A SUMMARY OF AMILLENNIALISM

The Apologetic Dog

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Okay, tonight, I'm glad that Pastor Nathan and Pastor Jeremiah has allowed me this opportunity to teach a lesson on Amillennialism.

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So if you will, we'll go to the Lord in prayer before getting started. Heavenly Father, I thank you for this time and opportunity to dig in your word and just give a brief overview of what

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I like to call is Reformed Amillennialism. So Father, let's not be edifying to those here tonight to hear your word

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And I want to look further into these things in this particular view on Reformed Amillennialism.

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Father, in Jesus name we pray. Amen. All right. Tonight we are going to be discussing the eschatological view known as Reformed Amillennialism.

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There are different ways in which we will look at this view tonight, but it will not be an exhaustive study.

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I just want you to be equipped with the basics so that you can further your studies after tonight.

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I want to look at one particular verse tonight. It's Revelation 1 10.

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John states that I was in the Spirit on the Lord's day. This is important because it's to bring about an understanding that John is talking merely symbolic here.

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Imagery is going to be given and this should not be taken absolutely literal.

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There's a handout that everybody has. The first part of it there that I want to highlight is a statement of faith, faith and doctrine.

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Regarding eschatology, we apply the dictum in essentials, unity, in non -essentials, liberty, in all things, charity.

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We believe that this doctrine regards personal eschatology, the coming of Christ and the eternal state are clearly expressed in scriptures and therefore essential.

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Yet we hold that the fulfillment of God's promises to Israel and the nature of the

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Millennium are less clear and are therefore non -essentials. So therefore various corporate eschatological views are free to be discussed and taught side by side as long as we maintain unity and love is preeminent.

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When Pastor Jeremiah gave his brief overview of the three views, he pointed out three essential points in eschatology.

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I will add a fourth one. The first three are the second coming of Christ bodily.

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We see that in Acts 1 11, the resurrection of the dead. We see that in Daniel 12 2 and John 5 28 and 29.

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Eternal life, John 3 16, John 17 12. The fourth one

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I wanted to put in there is final judgment and as Pastor Jeremiah says with the other three it's kind of implied, but I just wanted to be more precise and hold that final judgment, which is

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Matthew 12 36 and 37 and John 16. The non -essential points in eschatology the two are still the fulfillment of God's promises to Israel and the nature of the

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Millennium. A few things

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I want to talk about in the lesson. First, I'm going to talk a little bit about the history of our millennialism.

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In this part, we will look at some of the theologians who held this view, the word itself, and what does it mean.

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Secondly, I'm going to talk about the two age model. When we get there you can look at the chart to help you visualize and apply this point of view.

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The already and not yet is better understood in the paradigm in this paradigm taught in Scripture.

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The third thing is just a brief touch on recapitulation. The fourth thing

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I'm going to go over is the text of Revelation 20. There's a few things there that the topics

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I want to go over to help you better understand what's going on. Moving on.

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Therefore, there are three parts of history that I'm going to share with y 'all tonight. The first use of the word, the meaning of the word

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Amillennial, and the use of the principles being applied and those who've held this view with some nuances within this view.

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If you want, you could take notes or I can just give you a copy of this lesson once tonight's over with.

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I will be more than happy to to make that happen for you. As we press forward, the first part of the section is this is directly from the heidelblog .net,

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a brief note on the history of Amillennialism. The first use of the word, the term

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Amillennial, is probably about a century old. Remarkably, it is not widely used as to merit an entry into the

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Oxford English Dictionary. The exact origin of the word is not known.

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In an article by Kim Ritterbarger, it says he cites that Albertus Petyrs was the source of the term.

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Others cite Dutchman Statesman and theologian Abraham Kuyper as being the one that brought this word about.

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A search of Google Books show no clear instances between 1850 and 1900.

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There are a few instances in 1900 -1930. A guy named

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W. H. Rutgers used the term in his volume Premillennialism in 1930 and Louis Burkoff used it in his

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Reform Dogmatics, later Systematic Theology, in early 1930s.

