May 23, 2023 Show with Dr. James White on “A Christian Response to Sean Hannity’s Warning to GOP Candidates to Soften Anti-Abortion Rhetoric”

Live from historic downtown Carlisle, Pennsylvania, home of founding father, James Wilson,

19th century hymn writer, George Duffield, 19th century gospel minister, George Norcross and sports

legend, Jim Thorpe.

It's Iron Sharpens Iron.

This is a radio platform in which pastors and Christian scholars and theologians address the burning

issues facing the church and the world today.

Proverbs chapter 27 verse 17 tells us, iron sharpens iron, so one man

sharpens another.

Matthew Henry said that in this passage, we are cautioned to take heed with whom we converse and directed to

have in view in conversation to make one another wiser and better.

It is our hope that this goal will be accomplished over the next two hours and we hope to hear from you, the listener,

with your own questions.

And now here's your host, Chris Arnzen.

Good afternoon, Cumberland County, Pennsylvania, Lake City, Florida and the rest of humanity living on

the planet Earth who are listening via live streaming at ironsharpensironradio .com.

This is Chris Arnzen, your host of Iron Sharpens Iron Radio wishing you all a happy Tuesday on this 23rd

day of May, 2023 and I just wanna thank everybody on Long Island, New

York for giving me such a warm and hospitable welcome there

when I was there for a visit to attend a fundraising banquet

for Our Savior New American School in Center Reach, Long Island, which is actually an

old advertising client of mine when I worked for WMCA Radio, one of Salem

Media's affiliates in New York, Salem Media being the largest Christian radio network in the world

and thought that I would take them up on their request to attend this event for free and

saw some old friends there including some folks from both Hope Reformed

Baptist Church of Coram, Long Island, New York and also from Grace

Reformed Baptist Church of Long Island in Merrick, New York and the principal of the school there, the

headmaster I should say, Grace Christian Academy and what a wonderful time and also

reconnecting with my friend Kevin Herman, an old high school classmate who has also come to

Christ and thank you Kevin for being such a high

point in my visit.

Also I can't leave out Bill Shishko and his wonderful wife Margaret, Bill being the pastor of

the Haven Orthodox Presbyterian Church in Comac, Long Island, I visited there for worship.

It was such a blessed time and also seeing friends of mine from the church where I was saved

back in the 80s, Calvary Baptist Church of Amityville, Long Island, some of whom are now

members of the Haven Orthodox Presbyterian Church and I just can't say enough about how blessed

I was during that three day visit, actually four day visit

if you include the day that I left.

So thanks guys and I hope to see you all again soon and I am so excited to have back on the

program somebody who I think I love interviewing more than anybody else, Dr. James R. White

who many of you if not all of you recognize that name.

He is an author of numerous books, he is a New Testament Greek scholar, highly skilled and seasoned

debater, professor of apologetics and church history at Grace Bible Theological Seminary in Conway,

Arkansas, one of four pastors at Apologia Church in Mesa, Arizona and host of the Dividing

Line webcast.

He's also co -founder and director and resident apologist at Alpha and Omega Ministries.

Today we're gonna be discussing something very controversial, it's probably going to get some of my listeners

angry but we are going to be talking about or hearing from Dr. James R. White

with a Christian response to Fox News' Sean Hannity on his warning to GOP

candidates to soften their anti -abortion rhetoric to further ensure

ballot box victories.

It's my honor and privilege to welcome you back to Iron Trip and Sine Radio, my dear friend Dr. James R. White.

Well, it's good to be with you, Chris.

I was actually thinking we were gonna do this yesterday and I was rushing through the morning

to, you didn't mention that I don't fly anymore,

I travel via a fifth wheel trailer and so I went flying

to my next stop and I was trying to figure out time zones and making sure I'd be

available by four o 'clock Eastern time and I get there and I discover that I'm a

day early.

And so I ended up doing a program with Tim Bushong, I'm not sure if you know who he is.

Yes, I do.

Yes, I do.

You know everybody.

Asking Chris Arnzen, do you know, and then filling in a name is just a real waste of breath.

Tim Bushong was kind enough to record a commercial for the New American Standard Bible which still airs

on this program.

Well, there you, well, but he's done much more than that.

He did our Radio Free Geneva theme is Tim Bushong's work and

he just did the music background and then the mixing.

Have you had Tobias Riemenschneider on your program?

No, but I want to.

You want to, yeah.

You'll be laughing on this show very soon.

Perhaps we could do it live from the Village Lantern German restaurant in Lindenhurst.

Now be careful, because he's a real German, so.

Well, don't forget Mariana Bloch thought I did a good believable accent.

Oh yes, yes, yes, yes.

And she's from Germany.

Anyway, he, Tim did the music and then the mixing and

Tobias sang song two in German.

Oh, I heard it on the dividing line.

It's wonderful.

It's also somewhat scary.

Yes, it is.

I kept looking out the window for an invading army.

Goose stepping down the, yeah, it'd be wonderful.

But anyway, so I did Tim Bushong's program yesterday and we're going to do the dividing line right after

this.

So I'm sitting in our studio here and it's the

only fully functional 4K, two camera,

high quality webcasting studio, video capable studio that I know of

that rolls on wheels.

And so here we are.

I am now in metropolitan Tucumcari, New Mexico and you

and I have an acquaintance who's mocks me regularly for

my non -flying and the places that I end up speaking at and stopping

at.

He just mocks me incessantly.

Are you in gumshoe Texas today and stuff like this?

Who is that?

Oh, someone you worked for once, shall we say.

Okay, so obviously you don't want me to mention him but I know who you're talking about.

Of course you do.

And lots of other people do too.

He just doesn't need any more complications than he's already got in his life.

But anyway, yeah, I'm out in the middle of absolutely nowhere here but

I have a Starlink satellite dish sitting outside this thing and I'm

coming to you via Elon Musk.

I mean, it truly is amazing what you can do today.

It's crystal clear, crystal clear.

Yeah, it's astonishing.

It really, really is.

And we've got a 5G hotspot that we can go to back up on that if something were to happen with the

satellite feed and I'm just having a grand old time, Chris.

I'm gonna tell you, you've been to G3.

You've seen the lines that form.

People wanting to talk and greet and that's wonderful.

I love doing that for hours on end.

You know, there are also long lines at my booth every time I'm at G3 but that's because they put me

right next to the men's room.

Yeah, okay, I'm not gonna fall apart.

I'm not gonna fall apart on that one at all because I'm gonna go completely south at that point.

But getting into the smaller churches, I was just with Pastor Derek Melton in Friar,

Oklahoma.

Yeah, he owes me a knife.

Okay, and I'm not gonna pass that one on and he actually did

a knife that we are going to be auctioning off to help.

We've already paid for this thing.

It's amazing.

God's people have already, the RV's paid off, the truck's paid off, the studio's paid off.

Our people have made it possible for us to do this.

I think it's absolutely wonderful.

But the point is I get to get into churches and the stories that I can start

telling you when you have that opportunity.

This is Alpha Omega's 40th year.

October 7th, we will be having a big shindig in

Phoenix to celebrate 40 years.

