WWUTT 920 Q&A Unplanned, Gosnell, Walsh, Baucham, Jesting, and Angels?

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Should you go see the movie Unplanned? How about the film Gosnell? Is there anywhere that you can see that?

00:07

What's up with Matt Walsh lately and what are the roles of angels? The answers to these questions and others when we understand the text.

00:25

This is when we understand the text a daily study in the Word of Christ that we may be ready to give an answer for the hope that is within us.

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Doing this with gentleness and respect. Let others know about our ministry at www .utt .com.

00:39

Here once again is Pastor Gabe. Thank you, Becky. You're welcome. So since our last podcast,

00:45

I have been to the theater to see the movie Unplanned. Yes. On Amazon Prime, I watched 3801

00:53

Lancaster, which is the documentary about Kermit Gosnell, the abortion doctor in West Philadelphia, who was tried and convicted for murder, and all that has since transpired.

01:07

And then I've also watched the film Gosnell, which is a movie about that particular trial of discovering what was going on in his clinic, putting him on trial, and sentencing him to life in prison.

01:21

So I think I'm done with abortion films for a while. That would be nice.

01:27

It's kind of haunting. It is. And in fact, I wasn't planning on talking about this, but after watching 3801

01:35

Lancaster, which, by the way, I've watched all of these and Becky has not. No, no. I knew.

01:42

And I'm OK with that. Right. I knew going into this, I'm going to be watching these alone.

01:47

Becky's not going to be joining me. I didn't even bother asking. I don't need the visuals. I already have enough in my head.

01:53

Yeah. So I watched 3801 Lancaster. It's an hour long documentary.

01:58

If you have Amazon Prime, you're able to watch it for free. You say for free, but you're paying for Amazon for free quotations.

02:07

Right. You don't have to pay extra. It comes with your Amazon Prime. Oh, sorry. Yeah. So the anyway,

02:14

I watched it after Becky went to bed and it's not the it's not the most well done documentary.

02:19

I think it's good to watch for educational purposes and you'll definitely learn something from it.

02:25

But you are able to grasp what's being presented in the documentary better when you know what is going on before you watch it.

02:33

OK, because they don't really do a good job of setting it up, explaining what it is exactly you're watching. So but otherwise,

02:39

I think the pacing was a little off. They just expected you to know. Yeah. It's mostly clips of interviews because there's nobody really narrating it or guiding everything.

02:48

It's just showing you a series of things. But anyway, so you can find that on Amazon Prime.

02:54

I watched that when Becky had gone to bed and there was a thought that I had.

02:59

I won't explain what this thought was going through my mind, but I knew when I had this thought it was after I was done watching the documentary.

03:05

I was about to go to bed myself and I had this thought and I knew just having that thought. Sleep was not going to come well.

03:12

Yeah. And I had nightmares all night long. Yeah. And so anyway, all of these things are very difficult to watch unplanned.

03:20

As I said in my review for unplanned, the R rating on that film is deserved.

03:26

I didn't say that in my review to dog on the movie. I think the movie showed what it needed to show.

03:32

Right. But it's still not a movie you want to take your kids to. You need to see it first.

03:38

And if wasn't there a kid with his an adult with him, I guess probably his dad.

03:44

Right. Yeah. Wasn't that in the theater? Yeah. They were right behind me. OK. Just to my left.

03:51

And when the scene came up, it's within the first 10 minutes of the movie. The scene comes up of the abortion that Abby Johnson witnessed.

03:59

And that was kind of the abortion that changed her mind and where she had kind of her wake up call. OK. They show that pretty early on in the film and when it was coming up because they call her in the room and she's going to be helping with the ultrasound and all this kind of thing.

04:12

When that scene was being set up, there was a father and there was somebody sitting between them and then his son was on the other side.

04:19

And he immediately figured out what was about to happen. And they've got like arms full of popcorn and drinks and everything.

04:27

And he jumps up and grabs his son and goes, we're going. Oh, good. And ushered him out. But I don't think they ever came back.

04:33

Right. I think the dad came back in to retrieve something out of their seats. But then after that, they never returned.

04:39

When the scene was over, there was another person or two that left. And then another 10 minutes later, there's another scene.

04:45

Oh, my God. Which shows the effect of the abortion pill. Are you for 86? That scene for me was more chilling than the rest, because I think

04:53

I knew little about are you for 86 and the effects it can have on a woman. That was a that was a really tough scene as well.

05:02

Really, it's not an easy movie to watch altogether. But you don't go there for entertainment. Right.

05:07

Yes. You do not go into this film for entertainment. That's absolutely true. But then during that scene, there were another couple of people that got up and left.

05:15

Man, so I would be really tough. Here would be my concern with that. It just reflecting back on it and thinking of the people that got up out of the theater and left.

05:25

I wonder if they thought the hype surrounding the rating was that this was a political move to discourage people from going and seeing the film, and they were not actually prepared for what was in the movie.

05:37

And I say this in the review as well. I don't think that the promotional team behind the movie handled the

05:45

R rating well. They used it to stir up hype and attention for their movie. And what they should have done was, yeah, this movie deserves an

05:54

R rating because it shows the murder of children. I mean, they they probably should have said something to that degree because the

06:01

MPAA, who puts the ratings on films, was was essentially saying, look, what you're depicting in this movie is not just some sort of operation like you would see on a hospital drama on TV.

06:13

You're depicting the slaughter of children. It's like it's like the MPAA was saying that by putting an

06:18

R rating on it. And so it should have been within the film's promotional team to say, look, the MPAA agrees with what we're depicting in this film.

06:26

Right. It's not just tissue that's being removed. Yeah, it's showing the destruction of babies. You know that that's in the movie before you go in to see it.

06:34

You should not take your kids. I have an 11 year old who does pretty well, and I would not take her to see this movie.

06:42

So you need to see it first before you can take your I know

06:47

I mean, depending on what you've seen with your teenager, you know, you know well what your kids are able to process, what they understand.

06:56

Bring your tissues. I was warned that I needed to bring tissues before I even asked you.

07:02

I think you did. I said, do you have tissues? And you're just like, whatever. I was sitting in the theater. The chair that I sat in was a single standing chair.