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But it does not appear to have them become widely used until after World War II in 1957.

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In that time, it was apparently sufficiently well known that a editor of Christianity Today felt comfortable using the term without explaining it.

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So it is unclear to exactly when or who started the use of the word millennial, but it is a word nonetheless.

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I looked and there is just not a whole lot to say about the first use of the word which is known as etymology, but I think it's very important to include the parts that I'm highlighted tonight so that you can further your individual studies.

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God has given us teachers that we can look to and test and compare to scripture and be edified by their works.

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Second thing is the meaning of all millennial. Normally some would try to qualify since the

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A or R is in front of the word millennial, it negates an actual millennium indicating that the proponents of this position believe that there will be no millennial reign.

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This is not an accurate understanding or meaning of the term all -millennial. It is best defined as present or realized millennium indicating that we are currently in the millennial reign of Christ.

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Here is a more detailed meaning of the word all -millennialism. This is a direct quote from the

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Dictionary of Hermeneutics Concise Guide to Terms, Names, Methods, and Expressions by James D.

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Hernando. I would personally recommend this book as a study tool to help you in your biblical studies.

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As Brian would say, Brian AG, I love this guy. Every time a new word comes up, he kind of says we're doing the reformed dance.

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We're making up words. Thank you, Brian, for his diligence to want to look into these things.

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The meaning according to this hermeneutic is the belief that the thousand -year reign of Christ between the two comings is not to be understood literally, but instead this reference to a millennium is understood symbolically as the reign of Christ in heaven during the

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Church Age. Christ's second coming is understood to occur at the end of history.

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Most often, the first being commonly seen as referring to the new birth, this view is contrasted with premillennialism, which understands a thousand -year earthly reign of Christ to be literal and prior to the revelation of Christ at his second coming.

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Amillennialism shows similarities with postmillennialism by rejecting the millennium as the literal thousand -year reign of Christ on earth.

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Now to the third point of the history of amillennialism. In point of fact, it is the amillennial position that can be seen as the reformed position on eschatology.

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I see the methodology we use for this position being taught by Paul and Jesus I will explain more on that when we get to the part in the lesson on methods.

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We can even look at the confessions like the Heidelberg Catechism. The larger and shorter

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Westminster Confession of Faith catechisms also reflect credos and what we believe there to be seen an eschatological view towards the amillennial position in these creeds.

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It is the position held by the majority of the reformers as it was systematized in the 4th century by Augustine and was carried and this carried the amillennial view as the dominant view of medieval and Reformation periods.

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Although this teaching has been reforming from the start to the present as we will see shortly in some of the differences in methodologies within this view.

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As we see the Protestant reformer Martin Luther who 9 to 95 thesis statement in protest protest on the cathedral door at Wittenberg, Germany in the beginning of the 16th century.

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Then we have John Calvin in the mid 16th century who held this view and William Ames who is an

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English Puritan in the late 16th early 17th century. Then from the 20th and 21st centuries we see reformers like Gerhardus Voss, which we will be looking at a chart that he presented for us to kind of look at and we'll look at that later in the lesson.

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Along with reformers like John Frame, Anthony Hokema, R .C. Sproul and Matt Slick of Karam Apologetics Research Ministry.

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There are many articles there and I highly recommend if you want to further your studies like Matt Slick says he don't mind to do your homework for you.

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So get on there and there's all kind of doctrinal statements and issues that he's already worked out.

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Now on the handout here are a couple of methods that can be seen to be used in this view.

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My personal favorite is progressive recapitulation parallelism.

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That's a pretty big word to say well in this view it is it's it's an idea that the series of visions in Revelation described the course of history between the first and second comings of Jesus Christ.

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Each from a different prophetic perspective although these visions intensify before the time of the end.

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The second method is using the the

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New Testament data as the determinative category by which the Old Testament and future eschatology is to be interpreted.

