Dan Corner & OSAS, then Passion of the Christ

Webcasting around the world from the desert metropolis of Phoenix, Arizona. This is the dividing line. The Apostle Peter commanded Christians to be ready to give a defense for the hope that is within us.

Yet to give that answer with gentleness and reverence. Our host is dr. James white director of Alpha Omega ministries and an elder at the Phoenix reformed Baptist Church. This is a live program and we invite your participation.

If you'd like to talk with dr. White call now at 602 973 460 to or toll-free across the United States. It's 1 877 7 5 3 3 3 4 1. And now with today's topic here is James white.

Well and good afternoon. Welcome to the dividing line live this Tuesday afternoon 5 p .m. Here in the Mountain West where it's I got like 72 or something today. I understand It's very cold where the rest of you are, but this is sort of how it works I'm afraid and you know, the day is getting longer already.

That is just so disgusting. It has not been cold enough yet. If you all could package up some of that that cool air you all are experiencing and send it out here. We would appreciate it. Because I know what's coming in just a matter of weeks sadly, and it's a bad thing.

Anyways, open phones at 8 7 7 7 5 3 3 3 4 1 if you are. Obviously if you're listening, you've probably already seen the front page. I just updated within the last so-be ten minutes and Some of you have noticed the appearance of some some caricatures some cartoons a little bit of Humor that's a communicate something on the website.

We've had a few folks who have no sense of humor who have complained but other than those few folks. Everybody else has found the work of angel Contreras to be wonderful as I do. I just love this stuff.

The first one you sent was the the picture of me. And I thought it was great and so we've put that one up there and it's around the website here there and everywhere then we got a Caricature of Jerry Matta ticks on the house who issue if you're looking for it.

Make sure to go down to the bottom of the blog. There's an archive there. I'm gonna need to divide that up. The one we've got right now is big enough. That's gonna have to be the first section. We're gonna start doing it by dates because there's so much stuff.

Which is probably just an absolute shocking thing to our our Hawaiian representative. Who's actually an Australian representative who's living in Hawaii? Balthazar because he used to think that we never ever ever Updated the front page, which we didn't but now that we're doing it blog style.

We do it all the time. So anyways The new one I just posted is so cool it. It is about Dan corner and those of you who know about Dan corner we get folks who ask about Dan corner all the time and there is a AOM in org slash.

Oh s a s all capitals. Oh s a s that HTML is An old file really? I mean I've added a few things to it over time. I think I need to add this this caricature to it as well just for the fun of it. But if you go there you can listen to the links to some dividing line programs that we've done and and the emails have gone Back and forth Dan corner has written a big thick book.

I can see it over there the believers conditional security. It's an attack on one saved always saved and and that that's his big thing and and he feels that book is absolutely unanswerable and it's it's just the the cat's meow and and so on so forth and I remember I first got hold of I first heard from because he sent me his email and said I'm going to expose you on national radio.

That's loving folks, you know, hi, my name is they even start with that so I'm going to expose you on national radio and so anyway, we went back and forth and You can listen to the dividing line we did where?

You know, he came up with this audio file about me and stuff and and it's really interesting. When I expose his editing of what I had actually said and and things like that and just you know I just exposed him for being who he is.

He will not debate the real issues. He he says I'll only debate one saved all the same. I won't debate Calvinism. Well Calvinism is the foundation of that. I'm sorry if you believe in that but you do not believe in God's predestinating grace.

If you do not believe that men are dead and sin. You don't believe that Jesus is a perfect Savior. You have no reason for believing in one saved all the same. It's ridiculous I would agree with Dan corner that if you are not reformed believing in that is silly there's no question about it, but that's not why I believe in it.

I believe in it because of The exegesis text of scripture and my belief in these other issues which leads me to that it gives the the proper foundation for all of that and So I have repeatedly said if you want to debate the real issues we need to debate.

Is there a decree of election? What is the nature of man? Is he dead in sin? Is he not dead in sin? Is this Christ able to save perfectly the nature of the Atonement all those things? That's that's the issue so he won't do that and Something happened back in st. Louis a couple years ago.

You can listen to all that at the ailment org slash osas capitalized dot html and look at that well the I Had never seen a picture of Dan corner and we asked with you. I had no idea we looked like and for some reason we're sitting around channel chatting about I think we're chatting with angel about Different people that I've done debates with and it'd be funny to see this person along with this person.

