Benny Hinn Repents with Justin Peters

Andrew Rappaport's Rapp Report

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slash walk. Have you heard the good news? Benny Hinn repented.

01:05

Nuh -uh, Andrew. Not so fast on that. Welcome to The Wrap Report with Andrew Rapoport, where we provide biblical interpretations and applications.

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This is a ministry of Striving for Eternity and the Christian Podcast Community. For more content or to request a speaker for your church, go to strivingforeternity .org.

01:34

Well, I guess maybe, just maybe, Justin Peters is going to disagree with me yet again.

01:43

But Justin, didn't Benny Hinn make a confession that the prosperity gospel is false teaching?

01:52

Yes, yes, Andrew, he did for about the fourth or fifth time now in his ministry, he's done that.

02:00

All right, so for folks who may have had their head in the sand and don't know, this week, earlier this week,

02:08

Benny Hinn came out with a confession. That's actually the title of it on his YouTube channel.

02:14

And I want to first, Justin, play this for folks so that we have some context and then you and I can discuss this.

02:21

It is about four, a little more than four minutes long, but I am going to be playing it at a little bit quicker speed just so we get through it.

02:31

So let me play that for you and then Justin and I are going to discuss that because I think we're going to find that, well, we don't quite believe that Benny Hinn actually did repent.

02:44

So here we go. So it's all about our brokenness, our old man, we call that the flesh, must be broken, must be out of the way.

02:56

And today, sadly, among a lot of circles, all you hear is how to build the flesh.

03:04

It's a feel good message. That's what you hear out there. It's all about feel good, do good, all that.

03:13

Make money, all the rest of it. And I'm sorry to say that prosperity has gone a little crazy.

03:21

And I'm correcting my own theology and you need to all know it because when

03:29

I read the Bible now, I don't see the Bible in the same eyes I saw the Bible 20 years ago. And Steve Strang from Charisma, whom we go back years, he actually, he was in my wedding.

03:40

People don't even know that Charisma Magazine began with my father -in -law. Charisma Magazine started with Roy Harlan and I married his daughter.

03:49

So Steve Strang was in my wedding. We go way back and he's already asked me, he said, are you ready to make it public?

03:57

I said, well, not totally because I don't want to hurt my friends or my love who believe things

04:02

I don't believe anymore. And I will tell you now something that is going to shock you. I think it's an offense to the

04:08

Lord. It's an offense to say, give a thousand dollars. I think it's an offense to the

04:14

Holy Spirit to place a price on the gospel. I'm done with it. I will never again ask you to give a thousand or whatever amounts because I think the

04:26

Holy Ghost is just fed up with it. Are you, did you hear me? I think that hurts the gospel.

04:35

So I'm making this statement for the first time in my life. And frankly, I don't care what people think about me anymore. So I had a guy, well,

04:46

I'll tell you who, it was Dan Willis. I love Dan with all my heart. I said, don't you dare preach that message again.

04:53

Just a few days ago. I said, no, no, I'm not going to hear it. I don't want to be a part of it. So when they invite me to telethons,

04:59

I think they will not like me anymore. Because if you look at the word of God, I don't want to get into it now.

05:09

Am I shocking you? Good. Let's have a high five on this one. If I hear one more time, break the back of debt with a thousand dollars,

05:18

I'm going to rebuke them. I think that's buying the gospel. That's buying the blessing.

05:25

That's grieving the Holy Spirit. That's about all I will say.

05:31

If you are not giving because you love Jesus, don't bother giving. I think giving has become such a gimmick.

05:39

It's making me sick to my stomach. And I've been sick for a while too. I just couldn't say it.

05:45

And now the lid is off. I've had it. You know why?

05:54

I don't want to get to heaven and be rebuked. No, I think it's time we say it like it is.

06:01

The gospel is not for sale. And the blessings of God are not for sale.

06:08

And miracles are not for sale. And prosperity is not for sale.

06:17

All right, so with that, that is the first of the two clips that we're going to play.

06:25

And there's a lot in here, Justin, that a lot of people are making a big deal about.

06:30

And a lot of people are saying that he genuinely repented. You don't believe he did?

06:39

No. No, not for a second do I believe he did. Not only do

06:45

I not believe that he did, I can conclusively prove that he has not repented.

06:53

There is just so much there to break down. For one thing, this is not the first time.

07:02

Remember, we only have one hour, Justin. Oh, yeah. I'm working on my own, as you know.

07:08

I'm working on my own video that will have a lot of video of Benny Hinn from 25 -28 years ago and some video from a few days ago that will conclusively prove he has not repented.

07:24

This is not the first time that Benny Hinn has done this. He has, quote -unquote, repented from the prosperity gospel four or five times.

07:33

Going back to the early 90s, after the very first major expose that was done on his ministry by Inside Edition, featuring a very young -looking, what's his name?

07:48

Bill O 'Reilly, very young -looking Bill O 'Reilly. They did an expose on Benny Hinn, and it was, and I'm not using profanity here, it was damning.

08:00

I mean, it really was for him. And he came out, and he made this big public apology.

08:07

In fact, I could play a short clip of that if you want to try to do that. Let's see, I don't know if I, let's see here.

08:15

You could just hit play, and we'll get the audio. Okay, we'll try this here. Okay, this is just one.

08:22

This is right after the very first big expose was done on him. Preachers who live in big homes and drive big cars ought to reexamine their calling.

08:34

So, there you go. Preachers who live in big homes and drive big cars ought to reexamine their calling.

08:45

Well, that was in the early 90s. So he said this before. He said it again about a year and a half ago, said that he had repented.

08:55

He's done this periodically throughout his ministry. But he always goes back to the same old thing, because that's where the money is.

