July 9, 2021 Show with Pete Chiofalo & Robert Ioiron on “Impacting Communities Through the Christ-like Leadership of Coaches Transformed by Biblical Truth”

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Live from the historic parsonage of the 19th century gospel minister George Norcross in downtown

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Carlisle, Pennsylvania, it's Iron Sharpens Iron. This is a radio platform in which pastors,

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Christian scholars, and theologians address the burning issues facing the church and the world today.

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Proverbs chapter 27 verse 17 tells us, Iron sharpens iron, so one man sharpens another.

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Matthew Henry said that in this passage, we are cautioned to take heed with whom we converse and directed to have in view in conversation, to make one another wiser and better.

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It is our hope that this goal will be accomplished over the next two hours, and we hope to hear from you, the listener, with your own questions, and now here's your host,

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Chris Arnzen. Good afternoon,

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Cumberland County, Pennsylvania, Lake City, Florida, and the rest of humanity living on the planet

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Earth who are listening via live streaming at ironsharpensironradio .com. This is

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Chris Arnzen, your host of Iron Sharpens Iron Radio, wishing you all a happy Friday on this ninth day of July 2021, and I'm thrilled to have on the program two first -time guests discussing a ministry that we have yet to discuss on this program.

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Today my guests are Pete Chiofalo and Robert Irian, and they are president and director of operations of Coaches Outreach, and today we are going to be discussing impacting community communities through the

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Christ -like leadership of coaches transformed by biblical truth, and it's my honor and privilege to welcome you both for the very first time ever to Iron Sharpens Iron Radio, Pete Chiofalo and Robert Irian, and first of all, let me greet

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Pete. Hello, Pete. Hello. How are you, Chris? Thanks for having us. I'm doing great, and if you could, first of all, before we go any further, since you are the president of Coaches Outreach, give us a description of this ministry that we will be discussing today.

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Well, Coaches Outreach is a ministry primarily to high school coaches. It's branched out into some other coaches because it's a ministry,

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I think, that's catching on, but right now it's primarily a high school coach ministry, and we want to come alongside a coach and strengthen him because we believe he has a platform that makes him one of the most strategic youth ministers in,

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I think, in our country. The platform that they have is so powerful to impact kids.

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We want to come alongside them and do a number of things. We want to, first of all, you know, encourage them.

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We want to strengthen them through biblical truth, so we have a study written exactly just for them.

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So a coach at a high school, imagine a coaching squad having a

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Bible study together every week that's written specifically for coaches, and then we encourage their spouses as well through a couple of ways.

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One, through marriage retreats. So we have marriage retreats we offer to encourage them to build their marriages.

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You know, coaching is tough on a marriage, and so we want to come alongside and strengthen them there.

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And we also provide for wives a ministry called

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The Reach, which allows wives in a particular area, any area, to get together, coaches' wives, to get together once a month and meet around some of the same topics the men are addressing in studies.

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But it encourages them to connect with each other and connect with people who know exactly how they're feeling, what it's like to be a coach at a school in a community.

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It's tough. It's a tough job, Chris. And, Robert Erion, tell us about your specific duties as Director of Operations at Coaches Outreach.

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Well, I kind of work behind the scenes to help, to help really get our ministry out there as far as the models we create, helping book distribution, making sure we're consistent throughout the ministry and the different aspects of the ministry.

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I've been called many things, I guess, through my 18 years of Coaches Outreach. I've been called many things as well, but I'm not going to repeat them.

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I understand. I understand. It's really interesting, Chris.

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When I was brought on with Coaches Outreach, like I say, about 18 years ago, I was actually leading

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Bible studies as a layperson, which I know we'll get into later. And I was helping

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Tommy Maxwell, who was the founder of Coaches Outreach, lead a Bible study because the ministry had started to grow.

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And he had invited me to come be a part of his study and facilitate.

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And through our friendship, we started talking about a new position that they were trying to add to the ministry, and they were just sure that it was a development person.

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And I'm praying with him and helping him through that process. And God really put it on my heart to give him my resume.

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And finally, I told Tommy, I said, look, here's my resume. I am not a development person, but God told me to do this.

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I've done it. Now, please go hire someone else. I'm good. And of course, he goes back to the board and they said, no, we really don't need money right now.

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We need an operations guy. We need somebody that can come in. We're trying to grow. We're trying to expand.

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I mean, the goal of the ministry was to put a Bible study in every school in America. And how are we going to do that?

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And that was kind of in my wheelhouse. So it has been just a wonderful 18 years for me.

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As far as what do I do, I just do anything you need me to. You know, we're a jack of all trades. We're a small ministry with a huge heart.

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Well, we have a tradition here in Iron Sharpens Iron Radio. Whenever we have first time guests, we have them give a summary of their salvation testimony, including what kind of religious atmosphere they were raised in, if any, and what kind of providential circumstances our sovereign

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Lord raised up in their lives that drew them to himself and saved them. And so today,

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I'd like to have you both do that. And we'll start with Pete Chiafalo. If you could give us your salvation testimony in a summary form.

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Yeah, sure. I grew up in Miami, Florida. My mom was 15 when she got pregnant with me.

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And they decided, my dad went ahead and decided to get married, even though it was against,

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I think, counsel from everyone around. They were just too young for it. Was he also 15?

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He was 16. Wow. Yeah. So, you know, they ended up getting married.

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They were not healthy people. In fact, probably the best way to describe them was a

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Woodstock couple. They were a Woodstock couple. Drug, sex, and rock and roll was sort of the environment.

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I ended up with two sisters over the next five years. By the time

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I was in second grade, my dad was gone. He was not healthy personally.

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He was angry, brawler, drug addict, and unfaithful.

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It was a mess. So we had to sell the home we were in. And my mother raised three children by herself, basically.

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So I was brought up in that home and that environment, moving around a lot. It was not easy apartment -to -apartment kind of a thing.

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Different men coming in and out of our lives. All this time, though, I'm in love with sports.

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The only thing that's driving me is sports. I loved football, so I played from as early as I can remember.

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Without a dad in the household, just out of curiosity, not to sound chauvinistic, a mother could also import a love of sports to her children.

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But how did this love develop, if you don't mind me interrupting for that quick break? No, it's a great question because there's really no answer for it.

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I come from generations of unathletic people. My grandfather didn't like sports.

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His father didn't like sports. My dad didn't like sports. He didn't like athletes. He was rejected by athletes in school.

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He only went to the ninth grade but wanted nothing to do with athletes or athletics.

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I don't know how it happened. There was really no good reason for why I fell in love with sports so early.

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I would watch Monday night football by myself. I was a Miami Dolphins fan because nobody else cared about football in my house.

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By the way, I know a lot of folks who are as unathletic and nerdy and bookwormish as you could possibly be who are nearly savants.

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They have a supernatural knowledge of sports. They love sports.

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They love viewing as a spectator of sports, even though they could never throw a ball better than a five -year -old girl.

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They know the stats. It's just an interesting phenomenon. It is a very interesting phenomenon.

