Abortion and the Secular Worldview

Second Timothy 2 15. Be diligent to present yourself approved to God. A worker who does not need to be ashamed rightly. Dividing the word of truth. Alpha and Omega ministries presents the dividing line radio broadcast.

The Apostle Peter commanded all Christians to be ready to give a defense for the hope that is within us. Yet to give this answer with gentleness and reverence. Your host is dr. James white director of Alpha and Omega ministries and an elder at the Phoenix reform to Baptist Church.

If you'd like to talk with dr. White, you can call now by dialing 5 0 8 0 9 60. That's 5 0 8 0 9 60 and now with today's topic. Here's James white.

The Abortion Case of Sarah Brown and the Reality of Late-Term Abortion

As far as we can tell there was nothing wrong with the little baby that the woman was carrying back in 1993 when she flew to Wichita, Kansas from New Mexico at the age of 15 for a late-term abortion.

The young mother was eight and a half months pregnant. Eight and a half months pregnant that is Significantly longer than for example, my firstborn son was carried. He was premature by seven and a half weeks just a few weeks from being delivered when Abortionist George Tiller injected potassium chloride into the baby's brain.

Tiller also administered a chemical solution that horribly burned the child's lungs and throat. Tiller expected a dead child as a result of the procedure. But he later found out the child was not dead.

That was July 15th 1993 the day that Sarah Brown was born alive. Sarah Brown died last September at the age of five due to complications caused by the attempt on her life as an infant. Isn't it fascinating my friends that it is the same abortionist to whom a 14 year old, Arizona girl is.

Either there has gone to. I don't know. I've been out of town for a couple of days and I can't find anybody talking about this story anymore. Can't find any discussion of it any longer. It seems to have been a tempest in a teapot that's gone away.

But if you live in the state of Arizona, it's your tax dollars and your leaders and your judges. Who have deemed it proper that a 14 year old girl go to the same? Abortionist. Who killed Sarah Brown? For another abortion of From as far as we know a perfectly healthy and as each day passes more and more viable little child.

That's a society we live in. It's called a post-christian society. It's called a society that no longer has a foundation upon which to make moral decisions. It's called a society that's been taken over by religious fundamentalists and you say excuse me Religious fundamentalists.

What are you talking about? Our society has been taken over by religious fundamentalists it has been taken over by Secular humanists who are absolutely fundamentalistic in their outlook. They see only one perspective.

They are zealots for their cause and there is no length to which they will not go to promote their agenda. I've heard a lot of discussion. I've heard the John Jakub CIC for example, who is the president of Arizona right to life?

Saying I cannot understand The incredible desire on the part of The pro-abortionists to see this baby dead. Well, I can understand it. I can understand it very clearly you see given the worldview of those who promote abortion as a Safe and legal method of family planning.

Rather than what it really is the wanton purposeful destruction of human life over against all of the Simple factual data that we have today all of the the technology all of the facts that we know demonstrate beyond question.

That that unborn child is a unique individual human being. That the genetic makeup of that child will never be repeated again. That each one of us. Each one of you listening to me today once existed as a 28 week old preborn child.

Aren't you glad you survived? Aren't you glad someone didn't kill you then? We all were there. That pre preborn child is a human being and yet we kill them Regularly all across the United States and here in our state.

We do so though pro-abortionists will not engage in meaningful debate on the subject because they know That on the simple factual level they don't have a case. Instead they will throw up all the standard emotional argumentation.

They will throw sand dirt and dust in the air and do anything but engage in rational dialogue on Such a vitally important issue. There is not a single person that could possibly knowing the facts knowing anything.

Anything about science knowing anything about embryology knowing anything about developmental biology? There's not a single human being who could look you straight in the eye and say I know for a fact and can prove This isn't murder.

No.

They just close their eyes plug their ears. And say well, we need to talk about women's rights. And I wonder what about Sarah Brown's right? At eight and a half months to be born and to live her life.

She didn't have that right? Oh Well, it's only certain women's rights. You see really it's only certain women's rights who agree with us. Those the only women's rights that we're concerned about. We live in a post-christian society that is tearing itself up.

We sit around and wonder.

In.

Shock at Columbine High School folks. We shouldn't be shocked at Columbine High School. Why in the world should we be shocked by what happened there? We murder unborn children every day. Why in the world should we think anyone should value life at all?

