Today on the First Radio Free Geneva of 2014

Alpha & Omega Ministries

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00:08

Almighty Fortress is our God, a bulwark never failing.

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I don't like Calvinists because they've chosen to follow John Calvin instead of Jesus Christ. I have a problem with them.

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They're following men instead of the Word of God. Our helper he amid the flood of mortal ills prevailing.

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Hands standing on top of my feet, standing on a stump and crying out,

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He died for all those who elected, were selected. For still our ancient foe doth seek to work us low.

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His craft and power are great and armed with cruel hate.

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Well, first of all, James, I'm very ignorant of the reformers.

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On earth is not his equal. I think

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I probably know more about Calvinism than most of the people who call themselves Calvinists.

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Did we in our own strength confide, our striving would be losing.

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For God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever.

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Were not the right man on our side, the man of God's own choosing.

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Ladies and gentlemen, James White is a hyper -Calvinist. Now, whatever we do in Baptist life, we don't need to be teaming up with hyper -Calvinists.

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Just ask who that may be, Christ Jesus, it is he.

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I said the other day in class that I don't understand the difference between hyper -Calvinism and Calvinism.

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It seems to me that Calvin was a hyper -Calvinist. Right, I don't think there is typically any difference between Calvinism and hyper -Calvinism.

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Lord Sabaoth is name. Read my book. From age to age the same.

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And he must win the battle. And now, from our underground bunker hidden deep beneath Liberty University where no one would think to look.

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Safe from those moderate Calvinists, Dave Hunt fans, and those who've read and re -read George Bryson's book.

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We are Radio Free Geneva, broadcasting the truth about God's freedom to save to his own eternal glory.

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And welcome to Radio Free Geneva, the dividing line here at the beginning of 2014.

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Where did my calendar go? My calendar's gone. You took my calendar, didn't you? At least

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I could have looked at it. It had a pretty picture of a P -51 and a B -17. Yeah, well, it's 2013.

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I know, but... As you're looking at it, saying in the beginning of 2010... It's just a...

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All the calendars have been confiscated. I'm sorry. They are headed to destruction.

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Do I get a pretty World War II calendar? They are like goats. We have new ones on order.

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But can I get a new pretty one with planes from World War II? I did get a planes. Oh, good.

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I don't know if they were from World War II or not. Well, they are much prettier than planes from any other war. I got a couple of gun ones, too, if you want one of those.

03:42

Oh, okay. All right. Well, welcome, folks. I'm like...

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I am the product of the modern American educational system, and I can't follow a thought for more than about 12 seconds anyway.

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So there we go. Yes, P -51s rock. He's exactly right. Has anyone ever created a more beautiful aircraft than the

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P -51 Mustang? I don't think so. It's just... What? Well, of course, the

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Corsair had its own beauty. But there's a reason why P -51s are still being flown today in air races, and Corsairs are only at air shows.

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There's a reason for that. But the Corsair is beautiful, too. No two ways about it. Anyways, welcome. Welcome to Radio Free Geneva.

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And before we get back to reviewing Pastor Gaines' material, because we've got Sean McCraney.

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We've got Dr. Allen. We've got so much stuff that we need to get to, and fairly quickly.

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There may be a lot of Radio Free Geneva between now and my trip to Spain. But, look,

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I have to give you news updates as they become available to keep you up to speed.

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And so I have a news update for you today. As Aaron Cantor himself has said, he used to speak, he said 200 times a year at various places.

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Now, I think that's probably an exaggeration, as most everything else in his story is. But let's say it was 100 times a year for nine years.

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That's a lot of stuff to try to track down. And almost every day now, someone's going, hey, look what

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I found. Someone comes up. And it's not like we've got some group of people meeting in a back room or something like that.

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We've just got people that meet in our chat channel and that happen to have

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Google skills. We've just got a bunch of geeks in there is really what it is. And they keep tracking stuff down.

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And I was listening to a 2005 presentation by Eric and Cantor this morning.

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And this is Decatur Baptist Church. Now, this was new to me to have it.

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But as soon as I heard one portion of it, I knew that Muhammad Khan had gotten to it first.

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He had listened to this first because I recognized this part. Let me just play a little clip for you here.

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I came here as a missionary to you. I didn't know Christians. I thought you hated me.

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Everything I ever learned about American Christianity, I learned in the mosque from my imam or from my madrasa, my training center.

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And so every other place I'd ever lived, I lived there as a majority person. I always lived in the majority

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Islamic countries. Then I come to America. Now, I love that because we've heard that in parts before.

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But here again, I had always lived in majority Muslim countries. He never lived in majority

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Muslim country. I mean, it's just 180 degrees backwards. But then we had this.

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He had many wives. And what's found in the Geisler thing? Well, he got married later on.

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That's not what he was saying. I mean, there's just so much of stuff. But anyways, for the future, more stuff.

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There's a section on here I want to play you. Why this matters. Because, I mean, maybe

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I need to get in touch with J .D. Hall because he wants to interview me tomorrow on this subject about why this matters.

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And I might need to try to do it here so I can play this because I've got some stuff here about why this matters.