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In this method the book of Revelation is the God -given interpretation of the book of Daniel.

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There are some other ways of looking at different texts within the framework of our Millennial view but it's not my intent here tonight to shed light on all the methodologies but to help you see what eschatology it is important to carry a loose grip on the non -essentials like this.

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Now we are going to look at the two -age view. You can look at the chart if you want.

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We'll get to the verses here momentarily. This is the framework that will help you understand and see the amillennial view.

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As I press forward do not be discouraged if I or offended by if I say that Paul taught this or that Jesus himself taught this view of eschatology.

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You'll see that much more clearly, but like I said like I'm going to say other views can say that same qualifier to some extent that Jesus did this or Paul taught this but it'll become more clear as we move further into the lesson.

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Looking at the biblical writers we see that they understood the course in the future climax of human history as the progressive unfolding of two successive eschatological ages known as this age and the age to come.

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The two ages have a strong bearing on whether or not there will be an earthly millennium.

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These two ages provide a major interpretive category for eschatology in general and the millennial question in particular.

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The case for amillennialism grows directly out of our understanding of these two eschatological ages.

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Throughout the New Testament this age refers to the present course of human history while the age to come refers to the age of redemption realized at the coming of Jesus Christ, his bodily resurrection, and his exaltation.

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The period of time between the first and second advents of Jesus Christ, the time between the establishments of Christ's kingdom as described in the

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Gospels and the consummation of all things is the same period described in Revelation 20 as a thousand years.

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This means that the so -called millennium is the present reality and not a future hope.

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The events depicted in Revelation 20 refer not to future but the present.

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The thousand years is the same period of time in which the citizens of this age await the age to come.

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I'm going to go over a few verses that kind of point to the coming of the kingdom of God here on earth.

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But if I expel demons by the Spirit of God, then the kingdom of God has come upon you,

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Matthew 12 28. Being asked by the Pharisees when the kingdom of God would come, he answered them, the kingdom of God is not coming in ways that can be observed nor will they say look here it is or there or behold the kingdom of God is in your midst.

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That's Luke 17 20 and 21. For the kingdom of God is not a matter of eating or drinking but of righteousness and peace and joy in the

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Holy Spirit. That's Romans 14 17. In him you also who when you heard the word of truth the gospel of your salvation and believed in him were sealed with the

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Holy promised Holy Spirit who is a guarantee of our inheritance until we acquire possession of it to the praise of his glory and that's

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Ephesians 1 13 14. I just shared with y 'all a few verses about the kingdom of God and what that looks like briefly.

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I'm going to give a few fuller picture of how I understand the kingdom of God being a present -day reality.

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Bear with me here. Throughout the book of Revelation the throne of Christ and his people are invariably said to be in heaven and we see that in Revelation 1 4 3 21 and 4 2 etc.

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This is a heavenly scene not an earthly one. There can be no or little doubt that the portrayal of being sitting on thrones is not intended to express the literal idea of people sitting on actual pieces of furniture or ruling from there.

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However, it is a figurative way of saying that they are reigning over a kingdom. Who are these people reigning over this kingdom?

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John tells us in Revelation 20 that those who reign while Satan is bound are those who did not worship the beast or it's his image in verse 12

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Revelation verse 4. This is most likely includes those who were cured because of the

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Word of God and the testimony they had maintained. We see that in Revelation 6 9 as well as well as those who died of natural causes

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Revelation 14 13. They have been given authority to judge John said which conveys the idea of God's people joining in the heavenly court where they are thousands upon thousands of angels who attend the ancient of days waiting for the books to be opened as we look in Daniel 7 9 through 10.

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According to Daniel the beast was waging war against the Saints and was defeating them until the ancient of days came and pronounced judgment in favor of the

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Saints of the Most High and the same at at the time came when the they possessed the kingdom as we see in Daniel 7 21 and 22.

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From this it is clear that when Satan is bound the Saints not only possess the kingdom which is cross but judgment is passed on their enemy on their behalf.

