Jimmy Caraway Interview

Welcome to No Compromise Radio, a ministry coming to you from Bethlehem Bible Church in West Boylston.

No Compromise Radio is a program dedicated to the ongoing proclamation of Jesus Christ based on the theme in Galatians 2, verse 5, where the apostle

Paul said, but we did not yield in subjection to them for even an hour, so that the truth of the gospel would remain with you.

In short, if you like smooth, watered down words to make you simply feel good, this show isn't for you.

By purpose, we are first biblical, but we can also be controversial. Stay tuned for the next 25 minutes as we're called by the divine trumpet to summon the troops for the honor and glory of her

King. Here's our host, Pastor Mike Abendroth. Welcome to No Compromise Radio ministry.

My name's Mike Abendroth, and by now, if you're a long -time listener, you probably know the format of the show better than I do.

Sermons from Bethlehem Bible Church on Monday. We're going verse by verse through books of the Bible.

Actually, in the pulpit ministry now in Malachi, so we'll soon get those on the radio. Tuesdays, I talk to Pastor Steve, known as the

Tuesday guy. Issues in the local church ministry, maybe controversial things. Thursdays, I like to talk about positive doctrines.

What does the Bible teach about confession or the act of obedience of Christ or preaching, something like that. And then

Fridays, I usually critique something. Elders are to teach sound doctrine and refute those that contradict.

And so that's the Friday show. Wednesdays, I love because I get to talk to other pastors, other

Christian men, leaders, writers, thinkers, preachers. And today is a

Wednesday, so I'm welcoming Jimmy Carraway to No Compromise Radio. Jimmy, welcome. Pastor Mike, it is a real pleasure to be with you.

Well, let's just get a little of your background. And before you tell me about how the Lord saved you and how you got to Pennsylvania, when

I was at seminary, there were certain men that I really looked up to who knew what was going on.

They were well -versed in the scriptures and they seemed to understand systematic theology, where things fit.

And Jimmy, you were one of those men for me. I just look at you thinking, man, that guy's got it going on. So that was about 25 years ago, 20 years ago.

And I just think if my perceptions of you then were that, what must they be now at 25 years of maturation?

I hope a whole lot better than they were then, but you're very gracious with your words.

You know, when I got saved, the Lord put in me a curiosity to study and to learn.

And that's what carried me through. I'm just curious. I ask questions.

I imagine like Paul does sometimes, he kind of anticipates what question might be or comeback might come in him.

And I try to anticipate that and I answer it in my notes. I answer it in my study. So I wish to present whatever

I'm teaching airtight so that there's no way to get around this, no way to cut this off or shortchange what

I'm saying. Talking to Jimmy Carraway today, pastor of Christ Bible Church in Cranberry Township, Pennsylvania.

Jimmy, let's talk a little bit about this precision in gospel ministry. We both had Dr. Thomas, and I think he was one that really pushed precision.

What does it really matter if we have to dot every proverbial I and cross every theological

T? I mean, can't we just give broad swaths of truth? Why is particular truth, precise truth so important?

Because every word is inspired by God. And so if there is a, for example, in Romans 8, 26 and 27, if there is a

T, T -I in the Greek there, it's translated what?

So we don't know what to pray. We don't know how to pray, but we don't know what to pray.

And that's very different than how. Do I raise my hands? Do I get on my knees? That's not

Paul's point. The point is with that little word there is we don't know what to pray.

I don't know what the will of God is. I'm not God. I don't know what's gonna happen tomorrow. So I don't know what to pray about this, but the spirit of God does.

And that matters. Those little things matter. If there is a pronoun for emphasis in there somewhere, like as in the gospel of John, it's often in there, there is emphasis there.

You, you do this. And I think I have the responsibility. I think every preacher has the responsibility to discern that, to know that, and to communicate that.

Where it's difficult to see that in English, it would be bad

English to put you, you twice, but the emphasis is there. We need to discern the truth of that emphasis.

And we need to communicate that because that is what is inspired. Jimmy, when you're studying the

Greek language or Hebrew and you're in your office, technically study preparing, when do you, and how do you make the decision to say these particular details of the

Greek, I'm just going to generalize for the congregation or I have to be more specific.

I mean, how much of the film do we leave on the cutting room floor before we put it together into a sermon?

That's a great question, Mike. You can't forget your audience. It's just not a lecture.

It's a preaching message. It's not a seminary lecture. Where the emphasis lies in the text, where the point, where the argument hinges,

I think is what we need to bring out and bring out very clearly. And S.