07:11

OK, so there were no other chairs to my right or to my left. I don't even know why that chair was there.

07:17

But I walked in. It wasn't occupied. Everything else was packed. And so I went ahead and just grabbed that chair.

07:22

But I sat down and I texted Becky. I said, well, I've got my seat in this place is full. It is a full theater.

07:28

This was in Manhattan, Kansas, which is about 20 miles from where we live. Yeah. In our own town, the movie isn't playing.

07:34

But I read that because of the success of that opening weekend, they're expanding out to 1700 theaters now.

07:40

Oh, wow. So maybe it is in our community this weekend. I don't know. Maybe. But check your local listings. Now, I'm very hesitant to recommend movies.

07:49

In fact, you probably never heard me recommend a movie. Probably not. No. Yeah. I don't think I've done that. Talk about.

07:55

Yes. Right. Not not recommend. So I'm not saying that behind this film either. See it if you want to or don't.

08:01

It's not I don't think this is a movie that's going to change your life. And I'm certainly not within the realm of people that says we need to get behind this film and we need to support it.

08:11

Now, that's not me. Yeah. Because people are going to change their minds by the hearing of the gospel. Right.

08:16

Which, by the way, I said, is not in the movie unplanned. It's not in that film.

08:22

And that brings us to some comments that I've received. This is how we're going to start off with the the questions that we've received from listeners.

08:32

The Q &A. Right. Yep. Our Q &A. But these aren't exactly questions. They're just comments. Oh, OK.

08:38

Q &A and Q &A and C. Right. QC and a C questions, comments and answers.

08:46

Sure. So you can send your questions. That's right. You can send your questions to when we understand the text at Gmail dot com.

08:53

These comments have been taken from the blog that I posted, which was the review of the film unplanned.

09:00

OK. And I wanted to respond because because most of these are rather critical. I've got a video response I'm going to do to this as well.

09:06

It'll be posted on the the Facebook page. Oh, and I've started a new YouTube channel. So I was

09:11

I was trying to figure out how, you know. Yes. How can I do videos that are going to be longer than 90 seconds but still keep that that channel where, you know, you're going to get biblical teaching in 90 seconds?

09:22

OK. So I've started a new channel. It's W .W .U .T .T. Ext. Ext. Oh, extended.

09:31

So, right. Extended. But it's basically W .W .U .T. Text. Awesome. So, right.

09:38

So they're extended videos explaining longer than what we do in the 90 second videos, although they're not going to follow the same format like I do in the 90 second videos.

09:46

But anyway, so if you you can subscribe to that channel, if you're subscribed to us on YouTube, that's great. W .W .U

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.T .T. And then you can also look up YouTube dot com slash W .W .U .T. Text.

09:58

And that's where the extended videos are going to be. That's fun. So in my review,

10:03

I said that the gospel is not in the movie unplanned. And the majority of criticisms that I received as a result of that statement in my review is that that wasn't the point of the movie.

10:17

So, for example, Dan's comment, I read, I read very few of the comments. And that's

10:22

I saw a lot of that repeated. Yeah. People saying, well, you missed the point of the movie game.

10:28

Yeah. Like critiquing, criticizing. Do you want to say crikey? I don't know what

10:33

I'm saying. Criticizing people going crikey. Crikey. So anyway,

10:40

Dan's comment here, I think I'd like to use that word a little more often. Yeah, right. That's a fun word. We need to make it a little bit more

10:45

American. So I think Dan's comment exemplifies that a little bit where he says nobody said in this case that the movie had to be about presenting salvation with the millions of murders of murdered babies every year.

11:01

The reality of what happens needed to be shown. So hopefully people will wake up.

11:07

I am not arguing about the importance of presenting Jesus. You are misplacing what the movie was made for.

11:13

It is to help stop the murder of innocent lives. First of all, let me say and let me say this very respectfully.

11:19

But I'm astounded that I actually have to prove to you that the purpose of the movie was presenting the gospel.

11:29

Remember, the creators of this film is Pure Flix. They are a Christian movie making organization.

11:35

Right. They are also behind the film Case for Christ, by the way, which was the kind of the movie version of Lee Strobel's journey from atheist to Christian.

11:44

OK. Somebody told me I never saw a case for Christ. So I'm I'm taking this on on a what would you say?

11:51

A third person account grapevine through the grapevine. Secondhand. There we go.

11:57

It's it's coming second. I didn't want to use the term hearsay hearsay, but it's it's from somebody who saw the film.

12:02

Yeah. But they told me that the gospel is not in that movie either. A case for Christ.

12:08

Yeah, that's that's weird. Didn't present the gospel. But anyway, Pure Flix is notorious for this.

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They do they do this all the time. They're characterized as Christian films, and yet they don't present the gospel in their movies.

12:21

And so unplanned was the same way. So once again, I'm astounded that I have to prove that the purpose of the movie was to present the gospel.

12:29

And then the gospel wasn't in the movie. But here are the exact words of Abby Johnson.

12:34

Remember, unplanned is the story of Abby Johnson, who, by the way, said of this movie, it's not based on her life story.

12:41

It is her life story. OK, that's the word of Abby Johnson. So here here is what she said.

12:47

This is according to the Catholic News Service, March 19th, which was before the film came out, 10 days before the film's release.

12:53

Right. Abby Johnson said that the film is mostly about, quote, the amazing, ready mercy of Jesus Christ that is available to everyone, whether you've been touched by abortion or not, that Christ is so ready to redeem us.

13:12

That, she says, is the main purpose of the film. And yet the gospel of Christ is never presented in that scene where Abby and her husband are talking.

13:26

And this is after Abby has left the clinic and she's in a sobbing mess in on her living room floor.

13:31

Her husband comes and sits down next to her. And she says in the course of their conversation, she says, how can

13:39

God forgive me for this? And her husband says, because he's God. I promise you that the filmmakers think that's the gospel.

13:48

They think they presented the gospel with that response, with her husband's response. All you have to do is believe in God.

13:53

He forgives your sins. That's not the gospel. God doesn't forgive us because he's God. Right.

