BBC Elders Q&A

Elders’ Opening Remarks on Church Polity and Q&A

This is Bethlehem Bible Church, and these are the elders of the church. Churches have different ways to govern themselves. There's congregational rule. There is... So there's congregational polity, and that's very popular, of course, in New England.

Then there's bishops that run things, so that would be different denominations. And then there's elder leadership, and we believe the Bible clearly teaches elder leadership. And I know you know these men, and they read scripture regularly and pray for you.

And we, once a quarter or so, want to just have a Q &A. You could ask any question you'd like. You can either write the question, email the question, or ask the question tonight. So we want to do that.

I do want to say, though, if you ever have a question, a private question or anything you want to know about the church or what we believe, you can ask these guys at any time. I think the only time they wouldn't give you an answer is maybe there's some church discipline case going on or something like that, and they might not be able to give you that information.

But if you want to ask about church budgets, you'd like to ask about doctrinal things. Anything you want to ask, you can grab them any time. And what we try to do, by the way, I don't know if you've noticed this, but on Sundays, even though we're really good friends, all of us, and I think that's a testament to the glory of God, we don't talk to each other on Sundays.

Maybe just here or there because we're trying to talk to you and minister to you and be open for your questions instead of just huddling with our best friends, you know, the elder board. And maybe if I could give you a little pastoral advice, you probably have people that every week you want to see and talk to because they're your friends.

But don't forget about other people who are here and visiting that you might need to extend the right hand of fellowship to. And so we'd like you to model even what we try to do. Of course, say hi to your friends and loved ones, but then see who's visiting.

All right. So with that, are there questions for the elders? And if you just, since it's a small congregation tonight, if you just ask the question, I'll repeat the question on the microphone and then I'll have one of these guys answer the question.

We have a backup plan if there aren't questions. But are there questions for the elders? Yes. Okay. Good question. I don't think you got approval earlier. Let me repeat the question for the sake of the microphone.

I'm coming up now on 20 years of being your pastor. And what'd you say, Janet? Is it different than I thought it would be? I probably could do a, you know, radio show on this or maybe a whole Sunday night with, you know, six lessons I've learned or something like that.

Reflections on Twenty Years of Pastoral Ministry

But just off the top of my head, I'm remembering a conversation I had with John MacArthur in 97. I was a brand new pastor. I'd been here for six months. And I just wanted some help from John. And I said, you know, can you help me figure out this pastoral ministry?

Because it's easy in seminary when you're learning, but then when you have to do it. And John said to me, we were in New York, Scroon Lake. Scroon Lake, how do you say it? Scroon? Is that right? By the way, it was always funny because Word of Life is there.

And when I first got here, I talked to young people. Are you a Christian? Yes. When did you get saved? I got saved at the Super Bowl. Everybody I met got saved at the Super Bowl. I thought it seemed like it's kind of a poor congregation, but there's a lot of rich people here sending their children to the Super Bowl.

And Super Bowl was just this big event at Word of Life that had nothing to do with the NFL. So anyway, I asked John and John looked at me. And he said, over lunch, he said, you'll figure it out. I thought that is not the answer I'm looking for.

You'll figure it out. And this is going to sound like a joke initially, but for you ladies that have born children, if you knew the pain you would be in ahead of time, you might not want to have children, right?

It's just like, oh, nobody told me it was going to be that painful. And so we've had wonderful ups here at the church and wonderful downs because the Lord has made them both, you know, wonderful. What are my expectations?

I really thought I wanted to go, 2 Timothy chapter 4 says, preach the word. And so I thought there's a lot of things I'm not good at, but I'm determined with the training that I've had at the seminary and good godly examples, alive and dead, to just preach the word.

And really, Janet, I think, and you know this from Grace Church and here as well, the word of God changes people. It changes what they think, what they then do. It changes everything about them, imperceptibly sometimes, because you don't see immediate change.

You know, it's kind of like that growing bean. You know, you mark up your grandkids. How many grandkids do you have now? 15 or something like that? Okay, good, good. And so the word of God changes people.

1 Peter chapter 2 verses 1 and 2 talks about like newborn babes long for the pure milk of the word that by it you may grow in respect to salvation. And I just have watched people learn and grow. So that's been probably the most wonderful thing for me, is to watch people get saved and watch them learn and grow.

