Miracles, Signs, Wonders, and the Trinity with Justin Peters

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00:28

Let's try it one more time. Good evening. We are live and this is not Andrew Rappaport.

00:33

This is a Pastor Justin Pierce. I must've hit the wrong video clip to intro.

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And just me and a few people we know here tonight wanna really welcome everybody to come in.

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Hope you're ready to have a really good conversation. Justin's gonna be in about 10 minutes or so.

00:53

He's running a few minutes behind. He was power lifting or something. I don't know what he's been doing.

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So he's not here. Andrew's not here either. Just kind of give a quick update.

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He went back down to Florida. He went back down to see his mother and praise

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God, he got a opportunity to witness to her. She actually let him share the gospel with her.

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And we're just praying that God will have his will in her life and that God will be gracious in saving her soul.

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And if you'd pray for that, that'd be wonderful. We've had, let's see,

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I got brother Josiah back in the back. I'm gonna pull him up here, brother. How are you doing? Better than I deserve.

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That's the common phrase I keep hearing you say all the time too. It's better than I deserve.

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Well, it's because I'm a horrible sinner who has broken all of God's laws and God graciously sent his son, the

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Lord Jesus Christ, fully God, fully man to dine across, pay the penalty for my sin. And because I've repented and trusted in him,

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I'm forgiven. All my sins are washed away by his grace. Amen, that's right, without a doubt.

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So we have Justin gonna be in here in just a few minutes, but before we have

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Justin come in, I've got something kind of funny to share with you. And so for everybody, you need to watch this.

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I think you'll enjoy it. Let's see, let's pull this up here. So this is an Instagram account from Beth Moore.

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She says, brace yourselves. Today, I was having lunch with some staff and I told them someone had just asked if I had any pictures from any aerobics teaching days.

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And I lamented that I couldn't find one. We didn't have cell phones and the like at that time and nobody thought to bring a camera.

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It was a workout, not a photo op. The moment

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I was, I said it, my coworker Sabrina replied, I've got a video.

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And so she plays it. So just kind of give you what's going on here for the audio portion. For those that are handicapped with the video portion.

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So here you go. She says, you gotta be kidding me. And she plays it and she says, she nearly can't stop laughing because apparently she taught five classes a week at the

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Houston's First Baptist Church. And let's see, this is for your, she put it out there and said, everybody it's funny and for enjoyment.

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So this is Beth Moore. And only thing

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I can do is think flash dance or something like that. I just like, okay, that's all

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I can think of. I just, I don't know what to think. Anyway, so that's your entertainment for tonight.

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That was something else. I couldn't believe I, actually you won't believe who sent that to me.

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Who sent that to you? Justin Pierce. He said, he's like, you've got to see this.

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Wow. I'm surprised she didn't delete it. Oh yeah. I mean, no, she put it out there, but she's very proud of that though.

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You got to think she's extremely proud of the, you know, Chris, Chris Honnold's.

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He says, I'm pretty sure I'd throw a hip out trying those moves. She looks like she's in her twenties or something.

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Yeah. Yeah, definitely much younger, but you know, you think about it, that's when you have that type of Christianity in the church and I'm not saying anything wrong with, you know, exercising by any means, but when you have the type of Christianity in the church, that's part of your, you know, your activity.

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You know, I was teaching this as part of the classes, the yoga classes and all these others. Ah, there's a brother.

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I'll bring brother Justin in. Hey brother, how you doing? Hey guys. Doing well. How are y 'all? Doing good.

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I'm better than I deserve. You made it here. You made it here. I made it. Yeah, I made it.

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So I just played the video. Do you want to see it again? Sure. The video? Yeah.

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Okay. I just, I just played it. So let's see. I got to pull it back up. Give me just a second.

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So this was the, the Beth Moore video. I'm going to let you. Oh. Let you pull some comment on it.

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Oh man. I'm, I'm thinking the only thing

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I can think of is splash dance. I just like, maybe, maybe Kevin Bacon.

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There you go. Yeah. I mean, what do you say that?

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That's not even something that people had to go digging for. She put that up herself. Yeah. She put that out there.

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Yeah. I thought that was. She's narcissistic in the extreme, in the extreme.

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Joanne says that looks like a rain dance. Oh man.

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Well, you know, and you think about it though, we were just saying, she said that she taught those classes five days a week at a

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Baptist church in Houston. I just, you know, I mean, we have churches all over the place where, where Christians are teaching yoga.

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They're teaching, you know, all kinds of different things, but there's not much gospel. There's not much, you know, doctrine or theology in there.

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It's, you know, and Beth Moore is prime example of that. So. Oh yeah.

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Yeah, totally. I tell people Beth Moore has never been, she's never been sound, but her, her, her teaching was, let's say less bad 20 years ago than what it is now.

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She's gotten progressively worse. I mean, she's going the exact opposite direction that you would expect a biblically qualified Bible teacher to be going.

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I mean, I hope that the Lord allows me to live another 10, 20 years. I would hope that 10, 20 years from now, my teaching will be better than it is today.

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Yeah. And that's what you would expect just from accumulated understanding of scripture. That's, that's what you would expect, but hers, she's going the wrong direction.

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She's getting progressively worse. Yeah, I totally agree. You know, and that's one thing

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I was thinking is, is that the, as she's gotten older, she has worked harder to find herself in the word of God.

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Then she has trying to find the God in the word. Oh yeah. Yeah. I mean, that's, that's what

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I, I mean, I don't know what you think about that, but it's just like, I was thinking everywhere she's, she sees her doctrine, her theology, what she believes, you know, steeped in the word of God.

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And I think that's, that's terrifying. If y 'all, did y 'all remember the tweet she had, this was a few years ago, but about Noah, what she said about Noah?

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Oh my word. Talk amongst yourselves while I try to pull this off, Google it real quick. Oh, please find it.

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Yes, please do. And see if I can pull this up. I thought you were going to bring up the thing that she said about, there's this one pastor saying, women keep your body parts to yourselves and to your husbands.

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And she's saying, we don't want to hear about your unders. And then the what guy, he posted a video from her saying, don't be a mean girl and keep yourself for your husband.

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Well, and think about that. Oh, Priscilla Shrier has commented on this

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Instagram thing. But, but think about this. She was talking about, I wore leotards and tights and shorts.

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So I figure I must have either been guest teaching somewhere or leading a seminar and needed to go that, that takes some extra steps for modesty's sake.

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So that's what's in this Instagram. Was this part of the seminar that she was teaching?

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Is that the way I'm understanding this? And, you know, it's like, well, okay. Yeah, maybe she needed the extra money or having something like that.

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I don't know. But she's talking about for modesty's sake. Well, wait a minute. It's okay for her to talk about modesty, but if anybody else does it, you know, you need to keep your mouth shut.

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How dare you mansplain and all that. But that's what happens when you go woke.

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That's what happens when you get into social justice is, truth is not what's important.

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It's whoever is speaking. They, you know, and their life experiences and their, you know, cultural identification or whatever, that's what matters.

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Not the content, but who it is who's doing the speaking. So, I mean, as you said, Beth Moore said the same thing as this pastor did.

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His name escapes me right now, but this, she was saying the same thing 12, 13 years ago.

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But when he says it, oh, he's a sexist, you know, mind your own unders. So, I mean, she is the epitome of narcissism and hypocrisy.

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She's a false teacher. I have absolutely no hesitation whatsoever calling

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Beth Moore a false teacher. Yeah, and I don't blame you there. It's like, when you're trying to have a discussion about Beth Moore, you have nine times out of 10, somebody's going to be, how dare you say anything bad about Beth Moore?

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I remember 14 or 20 years ago when she was this or she did that, and you're going, well, yeah.

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14, 20 years, she's still bad. Her theology and doctrine was still off, but it was harder to find, you know, and that's the truth of it.

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Yeah. I'm going to try to send this over to myself so I can let everybody see it. Okay, yeah,

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I sent a text to that too to see if there's some way you can get it on the screen, but this is a - Yeah, give me just a second, and then

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I can, that's one thing I like about Dropbox. So, yeah, he's, let's see,

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I think I've got it sent to me. So we have a full and wonderful show.

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There it is. There it is. We got a full and wonderful show.

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We're going to really try to have - Is it just going to be the three of us tonight?

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No Anthony or Andrew? Well, Anthony's, you know, just, he's lost his mind and, you know, he just, no,

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I'm just kidding. I don't know where he's at. I don't know where he's at. So it's -

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He's at a church in Florida, I think teaching there. Yeah. Oh, he's teaching in Florida, okay.

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Yeah, and Andrew actually went back down to Florida. I don't know if you saw it or not, but he was able to share the gospel with his mother,

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I guess this afternoon or something like that. Oh, good, good.

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So praise God for that. Let me see. I actually pulled this up finally. I told

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Andrew, even if his, you know, if his mother dies lost, he'll have the blessing of having a clear conscience knowing that he's shared the gospel with her.

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So yeah, so this is, so this is Beth Moore.

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See, this was a few years ago, actually about five years ago, I think it was 2017, but she says, we've got this

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Noah instinct, this driving us to build arcs and shut ourselves in with our own kind.

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Then we shut ourselves further in with our phones. Then we get claustrophobic, bored and wonder why.

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Open a window and watch a dove with an olive, watch for a dove with an olive tree. There's a life out there.

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Okay. What are you talking about? That's what she gets from Noah?

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Like, okay, so. Well, I see Jesus Radar as one off the charts.

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Right? I mean, it's like, it's like hitting the peg. I mean. Well, but think about it too though, when you're so self -centered that you would say that, that, you know, that you only see the naturalistic, you know, trimmings of that passage.

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You know what I'm saying? I mean, yeah. Okay. There was, there was trees. There's an olive twig, but what was it a sign of?

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It was a sign that the judgment had come to an abatement and the whole world had died.

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Right. I mean, being in the arc, that was a good thing. Oh yeah.

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If you had been living in this day and age, that's where you had wished you had been was in the arc.

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That was a good thing to be in the arc. And she makes it out like it's a bad thing, having this

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Noah instinct and we build arcs and then we get claustrophobic. And I mean, you gotta be kidding me.

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That, and see, that's why I say she's getting worse. I mean, she's getting worse.

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That is such a, that is looney tunes. It is, it takes far more effort to come up with an interpretation of a passage of scripture that bizarre than it would to just read it and understand it for what it is.

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I mean, you've gotta work hard to get it that wrong. Yeah. You know, and that's the thing is if you think about it, it's not that hard to look and I'm not trying to simplify it to this point, but if you look at the

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Bible, it's not that hard to look at the clear text of scripture. You know, there's an old saying that it's so shallow, the theological doctrinal issues are so shallow that a child can swim in it.

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Yet there's so much debt to it that a theologian, you know, will never reach the bottom. I may have messed up the exact quote, but think about this.

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When you intentionally try to be shallow, you're basically slapping God in the face. You're saying,

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God, I don't care what you say. You know, to the authors, I don't care what you say.

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The authorial intent doesn't matter. Right. Right. And I was,

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I was - That's why I spend my whole time in this book with arguing for her. I was just about to do the same thing. Noziah did not put me up to this.

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Since we're talking about hermeneutics, I just like, this is a, there we go. This is a handy little, short little book too, but it's really, really good, you know, kind of a quick reference, hermeneutical.

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So anyway, go ahead, Noziah. Oh, well, I appreciate you holding it up too, but this booklet, it's about 20 some page, it's 20 pages.

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And what it does is it takes, it gives you a well -reasoned argument for interpreting the

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Bible as the authors intended it to. You might notice this is me on the cover.

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I was thinking of putting Joel Osteen on the cover because my opening illustration is a Joel Osteen Bible study.

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What you do is you sit in a chair, put a blindfold over your eyes, pretend what's in the

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Bible, you're reading the Bible, and then go up on a platform that says, this is my Bible, I am what it says

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I am, I do what it says I do, and then go off and never touch it again. Right.

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Oh yeah. Right. Yep. Yeah. Yeah. Absolutely.

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Then it gives the gospel at the end by exegeting John 3, 16. Yeah, it's a good little book.

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That's what I love about it. It argues for it and it presents it in a very clear, concise way.

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Okay. So here comes the big question. Humble Clay says, where can we get your book?

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It's available. You can get it by, last time I checked with Andrew, he said, if you buy anything from Striving for Eternity, you can pretty, you can, you'll get the booklet with whatever you purchase.

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So if you buy my first book, When My Ox Scores My Neighbor, using permits travel from Mount Sinai to Mount Zion, which is also another short book that demonstrates how to use hermeneutics.

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Then you can also get the booklet, What Does It Mean to Me?

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And I know Justin Peters, you sell them when you go places. And it's also available at, it's also available at amazon .com.

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And I don't really have the means to sell them personally, but I try to get it to where you can get it.

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Well, just to be clear too, on Amazon, it's not like we're going to run out.

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If you're not going to run out, they'll print them. So guys, they're really good. They're really good resources.