09:04

He always goes back, like a dog returning to its vomit. He goes back to it, because that's where the money is, the bread and butter.

09:11

So this is nothing new. The second thing I would point out is that he says that he has believed this for some time now.

09:20

In fact, in an interview that he did with Charisma magazine that was put up just a couple of days ago as of this recording, he says that he has believed this now.

09:30

He's had this change of heart for the last two years. But he couldn't make it public, because he was afraid of offending friends of his who still believe prosperity theology.

09:44

Afraid of offending some of his friends? How about offending God? That's who he should be afraid of offending, the

09:53

Alpha and Omega, not his fellow fake faith healers.

10:00

So that right there tells you that this is not genuine. If he was truly repentant, he would be so eager to make this right by God that he would be out there in the forefront immediately upon discovering this new revelation for him that prosperity theology is not actually biblical.

10:21

But no, he was more afraid of offending his fellow prosperity preaching friends than he was about offending

10:26

God. And you can go through Benny Hinn's timeline right now.

10:32

Go to his Twitter feed right now. I've got video of Benny Hinn from just the past few days of his television program that he is telling people to sow a seed.

10:46

Sow a $120 seed. I mean, this was just from a couple of days ago. Okay, but hold on, hold on,

10:52

Justin, because I'll act as the devil's advocate. And in this case, I may actually be doing that.

10:58

We don't usually want to advocate for the devil, but in this case, maybe he is. I want to play a clip because he's given what may be an answer.

11:07

You pointed out publicly on your Twitter feed that he had that video out and he provided yet another video to explain that, which you have mentioned.

11:19

So let's share and listen to this. I know many of you have heard what

11:26

I said Monday night about what I stand on prosperity. Because of what the Lord Jesus is doing in my heart, which is very real.

11:36

And I did an interview yesterday with Steve Strang on his podcast that I think you will really enjoy listening to.

11:46

Somehow today, by mistake, one of my old tapes got on one of our social media platforms that we have corrected.

11:54

There are still some old teachings out there that I'm sure you'll probably watch or hear.

12:01

But I do not want you to believe that I have changed my stand on prosperity as I have declared

12:07

Monday night. Very clearly, that's been all over now. It's gone viral. But please, again, watch or listen to what

12:15

I did with Steve Strang yesterday on his podcast. I think you'll be blessed.

12:21

Bless you. Okay, so. And I believe he even took that video down.

12:28

So wouldn't we say that he has genuinely repented? And look, we even see the evidence of it.

12:36

The evidence being that he's not only repented, but he's taken the video down that you said he was asking for the $120 sowing of seeds.

12:49

Yeah, he did take that one down. Now, he makes it sound like this was video from 10, 15 years ago.

12:57

No, I mean, this was still pretty recent within at least within the last couple of years.

13:03

You can just tell by looking at him that he's considerably older. He pretty much looks the same in that video that he's talking about that he took down as he does today.

13:11

So this was not very long ago at all. But it wasn't just that program.

13:17

I mean, literally, his timeline is absolutely filled, filled with this teaching going back.

13:28

I mean, go back earlier this week, the week before, the week before that, all throughout

13:35

August, all throughout July, all throughout June. I mean, literally, it is it is chock full of this stuff.

13:44

So now if he was as serious about it as what he claims, he would be taking all of this stuff down.

13:51

I mean, my goodness, the guy has a media team like no other. I mean, he pays people to do this stuff for him.

13:58

It's still up there. Well, and to think about the fact that he said that this change occurred two years ago.

14:05

Yeah, that's what he says. So was he sinning against his own conscience then? Well, yeah,

14:12

I mean, that's that's one of the that's one of the questions, because literally, I mean, go back the last two years looking at his at his television programs.

14:20

And it's full of prosperity theology, absolutely full of it. So there's no he hasn't he hasn't changed.

14:31

Also, even in his confession, he he's being very disingenuous.

14:38

He's created a lot of problems for himself, actually, this confession, this repentance.

14:43

He says that in the last two years, let's just assume for the sake of sake of kicks and giggles here, that somehow in the last two years, his theology has changed on prosperity.

14:58

And despite the fact that his media timeline for the last two years is still full of the same prosperity theology.

15:05

But let's just say that somehow all of that's everything on his Twitter timeline and all is all of his television programs.

15:14

The last two years were somehow every single one of them recorded more than two years ago, just for kicks and giggles.

15:19

Let's say that here's a problem he's created for himself. A, he says that this is a new discovery because he has grown closer to the

15:31

Lord and he has now discovered this. Well, just by saying that he has immediately disqualified himself from being a

15:40

Bible teacher. So you're telling me, Benny Hinn, that you have been teaching prosperity theology for 40 years.

15:52

And you're just now discovering that it's unbiblical. This has been a staple of his teaching.

15:58

This is his bread and butter teaching. It is what he is known for. And so that for which he is known, he is now saying he's been wrong about for the last 40 years.

16:11

Then you're not qualified. You're not apt to teach. You're not able to teach sound doctrine, and you're certainly not able to refute those who contradict it.

16:20

So this major discovery has just been in the last couple of years when he's had four decades of teaching the opposite.

16:26

Well, the man obviously has a fundamental misunderstanding of how to read and interpret scripture. He's, we'll just say, biblically illiterate, and yet he's been teaching the

16:37

Bible for 40 years. Well, the argument that some are going to make, Justin, is who are you to question him?

16:44

What expertise do you have on Benny Hinn? What expertise do

16:51

I have? Yeah. Did you maybe write some small little paper on his ministry?

16:59

Yes, I did. I wrote my master's thesis on Benny Hinn for my master of theology at Southwestern Seminary.