13:59

God forgives us because he is both just and the justifier of the one who has faith in Jesus. According to what we read in Romans 326,

14:08

God forgives because the price has been paid. It was paid by Christ who died on the cross for our sins so that anyone who believes in him will be forgiven.

14:20

Even the sin of being complicit in the murder of twenty two thousand babies, which is what

14:28

Abby Johnson. That's her testimony. Wow. She was involved in the nine years that she worked for that Planned Parenthood clinic in the deaths of twenty two thousand children.

14:37

Can God forgive you of that sin? Yes. Through faith in the gospel.

14:44

But that's never in the movie. So if you think that this film is supposed to be the message of Christ being ready to redeem us, and yet you don't give that message of redemption, then you've missed the point.

14:58

I didn't miss the point of the movie. The filmmakers missed the point. Right. Now, what were you going to say?

15:04

I was going to say that that wasn't what Dan was pointing out, though. But that's what Abby was pointing out, that the film is about Christ.

15:12

Right. And we're saying it's not. We're saying it's not. And Dan was saying that that wasn't the point. That wasn't the point of the movie.

15:19

But Abby said it was. Right. Abby said that was just a big old mess. Yeah. They did not do it well.

15:25

And that was see, that was the point of my review. So when people were telling me that I missed the point of the movie, my response to them would have been,

15:33

I think you missed the point of my review. Yeah. Because the point was that the filmmakers weren't even sure of their own message.

15:38

There were there were times within the movie I felt like they were contradicting what they were trying to say. Yeah. And that's not just stuff that was going on behind the scenes.

15:47

That's actually in the story of the movie. It just wasn't well put together. I mean, it's a pure flicks movie.

15:53

Yeah. They're usually like that. Yeah. They're kind of confused about their own message.

15:59

They're trying to make wholesome family entertainment. And oh, we're going to sprinkle the gospel in there. That wasn't really wholesome.

16:05

Now, that one wasn't. Yeah. That's not family friendly either. Of all the pure flicks movies, Unplanned is not in that category of family friendly, but I think it's only it's their only

16:15

R rated film. I don't even know that there's even a PG -13 rated movie in the pure flicks library.

16:21

I may be wrong about that, but that's that's just an assumption. But anyway, further along, understanding that the movie did mean to present the gospel, even though it didn't.

16:32

Abby Johnson said that she believes that the movie will bring redemption for women. I don't even think it does that.

16:39

I'll explain that in a little bit or I might explain that in the video if I don't come back to that here on the podcast. On the pure flicks podcast,

16:46

Abby said that she wanted this movie to show off God's story. Ashley Bratcher, who played

16:53

Abby in the movie, she said that she had to rely on the Holy Spirit with every scene that she entered into.

16:59

And she thinks her portrayal in the movie was by the power of the Holy Spirit. She said that the church, this again is

17:08

Ashley, says that the church needs to get behind this movie. And by doing so, we will show that we care.

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I think you show more that you care by going to an abortion clinic and preaching the gospel outside an abortion clinic by warning those women about what they're about to do and telling them to turn from their sin.

17:29

You do more to show that you care in that act than you do by going and watching this movie.

17:36

In an interview with Dr. Michael Brown, Ashley Bratcher said that God made this movie happen and that playing this role was the closest to God she has ever been in her entire life.

17:48

On Unplanned's Twitter feed, and everybody probably knows the controversy surrounding

17:53

Unplanned's Twitter feed, Twitter keeps shutting it down and they reactivate again and they lose all their followers.

17:59

And so, I mean, yeah, there's there's definitely a conspiracy going on there. Yeah. But on Unplanned's Twitter, they said that this movie is a message of hope and redemption for those in need.

18:09

J .D. Greer, the president of the Southern Baptist Convention, has said that this movie is a story of redemption. The Wall Street Journal said it was about redemption.

18:16

PJ Media said this movie was about redemption in Jesus Christ. I mean, really, when it comes down to it, everyone seems to think that this movie is about presenting the gospel, except for the people who are criticizing me for saying that the movie doesn't present the gospel.

18:29

Yeah. Why would they? Why would there be such confusion if it was clear that it was about redemption?

18:37

I mean, are they reading that into the story? Now, that's that's definitely what they were attempting to tell.

18:43

It's just not in the story. Not only is that not in the story, but I don't even think there's any advice for women in the movie as to what they should do instead of get an abortion.

18:54

It shows visually the things that go on behind the scenes at a Planned Parenthood clinic, and it does that very effectively.

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And so that and I said that in the blog. I think that that can be effective. And I enjoyed the movie for the most.

19:09

I mean, as much as you can enjoy a film like that. But I just I think I said I liked it. If I'm going to cut it some slack there,

19:16

I did say I liked the movie. But so visually, I think it was effective.

19:21

I think it was also good at showing the politics behind Planned Parenthood. OK, one of the things that the movie does is debunk the whole myth about abortion being three percent of the services that Planned Parenthood provides.

19:34

No, that's what they're all about is providing abortion. That is their entire missional focus is to abort babies.

19:42

Otherwise, it wouldn't be in my face. Yeah, all the time. Right. The new president who is who just became president of Planned Parenthood last year,

19:50

I think. I mean, she is open about no, we're about providing abortion. That's exactly what we're about.

19:56

And if we were to stop providing abortion, then Planned Parenthood would shut down. I mean, she's been open and brazen about that.

20:02

Wow. So there's no hiding now what the purpose of Planned Parenthood is, even from the president's own mouth.

20:09

And you don't even need the movie unplanned to prove that. But I think that unplanned does a good job of exposing some of the politics behind all of that.

20:17

Tony from Stillwater, Oklahoma. He said the movie was filmed in my town. I can tell you that this movie was not meant to be a gospel presentation.

20:25

It was meant to show two things. Many workers are blinded by the fact that they believe that they are truly helping women.

20:32

I think he's talking about abortion workers there. And abortion is the murder of a child. Sometimes the small steps matter.

20:38

It's causing people to ask questions about abortion. Well, one of the things that I said in my review is that it's true that the movie shows that abortion is the murder of a child, but it doesn't say that abortion is the murder of a child.