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It's very interesting. Anyway, I had this love of sports, and I guess there were a lot of guys, men in my life who had impact on me because of that, the coaches that coached me.

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Anyway, my mom is moving us around. I lived all over South Florida, everywhere you can live, I mean everywhere.

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When I got into eighth grade, my father, who was not in our life, reached out to us.

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I remember coming home from school one day in eighth grade, and my mom was in the back room crying. I walk in the house, and I go to her room to see what's up, and she's on the phone.

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I asked her what's the matter, and she just hands me the phone. On the other end of the phone ends up being my father, who has had to move from Miami, running.

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He had to run from Miami. Ended up being in LA. He got in a fight.

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He didn't think he was going to be alive much longer. He hadn't had solid food in 30 days.

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He was 31 years old, and I think weighed 129 pounds. He was a heroin addict, and he had no one to reach out to, but he called my mother.

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My mom, who is one of the most amazing people in the world.

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By the way, Chris, there's literally no religion in my house. Never went to church. I didn't know anything about God.

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Nothing, literally. Anyway, my mom finds a rehabilitation center called

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Turning Point, just north of Fort Lauderdale in Pompano, Florida. That would take my father for 18 months for free if he was willing.

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My mom did all the research, found this place for him. He comes from LA to here. Goes into this thing.

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We didn't know it was a Christian. It was a Christian rehab. So we put him in there.

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We came and talked to him for six months. And God was doing a lot of things in his life at that point, but he ended up giving his life to Christ.

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And completely changing in every possible way. Hallelujah. Oh, yeah.

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It was pretty remarkable. So we go to visit him a couple of times, and we all just remember going, who is this guy?

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Because it's not. I mean, he couldn't read very well.

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He ended up graduating like top in his Old Testament class. Wow. He had me memorizing a couple of verses.

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I'd go visit periodically, like once a month, and he'd have me memorize a verse. I memorized 2 Corinthians 5, 17.

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Therefore, if any man is in Christ, he is a new creature. I didn't even know what

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I was doing, but I memorized that verse before I even knew what it was to be a Christian. Just because he did.

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Anyway, he graduates while I'm going into 10th grade, my sophomore year of high school.

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And my mom thought, why don't you guys live with your dad for the summer, you and your sisters? Move in with him for the summer, get to know him again.

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So we did. And every night at dinner, he'd open the Bible, told us a story, shared

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Christ with us, taught us things biblically. It was really great.

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By the time that summer was over, I gave my life to Christ. I was 14. Just about 15.

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And my sisters, they enjoyed it, but they didn't respond to that and were looking forward to going back to my mom.

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My father asked me to stay with him. And he asked me to stay with him, and he would put me in a

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Christian school that was local, very close to us. And it was really the hardest decision

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I can remember making as a believer, but definitely as a young man, to tell my mom, who

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I was so close to, that I'm going to stay with dad. Because I've given my life to Christ, and I'm going to go to this

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Christian school. And it broke her heart, but she didn't show it. She didn't want me to know, but she knew it was the best thing for me.

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I went to that Christian school, became part of a youth group, became a leader.

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By the time I was in 11th grade, I called Dallas Theological Seminary, because I knew

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I was going to Dallas Theological Seminary in 11th grade. I felt called that early. And went to Liberty University, and then ended up coming to Dallas Theological Seminary, and that's where I'm at today.

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Well, praise God. I'll be totally honest with you, that testimony had a twist in it that I was never expecting.

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Yeah. And I don't know if I've ever heard a testimony quite like that, where the person that you least expected to lead one of the children to Christ did that.

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Now, how about your mom? Did she ever come to Christ? My mom did. It was 20 years later, at an

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Easter service, that I was preaching. Praise God. She gave her life to Christ.

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I am so happy to hear that. How about any of your sisters? My sisters are real open with me.

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They'll listen, but it just hasn't happened. They've had times where they've made a confession, but even they would admit it wasn't really real.

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It was probably more emotional. And so, right now, they're not believers, no. Well, we will keep praying, and where there is life, there is hope.

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Yes, absolutely. And now, Robert Erion. By the way, the spelling of your last name,

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I would never in a million years guess that's how you pronounced it. It almost looks like iron, but has the

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I -O in the beginning. But I'd love to hear your testimony. Yeah, Chris, you did a great job, by the way.

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I've heard my name pronounced many, many different ways, so you did just fine. You know, and it's really, honestly, my testimony is the beauty of the gospel, because it is a polar opposite of Pete's.

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I mean, I was raised in a Christian home. I was the youngest of four children.

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I guess I'm closest, about seven years, to my closest brother, so it's almost like I was the only child.

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But I've literally been going to church my whole life. I gave my life to Christ when

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I was eight. I had a very simple understanding of what

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Christ was and who he was and what I needed. Definitely filled the void that you know you have and that you're striving for.

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From there, I'm in royal ambassadors. I'm in the church choir. I'm in church leadership.

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I really haven't had, you know, I don't have that exciting testimony. And it's funny, when you're young, you're like, wow,

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I wish I had that kind of testimony. But actually, as you get older, I'm so thankful. I'm so, so thankful and blessed that I was surrounded by so many

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Christians and so many, especially men, that built into my life growing up.

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I had great parents, so I always had them first. But I had so many other mentors.

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And it's not so much a salvation experience for me, it's more of a discipleship experience. In seventh grade,

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I had Coach Kerry Kajihira, who was my very first coach, and took me into FCA.

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Got to meet Tom Landry. What a great experience. And really learned what it meant to be a

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Christian. But growing older, I was really impacted by Henry Blackabee experiencing

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God. Really opened my eyes to what I needed to do. And it's really interesting, the gentleman in my church, it's

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Hampton Road Baptist Church. They're in DeSoto, Texas. Larry Goat, who was forever the girls' high school basketball coach, was actually our facilitator of that study.

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And he challenged me. He said, when are you going to do something instead of just sitting here? And at the time, it was just to be a deacon in the church.

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But little did I know that Larry was the one that invited me to be a part of Coach's Outreach and step in a lay leader role.

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And then again, like I say, many years later, here I am. So I'm so thankful that I have the testimony

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I do. And it's just amazing to me that God can bring so many different people from so many different backgrounds.

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And then we're brothers and sisters together. Amen. And, you know,

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I have heard over the years, as a Christian, I have been a Christian since the mid to late 80s.

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And I have heard Christians say, those that have been raised in the faith, those that never recall a period in their lives where they were openly rebellious against Christ.

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They, as far back as they can remember, were lovers of Christ and followers of Christ, as far back as they can remember having conscious thought.

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And some of them have amazingly said that they wished they had more dazzling testimonies of darkness coming to light so that they would be a more effective witness to those around them.

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And I have told them that that is absolutely moronic, that they should be thanking

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God that they were preserved from that. Because God's children have their own unique stories.

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It's the same gospel, but everyone has their own unique story that God uses to bring others to Christ, to shine as a light in the world.

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Sometimes it's to show how those that have been openly and utterly depraved, those that are the most evil, even on the standards of mankind among us who come to Christ.