17:08

I wrote my master's thesis on Benny Hinn. I have read most, if not all, of his books.

17:15

I have been to 17 different Benny Hinn crusades all over the country.

17:22

I've been in the trenches. I've talked to people. I know what goes on. I've been in there.

17:28

So, yeah, I mean, I'm pretty well versed on Benny Hinn.

17:34

I know how he does what he does. I know what he is told. I know things about Benny Hinn that I haven't even talked about publicly.

17:42

So would it be fair to say that you possibly know the Hinn family better than the Hinn family?

17:51

No, I wouldn't say that, no. Well, you know their teaching. You know the teaching that he does.

17:58

I know their teaching, yes. I know their teaching. I know how he does what he does. I know where these wheelchairs that just magically appear on the platform,

18:06

I know where they come from. I know how that works. I know how they screen people to get up on stage because I've tried to get up on stage myself as part of research, not because I wanted to be healed.

18:19

So, yeah, I mean, I know how he does what he does. So this is kind of, and I don't say this in any kind of arrogance, but this is my wheel well.

18:33

I've studied this stuff. Here's another problem. And this is a big one.

18:40

It may be one of the biggest ones. He's created another problem for himself, and that is this.

18:47

You can go back and you could literally, you could find thousands, thousands, tens of thousands of examples of Benny Hinn saying variations of the following.

19:04

God is speaking to me, and he is telling me that if you will sow seed into this ministry, you will reap a harvest.

19:13

Sow $120, sow $1 ,000, sow $770.

19:20

He comes up with all these different numbers based on different things all the time. Ooh, I feel an anointing here.

19:25

The anointing is so strong that I've never felt the anointing as strongly as I do right now. God is speaking to me, and whatever

19:32

God says, we act on it. He claims that God speaks to him all the time, and God has told him for 40 years, multiplied thousands upon thousands of times throughout the last 40 years,

19:52

God has told Benny Hinn to tell people if they will sow a seed, then they will reap a harvest.

20:00

Now, he says he disagrees with that. Oops, you've just outed yourself,

20:07

Benny Hinn, as a false prophet. You've just outed yourself as a false prophet.

20:13

And this was one of the first things that I wanted to talk with you about, because my thinking when

20:19

I look at this, he's claiming that what he's taught for 40 years is false, is false teaching.

20:26

But he wants you to believe him now. So all this time, he was close to the Lord, he was hearing it directly from the

20:32

Lord, and what I didn't hear him do is say, I was lying,

20:38

I was deceived. The issue I have with what he says is it wasn't specific, especially to himself, because if somebody was teaching something for 40 years, and they realized everything

20:52

I was teaching was a lie, I was saying it was coming from God. I was either deceived or I was lying, one or the other.

21:00

I don't hear that from him. He just says, I got a new revelation. Well, this is just a continuation of the same

21:06

I'm hearing from the Lord talk, but now it's contradicting what he used to hear from the

21:12

Lord. So it's like, okay, we have a contradiction, and yet he doesn't discredit what he's done for 40 years as being false teaching and him being a false teacher, but he's still saying it's coming from God.

21:28

The very same thing that we have issues with. He claims the spiritual authority so that no one can question it because it comes from God, but if the other message came from God, and this message comes from God, and they contradict each other, then obviously one of his messages, if not both, are not from the

21:47

Lord. Yeah, you can't have it both ways.

21:53

You can't have it both ways. So if you no longer agree with this theology, then

21:59

Benny Hinn, what you have just done is you have just admitted to the entire world that for the last 40 years you have not been hearing from God like you claim you have been.

22:09

What do we call people like that? People who say the Lord spoke to me when in fact the Lord did not speak to them.

22:16

What do we call people like that? The Bible calls them false prophets. I mean, he's painted himself into a corner.

22:25

Yeah. So here's some of the things I noticed with this. There's one point where he says, are you shocked?

22:33

I mean, the audience is clapping. This was my first indicator that the audience must be in on it because if you've been teaching something for 40 years, and this is the first time you're ever going to announce it, and you have people that have been believing this, and I mean, we say believing this, they've been putting money behind it for years.

22:58

And now you're going to say it was all wrong, and they're going to clap and say, you know, great, amen, give them a high five.

23:08

That's not the reaction that someone would have if they just were told everything they were taught was a sham.

23:15

They wouldn't be cheering. Yeah, no, no, they wouldn't. I don't know that the entire audience was in on it.

23:24

I don't think Benny Hinn, before that program, as he walked into a studio there in Elisa Viejo, California, that he, before the camera started rolling, he looked at the audience.

23:37

He said, okay, guys, now I'm about to completely change my theology. I want you to go along with me here. I don't think it was necessarily set up.

23:43

No, but I think there were probably enough people, just like when they do the staged healings and things like that,

23:51

I think there were some people that did know they were supposed to clap at this. Especially because he gives a high five to a guy that it's almost as if he knew the guy was standing there.

24:04

Yeah, but see, Benny Hinn is such a master manipulator of people. When you're there in the studio, the lights are on, the cameras are rolling, you know this is being recorded, and the quote unquote man of God walks up to you and gives you a high five.

24:21

If you're predisposed to this, if you believe Benny Hinn is a man of God, and you obviously do because you wouldn't be there in the first place if you didn't, then you're just naturally going to go along with it.

24:34

It's the same dynamic about how he gets people to fall over when he slays them in the spirit and all this stuff.

24:42

Well, have you seen his friend Dan Wilson? Has he come out and pulled support for Benny?

24:49

Because he was name by name. Has there been anything? Because one of the things you know better than I is that when

24:58

Benny Hinn's nephew, Kosti, got saved, the family didn't treat him so well.