Sovereign Grace Church, right?

Yes, and I'm, we're starting,

I'm really getting to see the fruit of 40 years worth of

labor because not only is it amazing to talk

to people who will come up and say, your program is a lifeline for me.

I was going through so many difficulties and I was getting drawn this direction, that direction, all these things.

And it's one thing to talk to the adults, but the children

and now into the next generation of people who've grown up listening to my

voice on the dividing line and they're totally freaked out to meet me.

And I'm like, that is, that is so amazing.

And I had experienced it overseas.

I was in Pontchartrain, South Africa, and I had a homeschool family come up to me and they had been

listening to the dividing line for years in South Africa.

And now to be, just to have this opportunity, it's really special.

It really, really is.

And I don't know how long we're gonna have, not sure how long I can do this or how long we're gonna have the

ability to travel freely.

I really feel like one of the things that the regime wants is have us locked into our little cubicles in

one little space and make it impossible to travel.

But as long as we've got the opportunity, I'm gonna keep doing it.

And pretty soon we're gonna be arranging some debates.

I'll do debates in here online.

Oh yeah, it'll be great.

It's wonderful.

So Rich designed this thing and put it all together and

it's pretty amazing.

I'm looking at two 4K cameras here that we can do amazing things with.

So it's exciting.

It really is.

And so here we are.

That's why I'm able to do this with you from Tucumcari, New Mexico.

Praise God.

I also praise God for your willingness to accept the invitation of a new

advertiser of mine who just signed a one -year contract for advertising

with Iron Trip and Zion Radio, the Mid -Atlantic Reformation Society.

They are going to be having their Future of Christendom Conference September

15th through the 16th, the weekend before G3.

This is gonna be held in Lancaster, Pennsylvania.

Most likely, there is a slim possibility it may be held in Carlisle, Pennsylvania, but it

is more likely to be held in Lancaster.

They're still looking for a venue.

They've got some options that they are investigating.

But Dr. James R. White is going to be speaking on the theme, The Gospel at War,

and there will be subcategories to that main theme.

And just keep your calendars marked out for

September 15th through the 16th.

That's a Friday, Saturday, Sunday.

And if you want more details, go to futureofchristendom .org, futureofchristendom

.org, and that will eventually be updated with more

details.

And you could also go to midatlanticreformation .org,

midatlanticreformation .org.

Then, as I mentioned, the following week, that will be September 21st through the 23rd,

Dr. White will be one of many speakers.

I think there's over 40.

I don't even understand how they could do this.

But the Sovereignty of God Conference in Atlanta, Georgia, which is the next G3

National Conference, September 21st through the 23rd, and some of the speakers, in addition

to Dr. White, include Vodie Baucom, Steven Lawson, Paul Washer, Phil Johnson,

and Justin Peters, and Ken Ham, and Owen Strand, who is a colleague of Dr.

White's at Grace Bible Theological Seminary in Conway, Arkansas.

James Coates, the pastor in Canada who was arrested for refusing to shut down

his worship services during the COVID crisis.

Scott Anuel, Virgil Walker, Darrell Bernard Harrison, Scott Brown, who I just saw a couple of weeks ago at his

conference in North Carolina.

And for the ladies, there is Susan Heck, who I've also had on this program.

I've interviewed everybody on this roster at some point, except for James Coates,

and I hope that I get an interview with James at some point.

But that's g3men .org, g3men .org, use promo code

G3ISIR, that's G3, Iron Shepherd's Iron Radio,

G3ISIR, and get 30 off the registration fee, and you'll be hearing commercials with Dr. James

R. White reminding you to do that very thing.

As I said before, we've got a controversial topic today, a Christian response to Fox News'

Sean Hannity on his warning to GOP candidates to soften their anti -abortion rhetoric to

further ensure ballot box victories.

I am not vilifying Sean Hannity, and neither is Dr. White.

We just are in extremely strong disagreement with him over this,

and I have been surprised, speaking with brothers in Christ, even

theologically reformed and conservative brothers in Christ who actually agree with Sean

Hannity on this, it mystified me.

But it's basically a matter of how pragmatic should

Christians be when they are either running for an office or voting for

somebody who is running for office in regards to making yourself more appealing

to the population surrounding you.

And this is specifically a charge that Sean Hannity has to

those running for office in swing states especially.

And he is saying, in summary, if you're running for office and you're in the

GOP, you better stop claiming that you are opposed

to abortion even in cases of rape, incest, and the

life of the mother.

He is basically saying if you don't include those as exceptions to murdering your unborn child,

then you might as well not race, join the race, or

you should use, these are my words, I'm assuming he means that they should either change their

view if they are opposed to abortion for any reason, or use

cleverly deceptive language in order to be more tolerable

to the more left -leaning voting public.

But if you could, James, why don't you play the clip of Sean Hannity, and by the way, this is just

one clip, he has been regularly saying this very same thing

on the Fox News television program, Hannity.

This clip is from his radio program, but if you could play that, James, and then we'll have you respond to it.

How long do you wanna go with it?

I'll let you use your gut instinct as to when you want.

Hear that or you can just wave at me in the camera and I'll shut it off, so let's,

okay,.

Here we go.

Well, thanks for having me, I just wanted to get into talking about the abortion thing you brought up the other day and how our

politicians need to do a better job of being more politically moderate versus actually being morally

conservative, and I couldn't agree more, I kinda wanted to chime in as a healthcare professional myself,

and boots on the ground, as a productive woman, I'm in a productive age, the things that the left is doing is

a whole bunch of propaganda, and it's about their commercials, just like in Wisconsin, one of my nurse

friends, I asked her, I said, what happened, how did this go down, and she says, yeah, it's terrible, and she said, but

a third to half of the ads that they ran were constantly about all this abortion propaganda, and when I say

propaganda, I mean, they're talking about things that aren't true, but acting like anybody who's

conservative or on the right doesn't want them to have the rights based on

They're outright lying.

Let me be a little more direct than you're being, you're being gracious, you're from South Carolina, I get it, I'm a little

more blunt, raised in New York, although I did live in Alabama, Georgia, and other places around the country, so

you're right, they're demagoguing it, they're lying about it, they're turning it into a big issue, let me give you an

example how Republicans better nominate people, and they need to understand

where people are on this issue, politically, it's a divisive issue, and understand

that I believe in the sanctity of life, I'm from a life, however, politically

speaking, it is a death sentence for candidates, especially in swing states,

you cannot win.

Choose before they even start voting, yep.

Okay, so I'll give you a case in point, Doug Mastriano, running for governor in the great state of

Pennsylvania, he lost as, well, let's put it this way, the new Governor Shapiro,

as a non -incumbent, won that race by the largest margin of any non

-incumbent since the early 1940s, he got destroyed, utterly decimated.

Now, that impacted Dr. Oz's race, Oz, you know, Mastriano lost by

like 16 points, Oz lost by two and a half, three points, I forget the final total, but it was close,

and Dr. Oz was able to pull off something that very few people can pull off, and that is ticket splitting.