And oh, we've got lots of ideas now. There's Hold on there's more to come actually but anyway we were looking around us some of the folks we'd like to have we don't have pictures of and so I For some reason I forget who it was.

They just just popped into the channel with hey, here's a picture of Dan corner I'd never seen them and so I go over to it. I'm like, oh no It is the Dan corner has the perfect pace face for a caricature the big old bushy beard.

And and it's just as soon as I saw it. I knew oh boy. I know what's coming and yeah We do need to have you know, that's what we need to start doing. I saw on channel We need to have a link where we put all of angel stuff and on one page so you can just hear that our page Through them I have them, you know a larger size.

They're a little bit easier to read and so that's a good idea. We're gonna do that. Anyway, so just before the program today I get an email and as soon as I see angels name in the in the email line he gets he gets his emails open before anybody else does and Here was a a Dan corner he had listened to the the whole link the the dividing line right exposed his editing his stuff and wouldn't come on the air and the fascinating phone call from the Radio host lady who who came on yesterday later on the day.

You could you listen to it? You'll see what I'm talking about and So bing bang boom here comes the the the cartoon and it is now right there on the on the front page. So It's great. I Just love it. This this blog stuff is just way too much fun.

There's also also other neat stuff on on the blog. I've got some neat links there That that you might want to take a look at. I mentioned this week the Reformed Baptist Theological Review I mentioned I heard from John Piper who listened to My comments on the the passion movie.

I've been given John Sampson came through and gave me a DVD. I haven't had a chance to look at it yet. I gave it to me yesterday dropped by the house. And it's a very I mean, there's some money behind this very nicely produced DVD.

All sorts of endorsements from Lee Strobel and and all these people and I guess they're interviewing Mel Gibson and the fellow who plays Christ in the film and Who I guess played the Count of Monte Cristo.

That's the only person I that's the only way I know who he is. Is he played that particular person, but there's lots of stuff going on there and I made some comments about it. I do think it's I'm very very excited that to John Piper has done What I what I sensed needed to be done and that is has written a book to to Fill in where the the film isn't going to fill in.

I haven't had a chance to see it yet I want to be able to get it as soon as possible, but it is going to give us tremendous opportunities of witness, but Not in the way that I think a lot of folks Are thinking it is I mean we need to remember this is the essence of what I said in my sermon We go Sunday night.

We we need to remember that while this is going to be a tremendously Emotionally emotionally strong film it's going to leave a tremendous impression. When a post-modernist walks into a film like that we need to recognize that it's not going to be their standard operating procedure to Take that emotional experience and translate it into Truth.

They're not going to you know interpret it within the context of truth they're not going to have the rest of the New Testament's discussion of the intention of the Atonement the purpose of God. We have to fill that in and I think one of the dangers of the film is that it's going to give more impetus to a a postmodern derived Ecumenism where truth is not relevant where look let's you know, let's just all get together.

Let's hold hands. These people are believing in Jesus well, what are they believing about Jesus if a Roman Catholic can watch that film and Then walk into mass knowing what the mass means. Then they have not heard the message of the film if it is biblical they are instead are interpreting that within the context of A religious system that that removes it from its biblical roots and its biblical foundation so on so forth like I said my sermon if all you see there is Love or you see an innocent man being killed innocent men in the sense of judicially innocent in our world good just men Die unjustly every day.

That's not what the cross was about. We need to see the wrath of God. We need to see the purpose of God. We need to see the love of God. We need to see the sovereignty of God. We need to see what the book of Hebrews says about the Atonement and we we as as believers need to get that message out there and unfortunately, I don't know that that's what a lot of Evangelical churches are going to be doing.

I get the feeling that many of them are going to be willing to sense the seeker friendly movement is willing to dumb things down that they're going to do the same thing with the Atonement and you end up with a lot of folks with an emotional attachment to a historical figure not repentance and faith in Christ and So that's that's an issue.

It's coming up. It's coming up very quickly. I'm hoping that I'll be able to get a chance to see Dr. Piper's a book. Fairly soon the link to the website is on the blog if you want to take a look at it.

All that stuff is there other neat stuff. I'm enjoying doing that blog I hope everybody else is enjoying it as much as I'm doing it. I know it's low-tech I know I mean there there's blogspot .com where you can have you know Responses and stuff, but yeah, honestly, I wouldn't have time for the responses.