You can't put on the schoolroom wall thou shalt not kill. How in the world can anyone be shocked the violence that surrounds us? I was driving home Thursday afternoon. The kind folks here. In fact, I'd very much like to thank Chris Ward and the staff here at KPX Q.

I Showed up at Sky Harbor International Airport on Thursday morning and I was actually sitting at the gate with my boarding pass ready to get on the aircraft to fly to Southern California and to be the in-studio guest for the Bible Ants Man broadcast on Thursday and Friday and.

And they had a mechanical failure on the aircraft and canceled the flight and I was not able to go so as soon as I got in my car. After paying for a full day's parking for only being there for an hour and 46 minutes in the long-term parking anyways after having done that I called Chris Ward and Chris jumped into action shall we say and I did the Bible Ants Man broadcast.

Some of you I don't think we even were aware of this from approximately 10 feet from where I'm sitting right now in one of the studios it isn't quite completely finished, but almost totally done for the switchover that's taking place with 1360 and 960 so on and so forth and that was the only studio I could do it in that had the proper Had the proper Hookups to be able to to do this and as I said Chris Ward did a lot of work and getting that all set up.

And we're very thankful for that. Did two hours there, and I was driving home from doing two hours on the doctrine of the Trinity and I was listening to Marty Minto show and The representative of the ACLU was on talking about why they were opposing a program Over in Gilbert as I recall.

And I could not help but think as I was listening to this particular woman speak. How our entire society has been absolutely positively hoodwinked. We don't think straight anymore. Nobody does even Christians have so allowed The secularism of our society to become totally unchallenged.

That we don't think straight anymore. Here was a situation and not I don't claim to be an expert on all I heard was the program. But a situation where the ACLU writes a letter to Gilbert and says you don't want to do this this program.

They're talking about this thing. They're talking about because it is not.

Neutral.

If you go the website, they're Christians so Christians cannot promote their worldview in our society and Nobody will stand back and say excuse me, but the ACLU has a worldview. Secular humanism is a worldview.

That woman representing the ACLU is a fundamentalist secular humanist. She is just as religious. In fact, sadly more religious and more zealous for her religion than most Christians are. These folks won't give up.

These folks won't back off. But they are promoting a worldview. Oh. But it doesn't have a God in it. It doesn't.

Really?

There are no ultimate authorities. In this worldview you better believe there are just because people don't have the guts. To rip the mask off and say here. Here's your God Doesn't mean that there is not a God in this system.

They may not call their ultimate authorities God. But you better believe they have their ultimate authorities. And you see this explains John Jacobson's wonderment. At the zeal of these people who want to make sure that that little child never sees the light of day.

You see they have their God. Their God is choice.

Choice.

Human autonomy. That's their God and you see if. Morality. Righteousness. The simple facts that this is a human child that deserves to live. Gets in their way. Gets in the way of that choice. Well that goes against their God.

That goes against their religion. And oh, are they so zealous in defense of their religion? They won't stop they just keep going and they serve their religion. And they serve their religion well day and night.

Tirelessly not just on one day of the week or two days of the week. They serve their God every day of the week. Scriptures describe such individuals. The scriptures describe the zeal that they have. After a long catalog which includes murder and that's what abortion is after a long catalog of the sins of men in Romans chapter 1.

Haters of God. Insolent arrogant boastful inventors of evil. This is the incredible statement of verse 32 of Romans chapter 1 and although they know the ordinance of God. And I'm sorry, you can't look me in the eye and tell me.

That Brian Finkel George Tiller and these people do not know what they're doing. They see those children someone well said that if a woman's abdomen were transparent, we would not have abortion in our land.

Well I don't know what that's the case. We certainly would know what's happening. We certainly would know that we're killing an individual human being. Abortionists know they have to deal with the mess that they create.

By their quote-unquote procedures. They know what they're doing. And although they know the ordinance of God. That those who practice such things are worthy of death. They not only do the same. But also give hearty approval to those who practice them.

They will pat each other on the back. They will encourage one another. Don't worry about those Christians. Bury that conscience. Don't let it bother you. Think of all the good you're doing and just let us define what good is.

Let's not worry about having any external means of defining good. And although they know the ordinance of God that those who practice such things are worthy of death, it's not that little baby. It's not Sarah Brown.

It's the people who practice such things. God's judgment hangs over their heads and even though they know that they not only continue to do these things. But they give hearty approval to those who practice them.