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And sometimes it's to show his power of preservation, that he has had mercy on certain individuals that protected them from ever going that path of darkness.

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Of course, we're all sinners, and even the person raised in the

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Bible belt who never commits a crime as far as man's laws are concerned. If he doesn't have

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Christ, he's going to the same hell as Adolf Hitler, so we know that. But there are people who have been mercifully prevented from getting involved in all kinds of addictions and perversions.

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And so all of those testimonies have an important place in the body of Christ.

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I happened to not be one of those that was preserved from that, and I was a drunkard, very serious drunkard.

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And all the time during my rebellion as a teenager, and even later after backsliding as a

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Christian, I knew that I was in rebellion against God. But God had mercy on me and got a hold of me and gave me a new heart and a right mind, and thankfully those years are now long behind me.

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But before we go to our first station break, Robert, how did you develop a love of sports?

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And how did you come about being an excellent candidate to be director of operations for Coaches Outreach?

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And how did you meet Pete and get together with him? Well, you know, like Pete, I loved sports just growing up.

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Loved playing everything. Of course, Chris, if you remember, guys our age, we didn't have a lot of video games or computers.

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We didn't have them, so we went outside and we played. I drank out of the water hose.

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So, you know, God did give me some athletic ability. I can pretty much do anything with a ball, as my brothers would say.

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And I just love the game. I love the aspect of teamwork and working together and striving for goals.

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And throughout high school, I already mentioned Coach Kaji Hiro, and it's really interesting,

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Coach Kaji Hiro is wrapping up. He just won his 500th baseball game this year. Is he the coach of the

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Japanese ball player who's with the Angels now in America? No, no, no.

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Do you know who I'm talking about? I don't. There's a phenomenal

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Japanese ball player. Who has been compared to Babe Ruth. Oh, yeah.

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Oh, I do know who that is. Ohtani, I think. Yes, and he's in America now playing for the

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Angels. I am following him. He's amazing. He's absolutely amazing.

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And he goes both ways, pitches and hits, which they don't let you do that anymore. That's right. I'm sorry, but I interrupted you because I thought that's who you were talking about.

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Oh, no, no, no, no. No, it's great. So, anyway, it's just been very good, very fortunate. DeSoto High School, where I was at, very good baseball at the time, but in the back in the mid -80s.

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Very fortunate to win a state championship there with a lot of great guys. And a coach, Benny Jones, who is in the

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Texas High School of the Baseball Coaches Hall of Fame. Character, but a heart of gold.

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Loved him. Head football coach there, Fred Hitchcock, has been a mentor.

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The neat thing about those two coaches, or actually three coaches that I just mentioned, Chris, is when my father passed away seven years ago, the first three phone calls

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I got were from my coaches. Believe it or not, 35 years later, we still have that incredible connection.

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So after that, I went to college, went and played at Dallas Baptist for a couple of years, decided I was not going to be a professional baseball player.

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Pretty evident of that. So I transferred to Texas A &M University and got my degree. Was going to be in the family business.

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God had other plans for me. And like I said, Larry Goad introduced me to the ministry.

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He was the head girls basketball coach at DeSoto. He and I just missed each other, and he invited me just to be a part of the coaches

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Bible study. I thought that was neat. And was with DeSoto for about three years.

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Moved up to Colleyville near Grapevine where Tommy Maxwell, our founder, so I really got to know Tommy first.

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Met him, hit it off really well. When I came back to work in the family business,

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I got my master's in business administration. And it's really funny. I thought I was doing all these things to run the family business, but actually

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God was preparing me to use those same talents to help behind the scenes, orchestrate the things we needed to do to be successful at coaches outreach.

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And so, you know, it's funny. When Tommy hired me on, he's like, you know, I'm just, are you sure you're going to be here long term? And Tommy, I can't guarantee that.

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Well, 18 years later, I am still here, so I guess it's okay. Well, praise

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God. I'm glad that the Lord and his providence had you to meet and form a team, as it were, to be involved in this very important ministry coaches outreach.

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We're going to a station break right now. If you'd like to join us on the air with a question of your own for our guests,

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Pete Chiafalo, and now I'm forgetting how to pronounce his last name.

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I can't believe it. Robert, how do you say that? Iriani. Iriani.

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Is that right? Irian. Irian. Okay. All right.

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Pete Chiafalo and Robert Irian. I don't know why I forgot that. If you have a question for either of them about coaches outreach, about how sports can be used powerfully as a vehicle to proclaim the gospel and also to help disciple those that are already saved, especially youth.

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If you have a question about anything in that regard, send us an email to chrisarnson at gmail .com, chrisarnson at gmail .com.

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And if you could, both of my guests, if you could mute yourselves during the station break and always listen for my cues to unmute yourselves when we return.

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Don't go away. We'll be right back. Our email address again is chrisarnson at gmail .com, chrisarnson at gmail .com.

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Give us your first name at least, city and state of residence, and country of residence. Hello, dear ones.

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My name is Justin Peters. And my friend, Chris Arnson, host of Iron Sharpens Iron Radio, and I are frequently blessed to share great times of fellowship with one another at conferences all over the

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37:03

Welcome back. This is Chris Arnzen. If you just tuned us in, our guests today are

37:10

Pete Schiafalo and also Robert Erion.

37:16

And they are both involved with Coaches Outreach.

37:22

And if you would like to join us on the air with a question of your own, our email address is chrisarnzen at gmail .com.

37:30

chrisarnzen at gmail .com. Please give us your first name at least, your city and state, and your country of residence.

37:37

And Pete, if you could tell us exactly what is it that Coaches Outreach does to rally behind a coach.

37:47

I know you've already given an outline, but more specific details on how you even approach a coach or a team, or is it typically the other way around where they approach you?

38:00

Well, at this stage of the game, there's a lot of word of mouth, and coaches move around a lot, as you might imagine.

38:08

So you get a coach that leaves a high school and goes to another school, and he's sort of a voice for us at a new school, perhaps that's never heard of us before.

38:21

So word of mouth spreads as the coaches move around, which is quite a lot.

38:26

We have, right now, 600 Bible studies. The essence of who we are is the

38:33

Bible study. We produce, we have our own director of education who writes a study every semester for the fall and the spring of a school year that coaches can go through.

38:50

It is written for coaches, literally everything in it is designed to encourage a coach, coaching stories, coaching testimonies, illustrations that a coach can identify with really well, and the biblical text, whatever book we're studying, is just applied through a coach's, through the lens of a coach, through the lens of sports, all kinds of sports, all sports.

39:21

And so we put that study in the hands of a coach, and, you know, at a high school, you'll have anywhere from two to, you know, ten coaches, you know, somewhere in that world, give or take, sitting around every week studying whatever it is we've, you know, it's been produced for that particular.

39:45

And, you know, you got coaches talking about the connection it makes with them, the biblical input.

39:52

We're trying to remind coaches on a regular basis of their place in the kingdom of God, the strategic place that they have in the kingdom of God, and encourage them with biblical truth.

