SRR 125 Should Christians Support Black Lives Matter?

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October 2, 2020

00:02: I do a podcast. I'm not interested in your podcast. The anathema of God was for those who denied justification by faith alone.
00:12: When that is at stake, we need to be on the battlefield exposing the air and combating the air.
00:24: We are unabashedly, unashamedly Clarkian. And so the next few statements that I'm going to make,
00:30: I'm probably going to step on all of the Vantillian toes at the same time. And this is what we do at Simple Riff around the radio, you know.
00:36: We are polemical and polarizing Jesus style. I would first say that to characterize what we do as bashing is itself bashing.
00:57: It's not hate. It's history. It's not bashing. It's the Bible. Jesus said,
01:06: Woe to you when men speak well of you, for their fathers used to treat the false prophets in the same way, as opposed to blessed are you when you have been persecuted for the sake of righteousness.
01:17: It is on.
01:22: We're taking the gloves off. It's time to battle. All right, let's get started.
01:32: This is Simple Riff around the radio where the Bible alone and the Bible in its entirety is applied to all of faith and life.
01:39: My name is Tim. I'm one of the hosts of this podcast. Today I have with me
01:45: Hiram Diaz. He's the other co -host of the podcast. Carlos Montijo was not able to be here.
01:51: He had some things going on. It's been a busy, crazy year. We've not been able to record this year.
02:01: And we felt like we needed to get something out and just talk about some of the bigger issues going on in our culture today.
02:11: And this really this episode is just going to be a conversational episode between Hiram and I.
02:18: We just want to talk back and forth about some of the issues. And really sort of talk about the way that Christians should think about some of these things.
02:30: So Hiram, thanks for joining me tonight. And how are you doing? I'm doing good, man.
02:37: Still trying to deal with smoke inhalation. Being out here in Idaho, I'm close enough to get smoke.
02:45: Where we're at right now, we're getting like it's wafting in and out, if that makes any sense. You know, like we'll have moments of clarity.
02:51: It's nice and cool and breezy. And then all of a sudden the sky is just cloudy and it looks like Armageddon is upon us.
02:58: And the temperature goes up. So if I sound a little raspy or like sniffly, it's because of the smoke.
03:05: I've been inhaling it like all day. And so what you're talking about right now are the fires that are raging across the western hemisphere of the
03:16: United States, right? Yep, yep, yep. And of course, that's why we need to vote for Joe Biden because your life depends on it, right?
03:28: Well, yeah, because the fires all started because of COVID. Yeah. You know, I feel a little bit gypped here because AOC said we had at least 12 years to plan for this, right?
03:40: But, I mean, I thought you would have more time to plan for this, but apparently that's not the case.
03:48: So global warming is upon us and you are suffering for it.
03:54: Yeah, well, at least we know she's a false prophet now. We can take her outside and stone her.
04:02: Anyways, man, so let's talk about some of these issues because one of the things that we,
04:12: I guess what both of us want to get out of this podcast tonight is, it's sort of surprising to see that so many
04:22: Christians are, and we're talking about Christians, but so many Christians are divided among some of these bigger topic issues in our culture today.
04:31: And that's really unfortunate. And I remember having this conversation with one of my friends at work who was supporting
04:40: Black Lives Matter. And if you follow me on social media, you'll see pretty clearly that I do not support
04:50: Black Lives Matter. And what I told my friend was, you know, Christianity, he's a professing
04:58: Christian, and I said, Christianity is a system of truth, right? So the Bible alone is its objective standard.
05:05: And so with that in mind, we should be arriving at the same conclusions.
05:11: And the example, the analogy that I give is if I were to ask you, what is, if someone were to ask me and then ask my friend, what is the length of 26 inches, right?
05:25: And they would ask us independently of each other. We couldn't talk it out. We couldn't work it out. I could go away and cut a board at 26 inches, and he could cut a board at 26 inches.
05:36: And, you know, if we measured it correctly, then we would arrive at the same, roughly about the same length of board, right?
05:46: And I asked him, I said, why is that? Because the reason we can both do that, and based on this, we can,
05:54: I mean, if you order windows for your home, or if you order drapes, like you can give the measurements, and the people don't have to come here and look for themselves.
06:04: They can just measure it out and send it to you. And the reason you can do that is because we're both appealing to an objective standard of measurement, right?
06:14: So, we have an objective standard of measurement. We look at, you know, a yardstick or a ruler or a measuring tape or whatever, and we can both, you know, get 26 inches.
06:28: And so, we can arrive, you would expect that because we're both appealing to the same objective standard of measurement that we can, that we would arrive at the same conclusion of what 26 inches looks like.
06:41: And so, think about it. I mean, the Bible is an objective standard of truth.
06:49: So, why is it that so many people, when they talk about these topics, are coming to completely different and opposing sides?
06:59: Well, I would submit that some people are not going to the
07:06: Word of God first and considering what the Word of God has to say. And I think that that should be our starting point.
07:14: It shouldn't be my cultural experience. It shouldn't be my family history or my family background or my personal experience.
07:24: It should be what does the Word of God say? How does that influence or impact my thinking?
07:30: And it's really tragic to me because it's like, I don't care if you're black, if you're white, if you're pink, if you're purple, if you're brown.
07:37: Well, I do care if you're purple because you should probably get some oxygen.
07:45: But I don't care what color your skin is. I'm kind of lavender right now.
07:51: You're lavender? Because of all the smoke inhalation? Yeah.
07:57: Sorry about that. I don't care if you're black. It's like as brothers or brothers and sisters in Christ, we should be able to arrive at the same conclusion on a lot of these issues and we're not.
08:12: And it's tragic and it's sad. And so tonight we want to look at some of these issues through the lens of scripture and just talk about the way a
08:26: Christian should think through these things. So right off the bat, let me just affirm for everyone out there who might have had a mini stroke when
08:36: I said I don't support Black Lives Matter. Let me affirm that I do support that Black Lives Matter.
08:45: And furthermore, I would say that the Christian worldview is the only worldview that can substantiate the claim that black lives do matter because black people are fearfully and wonderfully made in the image of God.
08:59: And thereby have intrinsic value and dignity that cannot be given to them just by somebody yelling on the street,
09:08: Black Lives Matter. So what we've seen in the
09:14: Black Lives Matter movement is really that this is not something, it's not only something that's not
09:23: Christian, but it's actually something that Christians should openly oppose.
09:29: Exactly. And unfortunately, we find that people are falling victim to this, right?
09:35: That they're supporting this. So with that being said,
09:40: I want to ask you the question. I just want to throw it out there for the discussion. You've written an outstanding article on critical race theory, which by the way,
09:51: President Trump just got rid of critical race theory. Isn't that crazy, man?
09:56: That's such an answer to prayer. That's so cool. That is incredible.
10:03: It is an answer to prayer. He got rid of critical race theory indoctrination in federal agencies, which is amazing.
10:12: So I just want to throw this question out there. Should Christians support Black Lives Matter? And maybe you could weigh in on that.
10:21: Yeah. Down with capitalism. No borders, no walls. No borders, no walls, no
10:27: USA at all. Right? That's what they're saying. Yeah. A lot of people don't realize that is what they're saying, these quote unquote peaceful protests.
10:35: They don't realize that Black Lives Matter is Marxism. But that should answer the question.