25:06

We'll put it that way. Sort of cut him off and whatnot. Do we see

25:11

Benny Hinn's friends doing that yet? Maybe we need to give it more time. I don't see them calling him out and saying anything as if they may not be believing that this is real either.

25:28

Yeah, I don't know. It'll be interesting to see what people like Steve Muncy and Mike Murdock.

25:37

In fact, speaking of Mike Murdock, we just heard Benny Hinn on that clip say, if I hear break the back of debt with $1 ,000 seed again, if I hear that again,

25:49

I'm going to rebuke that person. He's talking about Mike Murdock. That's one of Mike Murdock's famous lines.

25:56

I broke the back of poverty with $1 ,000 seed. Mike Murdock was literally on Benny Hinn's program teaching that very thing very recently.

26:05

It's on his Twitter timeline within a year ago from right now.

26:12

When it was recorded, I'm not 100 % sure, but it's on his Twitter timeline right now. I just got through watching it a few minutes before we started recording this.

26:24

It's going to be interesting to see how some of Benny Hinn's friends react to this.

26:31

Benny Hinn has not repented. We'll see how long this lasts. I will say he has gone more in -depth in his confession this time than I've ever seen him do it before.

26:46

He's made overtures of confessing and repenting on this issue before, but this is the most in -depth

26:52

I've heard him go into it. It's not real repentance,

27:00

Andrew, because real repentance bears fruit. There is fruit in keeping with repentance.

27:07

What Benny Hinn, as you hinted at a minute ago, has not done, among other things that we'll talk about, he has not come forward and said,

27:16

I've been lying to you for four decades. I've been lying to you.

27:23

God has not spoken to me all these thousands of times that I told you he was.

27:30

I lied about that. Or at least say that he was deceived. Maybe he was deceived and he thought it was the

27:36

Lord. If he was deceived, this brings up a whole other issue because Benny Hinn is constantly claiming things.

27:45

He constantly gets words of knowledge. In his most recent healing crusade, in his most recent one, he's getting words of knowledge about people in the studio audience.

28:02

This is classic Benny Hinn. He'll point up to someone and he'll say, dear lady, dear lady up there, you have a problem in your shoulder.

28:11

And so God is giving him this information in real time. So he's doing this right now.

28:18

He's doing this right now. So if God can give him words of knowledge in real time about people in the studio audience, and God speaks to him all the time, how is it that God did not bother to say at some point in the last four decades,

28:39

Benny, what you're teaching isn't right. So we're to believe that God will give him words of knowledge about some lady's shoulder problem up in the 12th row in the studio audience.

28:52

And God will give him words of knowledge about this, about that. God just talks to him all the time, but has not apparently bothered or thought it necessary to give him a word of knowledge about apparently false teaching that he's been teaching for four decades.

29:10

How does that work? Well, and it's kind of interesting because we know that it's not a word of knowledge he's getting.

29:15

He's getting people handing, they go through a screening process. So he knows exactly where people are sitting and what they're wearing and different things like that.

29:25

So I think that the whole claim that they try to make is, oh, I'm seeing someone wearing a red shirt or whatever it is.

29:34

He already has that information. So that's what would make it, to me, be lying.

29:41

To me, that would make it lying, not deception. Yeah, I mean, he lies as easily as you and I breathe.

29:50

And that's not an exaggeration. I mean, he is the consummate liar. A lot of what these people do, whether it's

29:58

Benny Hinn or someone like him, some of these people that you see get up on stage are plants.

30:04

Some of them are. A lot of it, though, is just cold reading. And you can see psychics do this all the time.

30:14

Jonathan Edwards does it. Not the Puritan Jonathan Edwards, not our Jonathan Edwards, but the psychic

30:21

Jonathan Edwards. He does this all the time. He'll go up, you know, and it's cold readings.

30:28

Sylvia Brown used to do it. She's dead now. But these faith healers like Benny Hinn and others, they do the same thing these psychics do.

30:39

They just cloak it in a little bit of Christian lingo. So what

30:45

I want to ask you after this break is, he tried to do a secondary message to try to say that, hey, this is a real change in my heart.

30:55

I even corrected this problem. I think he immediately got called out, and he's doing even more damage control now.

31:03

I want to ask you when we get back, whether you think that secondary message that he did, basically trying to say that what we understood was not what was actually happening, do you think that that is legitimate?

31:17

So I want to talk about that right after this break. The Five Solas Podcast.

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Join us each episode to discuss the truths of these foundational rallying cries of the

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Solem. Deo. Gloria. The good news is, striving for eternity would love to come to your church to spend two days with your folks, teaching them biblical hermeneutics.

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That's right, the art and science of interpreting scripture. The bad news is, somebody attending might be really upset to discover

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to host a Bible Interpretation Made Easy seminar in your area. And that might be something that Benny Hinn could benefit from, a

33:03

Bible Interpretation Made Easy seminar in his area. Justin, he gave this video, this message on Facebook, where he said he had a real change of heart.

33:12

The change of heart is very real, he said. Are you not believing that he cleaned up his act enough?

33:22

Because I have my views on this, but I want to first see, do you think that that's not legitimate, not a real heart change?

33:31

No. No, it's not a heart change at all. And I can definitively prove that.

33:37

People say, oh, how do you know? You can't look into his heart. I can't look into his heart, but I can look into the

33:44

Bible. And I can look at what repentance looks like as defined by the

33:50

Bible. Repentance is not just saying, I was wrong. Repentance is not just saying, oops,

33:57

I made a mistake, I was wrong. Repentance bears fruit. John the

34:02

Baptist, Matthew chapter 3, therefore bear fruit in keeping with repentance. Acts chapter 19, the

34:10

Apostle Paul speaking to King Agrippa, he said, so King Agrippa, I kept declaring that all men everywhere should repent and turn to God performing deeds appropriate to repentance.

