February 20, 2017 Show with Charlie Liebert on “Always Be Ready to Give an Answer”

Live from the historic parsonage of 19th century gospel minister George Norcross in downtown Carlisle, Pennsylvania it's iron sharpens iron a radio platform on which pastors Christian scholars and theologians Address the burning issues facing the church and the world today.

Proverbs 27 verse 17 tells us Iron sharpens iron so one man sharpens another. Matthew Henry said that in this passage quote we are cautioned to take heed whom we converse with and Directed to have in view in conversation to make one another wiser and better.

It is our hope that this goal will be accomplished over the next hour. And we hope to hear from you the listener with your own questions. Now here's our host.

Good.

Afternoon, Cumberland County, Pennsylvania Lake City, Florida and the rest of humanity living on the planet Earth who are listening via live streaming. This is Chris Arns and your host of iron sharpens iron wishing you all a happy President's Day on this Monday of February 20th 2017.

And boy did our Lord and Creator provide a phenomenal beautiful gorgeous breathtaking Nearly summer-like day today here in Carlisle, Pennsylvania. Can't believe the gorgeous weather out there but if God created the World in six days.

I'm sure that having a beautiful day in Carlisle, Pennsylvania is not a problem for him but I am delighted to have Somebody on the program today who has been on as a co-host. You've all heard him. Or many of you have heard him on the program as a co-host on iron sharpens iron.

But today for the first time he is going to be my guest on the program. My primary guest and his name is Charlie Liebert founder of six day creation calm and we're discussing one of his three books. Always be ready to give an answer and it's my honor and privilege to welcome you back to iron sharpens iron Charlie Liebert.

Thank you, Chris. It's great to be here and in studio.

Again is my co-host the reverend buzz Taylor and hope you two can introduce each other because I know that you just met. Seconds ago. Yes.

It's the competition of the co-hosts.

And if anybody would like to join us on the air. Our email address if you have a question is Chris Arnzen at gmail .com. Chris Arnzen at Gmail .com. And please give us your first name your city and state in your country of residence.

If you live outside of the good old USA. Charlie this book that you have written always be ready to give an answer. There are other books on apologetics that have been written on how to answer the questions of skeptics and those who are in opposition to biblical evangelical Christianity.

Perhaps they are either atheists or agnostics perhaps they're even Roman Catholics or members of a non-evangelical Church or a cult or some other religion outside of Christianity. Why did you see a need for another book that helps?

Listeners to be ready to give an answer for the hope that lies within them.

Asking Questions Instead of Answering Them in Evangelism

Okay, let me give you a little background on that Chris. I was Teaching in a study back in 2010 in Greensboro, North Carolina where I lived at that time a bunch of Christian businessmen and As we talked about evangelism and talked about being able to witness for Christ.

One of the things that came up very clearly again and again is I get into a conversation that's going to lead in a spiritual direction and They asked me a question and I can't answer that question and I get diverted off the subject can never get to the gospel.

So I went back and for about actually for about two years I went back and studied the scripture. What the Jesus. How did Jesus would use a panel something like that? But if you look at his encounters with the Pharisees and other people in Scripture You see that he never answered the question.

He has to question answered the question with a question and I didn't find any other Evangelistic book that I've ever said that so I said, let me put down on paper how to do this. To doing this is very simple.

They ask you a question like where'd Cain get his wife? You don't answer the question. You say that's a good question, but let me ask you a question.

Why did you ask me that. Did you ever run for a political office?

Actually, that's not true. Yes, I did. I ran once for school board and lost third in a race of fives, but that's a whole nother story. So so so I was I was confronted with this again and again. And I decided to call this taking the spiritual temperature.

You ask a person a series of questions that probes to their presuppositions. This is what he did with the Pharisees. He asked him about the baptism of John. He took him completely off the track of what they were trying to do to him and took them to their presuppositions.

Forced him to think about it. That's the key. Okay, you get the priest up it you evaluate a person. Are they hot? Are they ready to hear the gospel? Are they Luke warm? Well, maybe they're maybe they're not or they cold they say like for example an atheist said to me recently I don't care what you answer.