10:42: No, we shouldn't be supporting Black Lives Matter, the institution. And the phrasing, even the phrasing
10:47: Black Lives Matter, I stay away from it. I try to explain what
10:53: I mean when I say that I don't support Black Lives Matter. Because, of course, people get triggered and they think you're saying something racist.
10:59: They think you're saying something bad. But I try to explain to people that really what the language is intended to do, like the terminology of Black Lives Matter, you know, for the organization.
11:12: It's intended to get that response from other people. You know what I mean? It's to put you in a place where they commit the fallacy of the complex question.
11:21: You know, the question like, have you stopped beating your wife recently? Or how long has it been since the last time you punched your wife in the face?
11:27: Or something along those lines. It's a question that automatically puts you in a bad position. So when someone says, oh, you don't support, don't you support
11:34: Black Lives Matter? The question that usually comes up is, oh, don't you think that Black Lives Matter?
11:41: It's like, of course I do. But what they've learned how to do is conflate the phrase as it occurs in normal speech and the phrase as it occurs as a term or as a slogan for the organization, which is a
11:59: Marxist organization. Which is being funded by people like George Soros and Alexander Soros, which is his son.
12:05: And that's not a conspiracy theory that's out there. It's in the news. It's factuality.
12:11: It's reality. And it does have anti -Christian, has an anti -Christian agenda.
12:17: Black Lives Matter is against heterosexuality or what they would call heteronormativity. The idea being that heterosexual relationships are, heterosexual sexual relationships are definitive of human sexuality by God's standard.
12:31: They're against that. They're against. They're against opposition to trans. Was it transgenderism?
12:38: They're against opposition to gay marriage. They are for homosexuality.
12:46: They are for transgenderism. They are for the dissolution of the family unit, which is crazy when you think about it because the family unit is what keeps people together and keeps society together at a very natural, if you look at it in a general sense.
13:01: Of course, it's God who ultimately does that, but the family is there. The structure is there in order to keep society as a cohesive unit.
13:11: And they're against that while at the same time claiming to be for black lives. Well, if you're taking black families and saying that it needs to be disrupted, the family unit, you're doing the opposite of what you claim to be doing.
13:23: So pretty much everything that they're doing, it's not really related to race.
13:28: And that's another reason why Christians need to oppose Black Lives Matter is because if you really care about black people, and you should because they're people, they're made in God's image.
13:37: If you care about anyone, if you find an organization that's exploiting someone for the purpose of another political agenda while claiming that they're doing it for those people, you should be opposed to that.
13:50: I mean, it's really that simple. Right. It really is. And so let me ask you this.
13:58: So that means that you should not march with them. That's exactly what that means because you're joining hands in wickedness.
14:06: It came out not too long ago, not only the Marxists, but also when they say... Now, just to clarify something really quick.
14:15: I went on the Theology Dude's podcast not too long ago, actually it was a while ago, and we talked about Black Lives Matter, me and Jonathan Moreno and the other people there on the show.
14:28: Yeah, those are good dudes. And one of the things that we talked about that I mentioned briefly was the whole say her name or say his name and how that ties into postmodernism.
14:38: And basically focusing on individuals and particulars as opposed to universals.
14:45: That whole thing, the philosophical, the abstract level. But something I didn't know at the time, and it came out not too long ago, is that the
14:52: Black Lives Matter founders, they explicitly say that when they do that, they are basically performing a seance.
15:01: They're calling for... Oh, wow. Yeah, I don't know if you heard about this or not, but they explicitly stated that it's a spiritual thing for them.
15:07: So when they say Black Lives Matter, and they say say his name, one of the people,
15:13: I don't know if it's Patrice or the other person, I think it's three of them, so it's Patrice or one of the other two.
15:19: But they all agree that when they do this, they are invoking the spirits of the dead.
15:28: And they feel as though the things that they're doing in the name of those people, they're doing because they are inspired, like literally inspired, like that person is working through them.
15:37: The way Christians say that the spirit of God is working through us, right? They believe that the spirits of the people who have died, that they're protesting for, supposedly, are doing things through them and their movement.
15:51: That alone, right? Even if you want to say, well, Marxism is debatable, which it's not, it's wrong, it's anti -Christian.
15:58: But even if you want to hypothetically throw that out there, okay, let's say Marxism is debatable, okay? Should you march with them?
16:05: No. Why? Because critical race theory? Well, critical race theory is another thing, but even hypothetically, let's say that's okay.
16:11: Let's say it's debatable, which it isn't, but let's say it is. Okay, do you still have a good reason to march with them?
16:16: No. Because they explicitly state that this is a spiritual thing, and what does scripture tell us?
16:22: What fellowship has light with darkness? Shall I take the members of Christ and join them to a prostitute?
16:30: And Paul is talking about sexual morality in that context, but it also applies to other contexts, especially spiritual ones, where, look, you can't be unequally yoked.
16:39: And the organization explicitly tells you, we're not doing this for the Christian God, we're doing this for the dead.
16:47: They believe in a sort of spiritism or traditional
16:52: African spiritism, right? The belief that there's a realm of ancestors, basically.
16:58: I don't know, the closest thing I can think of is something you would see in The Lion King or in Black Panther, the way they represent there's this other dimension where the spiritual entities live.
17:12: They believe in that, and they believe that they can invoke them. Scripture tells us that's necromancy. Scripture tells us that if they are being filled with anybody's spirit, it's not the spirits of humans.
17:23: Right. So we have no place, there's no justification at all to march hand in hand with people that are performing a mass seance and attempting to establish a world which is completely contrary to the one that God tells us is supposed to exist.
17:42: Yeah. Yeah, and, you know, so let's,
17:49: I'm really glad that you pointed that out because that was something that I wasn't aware of. Let me ask you this.
17:56: What about the argument that we should support them because the premise
18:04: Black Lives Matter is true, right? And so as Christians, you know, we love the truth.
18:12: So, of course, we want to support this. And what people will do is they'll say that, well, the movement has been hijacked.
18:20: And no, it hasn't. This movement was not founded in Christ. And one of the things that I have struggled to point out to people is that the premise
18:35: Black Lives Matter, while it's true at face value, it's rooted in a lie.
18:44: And so the lie is that black people are being hunted by the police or black people are being disproportionately killed by the police and they're not.
18:55: If you look at the evidence, it suggests that more white people are killed every year by police.
19:05: And of course, then people want to say, well, that's because the white population is a lot bigger.
19:10: But you have to look at the number of encounters with the police, violent encounters with the police.
19:17: And so, you know, the whole thing was I mean, what
19:23: I've told people is like, look, as a Christian, you need to be willing to bear witness to the truth.
19:30: Right. And so if you go out there and they start chanting things like hands up, don't shoot, referring back to Ferguson.
19:39: Well, that was a lie. That's not what happened. That guy did not. Michael Brown did not put his hands up and say, don't shoot.
19:48: He attacked the cop. And if you if you look at the evidence, I mean, the cop was well within his rights to to defend himself and use lethal force on Michael Brown.
20:00: And so if you go out there and you are they start chanting things like that, you then have put yourself in an in a position where you are obligated to bear witness to the truth.
20:15: And to speak to the truth and to oppose that, openly oppose that and say, wait a minute, that's not true.
