What Happens When We Worship?

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00:09

Welcome to All Compromised Radio Ministry. Mike Ebendroth here with Pastor Steve. There's our little hook line. That's where you come in.

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You have to love it, whatever it is. I don't even know what it is. Do you like any of my other little program buttons here, what they say and stuff?

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Do you like those? You don't care for them. Well, I really thought they were going to replace me. You know,

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I thought, it's Tuesday, guy, or sound effects day, you know. I want to talk about the gospel and play random sound clips from the 60s.

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Hey, it is a podcast after all. When I listen to podcasts now, I think, oh, what kind of music do they have?

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How long do they play the intro? Is it original? That kind of stuff. Do you ever think, how many smoker laughs do they have in there?

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How many Spock quotes they have, the six cents. Exactly. Uh -huh. All right. Anything happening new in your life,

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Steve? Any updates, praise reports? Anything happening? Well, I mean, lots of things are happening.

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I don't think it's things folks need to know about, but no. Then they all want to know when you say that.

01:19

Yeah, it's too bad. I'm not going to go

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TMI on the radio. All right. Sometimes with the preaching guys, I'll sit around and I'll say, or let's start off our class with the praise because we all need to learn how to praise the

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Lord better. And in front of people and around we go, and I guess our praise now is we've got the dumpster out there, somebody dumping the dumpster.

01:41

Thanks, waste management. That's our praise. You know what it's like around here?

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It's a man house is what it is, to use Charlton Heston's language. Well, it's better to have the dumpster dumped than to not have it dumped.

01:55

Oh, that's exactly true. I don't know if anybody goes through our dumpster to take stuff out.

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They can't. To take home. Not unless they have a key. Yeah, but these guys, they don't get out to take the key off and they share the key one after another.

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I mean, share the lock. They haven't done that at least a month. Come on, be nice. All right. Steve, in front of me,

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I have a book. I have lots of books. I have the book and I have other books, but this is a book printed by Reformation Heritage Books.

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Do you like what they do typically? I do. Could there be a better publisher out there these days? Do you think they're better than Banner and Truth?

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They're pretty good. And you know what I really enjoy about them? I mean, just because I was down at the conference down there in Fort Myers and Joel Beakey was there who runs

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Reformation Heritage. And first of all, and I've probably said this before, but I'll say it again because it's true.

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They treat every book that they send to your house like it's a Christmas present from grandma.

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I mean, they just... They overdo it. I'm like, I can't unwrap this thing. There's too much bubble wrap and tape. But they make sure you get it in a pristine condition, which is so nice, right?

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And I like to tell him that whenever I get the chance. But the other thing is, it's pretty obvious to me.

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I mean, there are so many publishers and different people that are really trying to squeeze money out of you.

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They really just don't care about the money. They really don't. They're constantly having these really pretty terrific sales.

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Beakey, while we were down there, said, just for the people down there at the conference and just for the next hour, like most of the hour was gone.

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So, it just created this madhouse down in the tent and I wasn't willing to stand in line since I already had the books.

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But all three volumes of his Systematic Theology, three volumes so far, he did say number four is at the printer.

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And the books by Thomas A. Brockle, right? So, that whole set -

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Wilhelmus. Yeah. Oh, Wilhelmus, sorry. I don't know why I wanted to be Thomas. Oh, because -

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Thomas Aquinas. You got Aquinas on the brain. Yeah. So, those, I think that's five books for $180, including shipping.

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Right? And I'm like, that's a pretty good deal right there, but I already have them all.

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I think it comes from the top down and Joel Beakey loves books. Yeah. Loves good printing, loves good quality books in terms of content.

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And so, therefore, you've got to wrap those things up. I mean, if you ever get a book in the mail and it's new and it's got a dog ear in the shipping, you're like, what is going on with this?

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He was so funny. At the end of every one of his messages, he had a stack of books that he brought up with him.