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And it's good stuff. Anyways, that's not the reason that I am taking a little bit of Radio Free Geneva time.

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I mentioned briefly the fact that there was a lot of opposition to our doing the presentation we did at Lindale.

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And I'm being straight open and upfront here. We would like to expand the presentation we did at Lindale.

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There's more information available today. More has happened since then. Cantor has had another

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Twitter explosion with more claims of being absolutely innocent and everything else.

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And so we would like to do another presentation.

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And this time we will have high def cam and multiple backups.

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And it wasn't their fault, but they had a catastrophic drive failure at Lindale. And all we have is what was streamed, which is very low quality in comparison to what we really want to have available.

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And so we want to do another recording of this presentation, make it longer, fuller.

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And we want to do it in Georgia. And we're already talking to a church about that.

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But I recognize that there's a lot of pressure there in Georgia to just follow the line, basically.

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But that's what we want to do. There was a lot of back story. And I finally told you what it was once the charges were dropped.

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But as I was flying from Atlanta to Dallas, I was informed that Tom Buck, the pastor at Lindale Baptist Church, First Baptist Church Lindale, he had been contacted by the police.

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And that Josh, a former student from Arlington who had passed out flyers on the campus about the event, he eventually got contacted as well.

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And to make a long story short, the news primarily came to me through Pastor Buck.

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But he ended up talking to the police, and they were trying to use the police to stop our presentation.

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See, that's all they can do. I mean, if the roles were reversed here, I would walk into the church, and I would demand an opportunity to respond.

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And I would respond factually, and I would refute what's being said. They can't, and they know it.

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Ergin Cantor knows he cannot refute this information. He cannot stand before someone who has this information.

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He knows it. His every act and behavior shows this. Any honest person sees it.

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And so the cops had told Pastor Buck, they said, well, basically, they said that if you all just wouldn't do this presentation, then this will all go away.

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This will all go away. Well, the police report was released and was forwarded to me today.

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And there are a couple of very interesting things. I mentioned to you the really odd thing, which we'd already been told about.

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And that is that when contact was made to follow up at the end of October, here's what it says toward the end.

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This is from 10 -28 -2013. Due to the fact that the victim, Arlington Baptist College, represented by President Danny Moody, had expressed that their primary interest in filing criminal charges was to pressure

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Dr. James R. White into ceasing his campaign against Ergin Cantor. I called to inquire if White and his associate, suspect

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Josh, had satisfactorily responded since my initial contact with them.

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Then on 10 -31, they finally got back. Some assistant got back.

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At about 0840 hours, she did call back and advised that she had spoken to Dr. Moody and advised that he was satisfied with the efforts of Elson and White and no longer wished to prosecute

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Elson for criminal trespass. Excuse me, but exactly what was it that we did that was satisfactory to them at this particular point in time?

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We did the presentation. We did not in any way, in any form, back down at all.

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We know who backed down. Kind of makes you wonder, does Arlington Police Department not have a false reporting charge?

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Well, again, it has nothing to do with that. It was a false report, though. Well, no, not in regards to what they were saying, but what the cops themselves recognized.

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Listen to this. It says, I did provide them both the copies of my business card and this report number and both advised.

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And both advised. So this is, well, back up the track here. Let me give you more of the information.

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When the police officer arrived, guess who the lead person in providing information to him was?

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Erikan Kanter. Erikan Kanter provided me with a zip drive and printouts. The printouts consisted of one copy of the flyers reportedly distributed on campus the day before, as well as a number of screenshots from Twitter linking the suspect to the flyer distribution on campus.

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So he had screenshotted Twitter conversations and provided a zip drive.

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I don't know. It was probably a thumb drive, I imagine. With these screenshots connecting

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Josh to me. And that's what they're going on. And so Erikan is the one who is taking the lead here.

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All right. He's the one who is all upset and he's angry and he's going to try to use the cops.

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The man is desperate. He is desperate. He will not repent. But he knows in his heart of hearts that we have him dead to rights.

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He knows it. He knows that we have the truth and he cannot defend himself.

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He knows it. Every action he's taking shows it. So listen to what the police officer says.

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He says, prior to ending my investigation on the scene with Moody and Kanter, I did provide them both with copies of my business card and this report number and both advised that their primary goal in reporting this offense was to bring about and end the harassment of Dr.

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Erikan as opposed to actual criminal prosecution of Elsem or Dr. White on whose behalf

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Elsem was apparently acting. Due to the fact that the actions of Elsem and White in regards to the content of the flyer do not appear to meet the elements of the offense, for the offense of harassment under criminal law,

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I did advise Erikan and Moody that they may be able to address their grievances through civil courts under slander or libel.

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I remember the cops had told Pastor Buck that that's exactly what Erikan Kanter said. I'm going to be suing

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James White for defamation of character. That's what he'd said. So the cops recognize exactly what's going on.

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The only reason that they followed through with this was not that they cared that a former student had passed out things on campus, but to try to stop the presentation of, and if you've watched it, two hours worth of Erikan Kanter talking about Erikan Kanter and lying about Erikan Kanter.

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That's what it is. That's what it is. And so these people are willing to drag the cops in.