In other words, somebody would vote for a Democrat for governor, but then switch for a Republican on the Senate side,

but there's only so much ticket splitting you can ever get.

If you had somebody, in the case of Mastriano, no exceptions for rape, incest, or the mother's life,

guess what, you're not gonna win any race except in a very small

few states with that position.

Now, I'm speaking politically, I'm not speaking morally, I'm not telling you to compromise your values, but those

candidates won't win, period.

Okay, I think that's probably a good spot right there.

Yeah, and in fact, that's actually where I ended my written transcript there.

Yeah, and so Doug Mastriano, he has been on my program, Iron Trip and Zion Radio, twice

before the election was called for governor.

I also have had on the program

other candidates that were more strongly,

clearly in favor of defending

human life, even in cases of rape.

For instance, Kathy Barnett, running for Senate, a black woman who is the most

conservative candidate that was running.

She is a woman who was conceived and born through

the nightmare of rape that her mother experienced, and her mother chose not to

have her murdered in the womb because of the inconvenience or because of the

uncomfortable experience of knowing that this child is a biological

child of a rapist, that did not stop her from giving birth to Kathy Barnett.

And Sean basically torpedoed her candidacy and brought up things that she had

tweeted that may have looked embarrassing for her.

And ironically, Sean was an extremely strong supporter of Donald Trump, and you could have

easily found many tweets and conversations and interviews

where Donald Trump even insinuated that Ted Cruz's father was a part of the

Kennedy assassination.

So, and let me also make it clear, when I listen to Sean Hannity, I am agreeing with him, I

would say at least 95 of the time, maybe a little less.

So I'm not vilifying him, and as I said before, there are many Christians,

I'm sure, I've only spoken to a handful about this so far, but I'm sure

there are many Christians who agree with him because there is something sympathetic to his argument when we

see how the leftists are destroying this nation and

in mind -boggling ways that we never would have dreamed in our worst nightmares could be coming true.

But at the same time, I want you to respond to this in light

of Christians both running for office and also the more numerous

Christians voting for those running for office when it comes to pragmatism, when it

comes to what is more important, being open and honest and bold about

your opposition to murder of unborn children for any reason, or to be more clever in the way

you present your defense of unborn life and make it seem more

tolerable and palatable for those who are on the left.

But if you could pick up there where I left off.

Yeah, well, a couple of things.

I don't watch Sean Hannity, I don't really watch almost any of that anymore.

To be honest with you, the only thing I used to watch was Tucker Carlson, so I don't really have much to watch anymore

along those lines.

And I used to listen to him some on radio,

but I got honestly a little tired of it.

And so I'm not a big fan, but that's sort of irrelevant to this

because in this situation, there's two things people need to know about where I'm coming from.

The second thing, the more modern situation is the fact that being

one of the elders at Apology of Church, Apology of Church is the home of End Abortion Now.

And End Abortion Now is an organization that seeks to

introduce legislation and is doing so all across the United States for equal protection under the

law, equal protection for all human beings from conception onward.

And so it is an abolitionist movement.

Now, when people hear that term abolitionist, I certainly used to have a very negative

view of that because the abolitionists worked outside the church.

In fact, they protested outside churches.

They were G3.

Right, right, they were just doing things they shouldn't have been doing.

And the person who has turned that around and has

changed the abolitionist movement and brought it into the church as a gospel issue

was Jeff Durbin, pretty much almost with just a few other people, but he was

the engine behind it.

And that was a lot of work and a lot of personal conversation and challenging

of people and things like that.

And so like in January, I preached three out of four Sundays in January because Jeff

was giving testimony before state legislatures all over the United

States for bills of abolition that were being put in, taking on the nastiest of these people.

And man, I can tell you the pro -abortion side, the culture of death is the culture of death

and its motivation is clear and obvious.

He is just masterful at taking those people on.

He can tie them into knots so quickly that it's truly

astonishing.

He's just so skilled at it.

And so that's the more recent aspect of where my response will be coming from here.

But I go back to the weekend of the birth of my daughter.

Summer was born on the same weekend that I was arrested outside of an

abortion clinic in Phoenix with Operation Rescue.

And that particular doctor was one of the worst.

And he, ironically, only a few years later, was

arrested for sexually abusing his patients when they were unconscious.

And, oh, he was just demonic.

I mean, just absolutely demonized.

It was the things I heard him saying when we were in front of his clinic, closing it down.

If I impersonated the demonic voices you hear on

the old Bob Larson program or something like that, it'd be pretty funny.

Well, yeah, it's true.

No, I remember them.

Oh, yeah, but that's because we're old.

The young people got used to going, Bob who?

They have no earthly idea what we're talking about.

But it would sound very much the same.

He was just demonic.

And what's interesting is I was not able to

continue.

I was actually the media representative for Operation Rescue.

Prior to that, I went on local radio stations, secular radio stations, was debating people on the

topic.

I wasn't able to continue that because of the fact that it was made

very clear to me in the pro -life movement that we had to

keep the gospel out of this.

I wrote a book called The Fatal Flaw, another book called Answers to Catholic Claims.

They were coming out right around that time period.

Some weird guy back on Long Island eventually got hold of me and we started doing debates on that subject there.

And so it was made very clear to me

that the mechanism that the pro -life movement was going to use was

not the gospel.

This was a political issue and it was not a gospel issue.

And so I had to stop being involved on that level with them.

And so what people don't seem to understand right now,

and honestly, Jeff would be, Jeff, Zach Conover,

Zach Lautenschlager, Dennis, all of our guys would be the best

people to be talking to about this because they are absolutely on the ground.

I hear about this stuff.

I obviously am involved as one of the elders there, but they're the ones that are absolutely on the ground.

Doing this stuff.

But of course, I'm more likely going to get Abraham from the Hebrew scriptures on the show than Jeff Durbin

because of the numerous attempts I've made to get Jeff back on the show that have failed miserably.

But anyway.

You know, I've talked to a number of people who say the same thing.

And so I thought I just heard thunder

here.

I'm sitting here going, what on earth is going on here?

Anyways, yeah, look at that.

I've got a thunderstorm coming in.

Well, yay.

Given that I'm on satellite going your direction, let's hope that

we stay connected up here.

Let's just put it that way.

In fact, could you pick up where you left off?

Let's remember that you were talking about Jeff Durbin and the work that Apologia Church is

doing.

As we have to go to our midway break, and if anybody has a question, actually, it's not the midway break, it's our first commercial break.

If anybody has a question, just send it to chrisarnson at gmail .com.

Give us your first name at least, city and state, and country of residence.

If you are asking a personal and private question, perhaps you have had

an abortion, someone you love is considering one, we understand things like that would

compel you to remain anonymous.

But if you are just simply asking a general question about the political

and the spiritual ramifications of our discussion on abortion, if it's just a general question, give

us your first name at least, city and state, and country of residence.

We are gonna be right back with Dr. James R. White of Alpha and Omega Ministries right after these messages,

so please do not go away, and send your emails to chrisarnson at gmail

.com.

James White of Alpha and Omega Ministries here.

