If a Husband Tells His Wife to Wear a Red Dress Everyday, Then Should She Obey Him?

The Bible Bashed Podcast

Subscribe

Download

Share

00

00:00

Warning, the following message may be offensive to some audiences. These audiences may include, but are not limited to, professing Christians who never read their

00:06

Bible, sissies, sodomites, men with man buns, those who approve of men with man buns, man bun enablers, white knights for men with man buns, homemakers who have finished

00:11

Netflix but don't know how to meal plan, and people who refer to their pets as fur babies. Viewer discretion is advised. People are tired of hearing nothing but doom and despair on the radio.

00:26

The message of Christianity is that salvation is found in Christ alone, and any who reject

00:32

Christ therefore forfeit any hope of salvation, any hope of heaven.

00:39

The issue is that humanity is in sin, and the wrath of almighty

00:44

God is hanging over our heads. They will hear his words, they will not act upon them, and when the floods of divine judgment, when the fires of wrath come, they will be consumed and they will perish.

00:59

God wrapped himself in flesh, condescended, and became a man, died on the cross for sin, was resurrected on the third day, has ascended to the right hand of the

01:12

Father, where he sits now to make intercession for us. Jesus is saying there is a group of people who will hear his words, they will act upon them, and when the floods of divine judgment come in that final day, their house will stand.

01:29

Welcome to Bible Bash, where we aim to equip the saints for the work of ministry by answering the questions you're not allowed to ask.

01:36

We're your hosts, Harrison Kerrig and Pastor Tim Mullett, and today we'll answer the age -old question, if a husband tells his wife to wear a red dress every day, should she obey him?

01:48

Now Tim, as we kick this episode off, what Bible verse do you have related to husbands telling their wives to wear red dresses every single day?

01:58

Yeah, so Ephesians 5, 24 says, Now as the church submits to Christ, so also wives should submit in everything to their husband.

02:06

Hmm, in everything, huh? Yeah, maybe that includes a red dress,

02:12

I don't know. Maybe, I don't know. I guess it depends a little bit. To some people, at least, it sounds like it depends, huh?

02:21

Sure. I mean, it's supposed to be a trap question, but yes.

02:29

Yeah, yeah, definitely. And basically the reason we're doing this episode is because, you know,

02:36

I don't know, it just seems like lately it's kind of been thing after thing after thing.

02:41

Everyone's getting all up in arms, and that's really kind of always the way it goes on the

02:46

Internet. The Internet outrage cycle. Yeah, you go online, and you get angry about one thing, and then, you know, about 48 hours pass, and you move on to the next thing, and you kind of see, some of the topics that people get upset about are kind of like repeat offender topics, basically.

03:06

Like, off the top of my head, I can think of, you know, this, for example, spousal submission.

03:12

That seems to always be an issue. The Billy Graham rule is one that seems to come up probably two or three times a year.

03:22

Yeah, David raping, did David rape Bathsheba? Yeah, that's another one.

03:27

Did David rape Bathsheba? You know, and people trying to MeToo David thousands of years after the fact.

03:36

So you kind of have these repeat offender topics, and this is one that, you know, feels like it comes up a couple times a year as well.

03:46

And, you know, this time, it was our good buddy Tom Buck who kind of opened the can of worms on it.

03:53

And so we have a tweet here that I will share with everyone so you can see kind of what's going on.

04:00

But you've got Tom Buck here. Tom Buck actually isn't our buddy. That was just a joke. That was a joke.

04:06

Yeah, we don't know Tom Buck, but personally. So Tom Buck puts out a tweet.

04:13

It says, if a husband tells his wife that he wants her to wear a red dress every day, is she to submit to his authority and obey?

04:24

And 7 ,250 people voted on this. 40 % of people said yes, the wife should obey.

04:32

59, basically 60 % said she should not obey him.

04:40

And so, you know, that seems, it feels like there's a lot going on here, basically.

04:47

So, Tim, you know, obviously there's a bunch of comments down here too, but just looking at the poll itself, what is your initial knee -jerk reaction to something like this and the results that we see here in the voting?

05:03

Yeah, so when you think about a poll like this, I mean, I think the way that the question is worded straight up,

05:11

I mean, there are people who have an impulse just to answer it as it is stated.

05:19

And I would say that, yeah, the 40 .5 are just answering the question as it's stated.

05:25

But then as it is the case with these kinds of questions, I think there's a lot of people who are at it, they have an impulse to basically answer a question that wasn't stated in a question like this.

05:40

So I think for many people, their knee -jerk response, instead of actually answering the question and interacting with the question, will be to answer another question.

05:51

And I think that's really what they're answering. So most of the people who are responding to this would be in the broader complementarian world.

05:59

And I think the question they're probably answering is the question, should a husband command his wife to wear a red dress every day?

06:10

So I think they, as you read through the comments and you see the interactions, most of the interactions are centering around them interacting with that point.

06:21

So they have a knee -jerk response basically to say, what kind of guy would ask his wife to wear a red dress every day?

06:33

And so then I think that question is taking up more of their brain space than the actual question that's being asked.

06:41

So then because they're not generally the kind of guys who really ask very much of their wife.

06:48

So since, see, two can play this game. So what happens is people, they make a bunch of assumptions about the kind of person who would answer yes to this question.

07:01

They basically assume that that kind of person is an abusive megalomaniac tyrant who. Right, yeah.