I won't believe anything you say. Well, what's the point of answering his question to begin with so you take a spiritual temperature and then? The key the key thing that I put in here is then you go to a testimony you say look I know that's a good answer to your question.

But let me tell you about how I believe there is a good answer and you walk right into your testimony. I came to be a believer as this whatever your testimony is three to five minutes. Testimony quickly and then you come to the end us and end with another question.

What do you think about the gospel? What do you think about Christ and just a question that leads to that that spiritual temperature that you've already evaluated to say well. Where is the person? Sometimes they get angry and walk away other times as an invitation to go further with the gospel and Sometimes you get to what I call closure, which is a section of a chapter in the book that says basically How do you close the gospel?

How do you bring a person to faith? What do you what do you tell them now? You got to understand that men were dead in their sin. God's got to have made them alive to hear if they've got ears to hear then they're ready to hear and you share the gospel.

That's what basically the book the book the book says.

Well as far as that question actually I know that after you bring the person back to the question of your own. Why do you ask that. That's interesting question. Do you eventually get around to offering them plausible?

Theories. Because obviously the Bible doesn't tell us specifically. But the only theories I know of is that There was a period of time where obviously God before he prohibited incest. Permitted brothers and sisters to have Relations.

So the only alternative I could think of is that Cain had marital relations with his sister or.

Even his mother or a four. I wouldn't think his mother but his first cousin, right? Because if enough time elapsed, yeah, because these lifespans are five six seven hundred years. So the lifespan is sufficient that it would be time to marry at the second or third generation person and in the end in the.

Recording of Scripture. Only a few women are mentioned in someone's genealogical record, right? That's correct.

There's only only one or two in all the genealogies in the Bible. It's pretty much the male line.

So so if it was interesting that both of the women in the genealogical accounts in Scripture were.

Notorious sinners who came to faith and they were not Hebrews, right?

Either they had Rahab the harlot who actually became a believer right. And Ruth. Ruth is the other one. Yeah, right. And Let's see here. We do have a question from a listener already. Okay, and I'll repeat our email address if anybody else has a question.

It's Chris Arnzen at gmail .com. Chris Arnzen at gmail .com. And as I said before, please give us your first name. At least your city and state and your country of residence if you live outside of the good old USA.

We have a question from Arthur in Middletown, Pennsylvania and Arthur asks. Ask Charlie if he would please explain presuppositional thought so people can use it to understand. That the use of evidences is only effective if you also deal with the way your object of concern thinks about the world.

How do you deal with your friends presuppositions and worldview? So I'm assuming that Arthur is either guessing or is aware already that you are a presuppositionalist because we haven't established that.

Although you did somewhat give a hint there. Yes, I did because I know that presuppositionalists do not like to be derailed by trying to prove everything that's correct.

Yeah. Thanks Arthur for the question. I would I would say this to the listeners in general. Every person has an attitude or a view of life. Which we called a worldview and that comes from the beliefs about who they are what their position in the world is.

What their life is about all the different things that relate to who you are. You see it's a set of presuppositions for a Christian. It's a certain set for a humanist or atheist it's very different set and What you're trying to evaluate when you're talking to the person about why did you ask me that question if I if I answer that? question will it change anything about how what you believe you can go and pursue this and You do that to get to get them to reveal to you what their presuppositions are.

I mean you could have for example a dialogue with an atheist and he says I don't care what you say I'm never gonna believe anything you say. Well, then the conversation probably is not going to get never going to get spiritual.

Although you should give a witness anyway, but you may have a conversation with the person that says gee, I'm really confused I go to church, but I really don't understand how that's supposed to change my life.

Well now you've got an opportunity to go further With with the gospel and your own your own beliefs about who Christ is and describing all the things related to your life. Remember when you give a testimony a Person can't question it.

It's your experience in your life. So they really can't say I don't. I think you're wrong because you're not wrong. You're describing what happened to you and when you come to the end of it. Then you've got to close with some kind of a question.

