Shadows to Substance Conference 2023 with Pastor Michael Schultz


Greg sat down with the speakers from the Shadows to Substance Conference 2023 hosted by  @openairtheology3783   His interviews included Pastor Greg Moering Jr, Pastor Kevin Hay, Pastor Claude Ramsey, Pastor John Crawford, Pastor Michael Schultz, Pastor Happy Addison, Pastor Braden Patterson, and Pastor Andrew Rappaport. Enjoy! Dead Men Walking Podcast:


All right, Michael Schultz, how are you sir? I'm doing very well. How you doing brother? Nice to meet you So we're continuing along in the subs from shadows of substance series here at the conference in Tullahoma, Tennessee and you just got done talking about the
Passover and how the Passover is a Shadow of Christ we had a he said
Paul says Christ is the Passover. I'm done. I'll walk off That's all I needed but oh,
I'd also be remiss to say that I had a gentleman reach out to me Who listens to the podcast? He just moved up to Michigan.
I'm from Michigan and he said hey, can we connect? I'm in Battle Creek or a Monroe. I said sure and then he called me today or yesterday and I go
I'm in Tennessee goes that's my stopping grounds. I go. I'm at the shadows to you know Conference and substance conference and he goes wait a minute.
I think Schultz is down there. His name's Josh Howard Yeah, do you know him? Yeah. Yeah conference with Josh last year.
He's fantastic. So he told me to tell you. Hi Oh great. I love Josh. He's a fantastic guy. He's doing great work all over good.
Good Yeah, it's it's so fun when the Word of God and kind of podcasting the conferences bring brothers
In the Lord, you know together kind of get to know each other. So tell us a little bit we'll just have a few minutes with you here, but Absolutely great session probably one of my favorite subjects
Tell us how maybe in a few minutes here how Christ is the Passover is a shadow of Christ Yeah, so well the the lamb symbolism is pretty straightforward.
Sure. Most people can pick that up on their own Yeah, but what I really highlighted in in the sermon was how that the lamb
It was very specific. God gave specific instructions. Every person has to be covered by the blood of the lamb
They have to have a specific lamb it must be exactly like this and it must be slaughtered in such a way and you can't waste any of the sacrifice and So we can see those shadows of Christ in that But I also wanted to highlight the fact that the shadow doesn't measure up to the substance
And so in the sense that the Israelites had to provide their own lamb, they had to slaughter their own lamb They had to apply the blood of the lamb themselves
God has taken that responsibility Entirely on himself and he's provided the Lamb of God and he has slaughtered the lamb and he applies the blood of the lamb
And so with Christ we have a much greater lamb something that we could never have provided never have actually applied to ourselves and so The Passover is a shadow, but I think that Paul would probably agree
It doesn't at all measure up to the substance of Christ. Yeah. Yeah, and like you said, it's one of the more
I would say probably one of the more popular shadows, right throughout this conference we've been talking about a few things arc of the
Covenant being a shadow and And the priests being a shadow and things like that I've always found it and tell me what you think here.
I found that one of the Passover. What are the most striking? ideas of Bringing the old and new covenants together.
I have some Jewish friends and when I talk to them I don't understand how they they can't put those two together because they're so You know, the
Bible talks about a veil over the eyes and things like that, but it's such a beautiful representation of Christ In Christ at the
Passover saying you do this in remembrance of me. This is what this is why you're doing that, right?
And we've had this reoccurring theme on these little sessions here on the podcast of how we have churches that want to unhitch the
Old Testament Shane From the New Testament and we've talked about that a couple times here
So I won't rehash that too much But but essentially saying we've spent most of our time at this conference in the
Old Testament because we're looking at those shadows How important is it for for believers to see those shadows and understand those and and does that help our faith?