Louis Johnson, I know you're an S. Louis Johnson theologian and he was a great man, but he used to preach and he would focus on a conjunction.

Sometimes, and it would just make so much sense when you understood how that conjunction worked in there.

And it gave clarity to many other things previously and following. Jimmie, do you think this is a right way to approach it?

I often give just enough information from the Greek to let some of the

Greek students know. We have other pastors here on staff and some seminary students. I let them know that, yes, there's a couple different ways to look at this, but I've examined it.

And in the stream of solid theologians, this is what the text says and means.

And then I proclaim it as a truth to be believed or a behavior to be changed in light of what

Jesus has done. Do you think that's a good approach? I think it is,

Mike, because one, as you're preaching to them, people are learning how to study themselves by listening to you.

The flip side of the coin is you can't bog yourself down in some matters that practically don't have a ready, immediate kind of value at the moment.

Save those things for a different venue, perhaps, where it's more of a lecture, more of a one -on -one, small group kind of thing.

But since I mentioned Romans 8, 26 and 27, when it comes to that matter of the

Spirit praying for us, who's praying, what's taking place there, I think you need to go into that because charismatics claim that passage as their own, and cessationists claim that passage as their own as well.

And so I think people need to understand why Pentecostals would latch onto that and say, that's my prayer language.

That's my justification for having prayer language. So I think we need to explain that so that people understand where they're coming from on that issue, and then explain what the text is really saying.

At other times, I may not go into a lot of detail on why Mark 16, verses nine and following is probably not part of the original text.

Jimmy, when you made mention of the fact that when you preach, you're teaching your people how to study, that works for both good, those pastors who are approved workmen who aren't ashamed, but also on the negative side, how do people, or what do people learn when they sit under the

Joe Osteens of the world? They learn that the word of God is not that important, that you can grasp a hold of or memorize the two or three points that the pastor makes.

You're not really sure where he found it in the Bible, but it made sense to me when

I heard it. Later on in life, you need that truth from which was spoken.

You don't know where to go to find it. You don't know if the point was even biblical. You don't even know if it came out of the original context of the message that he used to springboard off either.

So it doesn't promote spiritual growth in people to preach that way, because they are not encouraged to think biblically, they're hanging on every word, all of those principles that you say, but those principles are floating out in the middle of space, and they're not connected with a context and a specific passage.

And so they're living on, well, I heard a preacher say one time that so -and -so, really,

I don't know where he got it, but it sounded good at the time. And so we're two miles wide and a quarter inch deep.

Jimmy, tell us a little bit about the word that is preached. I find it fascinating that it is living and active and very sharp, and it is applicable in all kinds of generations and all kinds of people groups,

East, West. Here you're trained at the master seminary in the word, and then you're parachuted behind enemy lines into Pennsylvania.

And I would assume there's a certain kind of culture there, a certain kind of community where they have certain stresses theologically with other religions, and they have a certain way to do things.

They put a lot of coleslaw and French fries on their sandwiches. There's a certain culture. Tell me about the wonder of the trans -chronological nature of the word, and then how you've seen some fruits of that in your particular community.

Well, that was a really smooth question, by the way. You got the French fries and coleslaw in there.

What do they call those sandwiches again? From Andy. Oh, yeah, they're - Andy sandwiches. From Andy Brothers, yeah.

All right. Mike, you know the supernatural nature of the word of God, it's not just words on a page.

It's not Homer's Iliad. It's not just an ancient writing. It is God breathed, and he's preserved his word through the years, and it is able to discern the thoughts and intentions of the reader.

It's the only thing that's able to do that. So in God's wisdom, he's called us to, like Paul said to Timothy, preach the word when it's popular and when it's not, because God has so designed his word that the spirit of God would use this word of God to discern the thoughts and intentions of the people who hear it, and the reason it can do that,

I think, is because these people are created in the likeness and image of God for the very purpose of worshiping their creator.

So here's a word from their creator. Here's his word to you who made you, fashioned you for the express purpose of worshiping your creator.

So this word is the only thing that's going to penetrate into the depths of the soul, stir it up, and bring conviction.

Some people, it repels. As Paul says, we're, you know, sometimes we're an aroma of death unto death and an aroma of life unto life, but it is not a neutral message.

It is a supernatural power. It's the power of God unto salvation, Romans 1 16.

So what we gotta do is just preach the word. It's so simple.