20:23: You're bearing false witness. And instead, I mean,
20:28: I've seen professing Christians, you know, just start chanting the rhetoric or whatever, whatever, you know, chant it is for that day or it changes.
20:39: You know, it's like Black Lives Matter, Black Lives Matter. And then hands up, don't shoot. Or, you know, something about the cop.
20:45: So you just it's mindless repetition and nobody's actually thinking about what they're saying.
20:51: And so what I've told them is like, look, if you go out there with them and you start, you know, supporting them and in doing all that, or even if it's on social media and some of this comes out and it's like, it's not true.
21:07: You have an obligation to set the record straight, to bear witness to the truth.
21:12: Right. But the problem is, is that you can't do that. In this organization, there is zero tolerance, zero tolerance for those who would deviate even just a little bit.
21:28: And you saw this happen with the mayor.
21:33: What was his name? Fry. The Portland mayor. Yeah. Where they said he was pandering to them.
21:41: And it's a really funny video to watch because he's just pandering to them.
21:46: And then I think his name was, he was the mayor and his name, his last name was
21:53: Fry. And they asked him, do you support abolishing the police? And he said.
21:58: Oh, I know what you're talking about. Yeah. Yeah. And he said, no. And then they said, go home.
22:04: Go home, Jacob Fry. That was his name. They chanted, again, changing the chant just to get people fired up and on board.
22:12: And they chanted, go home, Jacob Fry. And they cussed him out and kicked him out of there. He walked out like a little puppy with his tail between his legs.
22:23: It's pretty pathetic, man. What a coward. Yeah. What a coward. You went there to pander to them.
22:28: And so that is unbelievably unwise for a Christian to go to one of these things and good luck.
22:38: Because here's the thing, if I see you there, whether it's in social media or whatever, and I hear them saying this stuff,
22:46: I'm going to tell you, hey, you need to call it out. And good luck with that because they will not tolerate any deviation from what they're doing.
22:59: You'll become the enemy. You will become their target. And they're on the prowl. They're looking for targets.
23:06: So I don't think it's wise for Christians to put themselves in that situation.
23:13: Now, let me pull this up. This is Colossians 2, verse 8.
23:18: I'm sure most of our listeners are aware of what this says.
23:24: But it says, So you've already explained that this is a philosophy that has taken people captive by empty deceit and according to elemental spirits.
23:47: You've already explained that. And I greatly appreciate that. And so what people are saying is that, well, the movement has been hijacked.
23:56: And it's like, no, the movement was not started in accordance with Christ. It was not started in accordance with Christ.
24:03: And what's amazing is that if you look at church history, you'll see denominations or seminaries start off well.
24:13: And then within a couple of generations, liberalism, modernism infiltrates them.
24:19: And they just go south. And so it's like if you see that happen again and again and again in church history, what makes you think that your movement, which is not started in Christ to begin with, which is premised on a truth claim that is rooted in a narrative that is a lie, it's going to be bad from the beginning.
24:46: It'll be different this time. What did you say? I said it'll be different this time.
24:52: I mean, that's what they say about communism. Yeah. I mean, people make, and it ties right into it, right?
24:57: Because they are Marxist. Black Lives Matter is a Marxist organization. Yeah. And the heads of it are
25:02: Marxist. They say that they're highly trained in ideology. Well, what do people say about Marxism, about socialism, about communism?
25:10: They say, well, it's been tried before, but they messed up the last time, right?
25:17: It won't be that way this time. It'll be different this time. And it's really, it's, I don't know, the way that I understand it is it's just, even if it's a professing
25:27: Christian saying this, there's, it's rebellion. It's sin. Yeah. And there's a reason for it.
25:33: And if it's, I understand to some extent, as someone who's
25:39: Latino, I understand, right? And who grew up around this kind of rhetoric regarding race and the white man oppression, systemic oppression, all that garbage.
25:48: I understand where the mindset is, let's say, right?
25:55: I understand why it would be hard for someone to, to jettison that mindset, to repent, because that's what we're talking about here.
26:02: Repenting of that way of thinking and go with what scripture says, because it's so firmly ingrained in your thinking from such an early age, because it's something that the whole community shares in.
26:13: You know what I mean? I grew up hearing stuff like this all the time. And it took me a while. It wasn't until I moved out to Idaho that I saw that, yeah, what
26:21: I was being told was not the case. Right? White people weren't out to destroy all the people that weren't white.
26:29: I just thought that wasn't the case. It's just, we're humans and we do human things. But it took a while for like, for that mindset to just go away.
26:37: And by the grace of God, reading scripture and being convicted of my own sin, I gradually lost that mindset.
26:44: And I began to see things as they really are. But, you know, it's pride that leads people to think that they can do something different when fundamentally the system itself is self -contradictory.
26:57: And it destroys itself. It eats itself and always will be doing that because that's the nature of the system itself.
27:04: It's pride that makes them think they can do it. It's the same thing with evolutionary theory. Why do they have to modify evolutionary theory?
27:09: Well, because it's internally contradictory, because it has all these problems. But it's human pride. Right?
27:14: It's the center pride. It's the rebellion against God that makes people think, oh, well, if we modify it this way, then it'll stand up.
27:21: You know, we'll fix it. We'll basically, we'll put duct tape on all the holes where the truth is leaking in and destroying it.
27:27: And it'll be better. Well, it won't be. But that's what we do.
27:33: We want to cling on. We want to love a lie instead of the truth. And that's essentially what's happening. And I say that even with Christians in mind.
27:40: And that's part of the reason why I can't stand, I can't stand when people try to make it so that, well, that's why
27:49: I get frustrated, I should say. When Christians don't want to hear about the truth about Black Lives Matter, right?
27:56: About the spiritual aspect of it, about the communism, Marxism aspect, all that stuff. Because they're doing damage to themselves.
28:03: They're doing damage to their brother and sister in Christ. They're causing others to stumble. And it's destructive and it's sad to see and it's frustrating.
28:10: So, let me ask you this question. Let's get into a little bit more of the,
28:20: I guess, the ideology. Because we mentioned that it's rooted in Marxist ideology.
28:27: And we see that come to play when notions of white privilege or white guilt are pushed, right?
28:35: Because this is rooted in Marxist ideology that's meant to divide people into class groups of oppressed and oppressor.
28:44: And it's rebranded. It's now what's known as cultural Marxism. But obviously,
28:50: Karl Marx, he divided people into the working class and the oppressor class.
28:57: I think it was the bourgeoisie and the proletariats. And the leaders of Black Lives Matter have stated openly that they are trained
29:08: Marxists. And so, what I wanted to get into is some of the
29:13: Marxist ideology that is coming out that Christians are embracing. One of the prominent ones is the notion of white privilege.
29:24: And I see a lot of Christians. So, first of all, I don't even think that a lot of these people that are embracing this are aware of the fact that it's
29:34: Marxist ideology that's infiltrating the church. But I've seen a lot of Christian brothers and sisters who are accepting and embracing the idea of white privilege.
29:49: I even had one sister tell me that I should be aware of my whiteness and that I should tell my children about their, you know, their...
30:01: I should let them know about their whiteness or... I forget how she said it. And I basically came out on social media and I said, basically, the notion of white privilege is erroneous, fallacious, it's wrong.
30:18: And I took a lot of heat for it. And I was really surprised, again, going back to what we were talking about in the beginning.