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My wife just brought me a drink, isn't it? Oh, well, that's nice. Such a good wife. That's okay.

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I was dying of thirst and I said, I said, I better get something to drink. And I saw that you got that. And I thought, huh?

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Oh, you got Chick -fil -A. I got me a Chick -fil -A drink. I love their - That's cold blooded to put

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Chick -fil -A in front of a man who lives in a state that nearest Chick -fil -A is like seven hours away.

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Wow. I would drive you one, man. I'll drive one to your house. It's persecution.

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Oh man, that's, somebody must really be mad at you for not having one around there. Yeah, we got someone watching from Australia.

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Oh. Oh yeah? Yeah, Joe Kobe. Kobe? Okay, yeah, let's pull him up. Yeah, absolutely. Joe, say hi.

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Joe, hey brother. Thank you for tuning in. Thank you for your kind words. Absolutely.

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Blessings to you and your family. Absolutely. That's wonderful. Well, you're, let's see, we're about 20 minutes in.

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So let's go ahead and get started with a little bit of our discussion here. We have some things to talk about.

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So we titled this, or I titled this today, Miracles, Signs, Wonders, and the Trinity.

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And the reason that we did that is we've had a lot of people coming in lately talking about the signs that they have, the spiritual gifts they have, speaking in tongues and all these other things.

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And one thing that I've, in the seminar I've been studying a lot of is the ministry of Jesus Christ.

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Okay? And not only his personal ministry, but his ministry to his disciples and the ones around him.

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And there are some issues when it comes to people making claims that they have the ability to, you know,

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God gives them revelation. You know, Justin, you talk about it all the time. God told me this,

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God told me that. So I want to talk about those things quickly about God told me.

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What is this? We're talking about divine revelation. And I want to ask you this.

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Can God give you a revelation of something, an event or a prophecy or something that's to come without it being authoritative, without it being as authoritative as the word of God itself?

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It's interesting that you had kind of like the part B to that. So my initial thought, when you said, can God, I thought you were going to say, can

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God speak to us or can God - I knew you were going to say that. If it stopped there, I would say, well, yes, he can.

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He does have the ability. The question is, is he doing those things?

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But since you said, can he give, I mean, some people may have heard me say,

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God could speak to me through a leprechaun in my refrigerator if he wanted to. He has the ability, but I've got no reason to think he will.

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And a lot of reasons to think that he won't. But can God - He's a donkey for crying out loud. Yeah. What's that?

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He's a donkey for crying out loud. That's right. That's right. Made a donkey talk. So he does have the ability, but can

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God speak in such a way that it's not as authoritative as scripture?

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Is that basically the question? Yeah. Yeah. And because, and as that, as the premise, let's talk about that.

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No. No. Okay. No. Because when God is speaking,

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God is speaking. And whatever he says is authoritative. Amen.

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Whatever he says has just as much authority as any verse in scripture, as John 3, 16, as Romans 10, nine, and 10, as, you know, whatever, whatever verse in scripture.

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When God speaks, that's authority. So he cannot speak less authoritatively on one occasion than he does on another.

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He cannot do that. Not that he won't do it. He can't. Yeah. There are some things that God cannot do.

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And speaking in a, like a second tier kind of authoritative level is quasi -authoritative.

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He means it, but he just kind of means it. You know, it just, uh -uh, no.

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No. If God is speaking, God is speaking. And whatever he says is absolutely authoritative.

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So the way the question is worded, no, he cannot do that. And that's why

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I worded it that way, because I'm not asking, can God, you know, make a rock that he can't lift, right?

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I'm not asking that. What I want to make sure of is because there are people, even Beth Moore, on a continuous basis.

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Oh yeah. Every day I had a word from God, I had a prophecy. You know, you did, brother,

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I think I've seen everything you've ever done. So I'm trying to remember, you did this, you did a video about the prophetesses and the prophets that have made all these predictions, just mundane daily predictions.

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And here's where we got to be careful. Guys, I want to make this clear. When people say,

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I had a word from God, or God said, or God told me, you have to ask yourself, is it normative for God to reveal himself through the prophetic use of, his miraculous prophetic use?

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Is it normative for him to do that? Or is there a special reason?

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And not just God told me, prophecy, but also divine miracles of healing and things like that.

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Because they're all interconnected and they all have a purpose. They all have, every single one of them have a foundational purpose according to the scripture.

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And we're going to talk about those things. I want to get into those. I started even in the post,

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Acts 2, 22, I started because that's our foundational starting point. And we're going to,

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Old Testament, New Testament. And I want to talk about these. And I actually,

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I have some notes that I want to express, and have you guys bounce off of some of this, if you don't mind.

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So what is a miracle and what is its purpose? Maybe we'll just start there.

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Justin, if you could give maybe a flyover, 30 ,000 foot view of what is a miracle.

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Maybe we can talk about that just real quick. Okay, I want Josiah to come in here. I don't want to, just cause

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I'm known for this issue. I don't want to be the only one, but okay. Hold on, hold on.

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Let me fix it. Hold on, hold on. Okay, now we're good. I'm just kidding, I'm just kidding.

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Thanks, thank you. First he insults me with Chick -fil -A, now he insults you,

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Josiah. I had to kick him both. That's okay, I can get him back.

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He knows all about me, so he can get me. Okay, so 30 ,000 foot view of what is a miracle.

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I'll start by saying miracle is a word that is way overused today. Almost everything is a miracle.

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And if everything is a miracle, then nothing is a miracle. So you hear people say, oh, there's a miracle that I ran into you today.

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No, that's not a miracle. It might be a kind providence of God, but it's not a miracle. A miracle is when

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God does something that has absolutely no naturalistic explanation.

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That it defies, it transcends the laws of physics, that the natural order of things, that God does something that has absolutely zero natural explanation.

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That's a miracle. Parting the Red Sea is a miracle. An ax head floating is a miracle.

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A bush burning that is not consumed, that's a miracle. Those are physical miracles.

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In fact, and I'll say, and this might surprise some people to hear me say this, one of the most common misconceptions about me and my theology is that I believe, that I don't believe that God heals people today.

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That's not true at all. I do believe God heals people today. In fact, just a few weeks ago, I was preaching at a church in Virginia, and I heard one of the more incredible testimonies of a genuine miracle of healing that I've ever heard.

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I've heard a few that were really incredible. This one though, it was a first person kind of a primary source thing.

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But anyway, long story short, there's this couple in this church in Virginia, and they adopted a little baby boy, and it was prearranged because the boy's mother was strung out on meth and who knows what else, all kinds of stuff.

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And the mother knew she couldn't take care of him, so it had been prearranged that when this little boy is born, he will go to this couple in the church.

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Well, because of all the drugs that his mother was on, he was born with a lot of health problems, and he had serious intestinal issues.

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They knew that, and so they did emergency surgery on the little guy, I think like right after he was born, and they went in there, opened him up, and the doctor said that his intestines were ribbons, just shredded.

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I mean, and there was so bad that there was nothing they could do for him.

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And so they just sewed him up, fully expecting him to die in a pretty short amount of time.

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So they just sewed him up, and they gave him to the adoptive parents, and didn't have long to live, and they were gonna try to give him some intravenous nourishment for a while, anyway, but after he came out of surgery, and they brought him to his parents, after a little while,

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I think later that day, he pooped. Yeah. Which is impossible.

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Yeah. And they called the nurse in. The nurse saw it. The nurse called the doctors in.

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The doctors were dumbfounded. And then a few hours after that, he pooped again. Yeah.

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And so they did a test, a barium test. That I've had one before, it's horrible.

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They called it a milkshake when I was a kid. Oh, drink this. This is a milkshake. Yeah, it's not a milkshake. It was horrible.

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But anyway, they gave him some of that, and they followed it all the way through his digestive system. Went all the way through, lickety split, no leaks.

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That's a miracle. And I rejoice in that. Recovering from a cold, recovering from COVID, you know, a slow, progressive recovery, that's not a miracle.

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That, it's a kind providence of God, because really everything is a providence of God.

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So it's a kind providence of God, or maybe even slowly recovering from cancer, whether it's through treatment or, you know, chemo, diet, whatever.

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You know, if you slowly recover from cancer, that's a kind providence of God, but that's not a miracle. What happened to this little guy was a miracle.

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So there are miracles, I believe, absolutely, 100%.

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And the greatest miracle of all is not even a physical miracle. It's a spiritual miracle, and that's the new birth.

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Yeah. Amen. So I'm gonna give some, I wanna give you a couple of definitions.

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A .H. Strong, in his theology, his book on theology, on page 118, he says that a miracle, and I'll post this up in a moment.

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A miracle is an event in nature, so extraordinary in itself, and so coinciding with the prophecy or command of a religious teacher or leader as fully to warrant the conviction on the part of those who witness it, that God has wrought it with the design of certifying that this teacher or leader has been commissioned by him.

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Now, listen to the way he's saying this.

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Now, we're talking biblical miracles. Now, yes, Justin, I totally agree with you. Those things do happen today, apart from any man.

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But in the biblical narrative, we see that the Bible tells us that God uses the secondary means and in other words, he uses men.

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And one of the things that he does in his miracles and the working of his miracles, Andrew says this and I agree, we see three times in history where miracles were normative.

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And if you look in the time with Moses, they were normative and they were so shocking that everybody had to see it, hear it, and submit to it, even if they hated the messenger, even if they hated the message.

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And that's why this is important because what we're talking about is the sufficiency of scripture to tell us what is going on in history and the miracles that took place, why were they given to us?

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Not can, you know, Justin jump around and say, hey, look, or Josiah jump around and myself, you know, oh, look,

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I've got a prophecy. I've got a miracle. You know, I can, you know, I can speak in tongues.

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I can do, you know, what, heal your foot and make it one leg longer than the other.

33:36

And I can, you know, I had a word from the Lord that I'm supposed to comb your hair and, you know, all this stuff.

33:43

Here's what a miracle looks like according to scripture. Okay, if you were to go, and I'm jumping around just a little bit.

33:52

If you go to Exodus chapter four, verses one through nine, I'm going to read it to you. It's a pretty lengthy section.

34:01

Exodus chapter four, verses one through nine says this. Then Moses said to God, what if they will not believe me or listen to what

34:11

I say? For they may say the Lord has not appeared to you.

34:17

So there's going to be, you know, a pushback. What if it happens? The Lord said to him, what is that in your hand?

34:25

He said, a staff. Then he said, throw it on the ground. And he threw it on the ground and it became a serpent. Miracle.

34:33

And Moses fled from it because he was scared to death because it was a snake. Okay. Moses fled from it, but the

34:40

Lord said to Moses, stretch out your hand and grasp it by the tail. So he stretched his hand out and he caught it and it became a staff in his hand.

34:49

That they may believe that the Lord, the God of their fathers, the

34:54

God of Abraham, the God of Isaac and the God of Jacob has appeared to you. What was the purpose in the miracle?

35:01

So they believe Moses. It was a process of vindication. It was not vindicating the miracle.

35:09

It was vindicating the miracle giver. I mean, the message giver. It was saying that this is how you know that this is a man of God.

35:20

This is not just any man of God, not Justin, Josiah, Justin, not

35:26

Andrew, but the man of God speaking on God's behalf, revelatory truth.

35:32

And what was he saying to them? Let my people go, Pharaoh, and you better submit because if you don't, what's going to happen?

35:40

God will judge you, more miracle, and the miracle of the wrath of God. It goes on and he says this.

35:50

So you don't believe those are natural disasters, Justin, the plagues? No. Either Justin? What do you think,

35:57

Justin? Yeah, not so much. No, I don't think the Red Sea was just a few inches deep and it was just a, yeah.

36:06

Millions of people. But think about it. Which one would have been more of a miracle? That much water killing all those people?

36:13

Either way you go, it's a huge miracle. Anyway, but it says the Lord further said to him, now put your hand into your bosom.

36:21

So he put his hand into his bosom and when he pulled it out, it was leprous like snow. And he said, put your hand into your bosom again, and he did it again.

36:30

And he says this. So he put his hand in his bosom again, and when he took out his hand out of his bosom, behold, it was restored like the rest of his flesh.

36:40

And God said this, if they will not believe or heed the witness of the first sign, they may believe the witness of the last sign.

36:51

So the whole purpose is God vindicating his own authoritative messenger.

36:59

Now let's go see if we can make that a little bit clearer. Like I said,

37:04

I jumped a little bit. I wanna give you about four different purposes. I'll let you guys jump in.

37:11

Anytime you wanna hear something. I wanna give you four. This is from my professor,

37:16

Doug Bookman down at Shepherds Theological Seminary. I think he's probably the greatest teacher

37:22

I've ever met. I'm gonna tell you, Dr. Bookman is phenomenal. I love him to death.

37:27

I just, I think he's amazing. And he's taught me so much, but I want you to listen to this. He says a very important, very important thing that you need to understand, a careful and precise definition of a biblical miracle must be given.