It's going to pursue them to give back to you more of the presuppositions. Where are they spiritually that taking temperature is real important. Because you know then what a person how a person is receptive at the gospel or not.

Now I don't want to Be too severely critical of any Evidentialist listening. One of my greatest living heroes is an evidentialist RC sprawl. And in fact John Gerstner who is now in eternity with Christ was an evidentialist and I and they were they are Both thoroughly reformed.

In fact, John Gerstner is even more thoroughly the reform.

But.

Can you give an outline of evidentialism, yes.

Actually when I was first converted I was more of an evidentialist than a presuppositional. Yeah. Well, I would think that.

Evidentialism would be a Common understanding of life Unless you are brought deeper into.

Philosophical thing that's correct. And in fact a One of the principal things I had to deal with as a new as a new Christian was evolution. Because I was I bought the goods on that completely because I'm a trained scientist.

He had a bachelor's in chemistry. So I bought the goods on that. So I that was one of the big wrestles I had. It took me three years and I'll say this humorously to evolve from old earth Atheistic evolutionist to a young earth biblical creationist took about three years.

I read the people like Ken Ham Henry Morris Dwayne Gish all those different books and it took a while to get there and as I got there as I began to mature in Christ, I began to understand that men are really dead in their sin.

They're not asleep. You can't wake in them and any oh and the all the amount of evidence you could ever give to a person that's dead. Falls on dead ears. They can't hear you. So the reason I go to the pre suppositions is because I want to discern has the Holy Spirit worked in that person's life.

To give them ears to hear. Jesus talked about that all the time. Ears to hear. Did he give the head. Do they have ears to hear. Can they hear the biblical truth. If they can then it's time to give It to them.

If they can't and they're dead in their sin and they're rejecting you then give a testimony. Anyway, and I'll talk about that in a second. Give a testimony anyway, because testimonies are seeds and seeds will germinate or not.

There's a man that I knit was that I knew when I was in high school. But I met when I was what going for my master's in business and I own a college about about 12 years out of high school and the Frank's out across the table for me at a Chinese restaurant and He told me a story of his life.

I Knew up to high school. He married his high school sweetheart. They had two children. He had a successful business in Amityville where I lived. He had a You know a house two cars and a dog all the things you'd expect then one day a fire in his home Killed his wife and two children.

That destroyed him. He became an alcoholic lost his business ultimately became homeless. And as he told me this story, I had no way to comfort him. I was far from being a Christian at that point. No way to comfort him.

So I he looked across the table at me put his fingers straight out in my face and said Charlie Because of Jesus Christ Coming into my life that changed everything. Now that's a seed and that's 15 years from a BC a long time before I would come to know Christ.

But when I knelt on my knees in that chapel and received Christ in Asheville, North Carolina that seed came back so don't be afraid to plant seeds with people that you evaluate as being dead and.

The the the evidentialist Perhaps is more convinced that Man is a spiritually depraved sinner but is Like the presuppositional this would but he would think more in terms of the of the lost sinner being a clean slate in regard to information perhaps whereas the presuppositionalist Knows that everyone who claims to be an atheist and an agnostic is really Self-deceived because no one really is an atheist or agnostic according to Romans 1.

Am I right? Yes, that's correct.

Men are dead in their sin. They cannot hear truth but they their minds are filled with all kinds of other things that are there and That that will lead them astray in the sense of Romans 1 2 and 3 teaches it clearly men are depraved to start with.

They're dead and depraved but more than that God can give them over and when that happens There's a dissent and you see that dissent illustrated greatly today in dr. Richard Dawkins one of the prime advocates revolution.

Whose Dawkins has recently said pedophilia is kind of okay, and that's a dissent. Wow. That's a dissent a dissent into further into sin. While all men are sinners and lost that's a dissent down into the what I say the pit, right?

Yeah that.

There's there's a. Both responses. Two responses I have to that number one it is consistent with atheism. To believe there are no rules, that's correct. But but even Dawkins who people view as some kind of a genius is in some sense even Making a self-refuting statement because we don't need him then to tell us it's okay.