They encourage others to do it. You see if more of us are doing it, then we feel better. We'll take a poll and we'll discover what what the current viewpoint of the culture is and we'll determine what's more on the basis of the poll.

Isn't that what's happening in our land? Isn't that what's going on? My dear Christian listen to what's happening in our society when you hear a fundamentalist atheist a Fundamentalist secular humanist on the radio on television listen to how they speak.

Listen to what they say. These people are religious. These people have a worldview and we have to challenge it. We have to rip the face off of this supposed neutrality to hear the ACLU this program isn't neutral.

Friends the programs that denied God is creator are not neutral either. The educational system that has drummed it into the heads of. Every person that we're driving by on the road right now. Our next-door neighbor the person walking past us in the mall wherever you might be right now.

The reason that so many of these people the vast majority of these people even those who call themselves Christians. Never give a second thought to the idea that God is their creator. God is their maker and therefore God can place demands upon their lives.

God has a law that says this is right and this is wrong. You know why they don't think about God that way. Well, first of all, they don't want to and secondly the society we live in has said no, there's there's no creator God.

We're just the random result of a random process of chance. Life might have started on this planet. Maybe didn't start it doesn't matter. It just happened to have it's all random chance and then we wonder Why a Dylan Klebold shoots people?

If you think you're just simply the result of random chance, why not? We sit around wondering why is all this happening when the simple fact matter is my friends the society's foundations have been destroyed and Christians sit around and instead of imbibing from the Word of God the Christian worldview.

We imbibe from the world the world's view and then transport it into our view of Scripture and we wonder. Why there's not a strong voice that says this is right and this is wrong. Oh, but certainly the the media and people are come down you like a ton of bricks.

Oh, how close-minded of you you want closed mindedness? Listen to a humanist. Listen to a materialist. You want closed mindedness. Go read the time magazine article that Stephen Jay Gould just wrote About evolution you want closed mindedness.

That's where you'll find it. That's where you'll get it. The closed-mindedness comes from secularism. The closed-mindedness it says we will not listen to even the possibility that we are the creation of God.

And in fact, we will close your mouth. Try being a creation scientist once all happened to you as you'll be mocked. No one will engage you in any type of meaningful dialogue. They dare not do so. It's a religion.

And our society still remains very very religious. It's just we've exchanged the God of Christianity for the God of self. We've placed ourselves in the center. The sad thing is the result of that is a absolute and gross degradation of human life.

Life's not sacred anymore. You can have dr. Death running around up there in Michigan. You can have abortionists that are I have been turned into cultural icons and heroes. For being so brave to kill defenseless little children.

All in the name of women's rights. What about the rights of that child? Oh, well, let's not talk about that. That's not really a child. Why not. Every argument that they put forward you can shoot it down in flames.

Within two minutes if that person will simply allow any semblance of logic to exist in the conversation and. That's why I don't find any Abortionist who is actually willing to address the issue in any type of debate format.

They won't do it. They can't the facts are all against them and they know it and They thrive on muddled thinking. They thrive on those that can be Emotionally swayed one way or the other who do not have the ability to sit back and say I need to examine this issue on A factual and logical basis.

No, they don't want that because facts and logic stand directly contrary to them. So the only way to do it is to dumb people down focus them upon their emotions and. Well from what I see in our society, they've done a pretty good job of it a pretty good job of it post-christian society.

What happens when you abandon the teaching of the Word of God? What happens when what the Word of God teaches us about who we are and what we are. And The preciousness of human life. What happens when you abandon that?

We see it all around us. We see it every day in the behaviors of people the degradation of human life. It's no longer considered something that is sacred. It's something that's expendable. What do we do about it as Christians?

Well, there's only one thing we can do about it. We've only been given one power. We've only been given one ability. We don't get rid of these problems by banding together and compromising on the central issues the faith.

We don't get rid of these problems by compromising on what the gospel is. The only power that has been given to us that changes the hearts of men is the gospel. All of the gospel and that includes the section of the gospel that talks about God's freedom God's sovereignty and God's power.

We don't need to add a an update that emphasizes man's sovereignty man's freedom and man's power. That's playing to the very God of our society the God of choice. Autonomous man. You see theology does impact a lot of other things what you believe about the gospel does impact.

Even what you believe about How to interact with the society and deal with the society. What do you think five zero eight zero nine sixty is the number five zero eight? Zero nine sixty or one triple eight talk nine sixty and that's area code six.

