They Went Out from Us: Jahaziel's Excuses for Abandoning the Faith

Alpha & Omega Ministries

Subscribe

Download

Share

00

Comments are disabled.

00:37

And greetings, welcome to The Dividing Line, my name is James White, just got off the air with Chris Arnson on Iron Sharpens Iron, I mean literally about 90 seconds ago,

00:48

I think maybe a little less, and here we are for the last Dividing Line of the year 2015, it is

00:58

New Year's Eve Eve, and we have a lot to talk about, had a great program, yes it was yesterday,

01:11

I was just seeing someone responding to what I just said on Iron Sharpens Iron, which is sort of odd, yes, yes, too many things going on here, had a great program yesterday, but that preempted doing what we were going to be doing, and what

01:30

I'd like to do today, start off, we'll see how we're feeling and whether we'll open the phones toward the end of the program or not,

01:36

I sort of doubt it, but I wanted to address the apostasy of someone

01:50

I've never heard of before, I'll be perfectly honest with you, I know other people have, and if you're in the

01:57

Christian rap world, this is big news, I'm not in the

02:03

Christian rap world, I, hey, I've participated in the writing of a few spoken word songs, which is still one of the more interesting aspects of my resume to be sure, and you should see when

02:18

Rich sings those songs, it's great, you know, he's got the beat down, anyway, I had not heard of Jahaziel before, sorry, but the news broke on the 22nd of December, I guess he's

02:47

British, maybe that's why, okay, it says, former UK based Christian rapper Jahaziel released a shocking statement renouncing

02:53

Christianity on his Facebook page just a few hours ago, in 2011, Jahaziel signed to a

02:58

US based label, XIST music, which also houses artists such as Gemstones and Sean Simmons, don't know them either, and also served as the label that relaunched

03:11

Da Truth and Ambassadors careers after their sabbatical, Jahaziel is without question the most talented and recognized

03:19

UK artist who has crossed over into the US space, his talent has been solidified by the various accolades he's received over the years,

03:29

Jahaziel won a MOBO award for best gospel act in 2008, he was nominated for a

03:34

MOBO award in 07, and won two Oasis awards in 06 for best male and best holy hip hop artist, holy hip hop, oh, okay, so here's,

03:50

I'm sorry, you got nothing on that, I, holy hip hop, holy hip hop,

04:00

Batman, yeah, that's what I was thinking, but you said it before I did, so I'm going to blame you, anyway, here's the statement, twitter statement, this just in,

04:17

Dr. Oakley 1689 is not a rap guy, yeah, there you go, that's exactly right, okay, um,

04:26

I need to explain my, I need not explain myself to anyone, well,

04:33

Jahaziel, you will someday, uh, but I feel the need to make a quick statement, a short while ago I turned away from 20 years as a professing

04:42

Christian, I just, I just want to stop, what should someone know after 20 years as a professing

04:55

Christian, now, I hesitate to say this because I'm going to have to step on some toes, but the reality is that quote unquote

05:16

Christian music ministry, whatever you want to call that, has an abysmal record in producing mature

05:31

Christians, an abysmal record, and the reason's obvious, if you're going to make it, you've got to get gigs, which means you've got to travel, which means you're almost never consistently under the ministry of the word in a sound church where you can have modeled for you the proper handling of the word of God, modeled for you holiness, godliness, see it not just in one person,

06:09

I'm not talking about these churches where you put one person up on a pedestal, man, don't put me,

06:16

MacArthur, Sproul, Moeller, don't put anybody up on a pedestal.

06:22

We are men with clay feet. Don't do it in a sound church.

06:29

What you're going to see are numbers of men and women who in different ways over periods of time, give you all the parts of the puzzle you need to be able to see what

06:45

Christian maturity is in its fullness and how it should look like in your life.

06:51

You won't find that in any one individual, but you see it in the body.

07:00

Now, if you're never in the body, oh, oh, oh no, no. They're always in a church.

07:06

No, no, they're not. I'm sorry, but if you are, if you're doing sound checks, if you're the big star, you're not having interaction with anybody.

07:20

You're not taking care of kids in the nursery. You know, some of the most important people to my kids in their growing up as Christians were their

07:34

Sunday school teachers. It was so important that they heard other voices saying what mom and dad were saying in other words, from other life experiences.

07:51

You know, they still remember teacher Diana and they still remember teacher

07:57

Warren and Mr. Flock and Mrs. Callahan and they remember these people and they remember the investments that they made in their lives.