People think they have to, I've gotta build a church, and I actually, there was actually a preacher of a large church in this area that said, oh,

I tried that and it didn't work, which what he meant was,

I tried preaching expository. I tried explaining the text and my church didn't grow.

So it didn't work. But the word that, I mean, the Bible says preach the word.

God takes care of the growth. It's the Lord who brings the people. It's the Lord who matures the people.

As Paul said, we water and another man plants and, but God causes the growth. So the simplicity of the message,

I think the method is just as simple. Just preach the word. I know it's contradictory to modern thinking, modern reasoning, where you gotta do something more.

It's like salvation. I feel like I have to do something more. Just obey, just preach the word and watch the spirit of God, use the word of God, transform people.

That's why ministry is so much fun for me. I so enjoy proclaiming the word and over time, seeing the change in people.

It's such a joy, such a peaceful joy that I have.

Jimmy, when I look at your ministry from the outside, I see a man who simply thinks,

I've been called to preach the word and you're not a flashy guy. I didn't at least see any

Armani suits last time or any Rolex watches, but you're not a flashy guy, but you're just kind of like a

Marine where you get put on the beach of Iwo Jima and you're told to go take the hill and you just say, yes,

I will. Don't you think as time goes on, there are gonna be some people who they first desired in a church, a good youth program.

They first wanted a nice parking lot and lots of good babysitting things or whatever they wanted, a great rock and roll band, but then they realized their life was weak.

They were falling to strong temptations and they think to themselves now, I just want the word.

Is there any place where some man, frail, fallible, sinful, but called by God will just stand up and preach the word of God?

Don't you think we're gonna see some more of those folks coming back to churches like yours and like mine? I sure hope so,

Mike. We've seen several young couples and families that come here, that have come here just in the past several months and they've stayed and it's a joy to see them.

It's exciting. Humanly speaking, we do not advertise.

We have a little 15 -second blurb on the radio just before Grace to You comes on in the morning.

Other than that, we have a website and we have a Facebook page. I wish,

I really do trust that God brings the people here who need to be here. And He has,

He is, He does. But I think, we don't have bells and whistles here.

We don't advertise that we have a flashy youth ministry. It's very simple.

Yeah, marketers would say, you'll never survive. But we have a very simple ministry.

And if people stay here, it's because they love the word of God and they want to hear the word of God and then in following that, they want to serve in some capacity, serve

God by serving one another in some capacity. Because we, it's not intentional necessarily that we do that.

We just don't have any reason to do anything other than preach the word. Well, in light of that,

Jimmy, and stemming from that, you do have a conference every year because it's not as if you're trying to keep people away.

You have been given a stewardship. And so there are different ways that you can encourage folks to learn and grow in Christ.

So tell us about both the conference that you have in the fall and then your blog slash podcast that's either started and or will start.

The conference is called Pillar of Truth Conference. And I started that about five years ago.

I think this year will be our fifth year coming up. I started it because in this area of Western Pennsylvania, Eastern Ohio, there aren't any conferences, at least at this time of the year.

There is a basics conference or the church where Alistair Begg is the preacher.

That's in mid -May. And it's an hour and a half from Pittsburgh.

And it's a good conference. We've been to that one. But in the fall, there's just not much going on.

And there is a dearth of the word of God in this area. You asked earlier about certain culture and the culture here in Western Pennsylvania is strong Catholic, strong high church.

And what I mean by high church is the pastors wear robes. You have

Presbyterians, you have Lutherans, Methodists, Episcopalians, Catholics, some Anglicans, a lot of that in this area.

So we have several people who have been saved out of Catholicism that come here.

And that's, speaking to the culture thing, that is the thing that's in the back of my mind most of the time is what will they think or I'm trying to anticipate how they think coming out of Catholicism, what they would associate their past with if I say certain things.

But the conferences is intended to provide an opportunity for people to come here, to be exposed to a topic from scripture, to have that topic expounded and explained by excellent men who do these very things in their own churches.

So October, last week in October 23, 24, I believe it is this year, you by God's grace are going to be here along with Dr.

Bill Barrick. Well, finally we have a conference where I can agree 100 % with at least one of the speakers.

Now, what I love about your philosophy there, Jimmy, is do you know, if we have a conference and the

Lord brings us 500 people, 1 ,000 people, well, that's just great because that's the Lord's doing.

But if we have a conference and we promote it and we have a smaller turnout, well, we're gonna just minister to the ones that are there.

And so I like that. Here's the ministry and trying to try to get people and train your folks as well to walk by faith and not by sight.

