of a person, we think of a different person.

When we think of a son, we don't think of Tyler back there as being

Arlen. He is a different person, isn't he? But now if you view it this way,

Tyler is man from man, just as Jesus is God from God.

Then they are both man. But we have a hard time thinking of them as two persons, but when we do, we mean two different persons entirely.

So we have a hard time conceiving of how can you have three persons but one God? So as we look at the

Greek and the Latin usage of the word person later, it'll help us a little bit, because we have to look at what did they mean when they said the word?

What did they mean by it when they said there are three persons? We have to look at how they defined the word person back in that day, but one thing we know is that Jesus taught very clearly that there was a person called the

Father. There was a person called the Son, and a person called the

Holy Spirit, and he said when you baptize people, baptize them in the name. Isn't it interesting it doesn't say in the names of the

Father? See, if you use proper grammar, I would have to say baptize them in the names of Raymond, Russell, and Arlen.

If I'm going to name three people, I have to say names if they're different people.

But Jesus said the name, and then named three persons, but used the singular.

It's almost the opposite of the Old Testament usage of Elohim where it's one God, but it's a plural word.

I mean it's the same thing, it's just showing that this is difficult to talk about in human language.

It's difficult. For God to put how he exists down on paper for us to understand is impossible for anyone except for God.

And even God has made it to be so that he must put it in terms we understand because we cannot understand his language.

So at least not yet. But isn't it interesting that he baptized in the name of the

Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit? There are people who claim that that verse is not found in the most ancient

Bibles, and they will use verses, let me see if I can give you an example of one.

Let's try Acts 19 .4.

They'll use Acts 19 .4 to try to prove that Matthew 20, 18, 19, and 20 was added later by a

Trinitarian scribe, and that Jesus never said it that way.

And in Acts 19 .4, it says, Then said Paul, John barely baptized with the baptism of repentance, saying unto the people that they should believe on him which should come after him, that is, on Christ Jesus.

When they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. It does not say in the name of the

Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit, it says they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. And they'll say that is how they were baptized, and there's no such thing as Matthew 28, 19, it was inserted much later by a scribe.

Well, there are two problems with that. First problem is every ancient manuscript has

Matthew 28, 18, 19, and 20 in it. I've spent a good couple of years of my life studying manuscript evidence, and to say that it doesn't exist in the oldest manuscripts is an out lie.

It's in all of the manuscripts. It's also quoted by all the church fathers as far back as 150

AD, so it was in their Bible. So there's a problem with that theory. And the second thing is if you just look at Acts 19 .4

and 5 in context, it's clear what it's saying. Then said Paul, John baptized with the baptism of repentance, and said to the people, believe on him that comes after me.

When they heard this, they were baptized in the name of Jesus. You see, it's a contrast between the baptism of John and the baptism of Jesus.

What was the baptism of Jesus? The baptism of Jesus was baptize them in the name of the

Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit, as opposed to John baptizing them unto repentance and to believe in the one that's coming later.

It's just a contrast between John's baptism and Jesus' baptism. It's not a formula that was used at the baptism.

Matthew 28, 18, and 19, Jesus gives us the formula. And you can go into any church today, anywhere in the world, when they baptize someone, they will always say,

I baptize you, my brother, in the name of the Father, or my sister, in the name of the Father, the Son, and the

Holy Spirit. And it's been that way since Jesus uttered his words in Matthew 28, 18, 19, and 20.

So you cannot escape it. It teaches this. The Bible teaches that the formula is Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.

So Jesus himself taught that there are three personages, otherwise, why would he say, not just say, baptize in the name of God?

Well, he could have. In fact, there is a place where he does say that. But it's interesting that there's a verse that says, baptize them in the name of the

Lord. And you would find that in Acts chapter 10, verse 47, and 48, you don't really have to look that one up, but it just simply says they were commanded to be baptized in the name of the

Lord. So the name of the Lord is Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.

Isn't that interesting? The one name, the name of the

Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. So this was the groundwork that they used to begin to prove that there are three persons within the

Godhead, within the one God. Now, let me take you to another one. Now, let's point out, then, if we're going to say there are three persons, why would they even say it?