08:10

And so they get, you don't get that when you're the rap artist that's visiting to do a set in each one of the three services, that's not being in the church.

08:22

And so being, if you feel quote unquote called to this ministry,

08:34

I can't tell you how it could be done successfully, but it would have to be extremely limited in regards to the amount of time that you're gone.

08:46

And there would have to be close accountability and discipleship from solid people to keep you from falling into exactly what we see right here.

08:59

Exactly what you see right here. 20 years. I saw this gentleman,

09:06

I don't know him, I'm sorry, but I saw him tweet last week that he had just watched the zeitgeist movie and he goes, how could

09:18

I have not seen this? The zeitgeist movie, which sets the standard for abject inanity on the level of any meaningful scholarship whatsoever.

09:35

And now he's all excited about it. Now, after 20 years as a professing

09:43

Christian, if you were in a meaningfully sound church, don't you think you'd have a foundation upon which to examine something like that?

09:53

And if after 20 years you don't, it's possible you're not in a good church or it's possible you're in a good church and you just aren't taking advantage of it.

10:06

I mean, it's possible being a good church and just simply ignore much of what's being said, I suppose, though I would imagine eventually that would get to be troublesome in some way.

10:16

But after 20 years and the stuff that that Jahaziel is going to say here demonstrates this individual was never discipled, was never grounded, was never put in a position of being able to grow or mature in any way, shape or form.

10:37

Now, of course, theologically speaking, they went out from us, so it might be demonstrated they were not truly of us.

10:51

And it is quite probable that we have here an unregenerate individual who is just playing at religion in the first place.

11:01

We can hope that this is a period of confusion that's going to lead to repentance and to greater things in the future, but in all probability, there are those who play at the

11:21

Christian faith. Now, of course, if you're one of those anti -lordship ticket punch, go to heaven.

11:27

This guy's Christian. He's going to heaven. Doesn't matter what he says now, right? I mean, 20 years. He pooped.

11:33

He's in. That's it, right? Anyway, just a thought.

11:42

Just a thought. Tomorrow, last day of the year. Last day of the year. I think back, and we have this tradition at our church.

11:58

We have a New Year's Eve thing we do. And years ago,

12:06

Pride dumped the movie stuff on me. And so we've watched all sorts of stuff.

12:18

We've watched The Radicals and Jan Hus, and we've watched a couple of them, the

12:25

Lutheran movie a couple of times and stuff like that. And so there's sort of a spot where we can think back and I can think back to where I was last year.

12:42

And I asked myself the question, how was my year?

12:51

Not performance wise, not trying to gain something from God, not talking about that.

12:59

But if we believe what we say, we believe that we're indwelt by the Spirit of God, the reason we're still here is to conform us to the image of Christ, is to cause us to be more like him, to be used by him, to minister to others.

13:19

What evidence do I have? What do I see in my own life? Sometimes the elders will sort of ask the question, do we see growth in this family, this individual, the congregation as a whole?

13:36

Is there a desire for holiness? Is there a steadfastness in light of the many, many, many temptations and distractions of the world?

13:54

But you individually, me individually, a year of apathy, some periods of fervor, passion, other periods of coasting along, too many times looking at others and saying, well, at least

14:24

I'm doing better than that person. We're not supposed to compare ourselves to one another.

14:36

What about it? How do you evaluate yourself? You're the only one that can.

14:41

The scriptures say we are to examine ourselves, or some people say you should never do that. I know there's the whole hyper -grace movement,

14:48

I guess. You're never supposed to do these things. I'm sorry, the Bible won't have anything to do with any of those things.

14:56

Where am I this year in comparison to last? And what kind of effort will

15:04

I make to be able to look back upon 2016 and to be able to say,

15:11

I've seen the work of the Spirit of God in my life.

15:17

I've hated my sin. I have sought holiness. I have sought to serve

15:23

Christ. I've sought to be used of Him in the service of others. What steps will

15:30

I take? Next month is that month where all the gyms make all their money for the entire year, because everybody has their

15:41

New Year's resolutions. But spiritually, different issue.

15:51

Different issue. It really is. 20 years professing Christian.

15:59

I had a good job with a church organization, a house provided by the church, a large social circle of like -minded people, a career in gospel music, and a worldwide fan base, a respected reputation, status within Christian, non -Christian circles.

16:12

I don't question any of that though, again, outside of my realm. Having left

16:19

Christianity, I may have lost many, all of these things, but what I have is worth more than all of them combined.