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We already know Erikan's willing to throw biblical authority out the window and sue Christians, but they're willing to drag the cops in to try to prop up this amazing house of cards, which is the entire story of Erikan Kanter.

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So that just came out today. And I am truly, truly amazed at what you have there.

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So Josh on Twitter just said, Who is this awesome character you were referring to?

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Well, he used to have a cameo in the Kanter presentation, but we cut that out because he walked by with his

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Starbucks at one point down front. But Josh, just be careful. Anything you say in Twitter can and will be used against you by Erikan Kanter.

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You know what, Erikan? It goes both ways because you can use whatever you want there.

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We've got you. We've got Emir writing to you in Twitter back in 2010, talking about when you were playing a homosexual bartender in high school.

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Yeah, did you take your geffia off before you played that part, Erikan? Hmm? Hmm? Sort of wondering about that.

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Oh, my goodness. It's amazing. Is there something?

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Oh, which picture? Oh, yeah, find it. Yeah, that'd be fine.

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That'd be fine. If you've got that picture hiding someplace, that'd be fine. But absolutely amazing stuff.

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Absolutely, positively amazing stuff. One thing

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I did not do was fire up. Yeah, I'm sort of listening to what's going on on the other side.

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Anyhow, we want to get to Radio Free Geneva, and I want to finish the review of Pastor Gaines.

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You got it? Yeah, go ahead and throw it up. On the live video feed right now, we have the picture of Erikan.

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Now, I don't know. I cannot prove that this is the exact play where Erikan was playing a homosexual bartender, but let me tell you something.

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It sure looks like it. It sure looks like it. Doesn't he have, like, the thing? Well, yeah, and then he doesn't have a thing tied around his – oh, yeah, it is really – yeah, right.

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It is really meant – yeah, mm -hmm. I don't think there's much question about it. And it was

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Emir who tweeted that Erikan played a homosexual bartender in a play in high school.

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What I'd like to know is what year that was, because he says he was about to enter college when he was converted.

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And I don't know about you, but I find it just a little bit strange that such a devout

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Sunni Muslim would be playing a homosexual bartender in a play. Yeah, it looks like a

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Sunni Muslim. Yeah, it does. It does, yeah. You can tell his hair is always squished down by a kufi, isn't it?

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Yeah, mm -hmm. Oh, you know, the fact is – that's got a little bit of a

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John Travolta kind of style to it. Oh, yeah, oh, yeah, the big hair and everything back then. Oh, but we – hey, we all have pictures like that.

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Just – I never played a gay bartender in high school, and I would not have ever done so, obviously.

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So there you go. There you go. Amazing stuff.

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Well, so we press on. We have other things to get to here. We haven't gotten it – and this is something you need to put on the top of the priority list.

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I want to once again recommend to people if you can wait a little while, maybe you can get it from us, but, look, we're not really big into that kind of thing.

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But I spent some more time yesterday listening to From Heaven He Came and Sought Her.

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And, really, I think this work is going to have a long -lasting impact.

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I would love if I had time to put out a companion volume that would be – how would

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I put this? This is a work of scholarship, okay? And, for example, it starts off – well, let me just –

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Introduction, Sacred Theology and the Reading of the Divine Word, Mapping the Doctrine of Deaf and Atonement, Deaf and Atonement in Church History.

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So Deaf and Atonement in the Ancient Church, Deaf and Atonement – let me see here, go back here –

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Deaf and Atonement in the Medieval Church, Calvin in Definite Language and Deaf and Atonement by Paul Helm, Blaming Biza, the

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Development of Deaf and Atonement in the Reformed Tradition, the Synod of Dort and Deaf and Atonement. And it finishes off with Karl R.

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Truman's Atonement and the Covenant of Redemption, John Oden on the Nature of Christ's Satisfaction. So the first third or more of the book is all historical, and we're talking deeply historical.

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I mean, there's a whole chapter here on a historical survey of Moïse Amoureux's work on predestination, and almost all the footnotes are in French.

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So, I mean, it's not going to be easy for people to get that. And that's before they get into Deaf and Atonement in the

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Bible. And that's where you have, in the Pentateuch, and J.

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Alec Mottwier's work on Isaiah 53 is really good.

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I think Michael Brown needs to make sure to have read that before we talk, because I think it's very important. Then we have

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Particularism and Universalism in the Synoptic and Gospels, Johannine Literature, Pauline Epistles, Deaf and Atonement in Paul's Theology of Salvation, Problematic Texts for Deaf and Atonement in the

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Pastoral and General Epistles by Thomas Schreiner, then the theological stuff,

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Donald MacLeod, Robert Lethem, then an even fourth section,

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Deaf and Atonement in Pastoral Practice. It's a huge book. It is a huge, huge book. And it finishes off with chapters by Sinclair Ferguson and John Piper.

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So, I really believe that it will have a lasting impact. And so far,

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I have been very, very blessed by it. It is extremely, extremely useful.

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So, I highly recommend it to you. Again, if you've got enough to read for the next few weeks, and you'd like to get it from us and help us out, that's fine too.

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We will be tracking that down and making it available and getting it into the AOMN store.