07:08

With the worst possible intentions, right. Living out the handmaiden tale and all that.

07:14

It's always, yeah, it's always that show for some reason. But I mean, if we're going to go down that route, then yeah,

07:21

I mean, I can make assumptions on the other end. I can make assumptions about the kind of person who, I mean, for the record, yeah,

07:28

I shouldn't even have to state this, but I've never asked my wife to wear a red dress every day. So we're free and clear of all guilt.

07:37

Have you ever asked your wife to wear a red dress every day? No, I have not, in fact.

07:42

So we're free and clear of the tyrannical accusations. I don't think it matters. Because my knee -jerk response is to say yes to this one.

07:54

So I guess that means that it doesn't matter whether or not I've ever done this. Right. I'm guilty of doing it.

08:01

But yeah, so I mean, I think that's a question we can interact with. But I mean, two can play that game. So I mean, yeah, I can make assumptions too.

08:09

So if we're going to be assuming things, I would assume that the kind of person who is reacting to this kind of thing really is just pretty out of touch with the current nature of the struggles that are out there.

08:24

So I would have an impulse very quickly if someone asked me this question just to say yes, yes, yes, that she should, because I'm answering it as stated.

08:33

They understand right now that in the vast majority of marriages, most guys are not asking their wife to do basically anything.

08:41

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Like this kind of thing, it seems like it's like –

08:46

I think it's being put forward as an over -the -top kind of micro – like act of micromanagement on the part of the husband.

08:53

And I'm not even – I wouldn't even necessarily disagree with that, that it's over -the -top micromanagement.

09:00

I would still say yes. Yeah, the answer is yes, even if it's that. So that doesn't mean that I'm suggesting that this probably isn't an over -the -top abuse of authority in certain ways.

09:18

So I'm not even saying that. I mean I would like to interact with that a little bit, but I think what's happening on the other end is you have – we're in a moment where most men in their marriages are not asking basically anything of their wives.

09:34

And then they've accepted that as normal. And so then something like this is just like the ultimate example of something that you basically should never do.

09:44

So yeah, I don't know. Yeah, it seems like a lot of people are interacting with it almost like – you've brought this up before in episodes past, but essentially a husband telling their wife to wear a red dress every day is the moral equivalent of a husband telling his wife that she needs to sleep in a dog cage every day.

10:09

Yeah, yeah. That's how people are interacting with it when it seems like they're – well, yes, there's probably a discussion to be had about a husband asking his wife to wear a red dress every single day.

10:26

There's probably a conversation that should be had there behind what's the motivation behind that?

10:32

What's the reasoning behind that? Why are you asking that basically? But then even that seems – still seems different, morally different from the ask or tell your wife to sleep in a dog cage every night.

10:48

But then most people seem to be treating them like they're the same exact thing.

10:55

Yeah, I think PatriarchyHannah made a comment related to that where she – your comment basically made me think of her comment that she made.

11:09

And I mean, I haven't been following this whole thing very closely, but I've followed it enough, I suppose, to where I – because it's flashing onto my timeline nonstop.

11:21

It's nonstop. She made a comment essentially saying that this is – like a lot of women are so unaccustomed to having any real persecution in their life that something like this would just sound like it's just so awful.

11:39

And the reason why is because they're really not used to being told to do anything. And maybe they – her comment is –

11:46

Oh, is it this? Women – here, let me – I'll share this and let's see.

11:56

Okay. Women's lives are too cushy nowadays, so the red dress thing seems like the worst that could ever happen to them.

12:02

They actually could use a little oppression. LOL. Is that what you're talking about? Pretty much.

12:08

Pretty much. We liked it, so. I like it because I understand what's being communicated.

12:16

Right. Look, and right on cue, the handmaid's tale.

12:22

LOL. That's funny. Oh, that's good. It's always the handmaid's tale.

12:29

It is, yep. So, I mean, yeah, some thoughts here. Some thoughts here.

12:35

So, one, yes, if you just interact with the question as it's stated, should a wife obey her husband if he asks her to wear a red dress every day?

12:44

Well, I mean, the answer is obviously yes, she should. She should submit everything to her husband. This isn't, you know, an example of him asking her to sin.

12:53

This isn't really some monstrous, you know, tyrannical act of oppression. And, you know, let me point out a few things that –

13:01

I want to point out a few things to show that this is kind of blown way out of proportion in certain ways, and then

13:08

I'll show some sympathy to the other side. But, look, I mean, most of the guys, even the guys who are trying to point this out as, like, there's this big, scary, you know, bogeyman out there of all these, you know, patriarchal men who are abusing their women and telling them to wear and gasp, you know, that kind of thing.

13:28

Nick, I really don't think that's the biggest problem at the moment. And I know that those guys exist, but really, in my experience,

13:36

I've met very few guys who are even using any of the authority they have, let alone trying to abuse it or something like that.

13:44

Right, right. You know, for every, you know, one guy I've known who uses his authority in a self -centered way,

13:52

I've met a hundred guys who are too afraid to use it at all. So I don't really know this is really a big thing that we should be afraid of right now.

14:02

But here's the thing. Like, those, almost every guy

14:08

I know is submitting to his, and I'm using that ironically, not in the formal sense, would submit to his wife asking him to wear basically all of his clothes that he wears.