16:25

I have my integrity. Really, Jahaziel? You have your integrity?

16:33

For 20 years, you did not study your faith enough to know it worth anything, and you have your integrity now that you've overthrown that?

16:48

How do you even define integrity? Because see, Jahaziel, if you're out there in agnostic land or atheist land,

16:57

I mean, zeitgeist, bad stuff. If you're out there, how does cosmic dust have integrity?

17:08

What do you mean integrity? Where do you get that idea from? Remember, if God's gone, you can't borrow from him to make your worldview hold together.

17:19

So, what do you mean you have your integrity? Where do you get that idea from?

17:26

What does that mean to a cosmic accident that has no transcendent meaning, and if you get run over by a bus crossing the street tomorrow, you cease to exist, and that's it.

17:42

You're dust. You're gone. Does that mean your integrity has disappeared too?

17:48

So, is your integrity a physical property that a bus can squish out of you? Have you thought about these things?

17:54

I don't get the feeling, Jahaziel. I'm sorry for what you said. I still get the feeling that you've thought this stuff through.

18:02

I really don't. When I first joined Christianity, wow, that bothers me.

18:10

When I first joined Christianity, no.

18:18

I'm sorry. A Christian who understands the gospel would at least say something along the lines of, when

18:31

I first repented of my sins and gave my life to Jesus Christ, when

18:39

I was found by the Spirit of God and my rebellion was quelled and I was drawn to discipleship in Christ, when

18:48

I became a servant slave of Jesus Christ, it sounds like you joined. When I first joined

18:54

AARP, which I'm not a member of, and stop sending me stuff. Man, I'm tired of that.

19:02

Somebody, as a joke, signed me up when I turned 50. I am not happy about that. Because I'm going to tell you, that's one organization.

19:09

They do not stop. I'm going to call them pretty soon and say, you will stop.

19:15

It won't make any difference. It won't make any difference. Anyway, sorry. There's a pet peeve of mine.

19:24

Join Christianity. Join the AAA. I have been a member of the

19:30

AAA for a long, long time. I've never had to use it, but everybody else in my family has.

19:36

So, good investment. That sounds like what you did. You joined the

19:41

AAA, 20 years later you found out there was a better automobile club. That's not

19:49

Christianity. That's not what it means. I realize for a lot of nominal

19:56

Christianity, that's what it's all about. But that's not what it means.

20:05

When I first joined Christianity, I was told, you must believe this book is God's infallible word.

20:11

Before I'd even read the book, double exclamation point. Now, what have

20:16

I said over and over and over again? By the way, I didn't say anything about opening the lines.

20:22

So, there's about a 98 % chance we ain't going to be doing that. So, I see folks there and I'm like, huh?

20:32

Anyway, I've said over and over again, and I'm going to say it again.

20:42

I believe that when the spirit of God works in a person's heart, that one of the inevitable results, one of the greatest signs of the presence of the spirit of God in a person's heart and soul is a love for, a continued obedience to, a desire for growth in knowledge of the word of God.

21:24

John chapter 10, Jesus lays it out, his sheep hear his voice.

21:30

There is a personal relationship and that includes the means, the primary means that God has given us whereby we may grow in the grace and knowledge of the

21:44

Lord Jesus Christ. And that is his word. And so, when

21:49

I see people who claim to be Christians, they have no passion for his word.

21:56

They have no passion for his word. I mean, look, I am not sinlessly perfect by any stretch of the imagination, but when

22:07

I sin, I hate my sin. I'm not apathetic about it.

22:14

I hate it. And it never, ever, ever has made me question the authority of the scriptures that tell me that what

22:27

I've done is sin. When I see people who can very flippantly begin to question the very authority of scripture, so as to allow for certain behaviors.

22:48

And you know what? See this down here took me a while to get it.

22:54

And what it's done is it's given me just enough perspective. And I'm not as old as some of you out there.

23:00

And I'm going to, once I'm 70 and 80 and stuff, I'll be saying this a whole lot more often, but I've at least been around long enough now that I can think back and I can think of that person, that person, that person saw it coming, saw it coming.

23:17

They're not a part of us anymore. And it didn't just happen overnight. Sometimes it does. Sometimes you just left going, huh, really?

23:26

But most of the time it's like, saw that coming, saw that there, saw that there.