Let's bring in some men. We have a conference and if a lot show up, fine. If not many show up, that's fine too because we're doing it for the glory of the

Lord. How could you help our listeners when it comes to evangelism have the same kind of philosophy?

In other words, do they need to close the deal, get them to sign the card, pray the prayer, or shouldn't they have the same kind of philosophy you have for a conference as they do in evangelism?

I think they should. You know, evangelism, as Paul said, God causes the growth.

It's God who gives life. So faithfulness is not in evangelism.

Faithfulness cannot, should not ever be defined as seeing people come to know the

Lord, seeing people repent. Faithfulness is living the truth, sharing the truth with people.

That's faithfulness. So yes, share the truth with people.

And if the Lord brings 20 people here or 200 or 2 ,000, God's in control of that.

And whoever is here, we will teach them to the best of our ability.

We will rejoice that the Lord brought as many as he did here. And that will be, the faithfulness will be defined with what defines success, not the number of people here.

But hey, Mike, look, as a pastor, I would love to preach to 500 people or 5 ,000 people.

Wouldn't you? Most days. I mean,

I would love to see of all the people out there actually come to hear the word of God.

I would love to preach to them, but you know, my mentor, our president of our seminary,

John McArthur says, you take care of the depth and God will take care of the breadth. So we just plow into the word.

We just dig deep, try to understand the wisdom and the plan of God for the ages and for us and for all these things and just rejoice.

And our worship rises higher and higher. And in God's providence, he brings more people slowly.

They keep trickling in and because they love the word of God. Jimmy, we've only got a couple minutes left.

Now you're talking about faithfulness and living it out. You're not saying that you believe that lifestyle evangelism is the way to go and people come to faith with a

St. Francis of Assisi manner. Are you saying that? No, sir, not at all. I didn't think so. Not at all.

You have to, St. Francis of Assisi. That's kind of sissy evangelism when, you know, if you have to use words, you know, that's the sissy way.

Faith comes by hearing and hearing by the word, by the word. It's good to live truth.

There's no doubt. It's sort of like maybe a preamble, so to speak. But faith comes by hearing, hearing the word of God.

You must speak truth. You must speak truth. Now, if the life and the words don't match, people will discern a contradiction or hypocrisy and you may lose your credibility.

And that would be tragic to lose your credibility. Nobody listens to you, but you're right.

You must speak the truth. You must hear about Christ. They must understand their need for a

Savior. Well, if you live in the Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania area and you have a good church, stay there, but you can always go to the

Pillar of Truth Ministry for a conference that is every fall right there in your own hometown.

Also, the at pillar truth is your Twitter handle feed at pillar truth.

And then Jimmy, give us the website for the church, Christ Bible Church, cbcofcranberry .org.

Yes, sir. Do you have a lot of cranberries there? No, well, we have a, there is a cranberry and then there is a cranberry township and we're in cranberry township, just 20 miles north of Pittsburgh.

Well, we have some cranberry bogs here in Central Mass, but I've been, I can't tell anybody where they are because then you'd all go.

So we have to sneak over there to the cranberry bogs. The legend of Boggy Creek. Are you from Nebraska originally?

Not originally, I went to school in Nebraska, University of Nebraska and attended a church out there for a while.

See, I knew that's why I liked you. We've got about 30 seconds left, but see, you are Nebraska Cornhusker.

We've got, yeah, do you like it that Bo Pelini's gone now? Boy, I mean, you know, you get rid of a nine and three season kind of winning coach.

You're like, wow, where are you gonna find, who's gonna let go of a 12 and one winning coach?

I know, Pastor Jimmy Carraway today on No Compromise Radio Ministry. I asked him a theological question. He gives me an answer.

I asked him about Nebraska. He says, turn to cbcofcranberry .org,

pillar of truth as well. Jimmy, thanks for being on today. Michael, it's a privilege. Thank you, sir. No Compromise Radio with Pastor Mike Abendroth is a production of Bethlehem Bible Church in West Boylston.

Bethlehem Bible Church is a Bible teaching church firmly committed to unleashing the life transforming power of God's word through verse by verse exposition of the sacred text.

Please come and join us. Our service times are Sunday morning at 1015 and in the evening at six. We're right on route 110 in West Boylston.

You can check us out online at bbcchurch .org or by phone at 508 -835 -3400.

The thoughts and opinions expressed on No Compromise Radio do not necessarily reflect those of WVNE, its staff or management.