I'm very excited to announce that my longtime friend, Chris Arnson of Iron Sharpens Iron Radio, and I

are heading down to Atlanta, Georgia again for the G3 National Conference.

That's Thursday, September 21st through Saturday the 23rd on a theme that I have been preaching, teaching,

writing about, and defending in live public debates for most of my life, the sovereignty of God.

I'll be joined on the speaking roster by Steve Lawson, Voddie Balcombe, Paul Washer, Virgil Walker, Scott

Anuel, and Josh Bice, founder of G3 Ministries.

And there's more great news.

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Go to g3min .org, that's g3min .org, and enter promo

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Chris Arnson, I look forward to seeing you all Thursday, September 21st through Saturday the 23rd in the G3

National Conference in Atlanta, Georgia on the sovereignty of God.

Make sure you stop by the Iron Sharpens Iron radio exhibitor booth and say hi to Chris Arnson while

you're there.

Go to g3min .org and enter promo code G3ISIR for

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I'm now back with our guest, Dr. James R. White.

I'm not really sure exactly how the weather is affecting our connection.

Are you there, Dr. White?

I'm here.

Okay.

I was getting nervous there when you were showing me weather reports and things like that and

digital images.

Yes, isn't it amazing?

I can show you the actual live radar of the huge thundercell that is just

about to land on top of me.

And my only concern, obviously, is the satellite connector out there in the wind.

So it gets knocked over and give me a few seconds because I still have the 5G to

switch over to to hopefully be able to get back with you.

But we'll see how it does.

It's done great during storms before, so we'll see.

But there's a lot of lightning in this thing.

So there you go.

Okay, well, we were talking about how much Apologia Church and the

End Abortion Now Ministry and Jeff Durbin and the entire team

there at Apologia Church have been used of God to save many, many,

many babies from being murdered.

Perhaps you can give me an exact number.

I don't know the number.

But I know that it -.

Oh, it's thousands.

It really is thousands.

Because we have over 900 churches that have become involved with End Abortion Now all around the world.

And almost all of them are doing regular outreach at the abortion clinics.

We do regular outreach at the abortion clinics.

We've had well over 1 ,000 saves in the Phoenix area.

So you multiply that by all the other churches involved.

And yeah, so we've been deeply, deeply involved with this.

And so all of that comes back to the fact that last year

in Louisiana, our bill came to the floor.

Most of the time, they're stopped.

Most of the time, they die in committee.

But what's amazing is most of the time, if they are going to be

killed in committee, they will be killed by the pro -life movement, by the pro -life

industry, not by Planned Parenthood.

They don't even have to raise a finger.

In fact, Jeff was in the capital of Missouri about

three weeks ago.

And the way it came down is the pro -life witnesses

testified against our bill, and Planned Parenthood did not have to lift a finger.

They didn't even have to testify because they knew once they had the pro -life organizations there

that that was it.

And all of it in Louisiana, it was coming to the floor and we had the votes.

And then Roe came down, the reversal of Roe came down, and the

pro -life industry freaked out.

I'm not expecting it to happen the way that it did.

And they scared the people that were gonna vote for our bill so that

it lost on the floor.

And so when Roe was struck down, abortion became

legal in Louisiana, whereas it wasn't.

Well, weird.

And in fact, in Arizona, the Arizona Right to Life people traded,

abortion was illegal on the books of the laws of the state of Arizona.

And the pro -life movement traded, removing

that for a heartbeat bill.

And so once Roe fell, abortion would have become illegal

in Arizona, but now it's not.

Wow.

And so people are really confused by this.

And much of it comes back to these issues of rape,

incest.

That's the primary ones, is that's the primary issue right there.

And in the life of the mother or as the leftist would even.

That one's not, look, when you have it, that is so rare.

The vast majority of the actual meaningful instances have

to do with rape.

There are some instances of incest.

And again, Jeff would have better numbers than I do.

The vast majority of instances where it's a matter of the life of the mother

or the child.

It's extremely rare.

And very, very often those situations resolve themselves with the death of

the child.

In fact, I don't even know.

I just personally, I just feel like we have entered into a time period of

so many more stillbirths than I remembered when

I was a young person.

My own daughters had two.

And at Apologia, we've just had a number of these types of things happening.

We'll get into more of that right now.

But the point is, Jeff does a tremendous job in dealing with

the arguments in regards to these hard cases.

But the fact of the matter is, what you have is you have people who want to have

abortion regulated, but they do not want to have abortion

abolished.

And when people say, I believe in the sanctity of life, but then

say what Sean Hannity said, and said, but we can't push for this,

or we won't get elected.

Then my question is, what do you mean you believe in the sanctity of life?

Exactly whose life are we talking about here?

And what do you mean that you believe in the sanctity of life?

Right, he also says something puzzling.

Now I'm speaking politically, I'm not speaking morally.

I don't even know how you can work that out in practical ways,

how that difference means anything.

In the long run, you are advocating that a woman should have the legal right to murder a

baby, or you're just saying that's the best way to win

elections is by claiming that she should have that right.

Well, here in the United States, the Roman Catholic hierarchy

in politics has of course developed this

schizophrenic mind, where I'm personally opposed to abortion.

However, I can't force my views on other people.

And so you have all these allegedly Roman Catholic individuals,

Nancy Pelosi, Joe Biden, the whole group, who will say,

religiously, I believe this, politically, I believe this.

Well, it results in utter schizophrenia.

And the issue, here's the issue as I understand it.

What we are saying, and this isn't really what the

abolition movement was saying in the past, or at least not with consistency and clarity, but it is now,

is that the only way to stop this genocide of

innocent children is to change hearts by the gospel.

And that's not what the pro -life movement believes.

In general, the pro -life movement, and again, I was a part of it, and was asked to

leave it because I was raising issues of the gospel, sees

managing abortion and restricting abortion and

getting down to heartbeat bills or things like that.

They're not dealing with the real issue of abortion because our society

refuses to deal with the issue of abortion.

Now, I'm gonna say something somewhat blunt here.

And so let me warn parents ahead of time.

Basically, because I think this is rather important and it's somewhat pastoral, but it's

blunt.

The ultimate philosophical, ethical, and moral

good in the United States of America today amongst the vast

majority of its people is the orgasm.

That is the ultimate thing.

Everything else takes second place to being able to have sexual fulfillment.

And so if that means sexualizing children, if that means abortion, if that means mutilating

children, it doesn't matter.

As long as you can have sexual fulfillment, that is the ultimate good of all things.

And as long as a society continues to have that perspective, you're going to have

rampant, widespread fornication, sexual activity,

and despite all of the methodologies of birth control that are now available,

there are gonna be people who don't want to do any of those things.

And so this is your emergency backup plan.

And it is to be in service of the ultimate good

of humanity.

Which is sexual fulfillment.

And as long as we exist on that animalistic level, as long

as that's the highest that we can rise,

morally and ethically, nothing's ever gonna happen.

Of course, abortion will always remain legal and

absolutely common, because it's your final backup to allow

you to reach the ultimate good.

The ultimate good being the orgasm.

And that's where we are.

