"Christ’s Voice to the Sexually and Relationally Broken" Part 2 Sunday, October 7, 2018 PM

to this conference where we learn more about how to biblically minister to those who are identifying as LGBTQ, and we're just so grateful for Stephen Black and his staff being with us the second week.

Thank you for taking the time to say these important things, and let me pray for us and ask that God would bless our time together.

Father, I thank you so much for the clarity of your

Word. We thank you that it is true, and it is right, and it is authoritative.

What a gift you have given us in your Word. What a gift you have given us in your

Holy Spirit. What a gift you have given us in your Son, Jesus Christ. We pray tonight that what we would do would be honoring to you, that the

Saints would truly be equipped to do the work you have called us to do. We ask special blessing upon Stephen and those who will be speaking tonight.

Just bless our time together, we ask in Jesus' name, amen. Stephen, why don't you come get us started.

Am I on? You hear me? Good. I want to start with the

Word of God in reading out of Hebrews chapter 11.

Hebrews chapter 11, starting in verse 1. Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence, some of your versions may say, the assurance of things not seen.

For by it the elders obtained a good testimony. By faith we understand the worlds were framed by the

Word of God, so that the things which are seen were not made of the things which are visible.

So we also, if you'll jump down now with me to verse 6 in Hebrews 11, it says, but without faith it is impossible to please him,

God. For he who comes to him, God, must believe that he is and that he is a rewarder of those who diligently seek him.

So Lord, thank you for your Word, thank you for this night, thank you for the opportunity to again proclaim the fact that we are we are saved by faith through grace, and it is your grace that is transformative.

If we will merely just surrender in our belief in you, and God there are so many people today that are just simply not believing your

Word, and I pray that you'd continue to help us to believe. For Jesus' sake and in his name

I pray, amen. So in the reading of the Lord's Word in context, if you weren't here last week, you really should look at all the scriptures, because we went through all the scripture, to show clearly that there is in the

Old Testament a very loud proclamation that homosexual behavior in any way, matter, shape, or form, male or female, in a relationship, not in a relationship, in any way, is condemned.

That behavior is condemned. Then we also looked at all the scriptures in the

New Testament, and it again underscores that all homosexual behavior, and the reason why we had all the nuances that gay

Christianity and gay Christians are promoting, that those words don't mean what they mean, which is, you know, pretty sad.

Some of us, you know, when you actually look at what the Greek literally means, it's clear it's any type of homosexual behavior.

So that was really important, and that is again a really important foundation for us, and so tonight we're recapping where we left off and moving into ministry, and you may remember that this was on your handout.

There is, if you have not received one, there are handouts for tonight as well, and you can see there that there are these three areas, the perceptions, the early childhood development, and the defensive detachment.

Now perceptions are what they are for people, and you know you'll hear in Jim's testimony, getting ready to come up,

Laura's testimony, you heard it in mine last week, and also in Joseph's testimony, that we all had different levels of perception based upon our experiences, and what we thought was the fact, you know, my dad was out of the picture, and which is true for so many people who struggle with same -sex attraction, that they have a broken relationship, and thus, you know, defensively detach off, and so there are so many, and scientifically we even know, that there are early childhood development issues that cause what we see in the second slide, the arrested emotional development of a person's soul, and so there are clearly from a clinical, from a counseling, from a therapeutic, from a pastoral worldview, and how to help souls, there are clearly things that indicate that this is about nurturing environments rather than nature.

In other words, nobody is born gay, and then we see, unfortunately, lowered social norms that are happening, and people that at one time who would have never considered going into homosexual behavior, are actually being mentored into it.

We have an article, it was several years ago, it was either in the Washington Times or Post, I can't remember,

I want to say it was the Post, but they had an article that was actually promoting that when girls go to college, they should be lesbians, because then that way they don't have to worry about getting pregnant, so instead of even worrying about getting pregnant, have friends with benefits to have your sexual needs met, ladies, at school, and keep studying, and don't have to worry about getting pregnant, so lowered social norms, of course, then we have the gay kisses, and you know, it's being normalized on television, and gang activity, some gang initiation rights actually demand the servicing of homosexual acts to be a part of their gangs, and then prison life, and we talked about that last week, so in recapping and ending this part, ministering hope, the beginning healing process of what has to happen for people, and you see it on your handout, when people come to our ministry,

I ask these three questions, and that is, are you really here because you want to be here?

Do you really want change? Because if somebody doesn't want change, and they don't want to receive counseling, they're wasting our time, and their time as well, so you've got to really want it, and you have to understand that when

Paul told Timothy, this life, this walk is a fight of faith, and faith is believing for something greater, and on the way over here, actually,

I was listening, and yes, I had my little thing up there, and so I was kind of reading too, I love the

Word of God, Hebrews, in context, Hebrews 9, 10, 11, 12, and 13, along in the middle of that,

Hebrews 11, and what I shared with you tonight, and conclusively, when you study the

Word of God, this relationship is with the Creator in whom we cannot see, but it is evident, and in nature itself, it is evident that biologically, the way that we are made anatomically, as human beings, that there is no other way in which human beings can be life givers, life giving, and like God, unless they operate in heterosexual behavior in a covenant marriage relationship, period.