First of all, because there are three designations in the

Bible. The Bible designates God as the Father, it designates him as the

Son, and it designates him as the Holy Spirit. So, since there are three designations, or we might call them names, they're not exactly names, but they're designations,

I'm going to wait until, is he okay? All right, stay back there,

Matt, don't keep coming up to the front, please, sir. Three designations is the first reason.

Now let's go to Luke 3, 21, Luke chapter 3, verse 21. There's another reason why they spoke of God as existing as three distinct persons.

First, because three designations. There is one called the Father, there is a person called the Son, there is a person called the

Holy Spirit. None of us would debate that you can prove that the

Holy Spirit is a person, not a thing, would we? Now, there was a heresy in the first century where, in fact, it was the

Gnostics that taught that the Holy Spirit was an energy force, that he was not a personal being.

We don't debate that because there's too many, many verses where it talks of the Holy Spirit speaks of him as having things that a person has, such as the ability to think, the ability to speak, and so forth.

All right, so we don't debate that today, but that was one of the earlier debates. Now, Luke 3, 21 gives us another reason, a second reason for the three distinctions.

Let's read it. Now, when all the people were baptized, it came to pass that Jesus, also being baptized and praying, the heaven was opened and the

Holy Ghost descended in a bodily shape, like a dove upon him.

Now let's clear this up. The word Holy Ghost and the word Holy Spirit are identical in the Greek language. There's even a group nowadays, still today, that writes little articles and pamphlets saying that there's a different person of the

Holy Spirit and a different person called the Holy Ghost, and those are two different persons. That's ridiculous. It's the same word in the

Greek, so it's not two different entities or people or anything. It's the same. So always think when you see

Holy Ghost, it's a synonym of Holy Spirit. And so the Holy Spirit, here we have

Jesus in the water being baptized by John the Baptist. At the same time Jesus is physically in the water, we see the

Holy Ghost descending in a bodily shape like a dove upon him.

It doesn't say it was a dove. It says it was something that looked like a dove or that it descended like a dove would descend, but this was none other than the

Holy Spirit. And while that's happening, there's a third thing happening.

A voice comes from heaven, which says, Thou art my beloved son, in thee

I am well pleased. And Jesus was about 30 years of age, it says.

Now that verse goes on to say he was, Jesus himself began to be about 30 years of age being as was supposed the son of Joseph.

Why does it say as was supposed the son of Joseph? Because the

Holy Spirit was his father, not Joseph. So we see a lot in that little three verses.

It speaks of the distinctions of the persons because Jesus was called the son of God.

He was physically in the water. At the same time, the Father's voice came from heaven, another place.

At the same time, the Holy Spirit descended in the form of a dove or in the form that looked like a dove, which was another, yet another place.

And so now we have God existing in three distinct domains at the same time.

Now one of the heresies of the modalists,

I can understand the modalist belief because the modalists believe that God existed in three modes, but it was one

God. In other words, they believe that when you look at Jesus, you're seeing the same one God, but he's manifest in the flesh, in the human body, same

God. Now what is wrong with that belief? Well, there's really nothing at all wrong with that belief, except that they had to add this.

The modalist, the true modalist, as you study it, believed that God could only be in one place at one time.

So if you were looking at Jesus, that is all there is of God, and there is no Father who could speak from heaven.

There is no Holy Spirit who could descend as a dove because there is all of God. That's the Jesus -only people.

That's true modalism. True modalism is a heresy because it believes that God only exists as Jesus.

And there is an extension of that heresy that says, okay, but later he changed and now he only exists as the

Holy Spirit. But it eliminates the other two persons at one time.

You can only have one God, so therefore there's only one, it's either Jesus or it's the Holy Spirit or it's the Father, but it's never three at once.

Well, what do they do with Luke 3, 21 through 23? What do they do with that passage?

They have to rip it out of their Bible, but it is the very passage that proves that that form of modalism is a heresy.

It's false. It doesn't line up. Anything that doesn't line up with the scriptures is a heresy. Because here we see

Jesus in the water, who was all the fullness of the Godhead bodily, but we see the

Holy Spirit descending upon him at the beginning as the anointing of his earthly ministry.