As long as we treat ourselves as animals, as long as we do not see

our sexuality as having anything to do with our purpose in life, our calling

are being made in the image of God, then we are going

to not only have abortion, but we're going to continue

doing the Nazi -esque selling of body parts and

everything else that comes with it.

We're not gonna stop.

And we're not going to ever see the moral element of

the mother and the father making the decision to

elevate their sexual satisfaction above the life that they have

been privileged to create in the way that God made us.

Because that's not why they're doing it.

And that's a unwanted by -product.

Now, I'll be honest with you, there are so many nations around the world right now

that have already fallen so far below replacement numbers

in their reproductive numbers that this is all gonna

change eventually, because these people will no longer exist.

The nations embrace, this is the culture of death versus the culture of life, and

the culture of death will eventually lead to the death of all the cultures that embrace this.

So there are nations, the Japanese are going to disappear.

They're simply, they're not gonna be here seven to eight years from now.

They're already having to use robots to take care of elderly Japanese, because there

aren't enough young Japanese to enter into those fields to take care of the

old.

Their reproduction rate is so far below replacement that the collapse

is inevitable, and they will simply cease to exist as a people.

And we'll pick you up right where you left off on the Japanese low reproduction rate when we come back from our

midway break.

Please be patient, this is the longer than normal break, because Grace Life Radio, 90 .1 FM in Lake City, Florida,

requires of us a longer break because the FCC requires of them to localize this program

geographically to Lake City, Florida with their own public service announcements and other local things, while we

simultaneously air our globally heard commercials.

We'll be right back after this break with Dr. James R. White.

Don't go away.

James White of Alpha Omega Ministries here.

I'm very excited to announce that my longtime friend, Chris Arnzen of Iron Sharpens Iron Radio, and I

are heading down to Atlanta, Georgia again for the G3 National Conference.

That's Thursday, September 21st through Saturday the 23rd on a theme that I have been preaching, teaching,

writing about, and defending in live public debates for most of my life, the sovereignty of God.

I'll be joined on the speaking roster by Steve Lawson, Voti Baucom, Paul Washer, Virgil Walker, Scott

Anuel, and Josh Bice, founder of G3 Ministries.

And there's more great news.

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Chris Arnzen, I look forward to seeing you all Thursday, September 21st through Saturday the 23rd for the G3

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When Iron Sharpens Iron Radio first launched in 2005, the publishers of the New American

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That's also the email address where you can send in a question to Dr. James R. White of Alpha Omega Ministries.

We have been hearing Dr. White's response to Fox News' Sean Hannity on

his warning to GOP candidates to soften their anti -abortion rhetoric to further ensure

ballot box victories.

Chrisarnsen at gmail .com.

Give us your first name at least, city and state, and country of residence.

Only remain anonymous if your question is personal and private, like it involves an abortion that you may have had

or a loved one has had or that a loved one is considering or anything like that.

We will keep you anonymous as you request, but please give us your first name at least, city and state, and country of residence if it is

a general question.

Before I go to our listener questions, Dr. White, right before the break you were talking about the

dangerously diminishing reproductive rate in Japan, if you could pick up where you left off.

Well, it's not just Japan.

It's Russia.

China has recognized that their one -child policy was a disaster, but you can't

just turn that around.

You can't say, okay, start having babies because the Chinese, for example,

have now the form of the family was so fundamentally changed by

the one -child policy only that many Chinese, Japanese,

have become accustomed to this new reality, and they don't want to have children.

They don't want to have those family responsibilities, and so you can't just turn it around.

There's lots of governments who've realized, wow, all that population bomb stuff was a bunch of

hooey.

It was ridiculous.

The guy that wrote all that stuff has made a lot of money off of just being continuously wrong, and

so we're facing a situation where a lot of this is going to

get dealt with by reality itself.

It's just going to happen, but from the Christian perspective, here's the issue.

What do you say to a woman who seeks

out an abortion, and then she seeks forgiveness from

Christ?

Do you say to her, well, you don't have to worry about the abortion thing because you were the victim

there?

Or do you say to her, that is sin, and there is only one

way of forgiveness for that sin, and when

the pro -life movement says, oh, no, no, no, no, no.

Mothers, even using the term mother there is challenging, but

women who seek an abortion are themselves victims of abortion.

Then you are taking away from that person the reality

that the Gospel actually addresses, the reality of their need to be

forgiven of their sin and reconciled to God through Jesus Christ.

There needs to be an honest recognition of what has taken place, not just the murder of the child,

but the fornication that led to it as well.

As long as you come to the conclusion that

abortion is a political issue only, and that it will never be addressed,

that's the dichotomy that Hannity is functioning with.

Political, moral, two different things.

Rome has come to live with that in the United States.

The bishop up in San Francisco who finally said, no more

can Nancy Pelosi partake of the sacramental life of the Roman Catholic Church, he's

the odd man out.

The Pope cut him off at the knees.

When she goes to Rome, the Pope allows her to have Mass.

That consistency is

what's not in existence anymore amongst Roman Catholics and amongst evangelicals as well.

The question really is, is this a Gospel issue or is it not?

If it is a Gospel issue, then the Gospel is the answer.

But politically minded folks, they don't even want to go there.

You never talk about politics and religion.

Obviously, this does touch upon other

relevant factors in how we interact.

There's a consistency that apologia is the home of end abortion now.

And we also did not close down during COVID.

There's a consistency in our view of the relationship between church and state,

sphere of sovereignty, and our church is an openly

post -millennial theonomic congregation.

And so from our perspective, these individuals, Jeff can sit there

and look at these legislators and say, as a minister of the

Gospel of Jesus Christ, Christ has been seated and is enthroned in heaven.

He has revealed his will on these matters.

And you as an individual and as a person who has been placed in your position by

God in his sovereignty will be judged by him for what you do in light of

what he has revealed is his will.

And that's not what I was raised with.

That's not what most fundamentalist Baptists are raised with.

And I think we have an automatic fear

of, in some sense, crossing over that line.

And all the arguments going on in other areas, what's Christian nationalism, what's mere Christendom, and et cetera, et

cetera, et cetera.

Yeah, I'm glad those conversations are taking place.

I wish they were taking place in a little better format.

I'm thankful, for example, for those that are interested, I'm thankful in the back and forth that

has actually taken place between Scott Anuel of G3 and GBTS

and Doug Wilson.

They've been writing articles back and forth, and that's the way it should be.

Memes and little snarky videos and

using all sorts of descriptions and language that Christians shouldn't be using anyways,

really has caused me to have deep concerns

about people on both sides of this issue.

It needs to be handled in a mature fashion.

And, hey, I'm sure you'll be there unless you're manning the

Iron Sharpens Iron booth and refuse to leave or can't get

past the long line at the men's room.

But on Thursday, before the G3 begins on Friday.

Oh, really?

I thought the G3 began on Thursday.

Well, the pre -conference on Thursday.

Okay. It's usually on Wednesday.

I thought it was Thursday.

Okay, we'll confirm that later.

Yeah, we'll find out one way or the other.

Anyways, well, I need to know that because I need to drive from Carlisle or

Lancaster, one of the two places, to Atlanta.