See, but but you got to understand. Atheism in itself is an untenable position, right? It's impossible because you cannot say in one sense There's no absolutes in the universe. Because I want to do what I want to do for behavior and then say an absolute statement There is no God.

The best an atheist can ever be is an agnostic. Atheism is a contradiction in terms. It's an impossible position. You can't say there's no God. First of all, you're not omniscient.

You can't know that for certain. Anyway, yeah, even Bill Maher made a comment. That was true in that regard. I don't know if he still considers himself an agnostic, but he used to say well the reason I'm an agnostic is like I don't have all knowledge.

Okay, that's that. That's a great admission for an atheist because a lot of atheists won't admit that they claim that we know there's no God because right. And then they'll give reasons and.

So as I was saying Romans 1 it gives us a clear indication that that man Innately knows that he is in rebellion against God because he knows the truth, but is suppressing it suppresses the truth.

Yes, if the truth is known you can't you can't understand anything in the area of science. About the amazing things like how our bodies are made and not see that there's a designer there. I mean, it's impossible to see there's no designer.

In fact Dawkins actually says that I was just I was working on my third book Today and I actually had a quote from Dawkins in there and basically it says that everything looks like it's designed but it's really not.

Well, that's not science. That's nonsense.

Yeah.

You'll find a lot of their rhetoric absolutely nonsensical.

In fact, I did a word search on the manuscript for the third book and I found the word stupid that now I've used in stupid about five times.

We have Joe in Slovenia. Who says dear brother Chris? I've often heard that the fossil record doesn't give evidence for the millions of years of evolutionary theory. However, most people believe that it does.

Please ask brother Charlie to give a concise answer that we can give to people who question six-day creation. When they claim that the fossil record proves Millions of years what specific evidence refutes that error?

Thanks for giving us such wonderful tools to engage the culture with the gospel.

Fossilization, Noah’s Flood, and the Limits of the Fossil Record

Okay formation of fossils first of all is a process that is Sudden and abrupt fish don't fall to the bottom of the ocean become fossilized. Fossilized fossilization has to take place where Animals alive or dead are buried suddenly by massive amounts of material particularly clay or mud and that'll turn into rock.

So so fossilization is a catastrophic process. That's the first point. The second point is when you look at the record as they constructed for evolution, they've constructed it in a circular argument.

They've said because we see the simplest things on the bottom and they're not always on the bottom cambrian layers in some places on the top. But that that lower level is on the bottom. So they say well as a result of that all the All the things that that resulted from evolution follow.

Well, they're out of order in a lot of places. That's another that's another point but let me get to the the real essence here. The real essence is The fossil record was formed as the catastrophic process of Noah's Flood took place and You can confirm that a couple ways.

Number one is 95 of all the fossils on planet Earth are in the layer that's called Cambrian and The Cambrian layer is a layer that represents the bottom of the sea the first thing to be buried in a global flood.

95 of all fossils are Cambrian. So it indicates catastrophic burial and it indicates The the lowest level being the most buried. There's two arguments against the evolutionary ranking of the of the the record itself.

Okay.

People talk about the fossil record. The fact that we have amoebas today and we have humans today. We shouldn't even have to look to the fossil record. We should have all the in-between stages. Walking around it or swimming or whatever.

They're talking about as far as evolution. Yeah.

If the if the evolution is not true and it's not if evolution is not true if ever I'm somebody let back up. But if evolution were true Then you'd expect to find biology a mass Continuum of creatures. Mm-hmm.

We don't we have cats and we have dogs and they're very different and.

Having said that you do believe that Species or kinds of creatures including humans Have changed in their structure to some degree over the years and so sure some even very radically. You have everything from a house kitten to a.

Sabertooth tiger. Okay. So there are differences within species. Let's let's go back to what what's a what's a kind? Okay, when God created kinds, it's probably at the in bio in biology the family level.

Okay, because dogs would include dogs coyotes dingles and wolves. They all have the same number chromosome count. They all in interbreed. So they're all the same kind. So there was two two created originally with the greatest absolute variation possible.