He was 30 years old and was about to have a three -year ministry on the earth, and he was anointed with the fullness of God.

He had the Holy Spirit without measure from this time forth. And there we see both in the same vicinity, but not exactly in the same place.

There's one coming down, there's one in the water. So we see a distinction, and yet we see the distinction at the same time, in space and time.

And then we hear a voice from heaven, which is the Father. So there is a different domain at the same time.

So that destroys the heresy of modalism. It shows that God exists as three somethings.

Now are we going to call it persons? If that's difficult for us, then let's define that later.

But at least three distinct somethings, because you have them in three different domains and you have them with three different names.

So there's two reasons that they talked about the three persons. We'll use their terminology, but we'll have to look and see what they meant by it.

Now, if you go into Luke 9, verse 33, you see yet another example, a very good example.

And there are many, many examples, by the way. I'm just giving you the ones that the fathers would go to first.

They felt like this was their greatest ammunition, so they went to these first. Luke 9, 33, and he came to pass as they departed from him.

Peter said unto Jesus, Master, it is good for us to be here, and let us make three tabernacles, one for you, one for Moses, and one for Elijah, and then it says, not knowing what he said.

Now what is it that Peter didn't understand that he had said that was incorrect? It says not knowing what he said.

That means he didn't understand he was saying something wrong. Here we have the transfiguration story, and Jesus is transformed to look like he looks now after the death, burial, resurrection, and ascension in his glorified state.

He was transformed or transfigured to look that way, and when that happened,

Peter, not knowing what to say, and all of a sudden, he sees these other two personages that are here with Jesus, Moses and Elijah, and he says, well, let me build three tabernacles, one for you,

Jesus, one for Moses, one for Elijah, not knowing what he said. What was it he said wrong? He is putting

Jesus on the same category or in the same category as just a prophet.

He said, oh, well, I have three prophets here, three great prophets, let's build them each a tabernacle to be comfortable in, and he's putting

Jesus on the same level as just simply two men of the

Old Testament who were prophets, very good men, very men greatly used of God, and in their glorified bodies, but not on the same level.

That's the first mistake Peter made, and then it goes on and says, while he was still speaking, he was corrected by the father himself.

Now, poor Peter. Peter was always getting in trouble, wasn't he? Do you know what it was that usually got him in trouble?

His mouth. He would speak things before really thinking them through.

There's a lesson in that for us, for some of us more than others, is we get a great idea and we just spurt it out, and then we realize three seconds later, well,

I forgot about one thing, that's really not a good idea, I left one little element out, you know, I wish I hadn't said that, and you can't really take it back.

Well, he gets corrected by the father himself while he thus spake, while he's in the midst of saying, hey, this is a great idea, let's put

Jesus on the same level with Moses and Elijah, there came a cloud and overshadowed all of them, and they feared as they entered into the cloud, so the cloud comes over them and consumes them, and Peter was fearing more than any of them probably, and there came a voice out of the cloud saying, this is my beloved son, hear him, and the other two disappeared, no more

Moses, no more Elijah, only the glorified son of God, and the father saying, hear him now.

Don't hear the prophets now. God has in former times in diverse manner spoken unto us by the prophets, but in these last days he hath spoken unto us by his son, that but is very important, there's a difference, in the

Old Testament times God spoke through dreams and visions and prophets, the New Testament time he does not speak that way, he speaks through his son only, and so God the father made this very clear, and he speaks of his beloved son, who is a different designation in a different place, because the son was standing on the earth, the father spoke from heaven in this particular place, it doesn't mention the

Holy Spirit, it did in the other place though at the baptism of Jesus, so it definitely shows the distinction in a place and in designation or name, whatever you would like to call it.

Now there is a third reason that they talked about the distinctions of the persons, so if we say there is a distinction in designation and a distinction in domain, there's also a distinction in delegation, and let's look at Mark chapter 13 verse 32,

I'm going to show you two or three little verses that show this very clearly, a distinction in delegation, or if you wanted to use a

Bible word, it won't make a lot of sense to us until we read the verse in a minute, but we can say a distinction in delivery, and I'll show you it'll make sense in a minute, it's actually the word used in the

Bible, designation, I'm sorry, delegation or delivery, a difference or a distinction in delegation or delivery,

Mark 13 verse 32, but on that day and that hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels which are in heaven, neither the son but the father.