14:20

Yeah, yeah. I mean, so this is one of those things that's really kind of funny in a certain way.

14:27

So, for instance, like most guys I know, like their wives will pick out their clothes.

14:36

I mean, there's that whole joke. Our wives at church all asked us to wear the same shirt one day for church so that we could get a photo op for it.

14:49

All of us suckers did it, you know. So, I mean, I think on the other end, most guys don't think it's some crazy thing to think that, oh yeah, if my wife wants me to wear something, then

15:01

I'm fine with wearing it. If she thinks I look nice in it, then yeah, I'm supposed to be dressing for her, right?

15:07

So I think that that is a big dynamic in this discussion. But then part of the problem is that that only really goes one way.

15:15

Right, yeah. Clearly, clearly, clearly it only goes one way. So, I mean, you know, that's what's kind of conceptually pretty funny about this is the thought that, like if my wife really wanted me to wear something and she asked,

15:30

I mean, there's plenty of things that she's bought and said, hey, yeah, I don't really like that outfit or whatever. I'm like, oh, whatever,

15:35

I don't care. It's not really, it's not that deep, you know. But so, yeah, there's that kind of dynamic.

15:43

Now, I think one person commented on this discussion and they said something like this.

15:48

They said, you know, should a wife submit if the husband asks her to wear the same red dress, or wear a red dress every day, this answer was yes, of course.

15:59

You know, but then should he ask her, well, of course, or should he command her to do that? You know, of course not.

16:05

And then I would say, well, I mean, the next thought in that process would be if he did, let's assume he asked her, he started by asking her to wear the red dress every day.

16:20

Her court, like what woman wouldn't want to wear a red dress, like what godly woman wouldn't want to wear a red dress every day for a husband if he thought it made her look nice?

16:34

Right. So, you know, is woman made for man or not? Is she the glory of man or not?

16:39

Like, why do we have to go in our mind to this is like a tyrannical act of oppression?

16:45

Why wouldn't she want to be well -pleasing in her husband's sight? Like, why are we treating that as if it's just a foregone conclusion that she has her own bodily autonomy and she would, you know, like, of course, she's an adult, she dresses herself.

17:00

It's like most men don't dress themselves. Most wives tell them what they want to wear and they're more than happy to do that.

17:07

That should go both ways. So, yeah, I would say first step, if the question is stated, should she?

17:13

Yes. Should a husband command her to? I don't see why he would have to.

17:19

Like if he would just say, hey, I want you to wear this dress every day, she should want to wear it, right?

17:26

Because she should want to. If he thought that she looked nice in that, she should.

17:32

Yeah. I mean, what are we doing in marriage? Why wouldn't you want to be, you know, look nice for your spouse?

17:39

Yeah, look desirable for your spouse. If he thought that was peak desirability, then why not?

17:45

Like, who else are you living for? You know? Right, right. Who else are you trying to impress if not him, right?

17:51

But then, you know, assuming that she really just, for whatever reason, like was all bent out of shape about it, should a guy command it and say, you know, let's make it a submission moment, you know, because you're not willing to obey me in the preference

18:10

I stated. Now, you know, now I'm going to make a command.

18:15

No, I really don't think that a guy, God has given men authority to use like that.

18:25

Now, I'm not suggesting that he doesn't have authority and that she should listen to his authority.

18:32

I'm just suggesting that God didn't give men authority to use it in a self -centered way, you know?

18:38

So I don't think a godly guy should turn that into a submission moment, assuming that he has a wife who utterly has no concern for being well -pleasing in his sight, you know?

18:50

So now, I mean, is it reasonable? Like, is it a normal scenario? I can't really think of very many, you know, situations where the red dress is the only outfit they can wear.

19:03

Now, I mean, someone, I think it was, I can't remember who it was. Maybe it was

19:09

Joel Webbin who was basically saying that like a boss, I follow this about this much here.

19:19

So I think maybe it was Joel Webbin who was saying that women will screech about like the idea of wearing the same outfit every day at the direction of a husband, so to speak.

19:30

But then, you know, they'll work for an employer who will give them a uniform that they're supposed to wear every single day.

19:37

Right, right. And, you know, Owen Stratton. Stratton. Yeah.

19:43

Yeah, yeah. Whoever, however you say his name. He responded to this by basically, man, it was like one of the biggest foot -in -your -mouth kind of moments that I could possibly imagine saying at that point.

19:55

But he responded to that by saying, what did he say?

20:02

Can you pull it up? I'm looking for it right now because I think I know what you're talking about.

20:08

I don't want to misquote him, but I mean he. Here, maybe it's this.

20:13

Let me pull this one up for you, and you tell me if this is what you're thinking of. A wife is not a.

20:25

Is this what you're talking about? Oh, no. There's some more here.

20:43

Yeah, I'm not sure. I don't know if I see it. Unless it was later in his.

20:51

How to go back to the. That's the one

20:58

I was just looking at. Okay. Yeah. I mean, he basically says like.

21:05

Like a woman is not a like. Oh, he said he said jobs require uniforms, not wives or something like that.

21:18

And I thought it was something is about is about like that. It is like jobs require uniforms, but not wives.

21:24

That is not. So are you saying that a wife is not a job? Are you? You require uniforms for jobs, not wives, right?

21:32

Like, so basically he's rejecting the analogy. He's saying you retire uniforms for jobs, not for wives.