37:43

He says, you see it in three different times, in the time of Moses, in the time of Ezekiel, and in the time of Jesus Christ and his ambassadors.

37:52

Okay. He says, there's four things that must be understood about miracles.

37:59

And I'm going to share those right here. Let me put this up.

38:09

Okay. There we go. I think we've got it up. All right.

38:18

So let's pull these up. A miracle must be non -counterfeitable.

38:25

In other words, the local heretic. Think about Moses, for example. He goes in and he starts doing these miracles and what happened?

38:34

Pharisees little demonic horde come in and whatever they did, they did this to try to disprove his authority.

38:47

But what they understood is they were doing it by the power of Satan. And they were able to counterfeit miracles in some way for a couple of them.

38:59

Right? They were to counterfeit them, a few of them. And so what was it that God was doing?

39:07

Not only was he proving the vindication of his man Moses, but he was also destroying the power of Satan in his midst right there.

39:18

Because they eventually got to the point where they said, we can't counterfeit this. When the frogs came, they said, we can't do that.

39:23

When the lice came, we can't do that. When the boils came and it was all over him, they were screaming at the Pharaoh, what?

39:29

Let them go. Yeah. Let them go. We've got to get out of this. Please let them go.

39:35

They tapped out. They tapped out quick. And think about it. So four things that must happen.

39:42

A true miracle must be non -counterfeitable. Now here today, what do you hear, guys? What do you hear all the time?

39:49

God told me, prophecy, got a vision. Justin, you deal with these prophets a lot.

39:57

What do they talk about, about weather and generalized health and all this other stuff? Oh yeah.

40:03

I mean, like miracle money showing up in your bank account and oh, so -and -so got healed or a metal plate disappeared and that kind of stuff.

40:13

Of course, none of these things are ever documented. The only documentation of any miracles that you see are no miracles at all, like Todd White going around on the street lengthening people's legs by about half an inch.

40:26

So, which is a parlor trick, just manipulating the angle of the foot and the tilt of the foot and that kind of stuff.

40:35

So those are no miracles. Now guys, think. When we're talking about miracles, divine miracles, true biblical miracles, they have to be non -counterfeitable.

40:47

Okay, Satan comes along. He tries to mimic. He sends his demons, the angels of light, counterfeit angels to come in.

40:56

Even Beth Moore and all these guys come in. I've got a vision. Somebody told me this. It's because we've made mundane things.

41:03

You said it, Justin. We've made the mundane a miracle. Oh, it was a miracle. I got a parking spot.

41:09

No, it's not. Dr. Bookman said last week, you're driving down the interstate.

41:16

I love this. I love this. He says, you're driving down the interstate and two semis get into a crash right dead in front of you.

41:24

And they come right up on top of you. They're just about to slam into you. And next thing you know, you're 50 feet up in the air.

41:31

And an angel is slowly bringing you back down to the ground and you just land with a little bump. He says, now you're getting close to approaching the concept of a miracle, but you're not even there yet.

41:42

He says, you're not even there yet. He says, I wouldn't even call that a miracle because it has to be non -counterfeitable.

41:49

It must prove that God has vindicated his own messenger. There's not a place in scripture where these miracles are being done that are not for purpose of vindicating the messenger.

42:04

I mean, you go look. I mean, I know everybody screams and yells, well, what about Corinthians? The messenger being vindicated was

42:13

Paul. And what was he doing? He was having to correct a church that was number one saying that he wasn't a real apostle.

42:20

They were trying to say he didn't have the authority as an apostle, that he wasn't a real deal, that he might've been the second or third generation apostle.

42:27

They were trying to push back on him and saying he didn't have any authority. And he said, everything you're doing is wrong.

42:33

He said, look, you're believers, but you're not believing. You started out believing and now you're running towards all the false gods that are out here in the

42:45

Corinthian world. And it was all meant to vindicate God's messenger.

42:52

The next one is a miracle is a function of divine revelation. We gotta be really careful of this.

43:01

We see people today that are so, they're trying to intricately tie in their unprovable miracles to their authority.

43:16

As teachers or as witnesses to God, or we saw it last week or a couple of weeks ago with the gentleman that was talking with you on the speaking in tongues.

43:31

Michael Salmon, over and over and over again, he kept on trying to talk about the issues of speaking in tongues.

43:38

Well, what was the purpose of the speaking in tongues according to Acts? What was it for?

43:44

It was for? Oh, well, in Acts, you had to proclaim the words of God, the mighty acts of God.

43:54

Overall, the gift of tongues was a sign of judgment against unbelieving Israel, but.

44:00

Listen to Acts 2 .22. I'll pull this up. Acts 2 .22

44:06

says, I apologize. Quiet time doesn't work good, does it?

44:15

Acts 2 .22 says, men of Israel, listen and hear these words. Listen and hear these words.

44:25

Jesus the Nazarene, a man attested to you by God. And how was he attested?

44:33

By miracles and wonders and signs, which God performed through him in your midst, just as you yourself know.

44:44

In other words, they couldn't get away with it. They couldn't get by it. God had vindicated his own man,

44:52

Jesus, and he was vindicating Peter and those other men as messengers sent by God.

44:59

That's what we see, and that's not the only time. Sorry, excuse me. Please, if you guys have anything you wanna add, jump in, please.

45:11

I don't know if I have anything I wanna add. I did see a comment up a few minutes ago that at some point

45:16

I think we should address because it's an interesting point. Cody Robbins at 626.

45:23

Okay, yeah, yeah. If you want, at some point, go back there. Yeah, let's go ahead and touch on that because he has actually reached out and said that a couple of times.

45:32

Let's see. Let's go ahead and put this out here. Cody, Cody's asked this a few times.

45:38

So let's go ahead and say, I'll let you go ahead and address it if you want, brother. Oh, that's not even the comment

45:44

I was thinking of. Or is it?

45:50

Yeah, the one where, let's see. Where he said, one thing I never hear addressed is, oh,

45:56

I guess it is. Yeah, yeah, yeah, okay. Okay, so Cody says, one thing

46:02

I never hear addressed is what makes people think Satan can't heal physically. He was granted in Job the ability to physically harm in the appeal to Jesus in Matthew 7.

46:12

They appeal to their works, yes, but they didn't know him and Jesus doesn't rebuke their claims to perform miracles.

46:18

And if I'm remembering correctly, Sproul taught the authenticity of demonic miracles being performed by the

46:24

Pharaoh's priests in Exodus. And Cody, that's a great point and it's something that I, from time to time, will bring up if it comes up in a

46:33

Q and A. Okay, none of the healing miracles claimed in the charismatic movement match the biblical definition of a miracle, but I do believe that on occasion,

46:48

I don't think this is common, but I think on occasion, what does sometimes happen, we know from scripture that Satan can inflict illness, right,

47:01

I mean, we know that. The woman, was it Luke chapter 12, the woman who was crippled and Jesus healed her and her illness was because of a demonic infliction or satanic infliction.

47:16

So we know from scripture that Satan, book of Job, he just, you know, Satan can inflict bodily harm if God allows him to do so.

47:28

So knowing that, if in the charismatic movement, someone has an illness, has some kind of a sickness, and let's just say a few of these occasions, a few of them are actually demonic.

47:40

If a demon that is causing that illness were to withdraw from that person, then there would be at least a slow healing, quote unquote, or let's call it recovery, because if the illness is being caused by a demon and a demon just removes himself and he goes and flies off and does whatever demons do, and that person were to recover, the appearance would be, oh, it's a miracle.

48:08

It's a miracle of healing, when in fact, that's not actually what happened. And I think in the charismatic movement, there's just enough of that kind of stuff on occasion to kind of keep the proverbial carrot in front of, you know, a carrot on a stick hanging in front of people to keep people, you know, just enough of that going on to keep people in the charismatic movement, because people in the charismatic movement, they're not there for doctrine.

48:35

They're not there for theology. They're not there to grow in the grace and knowledge of the Lord Christ or progress in their sanctification or understanding of scripture.

48:42

That's not what they're there for. They're in that movement for the signs and wonders and the experiences and all of these tales.

48:51

And I would not put it past Satan or one of his demonic court at all on occasion to do something like that, just enough to keep people in this movement, in this false movement, and to keep them away from real doctrine, real theology, really growing in the grace and knowledge of the

49:13

Lord Christ, really progressing in sanctification and holiness. If it can keep them off, you see what

49:19

I mean? Following these signs and wonders. So I don't think that's common. I don't think that's the rule, but I do think that happens, so.

49:28

Yeah. And I agree. I think it's way more made up for the person to announce his own status or her own status.

49:44

I mean, we've seen it with Beth Moore. I mean, but we've also seen it with, you name all the other groups.

49:52

But you think about this. Let's look at this list of four things. Are there miracles counterfeitable?

50:01

Yes. Every person that says, you know, oh, I speak in tongues. Well, I've got news for you.

50:07

Okay, I can do it too. Okay, I can do it too, at least the way you're talking about it. My cousin and I, when

50:14

I was 18 years old, we went to a charismatic church. It was, we had a wonderful time.

50:20

People were dancing and singing and shouting and jumping around, and there was very little

50:25

Bible. But they had people would go up front and one would give a prophecy, you know, just, and another person that was with them, and they were all staged.

50:36

It wasn't like they were just, you know, out of the blue. They were given a prophecy and somebody would interpret it. And they'd be like, is that right?

50:43

Yeah, that's right. That's exactly what I meant. Well, how do you know? You know, so they would do that.

50:49

But the thing that was so amazing to me and my cousin is they would take us out to dinner all the time.

50:56

And as they would take us out to dinner, they would tell us, have you received the spirit yet? Have you received the spirit yet?

51:04

Well, I guess, yeah, I think so. I wasn't a saved a bit more than a man in the moon, but I didn't realize that I thought

51:11

I was. And I didn't have any discernment, just I didn't ever watch clouds without water at that time.

51:18

So, here I am, I'm listening to these guys and they're like, you know, if you've received the spirit, then you should be able to speak in tongues.

51:26

My cousin went with them one time alone. And he said that they trapped him in the car for 45 minutes and prayed over him and they were pushing on him.

51:34

And he finally was like, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And they were like screaming and shouting and, oh, he's received the spirit.

51:41

He got out as fast as he could. And he said, I am never going back. These guys are crazy, but that's not abnormal.

51:53

Andrew actually posted a video last time on the show of how some of these guys were teaching people how to, what?

52:05

How to speak in tongues. How to speak in tongues, yeah. So, let's ask the question. Is that a counterfeitable miracle?

52:13

Yeah. Yeah. Not the real thing. Not a miracle, but yeah, it is counter. Tongues are very counterfeitable.

52:19

Counterfeitable? Yeah, tongues are very counterfeitable. And lots of pagan religions speak in tongues.

52:28

Hindus, some Mormons, a lot of Roman Catholics, some

52:33

Buddhists speak in tongues. And they do it in the exact same way that charismatics do. Exactly the same way.

52:41

So it's, you know, I tell people, you can teach a canary how to speak in tongues. It's not hard to do.

52:47

You can learn how to do it. And I can't tell you how many people I have talked to, how many people have emailed me and said that they used to be in the charismatic movement.

52:55

They spoke in tongues. God opened their eyes. They are now cessationist, as cessationist as I am.

53:03

But I've asked them, can you still speak in tongues? Oh yeah. They can still do it because it's just, it's a learned behavior.

53:10

It's a learned behavior. So, yeah. Well, and they say it's the spiritual language and all these other things.

53:19

The next thing here is it must prove that God has vindicated his own messenger. Now here's, that's what, see, that's why this is so troublesome is when everything becomes a miracle, then every mundane thing is used as proof of their message.

53:38

But in the biblical sense, what is it proving? It's proving that you have the authority to even proclaim the message, right?

53:48

I mean, Dr. Bookman, he actually taught that when it comes to the positives of being able to claim that you're a messenger from God, it's non -counterfeitable, that it has a function of divine revelation and the miracle is always for vindication.

54:08

The negative there would be something along the lines of, well, let's see, if you don't do what's right, if your message is not biblical, what happens to you?

54:24

Well, let's say you get stoned to death because you're a false teacher, you know, Deuteronomy, you know, it's also a judgment from God.

54:32

God may allow somebody to come in and do the miracle, and then what happens? They turn out to be a false teacher, you know, trying to get people to go to other gods, to the lawless people.

54:47

So here's a question. Sorry. No, go ahead, Joseph, you haven't said anything yet. Okay, yeah, if these miracles were real, they wouldn't be denying the

55:00

Trinity, which we will probably get to that later. I hope so. And they wouldn't be saying

55:06

Jesus wasn't God and that we're little gods. Justin, how many of the charismatic, mainstream charismatic leaders teach that Jesus wasn't

55:20

God and that we're little gods? Most of them, most of them. Now, if you were to press them and say, do you believe

55:28

Jesus is God? They would say, well, yeah, but when you listen to a long enough like I have, and you kind of, many of them teach that when

55:38

Jesus came to this earth, he was not God. He was just a man who had completely divested himself of deity, divested himself of all of his deific attributes, and he was just a man in right relationship with God, and he performed his miracles, not as God, but as a man in right relationship with God.