34:24

That doesn't mean we perform deeds in order to repent, but when God grants repentance, initial repentance unto salvation, which is what

34:31

Benny Hinn needs right now, it does result in deeds appropriate to repentance bearing good fruit.

34:43

In listening to the interview that Benny Hinn did with Stephen Strang, and by the way, this raises another problem, with Stephen Strang in Charisma Magazine.

34:53

Stephen Strang, the editor of Charisma Magazine, has known Benny Hinn by his own admission since the 1970s before Benny Hinn even got married.

35:02

Well, Stephen Strang knows Benny Hinn really well, knows what he's been doing for the last 40 years, and yet he's been friends with Benny Hinn through the entire 40 years of his deception and lies.

35:17

Doesn't speak very well, Stephen Strang, but anyway, back to the point, is that if Benny Hinn was truly repentant, then that would be bearing fruit.

35:30

Now remember, this isn't, according to Benny Hinn, something that he came to just yesterday.

35:36

He said his heart changed on this beginning two years ago simply by reading the

35:42

Bible. Well, maybe he should spend a little time reading Luke chapter 19 in his

35:50

Bible, Zacchaeus. Zacchaeus, tax collector, who had exploited all of the people under his purview.

36:01

When he was confronted by Christ, Christ met him, and he was broken.

36:07

He was given a godly sorrow per 2 Corinthians 7 over his sin. It resulted in bearing fruit.

36:14

And what did Zacchaeus say? Well, let's go to the text. Zacchaeus, Luke chapter 19.

36:21

He hurried, came down, received him, Christ gladly. When he saw it, they all began to grumble, saying he has gone to be the guest of a man who is a sinner.

36:29

Zacchaeus stopped and said to the Lord, Behold, Lord, half of my possessions

36:35

I will give to the poor. And if I have defrauded anyone of anything, I will give back four times as much.

36:44

That's what repentance looks like. Bears fruit. Zacchaeus said, half of what

36:50

I own, I'll give to the poor. And if I've defrauded anyone, I'll repay him four times as much as what

36:55

I stole from him. Now, I'm not unreasonable. It is not possible for Benny Hinn to repay the untold hundreds of thousands, indeed, millions of people he has defrauded over the last 40 years.

37:18

He couldn't do it if he wanted to. If he were to pay back four times as much all of the money that he's defrauded people for the last 40 years, he can pay down the national debt.

37:29

So it's not possible for Benny Hinn to do that. But what he could do, and what he should do, is if he's truly repentant, let's just say

37:41

Benny Hinn, let's say he's just now come to saving faith in Christ. If that is what's happened, then what he should be doing right now is confessing that he has lied to people for 40 years, confessing that he has lied about major events in his own life and ministry.

37:59

He should confess that all of the thousands and thousands of times that he claims

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God has spoken to him, God has, in fact, not spoken to him. He'll confess to that.

38:12

He'll confess that all of the people that he claims were healed up on his platform and all these miracle crusades that he's done for the last 40 years.

38:20

He would confess that none of these people were healed. He knows they weren't. He should confess that.

38:26

He should confess, I lied to you. I knew these people weren't healed. I said that they were.

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I lied to you. I told you that I checked up with their doctors. My team checked up with the doctors.

38:37

We don't ever do that. I lied about that too. So he should confess to all of these lies.

38:43

He should empty his ministry coffers, take every cent that his ministry has, every dime in the bank, every piece of property he has, sell that, give every cent of it to doctrinally sound ministries.

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He should join a doctrinally sound church, sit in the pew, submit himself to biblical teaching by biblically qualified elders, and sit there and learn for years and years and years.

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And I would say, in all likelihood, never preach again. Theoretically, theoretically, if he genuinely did get saved at some point, theoretically years and years down the road, maybe, maybe, but he would have to bear some real fruit in keeping with repentance.

39:42

He has deceived people, lied to people. He has, Andrew, Benny Hinn has cost people their lives.

39:50

He has told people that they were healed when he knew they weren't, told them that they were healed, told them that their sickness will never come back, told them not to listen to the doctors.

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And by the way, I've got video of him saying that to a pregnant woman, just from a year ago, just from one year ago, telling her, the doctors are wrong.

40:13

Don't listen to your doctor. People think he's hearing from God. They take his advice and they don't go to their doctor or they do stop taking their medicine because if they take their medicine, that's a sure sign that you lack faith.

40:26

And so in an effort to, not to betray any lack of faith, sick people stop taking their medicine and a lot of these people die.

40:37

And so Benny, you need to confess to all of this. Shut everything down. Shut your ministry down.

40:42

Empty your coffers and go work. Go work at Walmart.

40:48

Well, look, here'd be what I, and you went right to the text that I was thinking of going to, which is

40:54

Zacchaeus, because that's the one that I think everyone's bringing up because that's the clearest example. But let's take a real life example of what was the response when

41:08

Costi Hinn got saved. When Costi Hinn got saved and recognized everything he had been teaching was wrong, he repented.

41:16

What did he do? He confronted the false teaching, called it out, wrote a book on it, and it had the effect that his family wouldn't talk to him or upset with him, things like that.

41:30

Now we don't see, saying that people are not saved because of false teaching or saying what they're doing is false teaching.

41:44

And you brought this out earlier. He's worried about his friendships. Well, that's not what you see with Zacchaeus.