And even Eric Johanson last week to watch him. I mean, in one sense, I thought, you know, I didn't save, in every sense, I didn't save him or sanctify him, but I was used by the Lord in his life. And I thought that's, this is kind of the, as good as it gets.

And then the phone call from the doctor comes and then you go up and down. So 20 years of expectations. I really was happy when I became a pastor. And here's a little town of 5 ,000, 6 ,000 people out in the middle of nowhere.

I was glad it was in America. And the Lord knew I just needed to be behind the scenes just week in and week out. I mean, how many Sunday night services did we have here? Preaching through Genesis and Exodus and those places and those books.

And there have been trials, but every church has trials. I see the Psalms differently now because of the joys that are found in the Psalms and then the difficult times found in the Psalms. So scripture has become more alive in my life as I've watched people.

I've watched your kids grow up. You know, one of the benefits of being here 20 years, some of your children were not born when I got here. And then I've watched Harry baptize them. That's been pretty exciting to see.

That is life changing when you see these young people grow up, you know, little rug rat kids running around the Iwana circle and stuff. And then they're getting baptized. And Nathan Goddard, are you here, Nathan, tonight?

There he is. Nathan Goddard's in my preaching class. 17 years old, yes. And when I saw you, when did we first meet? Were you even alive when we met? And just watching young men and women just learn and grow.

And Nathan will be preaching a 30-minute sermon here next Saturday, right from that pulpit. It better be good. So I'm rambling, but it's just a testimony of the grace of God. I think of the Ebenezer in the Old Testament.

And you set up the Ebenezer and you think God has been faithful thus far. And I don't have an agenda as I say it, but you know it's the powerful word because we realize how weak we are and sinful we are.

I am weak and sinful. And you just go, what changes people? So I've always thought, you know what, when they bury me at Bethlehem Bible Church, I hope it's in a long time from now. I hope they say things.

I hope you say things like, you know, he might not have done this that well or this, you know, the other thing too well. And we wish he would have been such and such. But every time he stepped in the pulpit, he opened up the Bible.

Every wedding, every funeral, he taught the Bible. So that's really what I'm after. I think for these men, that's why the charge in 2 Timothy is the courtroom, language, life or death charge. I charge you in the presence of God, even the Lord Jesus Christ, who's going to come back to judge the living and the dead.

Preach the word in season and out of season. Reprove, rebuke, exhort with great patience and instruction. So that's what we really want to do. And we have a lot, a long way to go as an elder board. But every one of these men is committed to teaching you the Bible no matter what.

If it costs them their life or we get closed down or the persecution comes, we will teach you the Bible. So would I do anything differently in the last 20 years? There are lots of things that I would do differently, but the Lord even uses those things.

I think there was a pastor one day that preached a sermon about God causes all things to work together for good. And I would agree with that pastor. So I'm going to stop rambling. I don't even think I answered your question, but that's my answer.

Okay. All right. Thank you. And I will say, because some of you are newer to the church, Steve and Janet Cooley began coming to our Bible study in Los Angeles over 20 years ago and to watch them as immature Christians, mature and ministers of the gospel now.

And I don't mean capital M for Janet, but just ministering the gospel faithfully to ladies and to men. And it just really changes people. And so we get to watch that. I'd hate it if I jumped around every three years to different churches because I'd never get to see that.

And hopefully by the grace of God, you've seen growth in my life and we'll continue to see that. And I'd like to just keep getting to becoming a better pastor. And so hopefully you get to see it. I think somebody told me the other day, they said, Mike, we think you're getting nicer.

I thought, you know what? I hope I am. I hope I'm getting nicer and kinder. Okay. Next question. Pardon? What? Favorite book? Oh, yeah. What's my favorite book? A few months ago, you know, I was just saying a few things about, you know, this might be the last book I ever preached, the book of Hebrews.

Favorite Books of the Bible for Preaching

I'm just going to go slowly. And little did I know that might actually be the case, right? You just think, okay. So I've particularly loved Hebrew, Scott, for the reason that it helps me to know the Old Testament better.

If Janet asked me how I've changed over the last 20 years, I would say, I think I see more continuity between the Old Testament and New Testament. I would see Christ in more places. At least types are examples or flickers of who Jesus the Messiah is in the Old Testament.

So the Hebrews has helped me make those connections. And they've helped me make the connections legitimately because I don't want to say, oh, there's the pomegranate on the temple is representative of Christ.