Which means that in every gene there was one dominant and one recessive. Which gives you the possibilities in human beings that Condition of one dominant one recessive is how Adam and Eve were created.

There's all of mankind comes from them and the variations are incredible. The variations of humankind in two human individuals. Having children they'd have to have ten of the 2017th power children before they'd be a duplicate.

But that that number is beyond anything we can comprehend. I mean the universe only has ten to the 80 Adams.

Now one thing that always has baffled me about those who claim an age of the earth that goes into the billions of years Are even if you wanted to say a million or a billion is how could any? Scientific experiment.

Prove that like for instance if you Know where a specific figure From history is buried And you know the date that that figure from history lived. Let's say we go to Julius Caesar or something somebody of that nature you get you exhume a fragment of his remains and You find out that the date that has come up that you come up with in the experiment Matches the date that he lived and so on.

How do you get anybody to prove? through a scientific experiment that something is.

Is.

It's phenomenally and amazingly old as even approaching a million years let alone billions.

Well, actually you don't Chris. What. What you have to do is you have to take some science and make a whole set of assumptions? The radioactive dating is the most common thing they would use but radioactive dating makes assumptions.

Assumptions that there was no daughter at the beginning that everything decayed at the same rate.

I don't know what you mean by that. No daughter at the beginning the.

Radioactive decay is a series of steps. Uh-huh. You go down the ladder in the sense losing losing losing atomic number as you go down the ladder. Okay, and what they measure is the thing that's at the bottom of the ladder.

Let's say iodine for example, or whatever you measured the bottom and you measure the top how much is there at the top and. Then you use that with the half with the half-life with the decay rate to determine how long that rock has been there.

The problem is first of all, the only rocks you can measure are volcanic rocks. You can't measure sedimentary rocks. Because the sedimentary rocks do not contain material that was frozen in time. The material just accumulated over whoever knows how long but in a in a rock that's a basaltic rock.

That's come out of a volcano. It is liquid and then it becomes solid that moment it changes to solid state is the moment the clock begins. Now second thing is one of the common use used methods is called radiocarbon.

Radiocarbon simply is a method that measures living things how long living things have been dead. So if you find a bone and you measure radiocarbon, you can estimate how long living things are dead. Here's the problem with radiocarbon at the end of 50 ,000 years.

It's completely gone. So you can't get to millions with radiocarbon anyway, the second thing is and this is really exciting. In fact, I would say I say in my book their book here if evolutionary scientists were honest.

They'd realize evolution has been falsified because we have found tissue. That is biological tissue in bones and partially fossilized bones of dinosaurs. That can't last more than a couple thousand years.

It can't list six 65 million for sure and they've been dancing around this one for quite a long time and the fines Seem to be exploding because there's been it was originally one and now there's been eight or ten.

I think there were 14 the last time I looked and are any of them. Crying fraud and charlatanry is on the part of those. No, they're they're actually accusing the scientists of contamination. Contamination is is one out.

The other is that it was preserved because it was in a environment that was basically in a vacuum without any oxygen. That's impossible to believe that could happen on planet Earth. There's no way that can happen.

But that's that that's part of it and they also claim that there are some ways to preserve it using certain kinds of minerals like lead but.

There you have evidence of people having such a convinced presupposition That dinosaurs died before men and that the earth is billions of years old that they are just Refusing to see what scientific evidence they are being shown.

They did. Scientists doesn't matter to them at that point because when you attack the presuppositions, they will not give those up. So because they won't give those up you're reasoning with a post. You're not reasoning with someone who can raise.

Not now.

Can scientists Fairly accurately determine the age of things like for instance In the year that Julius Caesar lived or something. Is there a reasonable?

Accuracy. Yes, if for example you had a you had a wooden coffin. It was buried with the body because the body's most probably gonna be mostly turn to dust probably not gonna have any body. But if you had a wooden coffin that was buried with the person and you excavated that coffin and took that wood and red done.