Oh two. Five zero eight zero nine sixty. We've got to come up with all these numbers now. I said, I honestly don't know or if you're in four eight zero or Six two three, I'd assume you need to dial six.

Oh two to get five. Oh eight zero nine sixty. Not one triple eight talk nine sixty. I'm telling you someday we're gonna have 24 digit phone numbers. And I'm not sure how radio stations are gonna be able to survive that and get people to try to remember things like that.

Five zero eight zero nine sixty one triple eight talk nine sixty. Why has this story? Fallen off the radar screen. Why isn't anybody talking about anymore? Flash in the pan type stuff boy when it first came out.

Everybody's upset. All this is terrible. But you know folks as I listen to the people talking about it I Didn't hear anyone insightfully getting to the actual foundations of what the issues are and that includes.

Let's be honest here that includes the pro-life advocates. That includes the good guys sadly. Many on the pro-life side treat this as a political issue. It's one political side versus the other political side and in politics today.

It's it's not really wise. It's not really good to talk about things like moral absolutes God is creator who creates man and that therefore life is precious. That's a dangerous thing to do. You won't get elected if you say things like that so we make it a political football.

I Haven't heard anybody talking about the fact. Oh, yeah, they talked about you know this baby's going into the 28th week. That's a viable child. There's no reason to end this child's life. Let's talk about oh.

Well, it's supposed to be the result of rape. Oh. That's a big one today. See if the child is the result of an evil act. Then we have the right to take the life of the child. What happened to the person who did the raping?

Oh? Well, we need to defend them. I Mean they may have come from a bad background a bad situation. And no we need to kill the baby and coddle the criminal you wonder why our world's upside down.

Backwards.

You ever get the sense that things have just simply gone nuts. They have. But if you dare point these things out and say excuse me, but aren't you being grossly inconsistent? Aren't you being? Grossly contradictory with what you've stated elsewhere.

Oh, no no no no we. Who are you Oh unloving person? Who are you Oh mean nasty Christian fundamentalist? To attack me the greatly enlightened one. You see it every single day in the newspaper. You see it every single day on radio and television.

It happens all the time. How did it happen? Wasn't there a good old time as the golden age back a number of decades ago when? Everybody just believed the Bible was the Word of God. Well. I Don't think there really was.

I think there was obviously a time in our society. When? When people would accept that there was a supernatural revelation. And they would at least consider the possibility that they're subject to it.

There certainly has been a change has taken place over time. But how do we get where we are now? Well part of it is that we've been lulled to sleep and We don't listen to arguments. We don't listen to what people are saying.

We don't rip the mask off and say hey wait a minute. You're telling me. I can't quote-unquote promote my worldview. But you can promote yours under the cover of law. That's what the ACLU thinks. That's what the ACLU does.

Is promotes their worldview under the cover of law? But says to Christians, huh. Don't don't you don't you start promoting your worldview? That's religious that separates that violates the separation of church and state folks.

The Founding Fathers never believed that you could separate Church and state. What they said was that the state was not to make any law regarding the establishment of religion. You know the sad thing is I'll bet I'll bet 90 of the American populace today does not know what an establishment of religion is.

I bet 90 the American population Today does not realize that the colonies many of them had established religions. That is there was a state religion. This colony was this particular religion. That's what you had to be to be in this colony and what the Constitution says is no.

The government does not establish Anglicanism over Presbyterianism or Lutheranism over Baptist. That's what they were talking about in their historical context, but we don't care about historical context anymore.

What the Founding Fathers meant back then is irrelevant what we want them to mean now. That's what really matters. I'd like to hear what you think about it. Five zero eight zero nine sixty one triple eight talk nine sixty or the numbers.

Why don't you dial in now? We're gonna take a break and we come back. We'll talk to you about what's going on our society a post-christian society. And what can we as Christians do to live as salt and light and the society will be right back.

Living as Salt and Light in a Post-Christian Society

I'm back to the dividing line. My name is James white with you on this Saturday afternoon. Talking about our post-christian society how backwards and upside down and absolutely downright illogical it is self contradictory self-destructive and Yet so very politically, correct.

Well, we don't mind being politically incorrect around here and neither do some of our callers. For example, one of our more politically incorrect callers is Dennis and Phoenix. I think that's A political correct.

I'm sorry. How could you say such a thing? I'm a paragon of political. Yeah paragon of political. Wait a minute. That's weren't you the one a little while back that when we were talking about a certain a Certain television network that airs here in Phoenix on a channel.