56:02

That's exactly what Bill Johnson Bethel teaches, precisely what they teach. So yeah, many of them teach that, many, many of them, most of them teach that to one degree or another.

56:15

They have all taught that. I mean, Joel Osteen, Joyce Meyer, Joseph Prince, Bill Johnson, Kenneth Copeland, Benny Hinn, Jesse Duplantis.

56:26

In fact, Jesse Duplantis has actually said on multiple occasions that God created Jesus. So Creflo Dollar teaches this, and T .D.

56:36

Jakes, T .D. Jakes doesn't even believe in the Trinity. So that's, yeah, they teach that, and they also teach that we are little gods.

56:46

If you're a Christian, you're a little God, so. So I wanted to just real quick look at a couple of biblical terms for miracle.

56:59

There's four uses. What's that? So like Drew's comment, my two -year -old is speaking in tongues.

57:06

I have no clue what he's saying, but he's trying to say something. That's right, that's right. Well, then he needs an interpreter though.

57:14

There's a movie out where he's talking about the interpreters there. There's no interpretation, let him remain silent. I think

57:20

I can interpret that. I think he wants attention. There you go. There you go.

57:27

I do like it that the LSB, by the way, I wish the LSB, I love the LSB. It's gonna be my new go -to translation.

57:34

I wish they had rendered tongues as languages, but they did, they didn't do that.

57:39

They left it as tongues, but they did, instead of talking about, instead of, when it talks about interpretation of tongues, they do change that rightly to translate, which gives the distinct impression.

57:56

Okay, if you're translating something, this is a real language, so.

58:03

Okay, so let's - Yeah, there you go, right there. Was that a, let me pull it up.

58:09

First country sport. But if they're, see, most English, even the new American standard would say if there's no one there to interpret, but the legacy standard says if there is no translator, which

58:21

I'm glad they did that. Thank you, KT, for posting that up there. I really appreciate that. So Joe, Joe Koobi said, what is the difference between a miracle and a wonder?

58:33

And actually, we're gonna talk about that in just for a second. There are actually four words in the scripture that we need to talk about, okay?

58:45

One is a word for miracle. That's four different types of miracle expressed in the scripture.

58:52

One is the word ergon, and it's a generic use of the miracle as a work.

59:03

I'm gonna post each one of these up so everybody can see it and not just, you know, making these things up.

59:10

Because, you know, somebody's gonna say, oh, they're just making it up and whatnot. I don't want anybody to think we're just, you know, throwing it out there.

59:18

But a work, the works here, the miraculous works that Jesus did, John 5, 36, is the word ergon.

59:28

Now, if somebody wants to read that, that'd be great. I mean, I'll try to post the next one up and we can talk about that one too.

59:36

Let's see. And if you have the legacy standard Bible, we can read it in that one.

59:42

Read the verse, you mean? Yeah, if you want. Yeah, we do the legacy one. Yeah, I got it here.

59:49

Yeah, because I don't have a legacy Bible because I was gonna be getting one, just to fill in time for you guys.

59:55

I was gonna get one in and Anthony, Anthony Silvestro, he comes on the show sometimes.

01:00:03

He was actually going to send me one and it got lost in the mail. It's only been lost in the mail, it really did.

01:00:11

When the COVID thing hit, they said it made it up to Philadelphia or something like that. And it's never to be seen again, so.

01:00:18

Yeah, John 5, 36, Jesus speaking, of course.

01:00:24

But the witness I have is greater than the witness of John for the works which the Father has given me to finish.

01:00:31

The very works that I do bear witness about me that the Father has sent me. See, what he's talking about is the very miraculous things that he does.

01:00:42

It's the works that he does. Okay, you wanna talk about the things that you've done. You're speaking in tongues and you're lifting legs and combing hair and you got a parking spot and all these things.

01:00:56

Do they withstand the scrutiny of being able to say that this is a work that is vindicated by God?

01:01:05

If so, then I guess you're a messenger in the biblical sense.

01:01:10

And there is a sense that we are messengers, but this is a vindicated messenger.

01:01:16

I think we need to make sure that there is a different understanding. We have a message that's already been given.

01:01:24

We don't have a message from God where he gave it to us in direct revelation, right?

01:01:31

The next word is, you can see it in Acts 8, 13, is talking about the dunamis powers.

01:01:39

I didn't understand for a long time what Todd Friel was talking about, because people say, well, that's dynamite.

01:01:46

The charismatics will say, that's dynamite. Please, please disabuse us of that, Justin. Yeah, look,

01:01:55

Josiah was talking earlier about authorial intent. If you come up with a meaning, an interpretation of a particular verse of scripture that would not have made sense to the original recipients, then you've got the wrong meaning.

01:02:10

And Romans 1, 16, classic example, for I am not ashamed of the gospel, for it is the dunamis, the power of God and the salvation.

01:02:17

Oh, dunamis, that's the word we get for our word dynamite. So it's the power of God is like dynamite, except that it's absolutely nothing like dynamite.

01:02:27

Yeah, it's not, I mean, okay. So let's, okay, authorial intent. So let's, let's, let's go back in time, get in our little time machine, go back 2000 years, go to the recipients of the

01:02:41

Paul's letter to the Romans. Hey guys, guess what? You know what

01:02:46

Paul said here? Romans 1, 16, you know, this right here, we wrote this to you that he's not ashamed of the gospel because it's the power of God.

01:02:53

You know what that means? It means dynamite. They would look at you like, what? What's dynamite?

01:02:58

What's dynamite? What is this dynamite? They wouldn't have had the first clue as to what you were talking about.

01:03:06

So that's a classic hermeneutical wonder. The power of God is absolutely nothing like dynamite at all on any level.

01:03:15

Yeah. Dynamite, it's kind of an instantaneous explosion of power. It goes in all directions and then it's over.

01:03:23

Yeah, the power of God's actually nothing like that at all. Yeah. It doesn't mean that in the first place.

01:03:28

Let's see. Actually, I'm sorry, I didn't post that up there. Acts 8 .13,

01:03:34

Justin, if you want to put that up, that's great. I don't have the legacy, so I'm asking it for you to do it because it's better.

01:03:42

Well, I don't have my physical copy in front of me. I got it on my phone. Got it on app.

01:03:48

Oh, okay, I got you. Oh, I didn't know you could get it on app. That's handy. Oh, that's great. Yeah. Even Simon himself believed.

01:03:56

And after being baptized, he continued on with Philip. And as he observed signs and great miracles taking place, he was constantly astounded.

01:04:06

Once you think about this, that passage, Simon was a false teacher, claimed to be a

01:04:14

God, claimed to have the power of the gods. He claimed to be someone of authority to the point where they believed that he was worthy of respect and vindication.

01:04:29

They would think the people thought he was something else until the truly vindicated people,

01:04:35

Peter himself came in and said, what? You're in the gall of death.

01:04:42

I can't remember exactly the word. He's like, you have nothing to do with God or the things of God and let your money perish with you.

01:04:51

You think that what you're doing is worthy of money? It was blasphemy.

01:04:57

He's like this, what you're trying to do with the spirit is blasphemy. And so he was doing the manifestations.

01:05:07

I mean, the truth of the manifestations of the miracle working power of God. And that's why we have to be careful because as we're talking about these things,

01:05:18

I wanna build up to a crescendo because I want, when we get done in an hour,

01:05:23

I want everybody to be able to say when we get done, what is the purpose of the miracles?

01:05:30

Okay, we've already started this once. We already said it one time. It's for the vindication of the message, okay?

01:05:37

It's for vindicating the messenger. It's all about the revelatory divine message of God.

01:05:45

Every bit of it's interconnected. And you can't miss this. When somebody says,

01:05:50

I've got a revelation, I've got a miracle or any of these things, you have to say this, is it the same in the sense as it was according to the scripture that we see the scripture?

01:06:03

And here's why. All of these things were done to vindicate the messenger, not today's messengers because we don't have those, but it was the messengers that were given the word of God who would write the, let's just say it this way, write the inscripturated word of God.

01:06:22

They had to have so much authority that when Simon came in, they could rebuke him and the people submitted to him.

01:06:32

When the Pharisees came in, they submitted Acts 2 .22, what did they do?

01:06:38

They heard the message, they fell on their face and they repented. Men and brethren, what shall we do?

01:06:44

We know that we've seen the signs, wonders, the miracles. We know that God attested that Jesus, the one that hung on the tree.

01:06:51

We know that we killed him. What do we do? Repent, believe the gospel. All of this, and here's what's so important.

01:07:00

It wasn't in 350 AD where everybody came together in a church council.

01:07:06

I mean, we've heard this straw man for 200 years or more that, oh, they went back to 350

01:07:13

AD and they all sat down and they came together and coalesced the word of God. And what would be the canon?

01:07:18

No, what made the canon, what made the scripture from Matthew to Revelation, what made it and solidified it was the vindication of the authors.

01:07:33

And that could only be done by the people who submitted to the authority of these authors.

01:07:40

And what you have to understand is they were submitting because they saw the signs, they saw the miracles, they saw the power of God, they saw the authority of God, they heard the message of God.

01:07:51

And it's over and over and over again. And we have to be careful not to allow people to, how do

01:07:59

I wanna say, pervert. What we're trying to say is a true divine miracle.

01:08:08

What is the purpose of the miracle? And we don't want people to nominalize God's true biblical miracles because they have a purpose.

01:08:20

Just real quick, let me post this up. What's a sign?

01:08:27

A sign is a simeon. And it means this, with relation to miracles, this word means the authenticator.

01:08:39

A sign, Dr. Bookman says it this way. A sign is a badge.

01:08:46

It's a badge where you can say, this is what authenticates me as a messenger of God.

01:08:55

This is why I'm telling you to repent. This is why I'm telling you to submit to everything that the apostles teach.

01:09:03

This is why I'm telling you to listen to the apostles doctrine and to teach it and refuse to allow anyone else to say any other word.

01:09:12

A sign, it's written down here, is with relation to a message,

01:09:18

I'm sorry, a miracle. This word means the authenticator, a positive indicator.

01:09:24

It means credentials as a badge for vindicating an insignia.

01:09:29

And we see that in John 2 .11 and Matthew 12 .13.

01:09:37

He says, note that, and I don't know the word, wait, where, note that Samion.

01:09:46

Yeah, Samion, sorry, yeah, that's right. Can refer to a pointer, that which directs the mind to something outside itself.

01:09:57

And in Mark 13 .4 it says, the signs, the sign when all these things will be fulfilled, but the primary sense is the authenticating badge.

01:10:12

Guys, you want to jump in there? I don't want to take up the whole time talking about all of it myself. Josiah, you go ahead, bro.

01:10:19

Well, we were talking about Jesus' miracles and the miracles that the

01:10:26

Bible does. And Jesus shows over and over again that his miracles are to authenticate his message and his message that the kingdom of God had come and you had to repent and believe in him.

01:10:46

If you want to turn to Matthew chapter eight, that's chapter right after the Sermon on the

01:10:52

Mount. And in verses 14 through 17,

01:10:58

I preached on this a couple of weeks ago. It talks about Jesus healing

01:11:03

Peter's mother -in -law and says, when Jesus entered Peter's house, he saw his mother -in -law lying sick with the fever.

01:11:10

He touched her hand and the fever left her and he rose and began to serve him. That evening they brought to him many who were oppressed by demons and he cast out the spirits of the word and healed all who were sick.

01:11:20

This was to fulfill what was spoken by the prophet Isaiah. He took our illnesses and bore our diseases.

01:11:28

A few things that are important to point out there. Jesus' miracles were instant, more close to being instant.

01:11:38

They were to authenticate his message. They were falsifiable because many were being brought to him.

01:11:47

And also this was to fulfill prophecy. The passage he quotes was

01:11:53

Isaiah, and it's actually Isaiah 53, verse four.

01:12:01

It says, surely he has borne our griefs and carried our sorrows. Now, whenever you see a

01:12:07

New Testament author quoting an Old Testament author, you have to understand what is the context that the author is pointing to.

01:12:17

Because Matthew, what he likes to do, this is something I discovered with Dr. Abner Chow.

01:12:24

He said that you wanna look at the context because whenever they said a verse, and from an

01:12:34

Old Testament passage, the audience hearing the Old Testament over and over again would have understood the context that he was talking about.

01:12:44

And Jesus' miracles, it says, surely he has borne our griefs and carried our sorrows, yet we esteem him stricken, smitten by God, and afflicted.

01:12:55

But he was pierced for our transgressions. He was crushed for our iniquities. Upon him was a chastisement that brought us peace, and with his wounds we are healed.

01:13:05

So Jesus' miracles of healing were to foreshadow his healing us of our sins, and they're authenticating the fact that we are saved by his blood sacrifice on the cross.