23:34

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Saw it happen. Start seeing the pattern. Start seeing the pattern. I was told you must believe this book is

23:44

God's infallible word. Even before I'd even read the book. Well, did you, did you

23:50

Jahaziel? Were you, were you taught it, all of it, exposed to all of it?

24:00

You know, I was, I was saying to my wife after the, you know, Sunday night sermon, Deuteronomy 20.

24:06

Not easy folks. It's, it's, it's not easy to preach it. It's not easy to be in the audience.

24:14

I mean, there are some texts of scripture that are extremely hard to deal with.

24:21

We're in Joshua right now. We're getting, I'm going to have to read through judges pretty soon. We read a chapter or at least half a chapter, every service, new

24:32

Testament in the morning, old Testament in the evening. And that way over the years, everybody who's there in attendance regularly is exposed the entirety of the word of God.

24:47

That means you got to read some tough stuff. And if you've listened at any point in time, you can listen to them.

24:57

If you want to, there are a few people that do listen to the Sunday school lessons that, um, that we post on sermon audio.

25:06

When I teach the adult Sunday school class, we, we deal with a wide variety of issues.

25:11

I, I, there's nobody at my church that could ever say the things to Hazel says in this article, never, never.

25:23

They've been exposed to all sorts of things. I'm not saying there's no one who could apostatize from my church.

25:31

I'm not saying that, but they could never with honesty say, Hey, we never talked about stuff like that. I didn't know that there was this type of thing.

25:37

No, they have been hit with pretty much everything. They really have.

25:44

And my wife and I were talking about, I said, you know, I just, I just feel like it's necessary given who

25:49

I am and what I do, that if anyone ever does come to me and say, you know,

25:55

I'm leaving the faith member of the church, they'll have to do it in full knowledge of the answers to all of their objections.

26:03

They may not accept it, but none of us could be able to say, you know, you just didn't tell me about this. You didn't tell me.

26:08

No, no, that's not good. Not going to fly. Not going to fly at all. Uh, do you see that one debates and beats atheists, agnostics,

26:24

Muslims, Catholics, and all sorts of others. But he's met his match in double ARP. I don't like them.

26:30

I don't like them at all. Um, you know what? I hate it. They send, they send these envelopes and they don't put a return address on it and there's cards in them.

26:40

You can't just throw it out. You have to open it. That's dishonest mean.

26:48

I'm going to start an anti double ARP campaign right here on the air. How'd I get onto that?

26:54

Anyway. All right. How can one decide for themselves whether a book is accurate and true before they have even read and investigated the book thoroughly?

27:03

Well, Jahaziel, you should have been reading and investigating it, but what you were called to do is to believe in the gospel of Jesus Christ.

27:16

And Jahaziel, you need to recognize you. Um, especially if you're doing Zeitgeist stuff, you don't even think

27:21

Jesus existed now. So it sounds to me like you never understood that what you were doing is you were weren't joining a group.

27:31

You were dying. So as to serve one person, Jesus Christ, you were taking up your cross, denying yourself, following him on the death

27:41

March. It doesn't sound like that was ever really explained to you. You ever really understood it. So I get it.

27:48

You know, I, I, I get it. I'm not sure how well, and, and it took 20 years to figure it out because you weren't, see, if you're in a good solid church where you were constantly being met with the claims of Christ, this would have become a crisis issue for you a long time ago.

28:04

But if you're just all out singing poems, doing rap, then you don't, you don't get, you don't get hit with this stuff.

28:12

I get the 20, the 20 year thing now. Um, anyway, contrary to many opinions,

28:20

I have met some great people in church and learn some great principle principles from Christianity slash the

28:26

Bible. I would like to know what those are. I love when, when people leave and go,

28:32

Oh, I really appreciate the great principles of like what? Um, I mean, if you're abandoning this worldview, then you've got to abandon all of it.

28:45

And so, you know, you mean God's your creator? He's not your creator anymore. Everything else is based on that.

28:52

If you don't think you have a creator anymore, then what great principles have you picked up? Or is it just now mad matter of pragmatism?

28:59

Well, you know, if you treat others like you want to be treated, that's, you know, that's generally going to result in a better, I don't know.

29:08

Uh, Oh, and then you're ready. You're ready. I've met many sincere

29:14

Christians, both church goers and church leaders. Oh, wait a minute. Back up. I missed a couple of things.

29:20

I didn't mean to. These principles, however, are not exclusive to any religion. So what are these?

29:26

Just sort of basic pious platitudes of some kind. I have experienced

29:34

Christianity in literally hundreds of contexts. So my perspective in Christianity is quite an informed one.