30:26: It's like, I'm really surprised that people that I... you know,
30:33: I do believe that they're Christians, but I think that they're confused on this. And as Christians, we should be able to come to the word of God and recognize that something is not right here.
30:45: So, I wanted to just throw that question out there. So, first of all, white privilege, is it a legitimate idea?
30:57: Is it true? Do I have white privilege? So, explain that a little bit.
31:03: I hear you saying no, so, yeah. I've gotten to the point, man, where I just...
31:09: that's it. I get these things on Facebook, like I'm in these different groups, and there'll be this person asking this question where it's like, is it really true that blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, right?
31:20: And everybody's giving these elaborate answers, and I just say no, because I really don't see the point of getting into it, because nine times out of ten, people who are asking it...
31:28: and I'm not saying this about you, what I'm saying. I hear these things so often, and I see how those who are promoting them are responding, right?
31:36: The people that really believe in those ideas, where it doesn't matter if you give them the most elaborate, logically precise, airtight argument against what they're saying, they won't accept it.
31:45: But, for those who will, the reason why I say white privilege is not a thing is because when
31:52: I hear terms like white privilege, when I hear systemic racism, I'm looking at those terms through the lens of the philosophy that's accepted by the people at Black Lives Matter at the foundational level, because that's what they mean, right?
32:04: They're the ones who are pulling the strings, they're the ones who want the organization to go out, they're the ones who want their message to be heard, so the definition is not going to come from somebody on the ground level, who hears the phrase, let's say,
32:19: Black Lives Matter, or white privilege, or systemic racism, and they think just in terms of, let's say, a purely lexical definition of that terminology, because anybody can say, yes, if there's racism in a systemic, meaning there's racism in a system, it's a bad thing, right?
32:37: But that's not what systemic racism really refers to, that's just part of it. Just like with white privilege, somebody can say, well, if you're white and you enjoy certain privileges, such as, let's say,
32:48: I think it was Kimberly Crenshaw who came up with the idea, who constructed it, and who, one of the things she points to is band -aids being flesh -toned, if I'm not mistaken, and flesh being supposed to be like a universal, when in reality it's just white flesh, or white people of color.
33:07: You can look at stuff like that, and people will look at that and say, oh, that's white privilege, something along those lines, but that's not even what white privilege is, it's bigger than that, right?
33:15: Because it's a whole system of what they consider to be whiteness. This is one of the reasons why Black Lives Matter heads, these women, are involved in African spirituality, because they want to get away from, quote -unquote, the white man's religion.
33:28: And they don't say that, but I'm putting it in the way that I've heard other people who have the same mindset put it, right? They want to get away from European white male theology, that they believe is anti -black, that they believe is anti -every other minority.
33:47: So when I hear white privilege, that's what I'm thinking of, and that's the reason why I say it's not a thing.
33:53: Because what's in the background is a way bigger idea.
34:01: But the idea that white people enjoy certain privileges that black people don't enjoy on a local level, on a particular level, if you put it that way, and not a universal level, well,
34:13: I think that's going to be true in some cases, obviously, just like there are going to be black people who enjoy privileges that white people don't enjoy on a certain level, right?
34:20: There are places in New York where I can go to where certain other ethnic groups can't go, because they will be ousted, right?
34:29: They will be immediately identified as other. They will immediately be identified as subjects to be robbed, to be preyed upon.
34:38: And that's just the fact of the matter. And that happens everywhere you go. So if that's what people are thinking is white privilege, that sort of thing, and it happens in any people group at any given location, that's not exactly what it is, right?
34:53: It's a way bigger thing. It's part of the whole ideology that ties into critical race theory and Marxism and all that stuff.
35:00: So that's why I say no, it's not a thing, because it's not the individual example that I just gave.
35:05: Like, you go to a white neighborhood and everybody knows each other, and you're not white, and everybody experiences privileges that you don't experience because you're an outsider.
35:14: That's not what it is. It's way bigger than that. Mathematics is racist. And if you do well in a math class and you're white, it's because you have privilege.
35:25: If you do well on a test, it's because you have privilege. If you are good at getting to a place on time, if you're punctual.
35:31: And this is something I talked about with Jonathan over at the AllerDudes. This is one of the things I mentioned. This is one of the things
35:37: I tried to take advantage of when I wasn't a Christian, was the idea that punctuality was a white man's virtue, right?
35:45: And this is one of the things I used to justify me being late and wanting to sleep in. It's like, well, you know, my people, mi gente, we take siestas and we sleep during the day.
35:55: But the white man must have forced me to go to work on time. So if I get to work late and I get in trouble, it's because I didn't have the same privilege of being born into a white family and being born to learn how to be punctual and learning how to play by the rules, basically.
36:13: I'm such an outsider that I don't have any of those privileges because that's really what white privilege is referring to.
36:19: It's the whole system, as they claim, being against you because you're not white. Yeah, and I'm really glad that you're making the distinction between people who are on the streets trying to define white privilege and the established view from the system, because we see this all the time and it's pretty irritating.
36:41: When you get into a debate or you get into a discussion and then you point out something and then somebody will accuse you of making a straw man argument by misrepresenting what they're saying.
36:51: And they'll say, well, you don't actually understand what this means. And what white privilege really means is that, and then they'll come up with some other definition by which it appears to be more persuasive and people will jump on board.
37:12: And I've seen that play out because what people will say is like, well, have you ever been pulled over by the cops for no reason?
37:22: And it's really fun because then I get to tell them, yeah, I have. Of course you have, everybody has.
37:27: Yeah, exactly. And a while back I had put up this post where I was trying to just talk about this and people were getting triggered.
37:40: And I wrote something, I'm just going to read it to you. I said, the notion of white privilege and white guilt commit the fallacy of sweeping generalization.
37:48: Because it's like, you don't know me. You don't know my experiences.
37:53: And this whole narrative is built off of personal testimonies and anecdotal evidence.
37:59: So it commits a fallacy of sweeping generalization. And again, they're rooted in anti -Christian
38:05: Marxist ideology that's meant to divide people. And I wrote, the idea that white people don't see it because they're white, that commits the genetic fallacy.
38:16: And I went on to say, there's no epistemological foundation by which one can establish the premise of white privilege or white guilt.
38:24: If one wishes to appeal to a limited set of particular examples in order to substantiate these generalizations, then they're committing the fallacy of induction.
38:35: And so that's exactly what we get. We get anecdotal evidence, which is, you know, and somebody sent me this long
38:44: Facebook post. And it was a friend of a friend. And she told me, she says,
38:49: I think that we need to just sit quietly and listen. And I was like, okay,
38:55: I'm all for listening. Like, yeah, you do need to listen to what other people are saying. But you're just telling me to shut up.
39:01: And I'm not going to do that. And so she sent me this long Facebook post with like someone's personal testimony about how, you know,
39:13: I guess her husband went out to get something one time, accidentally left the phone at home, came back hours later and looked like he was kind of like dirty.
39:26: And then like said that, you know, cops had pulled him over, handcuffed him, put him on the ground, face down in the dirt and left him like that for hours.
39:36: And then, you know, she gave another testimony where she, her son was in the store with her and he like kind of walked away from her.
39:48: And she noticed the security guard following her son like he was going to steal something because he was a black little boy.