20:54

That's never mentioned in the movie. The only person, the only people I could say, the only group in the film that ever refer to abortion as murder are the sidewalk protesters outside whom

21:06

Abby Johnson strongly dislikes. She can't stand those sidewalk protesters. And holding up signs of murdered babies and signs that say abortion is murder.

21:17

You know, she is saying that that is ineffective. And now there are certainly some horrible people out there sometimes in the way they do their protests, like, oh, yeah, like throwing bloody baby dolls.

21:28

They'll they'll throw they'll throw them and say you're going to hell and stuff. Now, stuff like that is awful.

21:33

That's certainly not the way that we're supposed to approach this. Oh, no, definitely not. The way that you opened up the episode, quoting

21:40

First Peter three fifteen. We need to be ready to give an answer for the hope that lies within us. But doing this with gentleness and respect.

21:48

Yeah. So I'm certainly not in favor of that. But Abby also doesn't like, you know, any sidewalk prophet, prophet, meaning anyway, that's probably not the best word.

22:00

Sidewalk preacher evangelist. Yeah, there you go. I was meaning prophet as somebody who's prophesying, not somebody who's coming up with new revelations.

22:08

OK. Yeah. Anyway, the she she's against any sort of sidewalk evangelist being out there telling women that abortion is murder and you need to repent of your sin.

22:17

And she said, no, we need to love these these abortion employees as though they don't know what it is that they're doing.

22:25

They know exactly what it is that they're doing. They've seen the stuff that's going on in there, the stuff that the guys outside are holding up on the signs.

22:33

The signs are really there to warn the women who are going in what is about to happen, right?

22:39

Not necessarily the the people who work there, because they know what goes on there. I mean, I mean, Abby even really showed in the movie.

22:45

They know exactly what's happening in in in an abortion clinic. Oh, yeah. They're not clueless to any of that.

22:52

Tony said abortion is the murder of a child. The film was meant to show that abortion is a murder of a child.

22:58

Yeah, it shows that. But it won't say that. So only the abortion protesters whom the movie made out to be fools.

23:04

They're the only ones that ever call abortion murder in the movie. Rose from Michigan says,

23:09

I don't agree with your review. I've heard Abby Johnson speak in person. Her road to where she is now is amazing.

23:15

The movie was not a movie about her salvation. I see previous comment. That's exactly what she said it was about.

23:22

It's a movie about the horrors of the abortion industry. I thought it was a great film depicting the heinous

23:28

Planned Parenthood money making machine while touting that we should help women. Well, as I said earlier,

23:33

I don't even think the film helps women. Yeah, because there was a scene where Abby, now she no longer works at the

23:40

Planned Parenthood Clinic and now she's outside the fence appealing to women just like the the missions guys like like 40 days of.

23:49

Oh, I can't remember the name of the organization now. But anyway, the the folks that were out there kindly telling her, you know, don't don't do this anymore.

23:56

OK, but not telling her it was sin, not calling it murder. Well, of course not. Right. And she says they're the ones that convinced her.

24:03

Well, it took them nine years, apparently. So anyway, in the meantime, you killed twenty two thousand children.

24:10

But the Abby is speaking to a woman on the other side of the fence, on the inside of the fence and saying, you don't have to do this.

24:17

There are other things that you can do. And she says, I used to work here. I used to be the director of this clinic. And so the girl comes toward her and she's talking with her through the fence.

24:26

And while they're talking, Abby's voice drowns out as she's telling the woman, there are other things that you can do.

24:32

You don't have to do this. OK, her voice drowns out and the music that's playing over her. The song is allowed to have kind of the stage.

24:40

Oh, so the song's playing and you see the two of them talking, but you don't hear what Abby's saying. But wouldn't the message of what she's saying be more important than the song?

24:49

Exactly. That's exactly right. So at the point, so they just give the illusion to the gospel and the illusion to helping women, helping women.

24:59

Right. But it doesn't the illusion to redemption. Yes. But it doesn't actually deliver those messages at all.

25:07

So, yeah, sure. The movie's got people talking, but OK. Now what? Yeah. And like I said, part two.

25:15

Yeah, that's right. Unplanned to maybe that's what they have in mind. But the one of the things that I said in the review toward the end of the review is the movie still left a lot of questions unanswered.

25:25

And one of those questions is what can a woman do who is convinced that abortion is wrong?

25:31

And the film doesn't answer that question in that scene where Abby had the chance to tell a woman what else they could do.

25:38

The film even drowned out her voice and played the song instead. That's so sad. Yeah. So at every opportunity that they had the chance to speak a message, they didn't.

25:48

All they did was tell Abby Johnson's story of how she went from pro abortion to pro life.

25:53

But even her her pro life position is in doubt because when a bill came up in the state of Texas to outlaw abortion, she was against it.

26:05

Really? Yep. Because it would have criminalized abortion. And so anybody seeking an abortion would have been considered attempting murder.

26:13

And she said that she's not in favor of any bill that criminalizes a woman. Well, of course, it has the murder word, right?

26:20

She doesn't like that. We can't refer to it as murder. It's killing a baby. But no, apparently no one's responsible for this.

26:29

Oh, it's just big, bad Planned Parenthood. Now, now, Planned Parenthood is is a gulag. I mean, it is it is a concentration camp where babies go to die.

26:38

So I'm not at all trying to trying to relieve Planned Parenthood for any guilt. But the women that go in getting abortions are pro abortion.

26:46

Yeah. And they know what they're doing. Like maybe they are a little bit clueless the first time around.

26:52

But then you've got women going in for second and third abortion. Even Abby Johnson in the movie had at least two abortions.

27:00

So anyway, the film had an opportunity to speak. A great message did not accomplish that.

27:06

Like I said, see it if you want to or not. It doesn't matter. But certainly don't be guilted by Ashley Bratcher into thinking that the church needs to rise up and support this film.

27:15

And if they don't, then they're not showing that they care. Yeah. And speak the truth about it. If you've seen it, don't just say, oh, yeah, it's a great gospel.

27:22

Although if it doesn't say the gospel, it's not the gospel. And like it is. You want to know the gospel.

27:28

Go read my review of the of the of the film. And so I watched that movie.

27:33

I saw 3801 Lancaster. I kind of talked about a little bit of what about what I saw in that documentary, which you can find on Amazon Prime.