Anyways, that would take us back to back when I would write these big long articles. And we'd only update them every you know, three or four months. And most of time those responses back and forth are you know, just get into these huge debates.

That I just really wouldn't have time for anyway, so but it's not as high-tech as some of them are but you know what? It works and I think a omen likes it because I'm the one who does it and I take care of it.

In other words, he doesn't have to worry about it. I don't I'm not sending stuff over to Over to him and saying here post this on the website. I can do all that myself and Somehow manage not to crash the site in the process and that's that's probably a really good a really good thing.

So I try to throw something up there every day. I obviously cannot do so all the time. But I've actually been throwing stuff up there a couple sometimes. Twice a day just stuff that comes along people send me neat stuff and if I have time to I'll try to get it up there and and and see what happens with it and Hopefully folks will continue to enjoy.

Oh, come on. It's not that we never had an article on the front page for nine or ten months. That never happened someone someone. Correct. Mr. Mr. Astrophysics geek there so anyway. Hope you're enjoying that.

I'm enjoying it obviously, we talked about lots of different things from lots of different perspectives on the blog and Normally something there for for everybody. I got a I got an email right before I went on the air.

And it was a link. I'm not really sure what the What the significance of it is, but it was an open letter from a Westminster Theological Seminary professor Doug Green Saying he it's in support of Tom Wright.

And new perspectivism. Well, that's wonderful. I you know, that's that's great and wonderful as I've looked through it unfortunately as normal, I I don't see the key issues that are really really being dealt with.

Yes, there's there's some stuff that's being touched on but you know I think what we're seeing here is the result of decades of Well, let's face it decay in our theological seminaries and what do I mean by that?

I've said it many times before when when Christian theologians See themselves in worldly terms when they see themselves not as servants of the church who have been given a tremendous Responsibility a tremendous privilege to simply serve the church and when they start thinking That the rest of the of the world out there is somehow Not opposed to Christ and his his lordship when we start making friends with the world in the sense of Adopting worldly methodologies and worldly standards and things like that.

You do that long enough and your seminaries are going to be ripe for this kind of a situation. Where you have an obviously brilliant individual, I think it was last week sometime I saw later on Something was copied and pasted to me where where someone had said something in our channel and I hadn't seen it as they'd gone by somebody had referred to NT Wright as a as a Moron or something.

I'm like, well, you can't possibly believe that. I mean NT Wright is a brilliant writer. There's no question about that. He's done some great work in other areas, I don't find him brilliant as a historian of the Reformation.

I don't find him brilliant as one with a knowledge of what the Reformers did Exegetically at all. In fact, he says things there that are just absolutely positively Amazing to me that that he would do that but that's that's.

That's that's neither here nor there. The point is that He's not he's a brilliant guy, but the question is is his is his theologizing the same thing as doing solid meaningful consistent exegesis and I don't see a lot of folks focusing on 2nd Corinthians 5 Philippians 3 9 that would seem to me to be.

Where the focus needs to be that's where that's where things need to be to be. A Concentrated is on those biblical passages people say well, but you know what he says about the Galatians it fits real well.

Well, well, you know. This is another area if you don't if you've bought into the idea that you don't need to have a consistent Overarching theology and I don't know maybe that sounds like some sort of discrete proposition there.

But it's a discrete proposition to say you don't need a systematic theology. It's a discrete proposition to say all these things so I'm not sure you know why people get all excited about that. But anyway, if you've bought into that you don't need a consistent theology.

You don't need to have a theology takes into consideration the entirety of the canon of Scripture then you can believe anything. You can you can come up with any system and and make it quote-unquote fit in some areas and just not worry about when it Doesn't fit in others.

So anyways, not overly surprising to see that. Someone had just let me know right before I mean we're talking in 90 seconds before the program started my phone was busy fact. Just heard going off again 90 seconds before the program started I got a phone call that right at the end of the Bible Answer Man the Calvinism subject came up again.

In fact, our first caller may have heard that I don't know and that ironically. The the book that was offered the person was by George Bryson without any reference to any other side. So I found that to be interesting.

I haven't gotten the book yet. Believe me It should come this week and hence possibly Thursday morning. Once I have that book in my hand and I am able to determine That every time I was told read the book it ain't there.

We're gonna have a little discussion believe you me and yes, I am going to contact George and I'm gonna invite him to be on the program. I think it'd be a wonderful thing to do. I'd like to see that that to continue.