So that's not that bad a drive, so I can make it.

But anyway, the pre -conference that GBTS is sponsoring

is on the church and the state, eschatology, law, the whole nine yards.

And I'm the only post -millennialist at GBTS.

So why is this?

Well, as a good post -millennialist, you should say, for now.

For now.

Hi, folks.

We've got Hal Lindsey sticking in your eye, folks.

Hi, folks.

Yeah, okay, all right.

That's going to end up on YouTube somewhere.

Anyway, my specific topic that I've been asked,

because it's going to be a situation where each one of us makes presentations, and then there's going to be Q &A panels where

we hash all this stuff out.

But interestingly enough, what they've asked me to address is state overreach,

when the state violates severe sovereignty and tries to tell the

church what to do in worship and meeting and things like that.

And the reason they asked me to do that was because of my role in helping

the Navy SEALs with their medical

exemption requests that they made, which, of course, the government did not

grant, because that's not why the government was doing it.

The regime wanted to get rid of any Navy SEALs that would

be anything less than absolutely compliant to whatever they told them to do, even if it was wrong.

So that's really what was going on there.

But the religious exemption statement that the SEALs submitted to the government,

I wrote.

Wow.

Really?

Yeah.

Jeff met with them, and then he came back, and

this is how things work at Apology of Church.

You want some backroom insight here?

Jeff flies back from this meeting with all these SEAL leaders, and

he says, I've promised them that we will help them with this, this, and this, and with

a written statement laying out all this stuff.

And I said, and when do they need that?

This was, I think, on Friday or Saturday.

Wow.

And he said, they need it Monday.

And so I'm sitting there going, okay, so what are you going to do about that?

And this is just sort of how it works.

It's sort of like, well, you're the one that does the writing.

So it's like, okay, all right, I'll get to that right away, right now.

And so I didn't have a whole lot of time to make it quite as fancy as I would like to have made it.

But, yeah, I'm the one that actually wrote that.

And so that's why I was asked to address that.

That will still lead us into this whole discussion, I think, hopefully anyways.

But, yeah, that's coming up at G3.

So hopefully those coming will attend that pre -conference and

will find it to be useful and helpful.

One of the things, before I go to a listener question, that is most problematic with

Sean Hannity's view is that it really removes

from the equation the only reason you should be opposed to abortion is that it's

murder.

And if you're giving these exceptions, you are saying it is no longer murder.

Like, for instance, there was at one time a prevalent Roman Catholic view.

I don't know how prevalent it is today, probably barely exists.

But there was a view where the marriage bed, when you

had intimacy with your spouse, it was for the sole purpose of

procreation.

I don't think that we as citizens of the

United States can impose that kind of a rule on our citizens.

But when it comes to murdering the result of the sexual union, that

we can say.

And all these exceptions that Sean Hannity provides, he's really redefining what abortion is.

Right, right.

We have less and less reason for this as time goes

by, because I have said many times that we live in a day because

we can trace an opposition to abortion back to the Didache, the early

church was very clear on the subject.

And they didn't even understand much of what we understand biologically

of what was going on in the process and everything else.

We live in a day where, you know, back in the what was it, in the 70s when Life magazine

did that incredible expose and the first real in -the -womb

full -color photography, people were just blown away.

And much of the reversal of the gains that the pro

-abortion movement had made were resisted by the

fact that starting with well, even with my children, so it's been a while now, we had

ultrasounds of our kids.

So that was coming up on 40 years ago now, it's about when it started becoming really prevalent.

And so most everyone has grown up with ultrasound pictures of their siblings

on the refrigerator door, knowing, you know, that's in mommy's belly and there's the

hands and the feet and so on and so forth.

That's changed everything.

We know beyond a shadow of a doubt that that is a

human person with an absolutely unique genetic makeup that will never be

created again.

We understand the process.

It's still very mysterious to us in that we don't actually know how it works.

It is still beyond our science.

But the reality of the life of the unborn child is now just

not even arguable, and Jeff I've heard Jeff say a number of times that

he, in his conversations, sees more and more that people are now not even

arguing that point anymore and are literally just saying, yeah, but it doesn't have

rights because of where it is.

Right.

In fact, Jeff on this program said every woman that he has confronted at an abortion clinic

admitted she was killing a baby.

Oh, yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah, they know.

They know exactly what's going on.

Yeah, there isn't any way to win this argument from the other side, but they're not winning it by arguing it.

They're winning it by not arguing it.

That's the whole problem.

They're winning by the education system and by

shutting down the conversation, shutting down the discussion, and literally

dumbing everything down.

It is astonishing how little the citizens of the United States

not only know about their own history, even recent history, but how little they know

about the reality of the life in the womb, how little they know about the

reality of gender, sexuality.

All they've got is a surface level, this makes me feel good from YouTube

mentality.

And look, any society that falls into that

level of moral and ethical and intellectual decay is probably a society that will

be replaced by another society in the not too distant future.

And when it all comes apart, we have to be the ones

with the flashlights, once the electricity goes out, shining the way toward

how to get back to not normalcy, not get back to where we once were, but to where we

need to be as creatures made in the image of God.

That's one of the differences in my thinking now, where you're not thinking about, well, we're just going to punch

our ticket and escape out of here, we're just going to boom, we're gone.

No, one of the biggest thoughts that was relevant

in my eschatological shift was Doug Wilson saying, why is it

that evangelicals never think about their great -grandchildren?

And it's true, but now that I have a 13 -year -old granddaughter, I am thinking

about great -grandchildren and my great -great -grandchildren, and what am I

doing to sow into them and to invest into them?

And that changes everything, it really does.

Yeah, I would like to, if I ever had the unlikely opportunity to speak with Sean Hannity,

when he gives these exceptions in his own philosophy of rape,

incest, and the life of the mother, why he believes

that would be acceptable to punish the child because of those things

and murder the child.

It reminds me, I don't know how this line and this scene ever got into this Hollywood movie.

One of my favorite movies is Rob Roy, I don't know if you ever saw it.

Oh yeah, oh yeah.

There's a scene where Rob Roy, portrayed by Liam Neeson, and I always wondered...

It's a movie about how wonderful Scotland is, you don't think.

I've seen it 47 ,000 times?

Come on, man!

If Braveheart hadn't come out the same year, Rob Roy would have racked up all the Academy Awards.

Yeah, I loved Rob Roy.

Well, Liam Neeson, and I always wondered what he was thinking when he said this line, because I don't know where he

is politically.

But he's portraying Rob Roy, and he's sitting there with his wife, when she finally has the courage

to tell him that the child she is carrying is not his, but the

biological child of a rapist.

She said, I wanted to go out into the river and root it out with a

stick.

And Rob Roy says to her, why murder the child when it's the father

who should be punished?

And I would say that very thing to Sean Hannity if I ever had the opportunity.

Why do you think that it's acceptable to murder a child for any reason?

I guess you don't think it's murder.

Then why are you even opposed to it for any reason, if it's not murder?

Why do you say you believe in the sanctity of life?