39:55: And so she basically told the security guard like what was on her mind and like walked out of there and was so offended.
40:04: And so it's like, has that ever happened to you, right? Because let's just compare stories and whoever has the saddest story wins the debate, right?
40:13: And so I told her, I said, this person who asked me like, has this ever happened to you?
40:19: And I was like, yes, it has. I remember one time when I was fresh out of high school,
40:26: I was in college and I was driving around on the west side of town. And I pulled into a,
40:32: I was lost. I was looking for a friend's house and I pulled into a school parking lot just to turn around real quick.
40:38: And this cop like follows me in there. And I was like, okay, whatever.
40:44: But he pulls me over and then he like goes up to the car. It was a long time ago, but basically asked me if he could search my car.
40:52: And I was like, this is weird. And if I say no, then does that mean
40:57: I give him probable cause and then he's going to search it? And it's like, well, maybe like I'll disagree because I'm not hiding anything.
41:05: And so I said, yeah. And then he called in for a canine unit and he and like three other cops like searched my car like crazy, dude.
41:13: Like they took apart the pins. I remember I had pens and schoolwork. They took apart the pins and left them on the seat.
41:20: Like completely taken apart. That's crazy. Yeah. And I was like, did you not see me pull in here?
41:26: Or like what? And it was basically like I pulled onto school property after hours. And I was like, did you not see me like pull off the road?
41:34: Or like, did you think I was like doing something, you know, sinister? And so you would look at me and say, you have white privilege.
41:42: And it's like, I mean, this guy searched my car for like two hours. And I was like, all right, did
41:48: I match a suspect? Did I, a car? I don't know. You know, and everybody has those experiences.
41:56: And so the problem is, is that the Bible tells us how to approach these, these incidences.
42:04: I mean, these situations. I can give you another example. Like when I was, when I was actually in high school,
42:10: I was following behind somebody and the light turned yellow. And at the last,
42:16: I thought they were going to take the light. At the last minute, they slammed on their brakes.
42:21: I moved into the other lane to avoid hitting them because I had no intentions of stopping.
42:27: And then I was going too fast. And I took, I took the red or yellow light. I thought it was a yellow light.
42:32: So I get pulled over. The cop gives me a ticket for unsafe lane change, no use of a turn signal, failure to yield the right -of -way, running a red light.
42:43: I couldn't, I couldn't find my insurance card. And speeding.
42:50: I think that's six. He gave me six tickets. And I was like, is there anything you're forgetting?
42:57: I mean, you know, like media quota or what's the deal here?
43:03: You know? And so it's like, we've, we've all had experiences like that.
43:09: And, you know, if I were to, if I were to try to establish a narrative based off of my experiences, right.
43:16: And I'm telling you this as a Christian, here's how, here's what you should, here's, here's what you should have in mind.
43:25: Let me, let me pull this up. It's Proverbs 18, Proverbs 18, 17.
43:30: Okay. The one who states his case first seems right until the other comes to examine him.
43:38: Okay. So I could tell you right now, like, yeah, like I, that light was yellow and, and, you know,
43:45: I wasn't speeding. Right. I could tell you all of that. And if we're friends, you can, you can sympathize, you can empathize.
43:53: You can be like, man, yeah, I can understand how that would be rough. But at the end of the day, it's like, do you really know if that's what happened?
44:03: No. Because, and so, so like the example that I gave earlier, some lady who has her kid in the store and he wanders off and the security guard starts following him.
44:13: Right. Does she know, like, does she actually know that he thinks he's going to steal something because he's a black boy?
44:23: No. No, she doesn't. What if, what if he is, is concerned that this is a lost child?
44:31: So here's the problem with all of this. Everybody should have learned this, this proverb when the, the situation with Nick Sandman happened in January.
44:43: And if you're not familiar with that, I don't know what rock you were living under, but Nick Sandman was the kid who was wearing the
44:50: MAGA hat. And the kid with the, the kid with the, and I quote
44:55: CNN here, the kid with the most punchable face you've ever seen. Actually, I think that was, that was,
45:01: I think that was Bill Maher who said that. Really? I thought it was CNN.
45:07: It was said. It probably was Bill Maher. It was said. And Bill Maher said that he wanted to punch him in the face or something like that.
45:12: Yeah. So everybody jumps on this narrative and they interview the, uh, the native
45:18: American guy who is pounding the drum in, in Nick Sandman's face. And this was the
45:24: Covington high school kid. Again, if you're not familiar with this, um, who eventually sued
45:29: CNN and everybody else and like got millions of dollars. So he's doing well now, but his life was wrecked at the time.
45:36: But they interviewed the man, Nathan Phillips, uh, who is the native American.
45:41: And if you look at the way he portrayed it, it was like he feared for his life and he was the victim and nothing he was saying was true.
45:50: And everybody went and jumped on his narrative and jumped on his testimony. And if you, if you understand what
45:57: Proverbs is trying to tell us, it's like, look, I get that you have a story, but I, you can't use this to establish a universal idea that, and it's like, it doesn't even matter how many particular instances you have, because you can't use that to establish a general principle or a general rule or a general narrative.
46:22: Because you're committing the fallacy of induction. First of all. So it's fallacious. It's, it's, it's wrong reasoning.
46:29: But at the same time, it's like, in order for me to actually know what happened, like,
46:34: I want to ask the security guard, Hey, why were you following this kid? Uh, I want to see like, how was this kid behaving?
46:42: Right. I want to see, you know, why, what store were you in? First of all,
46:48: I mean, were you in, in, uh, were you at Walmart? Cause I don't believe that that would happen at Walmart. But were you in some high end store where it's like,
46:55: Hey, we've got some like really expensive merchandise. They've done that to my kids and I've, I've had to get after my kids.
47:03: Hey, stop touching everything. So yeah, this is, this is what scripture tells us.
47:08: It's like, look, if somebody comes to you with a sob story, a sad story, something happened.
47:14: Yes. Care for them. Love them. Be kind and courteous with them. And don't, you don't need to say,
47:19: Oh, you're a liar. And in order for me to support you, I need to go and ask the other guy. But remember the, like, understand the limitation that you have with, with this.
47:32: Okay. Ultimately, I want to be there for you and help you with this and support you.
47:38: But at the end of the day, if I were to render a judgment on this, in order to support a narrative,
47:43: I would need to hear both sides. And going back to the, the Covington high school kid.
47:49: Well, everybody learned their lesson and it costs CNN millions of dollars to learn this lesson because the
47:56: Native American was lying. That guy Phillips was lying about what happened.
48:03: Lying through his, he was lying about his identity. Yes. He was lying about a whole bunch of stuff. Yes. He was lying.
48:09: And the, the Covington kid, because nobody, nobody thought,
48:15: Oh, we should, we should check the other side. He was the innocent one in all of this. And so again, like think like a
48:22: Christian through these things, because unfortunately these narratives are, are being pushed through anecdotal evidence and personal testimony.
48:31: And it's, well, has this ever happened to you? And it's like, yeah, it has. And, you know,
48:37: I'll be honest when I get pulled over, I get, I get a little nervous. I get a little knot in my stomach and I'm like,
48:43: Oh man, like, I don't think I'm going to go to jail, but like, man, this is going to be such a pain in the butt to deal with.