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And that does assist in continuing the work of the ministry. All right. I've burned 22 minutes there, but I think it's important.

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I do want to try to finish up with Pastor Gaines here. We had listened to this clip before, but I think it was right toward the end of the program.

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I think this is important because it gives you a sense of the passion with which people preach against Reformed theology, but almost always not having thought through the fact that the objection they're raising would be just as valid against their own beliefs, which is highly problematic.

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We go back to Pastor Gaines. This was September 8th, I believe, of 2013.

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And we're going to try to finish it up today. I want you to give it all away. And if you do, give it to the poor.

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You'll have treasure in heaven. Follow me. And the man could have said yes. If he could not have said yes, then we have to say to Jesus, you're giving him a false hope.

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If you have already predestined him to hell, then you're toying with him. Now that's the hard facts.

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Jesus doesn't toy with people. Jesus gave the man a legitimate option. And the man chose not to receive

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Jesus. And it says he turned away. His face fell. His countenance fell.

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He owned much property. Really he was owned by much property. But Jesus wanted to save him. He felt a love for him.

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He gave him. Look, what does it say about Jesus if it wasn't a legitimate offer? If he was just toying with the man?

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If he was just saying, I'm just offering this. I know you can't do it because you're not the elect. I know that you can't receive it because you're not predestined.

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If that's the case, what does that say about God? What does that say about Jesus? Giving a false hope.

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Giving a false invitation. That's the reality of what we're dealing with. Do you understand how wicked that would be?

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And look at me. Jesus is not wicked. Jesus said, come to me. Come to me. Come to me.

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Now, it's very obvious to me that Pastor Gaines believes that the position that he thinks he's representing accurately is wicked.

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That it presents God as mocking the young man. But again, he's not an open theist.

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He specifically decried being an open theist. He said he was not an open theist. And so God knew exactly what that young man's autonomous choice outside of the decree of God was going to be from eternity past.

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And Jesus, is he saying that the reason Jesus loved him is because Jesus didn't know what his choice was going to be?

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But God the Father knew, right? So no matter what, his objection is just as valid against his own position because God knew with infallible certainty what the choice the young man was going to be and yet he loved him anyways.

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So how is that not mocking? And in fact, is it not more mocking from his perspective than from the perspective of a divine decree that has purpose that will result in the glory of God?

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I mean, again, I don't know whether the rich young ruler was ever saved or not. We're not given any indication that he was. But we're not told about anything that happened to him after this point in time.

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But let's say he was not. His self -absorbed idolatry and hypocrisy is recorded for us in Scripture as a great warning against self -righteousness amongst religious people.

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And if that's not enough for you, then I think you have a problem with God's being God. But from his perspective, if God knew, first, there was nothing that God could do about it.

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As soon as God created, he brought in knowledge of what was going to happen. And even though he loved this rich young ruler, he had to bring in the knowledge, which is infallible knowledge, unless God's knowledge can be faulted and can be false.

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He brought in infallible knowledge that, oh, that rich young ruler that I love isn't going to be saved.

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And there's nothing I can do about it. I could put out a 100 % effort.

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It doesn't make any difference. It doesn't make any difference. He's going to be lost. Oh, I'm so sad.

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Does Pastor Gaines even think about that? Evidently not.

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So, again, the idea that, well, if there's a divine decree, then everything is just false.

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If there isn't a divine decree, then nothing has purpose. That would be my response.

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So, we press on. Are you ready for verse 5? And he, read those words, he could do no miracle.

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It doesn't say he would do no miracle. It said he could do no miracle.

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Is that what it says? Guess what it says in the Greek? He could do no miracle. Why? He could do no miracle, except he laid his hands on a few sick people and they healed them.

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Here's the problem. He wondered if they're what? What is it? They're unbelief. Do you see that faith was the requirement for a miracle?

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And what is faith if it's not choice? So, I was directed to a later sermon that he did out of Mark, what was it, chapter 4?

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I forget where it was. And again, Pastor Gaines seems to be a very passionate man.

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I sensed very much that he feels that there is a certain level of apathy amongst his people.

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He was trying to snap them out of that, to warn them about that. It was a Sunday evening service. He talked about going long.

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It was a pretty long sermon. And I appreciate all of those things.

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But in the process, I heard many of these things repeated, and it became very clear to me that this is a part of his thinking, that without autonomous will, then

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God cannot act. I mean, he specifically stated in that sermon a, well, it's the very same statement that eventually was the one thing that ended up breaking my fellowship with a church that I had been a member of for years.

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I don't leave churches easily. But I did have to leave a very large Southern Baptist church

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I had been in for years, married there, everything else. And one of the reasons was the pastor in preaching, his topic had been giving, but had preached that we limit

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God. By our actions, we limit God. And Pastor Gaines, in that sermon from Mark, specifically made the same statement he just made here.

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We can limit what God can do by our lack of faith. And he points to this very text.

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And he looks at what happens in Nazareth as if, because of the unbelief of men,

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God's power was specifically limited so that Jesus wanted to do more, but he couldn't.

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Because the only thing he can do is based upon the faith of individuals.

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And a funny thing is, the text itself says, well, he did heal a few people. I guess they must have had faith or something.