27:40

And then just yesterday, I watched the film Gosnell. Now, between Gosnell and Unplanned, I thought

27:49

Gosnell was the better movie. Gosnell is PG -13. So the visuals are not as gruesome,

27:57

I guess you could say, as what they are in the film Unplanned. But they're still very unsettling.

28:04

And even though there are certain things they don't show, they certainly talk about it and it's it's rough.

28:10

It's hard. Gosnell was was a very well -made movie. And I would say quality of film was even a little bit better than Unplanned.

28:20

But I don't mean to take anything away from the filmmakers of Unplanned. As far as pure flicks films go, it really was pretty good.

28:28

Well, you did say you liked it. Yeah, right. I mean, I mean, that says a lot for me.

28:34

It is. I'm pretty cynical. That's especially when it comes to movies. I think it was within the first 20 minutes when

28:40

I saw both of those abortion scenes in Unplanned, I already texted Becky and said, this is already the hardest movie

28:46

I've ever watched. Yep. So and I've seen a lot of films long into the movie. Yeah. But I mean, as a dad,

28:51

I've become more sensitive to these things and having witnessed the the births of my children, you know.

28:57

So it's like I've been there for this and I can't imagine doing this to a child.

29:03

I just just wrecks me. I could I couldn't.

29:08

So anyway, my eyes are filling with tears all the way through Unplanned. I sobbed through Gosnell. It's it's difficult to watch.

29:16

And there were there were some really, really good points in both movies. OK. Unplanned made some good arguments in exposing the stuff that goes on in Planned Parenthood and the movie

29:26

Gosnell even made some great points. The one thing that I would say that Gosnell did better in their storytelling is that the writers of that movie were not confused about what the point was that they were making.

29:40

They stayed on target and they they told a story. Oh, that's good. And it was well told with Unplanned, though.

29:46

I mean, not only is there confusion with people promoting the film, but there's confusion even within the story itself.

29:51

It's like, I don't think you guys know what you're doing yourself. So if it's based off a confused lady, then it's going to be a confusing story.

29:59

It's going to be a confusing message. Right. Yeah. So anyway, Gosnell, between the two of them, I thought I thought was a slightly better movie.

30:05

The acting was real good. The guy that plays Kermit Gosnell can't remember his name now.

30:12

He's the he's the black guy in all of the Aflac commercials. There's a black guy in all the Aflac commercials.

30:18

Yeah, it's like almost every Aflac commercial. You have the duck. And then there's this older black gentleman that's in the in the commercials as well.

30:27

He's always making some sort of like, what is up with this duck sort of facial expression? OK, I'll have to look for that.

30:33

Anyway, I can't remember his name, but he plays Kermit Gosnell in in the Gosnell movie, and he does it really, really well.

30:42

I mean, he's very chilling and eerie. I've listened to audio tapes of audio tapes, audio, audio interviews.

30:52

OK. We're so old school. Who listens to tapes anymore? Do they still call it tapes?

30:59

Yeah, they do. You know, you'll listen to an audio wave or something like that on SoundCloud or something.

31:05

I'll still hear people go, listen to this tape, you know, or something. OK, just tape almost as a verb.

31:10

You know, it was taped. It was. But I've listened to interviews with Gosnell and the guy that played him in that movie had to have been listening to those interviews and was and had that imitation down pat because it was really creepy the way that he did, did that character anyway.

31:31

Next, I'm going to skip the next thing that I was going to go to. I was going to talk about something that Matt Walsh has said recently.

31:38

Now we'll go ahead and cover this. We still got some questions to get to, but they're fairly short. OK, so I think we can breeze through them pretty quick.

31:44

All right. So Matt Walsh recently appeared with Ben Shapiro on Shapiro's program. And it's the

31:50

Sunday special. This was the same program that John MacArthur was on a couple of months ago. OK, they usually talk about religious things on this.

31:59

This facet of the stuff that Ben Shapiro does. OK, so Matt Walsh was on with him this past Sunday.

32:06

And following that appearance, Walsh released the following statement on the Sunday special with Ben Shapiro.

32:12

I made the point that Christians should not cite the Bible when arguing about cultural issues with people who don't believe in the

32:20

Bible. I've sustained a fair amount of criticism for this point, which I thought was rather obvious. In order to persuade someone, you have to connect with them on a level they understand and use arguments they find convincing.

32:34

If you appeal to an authority that they do not think is an authority, your argument will succeed in making you look pious, but it will fail to persuade.

32:43

In order to cite the Bible, you must first establish it as an authority, which is a completely different argument and not one that needs to be injected into a discussion of abortion, immigration, transgenderism, et cetera.

32:55

If you insist on quoting the Bible in an argument with nonbelievers, you are essentially deciding that every argument must be a theological argument.

33:04

You have sworn off logic, reason and science as authorities altogether. This, again, may make you look pious, but you will never persuade anyone of anything ever, period.

33:16

And you also make Christianity look like an utterly irrational religion filled with people who cannot grasp any concept or make any case or any point without quoting

33:26

Bible verses. So, again, let me quote this portion of Matt Walsh's statement.

33:33

OK. If you insist on quoting the Bible in an argument with nonbelievers, you are essentially deciding that every argument must be a theological argument.

33:42

Let's pause there for a moment. All right. If you're talking about God, you are being theological.

33:50

If what you are saying is not rooted in historically biblical orthodoxy, then what you are saying is probably heresy.

34:01

And so what you are saying has to come from the biblical perspective, right? It has to.

34:07

So it's it's absurd for him to say that every discussion must be a theological discussion. He's talking about he's talking about God here.

34:15

So it is a theological discussion. So then going on, Walsh says you have sworn off logic, reason and science as authorities altogether.

34:25

Well, science is not an authority. No. I mean, like if he's talking about like the scientific realm or the scientific sphere of knowledge and study, and so that's not an authority.

34:36

You've sworn off logic and reason. Well, the Bible actually tells us in Philippians to rely on your own reasoning.

34:43

Well, yeah, there's that. Yeah. Whoever relies on his own mind is a fool, according to Proverbs. But in Philippians chapter four, we read rejoice in the

34:53

Lord always. I will say again, rejoice. Let your reasonableness be known to everyone.