So it is a fight of faith to get there for people who struggle with homosexuality, and as you saw last week in causality,

I mean, there's a lot of reasons why people get become homosexual, a lot of painful things, more than 55 % in the survey that we did were molested as children, so it is a fight, and so for so many of us, so many people that go through the counseling process, it's so imperative that you gain understanding of these whys, and I was just at the

National Alliance of Therapeutic Choice and Scientific Integrity conference this last few days, and more science has come out, and what's it, it's increasing the science, the more we see

DNA, the more we understand the brain, brain structures, the brain firing, the brain rewiring, the neural pathways in the brain conclusively point back that this is right, and I just love that, you know, spending three days, or two days, three days there, but two days listening to the science, again, underscoring, and so people, when they come to us, and would be true for you guys too, and we'll be talking about it,

Laura will be talking about that, is we need understanding how to help other people. If we really want to help the same sex -attracted person, then we all need understanding, but certainly the history of a person and being able to suffer long, and listening to, honestly, some really painful stuff, and for people to actually birth out in counseling, now some of you are not called to listen to this, because some of it can be so dark in getting a person to confess and process out their, their history of sexual sin, but understanding their own history, and then in that, and Laura will mention it, we're getting ready to look at it as well, the conflicts in the root problems, and then of course, we have to all, don't we all, in fighting the good fight of faith, embrace a process, but this is a process, a change with a purpose, it's not just you're, you know, gonna be suffering along, and nothing's going to happen as Christians.

God's economy in suffering folks always, always produces fruit, and you know, in my testimony last week, and again, reiterating that the worst thing

I've ever gone through was the loss of my daughter, six years ago, and, and God has brought such formation with that, and continues to work in, in my life, and we all have our, our, our testimonies by which we've gone through some really pain, and we, we hear this, and it's so important to understand on the other side of that, in God's economy, there is hope.

Amen? So with that, I'd like for Jim to come up and share his testimony.

Are these on? Testing, testing. I'm gonna start off with Psalm 32 and 3.

Oh Lord, my God, I cried to you for help, and you healed me. Oh Lord, you have brought up my soul from Sheol.

You have kept me alive, that I would not go down to the pit. My name is

Jim, and I was once gay -identified. I grew up in a household with a disconnected and distant father.

My mother had come from a broken environment that rendered her without significance, or value, or identity, so the stage was already set for me from my future relational and sexual brokenness.

My father was addicted to pornography, and at eight years of age, I had gone to work with him, and to keep me busy, he gave me a pornographic comic book, and from that,

I somehow knew to find the rest of his material that was secreted away, and I had already experienced being molested around the age of six by a son of one of my dad's friends.

So the pornography only opened another door, and eventually led to experimentation with male and female babysitters.

By the time I was nine years old, I was sexually active. The acting out came with, the acting out with one of my female babysitters was discovered, and my parents sat me down and assured me that I wasn't in trouble, that I would not get punished, and they were not angry with me.

They simply asked me to tell the truth, which I did, but I still got punished for it, which led to I'm making a secret but damaging vow that I would never trust my parents again.

This was damaging because from that point on, any molestation I experienced was kept secret. For the next six years,

I found myself the target of pedophiles. If there was a pedophile within 20 miles of me, they found me.

I was left on my own frequently, and as I was just another person who lived in a household with them, except that I needed to be fed and cloaked.

When I was 12, I remember making the decision that I must be gay because all these scenes kept happening to me, and that set the course of my struggle with homosexuality.

In 1983, I came to understand what Jesus had done for me, and through a series of circumstances, I came to ask

Jesus into my heart and in my life. Shortly thereafter, I married, but not having dealt with my past abuse and ignorant of where my sexual and relational brokenness came from,

I continued to deal with same -sex attractions and sexual sin, and this subsequently led to my asking for a divorce, and eventually

I returned to live as a gay man. Never once did I think that I was born gay, and even in my formative years,

I never knew anyone that was gay that testified to being born gay. I never heard that conversation with anyone.

I tried to be a gay Christian for about 2 .5 seconds, but my conscience, already knowing the truth about my sin, was notably pricked with the truth that it was not possible to be both.

I knew this inherently. Even living homosexually, I knew that there was no way that they could be compatible.

In the late 90s, I really began to hate my life. Homosexuality had destroyed my marriage, separated me from my daughters, rendered me incapable of breaking free from the chains that held me bound to it.

I would make an attempt about every six months to get free, but I wasn't willing to lay down my life to have his, and my efforts would fail and I would give up.

Then the Lord began to bring complete strangers into my life who loved Jesus and would simply love me, not trying to fix me, but in truth, with sincerity, just loved me.

I eventually came to that place where I was so fed up with being miserable and hating my life, hating myself, hating all of it,

I cried out to Jesus and I declared, if it kills me, I'm gonna follow you. From that day on, my heart was transformed and homosexuality no longer dominated my life.

It literally was an overnight deal. The very next day, my heart was different. I was set free.

This led eventually to me seeking ongoing healing with First Stone, and now 15 years later, I'm an intern, full -time staff member that stands on the biblical truth from John 8 36, if the

Son therefore shall make you free, you shall be free indeed. Thank you,

Jim. That is so good and so hopeful, and you'll see at the end of this tonight, it's not just us, it's multiplied by hundreds of people, and I've got lots of people's faces to show you.

So, alright, so in conclusion and recapping from last week, finishing up, homosexuality in our stories, as you've heard from First Stone, is clearly rooted in same -sex parent deficits.

There are environmental factors. This is so consistent. Folks, I have been ministering to people coming out of homosexuality for more than 30 years now, and these these things, homosexuality rooted in these things, is consistent.

I've never met anyone that didn't have several of these things. So, abuse, family factors, peers, unhealthy relating, broken families, and this thing of arrested emotional development.

Again, that if you can just get a picture of somebody like they're developing, and all of a sudden, at around whatever age, a traumatic thing happens, usually between cognitive memory, so three or four is when we know that children begin to really start memorizing or remembering things.

From about that age, up until about ten, there are things that happen very traumatically.

Now, it can happen post -pubescent, but most of the time, it's usually in those years where a person kind of feels stuck in a place of unmet emotional needs, so they're arrested in that place.

The lack of nature and nurture, we know that this is not genetic, and you'll see at the end of this, in concluding, that we'll give you some of the science.

Lack of mentoring, it's so important. You know, one of the things we were looking at, of course, this was from a very clinical level, is how same -sex attracted men and women are really actually afraid of their own gender in so many ways.