You're not thinking it through.

And in fact, Jeff will be very straightforward in saying,

look, you can't reason logically on this if you don't also specifically and

directly say that rape should be a capital crime.

Rape should be a capital crime.

And people say, well, wait a minute, how can that be consistent with a life -affirming

perspective?

Well, there's actually a pastor in Houston working on a debate,

possibly next year, on the death penalty.

But in reality, if you don't follow the biblical understanding

of why there was a death penalty in law, even pre

-Mosaic law, then you won't understand what life is.

And in fact, that's where Francis has jumped ship.

Because when he changed the universal Catholic catechism, and when he has said, as Pope,

in changing the teaching of the Church, that capital punishment is untenable.

Not only has he completely contradicted the entire traditional history of the Roman

Catholic Church, but he's completely missed the reason why God instituted

capital punishment was because of the sanctity of human life.

Right, but you've got to look at the bright side that keeps Protestants safer forever.

Well, I don't know.

And of course, I've had Roman Catholics tell me, oh, no, no, no, he may have changed the catechism, but that's not actually a change of the teaching of the

Church.

Right, right.

Roberts and Jennis would agree with what you just said.

Right, right.

And I'm like, really?

So when the next Pope comes along, and the next Pope, and the next Pope, and you've got three or four of them in a row

that have all confirmed the same thing, you're going to stand against that?

Okay, yeah, all right.

That papacy thing ain't working out too well for you here.

All right, let me go to some listener questions.

We have CJ in Lindenhurst, Long Island, New York, where I lived for 10 years.

CJ says,.

But if no one asks him, would it be wrong for him to obscure that, just as people do

in many other areas of life?

In fact, we all likely do during things like job interviews.

We don't want to lie if we're asked about a certain area of our life, but we don't necessarily want to

voluntarily reveal other things.

Yeah, I could understand that.

Like, for instance, if you see a photograph of the employer's wife on his desk, you're not going

to say, wow, your wife is much more attractive than you are.

How did you ever land her?

I mean, that's incredible.

But if you could, go on.

No, you would.

I bet you did.

I bet you do.

You may have wondered why you didn't get some of those big promotions, but that's because

you couldn't stop yourself.

I know you too well, Chris.

It's just like, that would pop into your mind, and it's like, hey.

Yeah, yeah.

Okay.

The issue is the question.

The pragmatism, basically, is the question.

Yeah, yeah, I know.

And that's why I would never run for office, personally.

I don't have the capacity to parse my language in that

way.

And there does come a point, and I

loathe to be dogmatic as to exactly where that point is, but there does come a

point where you simply can't avoid being honest

about your ultimate authorities in your life.

It is a reflection on the society that a good, godly man would want

to hide his godliness.

And I just think that line

is probably a whole lot clearer than we'd like to think it is.

And I would say, especially in this area, I just don't see how you can parse

your words.

Right, right.

So see how you can.

When is it ever a good thing to appease the wicked

while disobeying God?

Right.

You know, what happened in Pennsylvania, could we just step back a second and go

look what the result has been?

Have you seen pictures of the senator in his shorts and

stuff, standing there with the senators in their suits?

And have the people of Pennsylvania been properly represented by Fetterman or

what's going on?

I mean, that was judgment on the state, let's

just be honest.

It really was.

And I'm looking at the same thing.

We've got a governor in Arizona now who, you know,

there's still court cases going on.

And it was a stolen election.

It was as corrupt as anything that's ever happened in Chicago.

No question about it.

But she is, I have no respect for her.

She is an airhead.

She's just holding the place.

Other people are running the state into the ground.

Same thing with Joe Biden.

Other people are running the nation into the ground while he's eating ice cream and wondering which day of the week it is.

So that's judgment.

That's just judgment upon the nation.

It really is.

We have Joseph in south -central Pennsylvania who said, Sean Hannity claims to

believe in God, very strongly so.

And yet his words would betray that he is not trusting in God because of

circumstances on this earth that he fears.

Do you agree?

Well, my understanding, and correct me if I'm wrong, but his background is Roman Catholicism, isn't it?

Yes, but he did leave for a season and was a member of the actual church where you had

your first Muslim debate with Hamza Abdul Malik in Syosset.

But that was under a different pastorate and a different, really an entirely different congregation.

Yeah, I don't know what his current theology is or

anything like that.

I don't either.

It seems to me like it is primarily

of the same kind of pragmatic evangelicalism

that is reflected in the Roman Catholic schizophrenia, where it has

just become acceptable in the Roman Catholic Church in the United States, if you're a politician, to go,

oh, well, personally this, but this is what I will actually promote in society.

And that kind of schizophrenia, look, the other side just smiles and goes,

we understand, and knows that you're not a threat and never will be.

So it sounds like where he's coming from, like I said, I stopped listening to him a long time

ago, and I don't watch, you know, once in a while the TV would still be

on after Tucker went off and I'd see something.

But especially with all the stuff that happened in the last election and all, I just, I got sort of tired of it.

So I didn't, I don't know how to answer where he is right now.

By the way, Sean, if you ever do get this recording, we would love to have you on the show to

give a response and perhaps even have a friendly debate with Dr. White if you would like to do that.

We would love for you to be on to perhaps further clarify your own position.

We have, let's see here, Ronald in Eastern Suffolk County, Long Island.

And Ronald says, I can't for the life of me figure out how someone

like Sean Hannity would believe that taking a moderate view

against abortion would do anything but perpetuate an ongoing

cycle of candidates being chosen in primaries who are moderate

and weak on abortion.

So therefore, the abortion mill murder cycle will

continue when you keep desiring moderates to run for office.

That seems to be the case all across the spectrum on all the subjects.

The idea that you can appease the woke mob by

modifying your position, you know, it's really not working out well in anything

on any subject, whether it be immigration or abortion or all

the cadre of LGBTQ plus insanity.

That's not getting us anywhere, and that's not how the prophets did anything.

Of course, you know, Jeremiah got thrown in a pit, other people got sawn in half.

So if you're going to be overly prophetically clear, just be prepared to follow them in what

happened in their own experiences, I suppose.

But again, this does get us back to the

question that the entire Christian nationalism conversation raises.

And that is, what is relationship?

What is severe sovereignty?

What's the relationship between church and state?

What is our relationship?

What is the necessity for the church or individual Christians

to give testimony to the state as to

how judgment is going to come?

That was not something we ever talked about in decades past, I'll be honest.

And now all of a sudden, everyone's like, oh, yes, we need to be telling the magistrates

what their duties are.

And I'm like, we weren't talking about that only 10 years ago.

You know who was talking about that 10 years ago, 20 years ago, 30 years ago, 50

years ago?

Francis Schaeffer.

Francis Schaeffer and Rush Duny.

Right.

They were.

And now all of a sudden, there's a bunch of folks who are literally acting like,

oh, yeah, we've always believed that.

That's what we need to be doing.

And I'm like, come on.

I I've been around a little while now.

And no, we weren't we weren't talking about this before at all.

So I can be thankful for that.

I'm I'm I'm you know, when when Grace Community Church reopened

during the covid stuff and then took a stand and said we were wrong to have done that.