41:51

That's not what you see with Costi Hinn. That's not what you see with any believer. A genuine believer is concerned about what

41:56

God thinks first and foremost and what people think second. And so this is the big issue that I see with him is even though I think he's doing this video, you mentioned and I know for folks who are watching or listening,

42:11

Justin is going to be putting out a video this week giving a lot more evidence to support the arguments he's making.

42:17

So you hear Benny Hinn in his own words. But I find it hard to believe that this is genuine because A, as you said

42:28

Justin, this isn't the first time he's done it. He's done this in the past several times. I know you have some video clips that you're going to be able to provide for folks where he does that.

42:38

I kind of think that it seems, and I don't know his heart,

42:44

I don't know the motivations, but it seems like there's times in his ministry, if you want to call it that, that he feels the need to kind of repent, pretend to repent.

42:56

And this, I don't know, maybe it's because the FBI's been investigating him and there's some reason he thinks this will benefit him.

43:04

Maybe. But for anyone who's following Benny Hinn, if he goes back to teaching prosperity, then no matter what, either way, he's a false teacher.

43:20

I mean, that's the ultimate proof right there. And the fact that he's done this in the past several times, now this may be the most clear, but I still didn't see the specifics that I think someone that has genuine faith would do.

43:34

I mean, if someone has genuine repentance, they're going to be naming, I was wrong when I did this, I said this and this, this.

43:40

They wouldn't give the generalities that he did, even though he's more specific here. But the fact that he says this is of the

43:46

Lord, that this is everything that he taught was false. Now he's saying this is true.

43:52

When he goes back to teaching what he said was false, then we have no other choice but to conclude that he is a false teacher on one of them, because they're mutually exclusive.

44:03

I mean, is there any way out of it for him? No, no, there is no way out of it.

44:09

And I don't think Benny Hinn had the foresight or the biblical knowledge.

44:17

Ultimately, he doesn't have the regeneration that he needs to understand the corner that he has painted himself into.

44:26

Theologically, he has painted himself into quite the teeny, tiny corner here. And so, yeah, we'll know, not only will we know that if Benny Hinn goes back at some point later down the road, a year or two or whatever from now, if he goes back to preaching prosperity theology, we'll know that he hasn't repented.

44:47

No, if he preaches at all from this point forward, we know he hasn't repented.

44:53

If he preaches at all, if he ever gets behind the pulpit again, from this point forward, he should not be teaching anything, anything.

45:09

If he was truly repentant, he would be so overwhelmed by the burden of the weight of his sin, the gravity of what he has done for 40 years, not only exploiting poor and sick and desperate people for money, not only exploiting the widows for personal financial gain, not only giving sick people false hope, not only ripping the heart out.

45:40

Andrew, I've been to these things. I know what goes on at these crusades. I've talked to the people in the wheelchairs.

45:47

I've talked to the people on the stretchers. Literally, I've seen stretchers at these crusades before.

45:53

I've talked to the people lying on the floor on a blanket so sick with cancer they can't even lift their heads.

46:00

I've seen these people. I've talked to them. I've talked to the poor mother in Oklahoma City that Benny Hinn did a crusade.

46:08

She was there with her little boy. I can't remember the name of the condition right now, but her boy was born with only a brain stem, just a stem, just enough to keep his heart beating and his lungs breathing.

46:26

I've talked to her. I've talked to people like this. They're so desperate. This poor mother is so desperate for her little boy to be healed.

46:34

She gave Benny Hinn money. He has no idea what he's done to people.

46:39

He has no idea how many thousands, if not millions of lives he has wrecked.

46:47

That's not the worst of it. That's not the worst of it. The worst of it is the injury that he has done to the gospel of Jesus Christ for 40 years.

46:58

He has spread this theological poison all around the world.

47:06

He has brought reproach on the name of Christ. If he was truly repentant, this man would be honestly brought to his knees under the weight of what he has done for four decades.

47:20

The furthest thing from his mind at this point, the furthest thing from his mind would be picking up a copy of God's Word and preaching from it.

47:31

He's in no place to preach. If he was truly repentant, he would know that.

47:38

One thing I want folks to hear is the compassion you have. I know a lot of his supporters think that you just hate

47:44

Benny Hinn. You're just a hater. One of the arguments

47:49

I'm sure that many make is that you're just upset because you don't have enough faith to be healed.

47:55

Because you have cerebral palsy, for people who don't know. The argument would be, you just didn't have enough faith.

48:01

You're upset with him when really it's your faith that was lacking. I hope that people are listening because what you just said has nothing to do with being upset with Benny Hinn because of anything that's personal.

48:16

You're upset with Benny Hinn as I am and many others are because he's teaching a falsehood that's damning people to hell and he's doing it in the name of Christ.

48:29

Then, that's in the spiritual realm and has an eternal consequence. But in this physical realm, he's living high off the hog on the last two pennies that people can rub together and taking people who are desperate, wanting to cling to any kind of hope and he uses that and this is the thing.

48:51

Here are these people, they want to cling to any kind of hope they can and that is what he ends up using to build a living off of.

49:00

To get them to say, I just want anything. I'll give you that little bit of hope. It's a complete charade.

49:07

It's a fake hope. It's a false hope but I'm going to give it to you so you'll give me money and I could drive my fancy cars and I could do anything.

49:21

I want folks to realize this has nothing to do with a dislike for Benny Hinn. I don't know him but I look at the teaching and the teaching that he teaches is damnable.

49:33

It leads people to hell. That's the concern that both

49:38

Justin and I would have and I know that you're going to do a video going into a lot more detail with this and we'll provide the link to that in the show notes and if you can't find it just look in the show notes.

49:51

If this airs before the video comes out I will update the show notes just so folks know.