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And at the end, he would just go, okay, now just for a minute, just as a pastor to you guys, let me tell you about this book and why you need to do this and why you men should be reading this so that you can talk to your families.

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And so, just very, very sweet. Steve, lots of times I'll look at books and I'll look at the printer, right?

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Who's publishing. We just did that. Then I look at the endorsements quite often. And sometimes these days they want to sell books.

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So, you get kind of a wonky endorsement. You're like, why did that person be on there? Wonky, meaning something seems askew.

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Yeah. Like, why is Tim Keller endorsing this? That's what I'm talking about. These are the endorsers on the back of the book.

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Godfrey, Hart, Terry Johnson, Conrad Mbiwi, Joel Beakey, Johnny Gibson.

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And I'm thinking, you know what? There's no Matt Chandler on this. There's no, hey, we've got to have a big name to sell.

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Johnny Gibson, is he from ZZ Top? Well, I think he originally was with Gary Newman and the

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Two Way Army, but I'm not exactly sure. No, he did that really nice, Come Thou Fount of Every Blessing devotional.

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Oh, and that's the worship. Yes. And he also wrote the book about the moon is always full is when he lost a child and he used the moon as a catechism.

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Sometimes we can't see the moon is full, but the moon is always full. And sometimes the moon looks not full and just talked about the province of God, but God, the moon is always full and God is always good.

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And the moon is always different than the sun. That part's true too. Anyway, this book is What Happens When We Worship.

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Tom Landry -Cruise, oh, excuse me, Jonathan Landry -Cruise, C -R -U -S -E.

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I did that on purpose. What happens when we worship? And that's what I want to talk about today on No Compromise Radio.

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And I think it's going to lead us, Steve, into preparation for worship, what happens after worship, not just what happens during.

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So, are you ready to go? All right, here is chapter one, sentence one. Worship is a supernatural event.

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Have you ever considered that? If I were to ask you what happens when you go to church, what goes on during the actual worship service, how would you answer?

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Some people might answer, well, there's preaching, praying, singing. Sometimes we stand up and shake everyone's hand.

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Jonathan Cruise, that's not what I mean. What are these elements accomplishing? What happens when we worship?

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And then he said, something happens to us, something happens between us, that is with the people we worship with, and something happens between us and God.

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Real worship is supernatural. The God of the universe appears and meets with his people, and by his sovereign and gracious power, he changes them.

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It's astounding. I'll stop there. Worship is supernatural. Thoughts? Well, I mean, it's true.

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It's one of the means of grace, and it's one of the reasons why we tell people you can't watch online and get the same benefit, right?

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I mean, it's just not, because that's not corporate worship. Corporate worship isn't in the living room by yourself on the big screen.

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Yeah, but then I don't have to, like, go out in the snow and stuff. And I don't really have to, you know, do the one and others, and I don't really have to, you know,

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I mean, there are a lot of things you don't have to. I would point out, you know, when he says, the God of the universe appears.

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Yeah, through the word. Okay. I mean, I think I just want to clarify that so nobody thinks, you know, he's somehow conjured or made to appear or that, you know.

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Come on. I mean, how are we going to, you know, get the witch of Endor to come back and she can make some people show up?

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We can ask Sammy a few more questions. But I mean, there is a, I think there's an inarguable presence of the

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Spirit of God. Don't, I mean, we believe that, right? I mean, why do we, why do we even have sermons?

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Because we believe, like Lloyd -Jones said, basically that, and this is my paraphrase of it, but that the

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Holy Spirit works through the personality of a man, you know, who's prepared to preach the word and that the people are, again, by virtue of the

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Holy Spirit, by the power of the Holy Spirit, are enabled to learn, not from the man, but from the

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Holy Spirit working through the man, right? So, everything about a worship service, and this is what's wrong with so many worship, so -called worship services today, is meant to point us to Christ, is meant to remind us of Christ, and by the power of the

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Holy Spirit is, through the word of Christ, is meant to elevate us, to edify us, to, you know, bring us together in worship.