48:52: And I, you know, here's what I do. I'm, I'm, I'm white, you know, I'm, I have
48:58: Hispanic background, but whatever, you know, people look at me and they're like, you have, you have white skin. I, if it's at night,
49:04: I turn on the dome light. So that way my car is lit up. You can see, I put my hands at 10 and two and I wait for the, the officer to come over, roll down the window.
49:15: And I'm very, I try to be very polite and very respectful. I mean, me being a white person,
49:22: I, I don't believe that I could get away with running from the cops or, or trying to fight them.
49:29: I couldn't get away with that. And so, I mean, when you look at these things, like you have to think through the lens of scripture and you have to realize, okay, these are fallacious, bad arguments that are being put forward.
49:44: And you have to realize that this is all being established or this narrative is being established off of anecdotal evidence.
49:53: And, and it just becomes a competition at the end of the day to see who's, you know, whoever's got the worst story.
49:59: Well, apparently, you know, they win the argument. Um, well, did you have it?
50:05: I know. Go for it. Like you had asked me what you're gonna ask me. Did you have anything to add to that?
50:12: Yeah. So, in relation to what you're talking about, about having to really look at the complex nature of causes and effects, right?
50:20: When it comes to what people are just assuming is racism, because that's essentially what we're talking about here, right?
50:26: You're saying, you're talking about your experiences with the cops and how you can't base a universal off of these particular experiences.
50:32: Logically speaking, you can't do that, right? There is no justification from the individual experiences that you have to build up to that general conclusion.
50:41: Therefore, all white people are racist, or therefore, all situations in which a black person or a person of color is pulled over by the cops, it's a racial scenario.
50:51: And it's true, you have to look at the complex, the complexity of what's going on in any given situation.
50:58: And I know that because that's been my own experience, right? Like I told you, I grew up in New York, I grew up in the
51:04: Bronx, and I was spoon -fed this by the culture. The culture was constantly telling me, you're
51:10: Hispanic, you're not white, therefore, any conflict that you get into with someone who is white is one that's based on race.
51:20: I'm being dead serious when I say that, right? That is in the air, it was in the music and the rap that I was listening to, right?
51:25: It was everywhere. And so, there were some situations in which I knew for a fact that, not for a fact, but you know what
51:33: I mean? I was pretty sure that the person was acting out of antagonism toward Hispanic people, right?
51:41: There were some instances like that. I had a teacher in first grade or something who just didn't believe that I was smart enough to write a little booklet that I wrote on baseball, and so she tore it up in front of the whole class and threw it in the trash can, right?
51:54: And that was based on nothing. It was based on her antagonism toward basically all the kids.
51:59: She didn't want to be there as a teacher. She didn't like the fact that we were all not like her. But then
52:05: I had other teachers who treated me poorly, and I assumed on the basis of the narrative that I was constantly being fed that these were based on race, but I look back in the past now and I'm like, no,
52:14: I can look at it differently now because the scriptural mindset that I have now, by God's grace, allows me to see things from an objective perspective, right?
52:23: From the perspective that God gives us in scripture. And what I see is I was clumping everyone together into this one category, angry racist white people, right?
52:35: When in reality, this person had some issues with regard to race, right? But then this other person that I call the racism in my mind, well, they had a really bad class.
52:44: They were used to the kids being bad. They were used to kids doing certain things, and I just happened to fall into that group of people who were doing things.
52:52: And so I received a certain form of treatment. The same thing happens with police. It does.
52:58: And even with the police in New York, that's something that people don't talk about either.
53:05: It's not just that black people are accosted by white cops because that does happen, right?
53:10: But it's also like if I go to a certain neighborhood, like in Jamaica, Queens, right, because of my light complexion, automatically there's a conflict there, not just with the people that live there, but also with the police.
53:23: And the police treat me a certain way, and they pull me over as opposed to everybody else, right? This happens to me.
53:30: I was in Jamaica, Queens with a friend of mine, and the cops pulled me and my friend off the train, and they harassed us like for no good reason.
53:37: The only reason why is because we were the only people on that train that had a light complexion, skin color, right?
53:45: And so they were doing the same thing that we're saying shouldn't be done. But like you were saying, it's wrong, right?
53:56: We need to look at what's actually happening. We need to think things through clearly with a biblical mindset and really look at the causes of what's occurring because they're not always the same.
54:06: And we can't just assume they're all the same because we feel a certain way, and that's what's happening right now. Yeah, and obviously we want to acknowledge that there are racist individuals who are out there.
54:17: And unfortunately, what you're talking about is exactly what happens to a lot of people, is that they embrace the lie, they embrace the narrative, right?
54:26: And so you get pulled over by a racist cop, and he treats you poorly.
54:33: So some of these narratives, they may be true, right? But at the end of the day, it's like ultimately, unless I hear both sides, unless I actually see some of the evidence,
54:45: I can't really weigh in on a verdict. And again, I want to be sympathetic to some of these people, right?
54:53: Especially if they're friends. I do want to believe the best of them, right?
55:01: So I'm not saying we should just dismiss all of these narratives. What I'm saying is that we can't use them to substantiate universals.
55:08: And so I really appreciate what you're saying because it's like you could take that personal experience, and if you believe the lie, then you're going to filter that lie then into every other experience that you have, right?
55:23: So like the cop who treated you poorly because you're racist, because he was racist, and you were a minority group, well now every time, if you believe the lie, every time you get pulled over, and maybe you're being treated badly, but it's not because of race, it's because of poor training.
55:42: And believe me, I've seen this. I've seen this firsthand where, you know, it's like you don't understand the difference between someone who's hypoglycemic and has an altered mental status and somebody who's actually just being difficult, right?
56:02: Or, you know, maybe they have a head trauma or something and they're not being cooperative.
56:09: And it's like, it's not because they're resisting, it's because they have a head trauma. Or they have, you know, low blood sugar or something like that.
56:17: So it could be for that reason. And they're just getting frustrated or whatever and it's like, oh, it's because they're racist and it's because I'm Mexican.
56:24: And it's like, no, like this could just be a bad cop, right? Or it could even just be you, just like he's doing his job and you don't agree with it.
56:34: And because of your own self -righteousness, you're justifying yourself and you're in the wrong, you know?
56:41: That never happens. No, no. We never look at ourselves better than we ought to, right?
56:49: So, yeah. And I hear what you're saying and I really appreciate you giving that personal experience.
56:57: I know it's not all about personal anecdotes, but I want to address personal anecdote thing. Because, again, people look at me, they see my skin complexion, they think, oh, you never experienced racism.
57:07: And I have, like explicitly so, right? And this ties into the white privilege thing and stuff like that.
57:15: So one of the things with white privilege, one of the things that I've heard stated is, have you ever looked at your skin color and thought that you want to be a different skin color?
57:28: And I started laughing when I heard them say this because I thought that was my whole, basically my whole life from like as far back as I can remember from like the age of five, let's say, all the way up until the age of like 10 or 11.
57:41: I remember having emotional hurt, dude, because I was the lightest person, not only on my block where I live, but also like in my family.
57:50: I was on the lighter end of the complexion chart, right? So when you have Puerto Ricans, which is what I am, you have three races involved in the stew, the genetic stew that makes us up, right?
58:01: You have African slaves that came over with the Spaniards who interbred. And then you had the
58:06: Taino Indians that were there. So my background genetically is African, European, Amerindian, American Indian, right?