You know, the wooden nail is meant to be a fastener for things. It's not meant to be a picture of the cross. So I like Hebrews. I want to preach to the gospel of John badly, but I have a friend who's hurting me and not allowing me to do that because he's preaching through it now, Steve.

You know, I don't know why I do these things. Years ago, Steve said, I'd like to, you know, preach through a gospel. What do you think? I said, I'd preach to the gospel of John if I were you. He, you know, thought about it and it's his choice.

And he picked the gospel of John. I should have told him like Maccabees or something so I could preach the gospel of John. I probably do Luke after Hebrews. I love the gospel of Mark because there's just a lot of action and you just see the Messiah setting his face towards Jerusalem.

But unlike me, Jesus, when he's interrupted, he has time for people. It's part of the sovereign plan. And he might even allow people to die to minister to other people and then we'll go and raise them from the dead.

And so I like Mark because we are all too busy and we're all running and it's pell-mell, hectic, back and forth, rushing around. I think, you know what, there's a different way to go about it. Okay, good.

Next question. Yes. Well, that's a good question. Why did I decide to become a pastor? Well, I was going to try to split up all the questions tonight with... What are you doing? You just walk up here?

Is Santa on your way up? Is it money? It's like a gift certificate or something? I think someone has a question in that car. Okay, all right. You may be seated. Why did I become a pastor? Well, here's the thing.

Why God Calls People to the Pastoral Office

God makes pastors. And so when you're studying the Bible and things like that, and I was a younger man at the time, I never really wanted to become a pastor because I am kind of vain and prideful if I don't think about things rightly.

And so I don't want to get up and preach unless I'm an excellent preacher. When you have to listen to John MacArthur and James Montgomery Boyce and S. Lewis Johnson, how could I get up and preach after listening to some of these very wonderful preachers, the best?

And so I began to study the Bible, and I thought, all right, I'm going to go take 96 hours of seminary classes, and I will quit before I take the preaching class because I'm not going to get up and preach.

There's no way I'm going to stand up there and preach. And it's hard to preach, and it's difficult, and it's a responsibility. So I thought I'd do all that. But then at the very end, I took the class anyway and began to preach.

And so how do you become a preacher? There's two answers. God first works and then changes your heart and prepares you, and then you respond, and you have to study and learn. And if you want to become a pastor on your own, you probably shouldn't.

Well, for you, you're a young lady, you shouldn't. But if you meet a man sometime who wants to be a pastor, if he just says, I'm going to do it no matter what, I think that would be bad. He needs to say, God is forcing me to do this, and I don't really have another option.

Nothing else will make me happy. Nothing else will satisfy me. I have other things I could do, but I know God is pushing me and compelling me with circumstances and situations. And so how do you become a pastor?

It's almost like, how do you become a Christian? God is gracious, and he makes people Christians. He makes people pastors. And so I think it's what the Lord did. So that's a good question. Thank you. Kim, do you have a question?

Okay, other questions. Could be about anything, yes. Okay, thank you. I'll repeat the question for the sake of the recording. What is the elder's view of Israel? Is it spiritual Israel? Is it physical Israel?

Is it national Israel? Nation of Israel? What's the position? So now since I've answered a couple of questions, I'm going to ask Harry to first talk about it. The other guys can chip in, because Harry, he's like the Dallas guy.

He's got the Scofield reference Bible. My hope is built on nothing less than Moody Press. That's right.

No respect. Well, a quick answer is if we believed in spiritual Israel, we wouldn't be baptizing believers. Because if there's no distinction between Israel and the church, then we can just make the jump as some respected scholars and teachers do today, that infant baptism is the equivalent to circumcision in the Old Testament, because there's spiritual Israel.

There's no distinction between Israel and the church, or it just carries over into the New Testament. But we believe in believers baptism. That's one natural effect in terms of ministry, because we do believe that the church, the birthday of the church was in Acts 2.

I believe that God does have a unique program for his people. That's what distinguishes the church in Ephesians 2. It's Jews and Gentiles under Christ. But if we believe in a literal, biblical, hermeneutical interpretation of the scripture, then the promises that were made in the Old Testament, God will bring to fulfillment for his people, for the Jews.

Yes, that's a simple answer.

Steve, a lot of times this reminds me of a question that, I had one moment of fame early on in my Christian life, that was that I got to be the second person to ask John a question on a Sunday night. My question was filled with import and nuance.