40:04

I mean, they're right in the center, if you will, of cultural shifts, cultural impact in these students and youth.

40:17

And if they've got God's word practically brought to them on a regular basis, shared with others on the same team that keeps them focused, keeps them accountable, keeps them just, you know, mindful of what

40:36

God is saying to them, they can apply all that on the field to their coaching, coaching abilities and coaching strategies and the impact they have on not just the players, but other students.

40:53

These guys are teachers too, and they impact an entire staff and community. A community can be impacted by what a coach is doing on the field.

41:03

If you played sports, you know what it's like to have a coach that you respect and care about.

41:09

The impact he can have on your life is overwhelming. And Robert, what would you say in your experience, obviously you do not know every coach in the

41:24

United States or world or even those in your own city, but from your experience, what do coaches generally get right, even if they're not

41:35

Christians, when it comes to the basic principles of coaching a team and what are some of those things that they may frequently get wrong, even if they are

41:46

Christian? Well, I think first, okay, to get it right, it would be just the value of team and the value of each individual on that team, whether it's the starter or it's the reserve that never gets in, but has to be there at practice every day and the value of them.

42:13

And I think that coaches now, they have to have a bigger purpose.

42:24

And where do they get it wrong? Even the Christians, it's the sinfulness of man where maybe they value the short -term win over the long -term gain.

42:37

You're there planning, and unfortunately, it's not so much the Christian coach that gets it wrong.

42:44

It's the community that's supposed to be supporting that coach that gets it wrong.

42:50

Yeah, the reality, Chris, in Texas, hey, there's 256 teams playing for a state championship.

42:58

Only one team wins at the end. There's only two ways to win your last game, if you're not going to the playoffs or if you win the state championship.

43:05

Everybody else quotes a loser. And unfortunately, our society is so instant gratification.

43:13

They don't see the bigger picture. They don't see the team that goes 0 and 10 because, honestly, they just don't have the kids that can compete.

43:23

But those kids go on, and they're successful. They're positive role models.

43:31

They're successful in school. They're successful parents. They're successful mothers. They're successful fathers.

43:38

And a coach is a coach. You know, I think sometimes we refer to he, but we coaches, we have many female coaches in our ministry as well.

43:50

And so, you know, to get it right, again, go back to that, I do think a coach plays a special role in that they see the value or potential value in everyone.

44:12

And I guess that would be the main thing, I would say. And it's our job.

44:17

You know, everybody, too. One more thing is that half the people in our ministry are in it because they had bad coaches.

44:26

They had bad role models as coaches, and they don't want to see the next generation have to deal with that.

44:32

Then the other half had good role models, like myself, fortunately, that I'm still in connection 35 years later with them.

44:40

So would some of the bad ways that children are being coached, athletes are being coached, is perhaps coaches using a lot of profanity, coaches humiliating players in front of the other teammates unnecessarily.

45:01

Obviously, there is healthy and good critique and rebuke if somebody is not using the gifts that they have to their fullest potential, if they're being lazy, or being a prima donna and hogging a ball or something.

45:22

And there are good ways and healthy ways where an athlete can be publicly rebuked in front of his own teammates, but there can be a harsh, demeaning, and wicked way of doing it.

45:37

Am I on base in some of the ways where wrong coaching is practiced?

45:44

No, you're absolutely correct. In fact, I had one issue way back.

45:51

We had a gentleman we had approached to be a lay leader at a school, and he said, I don't want to do a

45:58

Bible study for those coaches because all they do is use profanity. And our stance was, no, you really do need to do a

46:06

Bible study with those coaches, so maybe you've got to work on their hearts and we'll see that they don't need to do that.

46:13

It is hard. I feel like the things that are said and done today as normal 20 years ago would not have been accepted.

46:23

But they are now, and they don't need to be. And I'll tell you, the good coaches don't do that.

46:29

And they don't need that. Just a fun, we always do a poll when we do our state playoffs just for fun.

46:39

The semifinals, and then again, we're in Texas, so when you get to the semifinals, finals, we look to see the number of schools that are doing a coach's outreach

46:48

Bible study. And it's not about the coach's outreach Bible study. It's about the type of coach that would see value in doing a

46:56

Bible study. And 50 % of those schools in the state playoffs in the championship games are doing a coach's outreach

47:05

Bible study. So they're doing it right. And they're showing that on the field that you can do it the right way.

47:13

And I'll tell you, words of a coach are devastating. You know that. We all know that. More so than a teacher. Because a coach, in many times, is a father figure.

47:21

And it's the only father those kids have. Or a mother figure, if it's a female coach. And there's nothing worse.

47:29

To hear that and to see that. And that's what we're working against. Now Pete, if you could,

47:38

I know a number of Christians and pastors and ministry leaders who were athletes.

47:48

Some of them very accomplished athletes. Some of them who got scholarships because of the gifts.

47:56

And it's interesting to me that even the very godly, genuinely

48:02

Christian, born -again men that I know, who have had a life formally involving athletics, many of them will have such cherished and treasured and fond memories of their coaches, even if these men were reprobate.

48:30

They were not believers. It was obvious by some of the things that they did. And I'm not saying that these

48:35

Christians agreed with every single thing that these coaches said and did, as coaches, or outside that realm.

48:45

But there was a connection, a bond that they formed with them that they will still, into their adulthood and senior citizen golden years, reflect upon these men.

48:58

And of course, as you were saying, there are women out there who are coaches too. But in my experience, the men that have shared these experiences with me, or the folks, the people who have shared these experiences with me, have been primarily, if not exclusively, men.

49:12

But what is it about a coach that forms these bonds amongst young people, especially?

49:21

Well, that's a great question. I was just with a guy last night who had been in the

49:27

Marines for about eight years. And he is trying to find fulfillment and work outside of the military.

49:39

And it's not easy. Of course, military guys don't transition to normal world very easily.

49:46

And I was asking him, what is it that makes the everyday business world so much different than what it was like to be in the military?

49:56

So what you miss in the military is you miss the camaraderie and purpose you had every single day to do what you did.

50:07

Even if it was difficult, even if it seemed in some unbelievably difficult, impossible to do, you found a way to do it because there was a camaraderie and there was a purpose you woke up with every single day.

50:22

In everyday life, you don't have that. Sports is probably the closest thing that you can look back with your team and go, man, we were all marching in the same way to have people alongside you.

50:35

And then to have a leader, a coach, who's guiding that team. Beyond you in years, somebody you look to, perhaps he's a father figure, perhaps he's just a great leader, somebody you admire because he knows what you don't know and he knows how to encourage you and how to speak into you.

50:56

Every single person that's ever played sports can think back on every coach that they've had.

51:03

I can go all the way back to elementary school and tell you coaches.

51:08

I can think of stories of every single coach. And it's all because, first of all, I had a passion for the game.

51:14

I love having teammates and a leader.

51:20

And the coach who led that, such a strategic position to unite all of that. You can't help but connect to him and you miss it.