35:02

The Lord is near. So if you know that God is God over every single person who's been made in his image, then your reason will be governed by the word of God.

35:15

Right. And so whatever you say will be reasonable, even if it comes from that. I mean, otherwise,

35:20

Matt Walsh is making the argument that by using the Bible, you're being unreasonable. Therefore, the

35:26

Bible is unreasonable. I know it almost sounds like he's ashamed. Oh, he definitely is. He's a

35:31

Catholic. Matt Walsh is Catholic. So he believes whatever the Catholic Church says about the Bible.

35:37

OK. And and that's subject to change. Right. You know, the Pope can. The Pope, whatever the

35:42

Pope says the Bible says, that's what the Bible says. So are the appeal is to the authority of the

35:48

Pope, not actually scripture itself. It's not a submission to the authority of scripture. So Matt Walsh is consistent in his worldview then because he does not see scripture as the ultimate authority.

35:58

He thinks the church is the ultimate authority. So therefore, you can't use the Bible to explain things to other people.

36:04

Well, he didn't even mention the church there. He mentioned logic and reasoning and science. Right. And that's it.

36:10

There's only one thing that has the power to change a person's mind, and that is the gospel. Yeah. Romans one, 16, for I am not ashamed of the gospel, for it is the power of God for salvation to everyone who believes.

36:27

And then, as you said, God is the one who has the power to change the mind, which he does through the gospel. Exactly. Now, we were both right.

36:35

Yeah, we were both right. You said, God, I said gospel, the gospel of God. Yes. Votie Bauckham has responded to this, and he's got a great quote related to this.

36:43

So I'm going to play what Votie Bauckham says in response. He will own Matt Walsh, and then we'll move on from here.

36:49

All right. Two knights approach one another. And all of a sudden, you know, when they meet one night draws his sword.

36:59

And the other night looks at the first night he was drawn his sword. And he says, I do not believe in thine sword.

37:06

Now, the second night has two choices. Choice number one, he can resheath his sword and enter into a philosophical or scientific discussion about, you know, metallurgy and anatomy and physiology and why it is that it's very important for his opponent to believe in his sword.

37:26

Option number two, cut him. And he will either believe or very shortly, it will not matter.

37:38

OK. Don't put away your sword. Don't put away your sword, because essentially, here's what you just you've just done.

37:49

Someone says, I want to have a discussion with you about this moral issue. And I argue that the

37:56

Bible is completely irrelevant to this moral issue. And you say,

38:02

I agree with you. Let's discuss it without the Bible.

38:08

You've already lost. Hebrews chapter four, verse 12, for the word of God is living and active, sharper than any two edged sword, piercing to the division of soul and spirit of joints and of marrow and discerning the thoughts and the intentions of the heart, which would make sense as to why people shy away from using it, who don't stand firm on it, on the word.

38:34

Because, I mean, that's that's a weapon. You can really hurt people with that. When we read about the the armor of God, I'm angry.

38:44

When we read about the armor of God in Ephesians chapter six, the weapon that we have is the sword of the spirit.

38:51

Which is the word of God. And so we must know how to properly handle the weapon that we've been equipped with.

39:00

No soldier is just handed a gun and then go there, go into battle and he's just waving it around all over the place.

39:05

He trains to know how to use that weapon effectively in combat. That's right. And so since our battle is not against flesh and blood, but against the spiritual forces that are inhabiting this world, the way that we fight against those things is with the sword of the spirit, the word of God.

39:25

So we must know how to handle it properly and not shy away from using it. Lest we do what

39:31

Vody has just described there. Putting away our sword. Oh, yeah. And telling the person, yeah, hey,

39:37

I agree with you. Yeah. First, I need to convince you that this is my sword and that it can cut you before I cut you with it.

39:43

Right. All right. So anyway, you know, Matt Walsh does a great job of framing conservative arguments in a very pithy way.

39:57

OK, and he has a good way of being very witty in his responses. That's all he's popular for, incidentally, is because he can word those things in such a way that has quite a bit of snark to it.

40:09

OK, but when it comes to theological things, I have never heard Matt Walsh make a single theological argument.

40:16

That's worthwhile or even worth repeating or use or would make you go. That's a good point. He's usually really, really terrible at it.

40:24

Like like not even kind of bad at it. He's really bad at it. But I mean, that's what you get from your kind of average run of the mill

40:32

Catholic. So now we're going to get to our questions portion now that we got less than 20 minutes of our program.

40:39

Lessons are good. That's right. This first question that comes in, the name is not given.

40:44

So we've got an anonymous question submitted. All right. Hello. I've recently come across Ephesians five, four, which says, let there be no filthiness nor foolish talk nor crude joking, which are out of place, but instead let there be

40:58

Thanksgiving. Now, when this person emails in, they they quote a different translation and the translation is neither filthiness nor foolish talking nor jesting, which are not convenient, but rather let there be the giving of thanks and says the part that I'm not really getting is the nor jesting part.

41:17

I've looked in an online dictionary and one of the synonyms is joking. So are Christians not allowed to joke?

41:24

If possible, could you make a video regarding this? Thank you. And God bless. Well, specifically the part where it says, let there not be jesting.

41:33

The Greek word that that's taken from more accurately translates as coarse jesting, which would be vulgar jokes.

41:42

So basically dirty jokes should not be should not be something that Christians should participate in.

41:50

We shouldn't think that that's funny. We shouldn't repeat those kinds of jokes. But understanding the principle that was laid down just a few verses before that in Ephesians four, twenty nine, let no corrupting talk come out of your mouths, but only such as is good for building up as fits the occasion that it may it may give grace to those who hear.

42:11

So the kinds of jokes that tear people down or the kinds of jokes that are just really dirty kind of jokes, right?

42:17

That's that's not our delight. We don't find humor in that. We can laugh and make jokes.

42:24

Becky and I do all the time, all the time. And then our kids keep us in stitches, too. Oh, my goodness.

42:29

They're so funny. Especially when we'll get into those rounds, like at the dinner table with their stall.

42:36

They'll start asking Alexa to tell them a joke. Oh, yeah. Alexa, tell me a joke.