49:57

But in the couple minutes we have left Justin, why is it you think that this, well let me ask this and this is hypothetical maybe you won't have an answer.

50:09

Is there a reason you think he might be doing this if he's not being genuine? In the interview with Stephen Strang, Charisma, he says

50:24

I'm not doing this because of my critics. He even says I'm not doing it because of my nephew. I don't believe that.

50:29

I believe that the interviews that Kosti has done, the two books now that he has written,

50:36

Kosti has been very vocal. I mean he's been on CNN talking about this.

50:42

It's brought a lot of pressure on Benny Hinn. This is your flesh and blood.

50:51

It used to work for you and so I don't believe for a second that Kosti's genuine conversion has not had a huge impact on him but unfortunately at this point it has not changed his heart.

51:08

So he is absolutely doing it because of this. Now I'll close with this Andrew. You're right,

51:13

I don't hate Benny Hinn. People ask me all the time does Benny Hinn know he's a fake?

51:19

Yes, he does. Or is he deceived himself? Yes, he is. Second Timothy chapter 3 verse 13.

51:28

Paul talks about men who are deceiving and being deceived. Both of those dynamics can be at work in the same person.

51:36

Benny Hinn I think perfectly fits that. He is deceiving, actively deceiving people and yet he is being deceived himself.

51:45

So I would love nothing more I honestly would love nothing more than to see genuine fruit in keeping with genuine repentance from Benny Hinn.

51:56

I would love that. I would love it. I don't want Benny Hinn to go to hell. I don't want him to go to hell at all.

52:04

Kosti doesn't want him to go to hell. Kosti loves his nephew and I don't love

52:10

Benny Hinn like Kosti does but I can say I don't want the man to go to hell.

52:18

I want him to come to genuine saving faith in Christ. But from what

52:25

I've seen from what I've heard just two days ago in the charisma interview or yesterday I guess it was that hasn't happened yet.

52:33

Well don't you think if he genuinely repented the first person he would have gone to is

52:40

Kosti Hinn his nephew? If I were he yeah that's who

52:46

I would go to. To me that seems like the clearest proof that he's not genuine in this because if his nephew has repented of the very same thing he's claiming he's repenting of and has already gone down this path and he has come to the same conclusion the first one that someone will go to would be someone like that a family member who's already gone down this path and say you are right especially when the person has written two books on this subject.

53:25

So the fact that he hasn't at least that we know of you may know more than I but as far as I know of neither of them have claimed that they've spoken to each other about this issue.

53:41

Go ahead. I was going to say that to me is the real proof that he's not repentant.

53:50

Yeah and I don't know for sure if he has or hasn't. Kosti and I are supposed to talk sometime in the next couple days tomorrow or Monday I guess but I haven't talked to him yet so I don't know 100%.

54:04

So we'll see. But that interview that he did with Charisma Stephen Strang just yesterday to me that sealed the deal.

54:16

That told me he is not genuinely repentant. He may have some level of regret.

54:25

He may have a guilty conscience. He probably does. But a guilty conscience is not repentance.

54:31

Guilty conscience is not a changed heart. Judas had a guilty conscience.

54:39

And he killed himself. He killed himself. That's right. Yeah. So we have a couple minutes left and we have something that you and I want to talk about after this with folks.

54:53

But here's the last question that I had for you is how should people who follow

54:59

Benny Hinn respond now? Now that he's come out with this what should their reaction be?

55:10

I would hope they would feel betrayed. I would hope they would feel like what's going on?

55:16

I've been listening to this guy for umpteen years and now he's telling me that staple of his teaching he was wrong about.

55:24

Maybe I should find somebody who actually knows what they believe and why they believe it. So, yeah, it'll be interesting to see what the fallout is.

55:35

I don't know. But again, with most of Benny Hinn's followers, you have to make the assumption and I'm not being judgmental when

55:44

I'm saying this that all of Benny Hinn's followers 100 % of them are either very immature

55:56

Christians or they're unregenerate themselves. They cannot be mature believers and I will say definitively that Benny Hinn has zero mature believers who listen to him on a regular basis and believe he's a sound teacher.

56:14

Because if you are an immature believer by definition you wouldn't be following Benny Hinn. So, so they're either false converts unregenerate themselves or they are immature believers and for those who are immature believers who have been listening to Benny Hinn it is genuinely my my prayer that this would be a wake -up call to them that they would they would leave

56:39

Word of Faith New Apostolic Reformation IHOP NAR all this stuff leave it and turn to some doctrinally sound teachers some biblically qualified men who who actually are able to teach sound doctrine and refute those who contradict and start growing in the grace and knowledge of the

56:58

Lord Jesus Christ. And that would be our prayer for his followers for him. We don't you mentioned it already we don't want to see

57:06

Benny Hinn die without Christ. We want to see him repent and come to genuine faith like his nephew.

57:12

And I just think I mean what could happen if God did a work on Benny Hinn's life that he genuinely came to faith that would be that would have a ripple effect if he came out the way

57:24

Costi did and started to name names and to expose things from the inside I mean from the very very top that that would really be able to expose things so that the gospel can go forth.

57:38

So yeah we we pray for that. So but let us close out with the couple of minutes that we have left

57:45

Justin because you and I have something special going on in about a year and a half.

57:50

We plan ahead don't we? Yeah I'm not sure I've ever planned anything out a year and a half before so I'd say yeah.

57:58

I like to plan ahead. It's enough to plan that far ahead. You and I are going to be going to Israel in March of 2021 along with Pastor Frank Mullis and Dr.

58:12

Anthony Svestra the four of us will be doing the devotions 13 days going to a lot of lot a lot of sites in Israel and so this is kind of one of these things that for some people it's a once in a lifetime opportunity.