I never mentioned between 20 and 22. That's uh, I think the terminology that you use I'm just quoting you now. Okay, it was the trash and blasphemy Network. Okay, isn't that what you said? That's fine.

Okay. I quoted you accurately there, right?

Okay. Hey, you know, I would never say something like that. I mean, I would never refer to the ACLU as the atheist communist lesbian Union. I would never do anything even I'm always like that.

How many do you have a book there or do you just sit around all day writing these things? I don't know. It just comes to me. I actually heard you call into a program recently. It was a it was a program that I think I think it was Don Mats at show As I recall.

And and that was you wasn't it? I sort of freaked out at the end. It has something to do with with Reformed Theology as I recall. Exactly that was that was the one and then you sort of disappeared real quickly.

Well, does that happen to you a lot? I'm saying that with my finger on the mute button Dennis. Anyways, that's not what we were talking about.

So.

Have you heard. I've been out of town for two days. Have you heard anything more about this particular issue in the past couple of days? Yes, the 14 year old girl went off to Kansas, yeah I guess so that has does.

No one has been able to confirm for me that the abortion is actually taking place. I have not heard any confirmation. It's just like it has fallen off the radar screen. Anyone at all hurting.

I love it judges. Well, we don't like our laws. We'll ship you off somewhere else. We like their.

That is probably the thing that has bothered me the most and that is you know I said to my my children before the last presidential election I said one of the things you need to realize is that you're the presidential election is not just for one man.

For four years that man appoints judges and If there's anything that the Bible warns us about in regards to society it is unrighteous. Judges, I mean When I listen to the reasoning and I listen to the worldviews that are now Informing the decisions of our judges. I go that there's there's the issue.

There is the the chief the chief means of the infection of our society has come through that means.

And the idea of original intent is novel. Oh, isn't it?

Oh, yeah, how interesting. How clean the idea that we should actually ask the question. What did the Founding Fathers actually intend when they wrote this. Imagine if if far less important contracts are true that way?

Well, yeah, I know you meant by this that you should get the money. But we have the power and we're interpreting it that we should get the money. In fact, we're gonna take your dog, too.

That's right. That's right. Oh, but don't ask anybody to be consistent in their application of such things. That's I. Shake my head and I just do not do not understand it outside of recognizing it is a it is willful rebellion against truth and Those who love the lie love the lie in many other areas as well as long as it doesn't hurt them.

I mean, look at the rationality in regards to abortion. I was standing outside of abortion clinic. I don't worry I wasn't throwing bombs or anything and I was just talking to a friend, you know into the world or maybe in this circumstance or whatever.

Light-tone. Yeah, really not part of the world.

It's already there. They have to deal with that reality, but obviously many people go Excuse me, but I just made a mistake and and I want to utilize technology to basically in essence forgive my sin forgive my rebellion forgive my Activities and I'm just going to use it for that and the vast majority.

The vast majority of abortions are performed just for that reason. They're not they're not these wild strange cases even in rape and incest.

Like if I found my dad was a rapist would be cool if you gave me the chair.

That seems to be what we think as long as long as something magical hasn't taken place and that magical Transition from womb to atmosphere hasn't taken place. Have you ever tried to get an abortionist who made that argument?

Oh, that's not really a human being until you're born. Have you ever tried to get an abortionist to explain? Logically and rationally the metaphysical reason that lies behind that. Excuse me. What about going from a womb to an operating room.

Transforms something from being non-human to human. Can someone explain that?

I mean like you want a breech birth. Pull them out feet first.

They're two-thirds out baby, but that heads in there so I can suck his brains out. That's what partial birth abortions all about. It does not make any sense and that's why every time this issue comes up You will never hear those who support it ever trying to defend it on a factual basis.

It is always emotions. It's always Talking about rights and things like that. I just. It just absolutely blows me away. Someone just mentioned that Ronald Reagan said it seems to me that all these pro-choice folks have already been born.

Well, that's quite true. There's I've never met a person Who was pro-choice who hadn't somehow managed to survive? The very period of time that they have turned into such a deadly deadly time in the development of children.

It is. It is truly incredible, well, thanks for calling in today Dennis we Already thanks for calling in. God bless. That opens up the phone line at five zero eight zero nine sixty five zero eight zero nine sixty one triple eight.