Now there is a distinction here in delegation because if we hold that the son and the father are one

God, which we have to hold that based on the study we spent three weeks studying already, we cannot eliminate all of the verses where he says

I am one God, I share not my name with another, there is no other, and I'm the only

Savior, we cannot eliminate those, so we must believe there's one God, so therefore if there's one

God, we see however clearly that there is one here called the son, and there is one here called the father, and one of them knows information that the other one doesn't know, how do we deal with that?

Well, the modalist can't deal with it, so they just can't deal with that, they don't know how to deal with it, the

Mormon types that come all the way back from the Gnostics and so forth deal with it by saying well there are many gods,

Jesus is just a littler God than the father, he is a God but he's not the

God, they even use John 1 1 where it says in the beginning was the word, the word was with God, the word was

God, in the Greek it has the article a, the word was a God, and they say see that proves it, the problem is everywhere it uses the word

God in the Greek, it uses that article because that's how the Greeks say the word God, so it doesn't prove that but they try to use that because they cannot understand how can the son and the father be one

God and yet not know the same information, well it's because there is a different delegation, let's read another verse before we try to explain that, look at Luke chapter 1 verse 32,

Luke 1 32 says he shall be great, did I get that right, did

I get the verse right, he shall be great and shall be called the son of the highest and the

Lord God shall given to him the throne of his father David, this is a distinct purpose that is delegated to the son which is not going to be something that the father does or the

Holy Spirit does, it is a particular, I strive for words, could we call it a duty, doesn't really fit

God to call it a duty, could we call it a ministry, not quite, so I called it a delegation,

I don't know what word to pick, you can help me with that perhaps, but it's a different, speaking as a man, it's a different job to do, the son has a particular job to sit on the throne of David during the thousand year millennial period that has been delegated to him not to the father, not to the

Holy Spirit, it has, well let's look at another one, look at I believe this would be

Luke chapter 1 verse 34, I hope I have the chapter correct, this is yours begin, then said

Mary unto the angel, okay, how shall this be seeing I know not a man and the angel answered and said unto her the

Holy Ghost, the Holy Spirit shall come upon thee and the power of the highest shall overshadow thee, therefore also that holy thing which shall be born of thee be called the

Son of God, the Holy Spirit had a particular thing delegated to him to do and it was to be the father of the

Lord Jesus Christ, there was no human father, so he came upon Mary and he created life in her womb without a human male, it was not the father who did that, it was the

Holy Spirit, so it was his delegation to do that. Now as we look at this, it not only says the

Holy Spirit shall come upon thee but the power of the highest shall overshadow thee, so the

Holy Spirit is the highest, so he is God but he has a distinct role to play in the person of the

Holy Spirit and this is just one of many examples, you could also talk about the role of the paraclete, the comforter,

Jesus said it's expedient for you that I go because unless I go I cannot send the comforter to you, so that's the

Holy Spirit coming in the role that designated, delegated role of being the comforter just like Jesus was their comforter when he walked with them, when he had to be gone physically he sent another comforter likened to myself, comforter likened to myself called the

Holy Spirit who will do the same thing I did only in a way better because I was with you but he shall be in you

Jesus said and so I just worded it this way, there are reasons why the church fathers talked about three distinct persons, one was because they had three designations, father, the son, the

Holy Spirit, second and Jesus named them all in the baptistry words that are used in baptism, secondly because they have three different domains at the same time, one can be in one place another in another place and another outside of space and time that's the father all at one time and yet three distinct domains and thirdly because they can have distinct delegated things that they do that the others don't do and yet they all participate and so these are the reasons that I see that they spoke in the terminology that they did, look with me at Luke chapter 10 verse 21 we're about out of time we are out of time this morning so I'm going to let you think about it for a week what the word person really means, what the word person really in its base meaning means, does it have to mean that because there are two persons that they have to be different like Russell and I are, that we are different beings so think about that we'll get to the