42:43

Yeah. Now everybody's Alexis are going off, right? Yeah. You do that often. So they'll start doing that.

42:50

And Alexa will tell random jokes. And then, you know, well, that'll get everybody in stitches.

42:56

And then we'll come up with our own jokes. And we'll make up our own stories that turn into jokes.

43:01

And anyway, so we love joking around. We love laughing. Perfectly OK for Christians to do that. It's just a certain kind of humor.

43:07

That's definitely more the world's flavor. Right. Should not be the delight of the Christian, the darker humor.

43:14

Yeah, certainly. Next question comes from Katie. Good afternoon, Becky. Hi. You know, you know, when somebody's been with us for a while.

43:21

Oh, yeah. When they start calling us good, Becky. That's our that's our celebrity pairing name.

43:27

It's so weird. It's like Bennifer and Brangelina. And we're good, Becky. Mm hmm.

43:34

I recently started studying the book of Hebrews, and I am currently going through chapter one.

43:40

I got to verse 14 and I'm having some trouble interpreting it. I've got a few different commentaries, but I just wanted to see your take on it.

43:48

What is the role of angels in Hebrews chapter one, verse 14? It says, are they not all ministering spirits sent out to serve for the sake of those who are to inherit salvation?

44:01

Thank you so much for your ministry. Y 'all rock, Katie. Thanks, Katie. Appreciate that,

44:07

Katie. OK, so let's go to Hebrews chapter one. Now, all through Hebrews one. One of the things that's being pointed out here by the writer of Hebrews is that the name of Christ is higher than all of the angels.

44:18

So Christ is not an angel. He is the one who governs over the angels because he is the one whom the heavenly father has given a position higher than the angels.

44:28

So you have points of the sun to the sun. He says your throne, O God, is forever and ever.

44:35

The scepter of uprightness is the scepter of your kingdom. You have loved righteousness and hated wickedness.

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Therefore, God, your God has anointed you with the oil of gladness beyond your companions.

44:47

So Jesus has the highest name even above every other heavenly being.

44:53

And it goes on to say, to which of the angels has God ever said, sit at my right hand until I make your enemies a footstool for your feet?

45:01

The answer to that question is none of them. None of the angels have ever received such a high honor, which destroys the

45:08

Jehovah's Witness teaching, by the way, because they think that Jesus is the archangel Michael.

45:14

Oh, right. But God has not ever appointed that kind of position to an angel. So Christ is

45:19

God, not the archangel Michael. So then the conclusion of Hebrews one is, are angels not ministering spirits sent out to serve for the sake of those who are to inherit salvation?

45:29

Well, think about what you see angels doing throughout the Bible. What are they doing for us? Well, they they go and appear to the shepherd and the wise men and let them know that Christ was born.

45:42

And right. They usually say, do not fear. Yeah, that's right. And then at the tomb, weren't they at the tomb saying that he's not here?

45:50

He has risen. And then after Jesus ascended into heaven, they appear with the disciples and say, why are you looking up into heaven?

45:57

Right. Yes. The way he left is the same way he's going to be coming back. So angels show up to deliver a message.

46:04

And so that's what they do. They're serving us with that message that has been preached.

46:10

And when we preach the gospel and live out the gospel,

46:16

Ephesians actually tells us that we are preaching the gospel to spirits. Consider Ephesians chapter three.

46:23

I'm going to start in verse eight here. To me, Paul saying, referring to himself, though I am the very least of all the saints, this grace was given to preach to the

46:31

Gentiles the unsearchable riches of Christ and to bring to light for everyone. What is the plan of the mystery hidden for ages in God who created all things so that through the church, the manifold wisdom of God might now be made known to the rulers and authorities in the heavenly places.

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This was according to the eternal purpose that he has realized in Christ Jesus, our God, in whom we have boldness and access with confidence through our faith in him.

47:01

So I ask you not to lose heart over what I am suffering for you, which is your glory.

47:07

So when we preach the gospel, we are destroying those those spiritual powers that have ensnared people to believe the lies of Satan.

47:17

And that's even illustrated in Second Timothy, chapter two, verse 25, where Paul tells Timothy to correct opponents with gentleness.

47:25

And God may perhaps grant repentance, leading to a knowledge of the truth. And they may escape from a snare of the devil after being captured by him to do his will.

47:34

And how does that happen? By the preaching of the gospel, right? So the angels came to us sharing the gospel, which, by the way,

47:41

OK, so this was after I left. I left Hebrews one. I should have stayed with this. What a state of the context.

47:47

Turning, turning, getting back to Hebrews chapter one. OK, so right at the end of Hebrews one, it says, are angels not all ministering spirits, ministering spirits?

47:56

So they they've preached to us the truth. They're not appearing to people and preaching the truth now. But we have evidence of that all throughout the scriptures.

48:04

Old Testament and new angels coming and delivering a message, speaking to Daniel, then coming and interpreting to Daniel the meaning of what he saw, you know, stuff like that.

48:12

Yeah. So angels are ministering spirits and out to serve for the sake of those who are to inherit salvation.

48:18

So they serve us. Right. Because we're to inherit salvation. The angels do not. The holy angels remain holy.

48:27

Those that are fallen and fell with Satan are not going to be redeemed. Right. So it's only those that are so it's only those.

48:37

Right. Yeah. Elect angels is the way that they're described, not saved angels. OK, they're described as elect angels.

48:43

OK, we are the ones who are going to inherit salvation. So all have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God.

48:49

And hearing the gospel proclaimed, which was first declared by angels. I'm getting to that here in a moment and then is also believed on by us.

48:57

So then you go to Hebrews two and it says, therefore, we must pay much closer attention to what we have heard, lest we drift away, lest we drift away from it.

49:07

For since the message declared by angels proved to be reliable and every transgression or disobedience received a just retribution.

49:17

How shall we escape if we neglect such a great salvation? It was declared at first by the

49:23

Lord, and it was attested to us by those who heard while God also bore witness by signs and wonders and various miracles and by gifts of the

49:31

Holy Spirit distributed according to his will. So how did angels preach the gospel? That's going back to what you had referenced, the angels delivering the message to the shepherds.