51:29

We get to adult life now and we don't, I can tell you right now, I don't know that experience anywhere.

51:35

I've gotten into CrossFit myself because I get a little bit of that dynamic in my life as an old man.

51:43

There's just nothing. There's very few things that compare to the kind of connection you have in that environment, that sports arena.

51:52

So a coach, you just can't help it. Whether he's a good coach or a bad coach, he's gonna impact you.

51:59

And we have to go to our midway break right now. This is the longer than normal break, folks, so please be patient.

52:07

It's the break where Grace Life Radio, 90 .1 FM in Lake City, Florida, requires of us a longer break because they are required by the

52:14

FCC to air their own public service announcements and other local things to geographically localize.

52:24

Iron Sherpins Iron Radio to Lake City, Florida. I would ask, first of all, that both of my guests mute their mics so that during the break we don't hear anything going on in your own homes or wherever you're conducting the interviews.

52:36

Also, folks, use this time wisely to write down the information provided by our advertisers so that you can more frequently and successfully patronize our advertisers, buy their products, use their services, visit their churches, promote their parachurch organizations, and support them financially.

52:56

But when you can't do those things, at the very least, please reply or respond to our advertisers so that you can thank them for sponsoring this show.

53:06

That's, of course, if indeed you love the show and you don't want it to disappear. Because, other than God himself being the primary reason we exist, our advertisers are the most important reason we remain on the air because we are absolutely positively dependent upon the finances that come through their ad campaigns to survive.

53:28

So please let them know that you love this show and that you thank them for supporting and keeping it in existence.

53:35

Also, use this time to write down your own questions for Pete and Robert of Coaches Outreach.

53:42

That's ChrisArnzen at gmail .com C -H -R -I -S -A -R -N -Z -E -N at gmail .com

53:49

As always, give us your first name at least, your city and state of residence, if you live outside of the

53:55

USA, and don't go away. We'll be right back after these messages. Chris Arnzen, host of Iron Sharpens Iron Radio, announcing a new website with an exciting offer from World Magazine, my trusted source for news from a

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The boys are back in town. The boys are back in town. The boys are back in town.

55:28

I'm James White of Alpha and Omega Ministries. My friend Chris Arnzen, host of Iron Sharpens Iron Radio, and I are headed down to Atlanta, Georgia, once again for the

55:38

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For details, visit g3conference .com. That's g3conference .com. Chris Arnzen and I hope to see you

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September 30th through October 2nd at G321. This is James White reminding you that Christ is supreme over all.

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When Iron Sharpens Iron Radio first launched in 2005, the publishers of the

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Here's what Gary DeMar, President of American Vision, had to say about Iron Sharpens Iron Radio recently.

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Good to be back, Chris. I always enjoy our time here. I have to tell you, you're one of the better interviewers out there, and I've been doing this for more than 30 years.

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Wow, that's some compliment. How much joy are you for that? You don't have to owe me anything.

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01:09:11

I have a few announcements to make before we return to our guest today Pete Chiafalo who is the president and also

01:09:21

Robert Erion who is the Director of Development at Coaches Outreach.

01:09:27

Before we return to that discussion we have some announcements that I want you to hear.

01:09:34

First of all, please continue to pray for my oldest brother John 76 years old in a rehabilitation facility after leaving the hospital in Denton, Texas.

01:09:49

He is battling cancer he is battling critical stage emphysema and right now on top of everything he is battling pneumonia.

01:10:00

Pneumonia is always deadly but especially deadly when it comes to somebody who is 76 years old with critical stage emphysema.

01:10:10

Please pray for my brother John not only for physical healing but pray for his salvation.

01:10:17

It is very unclear whether he has truly committed to Christ.

01:10:26

I love my brother so much I gave him the gospel just moments ago during the commercial break via private messenger on Facebook and he said,

01:10:40

Thank you dearest brother which is very important to me that he responded that way but it is still not a crystal clear convincing evidence that he agrees with the gospel.

01:10:52

So please pray that the Lord reveals to me that he is truly a believer after the

01:11:01

Lord has given him a new heart by his grace and mercy. Please pray for that. Please pray that the

01:11:06

Lord has mercy on him physically and extends his life here on earth. Pray for his wife

01:11:11

Jan and daughter Regina as well neither of whom are saved as far as I can detect.

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Thank you all for praying for my brother Bob closer in age to me, 64 years of age who just underwent successful cancer surgery from his bladder.

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01:14:43

Go to IronSharpensironRadio .com, click support, then click click to donate now. Also, if you are not a member of a truly biblically faithful, theologically sound church, no matter where you live on the planet

01:14:58

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01:15:07

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01:15:15

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01:15:21

I need a church in the subject line. That's also the email address where you can send in a question to our guests today,

01:15:31

Pete Chiafallo and Robert Erion of Coaches Outreach, chrisarnson at gmail dot com, chrisarnson at gmail dot com.

01:15:43

And we have a listener who chooses to be anonymous and the listener says,

01:15:50

To your guests Pete and Robert, I've always been a sports fan as far as I can remember dating back to my youngest years of childhood and was raising my family to love and appreciate sports.

01:16:07

However, things have gotten so abysmally horrible when it comes to professional sports.

01:16:15

I no longer watch professional sports activity on our

01:16:21

TV with the family and I prohibit our young children from doing so because these athletes and I'm of course not intentionally broad brushing, there are wonderful Christian athletes and even those that are not

01:16:39

Christian that are still wonderful role models. But at the same time, those that seem to have the majority of the limelight captured by them are abysmal at being role models.

01:16:52

They are prima donnas, they're crybabies, they're greedy, they hate America, they have bought into the woke movement which promotes racism, whether they are truly believing in that ideology or just doing it to protect or maintain and preserve their careers.

01:17:11

What is your opinion about the movement I have made toward a ban on professional sports watching on our home television set?

01:17:23

I guess, Pete, we'll start with you. Well, I guess it's understandable.

01:17:28

I mean, we've all seen a shift in sports, especially lately with it becoming a platform for athletes to, you know, and I mean, that is,

01:17:40

I mean, not a whole lot we can do about that being used as that platform.

01:17:45

They have a truly public platform.

01:17:51

So these athletes have clout and, you know, they're just, it's an opportunity for them to take advantage of that if they have, you know, especially popular.

01:18:09

I know a lot of people who have stopped watching professional sports because they just don't want all that comes with it.

01:18:19

Totally understandable. When I think about sports and the ministry that we have,

01:18:28

I'm talking about the opportunity to create as many, you know, to impact kids for Christ before they ever reach that space.

01:18:40

Because we're talking about high school coaches. And so the opportunity that we have to,

01:18:50

I don't know what the right word is. It's not infiltrate, but you want to see these kids get affected by a coach and it changes the course of their college career and their professional career to see what happens.

01:19:06

When you asked earlier, Chris, what's the difference between, you know, your everyday coach and a

01:19:11

Christian coach? Well, that's really where the difference is. I had lots of coaches that influenced my life that were not believers that, and I've said it in the past, had they been

01:19:24

Christians, I would have wanted to be because they impacted my life so much.