58:14: So within that, within my family, you have some people that are really dark. You have some people that are really light. You have some people that are in between.
58:20: You have some people that are orangey brownish and you have some people that are just yellowy. You know what I mean?
58:25: Like it's all over the place. But basically, I was one of the lightest people, right?
58:32: So even my sisters are darker than me. And people like, and not only that, but they speak
58:38: Spanish and I don't speak Spanish, right? So I'm already out of the picture. And so like I explicitly remember standing in front of the mirror, hating the fact that I had light skin, right?
58:48: Because this is something that they'll talk about a lot. Like, oh, you never had hatred of your own skin. I was like, I did. I grew up with it.
58:53: I was told to hate my skin color because I was called white boy, right? I was made fun of. I'm like, I'm not white.
58:59: You know my family. Like, yeah, but you're a white boy. Like, okay. Well, then I have to bear the brunt of that.
59:05: And I have to be the, you know, the butt of the joke in so many different situations.
59:11: And, you know, treated differently on that basis. And also, you know, to give another personal example of not experiencing quote unquote white privilege.
59:20: You know, like I stated, when I went to Jamaica, Queens and the cops would particularly point out me out of all the people that were there.
59:27: When I could tell that they were sketchy people from my knowledge of drug dealers and hustlers on the train. I could tell who the sketchy people actually were, but I was being pulled out because lighter complexion.
59:37: And another thing is being harassed for being in certain neighborhoods when people said
59:43: I shouldn't be there because they didn't know I was Hispanic. They thought I was white. And so there were neighborhoods that I got chased out of that I had family members living in.
59:52: Right. And it wasn't until I it wasn't until family informed them that I was family that they were like, oh, you're not what we thought you were.
59:59: Right. And I say all these things because I want to break the illusion.
01:00:05: Right. That it seems like the whole country is under that. This only goes one way when there actually are actual instances of racism.
01:00:12: It's like that's not how it works. You know, I grew up in a neighborhood where if you were lighter skin, you were going to get jumped almost on a daily basis.
01:00:20: Right. You were going to get picked on. You were going to be called retarded. You were going to be told.
01:00:25: And this is virtually like all the white people in the neighborhood where I live. They were inbred. Right. All these incest jokes, all sorts of really cruel stuff.
01:00:33: That's what I grew up hearing. So to hear the whole like the whole Black Lives Matter and other people who are not black, like the quote unquote brown contingency, what they call them,
01:00:42: Hispanics. Do you hear this idea that, oh, you know, it's to basically paint a one sided picture.
01:00:48: It's like that's not what's happening, dude. That is not what's happening. And I know because I just happen to to go in between.
01:00:55: Like I said, like I said describing before, ethnically ambiguous. Like I could be any one of these things.
01:01:02: Right. I've even I live here in Idaho now and my experience has been somewhat different.
01:01:07: Right. Because over here, the big the big racial divide or ethnic divide really is between whites and Native Americans.
01:01:15: Right. And the Native Americans here just so happen to be of a darker complexion. They are the excuse me, the
01:01:23: Nez Perce Indians. And so when I would go to the reservation with my son, who is part
01:01:30: Native American. Right. Because I'm light skinned and he's light skinned and he's getting free medical treatment because he's
01:01:36: Native American. I would get stink eye like all the time because they thought
01:01:42: I was white. You know what I'm saying? Where I grew up, like here's another thing. I grew up almost every day.
01:01:50: The Chinese delivery guy would get chased because he was Chinese, literally because he was
01:01:55: Chinese, because he and they would use slurs or whatever. He would get chased. He would get robbed.
01:02:01: He would get beaten up. His bike would get thrown into the gutter somewhere and people will laugh about it. You know what
01:02:07: I'm saying? It was it was completely acceptable. And that's the kind of stuff I grew up around. And I'm supposed to ignore it now.
01:02:13: I'm like, well, you're Hispanic, so all this Black Lives Matter stuff is true and you should support it. It's like, really?
01:02:19: You weren't paying attention. And some of the people that I know who are saying this are people that I grew up with who engaged in these activities.
01:02:25: I'm like, you don't remember it. You don't remember. Even with Puerto Ricans and Mexicans, you don't remember, like, making fun of Mexicans because all the stereotypes.
01:02:34: You don't remember getting into fights with Peruvians. You don't remember getting into fights with, you know, you remember the black people.
01:02:40: The quote unquote African -Americans getting into fights with the Jamaicans over cultural differences and all the slurs and all the horrible language that was flying around.
01:02:53: I mean, come on. You know, it's ridiculous. It's not only the statistical thing that's a lie. It's also this idea that, quote unquote, black and brown people are all living in unison and harmony.
01:03:03: And all of a sudden the big bad white man comes along and starts killing us. It's like, that's not what's going on.
01:03:08: There's so much interracial conflict in big cities that's not talked about that is primarily being started by people of color.
01:03:16: And by that I mean black people, Hispanic people, Asian people, etc. There's so much that's going on there, at least in New York, that's how it is, that it's impossible for me to see things differently, you know, to buy into the whole narrative.
01:03:33: Yeah, I really appreciate what you're sharing because you really are flipping the narrative on its head and showing that there is an opposing side to this because the narrative is always one -sided.
01:03:47: And this is how it's intended to play out because you see that, you know, even in the question that you alluded to earlier, have you ever wanted to be in a different skin color, right?
01:03:59: It carries with it the assumption that everybody wants to be white, right? Because it places every white person in the oppressor class or the privileged class when that's not everyone's experience.
01:04:13: And so if we don't take the time to consider, you know, that other people, again, going back to not making sweeping generalizations, which is exactly what this
01:04:23: Marxist ideology does. It's you're white, therefore you're in the privileged class, therefore you're in the oppressor class, and ultimately everybody wants to be in that class because everybody else is oppressed, right?
01:04:43: And when you get to, like if you were to sit down and talk with people in these communities, you're going to find that that's not the case.
01:04:51: Not everyone has that experience. And so really, it not only shows the other side of it, but it really dismantles the
01:05:00: Marxist ideology and the Marxist narrative that's being pushed because not every white person is an oppressor.
01:05:09: Not every white person is, you know, has privilege because of their white skin.
01:05:16: And so as Christians, you know, you also talk about how you came out of that and then you started thinking like a
01:05:24: Christian. As Christians, we need to think logically, we need to think rationally, we need to understand what good arguments are and not embrace anti -Christian ideologies that really at the base of it just have horrible argumentation.
01:05:46: So yeah, so I think that's a pretty good discussion. Really what
01:05:52: I wanted to get out of this discussion tonight was just going over some principles, some biblical principles, and how should we think through this stuff so that we're not held captive.
01:06:02: And again, I want to emphasize this more than anything else.
01:06:09: The answer to racism, individuals are racist, is
01:06:16: Christian theology. We don't need other people,
01:06:22: Marxist people, anti -Christian God -haters to start a movement for us.
01:06:28: We don't need that. We need the Christians to do what
01:06:34: Christ said, to love your neighbor as yourself. That's really as simple as it is.
01:06:39: Love your neighbor as yourself. If you see your brother poorly clothed or lacking in food, well, what do you do when you're hungry?
01:06:47: You feed yourself. So help them out, right? So Christian theology is a foundation upon which we can tackle these issues.