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The reign of the Saints depicted in Revelation 24 through 6 therefore fulfills the prophecy of Daniel 7 and of the thousand -year duration.

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We are given the present -day reality of the kingdom of God and who is reigning with Christ as we looked at verses that were clear on the topic.

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The age to come in is the already a present reality for believers in Christ.

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This tension between the already and not yet characterizes much of the

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New Testament eschatology as Christians await the final consummation of Christ's present kingdom on the great glorious day of our

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Lord Jesus Christ bodily return mind you. As we will see both Paul and Jesus repeatedly spoke of this age and the age to come.

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As we look to the handout the two age chart model by Gerhardus Voss that I spoke of earlier.

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We will go through several scriptures to give support of this view. It will help you visualize the

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Millennial position. In this age we got

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Matthew 12 32 there is no forgiveness for blasphemy of the Holy Spirit.

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The end of the age will be preceded by signs Matthew 12, I mean 24 3.

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Christ will be with us until the end of the age Matthew 28 20. The present age is an age of homes fields and families mark 1030.

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Material rewards are given to us in this life Luke 18 30.

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The people of this age marry and are given in marriage Luke 20 34.

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We are not to be conformed to the pattern of this world though the Greek word there is aeon which is age and that's

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Romans 12 2. Philosophy is the wisdom of this age in 1st

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Corinthians 1 20. Paul goes on to say 1st Corinthians 2 6 and through 8.

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Wisdom and rulers of this age that Paul keeps on contrasting as well as Jesus with this age being material temporal things.

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2nd Corinthians 4 4 Satan the God of this age blinds people's minds to the truth.

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That's not an exhaustive list of this age. There's plenty more, but now we're going to go to the age to come.

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Same verse start off Matthew 12 32. There is no forgiveness for blasphemy of the

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Holy Spirit in the age to come neither this age

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Jesus made that contrast that that's one of the unforgivable sins that there's no pardon.

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Matthew 13 40 the weeds will be thrown into the fire. We see that judgment coming

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Mark 10 30 and Luke 18 30 eternal life is a reward to those who believe in Christ by faith alone.

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It's an already reality for his children. There will be no marriages or given in marriage

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Luke 20 35. Evildoers will not inherit the kingdom of God 1st

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Corinthians 6 9 through 10. Those who live evil lives will not inherit the kingdom.

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Galatians 5 21 Christ will reign in the age to come Ephesians 1 21.

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Immoral people will not inherit the kingdom of God. Ephesians 5 5 we can just kind of go on and on about the age to come.

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This is a reality that Christ is going to bring about that the age to come.

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It's beneficial for Christians, but for unbelievers it wouldn't be a side

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I'd want to be on. These texts make it clear that the Lord taught this two age models successive and qualitatively distinct ages.

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This age Jesus said is characterized by marriage and things temporal or temporary as Keith would have me say.

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This age the age to come on the other hand is characterized by resurrection life and immortality.

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So it is impossible that the natural earthly life will continue after the general resurrection that will occur at the

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Lord's return as we see in John 6 39 40 44 and 54 as he points out that Christ will raise up on the last day those given to him by the

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Father. So also the harvest of wheat is the end of the age as the harvesters are angels as the weeds are pulled up and burned in the fire.

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So it is also will be at the end of the age. We see this in Matthew 13 39 to 40 pardon me.

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The impact of this two -age eschatological framework on the question of millennium becomes apparent when we examine how this these terms are used throughout the

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New Testament. Wherever the term this age is used it will always be in reference to temporary things or temporal things destined to perish.

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In the age to come those who partake in the first resurrection as we will see in Revelation 20 verse 6 are not characterized by temporal but eternal.

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This brings me to the theological term known as the already and not yet.

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Sure other views can assert and hold this method in a loose sense of its meaning but in the all -millennial view with the two -age framework we can properly understand this term already and not yet.