01:19:32

But the ones that did know Christ, well, that just, that was another level of influence and transformation in my life that changed me, made me a different kind of teammate, made me a different kind of example to people.

01:19:50

That's what you're really hoping. You're really hoping that these kids come to Christ and it changes their lives, whatever field they go into.

01:20:02

That would be, that's what we're hoping. And Robert, if you could chime in with your own two cents on that.

01:20:12

Yeah, sure. I agree with Pete in that it's a reality.

01:20:21

I mean, there are professional sports. Also, the reality is 99 % of kids that play sports in high school don't even go to college to play sports.

01:20:34

And so it really is a different venue. Personally, and I think it's a personal thing.

01:20:39

I don't think I could sit here and tell your listening audience, you need to do this or do that.

01:20:48

But it's entertainment. Professional sports are entertainment. And Charles Barkley said several years ago, don't make me your role model.

01:20:58

I'm not a role model. Don't look at me like that. And at the time, I thought, no, you really should be.

01:21:04

But in reality, we need to quit holding someone up on a platform or putting them on a pedestal because they can run a ball or they can dunk a basketball or they're really fast in track.

01:21:20

I mean, that's God given. And I hate the fact that there's so many athletes out there that don't recognize that God made them that way.

01:21:29

And then on the other side of that, you've got the Tim Tebow's the world that do understand that.

01:21:35

And isn't it ironic that a Tim Tebow, who gets offered to a roster spot, just he hasn't even made the team yet in Jacksonville, but the whole nation is angry that this guy has been given the opportunity.

01:21:53

And it's because he's a believer. You know, I mean, that's just part of being a Christian. He's going to be attacked.

01:22:00

But so to go back to your, the gentleman that asked or the mom that asked the question, no, that's up to you.

01:22:06

It's your family and it's your role to be a mentor. And at the end of the day, whether they watch sports or not, it's not going to impact them.

01:22:14

I don't think negatively or positively, because that's really not what we're supposed to value anyway.

01:22:21

Yeah, they could even continue or be nurtured and developed in their love for and skill of athletics without having the viewing of professional sports.

01:22:39

And we also have, in fact, this time I'll let Robert start and have Pete follow up.

01:22:47

We have BB in Cumberland County, Pennsylvania, who asks, can you describe the difference between coaching young children in things like T -ball or even soccer and other activities where children of all backgrounds and with all ranges of skill or interest in the sport are playing together and it's a good and healthy way for them to enjoy the outdoors, to get exercise and to learn some basic principles of participating on a team.

01:23:29

And that time of age when children are and should be taking the activity more seriously than just a fun time out in the park, because there are actually the livelihoods of some of their teammates being nurtured and cultured and developed for the future for acceptance into college and even into professional sports.

01:23:55

Is there a different way that a coach is a coach when you contrast those two realms of coaching?

01:24:06

Yeah, this is going to probably, this is going to be from me personally as coaching my kids, because when you're talking about T -ball and soccer, you're talking about, you know, five and six year olds, which is very different than a high school and junior high coach trying to coach kids at that level.

01:24:23

I wish that I could go back in time and treat the kids a little differently.

01:24:30

You know, you look at the grandparents in the stands, they have a totally different view of the game than the parents do.

01:24:37

We get so caught up, you know, and, you know, you want your kid to succeed desperately.

01:24:44

And so the motives are right. You know, you just want them, you don't want them to hurt.

01:24:51

You don't want them to fail. Are you saying that the grandparents are typically more vocal from the stands?

01:24:57

Is that what you mean? Oh, no, I'm saying just the opposite. I think grandparents get it. No, I think grandparents understand more.

01:25:03

It's just a game. Let them have fun. You know, it really, you're not caught up in whether they win or lose.

01:25:10

You truly are caught up in it. They're enjoying themselves. And I think that's the key is if they're enjoying themselves.

01:25:18

My kids enjoyed certain sports. And so they continued to play and we, you know, put them in the more competitive situation.

01:25:28

My old son wasn't that way. And so, you know, he, he did it. He stepped away from the competitive sports.

01:25:38

and that's okay. I think that the point is when your kids are five or six, it's not too late.

01:25:44

Some people think they've got to, you know, play year round tee ball or let your kids have fun.

01:25:50

Enjoy the different things. I would just encourage you to do that.

01:25:55

And again, I'm guilty of, you know, pushing my kids too hard because I understood what it took to win.

01:26:02

Does it matter at the end of the day, looking back? No, they did learn some valuable lessons on what it took to win.

01:26:08

and as long as they tried their hardest, that's all that matters. I mean, not every kid's going to be a star athlete, but that's the beauty of sports too.

01:26:17

You can measure your success against yourself. You know, maybe you strike out three times, but you hit a foul ball.

01:26:25

Well, you made contact. My dad was real good about that coaching me. He always looked for the positives.

01:26:30

The most negative situations. And I remember that more than anything.

01:26:39

Yeah, I would say the same thing. I coach my kids and you, you know, when you're young, I can, I can remember you get competitive because sports just brings out that competitive singing.

01:26:48

It doesn't matter how old the kid is. You just want your kids to win. You want them to be successful.

01:26:54

You want them to experience that because it's such a great thing. And I think we import too much of our own, uh, you know, desires for that into our young kids.

01:27:06

And they're just not having as much fun, you know, uh, but we need, we need to encourage those kids to have fun.

01:27:13

By the time you get to middle school, though, these coaches, it's their livelihood. These coaches. I mean, it's, it's when, or you develop a reputation.

01:27:22

It's when, or you need, you're going to move on to another school. If I have any hope of getting anywhere else,

01:27:28

I've got to, I got to have kids that can win. I can't be concerned about kids having fun.

01:27:35

I can't be as concerned about kids, uh, everybody playing. I have expectations as Robert alluded to earlier from culture, society, parents, the community, uh, to have a winning squad here.

01:27:50

And so if you've ever been to a, if you've ever sat in the stands at a junior high game or sat in the stands of a senior, especially here in Texas and Texas high school football is, uh, is everything you imagine it could be.

01:28:06

And so, uh, it's an incompletely different kind of environment. So yes, there ought to be a distinction between the two, but there becomes some necessary issues that make it completely different.

01:28:19

Coaches coaching junior high and high school have have a little bit different, uh, expectation and approach and strategy than the father who's out there coaching is.

01:28:31

And there ought to be a distinction for sure. Now I'm assuming you think that is perfectly right.

01:28:40

And in fact, a highly recommended thing for parents to cheer on their kids and support them and encouraging them.

01:28:47

It's just a negative thing when they start ridiculing, not only their own kids, but, uh, really being nasty, uh, to other parents, children out there and to umpires and referees, depending upon what sports being played.

01:29:05

And would you say that a Christian parent should never be involved in vocally criticizing a, an umpire or referee or, or is that acceptable as long as he does it with tact and Christian conduct, uh, uh, you know, without cursing, without demanding things of him or her, et cetera.