There's a thing that is in the core that somehow I don't add up, and the more in male homosexuality, the more personified the masculinity is, the more that person has a deficit inside of them that says, somehow

I don't add up. And until that is resolved in deep inner healing, they don't get free, and they continue to have same -sex attraction and lust.

So, very important that mentoring take place. I am so grateful for Cowboy Church and my father in the

Lord, John Ward, who still lives here in Oklahoma City. Unfortunately, he's been recovering from a stroke, but he was my mentor and pastor for years, and even up until months ago, would pray with me, and I'm so grateful for those kinds of people in our lives, and would you be willing to be that kind of person?

So, perceptions and identity conflicts will impact more of that, but in conclusion, freedom is not the absence of a struggle.

Is that true for all of us? Aren't we all going to be tempted? Freedom is really the ability to rise above the struggle of, in God's grace, to be an overcomer.

And if that's not your trajectory about understanding God's grace, then you're maligning

God's grace. Freedom is the ability, by grace, to rise above darkness, conflict, and anything that has been controlling you.

Freedom is a walk of holiness, of real holiness, not dumbing down our appetites, but actually allowing the

Holy Spirit to come in and rearrange those appetites. And here's my little acronym. It works.

It's been powerfully used. It's called ABS. Now, I know mine are really padded, and that's part of, you know, the grieving process of gaining all this weight since charity died, and I'm not making excuses for it.

I do need to repent, and I am repenting. But in the spiritual sense, we need

ABS. And I honestly, I don't know anybody that walks in freedom without ABS, okay?

Without accountability, and that's not just confession session. That's where you are living life organically with other men, men with men, women with women, that you are able to confess and talk about the inner workings of your own sin.

And until you have accountability, you'll never walk in freedom. Accountability with all technology, accountability with all places, with all people, and all things.

And then boundaries, that you put boundaries with person, places, and things, and in that, you are accountable to keep those boundaries in place.

I know no one that walks in freedom without boundaries. And then spiritually devoted life, a lot of times,

I'll ask someone just real basic, have you been baptized since you truly believed?

Would you like the empowerment of faith? Be baptized, take the Lord's table, always take communion, humble yourself in confession, receiving and engrafting the word of God, and practicing spiritual warfare.

If a person does not have a devoted life spiritually, they will come off the rails.

So, ministering hope and the roots of this is where we wanted to start tonight, and I'm going to just go over very quickly, and then

Laura is going to come up and teach on, basically, the ministering of this.

But one time, I was at a meeting in Chicago, and it was a really conservative meeting of a lot of political and solid

Christians, right? And I started talking about the root causes behind homosexuality, and this lady stood up and started yelling at me from the audience and said, you're speaking psychobabble.

I was like, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, let's back up here.

And I said, can we just look at the word of God about what I'm talking about? And so now, I've made sure to add this verse.

The spirit of the Lord is upon me because he has anointed me to preach good news to the poor.

He has sent me to heal the brokenhearted. So much of this is about brokenheartedness in a person's soul that is struggling, and to proclaim liberty to the captives, recovery to the sight of the blind, to set at liberty.

Wouldn't you like to set at liberty those that are oppressed and proclaim the acceptable year of the

Lord? So, what's behind this? A lot of rejection and self -pity, a lot of self -hatred.

Jim in his story, Joseph in his story, Laura in her story, and in my story,

I don't know hardly anyone that doesn't deal with some level of rejection and insecurities from their happenings.

And most of you, anybody ever felt insecure? Just me?

Some of you? How about every one of us? Every one of us have felt insecure.

Now, multiply that by about 10 or 20 times for the person struggling with homosexuality, and then you start getting a clue.

They really are dealing with significant stuff inside their soul. And then they're angry because they don't have an understanding.

They don't even know what's happening to them, and they're angry at God, and they're angry at their family, and they're angry at their same -sex parent, and they're angry at others.

It's very, very painful. And then I spoke to this last week in Romans 1, you know, this whole thing with ungratefulness.

And that actually brings bondage to anybody in the church, a spirit of ungratefulness that'll cause your thinking to be distorted.

Right there in Romans 1. And then rebellion, and fear, and insecurity. And we call this thing envy cannibalism.

And people go, what is that? Cannibalism? That sounds really gross. Well, the reality is, is that in homosexuality, there is this place where you want to devour the other, and so it becomes very sexualized.

And narcissism. I know a lot of people have heard the word narcissism, right? But in homosexuality, when you start unpacking, it's not just in homosexuality, actually, in pastoral care and counseling, it's this false facade we want to put forward to make people like us.

When in actuality, we're not letting people see who we are because if we did, we would be afraid.

And that's so true with people that actually find freedom. And instead of being so self -centered and full of self -love, they find freedom.

Gender insecurity, we could unpack. That's a whole nother teaching for this whole thing dealing with transgenderism and the mental illness around that.

Idolatry, emotional idolatry, Laura mentioned that in her test. Man, it's really working good tonight, isn't it?

Emotional idolatry, and that's really predominant in female relating at first, and then it becomes sexual.

And it doesn't mean that it's not predominant a lot in male homosexuality, but male homosexuality has a lot to do with sexual idolatry.

And I'll end with this. Folks, I am surprised how many people in the church that do not believe this.

It says clearly, we are not fighting against people made of flesh and blood. And I like this living version.

It's actually a paraphrase. It's not an actual translation, but it does a good job of Ephesians 6 .12.

Against persons without bodies, these evil ruler from an unseen world, these mighty satanic host beings of great evil darkness who rule this world, these wicked spirits.

Now, so let me ask you, I bring this up a lot here in Oklahoma, it's really true, and that is if you knew, and men,

I'm speaking to you first, but some of you ladies are toting too, I know. But men, if you knew there were a bunch of people wanting to come into your home and kill, steal, and destroy your family, what would you do?

Audience participation, what would you do? Mike, what would you do? Or at least, neat, neat, neat, you know, dial 9 -1 -1, right?