01:13:24

So there are several reasons why Jesus healed and did miracles.

01:13:29

It was to authenticate the message. It was to point to the fact that he was gonna die on the cross for our sins.

01:13:39

And his resurrection ultimately points to his actually fulfilling that by rising from the dead, so proving we have forgiveness of sins.

01:13:52

Amen. Yeah, Jesus never healed anyone just for the sole purpose of that person having an easier life, a more comfortable life.

01:14:04

I mean, yes, he had compassion on people, but that was not the primary purpose that he granted healing, was not just so that person could have an easier life.

01:14:15

Every miracle he did pointed to himself and attested to his deity and his authority, not just so that the blind person could see and have a better life, but the lame person could walk and get around.

01:14:31

Yes, that was one of the benefits, if you will, of that for that individual, but there was always a much, much broader view and purpose in everything that Jesus did.

01:14:44

Amen. And we just talked about this. KT posted this. We're gonna pull it up again. It's in Acts 2 .22.

01:14:52

That's been kind of our foundational issue here. We talked about the fact that we're talking about a work, we're talking about the power, we're talking about the wonders, we're talking about the signs.

01:15:03

We're talking about the fact that it must be something that is non -counterfeitable. It's something that vindicates the messenger, that it's a function of divine revelation and that it's always for that vindication purpose.

01:15:20

And Dr. Bookman points out that we see this in Acts 2 .22. It's clear as day.

01:15:27

Men of Israel, unbelievers, by the way, let's point out that what's the purpose of the signs of the tongues?

01:15:36

The Bible tells us that the purpose of the tongues is not so you can just get your willies when you're in the middle of your church service.

01:15:44

It was for the gospel for unbelievers so they may hear the message.

01:15:52

Listen to these words. Jesus of Nazareth, a man attested to you by God with what?

01:15:58

Miracles, wonders, and signs, which God did through him in your midst.

01:16:05

And you know it. Yep. Irrefutable. Go ahead.

01:16:11

Go ahead. No, go ahead. No, no, no, go ahead. No, I was just saying, all I was saying is it's irrefutable.

01:16:17

You knew it was happening. Yep. Yeah, that's right.

01:16:22

You knew it. Let me, in Acts chapter three, this is

01:16:28

Peter and John, and they healed the man at the temple who was lame from his mother's womb at the temple.

01:16:36

And so, you know, let's say Acts chapter three, beginning of verse six,

01:16:43

Peter said, I do not possess silver and gold, but what I do have, I give to you in the name of Jesus Christ. The Nazarene walk, and seizing him by the right hand, he raised him up, and immediately his feet and his ankles were strengthened, and leaping up, he stood upright, began to walk, he entered the temple with him, walking and leaping and praising

01:17:04

God. This was a man who had been born lame from his mother's womb, and instantly, the guy is jumping up, running like a deer.

01:17:16

Okay. This is no Todd White leg lengthening thing. And this is no slow over time, getting a little bit better.

01:17:24

This is a bona fide miracle. And look, verse nine, and all the people saw him walking and praising

01:17:34

God, and they were recognizing him, that he was the one who used to sit at the beautiful gate of the temple to beg alms, and they were filled with wonder and amazement at what had happened to him.

01:17:47

Everybody around this situation, they knew that a miracle had happened undeniably.

01:17:55

This was no psychosomatic healing. This was no, oh yeah, that bursitis in my right shoulder,

01:18:02

I think it's a little bit better today. Everybody, everybody was forced to admit, this is real.

01:18:12

This is the hand of God. They had to, they lost people recognize this.

01:18:18

The enemies of Christ recognize this. So that is a far cry. You don't see anything like this happening in the charismatic movement today, ever, ever, nowhere.

01:18:34

Not even Francis Chan. Francis Chan a couple of years ago said he was in, I don't know where he was,

01:18:40

Burma or something like that, and he prayed for deaf kids in the village, and all of the deaf children were instantly healed.

01:18:49

There's no proof of this. There's no, nobody had a cell phone, no video of this.

01:18:54

It's just, nothing like this is happening today.

01:19:00

It should have been, if it's a real miracle, it's gonna be verifiable or falsifiable even.

01:19:08

Yeah, that's right. That's right. And you have to think about this. When Jesus was doing this for vindication, you get to Mark eight,

01:19:22

Jesus sighs and he says, I'm not gonna give you a sign. The only thing, the only sign you're gonna find is when you see the, as it was in the days of Noah type thing, you know, he says, there's not gonna be a sign given to you.

01:19:38

You know, you're gonna see, I think it's amazing to me that he rejected them.

01:19:44

And the sign that he said he was not, that they were gonna get was the absolute judgment that was to come.

01:19:53

The end times judgment. Yep. You know, and we wanna say, well, you know what?

01:19:59

There's gold dust can fly out of all this stuff. And I know the, if we go through fire tunnels and we can do all this crazy stuff, you know, it's amazing that they are never in keeping with what the scripture says, you know, because they've made a new normal.

01:20:17

They've made the mundane, the miracle, you know. Go ahead.

01:20:25

No, I've never seen, I didn't see anywhere in the Bible where Jesus was sprinkling gold glitter and saying, hey, look everybody.

01:20:32

Right. No. No, no tooth fillings, turning into gold and angel feathers and gold dust, which is just stationary glitter that people dump into the ventilation system.

01:20:42

You know, that's not how this works. It's not how any of this works. Can I be, may

01:20:50

I be a little bold here? Go ahead. Absolutely. I love hearing you get bold.

01:20:57

I am a guest and this is not my program, but I was just texting my friend, Josh Comstock.

01:21:02

I think if you see him pop up in the, he and I went to a Benny Hinn crusade together.

01:21:10

2019. Yeah. Yeah. Fall of 2019. And I just invited him to come on the show.

01:21:16

I hope that's okay. But I would love for him to, he's on my board of directors. Josh is a great guy.

01:21:25

And it'd be interesting to have him. So if you see him pop up, if you don't mind letting, letting me in.

01:21:31

Absolutely not a problem at all. Okay. So, so let's look at a couple of negative qualifiers because everybody always wants to say, you know, well,

01:21:41

I can speak in tongues. I can do all this stuff. Well, a couple of the negatives, look at Deuteronomy 13, for example.

01:21:48

Now what does Deuteronomy 13 have to do with, you know, the prosody in China. And if you start looking at the scripture, because it all matters, by the way, it's not been relegated to the back seat.

01:21:58

It all matters. If we look at what the scripture tells us about in Deuteronomy, we find out that there are these false teachers that come in.

01:22:11

They, and, and it is clear that there is judgment to come. The warning here in Deuteronomy 13 is, is, is this.

01:22:23

If there are people that come in and they try to pull you away from, you know, from the word of God, from the truth of God.

01:22:30

If they try to pull you away, you don't accept them. You don't just jump in and say, you know, oh, wow, you've got a word.

01:22:36

You got a vision. You got a prophecy. And the old Testament, you would stone them. You, brother, come on in here.

01:22:43

There's a brother, Josh Comstock. Hey there. Oh. Well, how you doing?

01:22:50

Hey brother. How you guys doing? Josh, how you brother? Doing good. I'm very good sir. Good, good, good, good.

01:22:56

Well, I just finished my dinner. So I hear there's a show and I, I was missing it. So here I am. Oh yeah.

01:23:05

We're actually talking about Deuteronomy 13, actually four, four and five.

01:23:12

I'm going to pull this up here. Deuteronomy 13, four and five, you know, cause like we were talking about, everybody wants to claim that they have a vision or that they have a message from God.

01:23:24

And so here comes the question, you know, we're going to pull it up. Actually, let me do it.

01:23:30

Let me do it a little differently since we're all in here. We're going to throw ourselves on the side and, and we'll do a screen share and pull it up.

01:23:37

Work a little bit better.

01:23:46

Knows way more about technology than I do. I always tell people, if it's not 2000 years old,

01:23:51

I don't know much about it. I'll tell you, Josh is the tech guru.

01:24:00

Look, I would be, I would be doing my, I would be doing my YouTube channel and my seminars with puppets and, and if it weren't for Josh Comstock.

01:24:17

Okay. Can everybody see that? Is that a little too small still? I mean,

01:24:22

I can see it. All right. Let me pull that up there, make it a little bit bigger and let's see.

01:24:31

Okay. Let's see. Let's drop that out.

01:24:37

You don't want to read it in Hebrew? Well, I can do that for you if you want. You shall not listen to the words of, let's jump back to two.

01:24:48

I like, I like a little bit context. Let's go all the way to one. If a prophet or a dreamer of dreams arises among you and gives you a sign or a wonder, but wait a minute, there's no such thing as a person today that gives a false sign and wonder.

01:25:07

Is there? No. I mean, everybody says the proof, the proof is that I did the work, that I did the miracle, that I did the sign, right?

01:25:22

It vindicates me. I can speak in tongue, so I'm vindicated. But it says here that if one arises among you and gives a sign or a wonder, and the sign or the wonder does what?

01:25:37

Comes true. Comes true. Concerning which he spoke to you saying, let us go after other gods whom you have not known and let us serve them.

01:25:48

You shall not listen to the words of that prophet. Now, Justin, just ask the question.

01:25:55

Have you ever heard of any false teachers trying to get us to go towards different false gods?

01:26:01

Maybe say, for example, in Hinduism, Buddhism or anything like that, using signs and wonders?

01:26:08

Oh, yeah. All the time. I mean, that's their bread and butter.

01:26:13

That's what they do. They claim signs and wonders. Hindus and practitioners of Kundalini, they exhibit the exact same behaviors that charismatics do.

01:26:27

All of the same things. Dreams and visions, speaking in tongues, uncontrollable laughter, shaking, jerking, prophesying.

01:26:38

And they claim physical healings. And they do all of the same things that charismatics claim to do.

01:26:44

They do them in the exact same way. The exact same way. There's literally no difference.

01:26:51

And I think you came on the show, I wanna say three weeks ago. It might've been a little bit more than that.

01:26:57

And you actually went through some of the things that these guys do without naming them.

01:27:04

And everybody was like, well, that's the charismatics. And you said, no, that was, I believe it was

01:27:09

Hindus. I believe you're talking about. Yeah, Kundalini. Yep, Hindu Kundalini. Yep. Well, but think about it.

01:27:15

What do we see in the church today? Yoga. Yoga's a common practice in the church today and nobody has a problem with it.

01:27:24

Yep, that's right. Josh, since you're here, it was 2019.

01:27:31

You and I went to Benny Hinn, right? Yes. So did we see any signs of, he had a healing service.

01:27:42

You know, we were there for a miracle healing service. Did we see any real miracles? What were your impressions of Benny Hinn's night, that evening?

01:27:50

I was pretty impressed when you got up and started walking around the stage. But other than that.

01:27:57

Yeah, I was healed briefly and then I think wore out. No, it was definitely an experience.

01:28:07

I think the most or the biggest takeaway that I took from that event that night was nothing that Benny Hinn actually said or allegedly did.

01:28:17

It was actually the fact that there was, as you remember, as we were walking into the door, there was somebody, as you were being incognito, that came up to you and said, hey, are you

01:28:29

Justin Peters? I'm like, oh boy, here we go. And they said, I love your videos.

01:28:34

I watch you on YouTube. And I'm thinking, what are you doing here? Right. But that was real, that was a little bit bizarre.

01:28:43

That was weird. But no, anything else, it was definitely, I mean,

01:28:49

I remember getting the stink eye because we sat in two separate spots. But when they were lifting their hands and praying in tongues or whatever they were doing, and I was just standing there.

01:28:59

I mean, I stood out like a sore thumb because I just was standing there with my hands out of my side, you know?

01:29:04

And man, I could feel just the laser beams from across the aisle of people staring me down from not participating.

01:29:10

But it was a very uncomfortable feeling. But there again, it's almost like, if you stop and think about that, it was the looks

01:29:20

I was receiving from people, it was not of concern or, oh, maybe he doesn't know what's going on.

01:29:28

It was very much like, why aren't you participating?

01:29:33

As if it was a show, right? It wasn't something that was naturally happening. It was definitely different, for sure.

01:29:41

The first time I've ever experienced anything like that before. Yeah, yeah, indeed.

01:29:46

Yeah, and we, I mean, he had, Benny Hinn had people come up to the front there and claim to be healed, but all of them were psychosomatic.

01:29:58

None of them were any verifiable miracles. In fact, where I was sitting, there was, I've been to enough of these,

01:30:04

I kind of know how to pick these people out, but there was an older couple, a lady, she was overweight, and who

01:30:12

I assumed was her husband, I later found out was her fiance, in a wheelchair next to her.

01:30:20

And as kind of the early part of the service, I noticed that she had her hand back on her, if I can get my hand back there, but kind of on the back of her neck, and she was just kind of like doing this, like her neck was hurting, and she was just doing that before the healing ever started.