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This whole idea that God's activity in time is limited by man, again, illustrates the difference between looking at scripture from the divine perspective or from the human perspective.

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If man is at the center and God is peripheral, well, then that would make perfect sense.

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If it's all about man, if it's all about what God's trying to do, but can't do without man's help, okay, that would work.

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But if it is first and foremost about God, and God is creator, and God's glory, and man, therefore, is secondary to these issues, that's a completely different thing, isn't it?

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Yeah, it certainly is. The limitation of Jesus' power in that particular text is because God's manifestation of his grace is to those who have faith.

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These people were, sadly, very similar to those who committed the unpardonable sin.

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And it is God's freely choosing to not pour out the mercy of the ministry of the

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Messiah amongst them because of their unbelief, because they were there in Nazareth, because they knew

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Jesus. I mean, really, what you've got here is a parallel not to the idea of God's limiting himself by man's freedom.

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It's much more to the Pharisees' blindness and hardness of heart because these are the people who knew Jesus. They had been exposed to so much light, very similar to Chorazin and Bethsaida.

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But if you look down from below, start with man, then you limit God based upon that.

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And he was going around the other villages teaching. He wanted to do a miracle, but their unbelief caused him to say,

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I'm not going to operate unless you believe. And I'm not, here it is, watch me, I'm not going to make you believe.

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Now look, if he had predestined them not to believe, then why would he be amazed at their unbelief? It doesn't even make sense, does it?

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Does it? I'm going to make you talk. I mean, why would he be amazed at their unbelief if he had predestined their unbelief?

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It makes no sense whatsoever. Well, again, why would he be amazed at their unbelief unless you're an open theist?

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Pastor Gaines, in your own theology, God knew what they would do, right?

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So the whole, what's the problem with the entire position he's taking here? His amazement at their unbelief is not an amazement of ignorance.

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It's amazement of knowledge. He knows their hearts. He knows that they have received more light than almost anybody else has.

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And thankfully, because he is the God -man, he remains amazed when his own creatures rebel against his will.

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We should be amazed when men do not believe. Because the most natural thing that anyone's created in the image of God could ever do would be to believe.

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Does that not give you a real insight into the power of sin and depravity, which we so rarely properly appreciate?

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Certainly should. But again, the objection really had absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with making a meaningful argument because it's just as equal and valid against his own position.

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But he doesn't bother to explain that. Matthew 23, 37. Oh, Jerusalem! He's praying over the city.

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Jerusalem, the city that kills the prophets, stones, gods, messengers.

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How often I have wanted to gather your children together as a hen protects her chicks beneath her wings, but you wouldn't.

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I could go on. Doesn't actually finish the verse or interpret it, but let's give him a golf clap.

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He didn't skip the, your children part. You know, it's sad when you have to applaud an

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Armenian for actually just quoting the verse right. But if you're new to the program, you're going, what do you mean?

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How many times have we heard someone misquote that? I think part of the reason here, though, is

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I'm guessing this, but he says a number of times, read it with me on the screen. I think all the quotes are being put onto a screen and he's reading it himself, which is why your children stayed there because it's actually there.

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But kudos for that. It would be nice if there was some interpretation, but and you know, yesterday

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I was really taken aback. David in Australia just said, sorry, can't listen in.

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I'm glued to the train wreck. Train wreck. This is the last cricket match of the series. The ashes are going on right now.

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I didn't know. I knew that they had started. I did not know what the state of affairs was. I had not kept up.

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So I asked him in channel and he got all snooty with me and got all mad at me.

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And then I found out why. Australia is blanking England. I mean, we're talking if they win this one, it's called a whitewash.

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We would call it a sweep. Okay, they call it a whitewash, but it's the worst way.

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It doesn't get any worse than that. So the broom salesman will be going crazy over here. Over there would be someone selling whitewash.

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I guess. I don't know. But anyways, to our friends in England right now, our sincere condolences.

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This is a live show, folks. I'm sorry. It's just the way it is. And I am a product of American culture.

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Oh, look at something in Twitter. I must comment on it. Oh, man. 2014 has started off pretty rough, hasn't it?

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Anyways, we continue on with important stuff here. I just want to say God has a plan for you.

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Romans 12 too. It is good. It is perfect. But that plan being fulfilled is partly conditioned on your obedience and disobedience.

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God has predestined that plan for your life, but God does not predestine either your obedience or your disobedience.

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Did you catch that? Think that one through for a second. Think that one through for a second. Because when I think of God's plan for my life, it's what

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God has sovereignly decreed is going to take place and how he is going to use me as his servant. It includes the date of my birth.

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It includes the date of my death. And that's not what he just said.

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This becomes an impersonal plan. It almost becomes a

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Joel Osteen, God's -your -best -life -now type idea. If you do this, if you strive for these things, then you can improve things.

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But it's not like there is a sovereign purpose being worked out in my life that's different than the sovereign purpose of somebody else's life.

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And how can he have a plan? I mean, again, he's not an open theist.

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God has infallible knowledge of future events, but there's no divine decree. You know, that is really depressing.