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The already refers to the eternal blessings of the age to come which are realized in the present while the not yet refers to the blessings of the age to come to be realized in the consummation at the

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Lord's second coming. What does the already look like? While we see in Romans 5 1 since we have been justified by faith this is a present tense reality known as the already.

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Paul tells us in 2nd Timothy 2 4 through 8 2 4 verse 8 that there is a laid up a crown of righteousness which the

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Lord the righteous judge will reward to me on that day and not to me only but also to all who have loved his appearance.

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This as we see is a longing for the bodily return of our Lord Jesus Christ as he

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Paul continues to say in Philippians 3 20 that our citizenship is in heaven and from it we await a

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Savior the Lord Jesus Christ who will transform our lowly bodies by the power that enables him even to subject all things to himself.

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This is known as the not yet. Now we are going to look at just briefly recapitulation.

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When reading the historical narrative you start at the beginning and read through the narrative until you come to the end.

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Well, Revelation is not a narratival book. It's an apocalyptic book known as Apocalyptic as Jeremiah would say that Revelation contains a series of visions each of which functions like a different camera angle getting a different view of the same event.

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Therefore in order the order in which the different visions in Revelation are recounted by John does not necessarily reflect the order of historical occurrence of those reality in which those visions symbolize.

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This is known as recapitulation in which some basic pattern is repeated in a variety of different formulations.

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Put simply they are arranged topically and not chronologically as an example of this a careful study of chapter 20 will reveal that this chapter describes a period which is synchronous with that of chapter 12.

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This can be demonstrated by simply comparing Revelation 12 7 through 11 with Revelation 20 verses 1 through 6 and I will do that briefly if y 'all will turn to y 'all's chapter on that that I have paralleled beside each other.

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Revelation 12 7 through 11 in comparison with Revelation 21 through 6.

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The first scene we're looking at a heavenly scene verse 7 in chapter 12 with verse 1 in chapter 20.

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The second set of verses is 7 and 8 in chapter 12, which is angelic battle against Satan and his host and the presupposed angelic battle with Satan in verse 2 of chapter 20.

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Chapter 12 Satan cast to the earth verse 9 Satan cast to the abyss in verse 3 in Revelation 20.

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The angels evil opponent called the great dragon that ancient called the devil or Satan who leads the whole world astray in verse 9 of chapter 12 then same reflective chapter 20 2 through 3 says the angel angels evil opponent called the dragon that ancient serpent who is the devil or Satan restrained from deceiving the nations anymore to be released later to deceive the nations in the four corners of the earth and that's in 7 verse 7 and 8.

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I don't want to kind of go through all of it The charts there before you to kind of show what we what we mean by when we say

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Recapitulation you're looking at two of the exact same offense when they're laid side -by -side

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You see the same thing going on just said Differently like it's got a different camera angle view and this is one of them that I wanted to highlight tonight

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This is not an exhaustive look at everything in the passage of Revelation 20

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I will however bring light to a few more topics on the passage as I already pointed out some of the references to the kingdom of God earlier as Revelation 24 through 6 is the fulfillment of Daniel 7

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The language of Revelation is highly symbolic According to one scholar

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John sees the angel coming down out of heaven He has a key with which he is going to lock the abyss

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Revelation 9 1 and 11 the abyss is a deep hole provided with a deep shaft with a shaft 9 1 with a lid

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This lid can be unlocked in 9 2 Locked in 20 verse 3 and even sealed in chapter 20 verse 3

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Bear in mind that this is all symbolism There are good reasons not to take

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John's references to a thousand years literally for one thing Numbers are always used symbolically throughout the book of Revelation In addition the immediate context and figurative nature of many words used by John such as chain abyss serpent beast and so on Should remind us that numbers are also symbolic of something else

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What is the binding of Satan What this binding of Satan means is that the coming after the coming of the long expected

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Messiah Satan lost certain authority which he possessed prior to the last death burial resurrection and ascension of the