01:30:40

And when I looked over and I saw her doing that, I thought to myself, she's gonna be one of the ones that are gonna be healed.

01:30:49

Sure enough, sure enough, when the healing portion came, this lady walked up,

01:30:56

I've got it on video, I could pull it up right now, but she came up and Benny Hinn proclaimed her to be healed of her muscle tension and all that kind of stuff, and proclaimed her to be healed.

01:31:13

She said that she was healed, she said that, oh, her neck is better, my neck is better, I can move my neck, I can, and then she said, she said, my fiance, and she pointed over at him, my fiance is here in a wheelchair, and he just said, oh, madam, we pray for him too.

01:31:32

And he motioned her on, and that was the end of it. And like that right there.

01:31:38

Okay, so the lady with the sore neck is healed, but the guy in the wheelchair, oh, we pray for him too.

01:31:44

We believe for him too. You know, like, yeah, that's typical. That's how this works. That's how he does his thing, that's

01:31:52

Benny Hinn. That's Todd White, that's all of them, charlatans. Well, so we're talking about the negative aspects now of miracles.

01:32:05

Now we just talked about Deuteronomy, and we looked at what God commands about, you know, being on the lookout for these guys that claim these miracles, and some that even do it by the power of Satan.

01:32:18

Because I'm gonna tell you, they're not doing it by the power of God. And one of the evidence is they're trying to get you to worship a different God, okay?

01:32:27

They're trying to get you to worship a different God, in a way, or worship God in a way that he will not condone.

01:32:34

Oh, I'm worshiping God, I just don't believe in Jesus, or I'm worshiping Jesus, I just don't believe in God, the

01:32:40

Father. I'm worshiping, you know, the Mormon God, the Mormon Jesus. I'm worshiping, you know,

01:32:47

Jehovah's Witness Jesus. You know, you name it. There's all kinds of different Jesuses that people are calling for us to worship in the name of these signs, wonders, and miracles, in the name of a lot of these different things.

01:33:04

And the scripture tells us over again, not to do it. But here's another one. Paul says, whether it be of men or angels, do not believe them if they're coming to you with a different, what?

01:33:20

Gospel, a different message, right? He says, don't listen to them, don't believe them, don't follow their way.

01:33:28

And the greatest deceiver that's gonna show up, dispensational, the one that's gonna show up is this guy here, and he's in Revelation 13, five.

01:33:41

Listen to what he says. And he opened his mouth up with blasphemies against God to blaspheme his name and his tabernacle, that is, those who dwell in heaven.

01:33:52

And it was given to him. It wasn't on his own authority. He was allowed to do this, to make war with the saints and to overcome them and authority over every tribe and people and nation and tongue was given to him.

01:34:07

All who dwell on the earth will worship him. Everyone whose name has not been written from the foundation of the world in the book of the life of the lamb who has been slain.

01:34:21

And then if you jump down to verse 13 and 14, it says this. Excuse me.

01:34:27

He performs great signs so that he even makes fire come down from heaven to the earth in the presence of men.

01:34:38

And he deceives those who dwell on the earth because of the signs, which it was given to him to perform in the presence of the beast, telling those who dwell on the earth to make an image to the beast who had the wound of the sword.

01:34:55

And I see, and has come to come to life. So the whole point here is what?

01:35:01

Even Satan who comes as an angel of light can do what? Can perform signs, wonders and miracles.

01:35:09

Yeah. You know, Cody was asking that question.

01:35:15

Why don't people assume that Satan has not got the power to do this? That's one of the things that we gotta be careful of.

01:35:23

It's not just, oh, I can do a sign and a wonder. What is it coming from?

01:35:30

Because does it vindicate God? Does it vindicate the message? And what's the purpose in it?

01:35:37

What's the purpose in it? Something I'd like to ask Justin Peters is, do you believe that there's people in the

01:35:49

Pentecostal charismatic movement that are saved? Yes.

01:35:56

Yes, I do. I do believe there are some, I do not believe that all charismatics are lost.

01:36:04

I don't believe that, don't teach that, never have. I do believe there are genuine, some genuine

01:36:09

Christians in the Pentecostal slash charismatic, you know, all

01:36:15

Pentecostal charismatic, not all charismatics are Pentecostal, but I do believe there are some real sheep in this movement that having been said,

01:36:25

I think there are far more lost in this movement than there are genuine

01:36:32

Christians. I would also say, I'm sorry. I was just gonna say,

01:36:39

I just wanted our audience to hear that so they don't think that we're just saying all charismatics are going to hell, because I've been accused of saying that before.

01:36:47

Yeah, no, no, I don't believe that at all. These issues are not primary.

01:36:53

They don't go, they're not top tier. They don't go to the gospel itself, but I do believe that they're, these issues are of such an importance that for the second tier issues, they're at the top of the second tier.

01:37:12

They're at the top of the second tier and they're kind of bumping the floor of the first tier, but they're not there.

01:37:18

They're at the top of the second tier, because the fact of the matter is, is you cannot hold to a charismatic position and to the sufficiency of scripture at the same time.

01:37:29

You just can't do it. Those two positions are mutually exclusive. Definitionally, they're mutually exclusive positions.

01:37:37

So it's a very important secondary, very important. And I do not, however, believe that there are any mature

01:37:48

Christians that go to one of these false churches. I mean, a demonstrably false church,

01:37:55

Joel Osteen, Benny Hinn, Joyce Meyer, Joseph Prince, Bill Johnson, Bethel Church.

01:38:04

Are there a few sheep in Bethel Church? Probably. Are there any mature

01:38:10

Christians at Bethel Church? Zero, none, because if you were mature by definition, you wouldn't be in a false church.

01:38:20

So there would be maybe some very young sheep there who are saved more, not because of what is taught, but more in spite of what is taught at Bethel.

01:38:31

But there would be absolutely zero mature believers in a demonstrably false church.

01:38:39

Yeah. If they were mature, they wouldn't be there. One other question.

01:38:44

Oh, good. Thank you. Now, do you believe anybody who rejects slash denies the

01:38:51

Trinity in these movements are real believers? No, no.

01:38:57

Could you explain that? So do I believe you have to -

01:39:02

We'll talk about that too. Huh? Yeah, so we're going to actually really hit that harder in just a minute. Yeah.

01:39:09

So like, one, this Pentecostals, by their own doctrinal statement, they deny the

01:39:14

Trinity. One, this Pentecostals do. I do not believe you have to fully understand the

01:39:22

Trinity in order to be a Christian, because if that were true, then I would not be a Christian, because I don't fully understand it, that doctrine, you know, three in one, you know, that kind of makes your head swim.

01:39:38

One God, three distinct persons, each of whom is fully

01:39:44

God, and they're distinct personalities. I mean, distinct persons, but they're not, but there's not three gods.

01:39:51

There's one God, three persons, each of whom is God. You know, that scrambles our brains, right?

01:39:56

I mean, it does. So I don't, no, none of us fully understands it. As Charles Spurgeon said, he said, as well might a gnat,

01:40:06

G -N -A -T, as well might a gnat seek to drink in the ocean, so might a finite creature seek to comprehend the eternal

01:40:13

God. But even though I can't fully understand the triunity of God, I fully believe it, 100 % believe it.

01:40:24

Why? Because that's what Scripture teaches. Now, someone who is shown that from Scripture, and they see the

01:40:33

Trinity, and not the word, but they see the doctrine so clearly laid out in Scripture, the personhood of Christ, the personhood of the

01:40:43

Holy Spirit, the personhood of the Father, and how they're distinct. They see that from Scripture, and they consider it, and they reject it, and they say, no,

01:40:51

I don't believe that, then that person's not a Christian. Does that make sense?

01:40:58

Yeah. Makes perfect sense. I wanted to try to emphasize, we do believe there's charismatics that are saved, but there's whole swaths, a lot of them deny the

01:41:17

Trinity, and one of the people that we talked to a few weeks ago denies the

01:41:25

Trinity, teaches against the Trinity. Yeah, I found that out too. That would be a non -Christian, yeah.

01:41:33

That's one thing I want to kind of jump into while we're talking here in just a second.

01:41:40

Let's lay this foundation out, and the reason we're doing this is because as we noticed, we talked about miracles, signs, wonders, and the

01:41:49

Trinity, and the reason we did that is each one of these issues, miracles, signs, wonders, all have the purpose of being non -counterfeitable to prove that God has vindicated

01:42:03

His own messengers to a miracle must be, has a function of divine revelation, and so I don't want people to miss this.

01:42:13

The miracles that we're talking about that are biblical miracles, all of those things that we talked about, raising the dead and things like that, we see those three times in the

01:42:23

Scripture, in the Testaments, in the Old and New Testament, with Moses, with Ezekiel, and in the

01:42:28

New Testament, while God is vindicating His message and His messengers. We don't see it outside of that.

01:42:36

It's not normative, right? That's right. And here's why it's so important. If God has given, and I kept on dwelling on this, if God has given a message for humanity to know

01:42:50

Him and to know His purpose and to come to know how we can be right with God, how would

01:42:58

God do that? By just giving it to everybody and say, Justin, you had a vision.

01:43:04

Can you tell me what yours was? Josiah, hey, Josh, can you maybe tell us what yours was? Let's write it down.

01:43:11

No. God had to convincingly and authoritatively both tell us what is a false message and tell us what is a true vindicated message.

01:43:25

And by the way, the reason we're talking about the Trinity is because we're talking about what

01:43:31

God did and who is God. It's the God of Scripture.

01:43:38

You see it, and I know people talk about circularity here, but it's the God of Scripture. We're talking about the triune

01:43:45

God. If you don't know Him, if He's not the one that has given you the message from Him, then you don't have the

01:43:52

God of the Bible. Amen? You don't have that God from the

01:43:57

Bible. And that's why it's so important that we understand the qualifications, Acts 2 .2,

01:44:04

Hebrews 2 .3 -4 tells us the same qualifications. We don't have time to get through all of them, so I'm just gonna list them out.

01:44:12

John 3 .2 tells us that Nicodemus comes and says, says what?

01:44:18

Rabbi, we know that you've come from God as a teacher for no one does these signs that you were doing unless God is with him.

01:44:26

So the vindication is there, but we have to believe in God as He's presented

01:44:32

Himself in the Scripture. And we have to qualify that the reason that Justin said the

01:44:39

Trinity, if you don't believe in the Trinity, no, you're not a Christian. Now, like he said, we're not sitting there going through a doctrinal thesis on the

01:44:48

Trinity, you know, because the truth of the matter is this, you know,

01:44:54

I'm gonna keep referring back to Dr. Bookman. He's a genius.

01:44:59

And he said this, there is no parallel in all of creation to the

01:45:05

Trinity. We can't understand it by any means. You know, we cannot -

01:45:13

There's no analogy that fits. Exactly. He's like water doesn't fit. You know, what is that one, the

01:45:21

Lutheran satire thing? Oh, there's a few analogies.

01:45:28

So water, you know, water, vapor, ice, there's a three -leaf clover, you know,

01:45:35

God's like an egg. You got a yolk and the white and then the shell, you know, all that.

01:45:44

No, when God said - Come on, Patrick. That's the one. That's moralism,

01:45:51

Patrick. I'm gonna pull that up. I wanna pull that up. We don't have time for it, I guess. You know, yeah, that's hilarious, but it's true.

01:45:59

I think maybe James White, you know, he does a really good job talking about the triangle, you know, and whatnot.

01:46:07

And of course you guys have seen the triangle with, you know, God the father is not

01:46:12

God the son. God the son is not, you know, it goes down that list. Let's see if I can pull something up here while you guys are jabbering.

01:46:25

Yeah. Yeah, when we talk about the

01:46:30

Trinity, we're not talking about some kind of manmade formula or idea.

01:46:36

It's just, you know, when the Bible talks about God, it talks about God the father, talks about God the son, talks about God the

01:46:43

Holy Spirit. We also see that the scripture says that God is one. And we also know that Jesus is not the father.

01:46:51

We know that the father is not the Holy Spirit and it's boundaries that God placed for us to understand of himself.

01:47:06

Not something that we came up with. Yeah, when God said in Isaiah 40,

01:47:14

I'm not sure of the verse, I know it's Isaiah 40, to whom will you compare me, to whom will you liken me and who will be my equal?

01:47:22

That was not a challenge. Okay, that's not like, okay, come up with something that is like me, come up with an analogy that's like me.

01:47:32

That wasn't a challenge. God was affirming his uniqueness, that there's no one, there's no one, there's no thing that you can compare

01:47:44

God to, nothing. So it wasn't come up with an egg or a three leaf clover.

01:47:54

Well, and the reason that we wanted to, I better pull this all the way up, I guess. Okay, the reason we wanted to kind of talk that, because I talked about that at the end here, is

01:48:07

I can't remember two weeks ago, I think it was, or I can't remember when it was, a pastor by the name of Michael Salmon, he came in to the show and I don't know him, but Andrew and Justin, you guys had conversation with him.