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That is really depressing. Think about it. If that's true, if it is true that God knows all future events infallibly and his knowledge cannot be falsified and there is no divine decree, not only are you left with the

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God -shot -the -dice and said, I win! Worship me! But the sadness is that these plans -

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God can't have any plan for a specific person. Because while he may decree to give certain gifts to someone, for example, he can't know when he creates whether they're going to use them or not because that would involve a decree.

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Right? I mean, maybe I'm just weird, but I remember, especially in seminary, but it started in high school,

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I remember walking the grounds of Glorietta, New Mexico.

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The Southern Baptist Conference Center, which is no longer a Southern Baptist Conference Center. In Glorietta, New Mexico, I remember my junior year in high school, walking through those grounds alone.

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I already was pining after a young lady named Kelly, but she was dating my best friend at the time and it was really tough.

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So I was alone. The next summer, Kelly and I were there. And what?

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How many months later were we married? What about six months later? Yeah. Anyway, but I remember walking through the pine trees and looking at the beautiful church, the big church, and all the rest of the stuff.

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And what I was thinking of was, how is God's decree, election, predestination, assurance, salvation? I was trying to work through all that stuff.

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So I started early, but I remember specifically in seminary, once I had a few more tools to work with, thinking through, and I've always felt it was absolutely necessary for me to honor

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God, to be consistent in my thoughts about Him and in my statements about Him. But evidently,

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I'm weird. I'm weird. Even when I was in seminary, I remember talking with folks and I was struggling with something, and they're like, you know,

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I don't really put a lot of thought into that because you just don't leave enough room for mystery.

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Which is a nice way of saying, you keep bringing the various parts of your faith together and seeing if they fit, and just leave them out there, man.

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Don't worry about it. It's a whole lot better that way. And that just has never worked for me, and just means

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I'm very, very weird. He also told Elisha that Ben -Hadad would die.

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But the fact that God told Elisha that Hazel would choose to do these things and to kill

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Ben -Hadad does not mean that God ordained and predestined all the future and all the wicked actions of Hazel that are mentioned in our text.

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So when God gives to the prophets prophecy, all He's doing is narrating from an eternal perspective what

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He discovered after He created. No purpose, no decree. That's how

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He can give prophecy, is that He sees all of time, but there's no purpose in it.

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So all those purpose statements in the prophetic statements that tell about the future, ah, just get rid of them.

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Because there's really not any ground for that. You're going to burn their strongholds, set them on fire. They're young men, you're going to kill the sword.

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Now listen to this. Do you think God predestined this? They're little ones, you'll dash in pieces, and they're women, they're pregnant women, they're women with children, you're going to rip up.

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Do you think God predestined that? The same God that said, ah, I didn't plan that, didn't command that, it never entered my mind, back in Jeremiah, He wouldn't have planned this, this wouldn't have entered

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His mind either. If you say that God predestined these despicable deeds, you're reading your thoughts into the text, not out of the text, and that's called eisegesis, not exegesis.

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Don't make God into the one who predestines little ones to be dashed to pieces and women with child being ripped open.

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Don't accuse the impeccable, sinless, righteous God of such sins. No one is accusing

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God of sin. The question is, those events took place in history.

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I mean, hundreds of thousands of people died in a tsunami. That was a natural thing, right?

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Have you ever seen some of the amazing footage of the tsunami coming into Japan just a few years ago?

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Just the power of nature and the smallness of man, oh, it's just amazing, and thousands and thousands of people died.

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Those are natural. Well, did not God have control over those things? So was there a purpose?

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Was there a purpose in those things? Or is it just sort of, well, it's fallen world, and, you know, God created, and when

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He created, He knew this was going to happen, but He just didn't have any purpose for it. But then there have been armies that have marauded across the face of this spinning globe for thousands of years, and most of the time, those armies have been populated by very evil men, no restraint, and what they did was horrific.

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What they did was horrific. I mean, armies are made up primarily of unregenerate people, and so there's raping and pillaging and murdering, and it's been going on for a long, long time, and so both of us have to answer why that is.

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The Calvinist says God has a purpose. He is accomplishing His will.

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We point to Isaiah chapter 10. We point to Genesis chapter 50.

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We point to the statements of the prophet Isaiah all through his prophecy that God is working out

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His purpose. He does all things out of the counsel of His will, and even when we cannot see what the purpose is now, we have

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God's promise that there was a purpose, and we may well know what that purpose is in the future, but even if we don't, we can trust

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God that the judge of all the earth will do right. But where can

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Pastor Gaines go? He has no decree. There is no eternal purpose that is being worked out in time.

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God created and, for some reason, chose to create a universe with all this senseless, empty, purposeless evil and gets a pass by saying, yeah, well,

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He didn't do it. It was just the guy that did it. You created the guy, and you knew He was going to do it. You didn't have to do that.

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Now, I really doubt that Pastor Gaines has ever studied Molinism or these issues like that, and I've got nothing from listening to this that he's a

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Molinist in any way, shape, or form. He doesn't use that type of language. Not that that would actually accomplish anything, but I hope he doesn't go that way.

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I hope he doesn't go that way. It would be sad. Now, then he went off into some other subjects, but I did find this interesting.