29:40

Ah, so if you go to lots of churches, that makes you very informed. Ever thought

29:45

Jehaziel, that there is only a very narrow spectrum of churches that want Christian rap in them.

29:54

I've met many sincere Christians, both churchgoers and church leaders. And although I have not seen every one of the ready 40 ,000

30:05

Christian denominations currently in existence, uh, the number just grows and grows.

30:15

Doesn't it? There are not 40 ,000 Christian denominations. That's a, that's a joke, but it's, again, it's a joke that gets repeated so often that, uh, it's just accepted as a truth, even though it's a joke.

30:29

Uh, currently existence. I think I have seen enough to personally make a general conclusion regarding Christianity in the broadest sense.

30:36

Now, um, I would like to, you know, I, I don't know what

30:41

Jehaziel's background is, but I'd be interested in what schooling he received, what official training you received.

30:47

Um, you know, I'm sorry, performing songs in a church does not make you anything other than a performer.

30:57

Um, I'd like to know what your grounding in the faith was during those 20 years.

31:04

That's what I'd like to know. Now, after 20 years of being vocal about the positives of Christian faith,

31:11

I would like to take some time to be equally vocal about the negatives. I have found that is Christianity and it's controlling dictatorship.

31:22

You mean the Pope? What, what do you mean? How do you go from 40 ,000 denominations math to controlling dictatorship math?

31:36

I mean, there's no middle ground there. Which one is it? You, are you talking about elders in the local congregation?

31:44

That's not controlling dictatorship. What, what is that? I don't know.

31:51

Um, it's historic blood trail. So now we have an it and it is

31:58

Christianity. And I suppose everything that claims to be

32:03

Christianity, we now all get to answer for. And so we've got the inquisitions and the crusades and everything that Romanism did and, and all the rest of that stuff, um, now has to be answered by everybody.

32:18

Uh, no matter, again, let's not make distinctions. Um, it's historic blood trail.

32:24

It's plagiarized Bible stories, characters, and concepts. Now, given that he mentioned

32:32

Zeitgeist, then I guess he's fallen into the utter foolishness, indefensible, unscholarly, refuted forever.

32:42

And in fact, I owe an email. I will, I owe a lot of people emails. I'm so far behind email right now. I'll never catch up.

32:47

But, um, uh, a, a Muslim fellow that I've, I've actually debated in the past, uh, wrote a couple of days ago, what's the best book defending the

32:56

Bible against the idea that it's just borrowing pagan myths and stuff like that. I didn't bring it in here, but the gospel amongst the

33:05

Greeks by Nash is, wow, man, is it, what was that?

33:11

Almost 50 years old now might be. Well, I am, so it might be.

33:17

I think that's right around where it was. Um, the, the whole mythology, uh, the, the whole idea of religions, just borrowing ideas from one another.

33:33

That idea was just shredded in scholarly circles decades ago.

33:40

Why is it now the majority of you again? Well, but not amongst serious scholars, the internet, the internet, the internet produces mindless idiocy in the place of scholarship.

33:54

It does. We all have to use it. You're watching me on it right now. Great to have that part of it.

34:01

But the reality is that movies like zeitgeist could never survive in a serious academic setting.

34:09

Couldn't they're myth. They're, they are myth. They're creating myths. No one, no one can defend the

34:19

Osiris Horus Dionysus, all borrowed stories stuff.

34:24

It is pure abject stupidity on a level that is almost indescribable.

34:33

It requires the IQ of a wet shoelace to believe these things. It really does. I have no respect for it.

34:38

I can't have respect for it. It's that dumb. If you actually know those stories, if you actually know those sources, and then if you actually know

34:48

Christianity, if you can make a connection, you're an idiot. I'm sorry. You're an idiot.

34:55

And I'm going to talk about your hazel and I'm talking about anybody that can seriously look at that stuff. These people don't know that stuff.

35:01

That's the whole point. They don't know it. They don't either know Christianity or they don't know the stories.

35:08

They've made up stories, you know, all the stuff about, Oh, who was it?

35:13

Was it Osiris? Which one's the one? There are so many that you'd start losing track of, but you know, birthday was on December 25th and I had 12 disciples.

35:22

It's all a bunch of baloney. There are no original sources saying any of that stuff in Egyptology.

35:29

It's, it's all made up. Look at the references and they go in a circle.