01:48:26

And it was talking about the signs, it was talking about speaking in tongues and things, as I recall.

01:48:35

And everything seemed to be pretty well up and up. But the reason we did the beginning of this is we have to understand that when people start talking about signs, wonders, miracles, and everything else, we're talking about the

01:48:48

God of creation, the God of the Bible, the God that he's, as he has presented himself in scripture.

01:48:55

Now we see throughout the scripture that God has presented himself as God, the

01:49:00

Father, God, the Son, and God, the Holy Spirit. Okay, it is definably and definitionally here.

01:49:06

But Michael, unbeknownst, we didn't know, but Michael comes along,

01:49:12

Mr. Salmon, he comes in, he says, it took me about 30 seconds to pull this up on his

01:49:17

Facebook page. He says, by grace alone, by faith alone, by Christ alone, unless you do not believe in Calvinism, Trinity, eternal torment, so he denies the hell, and pre -trib rapture,

01:49:32

R -O -F -L. Roll on the floor laughing. And that's kind of ambiguous.

01:49:38

It's like, well, okay, what does that mean? I've heard people use

01:49:44

Genesis 1 .26 to prove the Trinity. Genesis 1 .26, God said, let us make man in our image and our likeness.

01:49:52

What? A lot of people do not see that the word let us and our, and our was added by the translators.

01:50:02

Did you guys know that? It's game over.

01:50:07

It's Hebrew plural with a singular verb.

01:50:15

So it. Elohim. You know, it's really, it's a good, it's a good thing that you can have like Logos Bible software, for example.

01:50:31

You know, it's really good to have stuff like that. Because, you know, when you don't know, you don't just trust people to say like statements like he just made.

01:50:42

You can actually go to scripture and you can go and look at, you know, things such as Logos Bible software.

01:50:50

That's really nice. You actually have multiple different definition, definitional meanings of God in the scripture.

01:51:01

And like Josiah just said, you know, what is one of those, what is one of those definitions?

01:51:10

And we see it is Elohim. Now Elohim, you guys have been through school on this.

01:51:19

So, so what does Elohim mean? Means.

01:51:26

Josiah go ahead. Means Hebrew it's, it's God, El is

01:51:32

God. Elohim would be the plural of, of God. And so you see oftentimes when it's not talking about the one

01:51:39

God of Israel, it's translated as multiple gods.

01:51:45

El can also mean mighty ones. So it could also mean multiple mighty ones. Exactly. So you have, most people don't know, but Elohim is, is called a

01:51:56

Hebrew locative. Okay. It's kind of like when you say water or the waters, you're not talking about one hydrogen atom, hydrogen atom, you're talking about water.

01:52:10

And however much is there is what? It's water. Now you would say water's plural because you look at the ocean or you look at the seas and things and you say, that's a lot of water.

01:52:21

Okay. But it's all water. That's a locative. Okay. So no matter how much you break it down, it's all water.

01:52:29

When you're talking about Elohim, you're talking about God as he has, as he identifies himself, as he is in the natural state, in the spiritual state, however else you want to say it, but it's

01:52:43

God, Elohim. He is God. So his first thing you have to see is, okay, does the

01:52:50

Bible say anything about Elohim? And so how about, let's see, we can go to,

01:52:58

I'm gonna move things around just a little bit. I got too much open, it's getting mad at me.

01:53:07

Let's see. I don't have my legacies

01:53:13

Bible on here. I may have to buy one. So that way I can get that on here. I love that.

01:53:22

The more I read the legacy, the more I like it. It's, it even tightens up and I love the new

01:53:28

American standard. That's what I've always preached from because it's the most literal, but the legacy standard, it's not just Yahweh and Dulas, slave that they've changed.

01:53:38

There's other, it's tightened up on the participles and some of the tenses. It's just, it's tighter.

01:53:46

It's a more, it's more literal. I like it a lot.

01:53:54

Let's see if anybody - It shows even the flow. I have the New Testament and I've been studying

01:53:59

Greek for four and a half years. And it even shows the flow of the

01:54:07

Greek, how each word flows together real well. I really enjoyed reading the

01:54:15

New Testament LSB that I got. I wanna get the whole thing, but I just haven't been able to get it yet.

01:54:24

Zoom in. So somebody is asking me if I can zoom in. So let me go ahead and try to make this a little bit, a little bit larger.

01:54:32

So I appreciate you guys kind of indulging here just for a second. You see this word

01:54:37

Elohim? Let me read this out for you. This is, this is a interlineary. It's the original

01:54:45

Hebrew writings that we've gotten down throughout the history. So we know that they're good and solid.

01:54:52

And it says Genesis chapter one, Barashit bara

01:55:01

Elohim et. Okay, so we'll just stop right there.

01:55:06

In the beginning created bara Elohim.

01:55:13

That's that, it's that plural locative. In other words, you don't take the ending, the eme ending off of there.

01:55:22

The eme is your plural. You don't take it off there and say Allah. That's not

01:55:28

God. God is the plural being, but what does it go on and say? It goes on and says, let me jump down.

01:55:42

Well, if you go back, bara is the third masculine singular and it goes with, with God.

01:55:49

So it means that in the beginning, God, the multiple plural

01:55:57

God created. Yeah, but think about this.

01:56:05

When we read the scripture, we read it and we go, well, can we really trust it?

01:56:11

Can we really trust that it's telling us the truth or can we see it? Can we trust that we have the original

01:56:19

Old Testament, that we have the writings that are important to understand?

01:56:25

Well, if you go and you start doing your study, Logos, am

01:56:31

I saying it right? Logos, Logos. Logos. I think Andrew gets all of it. The English pronunciation is

01:56:37

Logos. Okay. Yeah. So we look over here and we say in verse two, and the earth was formless and void and darkness was over the surface of the deep and the spirit of God was moving over the surface of the water.

01:56:52

Then God said, let there be. Okay. It goes right here and it says, darkness was over the surface.

01:57:02

Va, oh man, it's been so, it's been, it's been a while here. Vahashka, Vahashak, Elponay.

01:57:12

I can't tell if that's New York key. Yeah, Elponay. So darkness was on the face of the waters.

01:57:20

Okay. Of the deep is what it actually means. Tehoim, Vahara.

01:57:29

Okay. That's the spirit breath, spirit or breath of God.

01:57:37

Vahara Elohim. So you have God, Ruach, I'm sorry, you're right.

01:57:45

I'm sorry. You have Vah Ruach, that's the spirit himself.

01:57:51

So you have God Elohim at the beginning, God, the spirit here doing this hovering over.

01:58:00

We don't know what he was doing. We weren't there. But we notice that if we go back to what

01:58:10

Michael said, I've heard people use Genesis 126 to prove the Trinity and he goes down here and he says, but all of that was added by the translators.

01:58:22

Well, that's false. That's demonstrably false. That's false in every way.

01:58:29

Now, we don't have time to go through every single a bit of these issues.

01:58:36

But I just want to point out that he says there was a time when he studied

01:58:41

Islam and according to what they understood in Islam, they got their understanding of the

01:58:47

Trinity from the Roman Catholic Church. The Roman Catholic Church kind of demonstrated the

01:58:57

Trinity, you guys recall how they did this, right? God, the father and then the mother and the son.

01:59:10

Not specifically, but there was a lot that led that direction. So that's where he got this from and his understanding of the

01:59:18

Trinity from and that's why he's fighting against it. Because to him, Jesus is the old and new

01:59:25

Testament and the only God. We could go to other passages and deal with these issues and clear these things up.

01:59:33

I mean, we could go to many more passages and deal with these. We can go to, let me pull it up.

01:59:41

My phone went to sleep. Acts 20, which a lot of people may not think of Acts as a go -to book for the

01:59:54

Trinity, but Acts 20, verse 28. Acts 20, 28,

02:00:01

I don't know if you can pull that up, Justin. I'll get it right now. He's at 20, he just needs to go to 28. There you go.

02:00:08

Be on guard for yourselves and all the flock among which the

02:00:13

Holy Spirit hath us Pneuma, third person right there. So there's the third person.

02:00:21

I'm sorry about that. I went to, I was trying to get this where you could see it a little easier. Yeah, no, that's fine. Okay. So see that?

02:00:30

Okay. Be on guard for yourselves for all the flock among which the Holy Spirit, third person has made you overseers to shepherd the church of God, first person, which he purchased with his own blood, second person.

02:00:47

There's a Trinity right there. No, not the word, but there's the doctrine.

02:00:53

All three members of the Godhood right there. So if you look in the scripture, you see it clearly that God is defined.

02:01:06

You know, one argument that comes up, let's kind of speak this just for a second.

02:01:11

One argument that comes up, guys, well, Jesus didn't claim to be God. Okay, Kenneth Copeland, thanks for that.

02:01:19

Yeah, that's what Kenneth Copeland said. Yeah, he says it all the time. Jesus never claimed to be God. I mean, many people try to make that claim that Jesus didn't claim to be

02:01:29

God. They don't care about context. They don't care about any reason for what he said and why he said it, you know?

02:01:38

Yeah, I mean, before Abraham was, I am. If you have seen me, you have seen the father. I and the father are one.

02:01:45

Jesus forgave sin, something that only God can do. Jesus accepted worship, something that only

02:01:51

God should accept. So he most certainly did claim to be God.

02:02:00

Todd Friel and Phil Johnson did a really great booklet called The Man Who Split Time that teaches really well on that, showing all the instances where Jesus claimed to be

02:02:12

God by his miracles, his statements that only

02:02:18

God can make, and then rising from the dead. Yeah. That's a pretty big one.

02:02:25

That's, yeah. That's pretty significant. I wanna show you guys something, and let's just see.

02:02:33

I think we'll all agree with it. Well, I don't know, maybe not, but I would assume we would.

02:02:39

Mark 1 9, Jesus was going to get baptized. In those days,

02:02:46

Jesus came from Nazareth to Galilee, in Galilee, and was baptized by John in the

02:02:51

Jordan. Immediately coming up out of the water, he saw the heavens opening.

02:02:57

So who was being baptized? Jesus. Second person, Jesus. So Jesus, second person

02:03:03

Trinity, Jesus is in the water. He saw the heavens opening and a spirit like a dove descending upon him, second person.

02:03:12

So spirit like a dove, capital S is third person, right?

02:03:18

And a voice came out of the heavens. So Jesus was either a ventriloquist and he was faking it, and he made a flaming dove, or this is telling us that there is

02:03:34

God, the Father, God, the Son, God, the Holy Spirit, all in the same place at the same time.

02:03:40

Verse 11 says, and a voice came out of the heavens. You are my beloved son and you,

02:03:46

I am well pleased. All right. That's right.

02:03:52

There's the Trinity right there. And when, go ahead,

02:03:57

Joe. No, no, no, you go right ahead. I was just gonna say, when Jesus spoke of the

02:04:02

Holy Spirit, you know, it is your advantage that I go away, for the helper will come to you.

02:04:11

And when he comes, he will teach you. Jesus referred to the Holy Spirit using masculine pronouns, even though the word for spirit in Greek, pneuma, is neuter in its gender.

02:04:29

It's a neuter word regarding its grammatical construction in Greek, gender.

02:04:37

But Jesus consistently referred to the Holy Spirit with masculine pronouns.

02:04:44

He, he will come, he will do this. He will say, he will teach you. He will convict.

02:04:49

So either Jesus had really bad grammar, or he understood that the

02:04:55

Holy Spirit is a person and a masculine person at that.

02:05:03

In John chapter 20, verse 28, we see that Thomas, old doubting

02:05:10

Thomas, I can't stand that name. I can't stand that name because it's like, wait a minute.

02:05:16

Poor Thomas. Poor Thomas. I mean, he was a man on fire. He got his, you know, he went through just as much turmoil as Peter and everyone else.

02:05:25

He says, I won't see unless I touch him. And just before this -

02:05:31

Not until they saw him. Not until they saw him. And by the way, he said, not until I stick my hand in his side, stick my hand in his, you know, pierced arms.

02:05:41

I'm not gonna believe it. And then he looks and he says, my Lord and my

02:05:47

God. And Jesus gave a little chiding there, a little rebuke.

02:05:54

Because you've seen me, you believe? Blessed are those who do not see, yet they believe. Believe what?

02:06:01

That he is the Lord God. More than that though, it goes down to verse 30.

02:06:08

Therefore, many of the signs Jesus also performed in the presence of the disciples, which weren't written in the book, you know.

02:06:15

And they all vindicated who Jesus was. All the way up to the death, burial, and resurrection of Jesus Christ.

02:06:25

Well, guys, I'm gonna tell you, I don't know about you, but I think, I think we may have kind of just, you know, put the nail in the coffin on the idea that Jesus is the only one and only

02:06:39

God type. There is no father, son, the Holy Spirit, Trinity. Michael, if you wanna come on and correct what we're seeing here,

02:06:50

I actually watched two of his teaching videos where he actually teaches against the

02:06:55

Nicene Creed, saying, and the Apostolic Creed and whatnot, saying that they were, they didn't actually teach the

02:07:02

Trinity. That we're all wrong. I've noticed, guys, that there's a lot of that going on.