58:28

Now you've been to Israel you're going to be returning in 2020. I've been to Israel but it was a long time ago

58:35

I was 16 years old so I'm not going to say how long ago because someone's going to do the math. Let's say it was a little bit more than 10 years.

58:42

We'll just leave it at that and let people guess but Israel 35 years ago?

58:49

Yeah That's a pretty good guess but I do the math.

58:56

Yeah So we're going to be having one more week so September 7th or up to I think

59:20

September 14th you can get $100 off if you register and put a down payment now.

59:29

Now you say $100 is not a whole lot when it costs like $5100. Well what do you get for that?

59:35

What you're getting is by Israeli law you have to have an Israeli guide and you have to pay them what they charge.

59:43

So we have an Israeli guide, an Israeli bus, bus driver, all those things have to be there.

59:48

It includes your hotel stays, it includes basically everything but lunch is covered including the flight from JFK New York.

01:00:00

Now if you're not in JFK there's a discount you get and you meet us in Tel Aviv. So if you want to do that I think you get $1000 off to cover the flight.

01:00:10

But that is something that this is a once in a lifetime opportunity for many people to be able to do.

01:00:16

Now the reason we've booked it out so far is so you have time to save. And so if you want to come with us there are as far as we know right now we are limited to 55 slots and that includes the guide.

01:00:31

So that's not a lot. We're probably going to fill that quickly. So I want to encourage you to go to a website to get all the details.

01:00:39

There's a lot of details there and to be able to sign up. It is 2021 because that's the year that we're going to go.

01:00:48

2021 Israel trip .com. That's 2021 Israel trip .com.

01:00:54

If you go there you can get all the details. You can register.

01:01:00

There's a form you fill out. I filled it out and you put everything in so you can put your down payment.

01:01:06

If you do put the down payment it's $500 down. You don't have to pay it all right now. If you pay it now and something happens you can't make it you get most of that back.

01:01:21

My encouragement to you is save your spot.

01:01:26

There's going to be a lot of people. My encouragement is go to 2021

01:01:35

Israel trip .com so you can join Justin, Dr.

01:01:41

Silvestro, Pastor Mullis and myself. Striving Fraternity is putting this together. We're excited to be able to take people to go to the very places that we read in scripture and see the very place where some of these things happen.

01:01:57

We're going to go to the very mount where Christ preached the sermon on the mount. It's going to be a neat experience to be there.

01:02:07

I've been on that mount. I've sat there and thought about that sermon. We're going to read through that sermon.

01:02:14

Justin, you've been to Israel recently. How do you think that has impacted you and others, especially when we come to reading the scriptures?

01:02:27

I've always heard from people, oh, you've got to go to Israel. It will change how you read the

01:02:33

Bible. I'm not sure it's changed the way

01:02:38

I read it. It hasn't changed my hermeneutics or anything. I tell you what, Andrew, it for certain brings things alive.

01:02:48

It is a surreal experience to go and be where David fought

01:02:57

Goliath, to go to the pool of Bethesda, to go to the pool of Siloam, to go to Capernaum, to go to all these places that you read about in the

01:03:14

New Testament. As I went to these different places, I'm replaying everything in my mind.

01:03:21

I'm opening up my Bible and I'm like, wow, this happened right here.

01:03:26

You can see it. You can touch it. It really is. It does bring things to life, if you will.

01:03:37

Now, when I go and I read the New Testament, I read about Jesus healing at the pool of Bethesda, I think, man,

01:03:44

I've seen that. I know where he did it. I know what it looks like. It's a surreal experience.

01:03:52

It really is. I would strongly, strongly encourage people, if you're able to do it, do it.

01:03:59

You won't regret it, I promise you that. It exceeded my expectations, so I'm eager to get back there.

01:04:06

I'm looking forward to it. Lord willing, as long as the Lord gives me another year and a half of life, assuming the rapture doesn't happen between now and then,

01:04:16

I look forward to going. But if the rapture happens, I'm perfectly fine with going there first.

01:04:24

I'll wait for the New Jerusalem. That's okay with me. Yeah, the new one will be even better.

01:04:31

So folks, go to 2021israeltrip .com. Get all the details.

01:04:37

Please come and join us. It is going to be a really great experience, we hope, for everybody.

01:04:45

It is going to fill up, so don't think, oh, I have plenty of time, because a lot of people are going to think that's a lot of time.

01:04:51

They have time to think about it. You don't know what's going to happen in a year and a half. We gave a year and a half, so you have a lot of time to save for it, but you need to reserve your spot early.

01:05:02

So go to 2021israeltrip .com, and there you're going to get all the details.

01:05:09

So with that, Justin, I want to thank you for coming on. We're going to look forward to this video that you're going to be putting out soon and exposing everything that we've talked about in much more detail.

01:05:22

I'm looking forward to that. I know that there will be a lot of people that will be blessed by that. So I appreciate you coming on and helping us because you really are an expert in this area and you know the

01:05:34

Benny Hinn very, very well, and we all learn and gleam from that knowledge when you speak, and I hope that folks see that you don't speak from a hatred for Benny Hinn, you speak from a heart of compassion for where he's going to spend eternity.

01:05:49

Yeah, I do hate what he's done. I hate what he's done. I hate his ministry, but I don't hate him, and I do pray that the

01:06:01

Lord would be gracious and grant him repentance unto salvation. And we thank you for coming on,

01:06:09

Justin, and until next week, remember to strive to make today an eternal day for the glory of God.

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This podcast is part of the Striving for Eternity ministry. For more content or to request a speaker or seminar to your church, go to strivingforeternity .org.

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