Right? Neat, neat, neat, neat. Get the tones down. Hopefully, you're dialing 9 -1 -1, right?

I mean, and in the church, we're not even dialing 9 -1 -1. We think every thought that we have that comes into our brain is our own, and we're being yapped at by demons all the time, folks.

Where are all those dark images coming from? You think that's all from you? Until you learn to take every thought captive to the obedience of Jesus Christ, and know that the weapons of your warfare, not carnal, but mighty through God, to the pulling down of strongholds, and learning how to take every thought captive to the obedience of Jesus Christ, you don't walk in freedom.

And here's the thing, God's grace is given to who? Who? The humble.

God's grace isn't given to everyone. Oh, God's grace is available to everyone, but only the humble receive

God's grace. God's opposed to the proud, and until we will yield ourselves, and pray, and ask

God to intervene, we're not going to find freedom, and certainly that is true over the powers of darkness, and it is certainly true if we're oppressed, we need somebody else to help us, right?

We have to have people to help us. So becoming a church that matters, and we looked at a lot of this last week, so I am going through this quickly.

We must know the truth, and know practical avenues of ministry, and Laura's gonna talk about the practical avenues of ministry, and operating out of a heart of compassion.

You must know and believe the Scriptures, understand the science according to the

Scripture. Many are believing lies today, are people born gay? I'm surprised how many people still believe that.

That's been disproven now for almost 20 years, and it is not true, but you know you got

Lady Gaga as really a prophet, a prophetess to our generation, and really knowing some of the answers on the genetics, and we're gonna equip you with some of that and finishing up tonight.

So there are three sets of people that we're gonna encounter, and sometimes we talk about it in sets of four, but you are equipped.

You may not feel equipped, but you are, and of course if the seeking person you need to first get them to Jesus Christ, where they're surrendering to Him, at least coming into a mental belief to where they can grow in being born again, so that they're discipled and being born again, and for some people that is a process.

It's not just merely praying a prayer. An evangelical world, we teach that coming to Christ is praying a prayer.

Where is that in the Bible? It's not there folks. It's discipling people into a relationship with Jesus Christ, and they believe from the heart, resulting in righteousness.

Romans 10. They really need, and once we have that, and we're able to minister to that, then you know we have to have patience in ministering to the history and the roots, and long -suffering, and giving forgiveness, and being willing to forgive, and encourage, and empower, and the deceived, these people, it's kind of hard, and the mocking.

That picture, I was mentioning it to somebody earlier, the woman in a burgundy dress like clawing at the at the

Supreme Court doors. You know that I was looking at that going, why is going on inside of a soul that is so broken that they're literally clawing at the

Supreme Court doors. My heart goes out to her. She's probably been sexually abused.

She's tormented. People like that are tormented, and they don't know. They're deceived, and so important, and Laura will mention more of this too, but are you living a lifestyle that is going to provide truth to people, uncompromised, pray without condemnation, giving the comfort of the

Lord, knowing 2nd Corinthians 4, it's talking about the minds of the unbelieving are blinded by Satan.

They have a veil they can't see, and with our loved ones, we need to pray, God in Jesus' name, have mercy, and lift this veil off of the unbelieving.

Amen. Wait on the Holy Spirit, give you discernment on how you can minister, and it may not be about homosexuality first, and then with the the gay

Christian, there's where you do need equipping, because it will become argumentative. You must be able to confront kindly and wisely, but never compromising.

You need to know the theological lies, and you need to know the scriptures, and know what they really mean rather than the lies, right?

And if you're really going to help them, you've got to be long -suffering, and you've got to be living without compromise as well, and be prepared to answer wisely, and because folks, you will be manipulated.

If you're going to go into this battle, or if you want to try to minister to somebody, you will be manipulated.

But that's where you pray, you stay steadfast with no condemnation, and you continue this process, and you wait on the

Holy Spirit, and he will give you discernment, and he will give you the ability to do this.

Amen. So I'm gonna let Laura come on up, and she can handle this next part.

So this is Laura Lee Stanlake, and Laura is our director of Women's Ministries, and she's been around the ministry as long as I have, and so she knows a thing or two about ministering to people as well.

Alrighty, yes. So he said

I could share a little of my story, and I also come out of homosexuality, which is not a badge of honor.

It's my badge of honor, I think, is that Jesus considered me. He considered me and my sin and brokenness, and called me out, called me to his side, and radically saved me.

And some stuff started. I was born again after being religious my whole lifetime.

I was born again in 1987, though, and it began something with me and the

Lord. I fell, I fell deeply in love with him, and about six months into my new walk with Jesus, I entered into a long -term relationship with a woman, something that I had never been capable of until the love of Jesus started healing my heart.

So I was offended with myself. I could not figure out what to do with my sudden departure into sin, and I didn't know how to get myself back out.

It was, that relationship was literally like quicksand. So in all my years before,

I could have acknowledged, hey, this was a secretive, dark, compulsive, can you still hear me though when it cuts out?

Because I'll project. But there was a compulsive side to my sexual sin that was not common with most of the women that I was around.

But when Jesus saved me, the back of that compulsion broke, and his love be put into my heart.

But as I healed, I suddenly didn't know what to do with emotion, and I didn't have discipleship in place yet.

I didn't have the skills to walk. So when I entered into sin, actually the people around me didn't know what to do.

Somebody who willfully went into sin, you know, because like nobody made me sin.

But the appeal, the appeal drug me in feet first, really. And I, in not being able to extract myself, it was,

I think it was a test for the people around me. They didn't know what to do. They knew that I had fallen off, fallen off into something.

But I didn't, I didn't know how to talk about what had happened, and I didn't know how to bring the truth of it into the light.

I didn't have the maturity for that, and I'd never seen it modeled in the church, either. So when the turning point really happened in January of 1990, it happened something like this.