01:06:57: And we don't need somebody else to start a movement for us. And so much of this has been premised off of a lie where they try to create this problem that it's like, yeah, it's okay.
01:07:10: Some of these instances were horribly wrong, and maybe they were racist, maybe they weren't, but they were wrong.
01:07:18: But let's not broad brush everybody and condemn everybody or put one group of people based on their skin color into this class and another group of people based on their skin color in this class and make assumptions about them based off of their skin color.
01:07:38: That, by definition, is racism. Exactly. And the other thing that when you were talking
01:07:46: I wanted to bring up is that you flipped the narrative on its head because you were saying like,
01:07:54: I looked white and I didn't really want to be white, right? And so you were pointing out that there's racists in other cultural ethnic groups.
01:08:06: Of course, yeah. And that's one of the things that you have to pay attention to the redefinition of terminology because people are redefining what it means to be racist.
01:08:17: People are redefining and saying, well, you can't be racist because you're not part of the oppressor class.
01:08:23: Only white people can be racist because you have to be in a position of power in order to be racist.
01:08:31: And then they say, well, other people can be prejudiced. Well, the definition of racism is extreme prejudice.
01:08:38: Yeah. So, I mean, they're redefining terms. And I really, really appreciated what you were saying because you were pointing out like,
01:08:46: I mean, even in these minority groups, there are individuals who are racist.
01:08:52: And the idea that you can't be racist because you're black is patently absurd.
01:09:00: It is absolutely stupid. You can be black and you can be racist.
01:09:07: You can be white and you can be racist. And so it's not limited to people who are just in this oppressor class.
01:09:16: And so I really appreciated that because I thought you brought those things out well with your testimony from when you're a child.
01:09:24: And, you know, I wanted to add something to like not to go too long on the whole subject. But one of the things that I want to bring out that I know people probably won't like who buy into the whole
01:09:35: Black Lives Matter ideology or the, you know, who support the movement to some extent is the fact that if you are thinking in accordance with the whole idea that they're pushing, you need to repent.
01:09:52: And as harsh as that sounds, you need to repent. Because when I was talking about my mindset being changed, that's literally what it is.
01:09:57: Metanoia, right? Change of mind. The Lord changing my understanding of reality. And one of the things that I had to relearn and be taught afresh by the spirit of God from scripture was what it means to be a human.
01:10:11: My human dignity is not based on how much... I'll put it this way to get right to the point.
01:10:17: Right. Black Lives Matter is built on their anthropology is a Marxist anthropology. This is the reason why they push for quote unquote equity, quote unquote equality, because in that mindset stemming from Hegel, if you want to go back as far as Hegel and the
01:10:34: German, the German idealists. But primarily Hegel who influenced Marx and Hegel's was more of a intellectual thing.
01:10:43: What I'm going to talk about. But Marx turns it into a material thing because he, you know, he made
01:10:48: Hegelianism materialistic, basically. The idea is your ability to produce something and have a relationship with it, have a close ties to it.
01:10:59: That is you being able to reflect upon yourself and become a self, become a human, become more of what you are, develop into being a human.
01:11:09: And without that, you don't have the ability really to be to become a human.
01:11:14: Basically, in Marxism, the idea is that. Right. So this is one of the reasons why
01:11:19: Marxism is opposed to capitalism, because the idea is if you are just working a nine to five job and you're producing, let's say,
01:11:26: TVs. Right. The product of your labor is divorced from you. And that results in alienation because what you're making, which reflects who you are, is apart from you.
01:11:36: It's taken away from you. So this is part and parcel of what's in the mindset of Black Lives Matter.
01:11:41: This idea that your ability to acquire wealth and produce wealth and amass wealth is directly tied into your ability or your your self -worth as a human being.
01:11:54: Right. And that's something that you need to repent of. If that's the way you look at things, if you think I'm less than a human or I'm not as valuable because I don't have the ability to succeed in a business or something like that, that's wrong.
01:12:08: It's a wrong way of looking at human beings. That is not what Scripture teaches us. Our dignity. This is a reason why you can have someone who is severely mentally handicapped and Scripture still says that they're made in God's image because they are.
01:12:24: Because the very fact that they exist as human beings means that they have a certain value that can't be taken away from them.
01:12:31: Like you mentioned at the beginning of the podcast is we have intrinsic worth as the Imago Dei and that's the fact of the matter.
01:12:38: So while it it shouldn't be the case that if your life is being made difficult because of your skin color, let's say, it shouldn't be that shouldn't be happening.
01:12:49: But it also shouldn't be the case that you think that your human identity is thereby being erased or fully diminished or being blown out of existence altogether.
01:13:03: Because Scripture tells you otherwise. Scripture says the reason why the offense is so great against you when someone's being unjust is because you are the image of God.
01:13:10: Because you have a certain value and they're not acting in accordance with that value. But I've heard from a bunch of people,
01:13:17: Lecrae, the rapper being one of them, he's talking about all this stuff and he asked a bunch of people, and this was years ago.
01:13:24: But he asked like, why do people get upset when we talk about Black Lives Matter and blah blah blah. And I tried to explain.
01:13:30: I was like, look, because the whole assumption about human worth that's behind it is wrong. Your worth is not directly tied to your ability to amass capital and produce capital.
01:13:42: It's just not. Your ability to make things and have a relationship with those things doesn't produce your true self.
01:13:48: That's not what Scripture teaches. You are who you are. God has made you who you are. We're not Hegelians. We're not Marxists. We believe that God has created us a certain way.
01:13:57: And those opportunities are good. Sure, it's good to be able to amass wealth, create wealth and create a foundation for yourself financially and not be beholden to debtors and all those things and not have to suffer poverty.
01:14:08: But those things don't make you human. They just don't. Yeah, man,
01:14:13: I don't think I can add anything to what you just said. So I think that's a pretty good stopping point for this episode.
01:14:22: Christians need to grow in their discernment and have the courage to speak out against these things.
01:14:34: You know, I said in my Facebook post, I said, I think there are two primary reasons that people are falling prey to Black Lives Matter and the church.
01:14:44: One is the church is not discerning and does not know the truth. And this could either be they don't know
01:14:51: Christian theology or they don't know the truth behind Black Lives Matter. And that's what we're trying to expose.
01:14:59: And then there's the other case, which is the church is effeminate and won't stand for the truth.
01:15:05: And of course, we see this. A lot of churches are effeminate. The men won't lead.
01:15:11: They won't stand for the truth. They won't contend for the truth. You know, it's really a shame.
01:15:19: So we want to encourage people to think like Christians, to be biblically minded and to have the knowledge and the wisdom and the understanding to argue against these things.
01:15:33: And, you know, pray for courage that God would give you the ability to speak openly and truthfully and not to be ashamed of Christ or ashamed of the
01:15:45: Bible. So Hiram, hey man, thank you for joining me tonight. Of course, man.
01:15:51: Hopefully Carlos will be able to get on the next one. We need to get back to just podcasting and just putting stuff out there because there's so many things that are happening in the world today.
01:16:07: So the next episode, we want to talk about voting. Should you vote for a
01:16:12: Democrat? Is it OK for Christians to vote for Trump? So that's what we're going to be talking about in the next episode.
01:16:19: So hopefully we'll get that one out soon. And yeah, wish everyone well.