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Proverbs 21 .1 is a verse I have asked you to pray for our President and our leaders in America. I've been praying it virtually every day.

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The King's heart is like channels of water in the Lord's hands. He turns it wherever He wishes. New Living Translation is beautiful.

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The King's heart is like a stream of water directed by the Lord. He guides it wherever He pleases. What can

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I say? I mean, again, being as kind as you can to the brother, he's a wonderful guy.

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I know he's a wonderful guy. I'm sure he has a real heart for his people. But doesn't he see the irony in praying that prayer?

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Don't you hear what you're asking God to do? You're asking God to change the very heart of the leadership and to direct it as He wishes.

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That's sovereignty. That requires purpose. That requires overriding, creaturely autonomy and freedom, doesn't it?

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Yeah, it does. It really does. And it's just so ironic to find this kind of statement.

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Now look, if everything that the King does is predestined by God, why would God tell us to pray for leaders?

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Now, again, ask Him. If God knew everything that that King was going to do, why ask us to pray for leaders?

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Because it changes us. And when it changes us, it can be used as an instrument to change

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Him. Now what's your answer? Your answer can't be so that God will work harder on them because God's already doing the best

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He can. If that's your answer, then you're saying that God isn't as good as He could be until we cajole

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Him into being better. I don't think that's what you want to say! And I'm sorry, but it's just so painfully obvious that Pastor Gaines has never been put in a position of really having to bring the various elements of his theology together and to see, do these fit together?

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Is there a consistency here? Or what am I believing over here and here completely that they don't fit together?

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They actually repel each other. And unfortunately, in a lot of seminary education in our land today, that's not what happens.

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When I have had the opportunity of teaching, my students will tell you I have warned them over and over and over again,

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I am here to step on your toes. If you can get through this class without having your toes stepped on, without being challenged, without being offended, then

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I have failed as your teacher. Now that is not politically correct. And funny, it's something that Eric G.

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Kanner always preaches. Always preaches. And yet, the reality is,

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I'm the one who does it, and I've been doing it for a long time. That's what seminary should be for.

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It's not often really that way. If it's all predestined, why would we pray? What does our prayer do?

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You say, well, God uses means. I understand where you're going with that, but I'm telling you, really, if it's... See, he has heard.

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People have tried to tell him. God uses means. And that means sometimes changing the means. Changing our hearts.

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When you're praying for the leadership, that might change how you respond to the leadership. It's already predestined.

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Our prayers don't really do anything except just kind of agree with God. And if it's already all known to God, then your prayers aren't changing anything.

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It's already known to God, right? Doesn't see it. Doesn't see the exact same issue.

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We're not asking God in faith to do something otherwise. But 1 Timothy 2, 1 -6 really does not lend itself toward us just acquiescing with God.

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That's all prayer is. If prayer doesn't change anything, if it doesn't really matter that we pray, God's going to do whatever

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God's going to do, then why pray? Really, I mean, let's just be honest. Yeah, let's be honest. We do have a fundamentally different view of prayer.

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You seem to think that God needs to be cajoled into being better. I say

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God commands us to pray so we have communion with Him, we are obedient to Him, and are changed into channels of His mercy and grace thereby.

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But I do not believe that my prayers are intended to make God better than He already is.

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Or to give Him wisdom. Or to give Him direction. Because the God I know from the Bible does not need any of those things.

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One last section, believe it or not, in this portion. 1

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Timothy 2, 1 -6 says prayer does change things. First of all then, he said, I urge that entreaties and prayers, petitions and thanksgiving, four kinds of prayers, we don't have time to break it all down, be made on behalf of all men for kings and for all who are in authority.

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Why? So that we may lead a tranquil life. Now notice, right there, he's holding the answer. For kings, those in authority.

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What kind of people are they? They're kinds of people. It's groups here, but... And quiet life and all godless indignity.

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And then look at these verses that just happen to be in this text. This is good and acceptable in the sight of our God, God our

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Savior, who desires all men to be saved. Are all men saved? Ask your question. Are all men saved?

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But God desires for all men to be saved. And don't tell me all men doesn't mean all men, because he just said pray for all men.

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Did you catch that? Don't tell me all men doesn't mean all men. And he just identified that it's groups. That's why

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Revelation chapter 5, You have made us to be kings and priests. Who? Men from every tribe, tongue, people, and nation.

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From every tribe, tongue, people, and nation. I'm going to look at that for just a second. We've got just enough time to look at it.

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Revelation chapter 5. And it says,

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Did he go back here? There it is. Speaking to the Lamb, Worthy are you to take the book and to break its seals.

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For you were slain and purchased for God with your blood men from, and there's the

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Greek preposition, ek, ek, pases, fules, kai, gloses, kai, lau, kai, ethnus.

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You purchased for God with your blood men from, doesn't say you purchased every tribe, tongue, people, and nation, does it?

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I would like to ask those of you who believe, in a general atonement, non -differentiated, peanut butter, for everybody who's ever lived or ever will live, atonement.

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How do you understand that? How do you understand that? You purchased with your blood.

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What does it mean to purchase? That's agrazo. And it's with your blood, entohimatisu.