I heard a testimony on the back end of a horrible weekend. In that horrible weekend,

I had had yet one of many current fights with my girlfriend, and she just embarrassed me to death with her vocalness and how loud she was in my apartment complex with my, with her desperate yearning and pulling at me.

And I was completely coming undone at the edges, and it frustrated her so much.

And the Lord came to me in a place of deep sin that weekend.

He came to me, and I had, I had an experience of him that was outside of my understanding.

I mean, some of my early years with the Lord, people had said, you can, you know, if you want to quit sinning, imagine yourself doing that in the throne room of God.

It was a very heavy thing to say to somebody. And I actually couldn't imagine myself doing my sin in the throne room of God because my discipleship said

God wouldn't have anything to do with a sexual sinner like me. So imagine my surprise when the

Lord of life came into my sinful place and said, I love you, but question me.

What are you doing? And it had a jarring effect. It had a sobering effect.

And I found myself in the moment repenting, agreeing with him.

You do love me. What am I doing? So the next day,

I got a phone call from my church. I was saved and set free at Western Hills Church at 44th and Walker.

They were in the middle of revival at the time, and they were having some sharing that night.

A guy named Dennis Jernigan was sharing his testimony, getting ready to go national with this testimony.

And that night he was sharing, and I had no personal connection.

So complete was the deception that Stephen was just talking about, that deception that Satan clouds the eyes, puts a veil in place.

So complete was my deception that none of his testimony did I relate to at all. Not at all.

I didn't see myself in his story. I didn't relate to his story. But toward the end, he sang a song, and he said, in the song it says,

I wish I could take your heart into my heart. I wish I could show you just how good it feels to let go of the things that you know are killing you, and cling to the only one who can heal.

But if I did, it wouldn't be you. You're the only one choosing for you.

It's true. I love you. And it was that it's true. I love you.

It's like I just heard Jesus say it the day before. And I answered the altar call right to the front.

And when the women came to pray for me, what would you like prayer for?

And I said, it seems that I'm in a relationship that's just not good for me. That was the totality of my confession.

I understood that this pressure was killing me. I didn't have a revelation of my homosexual sin.

Does this bother anybody to know that? It's like this conversion did not include homosexuality for me.

It included this deeply weird relationship I was in with this girl. My distance from the

Father. The call of Jesus and his love. But I had no, the blinders weren't off.

They were not off. So when I went to him, and they were waiting to pray for me,

I thought that they were gonna pray for me. But they just stood and waited. And the

Spirit of the Lord began to minister to my own heart. And he began to come and actually work in me.

And I heard myself pray. Father, I cannot help myself. I need you to help me.

It was the most sincere cry of the heart. It was the cry that set me free.

And within a couple of days, and for reasons that I can't explain except for God, my girlfriend who was, she was like quicksand for me, broke the relationship.

And when she said, can we get together and talk about it? I said, no. I think

Jesus is delivering me. If that were the end of the story,

I guess that would probably be enough. But the truth was, is that suddenly not having her in my life, and suddenly having an awareness that there was something deeply, disturbingly wrong going on in my soul.

The awareness of a deep shame that had gripped me. An awareness of a place that's preferred to stay in the dark.

I realized that I had a much greater need than to get out of a controlling relationship.

And this is where the church came in. And so now

I'm just going to interweave some of that in the rest of this message. When we want to become a church that can impact lives at all, to anyone who is trying to find freedom of any kind, to anyone at all who is repentant or seeking repentance and looking for ways to walk it out, there are certain qualifications that we need in place as a church.

It isn't just First Stone Ministries. You know, we're a parachurch organization.

We come alongside the church. But it's really the church. I mean, Stephen and I both have at the core of our testimony the church's influence on helping us find freedom.

So what makes churches safe for people who are trying to find freedom?

I don't want to discourage you, but truth, knowing the truth, isn't enough.

There are some things that have to happen in our own hearts. I got slam -versed my whole life.

You know what slam -versing is? Just having something said to you and that's supposed to make a difference. It's like, you know,

Ephesians 1 says God has to open the understanding, right?

Hebrews 12, Hebrews 4 says that the Word of God does a work to change the soul.

Romans 12 says that something has to come in and change and renew the mind.

But it isn't just saying verses to people, especially Romans 1. That doesn't actually bring conversion for people who are in deception.

They don't get it. They're in deception because, well, they're sinning and sinning brings deception. So you, you become safe people.

Are you people who know how to keep confidences, keep the secrets of your friends who come to you in confidence?

Do you keep confidences in the church? Is the church a safe place? Are you yourself living an uncompromised life?

It's one thing to say to a struggler in homosexuality or any sexual sin, you need to quit sinning, but if it's going on in the secret places of your life, what you're viewing on TV, what you're seeing on the internet, conversations that you're having, anything that's going on the side, those things have to go.

It's terrible. It's the whole log and splinter situation.

What are we doing when we say to people, you need to quit doing what you're doing because it's, you know, homosexuality?

And then I have this other stuff going. I've read all of, you know, Fifty Shades of Grey, ladies.

It's like my close Christian sisters reading Fifty Shades of Grey is a deep, deep, deep compromise.

Going to that movie, it's like, why would you do that? Do you know what that's about? You know?

So it, you know, men aren't the only ones that are sexual sinners in their brains, and so Stephen lets me talk a little bit, too.

What does it mean to live in transparency, living in open -hearted lives with one another? Are we transparent with our lives?

You know, we have a parents ministry in our, in our, and among what we do, and part of what drives it is that they don't have any sense.

The parents come to us, in part, because they have no sense that there is a safety to talk about their child's rebellion, or the pain feeling, or the grief that they're experiencing.

They don't have a sense that there's a safety in their own church home for this, and that's because people are not living transparent lives.

Totally a sidebar, but everything I've ever read that was about revival, what comes into play almost immediately is confession of sin and transparency with one another, and in, in on that, it's like a red carpet for Holy Spirit coming and bringing revival to churches.