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Yeah, that's good. Steve, people sometimes think worship is boring, especially if you don't have a rock band that's, you know, cranking out with high decibels, and I don't know, does your watch tell you when the decibels are over 90, 90 decibels?

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It does, yeah. And it goes off, like, all Sunday morning, you know, usually during the preaching.

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Yeah, that's right. When I get up and whisper and kind of yell. Jonathan Cruz says,

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Let's admit that at first glance, worship can seem dull. There's a lot of sitting. There's a lot of listening.

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Patience is required when we have short attention spans, videos, push notifications. It's no wonder an hour of concerted stillness seemed like a chore.

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But just because it seems dull doesn't mean it is. It simply means we're not aware of what's happening when we worship.

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This is why God is not pleased with those who wear the boredom badge with honor are those who dutifully suffer through the service, while secretly wishing church wasn't an obligation.

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He wants us to be fully enraptured with him. He wants us to be thrilled at the thought of coming to church to sing his praise, fellowship with the saints, hear his word, celebrate the sacraments of his covenant and receive his blessing.

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Anything else would mean we fail at the great exhortation of Psalm 100, serve the Lord with gladness. I mean,

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I don't want to say that I get, because I don't, I don't get mad at anybody for yawning, but I think during the church service,

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I can't remember the last time I yawned because, I mean, if I'm preaching, would

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I yawn? I sure hope not. And so, I want to be so engaged with the sermon that it's impossible for me, if I'm really, unless the guy is just really dull, which he ought not to be, right?

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I shouldn't be allowing myself to be bored. And, you know, as for the other things, the pop up screens and all that,

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I mean, I cheat a little bit because I leave my phone in the office.

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So, I don't, you know, I'm not even tempted to look and I put my phone on airplane mode and stun mode and everything else, so it doesn't do anything and, because I just want to focus on that.

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And I think, you know, obviously not everybody has an office they can stash their phone in, but put all the devices away, forget about them for a while.

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Steve, let's talk about that a little bit more. At the risk of sounding legalistic, these are not laws, commands, imperatives, binding of conscience, but this is just pastoral wisdom, friendly wisdom, take it or leave it.

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But I think that's the first wise thing that people could do if they're struggling with their worship, right?

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And I don't mean that's the band, that's not the worship, but their involvement in singing, preaching, listening to preaching, et cetera.

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So, when I was traveling recently, I didn't have a Bible with me because I was bringing like diapers and crockpots and stuff like that to Amos and his family.

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So, I didn't bring any books. I had my Kindle and I had my Bible on the phone. So, I'm sitting there with my phone during the preaching,

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Luke was preaching, and a notification comes up. What happens? I mean, so, I think that's smart.

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Try to not use a tablet or a phone, and if you must, just turn it on airplane mode to help you be engaged.

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That would be a pastoral friendly. One of the things I liked at Tom Askell's church when we were down there was, you know, because when

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I travel most of the time, because if I take my Bible, that's an extra, like, what, four or five pounds?

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I don't know. Yes. What if you have the preacher's Bible? Yeah. So, I typically don't, if I'm flying,

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I don't take it. I'm going to check my phone right now. And so, they had in every single seat back a

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Bible. So, I like that because I'm just like, I'm not going to use my phone thing that I brought here because it doesn't matter what

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I do, I'm still going to get, I've tried putting it on airplane mode and everything, and I still get notifications, you know, even if they just vibrate or pop up or whatever.

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And I'm like, this way, you know, if I'm looking at pages, there are no pop -ups.

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There are no distractions. You know, I'm not getting notifications or texts because people were like, even last

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Sunday, I was getting annoyed because I have some friends who were texting on Sunday morning and I'm like,

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I wanted to write back and go, why are you people not worshiping the Lord? Get off, get off.