Talk nine sixty is the phone number. We'd like to hear from you and your thoughts this This weekend when we supposedly take time to remember Labor and labor workers and so on and so forth not labor as in child labor, obviously.

But labor is in working we find so many things to think about. To distract us from the fact that we live in a society that has blood upon its hands and you know Christian. If you go to church Sunday morning, and we stand around and say Oh God bless America.

Whatever you do don't go back to your Old Testament. Well, most people don't anymore anyways, but if you happen to go back to your Old Testament, you might discover That God does not take very seriously those who say bless us bless us bless us in the midst of their sin God said to Israel over and over and over and over again I don't want your sacrifices.

I don't want your religious worship. Your hands are covered with blood. How do we pray for our nation? It's a tough question. I Was raised to love the United States of America. I was raised to be patriotic and yet as I look at our society I Look at the fact that there is right now.

We were talking about this in our prayer meeting on Wednesday night. There is great concern being expressed by many Christian leaders that there are laws being Contemplated that there are laws being promoted with large amounts of money and great zeal by certain elements of our society to make sexual perversion not sexual orientation.

Orientation is whether you know whether you're standing upright or whether you're falling down your face. That's orientation. That's knowing north from south. We're talking here about sexual perversion.

Making sexual perversion a protected class in our society and Pushing it and this is what they want. They want to push it so that if a church exists and has employees that you cannot Discriminate quote-unquote discriminate that is to take away your freedom.

To hire people to work in your church. Who are not completely and totally opposed to everything you believe and teach. Now the society the media doesn't put it that way the media does not say. There is a move afoot to remove the freedom from American citizens.

To choose who will work with them based upon what people believe in regards to sexual perversion. They won't say that what they will say is there is a Wonderful effort being made to again protect the rights of all American citizens.

So that there be no discrimination bigotry or hatred but that we all love one another and that there be no differentiation in our opportunities of of employment and So that we all have freedom and can live together and hold hands and sing the Pepsi song together.

It's enough to make you really really become very very upset. When you realize the way that even words are twisted and perverted to avoid recognizing what's really going on and that is they want to take freedoms away from American citizens and specifically and purposefully Christian American citizens and the ultimate goal folks is real obvious.

Don't kid yourself. Don't kid yourself. The ultimate goal is to stop the worship and the gathering of Christian churches in open in our society. You'll already hear atheists saying that they think that our society should be completely free from religious Expression.

I remember a number of years ago and this tells you how old I've gotten. It's back when I had as much hair as Rich Pierce still has which I really don't appreciate. Yeah, which is actually thinning some though.

I hate to tell you that rich but just a little bit. Okay. Well, I Let's just put this way. I didn't have any gray hair at that particular point in time. Anyways, this was a long long time ago. Some of you may remember a man by the name of Tom Likas.

That name probably hasn't been uttered on Arizona radio for a long time. But Tom Likas used to be on KFY I KFY I think has tried to distance itself from the fact that Tom Likas used to be on KFY I but he was and Tom Likas was an atheist.

I Was on I think my recollections correct 16 times With Tom Likas and frequently I was on with atheists. Sometimes I was on with just Tom alone as an atheist and The most amazing encounter I ever had on the air.

And in fact, I think I think rich we still make available the Brian Lynch interview, don't we it's still available on. Is it on our website? It's available on the website if you want to hear an amazing and I was young back then.

Okay, and those of you who have have read all of Van Til's writings. No, I had not absorbed all of them quite yet at that particular point in time. So please forgive me. I was still learning. But I had an encounter with Brian Lynch of the American Atheist Society.

American no American Atheist not American Atheist Society. It was Madeline Maria Harris group. I had heard Brian Lynch on earlier with another minister and I had been shocked at the hatred that this man just Seeped over the air.

I mean it was incredible. So when they called me and asked me to be on I you know, I wore, you know asbestos that day because I expected to be totally flamed. And what I didn't know when I showed up was that he was in town.

I expected to be on the phone. Well, it was fascinating when he walked into the studio. The man could not have topped a hundred pounds he was about five foot two and He honestly sat down and and just so like well very nice weather we have today.

Very interesting studio here, isn't it? And it was it was amazing. I'm sitting here looking at this guy like no way. This is not the guy heard on the air before as soon as that mic turned on. Somebody else was sitting in that chair all of the hatred the anger the ridicule the the absolute Detestation for God and his people flowed out and then as soon as the microphone was turned off my it's very hot out there today.