Anyway, sidebar. Knowing in your own heart what sin looks like.

So it's not just enough, I think, to, for me to look at myself as a sexual sinner, because I'm repentant, and I've walked away from that, but what remains in my heart that's still under the test?

What are the attitudes that are contrary to love? What are the, what are the things

I've been thinking, feeling, and believing? Am I judgmental? Am I, am I full of hypocrisy?

Am I fearful? Am I greedy? Am I full of envy? And, and the

Spirit of the Lord wants to dig into those places of our hearts in order to set us all free. The whole church, we're all meant for freedom, not just sexual sinners, and, and to know about that in our own lives actually brings a great liberty.

When, when I am living in the light, like it says in Ephesians 5, if you live in the light, you will walk as children of light, you know?

And that, I mean, to me it's astonishingly powerful. I think one of the most powerful things that people did for me is, by way of example, when they would witness to me, they didn't say, this is what

Jesus wants to do to you, you sexual sinner who's trying to find freedom, but they actually shared their lives this way.

This, I don't, I don't know much about what you're dealing with, but this is what the

Lord is doing in me about a similar fear or a similar attitude, and I learned from them.

I learned, I learned how to talk to Jesus in my pain. It was so powerful and it, it increased the integrity of their, their witness so much.

When, when somebody could really show me this is what it looks like for me as I walk with Jesus, I understood a lot more when

I read eventually about Paul, follow, follow me as I follow Christ. It's like, hey, just come and go with me because this is what

I'm doing right now. And I try to minister in a similar way now, all these years later.

I try to say, hey look, I'm practicing saying a lot of little yeses to Jesus over my lifetime, and chunks of things keep changing in me.

I went, I went from being very fear -bound to finding a great deal of freedom.

I went from being full of anxieties about everything all the time to having just a select few, and you know,

I, I really was ungrateful for a significant portion of my

Christian walk, but I've become grateful. I tended toward pessimism.

Pessimism, by the way, is called unbelief in the Bible. And, and the

Lord has, just in the past five years or so, been uprooting, uprooting the unbelief in my own heart, and teaching me what real hope is.

That hope is a confident, absolutely confident expectation in Jesus.

Absolutely confident. So I'm still learning. We need to learn that, that God demonstrates strength in our weaknesses.

I, I like the example of Paul when he, when he talks about God being at work in him in a really mighty way, 2nd

Corinthians, when he says, God was at work in me in a really mighty way. It was because of these amazing revelations that a messenger of Satan was sent to me to oppress me, and I asked

God to, I asked God to release me from it, and he said to me, my grace is sufficient for you.

My power is perfected in weakness, in your weakness. And the reality of that, did anybody see the

Apostle Paul movie that came out just in this past year? Okay, that something about this was, and you know, it's very simple, very simple, but something about that, that, that helped me was on purpose the filmmaker chose to interpret what

Paul's thorn in the flesh was, which we're all speculating all the time, right? What was his main deal?

What was his big deal that, that, was he a sinner? Was he sinning, and he's struggling with sinning, but, but in it he would, they chose to portray that he was being tormented by the memory of his murderous life.

The oppression of the, of the church, and then he was now a representative, an ambassador for the same one that he was persecuting, and I completely went, absolutely,

I know what it is to have the knowledge of my history dog me, and that, that was amazing.

Okay, so befriending people who are hurting, not because, not because they're sexual sinners.

As people are coming and trying to find freedom, don't, don't convince yourself ever that, you know, that's their main deal.

That's just one of the deals of their deal. We come, we come knowing that Jesus, it's the work of the

Lord that God sets, is it Psalm 68, the lonely into families?

I'm gonna say that. God sets the lonely into families. You know, it first declares that he's the defender of the orphan, defender of the weak, a defender of widows, but then says he sets the lonely into families, and, and you're that family.

You're that family, and when people are repenting and turning, they're seeking a family.

They're seeking a place to be. They are, when people forsake sin, they are cutting off something.

What, what's gonna replace that? What, what is it? I, the ministry of the church to me at one point, there was a woman who said, you don't need anybody but Jesus, and I couldn't find it in the

Bible, and I knew it wasn't true. I did need the church family. The idea that people, you go over there, and you work out your, your problems, and then come back, that, that was just not gonna work.

Somebody had to get in the messy place with me, and they did. Listen for God's voice and God's direction.

You know, it's like to, to sit with the Lord, with that person that you're loving on, sit with the

Lord, and, and, and put their name in front of his face, and listen for his voice about it.

Lord, what do you want me to do, minister to my friend? What do you want me to do to care for this person?

It doesn't, it doesn't do any good to argue. Don't argue with their unbelief.

Don't argue with their fears. Don't argue. It doesn't do any good. Nobody could talk me out of my shame.

Nobody could talk me out of it, and nobody could talk me out of my pain, but people could sit with me and minister some open -hearted life to me, and it really did change me.

Imagine what it's like when you're going through a deep grief, right? When you're in a place of deeply grieving, what helps you the most?

Is it the little sayings that people say? Well, they're in a better place. Does it help?

It doesn't really, but it does matter when people sit with you and your pain. So just kind of remember that.

I mean, this is just normal Christianity one -on -one. Okay, so we have to deal with the idea of what happens when sexual sinners come into the church, and they're really struggling.

We all, we all know Matthew 18, that there's a process. You go to your friend, and if they receive you, great, but if they don't receive you, bring a few other people with you, and if they receive you, great, but if they don't, then bring it before the church, and that's, we believe that.

The thing is, it's not a step one, two, three, and it's not day one, day two, day three.

You know, the Word of God counsels us regarding long -suffering, to bear burdens, to walk along with people, and too quickly,

I think sometimes we get to the end, and we just try to, you know, make people straighten up and fly right, right?