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So it's there. The purchase price is there. And the result of this, you made them to be a kingdom and priest to our

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God, they were laid upon the earth, et cetera, et cetera. It's all there. This is clearly soteriological. It's not about false teachers in 2

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Peter. So what does it mean? From every tribe, tongue, people, and nation.

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There is a clear distinction made, right?

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So there you have particular redemption, right on the very surface of the text.

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Very clear. How do you answer that? I mean, in the same context, you've got all men here, meaning all men. A verse or two later, it doesn't mean something different than that.

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It means all men. Verse two later, it doesn't mean anything different than that. It means groups of men, just as it did when it talked about kings and those in authority.

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And as it will have to mean when it talks about the intercessory work of Jesus Christ. Here, at least, all means all, and that's all all means.

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Who desires all men to be saved, even though they're not saved, and come to the knowledge of truth. There is one God, one

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Mediator, also between God and men, all men, the man Christ Jesus, who gave himself as a ransom for, say it again, all testimony given at the proper time.

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Make no mistake. God has a plan for leaders. Unfortunately, he did not bother to delve into answering a simple question, and that is, if your interpretation of that is right, then for whom is

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Christ interceding? Who is he interceding for? And this is going to be absolutely central to the debate that I have with Michael Brown.

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I was going to say, yesterday Michael and I, I think he was somewhat tongue -in -cheek, tweeted to me, he said,

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Hey, I've got a proposal for you. How about we just cite scripture texts in our debate? And I'm like,

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No. We need to actually explain what the background issues are.

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We need to explain how God's truth relates from this text with another text. You don't just sit there and quote verses.

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I mean, all that does is he quotes the ones where his presuppositions are read into the text.

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I quote mine where my presuppositions are read into the text. And unless you ever examine the presuppositional nature of the interpretation and challenge the exegesis behind the choosing of those texts, you accomplish nothing.

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You don't defend the Trinity that way. You don't defend the deity of Christ, the person of the

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Holy Spirit. You don't defend the immutability of God. You don't defend the resurrection or justification by faith in that way.

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And certainly you do not address the atonement in that way. It is the very testimony of all of scripture that has to be brought together to answer the question, what is

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God's intention in the cross? Now the very phrase, limited atonement,

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I admit, is horribly insufficient to actually address the subject.

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But I think one of the most beautiful elements of biblical revelation is the specific, purposeful, perfect, accomplished, finished, infallible, sacrificial work of Jesus Christ in behalf of his people, in fulfillment of the angel's statement.

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She calls him Jesus. Why? Because he will save his people from their sins. He will not simply make it a possibility.

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He will not simply make it a hypothetical issue to where we bring about our own salvation by availing ourselves of his work.

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No. He will save his people from their sin.

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I have come down from heaven not to my own will, but the will of him who sent me. And what is the will of him who sent me? That of all that he's given me,

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I lose nothing, but raise it up on the last day. That's the same man, in his own words, fulfilling the angelic prophecy of what his very name would mean.

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He should be called Jesus because he will save his people from their sins. And so as that faithful, perfect, high priest,

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Jesus does not fail in his high priesthood. He is both the offerer and the offering.

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His offering has been accepted by the Father. He has entered into the presence of the Father where he stands in our place having accomplished eternal redemption.

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He has obtained it. Now the question then becomes, do you think that therefore it's just sort of like the

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Thesaurus Maritorum? It's this treasury of merit and then we have to work the system and do all the things we need to do to sort of get those drops of grace and hopefully get enough?

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No. And is it merely a potential thing where the potentiality exists for every single individual?

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But if they would, they have to do something, it can be a short list, long list, but it's just a potential redemption.

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Is that what the high priest had? Is that, again, it all goes back to whether you look at Scripture from the

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Godward perspective or the manward perspective. Well, we can only look from the manward perspective. No, that's not true. As we read

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Scripture, we can be instructed by Scripture to see that its primary focus and central aspect is what

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God is doing to glorify himself and we can be instructed by Scripture to not view ourselves as the determining factor in all of these things, but to see

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God as the central aspect of these things. And so, there you go.

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Somebody in Twitter very quickly said, did you say something about, talking about Sean McCraney? Yeah, I have listened to, for future

57:38

Radio Free Geneva, I am planning on responding to what he said about Calvinism, especially his mocking dismissal of it.

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Look, from what I can tell, he seems to be on the side of the angels and just seems to be very ignorant of the subject that he's addressing.

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So, yeah, I do hope to be able to address what he said and would love to have a conversation with him.

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I would love to correct the many misapprehensions that he gave air to on his program a number of months ago, if he'd be willing to do so.

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Because, hey, he's got to admit, we both share something. You know, he's up there in Salt Lake City, okay, he's in the middle of it more than I was, but I've been dealing with Mormonism for a long, long, long, long time.

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So, we'll see what happens. Well, thanks for listening to Radio Free Geneva today with a little bit of cannerism there at the beginning, but had to get through that.

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And thanks for listening to the response to Pastor Gaines, and I hope it's been useful to you.

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Don't know exactly what we're going to be doing next week, but that's because things develop so quickly. But Lord willing, we'll be back here with The Dividing Line.