35:35

They're, they're quoting each other. It's, it's pure fantasy. And yet if you want a reason to disbelieve,

35:43

Whoa, it's great. Wonderful. But you see that stuff could never, ever, ever survive a meaningful debate because you get into cross -examination sources, please.

35:55

Sources, please. Well, well, sources, please. Well, done over finished.

36:04

So plagiarized Bible stories, you're talking about a flood narrative where you can find, if there really was a flood, are you shocked that you find it in more than one source?

36:18

Is that what you're talking about? Don't get the feeling that Jahaziel, you know, it's funny when people leave the faith, isn't it interesting that 95 % of the time, minimally, and I'm being generous at that point, it's actually about 99 % of the time, but let's, let's be generous.

36:40

95 % of the time, there's no attempt to actually find answers. When I've talked to, when

36:48

I've talked, when I've known people who've left the Christian faith and they, they would have had access to me. Do you think they came to me to ask questions before they left?

36:57

Of course not. Because that's not why they left. There's something else going on here. We all know that.

37:04

But anyway, it's plagiarized Bible stories, characters, and concepts, the many human errors of the

37:13

Bible and its contradictions. Of course, we're not given any examples, but this is, that's a

37:19

Bart Ehrmanism right there. You know, just throw it out there as a given. The brutal nature of its

37:27

God. Now there's a, that's more of a, of a Richard Dawkinsism, Dawkinsism than anything else.

37:37

The brutal nature of its God. What do you mean, Jahaziel? What do you mean?

37:45

Yeah, someone asked, isn't this one of the biggest things you debated Dan Barker on? Well, tried to. Dan Barker had, and was to that very day, and I think still is, selling his book where he draws all those parallels to the

37:59

Egyptian gods and the Greek mythology and all the rest of that stuff. And when we debated it, he knew it was indefensible.

38:07

So he decided to go another direction. And that's why he objected to my quotation of his own book. Yeah. That's, that's what happens.

38:18

If the book he was selling in the, in the foyer of the church. Yeah. The brutal nature of its

38:26

God. What do you mean by that? When, when you joined

38:33

Christianity 20 years ago, Jahaziel, did you hear something about the cross?

38:40

Was the cross mentioned in any of your music? Have you ever noticed that the cross is brutal?

38:50

That's brutal. I mean, did you, did you not see that God's holiness is on display there?

39:00

His wrath against sin, the extreme measures it takes to bring about redemption from that.

39:06

If you never saw that Jahaziel, you never understood what you were singing about. Did you?

39:17

Interesting. It's involvement in the slave trade.

39:23

Well, again, what's the it's who were the primary people who brought about the end of the slave trade again?

39:33

The crusades. Okay. The inquisition. Oh, so, so we're all, we're all responsible for what

39:39

Rome did now. Okay. So I didn't think you were a Roman Catholic. Did you follow the

39:44

Pope? Did you, did you have, did you understand if you didn't follow the

39:51

Pope, did you have a specific knowledgeable reason as to why you didn't?

39:57

There's a fast, vast difference between being a non -Catholic of ignorance or taste or tradition and being a person of conviction who rejects the pompous pretentious claims of the papacy.

40:15

A lot of P's there. It sounds pretty good. The pompous pretentious claims of the papacy, the witch hunts it's second -class view of women.

40:25

Really, really second -class view of women. I mean, this is, this is borrowed.

40:31

This has to be borrowed from some really cheesy, shallow atheist website. I mean, anybody just throw, it's so easy to put this stuff together.

40:41

It's impossible to defend it. Husbands love your wives as Christ loves the church.

40:47

That's second -class. Yeah. It's masculinization of God.

40:54

It's emasculation of men. What, what? I don't even,

41:00

I don't even know where to, where to start. What? You're, you're a very confused man.

41:08

Very confused man. It's financial corruption. Well, you get the drift.

41:15

Yeah. I get the drift that you're just throwing a bunch of stuff together to have some excuse for your apostasy.

41:22

I get that drift. Yeah. I got that. Are there all sorts of false prophets running around making money?

41:34

Did you profit from any of that? Did you have any standards as to what churches you went to?

41:42

Any theological standards? Just wondering, just wondering. You get the drift.

41:49

So yes, I will go on and I will not be silent as some have asked. My integrity will not allow me to be so passive against mass corruption in all love,

41:59

Jay. Well, Jay, my, uh, my strong recommendation to you, uh, if you're going to speak out, um, if you're going to talk from your integrity, and may

42:20

I suggest something integrity would require that you actually know what you're talking about.