21:39

It's like, well. I think what he said was jobs require uniforms, not wives.

21:45

But then the problem with that was pretty obvious. It's like, no, the employee who works at the job is required to wear a uniform.

21:53

Are you suggesting that a wife is not a, like she has no job either?

22:01

You know, she has nothing to do. So it was pretty funny, but yeah. Leaving all that aside. Yeah. I, I, um,

22:07

I don't think I, I understand that I can maybe hypothesize some random weird scenario where maybe it would be appropriate for a husband to ask his wife to wear the same red dress every day.

22:23

You know, maybe if they're in a time where color wearing is significant or something along those lines.

22:30

Hey, look, if it's the crips and the bloods, man, you gotta be careful what you wear.

22:36

Gotta be careful. Yeah. It's a safety concern. Yeah. But that really isn't the point. I don't want to miss the point of the analogy.

22:42

Yeah. I mean, I think in general that there really isn't a, you know, wonderful situation where a husband should demand that level of specificity at the same time, you know, people make the same kind of argument with a husband saying,

22:55

Hey, I'd rather you wear a dress and not pants. Right.

23:02

So, I mean, that was like a huge controversy in my grandfather's time to where, you know, when women took off the dresses and started wearing pants, that was a big deal.

23:14

And I, so people are going to have the same kind of reaction to this more extreme version of it, where a specific color dress every single day.

23:23

Then, yeah, they're going to, they're going to have the same reaction to that as to a husband, basically. Even suggesting that there are certain kinds of clothing that he doesn't want to wear, but I mean,

23:33

I would think that that would be, I haven't forbidden my wife from ever wearing pants, but the thing is like, that's far more reasonable to me to think that you're living in a, you're living in a time where everyone is so casual now and all the, like all the clothings there in all clothing, there's a push towards androgyny and if a husband were to come along and say,

24:00

Hey, yeah, like I want you to wear dresses. That's all I want you to wear. I don't think that would be some great monstrous crime.

24:08

Yeah. It kind of seems like. That wouldn't be a preference issue. If that makes sense. I think,

24:14

I mean, I could see how this can be taken out of the category of preference issue and be put in the category of wisdom or even biblical conviction to where you don't want your wife wearing a garment pertaining to a man you could have.

24:26

I mean, I could see how I could, if it just reduced to pure preference, I want red, right?

24:31

For no reason other than I want it. I don't see that as a godly use of authority, but I mean, I could see very clearly how this could be pushed from a wisdom preference into like a wisdom kind of category or even a possible sin kind of category.

24:45

And people would have the same kind of reaction. So I don't know that they're making those kinds of distinctions. And when

24:51

I read stuff like this, normally the way it comes off to me is kind of like when you have the, you know, like when you have the kid who is essentially trying to figure out where the line is so that they can cross it.

25:05

Right. And so, you know, you, you give them, you give them a rule and they say, okay, but can

25:10

I do this? You know? Okay. But can I do this? Okay. But can I do that?

25:16

You know? And, and I, you know, these kinds of questions kind of always that's, that's the light

25:23

I'm on. I'm always tempted to read them in is like a you know, how, like how far are we allowed to go before we're straight up breaking the rule, especially because we live in a time that is so anti, you know, like husband using his biblical authority to lead his family.

25:47

And so, you know, like women everywhere are being told like the opposite of what this question seems like it's trying to address.

25:57

You know, like every, every woman everywhere is being told that, you know, you're independent, you can do whatever you want, you know, you don't need your husband telling you what you can and can't do.

26:09

You know, you don't need your husband leading you in these ways. With what to wear, period. Right, right.

26:15

And so, but, but like you said earlier, women constantly do that with, you know, with their husbands and it's not really viewed as that big of a deal because, you know, probably most of the time it's not that big a deal, but then for some reason it's a big deal the other way.

26:31

So then when you start asking questions that are also seemingly trying to toe the line as much as possible, that always, that always feels pretty concerning to me when you're looking at these kinds of questions.

26:48

You know, and maybe it'd be helpful to Tim, just to kind of lay out, I think you've done a little bit of this already by, by distinguishing between, you know, a husband giving a command for things that are purely his preference versus things that might be either related to, you know, helping his wife avoid sin or helping his wife do something, you know, that is wise, right?

27:16

So like that wisdom category or sin category versus preference category.

27:22

But then just in general, what are the, you know, the, the commands that God has given surrounding, you know, the authority of a husband and the submission of a wife, and that might be helpful in having this kind of discussion just to kind of lay that, lay that groundwork out for us.

27:43

Yeah, I mean, I think there's three types of categories that people should be thinking about related to this topic. And, you know, the first one is like preference issues.

27:51

So preference issues are just non -moral issues that reduce to personal taste, if you want to put it that way.

28:00

So an example of that would be, you know, I like chocolate, you like strawberry, whatever, right?

28:07

So that would be a preference issue. It's not really, there's no moral considerations that are factoring into that kind of discussion.

28:15

There's not a command, you know, there aren't any commands that are coming to the forefront, which people are using to decide between a choice like that.

28:27

So in general, yeah, in general, I don't really think that a husband should be using his authority to get his own way, particularly as a habit or a practice.

28:41

So the Bible says, you know, let each one of you not look to their own interests, but the interests of others.