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Maybe they're in a different time zone. Maybe they are, maybe they're in Europe and they already have worshiped. Or maybe they're of a different religion.

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Sorry. You know? Okay. Yeah. How about other things? I know people stand up and love to go to the bathroom in the middle of the service.

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Maybe they have taken a diuretic. Maybe they're on Lasix. Obviously, there are times like that.

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But what we did with our children is we said before the service, worship service, it's time to go to the bathroom.

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Well, I don't have to go. I didn't ask you. So, let's get the children to all go to the bathroom and let's take care of all those needs.

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And if you are older and you have to use the restroom quite often, I say just go beforehand. That would be helpful.

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That's a good, just helpful hint. I mean, true confession of people are thinking, well,

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Steve's a hypocrite. I've seen him get up during the service. Here, let me help you. A lot of times what

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I do is I go upstairs to just kind of see how we're doing for space. I'll go look at the overflow room and go, man, there's lots of room up here.

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I'll go, ooh, we don't have any room at all. You know, I'm always, it's those kinds of things.

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When I look in the sanctuary and just go, this thing is packed. I need to look at the overflow room and see how we're doing.

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Right. Occasionally I'll get up, Steve, when we have a couple of praise songs and I'll get up because I'm Psalms only.

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So, I just, I'm never going to do that. No, I have gotten here early for my class and I probably had a bunch of coffee and it's been a few hours since I've had breakfast and I go in,

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I think, you know what, could I be getting that thing in my eye where it's the sugar deal? And so, I walk in here to the office to study and I eat a half a protein bar really fast and then go back out.

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So, I should probably eat the protein bar before I go. When people get up during my sermons and go to the restroom,

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I usually say, was this something I said? I had a seminary prof who would say that, you know, because we had a

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Greek class and pretty hard at 730 in the morning to 930 to just not take a break at all.

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So, he would say, remember men, caffeine is a mild diuretic. Or he'd just look at him and go, was this something

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I said? I think I know that guy. Yeah. He was in my class a year and a half ago. He's so much fun.

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Steve, let's talk about when it comes to worship services, the influence of entertainment upon the congregants, even the best congregants, and the desire maybe to be entertained versus reminded.

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I don't mean that preachers should be boring, but there's a routine that goes on every week.

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There's a liturgy and maybe people become too accustomed or too familiar with the routine and now they're influenced by entertainment.

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What's the effect of entertainment on the worship of the saints, do you think? Let me entertain you.

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As Paul Weatherwood would say, that's entertainment. Well, I think the people underestimate the effect that the culture and the entertainment culture has had on them.

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The fact that they expect to get...

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They basically expect everything to be a three -act play. The introduction where they get to meet the characters, then the crisis, then the resolution.

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Or they're looking for short informational spots, like maybe five to seven minutes long, and then some kind of commercial sort of thing.

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And we actually watched a sermon... Well, it wasn't really a sermon, a service that was somewhat like that.

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In part, it was due to an injury. But the man who was speaking,

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I don't want to call him the preacher, the man who was speaking would speak for about eight to 10 minutes, and then they would have a musical number, and then he'd get up and do another eight to...

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He was recovering from surgery. And I'm just like, well, that's a way to do things, right? The other way would be to have him sit or to do something else.

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But anyway, I think the entertainment culture has people looking for something to be excited about.

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And if they don't get what they want, they tend to tune out or look for something exciting. So hey, let's see what's going on in Instagram.

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Let's see if I have any text messages. Let's see... Yeah. Why aren't those PowerPoint graphics cooler?

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Oh, man. Could we use some cooler graphics? Yeah. Cruz writes, people are saying when it comes to the entertainment aesthetic, come worship with us.

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We have made church exciting. We have made it fun. We have made it entertaining. Don't be bored when you could have a good time enjoying the show we put on for you.

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Cruz, there's a flaw in this thinking, though, that worship is something we have to make exciting.