That first sermon that John MacArthur preached, I'm sitting here listening,

going.

One of those told you so moments.

It wasn't I told you so moment.

And it and it's not like, OK, now you need to admit that we've been right about this all along.

No, it was I'm just really thankful that the Lord has brought circumstances about.

And people are going, man, I got it.

I really got to think this through.

And, you know, I had a dear, dear, dear brother.

I won't go into names.

But when I preached my sermon about my embracing post -millennialism,

his first comment to me when we talked afterwards a couple of days later was,

oh, drat.

Now I have to think all this stuff through, too.

And and that was I think that's what's happened with a lot of people is that for a long time, we just sort of

bopped along with our traditions.

And then 2020 came along and now everything after 2020.

And we have to go, wow, we've really got to think this through.

And the same thing with the abortion debate is Roe gets struck down

and all of a sudden we're seeing just how dedicated the culture of

death is to death itself and how many of our fellow citizens.

This isn't just this isn't a preference poll.

This isn't something this is how you view life.

And people who are already worshipping at the altar of the culture of death are going to

continue worshipping at the altar of the culture of death.

And this is its central sacrament.

So it has become a religious commitment on their part.

And the only way to change that is to change hearts and minds.

It's a gospel issue.

It has to be.

I just want a quick read a very brief comment by one of my listeners who's also

become a very dear friend of mine.

Jason Contino, who is the pastor of Harborview Christian Church

in Port Jefferson, Long Island.

Dear Reformed Baptist brother.

Jason Contino says and he's referring to

those that are full throated anti abortionists.

It's not a death sentence for candidates.

Abortion is a death sentence for babies.

I mean, very succinctly put and obvious and using Sean

Hannity's own words back at him on that.

Right.

Very true.

But again, the pragmatist.

But I'm even left going, OK, so let's say you win the election because you

waffle on this and you don't take a strong stand.

What do you do then?

Are you are you not now limited as to what you can actually do

in regards to abortion?

Are you are you now limited to what you said during the election and therefore

you can't continue to push forward?

Or are we just keeping the status quo so that you have the continual

debate and the managing of things, but not the actual abolition of it?

Because I've really come to start wondering, do these people want to see it

abolished or they just want to see it regulated and continue forever?

You know, that's what that's where the the slavery issue comes in.

You just want slavery to be, you know, moderated and and

limited.

Or do you want it abolished?

Which which is it going to be?

That's right.

That's the question.

And we have to go to our final break.

And when we come back, we'll have Cindy from Findlay, Ohio's question slash statement

aired.

The email address for your question, if you want to get in line, is Chris Arnzen at Gmail dot com.

Chris Arnzen at Gmail dot com.

Give us your first name, at least city and state and country of residence.

Only remain anonymous if your question involves a personal and private matter.

We'll be right back.

James White of Alpha Omega Ministries here.

I'm very excited to announce that my longtime friend Chris Arnzen of Iron Sharpens Iron Radio and I

are heading down to Atlanta, Georgia again for the G3 National Conference.

That's Thursday, September 21st through Saturday, the 23rd.

On a theme that I've been preaching, teaching, writing about and defending in live public debates for most of my life.

The sovereignty of God.

I'll be joined on the speaking roster by Steve Lawson, Voti Baucom, Paul Washer, Virgil Walker, Scott

Anuel and Josh Bice, founder of G3 Ministries.

And there's more great news.

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Chris Arnzen and I look forward to seeing you all Thursday, September 21st through Saturday, the 23rd.

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Make sure you stop by the Iron Sharpens Iron Radio exhibitor booth and say hi to Chris Arnzen while

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Puritan Reformed is a Bible -believing, kingdom -building, devil -fighting church.

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Tell the folks at Hope Reformed Baptist Church of Corham, Long Island, New York that you heard about them from Tony Costa

on Iron Sharpens Iron.

Welcome back.

Cindy in Finley, Ohio says, As one who was given an ultimatum, I left a

marriage because of pressure from my husband to abort his child.

May I encourage all those listening who feel they are being compassionate to women who feel they

have no choice but, quote, quote, to murder their child.

Please, your compassion is seriously misplaced.

You must be gentle but brutally honest with the mother that murder is never an

option.

Please never accommodate the fast and easy solution.

My daughter and her children have been a supreme joy.

Never support someone's argument for abortion, which was obviously a comment, not a question.

Do you have any response to that, Dr. White?

No, it's just that there are so many that could testify the same thing.

Their voices are almost never heard.

It is so sad.

If we actually had journalists still in this nation, those

voices would be heard.

But one of the things that really, to me, demonstrates how far we've gone is we

don't have journalists.

We don't have a free press.

We just have Pravda.

Pravda just closed up shop in Russia and moved to New York City.

Very quickly answer the question of a listener who is asking off -topic.

Joseph in Gardner, Massachusetts.

I wanted to know if Dr. White has any plans to debate Oneness Pentecostal Jerry Lynn Hayes.

Not heard of him.

Okay.

There you go, Joseph.

I think you're a first -time questioner, so send me your full mailing address and you'll get a free New American Standard Bible.

Well, I want you now to summarize what you most want etched in the hearts and minds of our listeners

in regard to these ongoing statements by very well -known and highly

respected Sean Hannity of Fox News.

Well, we as Christians are faced with the question of pragmatism,

and I think as we have seen our culture crashing into

astonishing self -destructive behavior, completely throwing the concepts

of justice and man being created in the image of God right out the window, and the results that we're seeing, the

mutilation of children, and the elevation of these things to moral goods.

Obviously, the idea of the myth of neutrality, the idea that we can actually play

games in politics, hopefully by now we've realized that does not work, and it's not going to work,

and has led to disaster.

And so the question is, how do we deal with this?

Where do we go now?

And I think this is a good example of having to speak the truth and recognize the only way

to change this society, which has all the information it needs in the world, the only way to

change this society is to do so by means of the gospel.

And so it's not a matter of moderating, it's a matter of being even clearer and then

having the right answer for the real problem, which is changing hearts and minds.

Yes, and in fact, Sean Hannity, according to his own profession, he is

not compromising his beliefs.

He actually believes in those exceptions to abortion being the

rape, incest, and the life of the mother, and he is just clearly wrong if he

believes that abortion is murder.

Otherwise, he shouldn't even be opposing it.

And we just want to remind everybody about the upcoming

Mid -Atlantic Reformation Society conference featuring Dr. James R. White

coming up in September.

For more details, go to midatlanticreformation .org, midatlanticreformation .org, and click on

events.

And don't forget about the G3 conference, September 21st through the 23rd in Atlanta, Georgia, on the

sovereignty of God, where Dr. White is speaking.

Go to g3men .org, g3men .org, and use promo code G3ISIR for a

30 discount.

That's promo code G3ISIR.

I want to thank you so much, Dr. White, for doing such a superb job on the show, as you always do.

I want to thank our listeners, especially those who took the time to write.

And I want you all to always remember for the rest of your lives that Jesus Christ has a far greater Savior than

you are a sinner.