42:27

And this does not show any integrity at all. None. So you got some work to do.

42:35

Got some work to do. And maybe my hope is that in digging into it, you might discover that you never knew.

42:44

And there's a whole lot more there than you did know. Let's hope that's what happens. But saw that coming up on my feet a lot.

43:01

Um, the, uh, the old voice has been going for an hour and 45 minutes now, and the old cough is wanting to come back.

43:10

Uh, life news .com had an, just another one of those articles.

43:18

Uh, if you don't recognize that sin impacts the mind and the totality of the human being, here's a story that should convince you.

43:35

Carolyn Payne grew up in a good

43:40

Christian home, whatever that means with loving parents and opportunities to make the most of her life. Instead, she decided to become an abortion doctor, paying an

43:51

OBGYN resident pictured above cute little girl, awful glad no one aborted her, but Hey, that's another issue.

44:00

Wrote a shockingly bold column for the women's website XO Jane about how her faith and upbringing influenced her to abort unborn babies for a living.

44:10

Now, of course, as with the vast majority of these other articles that are appearing,

44:16

Dr. Moeller has mentioned some others that have appeared recently in mainstream media. What is obviously and conspicuously absent is any discussion of the object of her plundering and her murderous intent.

44:36

And that is the unborn child. Um, they have to ignore that.

44:43

They have to ignore the reality of that unborn child.

44:50

They have to ignore its human nature. They have to ignore its unique genetic makeup.

44:58

They have to ignore the reality that if they don't kill it, that it will be born as an individual, that this is merely a period of development, that that development will continue outside the womb, which is why on any philosophical or logical level, there really isn't any meaningful.

45:24

It's only an arbitrary means of arguing against infanticide that the philosophers who have argued for infanticide are simply carrying the logic of this murderous perspective to its conclusion.

45:50

Um, through her experiences, pain flaunted her career goal and what she perceived as the importance of training programs for abortion doctors in the

45:57

U S I love providing abortion care to women. And I am proud to do so. Pain wrote that she and many of her colleagues are not afraid, embarrassed, or ashamed to say so.

46:07

Um, that says who wants to be an abortion provider?

46:13

I do. And I don't have a nose ring or a tattoo. I'm a five foot blonde from Ohio. And my last boyfriend was a pastor.

46:28

I'll just let that one sink in for a moment. In fact, my

46:33

Midwest Christian upbringing. Now I, I bet if I ask, we'll find out anybody in this audience know where this young lady went to church.

46:50

I'd be interested in knowing. I'd be interested in knowing what is a Midwest Christian upbringing?

46:57

Well, there's a, there's some great churches in the Midwest, but I believe Matthew Vines was raised around that area too.

47:05

So there's all sorts of apostasy in the Midwest too. Just be interested.

47:13

In fact, my Midwest Christian upbringing is largely responsible for my belief that providing abortion services is one of the most meaningful ways

47:18

I feel I can contribute to making the world a more fair and equal place for women. These folks believe this.

47:30

These folks believe this. They have to repeat this to themselves every single day so that they can suppress the knowledge of the atrocities they're committing.

47:45

And this demonstrates to us the reality of not only what suppression of the truth means, but what it does.

47:58

There is what's Romans 1, the exchange, the exchange. They exchanged the truth of God for a lie.

48:09

The truth of God for a lie. There is an exchange and it impacts the mind. This woman is a trained

48:19

OBGYN. She's a doctor. She has taken embryology.

48:26

She has taken fetal development. Now for her, it was to enrich target practice, but I've taken those classes.

48:38

I was department fellow in anatomy and physiology. And yeah, it was a while ago.

48:45

I'd sort of love to take those again. They've learned so much more since then.

48:52

But she's taken those classes. So she knows the nature of that child.

49:01

She knows it's not just a mass of cells. And so she knows that 49 % of the time, you realize there is a disparity.

49:18

It's interesting. There are more boys conceived than girls. It's about 50 -50. There are more boys born than there are girls.

49:29

And I think, what is it? At 25, it's even? Because guys go to war and guys do stupid things.

49:40

Just watch some of the year -end GoPro video and most of the people that are doing stupid things are men falling off mountains and impaling themselves and doing things like that.

49:50

So she knows pretty much one out of every two of those clumps of cells is female.

50:08

In fact, I can guarantee you, I can guarantee you, I can guarantee you that at some point of time, she has thought about the fact that she herself went through every one of these stages of development.