28:46

It's more blessed to give than to receive. So thinking about things along those lines,

28:52

I really don't think that a husband should be saying, you know, here my family stands, we will be a chocolate ice cream family instead of us, you know, because that's,

29:05

I mean, those really aren't the things to go to war on. In a lot of ways, that's like the definition of selfishness. Now, I mean, there's a distortion of that on the other side to where a lot of people basically start with the premise, you know, happy wife, happy life.

29:19

And then what they're encouraging men to do in that kind of situation is to basically as a rule and as a practice, like always give his wife whatever she wants, right?

29:32

So when it relates to the category of preference issues, then it's like, well, you should be using your leadership basically to give her whatever she wants and you should never get anything that you want.

29:42

And I would say, well, that's not necessarily true either. So meaning like,

29:49

I can, I could think of, you know, plenty of situations where I say as the husband,

29:56

I were to say, Hey, let's go to X restaurant tonight.

30:02

Right? Well, if my wife were to have like a complete meltdown and fit about it, that was like news to me, like shocking to me, it's like, what is going on?

30:16

This is a hypothetical situation. Okay. But let's say that she were to have just like a meltdown or something.

30:23

Then I would think that whatever, like her preference has become way too important to her.

30:31

And so, I mean, I would have a category in that moment for saying, Hey, this is, this should not be, we should not be fighting over this kind of thing.

30:41

I suggested we go to this restaurant, not because I was trying to have a big selfish moment, but because I was trying to do something nice.

30:49

But, you know, if you're going to turn it into a big selfish moment, then I'm going to, I'm going to double down on it.

30:56

Right. I got to get my impulse in that moment. Wouldn't be just a cave and say, well, Oh, I guess you're upset because I didn't, because I didn't preemptively know the magical restaurant that you've been craving all day long, you know?

31:12

And, and, you know, I didn't know that you hated this one so much. And so now, like, you know,

31:18

I would just refuse to play that kind of game in that moment. So, I mean,

31:23

I have a category for a husband just kind of sticking to his guns at that point and say, Hey, if you're going to, you're going to turn this into a nightmare.

31:32

This wasn't even about that. We're not, I'm not just going to make a pattern of appeasing you just to keep the peace.

31:38

Right. If our peace is dependent upon you getting your way every time, then we're just not going to have peace.

31:44

You know? So, yeah, I mean, I think in general, you don't, you don't appease Hitler. And if your wife was acting like Hitler, you don't, you don't, you don't appease her, you know,

31:54

I don't think that's the right move. You don't, you don't give them Switzerland. You don't give them Czechoslovakia.

31:59

Oh, no, no. Poland. No, no. I thought we were just,

32:05

I was trying to do something nice. If you're going to turn it into a nightmare, then we're just going to, you know, I'm not going to budge.

32:12

I'll be stubborn, you know, at that point until you, because you, you don't need to realize that you don't need to have a lever you can use just to get your way, whatever you want.

32:20

I don't act like this. So no one who has families could act like this. I mean, it's the same thing with your child. Like if your child just pitches a absolute fit.

32:28

Now there's a kind of person who doesn't understand how analogies work. And they think that I've just compared a wife to a child gasp as if there's the same kind of relationship, but it is just an analogy, but I mean, the same thing with a child.

32:40

If your child were to do that kind of thing, like go to war over a preference.

32:46

You say, this is preference is way too important to you. We're not going to give you your way at this point, but generally, no,

32:51

I don't think a guy should be using his authority to demand his preferences.

32:57

That isn't the way that God, that isn't a reason why God gave him that authority.

33:03

So you have that, you have preference issues, you have wisdom issues, and then you have sin issues. Sin issues on the other side of preference issues are, they're just clear black and white issues where, like that are clearly sinful.

33:20

So for example, you shot that murder. There's no conceivable situation where it's ever okay to murder.

33:29

I mean, there is a biblical concept of a lawful killing or something like that, but yeah, murder is murder.

33:34

You should always avoid that. A husband should be leading his family into faithfulness kind of issues.

33:41

So, hey, we're going to go to church every week. That's what God says. We're not going to kill anyone.

33:49

We're not going to murder anyone. As for me and my house, there will be no accidental murders.

33:56

We're not – I realize I'm mixing categories at that point, but you understand what

34:02

I mean. Theft is wrong, murder is wrong. You have black and white kind of sin issues.

34:08

So there's that. Now, wisdom issues are a little more complicated because a wisdom issue might involve many different commands and principles, and there may not be a clear right answer.

34:21

Yeah. Like a clear, specific, biblical answer that is readily apparent to everyone.

34:28

So, I mean, just imagine like as a family, how much should you save? What do you mean?

34:36

How much? Like what number? How much should you save? Yeah. I mean, you should be saving something.

34:47

I can't give a blanket statement on – I guess maybe you could give a percentage. You could say, hey, it's a good idea.

34:54

The most you could say is, hey, it's a wise decision to save, you know, probably 10 % at least of what you're making, right?

35:04

Well, to a certain extent, yeah, but then it depends on how much income you have, what stage of life you're at. I mean, you may be at the very beginning of your life and you have literally no disposable income or very little.

35:15

How much can you devote to that? Maybe you have a choice between giving a tithe or saving.

35:21

What do you do? I think you give your tithe, that kind of thing. So, yeah, I mean, it kind of depends on your income level, your situation in life, whatever responsibilities that you have.