Yeah, absolutely. First of all, I don't think that I don't think that any Christian can rightly say we don't need the
Old Testament There's some preachers out there they do and I think you know their names. Yeah, Christ certainly would disagree
We had a man mentioned this morning, you know Christ begins to lay out to the people on the road to Emmaus everything about himself from the
Old Testament Yeah, and he made a great point also brother John Hey Christ had no
New Testament. Yeah, he preached Christ purely from the Old Testament Amen, and Paul did too by the way
Yeah, Paul is going around conversing with these Jews in the synagogues all over Asia Minor. Yeah conversing with them about Christ Convincing them from the
Old Testament and it's not just an evangelistic tool to Jews for Christians we do need to see this is a
Comprehensive book where God has been here from the beginning you you can go back farther But at the very least you'd have to say we have
Christ in Genesis 315. Yeah, the the proto -evangelium you are right there Yeah, okay,
I will give a seed and the seed of the woman will crush your head he's he's there from Genesis 3 we heard him from Genesis 7 earlier with the
Ark and To to eliminate those signs and seeing how that God didn't just introduce something new with the person of Christ Matthew right.
This is not a new book He's continuing his book and bringing his plan to fulfillment and showing everybody what he has been pictorially
Depicting for all these years. Yeah So, yeah I think that it's a fool's errand to try to unhitch from the
Old Testament or in any way undermine the Old Testament's importance That's ridiculous. Yeah, and you had a really good point to of a specific shadow within a shadow of even the act of Every single person even
Moses and Aaron had to be covered by the blood, right? You gave a fun little example and I've been guilty of this too of you say we're all sinners, right?
But then you made the example of you know Maybe a Paul Washer or heck even a James White or someone like that walks in you go everyone kind of gravitates there
They're sinners too, but maybe a little less sinner, right? You said it kind of just but it's making the point that even even us we can get into that mindset of There's some that are more worthy than others when in fact, we're all unworthy.
We're all sinners We're all depraved in need of a holy righteous and just God, right? So we even see a shadow in the every single man had to atone
Had to be atoned for the Moses the Aram do you think there was any significance in each man and his family?
Doing it, you know Moses and Aaron couldn't go and do it for them. Yeah, is there a shadow there? I mean, what are we what are we seeing when he's commanding each man for his family has to go put the blood on the
Doorpost. Yeah, so I did very lightly touch on that that it was not something that Moses and Aaron could do for the people
Of Israel every single man had to act as his own priest Are you pretty graphic language? But it's the reality that every single man had to take the knife in his own hands
He had to slaughter the lamb. He had to apply the blood. He had to do it in his own house There's no holy place. No temple.
No tabernacle. No altar He is the one responsible and so I made a little bit of a comment about talk about the priesthood of the believer
Because he's his own high priest. He doesn't take it to somebody now Of course, we know Christ is our high priest and he's done all of that work for us
But there's a reality where we are still all Individually responsible for the application of the blood of the
Lamb. I won't God doesn't have grandchildren Okay, God has children and just because your parents were
Christians doesn't mean that you're gonna be you don't get to you know Right you're in and say well God's my grandpa So I'm going to heaven anyway, because my parents are
God's children, right? You don't get in like that every single person has to have the blood of Christ applied to them individually.
Yeah, you don't get in Under these sort of household narratives, yeah, that's not how it works.
Yeah I think that you see that with Moses and Aaron not being able to serve the whole nation of Israel that way
That they had to tell the men you're all responsible yourselves Yeah, no, and you know as a hunter and someone who processes his own
Animals even just the physical reality of having to like you said take the knife in his own hand That's even when we were talking about priests that job was pretty gruesome
I mean, you're burning you're cutting there's blood there's skin the smells. I mean, I've done it before it's it's it's not fun
Ask any butcher or anyone who does processing of animals It's not a it's not a light task
So there was some personal responsibility there to to be personally responsible for for you and your family
Which which I think is event a Shadow of Christ as well as good
Reformed folk We also believe that God also holds us personally responsible even in his sovereignty And if you don't like it, you don't get to ask him why
Paul says right, right? You're not God so I think you had such a
I thought your session was so good because it's kind of a glossed over Shadow because it seems to be the most popular but yet there's a lot of intricacies in there that you really brought out
Tell everyone Where you're at where they can find yet. Are you pastoring right now? You are
Pastoring I pastor a church called Antioch Baptist Church. Okay, and Lewisburg, Kentucky We are reforming and always reforming.