The first question really wasn't. The guy says, what's the significance of Benjamin Netanyahu in the end times? And this is like 1995, 96, something like that. Yeah, that's exactly right. I mean, I was in the audience.

Well, actually, I was standing at the microphone, but I just kind of like, kind of questions that. All that to say, because we talked about it a little bit, Janet and I did this morning. Listen, if Israel was wiped off the map tomorrow, does that make God's promises to Abraham, the Abrahamic covenant, null and void?

And the answer is no. We don't know that this is the end times Israel that's going to exist at the end. It may be, it may not be. But what we do know is that God is going to fulfill everything that he said.

And that means the land promises to, we believe, to national Israel, that there will be a country called Israel, that there will be a Jewish country there, that they will be descendants, physical descendants from Abraham.

Unlike, as Harry was saying, those who say that it's spiritually fulfilled, that's the key difference. Is it going to be literally fulfilled to the descendants of Abraham, thus fulfilling the promise to Abraham?

Or is it going to be figuratively fulfilled to the spiritual descendants of Abraham? And we would say it's going to be a literal fulfillment. And that literally Jesus is going to rule and reign for a thousand years, literally from the Temple Mount.

That there's a literal millennium and all that. So we take a very literal view of revelation and eschatology. So all that to say that I, you know, people say, well, has the Abrahamic, I heard a covenantal theologian not long ago say that the land promises were already fulfilled to Israel.

And I'm like, that's not true. Because it would go deep into, it would go across the Sinai, actually, further than Israel has ever owned. And then it would go the other way into Syria and even into part of Iraq.

So that's never happened, not in history. So we believe that there's still a future fulfillment. You want to say something? Maybe something brief.

Okay, sure. Hello. I want to tell you, when I got saved, I was a dispensationalist. And that's all I had actually heard. I've never heard of covenant theology. So for those of you who may not know it, you know, there's two broad categories.

One is covenant theology and the other one is dispensational. But there's really not two camps. I think, Pastor Steve, you've done a series on this, right? So you might find some Sunday schools earlier on this subject.

And there's various people that are in... IBS, thank you. And there are people who hold to different levels of continuity between the old and the new, between Israel and the church. And so depending on who you're reading, you may see some texts of scriptures emphasized more and some of the other texts, you know, either spiritualized or changed.

Or not changed. They don't emphasize it enough or gloss over it in order to provide the emphasis in one area. And since I know Scott got it and I had to read the book, Continuity and Discontinuity. I read it and I said, I didn't understand anything.

I just read this book. It's a heavy book, but it's a helpful book because it tries to show some of those challenges in interpretation. But I think coming back to what Pastor Steve said, if you hold on to a literal hermeneutic, that the text that we are reading is to be literally interpreted, especially Revelation 20, talking about the thousand years.

The unconditional promises of God, Abraham down. If they are literally fulfilled or not. And again, there are others who would say, you know, maybe they are fulfilled or they're abrogated for some other reason.

But we do hold that national Israel is distinct. And there will be a culmination when Christ comes back and rules as the son of David on the throne of David. And everything that has been promised and prophesied in the Old Testament will be exactly fulfilled as God has promised.

And Hank Scott.

I mean, that's essentially what we talked about in the car. A lot of it, we talked about the different levels of covenantalism and we talked about dispensationalism and really just the views there between what Israel is and how we focus on, you know, how Paul deals with it in Romans and in other texts where we know that it would be fulfilled.

And that's what we had discussed too. So I think she just wanted to confirm I was right over there. Oh, good.

Well, I think what happens is when you need to talk about Israel and the future for Israel, the battle really is found in the individual texts. So if you read a systematic theology, you might easily say, oh, that amillennial view of spiritual Israel, that sounds right because these people who teach that are not dumb.

If you read a systematic theology with dispensationalism, you think, oh, that's right. But the best thing for you to do is to go to Galatians 6 .16, the Israel of God, and figure out what Paul means as he writes that.

Your theology should come from the text. You should be looking at Romans 9 and Romans 11 to find out what about this literal Israel. Is it literal or is it not? It's fascinating when you do look in the New Testament, every time the word Israel is used, it's used of a national literal Israel, except maybe Galatians 6 .16.

I don't think it's an exception, but that's where the amillennial people would go to. When you hear dispensationalism in covenant theology, one of the men had already said it, you're dealing with, is there a lot of continuity between the Old and New Testament?

Are there things that are different and there's discontinuity? And the more continuity you have, one program across the Testament, you will be more covenant in your theology. When you have a little more of a break, Israel and church, you'll be more dispensational.