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No, corporate worship is not boring, and that's not because of anything we do. It's because of God's presence in and among us.

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No matter our productions or programs, we can't manufacture that supernatural wonder, and we certainly can't top it either.

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I'm about to get to Ananias and Sapphira and Acts, and I'm just like, you want entertainment?

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Are you not entertained? Are you not entertained? It really is if the cross, and if that doesn't mean enough to you, in other words, if the reminder of the greatness of your sin and the greatness of your salvation isn't enough to move you, then what is?

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Right. I mean, how can we top that, right? Everything else is some kind of weird elixir band -aid or something.

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It's just some other religion or something. I mean, that's why we continually talk about, well, this is the

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Lord Jesus, right? Whether it's Colossians or Luke or Acts, continuation of Luke, and you're like,

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I don't know what else I have to offer you. But some more jokes or maybe, you know, maybe throw the

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Bible into the congregation. A hip, relevant pastor with cool, down -to -earth practical messages that everybody wants.

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Ride a motorcycle up onto the stage. Oh, the sermonator. I mean, there are, you know, when people just think, man,

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I have to really do something to make the congregation pay attention to me, you know, what am

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I going to do? You've just missed the point of worship because it's not about grabbing their attention about thrilling them, you know, temporarily.

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It's about reminding their souls of what has been done for them, what has been accomplished for them by Christ Jesus.

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Pete Steve, that was not very entertaining of you or sensitive to the congregation on Sunday.

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We rotate as elders doing our scripture reading for the Old Testament. We read a chapter at a time.

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I think there are probably a couple exceptions. If it was Psalm 119, we might break it up. For the most part, we try to read the whole chapter.

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And you read Hosea chapter 4, and I think you said whore or whoredom or whoredomness,

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I think maybe 10 times. That was really, that was not nice of you. Sorry. I apologize.

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Well, I mean, it's what the text is about. And, you know, I even described what it's spiritual unfaithfulness and it could not be more plain.

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You know, the sacrifices made on hills and mountains and all these things that were going on Israel was just unfaithful.

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And I said, by the way, we are unfaithful. That is actually a shock to the system where you think about prostitutes and whores and all that kind of stuff.

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And you think, oh, this is bad. I remember driving from Germany.

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We are in Munich as a family. I've got a van and I'm driving with Kim in the front seat, four children in the back, two seats.

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And we're headed down into, what's just south of Germany?

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Austria? Czechoslovakia? We were going into the Czech Republic. Yeah. Czechoslovakia had since split.

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Yeah. Yeah. Go back to 1989. You're too busy waving to people in the parking lot here.

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All the fans. I mean, they crowd up around, you know. Did you know when I first started No Compromise Radio and we did live radio, that people would come up and they would watch right through this window?

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We do in live radio. Friends or foe? They used to be friends and they still are.

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Okay. That's good. Jack Cherwick was one of them. Wow. That's cool. Yeah. Anyway, I remember driving and we went across the border.

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I remember when they had borders. Remember what a border is? Well, some countries still have borders.

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Right. And we came to a stoplight and a prostitute came out and propositioned me, opened up her jacket a little bit.

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And there was my wife sitting in the front seat. I'm in a van, a family van, and my children were in the back.

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And Luke's like, Dad, what's going on? And I said, Luke, that's a whore. And we have to feel really sorry for a person like that.

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And you think about what a prostitute is, what a whore is. And then you think, oh, that's actually a picture of me when

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I know better and I'm off worshiping false gods. Yuck.

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Oh, I never do that. I never worship false gods. Oh, until you failed to love the

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Lord, your God with all your heart, soul, mind, and strength, which happens, oh, I don't know, every minute.

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Steve, tell our listeners a little bit about how much you have to prepare during the week to come up with a program to get people to have an ecstatic, wonderful experience during the worship service.

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I would not even know. I wouldn't have any clue because I don't ever think that way.