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Savior The first place to look for help in interpreting the meaning of the binding of Satan is earlier in the passages within the book of Revelation itself as We see in Revelation 9 the abyss is symbolic of death and Hades GK bill points out that the abyss is one of the various metaphors representing the spiritual sphere in which the devil and his accomplices operate

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Revelation 9 1 through 11 portrays an angelic being probably the devil

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Using the key of the shaft of the abyss opening the abyss and releasing demon demonic creatures so that they can torment unbelievers on earth if Christ takes authority over this realm through his own death and resurrection as Was stated in Revelation 1 18 then the binding of Satan is a direct result of Christ's resurrection

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Although Satan is bound during these this present age This does not mean that he ceases to be the god of this age

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Who blinds the minds of unbelievers? 2nd Corinthians 4 4 he is the ruler of the age of the air

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Ephesians 2 2 and the one who prowls around like a roaring lion looking for someone to devour devour 1st

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Peter 5 8 Satan continues to do all these things John did not tell us or John did tell us however

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That with the binding of Satan he is now prevented from deceiving the nations until he is released 2nd

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Thessalonians 2 This text supports the Satan being restrained from having complete

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Abilities as he did before the Son of God became incarnate the binding of Satan is as the text indicates in Revelation 20 verse 2 through 4 during the thousand -year reign of the

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Saints with Christ in verse 4 the souls of those who are who have been beheaded for the testimony of Jesus and the

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Word of God sees chapter 6 verse 9 of Revelation and Those who had not worshipped the beast or its image and had not received its mark on their forehead or their hands

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They those people just talked about all those people came to life and reigned with Christ for a thousand years

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Then John brings more clarity in verse 6 blessed and holy is the one who shares in the first resurrection over such the second death has no power, but they

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The same people talked about early will reign with him for a thousand years John understands the bonding of Satan to be synonymous with the resurrection ascension at this time the

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Thousand years began and the Saints reigned with Christ as Revelation 20 verse 6 established further those who partake in the first resurrection

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Who is Christ mind you as John points out in John 11 25?

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He says I am the resurrection and the life whoever believes in me though. He died yet shall he live

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That's a beautiful truth from our Lord as the the Greek word there live is

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Oh, this can be seen as born again This is not necessarily a resurrection because resurrection always entails a body

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Jesus is the only one in his resurrected glorified body when we look at John 5

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John makes a distinction from the souls that live through faith in Christ and the bodies that are resurrected at the general resurrection as we look at verse 25 and 28

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Verse 25 says truly truly I say to you an hour is coming and is now here

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When the dead will hear the son of the voice of the Son of God and those who hear

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Will live this is not the resurrection But is evidence of those who partake as John talks about in the first resurrection by faith in Christ further in John 5 28 and 29

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Do not marvel at this for an hour is coming When all those who are in the tomb will hear his voice and will come out

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Those who have done good to the resurrection of life and those who have done evil to the resurrection of judgment

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Okay tonight we have gone over some essential eschatological views points in this view

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And some of the non -essentials briefly went over the word all millennialism the history of the word when the word come about and when the principles date back to And some of these great theologians like John Calvin and John frame

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There were some others that bring validity to some doctrinal points made by this camp

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We have discussed the two aids model that works best with the already not yet paradigm

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Also touched on recapitulation and a few topics concerning Revelation 20 1 through 6

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Like the binding of Satan and who reigns with Christ as well as the fulfillment of Daniel 7 in Revelation 20

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Before we get moving to the Q &A I want to just look at One more view of parallelism in Revelation 16 14

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I didn't write the whole scripture down this just kind of draw you to it

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This will be recorded for everybody that wants to go back and look at this Revelation 16 14 who go abroad to the kings of the whole world

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To assemble them for battle on the great day of God the Almighty They're dim for battle when we look at the

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Greek. It's tan Polly mom. It's talking about the war It's a recapitulation.

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This is the starting point as we see is there assembling for the battle then Revelation 1919 and I saw the beast and the kings of the earth with their armies gathered to make war against him who is sitting on the horse and Against his army same

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Greek word there tan Polly month and pastor Jeremiah is a very stickler as a ma when you look at the definite article pastor.