And I think on the elder board, we have different varying degrees. My guess would be, and I could be wrong, that out of all of our views of premillennialism and the future for Israel, my guess is I'm the most covenantal, although I'm not a true covenant theologian, and maybe Scott and Harry are the least.

That would just be a guess of mine, but we're all within the same kind of range. The word covenant is just where we get our word federal, federal headship. We here at Bethlehem Bible Church, if you believe what I teach, and these men would believe it, the federal headship of Adam, Adam was a federal head, Jesus was the last Adam as a federal head.

That kind of talk is covenant theology, but we have a different type of hermeneutic and we still see a future for Israel. The elder board is unified in the federal head Adam, the federal head Jesus, and one plan of salvation for Old and New Testament, the Spirit of God working the same way in the Old Testament and New Testament, with few exceptions.

I believe in one people of God. Harry might believe in two people of God. We haven't sat and talked about it. It's not that big a deal. But we are unified as an elder board, not to the minutia, but generally where we're all premillennial and see a future for Israel.

Okay, yes. Well, the question is, how do they define spiritual Israel? When you guys would take it? Well, instead of what? Oh, yeah, please, please do. No, no. I defer to the PhD at the Southern Baptist Theological Seminary.

Defining Spiritual Israel and Hermeneutics

Here's the confession. Um, you know, covenant theology, and maybe this might help think about how I view this. Maybe five, six years back, we had a lot of questions from within the body about covenant theology.

So until that point, this was really not even a subject I deeply cared about, in the sense that, you know, I knew what the word said. I knew how to interpret this text as needed. But then here were some sheep in the body who had a differing view and a strong differing view, not just, you know, I want to talk about this, but I think this is right.

And you're wrong. Can we speak? And so that's what brought me into thinking about studying covenant theology. Even when I had to go to Southern, it was an academic exercise. It wasn't really, I wanted to study it, but it was very dense.

And I said, I'm passing this by because I'm able to study, understand, and apply the word without a deep understanding of covenant theology. So when we think of spiritual Israel, and this is why I'm saying I will defer to you, because I have studied specific texts as people have brought them to me, either from a standpoint of pedo-baptism.

So one of the members came and said, I believe this is right. So I said, you know, I haven't studied this, but let's look at this together. So then I just walked through the text with this person and said, I don't believe this is.

So help me understand how you see this as a pedo-baptist text. And it turned out that that particular text didn't have anything. And so then we started looking at some commentators, covenant theologian commentators, to say, how do they make that interpretation?

And then as we study it, we can realize, you know, there is a broader theology that is driving this particular commentator to come to that conclusion. So when I used the term spiritual Israel, I wasn't using my great PhD resources and all the different texts that I've applied, but the terms that I have heard people use them to me.

So when we look at texts in the New Testament talking about Israel, they would often, like Pastor Mike was saying, many of these texts are literal texts talking about the nation of Israel. But they would say, you know, this is not talking about Israel as a nation, but we are the spiritual Israel.

And I think the text, is it in Ephesians? They would use one of the texts to talk about how I might be mistaken, but talking about the middle wall of division that is being broken. And now that we are one and that there is everything that is talked about Israel is now the church and there is just one body or one people, then it takes it further.

I'll defer to someone who knows.

Well, here's kind of an interesting thing. This really is hermeneutic driven, that is to say, how you interpret scripture. And, you know, the question is, do you interpret for authorial intent, which is what we would say, but using a grammatical hermeneutic or a literal grammatical, you know, hermeneutic, which is to say, we look at a text, we look at it in its context, and we try to figure out what the authorial intent is.

The covenantal theologians add something to that. They say they have a literal, historical or literal, grammatical, historical hermeneutic. And what that means is they interpret the Old Testament in light of what the New Testament says.

So things that are written in the Old Testament may not even mean what are, you know, the original author may not have understood what he was writing. For an example, Isaiah chapter 2, the word that Isaiah, the son of Amoz, saw concerning Judah and Jerusalem.

Now, that's a prophetic vision that he's given here. You know, a word from the Lord, so to speak. And it says, it shall come to pass in the latter days that the mountain of the house of the Lord shall be established as the highest of the mountains and shall be lifted up above the hills, and all the nations shall flow to it.