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I mean, I pray this on Sunday morning and I pray it throughout the week. All I want to do is faithfully proclaim the truth and I want to glorify the

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Lord Jesus Christ as I do. That's all I care about. You know, whether people think, oh, that was scintillating, that was the best sermon

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I ever heard, or whether they just go, boy, I can hardly wait until Mike gets back. That's not my concern.

25:18

It really isn't. How do you think, Steve, as we're kind of wrapping things up, we should, or our listeners who are pastors and leaders and elders, how should we help the congregation think the right way?

25:31

Isn't there some kind of steady, ongoing need that they have, because we even as leaders need to have it, that this is worship of the thrice holy

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God. This is worship of a triune God. Our worship is for God only, Coram Deo.

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It's not for people. We don't exegete the people. How can we keep reminding folks of that? Because left to themselves, it's, you know, what's in it for me?

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This is boring. I'm used to these other kinds of churches. Well, I mean, if we just see what the Bible says, it says we need to be renewed in our mind.

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It says, you know, Peter says that we forget and we need to be reminded. These kind of things are sprinkled throughout scripture.

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Why is that? Well, I mean, all we'd have to do, it, well, I guess

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I could just go back to Israel. You know, God rescues them out of Egypt. They go into the, you know, wilderness.

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What's the first thing that happens? Moses goes up into the mountains and what do the people start doing? Worshiping idols. I mean, they can't, and that's kind of the theme of the scripture, right?

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As soon as God's out of our mind, we wander. This is just, you know, prone to wander.

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So, it's good for us in the time that is allotted, the time that's scheduled, to really just try to focus.

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Just take the hour, hour and a half, Lord willing, hour and 45 minutes, and just really try to block off everything else.

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And for that short period of time, just try to worship the triune God for what he's done, because I promise you, during the rest of the week, you are not going to have that kind of consolidated time where the sole focus is on worshiping the

27:12

Lord. Good point. In addition, if we're man -centered, since man is finite, worship is going to terminate pretty quickly.

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But since God is infinite, and if we keep our eyes on the Lord, the infinite God, with songs, hymns, spiritual songs, preaching,

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Lord's Supper, then worship is never -ending, right? Infinite. You can just keep going and going and going on up through eternity.

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It never gets old. I mean, I, you know, how can you even go to a

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Bible conference and, you know, not just go, ah, this same old stuff again?

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It's, you know, I mean, the number of times where I sit down and I just think, I am learning something new because I'm not what

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I am being reminded of. Well, I just said it there. What is happening over and over again is

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I'm like, I hear things and go, yeah, I knew that, but I hadn't thought about that for a long time. And that's so good.

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And I should remember that. And thank you, Lord, for bringing that back to my mind. And, you know, they're just, the scripture is an inexhaustible source of riches.

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The problem is that our mind can't contain it all and we leak it, right?

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And we need to be reminded and be drawn back to these truths. That's exactly right. Who God is, what he's done, and then to be reminded that in fact, we as Christians are good with God.

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We're right with God. We're fine. We keep thinking our sanctification is the means for our justification.

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And we're reminded on Sunday, no, Jesus paid it all. We're reminded with the Lord's supper,

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God and his works are the ground of your salvation. And we want you to have fruit and evidence. There's going to be discipline for sin.

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Please repent when you sin, but you're fine with God. I think that's a good reminder. I can't know that enough.

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Mike, everything's good between you and God. It's mind blowing. I mean, is that amazing or what?

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I mean, is it so bad? Oh, boy, I hope he doesn't tell me again that, you know, this holy God that I'm going to appear before one day loves me and I'm okay.

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You know, no, I don't want to hear that. Steve, thanks for talking today about worship, gospel worship.

29:31

We recommend this book to people, What Happens When We Worship, Jonathan Landry Cruz, forward by...

29:38

Easy for you to say. Michael S. Horton. Horton. I think he knows a bit about worship. He knows a who? Yeah, yeah.