01:29:29

Um, you know, uh, having, having a lot of, uh, parents lose their minds on, on a sideline, probably a lot of coaches, you know, turn it up.

01:29:47

Lose their minds on a coach, uh, or a referee. And I coached my kids as long as I could.

01:29:54

And then they ended up being, you know, going on and I watched them play junior high and high school football.

01:29:59

One of my sons played a little bit of college football. Um, I think as a believer, everything

01:30:06

I do, I have to do the way Christ would want me to do it. And sometimes that means don't do it at all because, uh, it's gonna, it's not going to go well here.

01:30:19

It's just really difficult. So, I mean, I'm, I don't think you have to be the raving lunatic on a sideline, which you do have, you know,

01:30:32

I've pulled coaches aside, uh, personally and, and talk to them, tried to do that in a respectful way.

01:30:39

I think most of the time, um, I was the coach that got pulled aside. Sometimes when my kids were younger, uh, it always made a difference if the parent was sort of realistic understanding and, um, approached me with just respect and care for his kid.

01:30:58

I'm a parent. So I understand the parents concern for their kids. And I think coaches should understand that as well.

01:31:03

But, uh, but, but I do think it's something's not right.

01:31:11

When, when you lose your cool on a sideline in front of your kids, you've lost the whole point of what it means to be a model for your kid, which you have them in the sports to begin with, to teach them those kinds of things.

01:31:25

And then you completely lose it over a call that probably could have gone either way or that no one would have ever seen or, uh, or could have gotten perfectly right.

01:31:38

It's, um, so, uh, our passion for our kids and our passion for sports, you put them together and you've got something very combustible that if Christ is holding your heart, uh, you can, you can lose it.

01:31:54

Sports, uh, sports can do that to you, but it's not healthy.

01:32:00

We'll have you, uh, again, start Pete, uh, this time, uh, and then we'll have

01:32:06

Robert follow. We have Ronald in Eastern Suffolk County, Long Island, New York, who says,

01:32:13

I am very upset by the trend in sports and academics with young children.

01:32:22

When things like, as far as the classroom is concerned, test scores and things like that are done away with.

01:32:30

And in the athletic realm where scores are eliminated and all sense of competition eliminated.

01:32:38

I think this is extremely damaging to the growth and nurturing of children and making them totally unprepared for the real world.

01:32:47

What is your opinions on that? And we'll start again with you, Pete. Uh, yeah,

01:32:54

I don't think you have to take, uh, it's, it's the whole idea of everyone wins.

01:33:00

Everyone's a winner and everyone has a trophy and there's no comparison. Obviously we all understand competition can get unhealthy.

01:33:10

No matter what we do, it can get unhealthy. Competition can get unhealthy, but I don't, I don't know that trying to create equal floor all the time is going to serve everyone.

01:33:23

Well, and you're, and your listeners, correct. Um, we don't, one of the, one of the valuable things about sports, about competition is it teaches you, uh, is it teaches you how to lose.

01:33:36

Sometimes you gotta know how to lose in life. Sometimes you get hurt and it's really disappointing.

01:33:44

And you're like, man, if I hadn't gotten hurt, this would have, this would have happened. Um, we also realize, you know, and I, I did it quick.

01:33:52

Um, I was in an elementary and junior high school. I was one of the better players on, on my team.

01:33:59

It didn't take very long, uh, to, I realized, you know, I got to ninth grade and realized

01:34:06

I'm not growing fast enough to play with the people who are playing now.

01:34:11

And there's a sort of reality that comes in as great as I thought

01:34:17

I was. Uh, maybe this is not what I ought to be doing. I mean, these are great life lessons because that's true in other areas.

01:34:25

Of life. So your listeners, I mean, makes a great point, how it applies in these institutions and schools and those kinds of things, you know,

01:34:35

I'm not in that world specifically. So it's hard for me to, uh, judge it completely.

01:34:41

Generally speaking, I like the idea of us being realistic about our abilities, about competition, about, um, you know, the winning and losing.

01:34:52

Is it always a, is it always a bad thing? I guess what

01:34:58

I'm trying to say. And Robert? Yeah, I would, again, agree with Pete on that.

01:35:08

It's the whole participation trophy. I, again, it started with good intentions, but, but it's become meaningless.

01:35:19

I can tell you as a father, when, when my children received a participation pro, you know, trophy for playing soccer or something and, and, you know, rec sports, it meant zero to them.

01:35:34

Um, especially when, when they, they did succeed and they did well, um, there, there needs to be recognition.

01:35:44

Um, but I think there's extremes to that. It can go the other way. And I think that's why we are where we are right now, because some people put so much on winning, uh, versus losing, but, but it's, it's life.

01:35:57

It is necessary. You know, you aren't going to always succeed in life. Um, and, and that's that.

01:36:05

Honestly, that's the value of sports in high school and junior high, because it's, uh, it's a very safe place to fail, you know, because when you get older and you're an adult and you fail, it's a lot, it's a lot more difficult.

01:36:21

Uh, and we're seeing that, that right now, I mean, you're seeing people who have been patted on their back all their lives and, um, with the parachute parents and everything.

01:36:31

And, you know, all of a sudden for the first time, it's not being handed to them.

01:36:37

And they don't know how, how to recover from that. But the kids who have been taught that, and a lot of times it's taught people to understand that's what you learn through sports.

01:36:46

It's not, it's not always about athletics. It's about learning, you know, these life lessons.

01:36:51

That's the major part of it. Um, you may not win ballgames, but you may learn how to win in life.

01:36:57

And that's, that's the goal because reality is you can lose in life. I'm going to ask you a question and then have you both answer it after the break.

01:37:07

This is the final break. And, uh, by the way, folks, it's the, it's the, probably the shortest break in the show.

01:37:15

If you have a question that you'd like to ask as well, send it in immediately because we're rapidly running out of time.

01:37:22

ChrisArnzen at gmail .com, ChrisArnzen at gmail .com. But, uh, we have a question, uh, from CJ in Lindenhurst, Long Island, New York, uh, who says, there is a controversy and a disagreement in my church over the observation of the

01:37:43

Sabbath or Lord's Day, depending upon how you view that day in regarding strict observance and liberty.

01:37:52

I was wondering, regardless of what position you take on Sunday, how we can allow our children to participate in either high school sports or others, or even to view professional sports, which all have seemingly totally disregarded the importance of honoring our

01:38:17

Lord on His day. It's quite abysmal how even many Christian athletes and children of Christian parents put as a priority their athletic activity far above and beyond the observance of the

01:38:35

Lord's Day. How do you to reconcile your activity in sports with this very important issue?

01:38:42

And we'll have you both respond to that after the final break. And if anybody else has a question of your own that you would like to ask, our email address is

01:38:53

ChrisArnzen at gmail .com, C -H -R -I -S -A -R -N -Z -E -N at gmail .com.

01:39:00

Give us your first name at least, your city and state of residence, and your country of residence. Don't go away. We'll be right back after these messages.