50:28

That she herself was once the blastula and the zygote and the whole nine yards and when the differentiation and when this organ system develops and the absolute miraculous process.

50:45

So designed that it cannot be described without using the language of design.

50:54

Can't be described. Can't do it. She's thought of herself in each one of those stages.

51:04

And yet, the deceptiveness, the twistedness of sin, the suppression of God's truth, the exchange of the truth for the lie can lead to these words which will echo in her ears before the judgment seat of God.

51:32

As will the voices of every one of those little girls and boys that she murdered.

51:44

I left a, I left a comment on the, I think it was the, yeah, it was the

51:52

Facebook posting of the LifeSite News article. And I commented about what

52:00

I'm just saying right now. Here is the perfect example of the twistedness of what rebellion against God brings.

52:08

But I also included in it that every one of us deserves to stand before that judgment seat condemned.

52:20

Because it's so easy to look at someone like this and to be filled with righteous anger.

52:28

To be filled with righteous anger. And yet, as long as we remain focused upon the great price that has been paid for our redemption, that our sin is just as reprehensible before a holy

52:46

God. Hopefully, even in announcing the reality of judgment that will come upon this woman if she does not repent and turn from this.

53:06

Hopefully, we don't do that with the attitude of smug, pharisaical condescension.

53:13

Now, I know in our society, let's, let's be, let's be perfectly honest with you. In our society today, any discussion of judgment, of objective morality, of proclaiming the wrath of God is automatically interpreted in the context of condescending self -righteousness.

53:37

It's just, it's the meme. It's the way the society does it.

53:43

That's how the society is getting around it. I get it. But all we can do is control the attitude of our own heart.

53:57

All we can do is seek to make sure that our words are seasoned as it were with, with grace and then leave the rest up to God.

54:11

That's, that's, I cannot control the emotional response.

54:21

And this is, this is what is so difficult for me today. I cannot control the emotional response of people to my words when they are individuals who do not think, but simply emote.

54:49

And that's the younger, younger generation now. There is a tremendous confusion between feelings in the heart and thoughts in the mind.

55:05

I mean, you, you watch, remember that, remember that liberal professor? Where was that?

55:12

Well, it could be anywhere, any university at all anymore. But there was this one ultra -liberal professor.

55:20

I don't know if it was Yale or where it was. It's only a couple of months ago. And he's trying to, in essence, defend liberalism, but he doesn't realize that his own students are now surrounding him, have now taken his own liberalism to its ultimate conclusion, which is to suppress all expressions other than that, which makes me feel good.

55:51

And this, this young, this young lady is in his face screaming at him about how she should not be offended, how this should be a safe place.

56:08

There is no room for offensive thought. I don't know how you reason with people like that.

56:16

First of all, that young woman should not be in a university. This, this woman cannot think.

56:26

This woman should, I don't know how, I guess there aren't entrance exams anymore. You know, it's just as long as you can get your government money, which is why it's so costly anymore to get a graduate degree.

56:42

Um, but you know what? There are people that shouldn't go to college. There are,

56:48

I'll say it. I'll say it. When I was, when I, when I grew up, it wasn't a given and it wasn't because of white privilege or anything else.

56:57

There was a standard. And there were some people in my high school that didn't measure up.

57:08

It's the way it is. Oh, it's terrible. No, it's reality.

57:13

It's life. And that young woman screaming at that professor is incapable of rational thought.

57:21

She doesn't belong in university. Doesn't, I don't know how you reason with someone like that, but it has taken a lifetime of abusing the image of God within her to turn her into that.

57:36

Cause that's not, that's not how life is. That's not, that's not how reality is. Um, she's still a child.

57:45

He's not ready for university, but there she is. There she is. And I don't know how to, those type of folks will be offended by anything, by how you look, how you dress, who you are.

57:57

They're just simply a walking factory of offense. And there's nothing you can do about them.

58:02

Nothing you do about them. Anyway. All right.

58:08

That's it for the dividing line for 2015. Wow. I wonder how many we did in 2015.

58:15

Didn't add that up. A lot, probably somewhere around a hundred.

58:20

I would assume maybe, maybe a little less than that, but some weeks we did three. Sometimes we made up.

58:27

So we'll, you know, we'll see. Anyways, thanks for watching. It'll be a new year when we get together again.

58:35

We will be with you next week, but then the week after that heading for Charlotte and Georgia and who knows what's going to happen then.