And especially where it's just just he and I Do so and that would be a that would be a good thing and maybe some of you who are trying to call in Would be able to would be able to do that. So anyway, ah Let me see here Bring bring what did my book arrive?

Is this the UPS deliver or something next door? Maybe if it did maybe I can maybe I can get it even even today though. Obviously trying to read the book and do the program at the same time would be a bad thing.

So let's let's go ahead and Let's go ahead and head for our phone calls here at eight seven seven seven five three thirty three forty one. Yes, I know I mentioned Balthazar had looked through it couldn't find Genesis 50 x4.

I realized that I want to look at myself. I also want to look for Isaiah 10. You know, I trust Balthazar's examination no question about it, but I want to have it in in my hot little hand when I when I discuss it.

So let's go ahead and go to our phone callers and let's talk with Aaron in California. Hi Aaron. Hi.

Can you hear me? Okay. Yes, sir. Okay. I have a nice little consolidated thing. I wanted to talk about. I Have a listen to the the Bryson you and Bryson talk back and forth till my brain is turned to mush.

I must have listened to each one 12 times by now. There's really no reason to do that.

Well, I am a neophyte at this and that's sort of the the topic I wanted to cover. The Accepted theological Terminology for certain words used like when we call say God is responsible for something and calling them the author of evil.

What initially what I'd like to say is When it seemed like you clearly denied that God is responsible for evil in those debates and I'm gonna take this thing down. Trying to look at my notes and they're waving at me.

Now if they're talking about God is responsible for evil as in he's accountable for evil. That would be clearly ridiculous. But if neophytes like me are are looking at this. It sounds like maybe Calvinists are playing some double talk when we say yes, he decreed evil.

No, he's not responsible for it.

It I don't know if you know what I'm talking about. But well any theistic system that Confesses that God has absolute knowledge of the future has to develop what's called a theodicy theodicy dealing with the issue of the relationship between God and evil and Though the theodicies would break down between those who would say that God created Knowing that evil would exist and he has a purpose in the way that he created and in the evil that exists and that would require some type of a divine decree whereby The creatures that he creates are the ones who have the intention of doing evil.

They love evil Desire evil they act in evil fashions and then God utilizes their activities to his own glory and to the good of the redeemed and to the demonstration of his justice and righteousness or.

You're going to come up with some other concept that in essence does not have a divine decree. That then has to explain how God can have knowledge of future events. There's some of the various forms simple for knowledge Middle knowledge the system developed by Molina, etc but in some way shape or form you you end up having to explain if you believe God has knowledge of all future events the Basis upon which he does and whether you want to try to affirm some libertarian free will in the midst of that.

So that it's the actions of men in time that determine the shape of the future or what else however else you want to put it. And so the the term Responsibility or the term decree the term Author of etc, etc, at least historically and unfortunately, that's one of the reasons why there was really no reason to Listen to the Bible answer man discussion because one of the two people in the Bible answer man discussion has no interest in maintaining The historical use of words.

Mr. Mr. Bryson Feels for some reason that he can redefine terms as he sees fit. It doesn't matter how they've been used whether it's by Westminster or or by Arminius or example, I'm sorry I'm like monergism monergism and synergism.

Exactly. These are these are historic terms that have certain meanings. He decides he wants to not only change them but become offended by his reinterpretation of one of them so That's why I wouldn't say it.

That's that's the best discussion to listen to because We never got past my answering loaded questions With loaded language and I never got answers to this to the direct questions that I asked so you can listen to one Yes, or no to answer seven questions.

Oh, well, yeah, and well not only that but I I just don't believe that that mr Bryson is familiar With a lot of the historical issues. I doubt very much that. Mr Bryson has ever cracked the binding of turrets and zealantic theology.

I I doubt that he's really spent much time with that kind of stuff. He has spent time reading Calvin's Institutes. Well, okay. That's fine. But that's not the be-all and end-all of all things and I don't necessarily know that that's really joined with a lot of background Information that would allow him to understand that real well.

So the the issue really boils down to the in regards to the questions you're asking the reason that people think there's some sort of double speak is because we're Didn't get a chance to discuss the issue of the means by which God Accomplishes the ends that his decree envisions.

Ironically, it used to be that that on the Bible answer man. It would be said there is no such thing as a as a Rebel molecule a Molecule that's out of God's control that's not said any longer, but it used to be said that the God ordained the ends and the means and That is is what reformed people been saying all along that we have to differentiate between first causes and second causes and we have to recognize That God when he uses secondary causes Does so in a perfectly holy way so that when those secondary causes?