35:36

I mean, there's a point where you can be saving so much to where you're guilty of hoarding too.

35:42

So, I mean, trying to just, I mean, you think about all the things that coalesce into a decision like that.

35:50

I mean, it's very difficult to give an exact amount to say, this is how much you should save, like every single person.

35:58

But I mean, so what I'm saying would be like, how much should you save? That would be a wisdom issue. And I think a lot of what a husband should be using his authority to do would be to step in and make decisions on what's wise and what's sinful.

36:12

So, yeah, I mean, I think if he's using his authority just to selfishly get his way, then that really isn't the best way to use it.

36:25

Would you be? I would say he's a petty tyrant if that's what he's doing. But then I do have a category for standing your ground when faced with someone who's going to make a mountain out of a molehill kind of thing.

36:36

Yeah. In terms of the preference thing, saying, hey, you know, a husband shouldn't be using his authority to get things that are his preference from his wife or from his children even.

36:50

Are you appealing to verses like 1 Corinthians 13, love is patient, love is kind, love does not envy or boast, it is not arrogant or rude, it does not insist on its own way, it is not irritable or resentful, it does not rejoice at wrongdoing, but rejoices with the truth, love bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things.

37:14

Are you looking at something like it does not insist on its own way as like, hey, if you're someone who loves your significant other, you're typically going to try to put their preferences over your own as much as possible?

37:35

Yeah, I mean, I think that's a great verse. Love doesn't insist on its own way. So I think you should have a general orientation to be trying to place your wife's preferences above your own.

37:48

But I mean, I can imagine different scenarios like this, right? So let's say you really, yeah, in the example you thought, oh man, like, yeah, you know what sounds really good, going to whatever restaurant tonight.

38:05

I'm going to save my wife some work and why don't we go there? I would think that would be a pretty normal thing to do, even if your preference was included in that, and as an act of leadership, you were just to say, hey, like, why don't we go to X tonight, right?

38:23

Now, I mean, again, like if your wife, if there's no category for you doing that in your relationship at all, you have a significant problem on your hands.

38:32

Okay, you didn't ask me first where I wanted to go, you know, how did you include me?

38:38

You know, I just, I think this relationship has gone off the rails in a pretty significant way if there's no category allowance for a husband to think, oh,

38:46

I would really like to go to this restaurant and I'm going to let, you know, I'm just, why don't we all go?

38:52

That would be really fun, you know, kind of thing. Like if no one's ever allowed to do that, I don't really know what marriage is at this point.

39:00

You know, but a lot of people, they treat, you know, that, they don't really consider situations like that into the mix when they're answering the question, you know, should a husband ever make a decision without consulting his wife?

39:16

It's like, I imagine there's thousands of situations like that. Spontaneous spur of the moment, hey, wouldn't this be fun?

39:25

Why don't I try to surprise everyone? It's like, oh yeah, your surprise was a terrible surprise.

39:32

I think you're surprised, you know, it's like, oh, that's shocking. I thought it was going to be fun, you know, that kind of thing.

39:38

So, I mean, I have a category for that. I would think that your basic orientation shouldn't just be that in situation after situation after situation, it's always your desire that's being preferred and then your wife's desire is the one that's being run over, that kind of thing, right?

39:56

So, I mean, I would think in a healthy marriage, that would be a normal thing and there would be an equal, if not more, you know, number of situations where you would be trying to do something you'd know specifically your wife wants to do too, right?

40:12

So, as a leader, I think you should have freedom to make decisions that include both, you know?

40:21

Yeah, so, you know, I would think if your wife lost her mind because she didn't get her way one time, then, yeah, maybe you stand your ground on that.

40:33

Sure, yeah. This is not the way this works, you know? Right, yeah, because then you're, it seems like you'd be venturing into a straight -up sin, or straight -up sin territory, right?

40:46

Some sort of selfishness or, you know, jealousy. Love that sits on its own way applies to both the husband and the wife.

40:53

Right, right, that's an equal, you know, equal opportunity offender kind of situation.

41:01

Yeah, and you shouldn't be leading your wife in such a way that you just give that a blanket pass and you don't confront that, you don't, you just kind of allow her.

41:08

So, but I think in general, yeah, if there's something, for some reason, that really your wife found demeaning or insulting or whatever else that was objectively demeaning or objectively insulting,

41:24

I would think you would want to yield on it, you know? So, I mean, that doesn't mean that every, with the abuse discussions being what they are right now, everything is being put in this category of being demeaning and assaulting.

41:36

If my husband were to say to his wife, hey, you know, I want you to wear dresses, I don't want you to wear pants stuff anymore,

41:41

I would think, most people would think that would be demeaning and insulting and infantilizing her. And I would just say, yeah, you know what?

41:50

Maybe it would be nice if we all lived in a society where everyone tried to support what we tried. Yeah, yeah.

41:57

And if you as a husband wanted to contribute to that, you know, it's funny, like my wife, as she's worn dresses out in public, for instance, just talking about this, there's been random people who just like thank her.

42:13

Thank her? I mean, not in like a creepy way, but just more like...

42:21

Like thanks for actually putting in some effort. Man, that tells you where we're at, doesn't it?

42:33

Thank you. Thank you for trying even a little bit.

42:39

It's pretty funny. But no, I mean, I would think that everything right now is being put in this demeaning, insulting kind of category to where people are just ridiculous.