But there's no life in that. Instead, God is tender and full of mercies, and he didn't have,

I mean, I'm just quoting somebody here, but it affected me so much almost 15, 16 years ago when somebody said,

Jesus didn't have to hang on the cross for you one minute longer, Laura, than he did for all the rest.

I was like, that's true, that's so true. My homosexual sin did not distinguish me from the whole rest of the church that needed saving just as much.

Mercy, you can't ever go too far with mercy. We need to know, so we talked about some of those practical bits and pieces, right?

How to minister, how to provide pastoral care. We actually call it discipleship quite a lot.

Just how to teach people how to walk with Jesus, how to talk with Jesus, how to read the

Word and not feel distant from it, how to apply the Word of God to their hearts.

This is the normal Christian life. This is normal discipleship. We'd do it with anyone else, but having some growing skills about what drives those things for the sexual sinner, things that Stephen just mentioned, like bitterness and fear and the deeply held things that the

Word of God addresses over and over again. You know, it's like, can we actually minister that so that people heal?

Working on accountability Stephen talked about, but we actually say this and empower sin.

For me, for you, secretiveness empowers sin. So we teach and we want others to learn this is how it works.

Inner healing. So there's a verse that comes to mind for me from Jeremiah 6, and in part it just says this, from the prophet to the priest, you have dealt with my people falsely, saying peace, peace, but there is no peace.

You have superficially healed the wounds of my people. That's painful. You have superficially healed the wounds of my people.

What we want is not that.

We want healing to the depths. A lot of the pushback from my old community,

Stephen's old community, is that there's nothing there to heal. There's nothing broken or hurt or painful there, but it said with such venom we actually know different.

Stephen and I would know different. Jim would know different. Joseph would know different. There are things at work here that are full of judgment and pain, and Jesus does come close to it because that's what

Jesus does. I did not gain any real freedom by just saying stop doing your homosexual thing.

I did, and freedom didn't come when I stopped doing it. Freedom started coming as I began to walk with Jesus, and you know it's hard for me because I actually wasn't gonna go back to it, okay?

The repentance was real, but it was more than six years before I would have even said my desires don't get pinged by that all the time.

You know, it's like a long journey just to gain some ground. I was so entrenched in what

I was doing. You know, you're ministering to grief.

Anybody who's repentant is gonna deal with grief. Repentant, it's kind of false if you say that repentance brings joy.

Repentance eventually brings joy, but it brings grief.

You know, maybe we understand God and His holiness, and we know that we're grieving

His heart, and we repent, but man, to say no to anything is costly. Yeah, especially if they're giving up the whole life that they've invested in.

Friends, and homes, and associations, and places that you go, and things that you do in order to choose

Christ foremost. I do a program with our ministry called

Living Waters, and how Living Waters impacted my heart was in the season leading up to my salvation.

I was attending an Episcopal Church in Midwest City, and it had an amazing effect on me.

Every time that we came together to celebrate, the central piece of their service was proclaiming the death, burial, and resurrection of Jesus Christ.

Death, burial, resurrection of Christ. Death, burial, resurrection of Christ. And I, as a

Southern Baptist who had walked the aisle so many times, the most holy ones were at Falls Creek and during revivals, but I walked the aisle a lot trying to fix my stuff.

And, but having that proclaimed every time made me start wondering what that meant.

What did it really mean? And then I was born again about six months later, and when

I came to First Stone, after I'd been walking with Jesus for a while, they were doing something called

Living Waters. And Living Waters has the central theme of the cross, proclaiming the death, burial, and resurrection of Jesus.

Death, burial, and resurrection of Jesus. Identifying with him in his death, putting death to sin, his suffering, his wounded heart, in order to have a place to go with the pain and shame.

He himself bore our iniquities. He bore our pain. The chastisement for our peace was upon him, and by his stripes we are healed.

That exchange was shocking to me. But, but not just that, you know, actually laying it down, repenting and turning, and then identifying with him in his resurrection so that there was power coming into that vacant place, not left to myself.

When we begin to minister to people, they have to know that their identity is now rooted in something new.

That it isn't those labels and things. It's not, my identity can't be also that I was ex -gay.

There's no freedom in that for me. It's just a truth, but that's not my identity. I had to find identity elsewhere that Jesus loves me.

That he, his sacrifice was for my entire freedom. That I could walk, that I could walk with him in such a way, this new identity as his child,

I could walk with him in such a way that he could ask stuff from me for the rest of my life, for the sake of my freedom.

And so I'm still saying yes as to him. It's hard to give away what you yourself don't have.

And so we have to draw into, out of, into the relationship with the Lord so that we draw intimacy with him.

And the power in our witness when we offer that truth.

People know when you're saying this is just how it is with Jesus, but you feel empty in your heart. People feel emptiness from people when they share empty things.

And the Lord has good for us in that. We need to teach people actually how to have friendships.

One of the great ways to do that is to model for them friendship. So men, men with men, women with women, model a healthy same -sex relationship.

Be a friend and teach them how to receive friends and have friends. I was put in that direction.

Two women in my life early in my discipleship impacted me for eternal things.

One was a woman named Pat Franklin who was just a church woman who had some skills in her bag regarding how to help people who struggle with unforgiveness and bitterness and fear.

And Pat Franklin sat with me for many years on a weekly basis, 12 years in fact, before we agreed, let's stop and so that I can go do what

I'm called to do. And the other was a woman named Gay Voiles who befriended me kind of at the early part of the journey.

I would have thought at much risk that I would get clinging on to her or something, but she befriended me and she refused to respect my horror at my sin.

She refused to keep out of the things that I wanted her to keep out of.

She laughed at me when I blew it. She laughed at me when I was insecure. She's still laughing at me.

And she was a good gift for me because she refused to treat me like I was uniquely weird because of my brokenness.

It was very healing and it busted the shame. So gifts of the church.

You know, we're gonna wrap this up. What this was really cool about what you heard a woman who said,

I used to be so insecure and so fearful. It is a miracle that she's up here speaking and teaching.