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Nathan can definitely Hit you up with that. It's talking about a specific event.

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It's a one -time thing the war Looking at one more. We're gonna look at Revelation 20 verse 8

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The nations that are at the four corners of the earth Gog and Magog to gather them for battle this battle is the final battle that are

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The the unbelievers and the Saints will meet. I think it's the the judgment day

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That's just my preferred opinion, but we can now open the floor up for Q &A

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As the chart I gave you it helped explain because the the age to come

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Doesn't handle the periphery of the return of crops So that whole thousand years will be from one cross first came and until the cross cross returns

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That whole period there in that chart. That's the thousand year reign and all we look at is symbolic

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I'm not saying anything in Revelation that I wouldn't Take some more

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Anybody else for me Bring that turn me down That's a good question for the audience that didn't know he was raised and saturated with free meal and Even I, I mean

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I was free meal in the vagueness that I had coming into it

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What would I have done to persuade men? Nothing.

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Nothing. I'm not here to persuade you into a different view. Eschatology is one of those things that we can hold like this

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I see them as brothers in Christ So I just find it more fascinating for the theological push and drive that I have so you may be

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You're still my sister in Christ. Your eschatology view is not

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Something that's going to sway you from We're taking the Lord's table here. So finally, we love you and we'll help you learn more about pre -millennialism

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That's that's where we come from. We're not going to take each other's knowledge We didn't do that in my house.

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I'm going but here we get to lovingly walk with each other and encourage you

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So I'm with John McCartney So what started to make me kind of back away from it

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Was looking at the Olivet Discourse 24 and the other three

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Synoptic Gospels because that's kind of how you're going to do revelation So when you really look at the context of this generation that Jesus is speaking to you

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You kind of have to conclude one of two things. Is he speaking to this generation that's hearing him? That'll be around for the next 30 -40 years

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We're just talking about a future generation that will be in this future thousand -year reign

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And so for me I was looking at how Matthew used this generation throughout his gospels And it seemed like he was talking to like when he was rebuking the

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Pharisees in a chapter earlier. He called them this generation So that's persuasive to how you read the

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Olivet Discourse that this generation of those people well Necessarily, you have to lead pre -millennials.

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You interpret this generation to be immediate rather than something future To me that was pretty strong exegesis and I'm saying it's the one and only view

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But that's what made me kind of step back and say, okay, well, this is gonna change how I look at Daniel 9 and the whole book of Revelation Until God returns

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Well actually it dates back to Paul and Jesus because they taught the two -faced model and that makes more sense in the all male view

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That's our push. That's how we categorize our view of all males. We look at the two -faced view of this age and the age to come.

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Are we all ready or not yet? I get what you're saying. If we looked at something on the dating

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The dating of the two -faced model That wouldn't be a foundational issue on whether to believe something or not because I mean we got a lot of heritage that believe some of the right things in different ages, so We're trying to get to the

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Word of God and that's why we have three biblical and theological views It's gonna rain forever

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I'm gonna be there with you And that's one thing that we all tend to agree on That's what we're rallying around each other about And you know, it amazes me

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I've never really Stood against in my life But since y 'all have been stood against I've been digging deep

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And I think that a lot of things Some views King James, New King James But I think a lot of these new views are false

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It's only a few hundred years old It's because of a lot of the opinions and titles that's in some of the

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Bibles And that's just my personal opinion Oh yeah, we're all entitled to have different opinions and views, like you said,

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John Frayn said it best Perspectival I mean, how you were raised and what you were surrounded with That's gonna change your perspective when you come into any particular doctrine or view

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I mean, because I've looked at it from a whole different view And that could be why I'm omnial So, I mean,

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Don Eastwood Historic, pre -mill, I believe, right? Yeah, he's historic

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So, I mean, we all want The perspective we come into this doctrine with could say

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It's not a foundational issue like soteriology We will come back together and pose a certain problem

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Well, he was surprised at the term that split But it bothers me that we're gonna re -institute the second

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Unless it's kind of like North Supper or something

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I mean, that's probably the one thing

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Yeah Talking about Christ Since the foundation of the world

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But as it is talking about Christ He has appeared once for all at the end of the age to put away sin by the sacrifice of himself

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So what age is that talking about in Gwen? Is that talking about when he died on the cross?