42:50

But yeah, no, I would think in general, if your wife just had some strange, even like thoughts that you really didn't understand and it really wasn't that deep and it really wasn't a big deal and, you know, for some reason, something is rubbing her the wrong way, yeah,

43:10

I wouldn't just demand my own way.

43:17

And I don't think husbands should be just demanding their own way if there's something that really is troubling for a wife.

43:24

Maybe you don't even understand it, then yeah, just it's not really that deep.

43:29

Now, let's assume there's a husband who is demanding his own way. And it's not just like a one -time thing, it's a consistent thing.

43:39

Should the wife in that scenario continue to submit even though it's a preference thing?

43:47

Yeah, I mean, I think that's what submission means. Okay. So even though he might not be using his authority in the right way, the

43:56

God -honoring thing for the wife to do would be submit to it, right?

44:01

Yeah, I mean, I think she could confront him about it. I mean, a lot of those things are judgment of motives. A lot of those things end up being judgment of motives.

44:10

Like, I think you're being really selfish right now kind of thing. That's a little bit hard to establish because you're not a mind reader and you don't know the secrets of the heart.

44:20

So a lot of those things, I'm noticing a pattern where it seems like you're always quick to get your way, but then you don't give me my way.

44:28

And I mean, I think those are all things to talk about, to confront about. If you notice that it goes on and on and on, that's just a pattern.

44:35

I mean, those are things to reach out to a pastor about, get some help with. So, sure. But yeah,

44:43

I mean, 1 Peter is pretty clear here. Wives who are subject to their own husbands, even if some do not obey the word, win them over without a word when they observe your chaste and respectful conduct.

44:55

If it be possible, as much as lies within you live at peace with all men. A wife could submit to a selfish husband and make it a non -issue.

45:06

Try to win him over secretly without a word. Now, a husband is not required to win his wife over without a word.

45:12

That's her posture towards a husband who is specifically using his authority in an ungodly way.

45:19

But that is her instruction given, is to win him over without a word. I mean, that was the example of Augustine's mother, like Monica.

45:26

I mean, I think this is such a foreign thought here, but she was so submissive to her husband that she didn't...

45:40

People are going to take this from me. She was so submissive to her husband that Augustine praised her for not being one of the women who ended up at the waterhole with a black eye kind of thing.

45:54

So, I mean, that's like living in a time that is completely different than the kind of time that we're living in.

46:00

But I mean, his point in that was just to say that when you have a wife who is determined to follow her biblical role, regardless of what the guy does, there's a lot less conflict that comes from that, right?

46:13

And you can avoid most of the stuff that the contentious woman may not be avoiding.

46:20

I mean, if you think the answer to it all is just to be a contentious woman, then you're introducing certain problems.

46:26

So, I mean, you can even have a jerk... You can have the worst husband imaginable, and even the worst husband imaginable, it's going to be very hard to fight with him if you're not determined to fight with him and turn everything into a fight.

46:40

Now, that's not to say that there aren't some guys who are going to find it out. And I'm also not saying, as people probably want to hear me to be saying, that anytime there's conflict, it's the wife's fault.

46:51

I'm not saying that. I'm just trying to say that that whole win him over without a word thing does often work.

46:58

Or at least it does tone down a lot of the conflict that you might have. So, yeah, if you're in that situation where you're living with a stubborn pig -headed guy, you do have marching orders to give him.

47:09

It's not your job just to resist him at every point. You suspect that he's possibly being selfish or know that he actually is being selfish.

47:17

That isn't really the right path here. Yeah. Okay. I've got one more question for you, and it kind of takes it back to Tom Buck.

47:27

Because just like Tom Buck ran a poll asking if a husband tells his wife that he wants her to wear a red dress every day, is she to submit to his authority and obey?

47:41

He ran a follow -up poll that's still going right now, and so I'll show that to you.

47:48

Let's see. And so this is the new poll that's going right now.

47:54

If the government tells a citizen that he is to wear a mask every day during a pandemic, is he to submit to the government's authority and obey?

48:04

And then he adds an asterisk, you know, assume the government even provides the mask for him to wear.

48:11

What's your general response to a question like a poll like this that's being asked in the context of the red dress question?

48:24

Yes, sir. So, I mean, basically what he's trying to suggest is he's trying to do a moral... Well, I assume...

48:31

This is my assumption. My assumption is that there's a bit of a moral equivalence argument that is going on there to where you're basically trying to equate the two scenarios.

48:42

Now, it could be because I'm not an infallible interpreter of the mind, you know, that he would answer both of these in different ways, but then putting it back to back,

48:55

I would suspect that the point here is just to suggest that the answer to the red dressing is no.

49:02

Well, there's comments on it, you know, from people who seem to, you know, be in large agreement that are essentially saying, oh,

49:10

I see what you're doing. All right, yeah. So, I won't put my explanation forward as the absolute truth.

49:22

I'll just say I suspect that's what's going on, and we'll leave it at that. But, yeah, I... The thing is you do have to ask about the nature of what the government's authority is, and you have to ask just some simple questions along those lines.

49:35

So, there's... I'm sorry for yelling so much. That's all right.

49:41

I put together a play set for my kids today and I'm exhausted. But here's the thing. So, there's a difference between using your authority.