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01:40:30

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01:40:36

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01:41:11

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01:41:17

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Oh hail the power of Jesus' name.

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Again, I'm Pastor Anthony Avivio and thanks for listening. Welcome back. This is Chris Arnzen and Pete.

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I believe we are starting with you again. Yes. The question, very controversial question, a question that even brought up an enormous amount of global controversy in the early 20th century during the

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Olympics when the world -renowned athlete Eric Little refused to run on the

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Sabbath, as he called it, the Lord's Day Sunday because he believed he was violating a commandment of God and actually took the risk of running in an event, a track event that was not where his skill primarily was and outside of his own experience as an athlete and he still, by God's grace, won.

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But how does a Christian parent or athlete respond to the blatant disregard for the

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Lord's Day in the realm of sports, both in the grammar, high school, and colleges, but also in the world of professional sports?

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Yes, I think culture, from an athletic standpoint, definitely has really no regard at all for that special day.

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That was a time when everybody did in society. I remember when my kids started, when spring football started.

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You'd play football in the fall when you were coaching your kids, little kids, and then all of a sudden they wanted to start to get a spring league together so you could literally play all year, play football all year, tackle football all year with your kids.

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And the only hitch to playing in the spring was you would have to practice sometimes on a

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Sunday or have a game on a Sunday because it was spring and other sports were going on and you just didn't have the fields, you didn't have access to things because football wasn't normally in the spring.

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And I remember letting everybody know on the team that, hey, we're in, we want to play, but we're not going to participate in anything that happens on Sunday unless it's after church.

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Later on in the afternoon, we would participate, but if it was in the mornings, if it affected us, we just chose not to do it.

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So you're looking at families having to make choices today with their kids, unfortunately, choosing to stay away from it.

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There's a fine line between making the Sabbath something that God didn't intend it to be and honoring it at the same time.

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We could be legalistic about it, like the Pharisees were. They were.

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And Paul in Colossians says, be very, very careful about making one day special of other days.

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So there's a balance between honoring the Sabbath and making it legalistic.

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This is why I would push back to every family to say what's healthy for our family may not be healthy for yours.

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Or we choose to be at church on Sunday mornings. Or we have this great Wednesday night program that we're a part of that allows my kids to be able to go to Sunday.

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So each family is going to have to make hard decisions. I think the idea that any family would just say, we've given up our

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Sundays just for sports, without thinking through the spiritual implications, in their own home and family, would not be wise.

01:51:33

I don't think that's wise at all, to just give in to it. But I don't know that I would say to every family in our church, you can't miss a

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Sunday. A lot of people work on Sundays. Their job requires them to work on Sunday.

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And so it's definitely sports as disregard.

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But a lot of people have to work on Sunday and can't go to church. So they have to choose a different time. They do small group during the week or they do a

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Wednesday night program. They have to figure out how to fit that in. You don't want to make it a legalistic thing.

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On the other hand, every family ought to really take into account, how is this going to impact our home if we're given the choice to not go to church on a

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Sunday or to not honor that day? I think that's more where I would lean than just impact in the same one way or the other.

01:52:35

Yes, of course. In the reformed circles that I am in, there are some that obviously would say that a person shouldn't be working on the

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Lord's Day either unless it is an act of mercy or necessity like a police officer, a fireman, a nurse, a doctor, that kind of a thing, a soldier.

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But that is an issue that I'm sure will continue to divide the body of Christ.

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But certainly nobody should have a flippant attitude about, well, it doesn't really matter. Robert, if you could put your two cents in there.

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Well, I have been guilty with my family because my daughter played select volleyball, and their tournaments are on the weekend.

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We travel to Chicago, Denver, different places like that.

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So I could never tell anyone what they should or shouldn't do. But I would go back to kind of what

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Pete said. It's really all about your heart and what you worship. What do you make in your idols? Our family knows where we stand.

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It is God first. It is Christ. Sunday is no better day than the other days, honestly, to worship the

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Lord. I mean, if you're only doing it on Sunday, there's a problem. If you're only thinking about Christ on Sunday, there's a problem.

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The Sabbath was created for us to rest and to contemplate and to bring us back, to remind us that God is our creator, that God is in control.

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It's not an easy question to answer, and I think Pete's right. Everybody has to answer that question in their own heart.

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Obviously, it is one of the Ten Commandments. So you can't brush that aside at all.

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So kind of that's where I'm at. Well, I'd like you each to have about a minute and a half or so to summarize what you most want etched in the minds and hearts of our listeners and regarding to Coach's outreach.

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And we'll start this time with Robert, and we'll have Pete finish. I may double up with Pete, but we have issued, or Pete, God put it on his heart, a challenge 1 ,000.

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And so basically, over the next year and a half, we want to add an additional 400

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Bible studies at the high school and junior high level across the United States.

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We now have the ability to do that. Really, the way to do that, though, is for people like your listeners, the men out there in Pennsylvania and New York that are asking these questions to step up and help us.

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We need facilitators for these Bible studies. The coaches don't lead the Bible studies. We get men from the community, lay people that can just come in, love the

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Lord, love these coaches, love sports, and build into them. The material is written.

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It's all self -contained, very, very strong. We're trying to teach coaches how to study the

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Bible, not just the information but how to study. We use the observation, interpretation, application method that Howard Hendricks made famous at DTS, and it's teaching coaches how to study the

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Word and become disciples and then build into their community. So what I would ask is if you're a listener out there and are interested in any part of this ministry, maybe a coach wants to know more about the ministry, reach out, coachesoutreach .org.

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Just tell us you're interested, and we'll help you. Everything's free. We're not asking for any financial donations.

01:56:31

We have people that take care of that. We just need feet on the ground. And Pete?

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Yes, I think I would add we are in roughly 19 states.

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We have studies in 19 states. There's about 600 of them going on. That's roughly 6 ,000 coaches involved.

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We now have maybe close to 20 colleges that are also doing these studies, college campuses doing these studies.

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We even have one professional team doing the study.

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So right now, if you're a coach or you love sports or you're connected to a team, let us know.

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We can get you the resources to encourage a group to have a study.

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Just introduce them to it. That happens all the time. And if you want to lead a study like Robert's done or you want to support our ministry because you feel like you can do that, whichever thing you want to do, if you love sports and you love the platform of getting the gospel and the word of God out to these coaches and athletes, then support us some way, some way, whether that's just tell a friend, a coach, or a team, or something, or be a lay leader, or financially support the ministry.

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Either way, coachesoutreach .org. We're easy to find, and I think we're making a really big impact.

01:58:05

Amen. Well, thank you both so much for being such excellent guests on the program. Again, that's coachesoutreach .org,

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coachesoutreach .org. I want you to both extend my warmest greetings to Scott Henderson, who is the one that introduced me to both of you and your ministry.

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I want to thank everybody who listened today, especially those who took the time to write. I want you all to have a very safe and blessed and joyful and refreshing and Christ -honoring weekend and Lord's Day.

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And I want you all to always remember for the rest of your lives that Jesus Christ is a far greater Savior than you are a sinner.