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Was that the end of the age? Or is that talking about when he comes again And sin, supposedly according to non -biblicalism is done away with What verse are you saying?

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It's Hebrews 9, 25, 28 I don't know if I'm saying I'm not saying It appears context is sacrifice

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But then when it talks about put away sin by the sacrifice put sin away it's talking about his second son

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Just a minute I can get down a little bit Mine don't say anything

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It says ages N -A -S This is This is

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Grudens Yeah To particularly to talk about it

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I don't I couldn't because when it says ages it's always a plurality

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I've never seen them do plural on a singular verb to a word

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What do you think Pastor? Is that a certain term? Yeah I mean you could talk about it more if you just looked at it a little bit

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It says once and for all at the end of the ages put away sin by the sacrifice of himself

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Hey, don't go over here Yeah The sacrifice would entail all of our sins which are atoned for so there's a broader context there that could kind of be smoothed over if I had more time because it's talking about our sins being atoned for, it's not necessarily specifying the ages it's just talking about our sins no more counted against us because the sacrifice has come so there's no more counting our sins upon us but somewhere right now the cows, they're the ones to bring the sacrifice so in some man's coming in the clouds

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I have heard people say that that 2780 which

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I can see that as a possibility because there are times when people want to have a joke so it's really got to use a mention or a tribe to do so and they said it's such a possibility that he could be referring to Christ's return in the judgments in 70

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A .D. on that would that be in the scope of all that you believe that that is oh yeah, that's also the view that I would hold it being a judgment on the clouds because when you tie that with Daniel 7 like I spoke of earlier

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Revelation 12 talking about the ascension of Christ and Daniel 7, where is it, 9 where the thrones are there and the answer of days comes and he takes a seat and we see the father taking down a seat where he announces judgment judgment 7 .14

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if I remember correctly the son of man comes to the answer of days so the son, which is

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Jesus Christ, at his ascension came to the answer of days and it's judgment as we see in the

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Olivet Discourse where the temple was destroyed me and my wife were arguing a lot about if that would be worst ever because we see in some of the

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Old Testament where women were arguing over who was going to eat whose baby and it was just weird thing me and my wife were debating but yeah, that would be judgment because it says it's coming up to them that it's not a descent so you can't talk about it being like the old terrorist heresy trying to claim that the cross is coming to the answer of days something is coming up to the answer of days it's not descending so it's talking about judgment our great hope is the return of Christ bodily and I love

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Paul Washer he said that he's going to come down mine, mine, mine that's what I love about my lord and savior he's going to come down and take what's his bodily one more question yes sir just to kind of touch post millennialism they look at like B .J.

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Warfield John 2 where he says he's not going to put this in the whole world so post millennial looking at the

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Christianization of the entire world when the gospel is going to convert hearts and minds of everybody on the planet

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I mean that's I think it's just a it's a false

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I don't want to say false it's another view of Judaism the

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Judaizers thought oh man he's coming back to make everything right well what draws that from post millennial we're looking at things spiritually because those that are who hear the son of God and live are born again and we're part of the kingdom of God and we see in the

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Lord's prayer that thy kingdom come on earth as it is in heaven so we're getting a picture where the kingdom is being built in heaven and we want that to be saturated here on this earth so that would be the distinction

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I would say between yes well there's a sloppy distinction because some post millennial have a nuance where they they're trying to say the end of the age was the

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Jewish age and I really wouldn't be able to fall upon that but maybe Jeremiah has got something yep yep um um heavenly father