49:43

Yeah. So and the angel Gabriel coming to Mary. So the gospel proclaimed by angels.

49:49

And you had even angels with God when he met with Abraham at the

49:55

Oaks of Mamre in the book of Genesis and said that at this time next year, your wife, Sarah, is going to have a son.

50:02

And it's through your offspring shall God's people be named. And this was declared through angels.

50:09

That's right. And that becomes the gospel. According to Galatians chapter three. That's the message of the gospel that was declared to Abraham.

50:17

So all of this proclaimed by angels. Oh, that's neat. Angels ministering spirits sent to serve those who will inherit salvation.

50:23

I've never summed it up. So, yeah, that's really cool that it's all put together like that. Yeah. So thank you,

50:29

Katie. Thank you for your question. Thank you. All right. Last question down here at the very, very bottom. This comes from Ashley.

50:35

Hey, Pastor Gray. Pastor Grabe can't even say my own name. Hey, Pastor Gabe.

50:40

Greetings from Virginia. I really enjoy listening to your podcast while getting ready for work in the mornings.

50:46

I was it was recommended to me by our mutual friend, the unnamed cow. Oh, awesome.

50:54

On last Friday's show, March 29th, you answered a question by playing clips from a woman teaching on her beliefs about Easter.

51:00

My question to you is, how was that not a violation of First Timothy 212 where it says,

51:05

I do not permit a woman to have authority over a man. Rather, she is to remain silent regarding the position of a pastor, which is supposed to be for a man to fill and not for a woman to fill.

51:17

So then Ashley goes on by playing the clip. Were you not in some way giving her a platform to teach, even if it was for the purpose of disproving her argument?

51:27

Thank you for reading this and being willing to help me grow in this area, Ashley. Becky, quote me a Bible verse.

51:34

John 3, 16, for God so loved the world that he gave his only son that whoever believes believes in him shall not perish, but have everlasting life.

51:44

All right. So have you violated First Timothy 212 on this program now because you have quoted a Bible verse?

51:49

No, no. So the context there in First Timothy two is talking about structure and order within the church.

51:56

Right. And the position of an overseer is supposed to be filled by a man. Women have a very, very important role in the church.

52:04

To see what that is, go to Titus chapter two, for example. Right. Women, older women teaching younger women, older men mentoring younger men.

52:13

But specifically the overseer of the church, that which is that man who is responsible for the shepherding of the flock of God, the elder.

52:22

And it should be a plurality of eldership. These elders should be men. And so there are going to be women out there teaching on videos and stuff like that.

52:31

If there's guys listening to it, you know what? That's on the guy. But but a woman's focus when she teaches, because women, there should be women teachers out there.

52:40

Yeah. Women teaching younger women. Right. And younger, not just in the sense of younger by age, but also spiritual maturity.

52:47

Yeah, that's what I was going to say. Right. So so there should be women out there teaching. But when they teach their emphasis in their target audience should be other women.

52:56

They should not be teaching with the aim or the goal of leading or teaching other men.

53:03

Right now. Now, I did not give that woman a platform to teach on my program. No, because she was roundly rebuked for what it was she was saying.

53:14

So, no, that her putting her on the podcast was not a violation of First Timothy 212.

53:19

Now, whether or not she was speaking to men and women, well, that's on her. And if there are men listening to that and saying, well,

53:26

I need to get I need to get some some teaching from this woman. And so I'm going to sit under her authority and guidance.

53:32

That's on him. I don't even know that that would necessarily be her responsibility. So anyway, I hope that helps clear it up a little bit.

53:39

The context related to the fact that Paul is talking about the order of of worship and administration within the church of God.

53:49

Right. And the elder role is confusing because I mean, teaching like Bible studies and stuff like that, especially online, it gets confusing as to is this acceptable?

54:01

Is this not acceptable kind of thing? You know, but where do you draw the line? The line is putting it back into context, putting it back in the

54:09

Bible passage and learning that it it's it's about the church. Right. If you're a guy watching a woman teacher on YouTube and you feel guilty about that, turn it off.

54:20

We'll just handle it simply in that way. So Ashley has a P .S. here at the bottom.

54:25

We'll conclude with the P .S. P .S. Do you know that the cow can sing?

54:31

It is a moving thing to hear. Yes, we do know the cow can sing.

54:37

We actually did know he can sing and he does quite well. He does very well. In fact, there was at one point that I asked him to come and lead worship at our church, but you guys kept him out there in Virginia.

54:47

Yeah, well, we won't hold that against you. Yeah. Any further questions?

54:53

You can always email us to when we understand the text at Gmail dot com. Let's conclude with prayer. Yes, let's.

54:58

Our wonderful God, we thank you for the salvation that has been declared to us by angels and by our

55:04

Lord and then was spread throughout the world by your apostles coming all the way through church history to us today that we might hear the gospel and turn from our sin and live.

55:16

And we and this is all by your grace, by your power, by the Holy Spirit within us that has transformed our hearts from a rebel against God into someone who loves

55:28

God and desires to obey your word and keep your statutes. So help us walk in your ways and grow in holiness as we go.

55:37

And I pray that we're able to to preach the gospel with boldness. We're not trying to please men, but we are workers for the kingdom of God.

55:47

Let us not shrink back from that message just because somebody would find it offensive, but help us to preach clearly and also to share this message in with gentleness and respect, not trying to beat somebody over the head, but knowing it is the power of God that transforms a soul from sinner to saint.

56:06

We thank you for your goodness and your grace day by day. In Jesus name. Amen. Amen.

57:18

I won't turn yours on, then. I don't have my mouse, so I got to use my touchpad.

57:27

I'm not I'm I'm not going to remember that. I'm going to keep going over here like this. And my mouse isn't going to be there. I left it at the church.

57:35

I didn't bring it back with me when I came home yesterday. Are you done chewing?

57:50

Well, I got the chocolate to wake myself up. Are you

57:56

I'm not going to turn your mic on if you're still picking stuff out of your teeth. See, I'm just drinking.

58:11

That's that's a tolerable sound in the mic. Oh, I hate being cold.

58:20

It's not that cold. Why don't you go put a sweatshirt on? Yes, go, go get a sweatshirt.