And she is a great teacher, nationally recognized by many people in being able to teach on this subject.

And really the center of what we all are. People go, why do you wear that cross? A little secret about this cross

I wear. The only way I'm gonna have relationship with somebody is through the cross.

And I put, I have to, I have to literally put this on every day and I've been doing it every day since the week my daughter died.

And it's also to remind me of the worst thing that has ever happened to me. Our momentary light afflictions, they're little crosses.

Little. Everything we go through are little crosses. But it's important that every day that we face a cross, that we acknowledge it, and sometimes we have to share our crosses with one another.

Very important. It's why I wear this. So let's wrap this up.

So in concluding, we have, we have some amazing resources, such were some of you, is a documentary

I think. Is it back there? We don't have it here? Oh, okay. We do have this at our office.

And then we have two other documentaries. Oh, these are the people, the ladies. These are faces with real names.

And these people are ministry leaders in their own right. Look at all these women.

That's a lot of women that came out of homosexuality. And guess what? There's a lot of men too.

And some of these are nationally known speakers and ministers that have come out of homosexuality.

The idea that people don't change and go on to live long, productive lives free from homosexuality is a lie.

This man right here is a dear friend. He's a grandpa. This man is a dear friend.

He's old enough to be a grandpa, but he never got married. This friend has many children.

I know all of these people. Frank Worthen was called the father of Exodus, the father of the ex -gay movement.

Went to be with Jesus in February. I think everybody up here except for two or three people are married and have children of their own and several grandchildren.

So you just need to know that what we are proclaiming here is the truth. And there's two other award -winning documentaries.

Actually that guy in the back, David Call Foster, was a movie star.

He was in the movie Halloween and played in other movies, but he was in Hollywood. So he's the one who produced all these amazing award -winning documentaries.

And this particular one is the Ministry to the Family. Such were some of you as the testimony on homosexuality and all the psychology and theology.

This deals with parents and child, spouses, family members when they come to you and say, how do you like me now?

I'm gay. And what are you to do? So a lot of what we've taught here is in that documentary, but it's very powerful.

And then this is the thing that is hitting the church by storm right now, and that's transgenderism.

14 people that have overcome that actually had transitioned, that came all the way back to Jesus.

So you saw this, hopefully, in your handout last week. This is a well -recognized lesbian activist who is telling us, listen, we know the truth.

The gay community knows the truth. No one is born gay. The idea is ridiculous.

Homosexuality is an adaptation, not an inborn trait. And then we have a scientific report on our website, but this newest one is so exciting.

John Hopkins, 2016. Dr. McHugh was a part of this.

Good friend of what we do. So I want you to see some of these concluding statements from the executive summary of this large report and study.

In sexual orientation, the understanding of sexual orientation as innate, biologically fixed property of human beings, the idea that people are born that way is not supported by scientific evidence.

Compared to heterosexuals, non -heterosexuals, that would be the LGBTQ community, are about two to three times as likely to have experienced childhood sexual abuse.

This is fact concluded by science. Sexual abuse is a major causality.

Part two, sexuality and the mental health. Compared to the general population, non -heterosexual, the subpopulations are at an elevated risk for a variety, adverse mental and health causality.

I just saw a doctor yesterday present numbers and they were outrageous. They're like three, four, five times.

And for transgender people, it's even more, as you're getting ready to see. Members of the non -heterosexual, that is this population that we're talking about, are estimated at about 1 .5

higher risk of anxiety disorders from members in the other population, heterosexual population.

And 1 .5 times the risk of substance abuse, alcoholism, drug abuse.

And the report that came out just a few weeks ago, it's actually double that.

And so to say that this is not a problem, it's a huge health problem, it's an economic problem, outside of even the morality.

There's so many problems with this. And 2 .5 times higher risk of suicide.

And then look at the transgendered. 41 % compared to 5%.

And these are people that are even living in Scandinavian countries where it has been acceptable for years.

And they've transed into from male to female and they're still 41 % killing themselves.

Do you know that that's worse than, we should have warning labels, worse than tobacco and killing people.

If we really love people, we should be warning them. And warning the church needs to stand up.

So the hypothesis that gender identity is innate, fixed property of human beings that is independent of biological sex, that a person might be a man trapped in a woman's body or other, is absolutely not supported by science.

And they conclusively show in this report, and then going on, it says here that adults that have undergone this are five times more likely and about 19 more times likely to commit suicide.

That should make every one of us feel heavy -hearted about what we're seeing with hormone blockers 50 times now higher than ever before in our history.

50 times higher to children across America. Hormone blockers.

So how are we going to make a difference? Let's wrap this up and then hopefully you all have index cards and you have written down a question.

We're going to have a Q &A time. But how are you going to make a difference? And folks, it's going to take courage.

Every one of you are called to be courageous. Do you know that it's the cowardly that go, that every one of us are called to stand and encourage speaking boldly the truth?

Because why? Because you are a people of love. We cannot be silent.

If we're going to make a difference and become a church that matters, no more compromise, no more false humility, no more false compassion.

We have to have true compassion to speak the truth. And there cannot be the feeding of this idea of victim mentality, which is happening in the evangelical circles, calling it a sexual minority.

This is what's happening, folks. Even in the PCA church, DSBC, evangelical churches saying we need to embrace our

LGBTQ people, Gospel Coalition, Acts 29, ERLC, because they're sexual minorities.

I'm sorry, folks. It's terrible. So pray.

We need a heaven -breathed revival, and we need to find ways to help administer. I think that's why you're here tonight, and certainly giving of your resources, your time, and your money.

And I'll end with that, Michael. So we want to receive your questions and have a

Q &A time. Ten -minute break or a five -minute break. Stand up, and then we'll go into Q &A.

And hey, Q &A is actually some of the funnest time. We got to talk and talk and talk, but Q &A is the best.