And many people shall come and say, come, let us go up to the mountain of the Lord, to the house of the God of Jacob, that he may teach us his ways, and that we may walk in his paths. For out of Zion shall go the law and the word of the Lord from Jerusalem.

He shall judge between the nations and shall decide disputes for many peoples. And they shall beat their swords into plowshares and their spears into pruning hooks. Nations shall not lift up a sword against nation, neither shall they learn war anymore.

Now, if you read dispensational commentators, they'll say that this is a view of the thousand-year reign of Christ from Jerusalem. If you read covenantal theologians, they will say, this is a prophecy about the church in the end times.

And I, you know, I kept looking at the text and looking back at the commentaries, looking at the text, looking, and I'm going, I can't see the church there. They see the church throughout the Old Testament.

They say that there's one people of God, that God always worked the same way for, you know, to use shorthand here. And we say that he always saved the same way, but he didn't always work the same way.

I mean, obviously the Gentiles, for the most part, were not saved in the Old Testament. Well, now the Gentiles are. There's a transition that takes place, you know, when the church comes into being. And that's what we believe.

But what was the original question? I don't even remember now. Well, spiritual Israel. Oh, sorry. So again, it has to do with, you know, is there really a spiritual Israel? You know, those who are saved, you know, and they would point to this, they would say this.

Well, is it true that physical Israel in the Old Testament contained saved and unsaved people? Yes. Well, then not all Israel was really Israel, and it's the same now. And, you know, so anyway, all that to say that I think it kind of muddies the water when we start talking about that.

And I'd rather just talk about people who are saved and not saved. So.

The Church, Acts 2, and the Atonement of Christ

There's a lot to talk about with this. Let's have the next question, please. Yes. By the way, we're glad to have you, and you're supposed to be sitting over there. Remind me of your name. Lewis. Okay, please.

Okay. Thank you, Lewis, for the question. Let's see. How could I summarize it? Maybe we could start with when did the church start? And then how could the church, Lewis is asking, how could church start in Acts 2 if substitutionary atonement wasn't preached until later when Paul was preaching?

Is that a fair summary? Something like that. Men.

You can do whatever you like. We can edit the tape. Okay. He's just a visitor. While I'm fumbling along, hopefully the men can find some text to work through. What I really want to do is reprocess the question that you gave so that I can frame it better in my own mind.

When I think of Acts 2, so we have there the coming of the Holy Spirit. We have the proclamation of the message by Peter. And as you said, I don't recollect in Acts 2 there being a substitutionary atonement doctrine proclaimed.

When I always look at preached messages in the text, in a historical text like Acts, in my mind, I know that this is a summary of the overall message, but it contains the key points of the message. So if he did speak on substitutionary atonement, I think Luke, by the inspiration of the Holy Spirit would have probably covered that.

So even though it may not be a verbatim, every word that Peter said, I think you may be right in saying that that teaching is not there. And when you said Antioch, that's where we have the believers first called Christians, and we have false teachings from later on that more explicitly lay that out.

But when you first gave the question, here's how I was processing it. We are talking about two distinct things. One is the salvation of believers, and the other one is the formation of the church. Now, salvation is just as dependent on the doctrine of substitutionary atonement as it is the church as a whole.

So we know that the people in Acts 2 who repented and were believers, and even those before the church was formed who were saved, like Jesus talking to the thief on the cross, he is also saved with less than wholesome understanding of what happens in the time of salvation, in understanding everything that Christ has done, except that he needed to repent and believe, and he trusted in the work of Christ, even if he didn't understand all the implications of that work.

Now, with that said, how that applies to the church, I'll let these men.

Welcome, by the way, Louis. Good to have you with us. Acts 2, Acts 1 -8, the overall theme, overall outline of the book, right? You should go and be my... They were talking about the kingdom of Israel, right?

They're just focused in Acts 2, he's addressing Jews. They're talking about the kingdom of Israel. Well, it's not for you to know right now, time of epics, but you will receive power on high when the Holy Spirit comes on you.

You'll be my witnesses in Jerusalem, Acts 1 -7, in Judea and Samaria, Acts 8 -12, and to the ends of the earth, 13 -28, with Paul's three missionary journeys. So when Christ said that, in Christ's mind, as a son of God before his ascension, when he said that to the disciples, do you think he was thinking, now, when you're going to be witnesses in Jerusalem, Acts 1 -7, it's not fully legit because the full progressive revelation of substitution and atonement hasn't been taught like it has by the Apostle Paul.