Commits evil they do not do so because God's intention is To make them or force them to be evil they do it out of the freedom of their own heart. They are doing what they are desiring to do and I tried to bring that philosophical concept into the into discussion Biblically by pointing to Genesis 50 Isaiah 10 and Acts 4 because in each one you have the clear situation Where humans are acting they have intentions they have desires in point of fact God has to restrain them.

He is restraining them from doing more evil than then his decree is going to allow. But you do have them doing exactly what God's hand predestined to occur. And so you have this compatibilism you have the ends and the means if you want to say well was God responsible for sending Joseph to Egypt.

God says yes, I was I was responsible for sending Joseph to Egypt now. Then if let's ask one of Joseph's brothers were you responsible for sending Joseph to Egypt he's gonna have to say yes I was. However, what was God's purpose in sending Joseph to Egypt to save many people alive?

What was the brother's intention saying Joseph to Egypt to get rid of him? So you have one action the intention and purpose of one is pure and holy. The intention and purpose of the other is sinful and is is self-centered and is not forced upon him but if anything he is restrained from doing more and.

Therefore with that in mind you can then ask the question well if we back up and say the action considered without Anything else did God decree it. Well of course he did. Oh, then he decreed evil. For the purpose of good.

He did just as in the cross. Just as in Isaiah 10 just as in Genesis 50. Now someone wants to say I'm not gonna believe that fine. You've just said you you refuse to believe the Bible. Show me what those passages mean from the text in in those contexts and make sure that at least if you're going to represent what I'm saying you place it within the context of the of the Exegesis that I've offered of those texts and not you know the the twisted.

You know raping little children stuff. That's that was constantly being thrown around.

I'm thinking that should there be a call for a change of tactics when you do debates like this because um what I'm saying here is not not whether who who use the terminology right is there's going to be a lot of Laymen and and just plain amateurs at this stuff.

I mean, I'm someone who lives and breathes it and even I get tripped up with this stuff. So when so should there be like because should there be a change in reform tactics because they're going to be.

While we're saying one thing The common usage of words in English language not not reformed language when we're talking about the theological terms of it is Going to be different. We will say no. He's not responsible.

He's not responsible for evil when if they're just saying are we is he responsible for the existence of it. Well Yes, is he going to be accountable for it? No? That's ridiculous. We're not going to be going up.

What are the Arminians going to do. Go up to heaven and arrest God for being as he's accountable for you?

Yeah, I like that, but I don't I don't know how the the the tactic can be changed. I mean if we're in a if we're in an actual debate where both sides are given equal time and and are allowed to make An opening presentation to establish their own their own terminology.

That's one thing. But that's not that's why you don't have debates on radio. Unless you do it at the only debate I've ever done on radio Was on KIXL against James Aiken many many years ago. It was an actual debate because you had equal time amounts, and you had cross-examination and.

Etc etc, but most likely just this radio show where Hank just absolutely tried it. Yeah, I don't know if you know this, but he was answering Bryson's questions for him. Now Bryson. You don't believe that.

Do you know Bryson believes like this yes?

Moderator yeah, every everyone noticed that by the third hour That George was being was being Almost had big cue cards being put in front of him that was obvious. No one no one missed that everybody saw that and and you Know God's purpose was fulfilled in all of that that and that you know I don't I don't bother myself too much about that, but.

Yeah, that's this is a radio program with callers and with callers you you have to keep things moving you have to keep a pace Up you know that means sometimes you don't really get an opportunity to really comment.

There are a lot of things that George said that I would like to have commented on and there have been many times that if I'd been the moderator of the program I would have stopped George after about 30 seconds of rambling and say excuse me.

But that's not an answer to the question could we get an answer to the question that was asked of you specifically? That's that's where we differ. That's that's just simply the nature of how things were done, but That that's how it went so I'm not sure how I could change my tactics other than not going on a program where I'm you know.

Where it's going to happen?

But then again, it's probably just this radio program, but I mean an understanding that there were going to be did there. You know there's a lot of layman listening, and they're just going to be taking the words at face value.

Well.

But you know but you know Aaron you you can't you can't worry yourself about that. I for and and we need to run after this. But I you know I understand that and when I was younger I Really concerned myself about that kind of thing, but you know what I've come to learn That I simply have to speak the truth.