So at the moment, I'm a sole pastor and I'm leveraging for plurality of elders So we're working right, but we are we are
Definitely trying to be faithful to God's Word and and we're thankful for any support that we get
Are you a newer church plant? No, we've been there a while. This church is 206 years old
Wow, and I've been there Yeah, I've been there four years and what was really convenient for me at least when
I came in as a reformed guy It was largely and what we might call an IFB Church when I got there
Yeah, most everybody dispensationalist most everybody was KJV and so very different but I asked if they had the original documents and they did from their founding and It's bound in a book that's made of wood
I mean Wow such an old book handwritten and when I opened it up it has the statement of faith and it's essentially the 1689
And so I was able to say look I'm not teaching something new. I'm teaching something so old your grandma never heard of it
Right. Okay, so and to be able to say look these are the founding documents of our church Yeah, and I'm teaching this and just because you've never heard it doesn't mean it's new or novel or heretical or wrong, right?
It means this is something that's been Abandoned for a while sure and we're trying to return to what we've always had
Wow. So, how was that received? Well, the the legacy members have been hit or miss some of them very well adapted to it
And but more not because of the historical thing, although that helped Yeah, the biblical arguments have been just unavoidable for a lot of them is the first time they've ever been under expositional preaching
So as we're going verse by verse book by book there. There's just no avoiding this But there are some that you know drew back from it like you'd expect most in the four years that I've been there we've grown from a church of about 17 to now we average 61 and Most everybody that's joined when they join
I asked them Okay tell me a little bit about your salvation story and tell me why you want to join the church and most all of them say
We really love the teaching and the preaching here Yeah, and so we've got people coming not that we don't have music not that we don't have programs
But people are coming for the Word of God Wow, and that's exciting to me It's encouraging and so we're excited about what
God's doing out in the woods in Kentucky Well just as we finish up here. Well, what was that like when you four years ago?
What made you jump into that because that is an uphill battle brother, you know, like you said dispensational
King James Oh, it's quite a shift from probably what you're preaching. Now. Did you go? Okay, I'm a roll up my sleeves and by the grace
He leads me is that kind of yeah four years there was certainly a leading of God towards the ministry there and We knew it was gonna be hard and we knew that it was gonna be a lot of fighting
Yeah, we knew that. Yeah, but I guess I'm of a different approach than most people most guys
They'll strive at a church and if the church is bucking them a bit, you know, he kick against the pricks. Sure Then they'll say well, you know what?
We're just gonna go plant a church and not that I'm against that but there's something to be said about This church has been here 206 how many people can say that not many pastors especially to that's awesome, right?
And so for me to say look, we're gonna buckle down and if we get voted out we get voted out but we're gonna be here and faithfully serve this church and try to do our very best to do what
God would have done in this church and We're gonna take that legacy that this church has and revive it and say this is who we are it's who we've always been and we're gonna allow
God to lead and like I said my wife and I we Decided a long time ago if we get voted out we get voted out
God that's in God's hands, right? We're just gonna be faithful where we are while we're here and try to do our best and for the time being it's always been
Productive it's not been easy, but it's been a blessing and we're thankful for God bringing us there.
Amen Amen, so give everyone your socials and maybe some information about the church if they're in the area They're listening and they want to stop by well,
I don't really spend much time on social media I'm on Facebook. I have a YouTube channel, but I don't really
We post our services to YouTube and so you can look it up ABC Lewisburg is I think a good way of finding us
And that's le W I S B U R G Lewisburg, but I'm always glad to talk with people
Like I said, you can find my information online. There's a video of me speaking with Josh Howard at the conference last year
Okay on YouTube. That's a pretty easy way to hear my preaching or even to get a hold of me Anybody that comments on there?
I try to talk with them and get you my email and stuff That's called historic premillennialism because I'm a historic premill guy
Okay, so I represented that perspective at the conference last year and I'd love to talk to anybody awesome.
Cool Well, thanks so much for stopping by we'll make sure we link all that up when this goes live and guys Thank you for joining us for another session during the subs from shadows of substance conference
We'll keep bringing you more of the speakers and more of this content as always Understand the chief and a man to glorify
God bring him joy him and glorify him and God bless guys Be sure to follow us on Facebook and Instagram at dead men walking podcast for full video podcast episodes and clips or email us at dead men walking podcast at gmail .com