Greek and Latin definitions next week, well let me close this morning's with Luke chapter 10 verse 21 follow along with me,

I want you this is this is important to understand, in that hour Jesus rejoiced in spirit and said

I thank thee O father Lord of heaven and earth, now here you have one person talking to the other at the same time you have one called the son speaking to one called the father this is why they talk about two distinct persons, so Jesus rejoiced in spirit you could say there's the third person the spirit the

Holy Spirit within Jesus causing him to rejoice and he says

I thank thee O father Lord of heaven and earth that thou hast hid these things from the wise and the prudent and has revealed them unto babes, it teaches us that any understanding of the

Trinity whatsoever is not going to be understood by the wise and the prudent because they're going to think so hard philosophically that they're going to talk themselves out of believing this could possibly exist this way, there's no way

God could be one God and three distinct persons at the same time therefore I reject it because my logic will not allow it, it says very clearly

Jesus thank God he said I thank you that you've made it that way only the babes can understand it what does that say about us intellectually, we're we are babes in the sense that we trust

God when God says something we just trust that's the way it is we don't have to totally understand it to believe it do we it's like brother

Otis has said so many times we believe first and then we see facts later that's the opposite of the way the world does it so the world the prudent the wise are going to reproach it trying to say prove that to me first that doesn't make any sense therefore

I cannot believe it, now he goes on and says even so father for so it seemed good in thy sight all things are delivered to me of my father

Jesus said now you have a distinction there but you also have a sameness in the sense that the things are owned by both the same things that are possessed by the father are possessed by the son now that is going to lead us into some of the

Latin and Greek understanding of the Trinity a little bit later next week where we start to talk about some of the legal concepts of what goes on in a courtroom and they use those to try to teach this and a

Trinity to them was a legal term that meant three persons that own the same exact thing well so the theologians took that to say okay the father son the

Holy Spirit are three persons that own the same thing and that thing is the essence of God they have the same essence they're of the same stuff therefore they are one

God and so Jesus said he's delivered to me all things are delivered to me of my father no man knoweth who the son is now look at this but the father and who the father is but the son and he to whom the son will reveal him no human can understand the way

God exists unless Jesus revealed it to you no human can understand who

Jesus is unless the father draws you to the son so the father must draw you to the son or you will not know who he is you'll think he's just a prophet like Peter said he was you know he's just like Elijah he's just powerful prophet he's like Moses he's like Muhammad he's like Buddha you know

I get so fearful when I hear our president mentioned the Koran in the same sentence with the

Bible like he's done a couple of times I don't know who's writing that in the speech very politically correct but it's also very wrong it's like building a tabernacle for Jesus Elijah and Moses and putting them in the same level but he just doesn't know better pray that the men around him and he himself will be in the

Word enough where he won't do that now only

Jesus can reveal the father to us only the father can reveal Jesus to us and he turned and to his disciples and said privately blessed are the eyes which see the things that ye see for I tell you that many prophets and kings have desired to see those things which you see and have not seen them and to hear those things which you hear and have not heard them that tells us the

Old Testament people did not understand the Trinity nor did they view God in a

Trinitarian viewpoint whatsoever they could not see that they saw one

God period no person one person they saw one God in one person they struggled with what

Elohim meant they never could figure it out so they just dropped it when

Jesus was born in the manger and God was manifest in the flesh and the fullness of the power of the

Holy Spirit men's eyes began slowly to be open to a more mature revelation of God to us and that is a more mature revelation of how he is one

God subsisting in three distinct persons as long as you understand what the word person means we'll study that next

Sunday let's stand if you're not careful with that word person all of a sudden you've created three gods again so it's very important to be here next

Sunday you want to be here next Sunday let's pray father we thank you for the day together we thank you for Tyler being with us today in the safe passageway into this world that you gave him and the protection of my daughter and thank you for that we thank you

Lord that you are with each of us in power and Providence and nothing happens by accident we ask you to be with Russell's granddad today and help him emotionally but also physically give the doctor's wisdom to know what to do in his life this time and family great wisdom as well and we ask you to bless our fellowship time and our meal together in Jesus name