And I have to leave the rest in God's hands especially if we live in a day where God's judgment is coming upon this nation for our our abject Hatred of God's truth our abject Rejection of the gospel. And throughout our land if that's the case then then we're going to see the truth maligned and misrepresented over and over and over and over again.

And if we if our blood pressure goes to the ceiling every time it happens none of us are going to live very long. I've learned the truth of what what I believe it was Spurgeon who said Christ's sheep hear Christ's voice.

And I I I debate for those folks. I debate for those individuals I trust the Lord to take care of them hearing What I'm saying, and I recognize there could be people who are going to twist what I say and everything else anymore.

I've just gotten old enough to realize I've got to leave that in God's hands and go from there. Hey all right. Thank you. All right. God bless eight seven seven seven five three Thirty three forty one phone number got lots of folks online.

We'll get to all of them right after we take our bottom of the hour break you'll notice there has been I'm sorry oh Okay, never mind. I guess I'm going to David in Singapore. Hello, David. Hey, how you doing?

I guess this is probably costing you an arm and a leg, huh?

David hi, how you doing? I'm doing good. That's very kind of you to hold the break for me. Okay. What's up? I just wanted to say hello. Thank you very much for your ministry. Well. Thank you very much for listening.

Say again, sorry. Thank you very much for listening. I'll try to speak up.

It's a weak line. Um I my whole ministry has been turned around by some of your stuff. I'm not just particularly on the on the Reformation issues. But just on just on doing what the text says. Right. Leaving what the text said they're not going for for the tradition.

Well, I'm learning to have confidence in the Lord in evangelism in my game to school. Trinity. Ah excellent it you know. Christ. Christ is the icon of God in a way we go. How do you know God. And they just just complete confidence?

I think a lot more confidence now. Excellent. Because we know if God wants one of them. He'll have them. Yes, he will. Irrelevant of my babbling at the front. That's the first thing. I wanted to say secondly um I've been asked to call you to talk on your accent.

I you've been asked what to call you to talk on your accent. Well, you know I've noticed that I sound pretty much like you do.

Don't you think the room seems to be a bit concerned about about what they call your English accent. Well.

Understand that I wasn't gonna do it today, but now that you brought it up.

I'll go ahead and do it now. That's like Dick Van Dyke. Is it that you're doing now Dick Van Dyke? I was like poor blimey Mary Poppins. Very worrying. What I'm more concerned about is your regular American accent, which is also a pretty bad distortion of English, but I.

Do you have anything specifically you want to ask you. I do.

You were talking about babies before because actually one of my favorite pastimes is Chatting with with liberals on the internet. It's a little bit purple for swine sometimes a little bit. There's some things that's coming up.

It's psalm 137 yes. I'm gonna get very excited to go. Psalm 137 verse 9 Hattie shall be the one that takes all little ones and dashes them against the rock right. Can't be the same God as Jesus can it.

Jesus is very cuddly. He doesn't bash, baby. And so one of the things I'm trying to do is get a good apologetic for that. And I wonder if I can just run something past you okay. And I wonder if the key to understanding something like someone who said and it's actually the further filling in we get in Revelation 18 Babylon yeah, and whether that's that that's the place to go in to say look.

This is the way that God is. He will execute all of his children.

Well, that's true. I think the first thing that when people bring that up the first thing I say to them is well You know I'm very thankful that in the Psalter I find God by his spirit. Expressing every aspect of the range of human emotion from the highest levels of worship and thanksgiving to in fact the lowest levels of abandonment feelings of abandonment.

And here you have The people of Israel whose whose children have been destroyed by these these these armies they have there they've seen their their children their their wives their husbands killed. And.

Here you have an imprecatory psalm and there this isn't the only one there are other imprecatory psalms and People say well you know what I? Don't like that in my Bible. I I don't like the idea of an expression of these things.

I remember the first time I went to Phoenix Reformed Baptist Church, and I heard pastor Fry preaching. And he still does this every once in a while, but I think he did it more often in the past. I'm not sure if Why that exactly is but I remember the first time that he was preaching about or praying about false teachers.

And he used the biblical phrase Lord break their teeth. Now when I think about that, I just shudder. I mean just it's like drawing fingernails down a chalkboard. Wow.

Well in the Anglican Church, we pray for that conversion, but carry on well.