Radiocarbon you'd get you'd get an age. That would be reasonable. However, there's one problem if You go before the flood. The atmospheric conditions are so different that you're not going to be able to use the radiocarbon to measure something so you've got to be sure that what you're trying to measure is a Something that was that grew or came into being after the flood.

Because pre-flood stuff and pre floods that one of the pre-flood stuffs is the fossil fuels oil and coal. That I mean that that's part that's part of the results of the flood. In fact, let me say that think about that.

There's another apologetic here. For your listeners in evangelism. That's one thing that's really important cough fossil coal. Diamonds and we can't really do oil but fossil coal and diamonds have been measured with radio and found radiocarbon in them.

Which means for sure it's less than 50 ,000 years old. And that's a huge problem because they have the carbon difference period of 750 million years ago. When they're supposed to form that stuff and they have really no a good explanation for a formula.

We've got a great explanation when the flood came it washed all the forest stuff together and buried it and under the pressure and heat of the Being buried inside the earth. It turned into coal and oil we could do that in the laboratory actually.

We're gonna go to a break right now. And if you'd like to join us on the air our email address is Chris Arnzen at gmail .com. Chris Arnzen at gmail .com. Please give us your name at least your first name your city and state and your country of residence if you live outside of the USA.

Oh, and by the way Joe in Slovenia, you have won a free copy of Charlie Liebert's book. Always be ready to give an answer and thank you for providing an American address where your daughter lives and we will have that shipped to her and That will be shipped out by our friends at Cumberland Valley Bible Book Service CV for Cumberland Valley BBS for Bible book service calm also Arthur CV BBS dot-com.

Oh, yes, Arthur in Pennsylvania is also Receiving a free copy. I forgot about that. Sorry about that Arthur. And we're gonna be right back after these messages. So if you'd like to send in a question of your own do so as soon as possible.

We look forward to hearing from you and we will be right back.

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Paul wrote to the church at Galatia for am I now seeking the approval of man or of God or am I trying to please? Man, if I were still trying to please man, I would not be a servant of Christ. Hi, I'm Mark Lukens pastor of Providence Baptist Church.

We are a reformed Baptist Church and we hold to the London Baptist confession of faith of 1689. We are in Norfolk, Massachusetts. We strive to reflect Paul's mindset to be much more concerned with how God views what we say and what we do Than how men view these things.

That's not the best recipe for popularity. But since that wasn't the Apostles priority, it must not be ours either. We believe by God's grace that we are called to demonstrate love and compassion to our fellow man and To be vessels of Christ's mercy to a lost and hurting community around us and to build up the body of Christ in truth.

And love. If you live near Norfolk, Massachusetts or plan to visit our area Please come and join us for worship and fellowship. You can call us at 508 -528 -5750. That's 508 -528 -5750 or go to our website to email us listen to past sermons worship songs or watch our TV program Entitled resting in grace.

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For details call 717 -388 -3000. That's 717 -388 -3000. Or visit chef exclusive .com. That's chef exclusive .com. Welcome back. This is Chris Arnzen. She just tuned us in. Our guest today is Charlie Liebert a Christian apologist and founder of six day creation .com.

He is the author of two books with Christian themes. The first always be ready to give an answer. Teaches a Christian evangelism strategy that gets to witnessing. Every time an unbeliever asks you a question.

His second book Answers for the hope that is in with that is in you. Provides answers to over 100 questions that Christians are commonly asked by family and friends. They can both be found at the website.

Your Christian answers calm. That's your Christian answers calm. His third book to be published later this year titled without three miracles Darwin's dead that shows that science proves atheistic evolution is impossible.

Our studio co-host today again is Reverend buzz Taylor and. We are accepting your questions at. Chris Arnzen at gmail .com. Chris Arnzen at gmail .com. And we do have. Before we go to your book. I just wanted to get one more listener question out of the way we have.

Lou in Sharpsburg, Georgia. Who asks among the most famous world religion world religious leaders outside of Christianity? Such as Mohammed and others. Do you know what the origin and age what their views are or were?