02:07:10

From, you know, Norm, the Church of Christ guy, you're all wrong, you know.

02:07:15

The Mormons, you're all wrong. The Jehovah's Witnesses, you're all wrong. Anti -Trinitarian, you're all wrong.

02:07:22

I've got a different God and a different revelation. You know, you gotta do it this way, not that way.

02:07:29

So, I see that a lot. So, I don't know that we have much more to lay out, unless you guys have any other thoughts on this.

02:07:44

No, I enjoyed it. Yeah, I guess. I defer to you, gentlemen, you guys are the experts.

02:07:52

Got you, got you. We should probably pray for our brothers and sisters in Ukraine.

02:07:59

We'd be praying for them going through an invasion right now, a war.

02:08:07

I really don't care what side you're on on this. There's gonna be millions of deaths.

02:08:18

If not thousands of deaths of civilians, soldiers.

02:08:25

A lot of people will be going to hell who don't know the gospel.

02:08:32

There's gonna be believers that are gonna be swept up into eternity to be with Jesus. Maybe praying for the lost souls there in Ukraine.

02:08:42

We'd be praying for Russia, that maybe Vladimir Putin will, not

02:08:47

Putin, yeah, Putin will repent. And we'd be praying for the soldiers that maybe

02:08:58

God will change their heart. We do believe that God is all powerful.

02:09:05

We don't believe that he does mighty, miraculous miracles like sending fire down from heaven right now.

02:09:16

He will sweep the whole world up in fire one day and people are gonna be held accountable for their sins.

02:09:26

Whether it's Putin with his killing millions of people, whether it's people for just wanting to live in their sins of lying, stealing, using his name in vain.

02:09:42

God's gonna judge this world and you'd be praying for people's salvation during this really terrible time.

02:09:52

I preached in the Ukraine. I don't know why people call it the Ukraine. I preached in Ukraine a few years ago, urban Bible seminary.

02:10:04

And ever since all this stuff started, I just, you know, I think of those guys and gals and brothers and sisters.

02:10:13

And there's just such sweet, sweet people. And it's just hard to imagine right now what they're going through and about to go through.

02:10:26

It just breaks your heart. There's good churches in Ukraine. There's some good solid believers in Ukraine.

02:10:34

So we need to be praying for them, for their strength and for their safety, but especially for their witness in this time.

02:10:45

Absolutely. We definitely do. And that's the thing is we have a lot of Christians around the world that are being persecuted and gonna continue to be persecuted.

02:10:56

I'd say it, but we have a terrible president. We have one that will not lead and he's going to, the

02:11:05

Hollywood elite and all these other people are going to try to tell you how, that we're evil, we're wrong, we're bad, we're terrible because we're not part of the woke crowd and whatnot.

02:11:17

And I think, Justin, you and I are gonna talk maybe about that next week as well. We go through and start talking about some critical race theory and what's going on right now, because this is so important.

02:11:28

You gotta realize we're dealing with a worldview issue. And I'm not gonna be of any illusion to say that Donald Trump was a

02:11:38

Christian. We've said it on here many times, we didn't believe he was a Christian, but he was trying to do the right thing.

02:11:44

He was trying to do what was right. Yeah, he had a lot of bad people around him. He's not a, he was not a

02:11:53

Christian, okay? But he was trying to do the right thing. One of the right things as far as government is concerned is to see to it that as Christians, we can share the gospel and proclaim the truth, the word of God.

02:12:07

As even as non -believers that you can live your life and that we try to protect the rights of all the living, because as we believe, the scripture tells us and so does the constitution, that we were endowed by our creator with certain unalienable rights.

02:12:26

In other words, they didn't come from government, they didn't come from society, they came from God. Well, today we live in a society that says there is no

02:12:34

God, there is only government and the only way to get equity, equality, rights, freedoms is by the use of force.

02:12:46

And that use of force has to come from the divine government because we've gotten rid of God. Now that's

02:12:53

Marxism, that's socialism. We're gonna talk about that next week. So I wanna encourage everybody to please come on and watch us and share and tell us what you think.

02:13:03

We're gonna talk about that a lot next week. But I'll say this, to Michael, I've read your stuff,

02:13:09

I've looked at what you've been teaching on and it boils down to this. You say, talking about the

02:13:16

Trinity, such a problem doctrine. Jesus Christ is the word in the flesh, not the son in the flesh.

02:13:25

The word is God, not the son. The son died for us, God cannot die.

02:13:34

Fundamental flaw in your understanding of who God is and why we said from the very beginning that this matters.

02:13:42

And I want everybody to understand this. The reason this matters is when you claim miracle signs and wonders and you don't know the

02:13:50

God of the Bible, you don't know the God of creation, the God of Christianity, the one that founded, lived and died for us.

02:14:00

God, the father who purposed in his will to cause these things to happen. God, the son who by his life, his death, his burial, his resurrection, but he paid that sin debt.

02:14:14

And God, the Holy Spirit, who affected all of these things by his will, his power as well.

02:14:21

He brought these things out to regenerate our dead hearts. If you don't understand that, then you don't have the

02:14:27

God of the Bible. The miracle signs and wonders that you're doing, they are not of God. What you're doing is you're affirming false signs, false wonders, and false miracles.

02:14:39

So when you came on the show the other week and you're all about these signs and wonders and how you can do all these things, and for everybody else that does this, when you don't have the

02:14:49

God of the Bible, you don't have the miracles of God either. The first thing you have to do is -

02:14:58

What's that? Justin Pierce, is there anything you want to say to Michael Salmon, if he's listening?

02:15:07

Brother, have you got something you want? Yeah, yes, sir. Oh, I thought he said - Yeah, I thought he said Pierce. I did too, because we're just twin brothers here.

02:15:16

Yeah, no. I mean, I wish I had seen these statements from him before we had our discussion a couple of three weeks ago, whenever it was, because that's enormously troubling.

02:15:27

As I said, it's one thing to not fully understand the Trinity, because none of us do, does.

02:15:33

None of us does, but to know it's in scripture, to see it in scripture, and then consciously reject it, that makes me very worried for your soul.

02:15:48

So yeah, that's what I've seen here in these screenshots. That's heretical. Yeah, yeah, absolutely.

02:15:59

And, oh, I'm sorry, put it back on here. There we are. Okay, guys, we wanted to have this conversation, and it really was my burden tonight to have this conversation, because we said there's four things that the miracles had to do.

02:16:24

The whole purpose in these miracles was to vindicate the messenger and the message.

02:16:32

It was to vindicate God. It was to say that God is the one who has the right to give us his message, and we must submit to it.

02:16:44

You know, one thing about the messages is they were short. Well, the prophecies, for example, they were short -term.

02:16:51

They were entirely unreplicable by human ingenuity.

02:16:59

They were precise and specific, and today, we don't see that. When it comes to the signs and the wonders that people talk about with speaking in tongues, nobody knows what they're talking about, but in the

02:17:12

Bible, the tongues, what were they, Justin? Were they just angelic gibberish, or what was it?

02:17:18

Known human languages, just not known to the one speaking, or, by the way, known to the one who was doing the interpretation.

02:17:26

It was a supernatural ability to speak in a known human language that was not, like me speaking fluent

02:17:33

Swahili. It's a known language, just not known to me, and say, for example, Josiah, if you had the gift of interpretation or translation of tongues, you could translate what

02:17:43

I said in Swahili back into English, even though you, I'm assuming, don't know

02:17:48

Swahili either, but you could do that if you had the gift of translation of tongues. I know eight words in Swahili.

02:17:58

You know what? I don't know any. You know eight words in Swahili? I know eight words in Swahili. Do you?

02:18:03

Yes, I know. You know more than I know. Semba means lion, Mufasa means king,

02:18:10

Rafiki means friend, Mimbu means God. You got the little kids, so you're.

02:18:19

So you learned a little bit of Swahili My grandfather was a missionary to Africa for 50 years. I should have picked,

02:18:26

I don't know, Zulu or Mandarin or Farsi or something. Yeah, there you go.

02:18:32

So let's. I just know those eight words. Let's see if we go, Catherine Music, she said,

02:18:41

Justin, I want to thank you for coming on here. She said that she had learned a lot tonight, that she's learned something new tonight.

02:18:49

And guys, that's what we wanted to do. And I wanted to make sure that you understood that our grounding, our foundation is not in mundane, quote unquote, miracles.

02:19:02

It's in the revelatory, powerful word of God. He doesn't have to give us more revelation.

02:19:09

In fact, I would dare say that the vast majority of people in the world don't read their

02:19:14

Bible enough to know what it says, let alone to be able to say, God, I need more. There's not enough here.

02:19:21

But if you need to hear God speak, Justin, what should you do? You want to hear

02:19:28

God speak, read your Bible. If you want to hear God speak to you audibly, read it out loud.

02:19:35

100 % guarantee you will hear him speak. Amen. All right, guys, anybody got anything else?

02:19:42

We probably want to talk about our sponsor a little bit. Oh, yeah, that's right. Let's do sponsor because Andrew will beat us up.

02:19:48

We'll take us a nap. Yeah, let's see. Let's see, where is that at? Thanks a lot for putting me on the spot.

02:19:56

So, okay, so we do have a sponsor. We better throw a shout out here, mypillow .com. There's a promo code there for Striving for Eternity.

02:20:03

It's S -F -E. If you want a pillow and all the things that they have, I don't know what all they have, but it's a lot.

02:20:10

You could call 1 -800 -873 -0176 and just tell them about your promo code

02:20:16

S -F -E, and they would be glad to hook you up with pillows and blankets.

02:20:22

And what all they got? They got footies. They got the flippers, slippers. I don't wear them, so I don't know.

02:20:30

Yeah, both this pillow and the sheet are from MyPillow. I've always,

02:20:36

I liked how soft their sheets are, and their pillows are really comfy.

02:20:44

I used to wake up with a hurt neck, but I feel a lot better. And I also got the

02:20:49

MyPillow mattress topper, which this time I won't take apart my bed just so I can show it to you guys, but it helps my wife and I wake up without back problems.

02:21:00

Yeah, great. I use it a lot, I have one, I like it. I've got one of those thermal pillows that's got all cold, so it's not my pillow.

02:21:10

But anyway, so that was our spot for that. But I want to tell you guys about Logos. I said it right, it's

02:21:18

Logos Bible Software. Bit .ly, B -I -T dot L -Y backslash

02:21:23

S -F -E, Logos, L -O -G -O -S. So if you go there on your computer, sign in, we get you five free books, your choice, that'll be five free books.

02:21:39

I think Andrew's got a choice of multiple different books. I think it's like 20 % off to buy

02:21:48

Logos Bible Software. And you don't have to be uninformed about what the word of God teaches and about the purpose of God.

02:21:59

You can follow along, you can teach, you can study. You can study to show yourself approved unto

02:22:06

God. And I think that'd be a great, great thing for you guys, for your birthday or for whatever else.

02:22:11

I also want to encourage you. I got to say, Justin has become an incredibly good friend of mine.

02:22:20

I love Justin, we've never gotten to go, well, no, I take it back. We've gotten to go eat crawfish and stuff like that, the one restaurant.

02:22:29

But we don't get to hang out a lot, except for on here and text back and forth.

02:22:36

But he's a go -to for me. Andrew always says, who are you going to have on the show? I said, who do you think?

02:22:41

All the time, because I love you, brother. And we've become good friends and I love having you on.

02:22:51

But more than that. I enjoy coming on, honored by the invitation. Thank y 'all. But even more than that, he's a strong biblical

02:22:58

Christian and he needs your support. If you guys are looking to support somebody, you couldn't go better than to support my brother,

02:23:09

Justin. He always needs your support. We all do, COVID and all this stuff going on around the world.

02:23:15

It makes it hard on ministries. And if you're doing your work for your church and whatnot, and you want to reach out and do a little more support, please get a hold of Justin.

02:23:26

He's worthy of your time and your support. So just want to put that out there.

02:23:34

Thanks, brother. Absolutely. Well, anybody got anything else? Because if not, we're going to shut it down. One last thing.

02:23:41

I forgot to mention one other place you could buy my booklet. Okay, let's see it. What does it mean to me?

02:23:46

You can buy it at also trackedplanet .org, Andy. He does a great job.

02:23:52

He's actually the one who helped me print these. I'll have one coming for you as soon as Josiah helps me here.

02:24:02

Yeah, as soon as you get all the taxes worked out, we'll. Yep. Well, so everybody come and see us next week.

02:24:11

We'll have a good conversation. Justin, you're going to be in here next week with us, right? Lord willing, the creek don't rise.

02:24:18

I should be. Don't rise. There you go. We'd love to have you. As always, make today an eternal day for the glory of God.