49:54

There's two different kinds of categories you could see. Like, you can see someone using... moving beyond their scope of authority, and that's something that's happening with the government issue, where they're moving beyond the scope of their authority.

50:09

But then, like in another situation, you can be working within the scope of authority that you have, but you could just be using that authority in a self -centered way.

50:20

So, I would think in the husband asking the wife to wear a red dress every day scenario, he's within the realm of his authority.

50:29

He's just using it. He's most likely using it in a self -centered way.

50:35

Maybe there's more to it than that. Maybe he's tired of all the sweatpants and the casual yoga pants, all that kind of stuff.

50:45

It's just like, you know, it's... we need to set a different standard as a family kind of thing.

50:52

Yeah. Plus some weird thing with red, you know. Sure, yeah.

51:00

Who knows what that's about, you know. So, I mean, but yeah, I would assume it would probably be mostly self -centered there in that, but maybe there's more to it.

51:08

In the government thing, do they have the authority? Do they have that kind of authority? So, the government doesn't have unlimited authority, and the government relationship over the citizen is not the same kind of relationship as the wife or husband in that way.

51:24

So, meaning, like, you think about what the government has authority to do. Well, a lot of their authority centers around bearing the sword.

51:33

So, a lot of it, like, the government is the avenger of wrongdoing. They're supposed to be protecting property rights.

51:39

Like, when they step into the realm of asking you to put a mask on their face, that's them operating as a petty tyrant beyond the scope of their authority.

51:49

So, yeah, I wouldn't say that the husband telling his wife what to wear would be outside the realm of his authority.

52:01

I mean, if she were wearing a miniskirt and he says, get it off, you know, it's too short.

52:07

She should listen to him. He's her husband, you know. So, that's within the realm of his authority. Yeah, he may use it in selfish ways at times.

52:14

I mean, that's the temptation of kings in the Old Testament. Kings use their authority in a self -centered way. But then, you know, when they did use it,

52:24

God explained the behavior to the Israelites. So, king, they're going to take, they're going to take, they're going to take. But they were using the authority they have.

52:31

But then the government we have is not a king over us or under the Constitution. And this is a different kind of government that we have here.

52:41

And their authority is not endless. So, there might be many situations. So, for example, just to give you an analogy of how that works.

52:47

Yeah, I mean, obviously, if the state of Georgia sent you a tax bill, you would say no, right?

52:55

Right, yeah, because I don't live in Georgia. Because you don't live in Georgia, so they don't have the authority to tax you.

53:02

So, a lot of what our government is doing is they're claiming authority they don't have. So, it's not just an issue of them using it self -centeredly.

53:09

It's the claiming authority they don't have. So, it's just, it's not comparable. So, as a fun little closing thing,

53:17

I thought it would be funny to say, all right, how do you want to vote on this poll?

53:24

And that's how we're going to end the episode is I'll put the vote in for us. Okay, all right, fair enough.

53:30

So, if a government tells a citizen he is to wear a mask every day during the pandemic, is he to submit to the government authority and obey?

53:37

No, there it is. Oh, look, 85 % said no, they should not.

53:46

But at least we've given a good explanation for it. And so, hopefully, that'll be helpful for some people to be able to distinguish the difference between these two scenarios.

53:59

So, but I think that's a good place for us to wrap the episode on. I think we've talked about this a good bit and kind of covered everything that I knew to ask.

54:09

And I'm sure there's probably more that could be said on the subject in general, but I think we'll leave it there.

54:15

So, thank you, Tim, for answering all my questions related to that and even telling me how to vote for the podcast on that poll at the end.

54:25

So, you know, mission accomplished there. We stuck it to everybody and told them the difference.

54:31

So, thank you for doing that, Tim. We want to thank all you guys for listening to us and supporting us, whether that be through watching the episodes and hopefully learning from them, whether that be by supporting us financially, which you can do by going to our

54:51

Patreon and giving to us there. There's a link down in the description for that. If you want to interact with us more throughout the week, then feel free to follow us on our social media accounts, especially on Twitter.

55:04

That's probably where we're the most active. There's links down in the description to our

55:09

Facebook and our Twitter. I should probably add Instagram. We have

55:15

Instagram, we have Rumble, we have TikTok, all that stuff. So, I should probably add those in there as well so you can go follow us there.

55:22

Go follow us there if you haven't already. And if you're looking for other ways to support us, you can do so by leaving a like and a comment.

55:30

If you're watching the video on YouTube or Rumble, obviously subscribe to the YouTube and the Rumble channel.

55:37

And if you're listening to this in podcast form, then subscribing to the podcast and leaving us a five -star review.

55:43

And those are some really good free ways for you guys to help support us and get us out there to more people.

55:49

So, we certainly appreciate all that, and we look forward to having you on the next one. This has been another episode of Bible Bashed.

55:57

We hope you have been encouraged and blessed through our discussion. We thank you for all your support and ask you to continue to like and subscribe to Bible Bashed and share our podcast with your friends and on social media.

56:09

Please reach out to us with your questions, pushback, and potential topics for us to discuss in future episodes at BibleBashedPodcast at gmail .com

56:18

and consider supporting us through Patreon. If you would like to be Bible Bashed personally, then please know that we also offer free biblical counseling, which you can take advantage of by emailing us.

56:29

Now, go boldly and obey the truth in the midst of a biblically illiterate world who will be perpetually offended by your every move.