Presidential Debate, Latin Mass, the God of Purpose and Glory

Alpha & Omega Ministries

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00:29

Well greetings welcome to the dividing line about 10 seconds late there, I guess I'm not sure but We're we're we're all fine.

00:37

Now is what I'm hearing from the other room. So suppose that's good to Twitter things

00:44

Might as well start off with a smile because we get pretty serious later on Squad gives 21 fire alarm salute for their fallen comrade

00:55

Jamal Bowman now And it's a sad commentary on the

01:05

Collapsing state of the United States of America that Jamal Bowman or the squad as a whole have any place in the

01:14

Government of the United States. They're all enemies of the Constitution enemies of anything.

01:20

That's good or writer But this is the guy who's not only a rabid anti -semite, but he

01:30

He's the one I got caught pulling the fire alarm to interrupt a vote And ended up being censured for that and having to pay a fine and and he lost he got crushed

01:45

And in fact, I think the other Babylon be headline was oh no, no

01:52

No, actually, I think it was the guy on Fox Said Hamas loses seat to moderate

01:58

Democrat So Yeah, he is pretty much just a

02:04

Hamas operative and I I Normally wouldn't say that but I saw some of his final campaign

02:15

Stuff where he's dropping f -bombs all over the place. I mean, it's just It's an absolute circus that there there was once at least in my lifetime

02:28

A level of seriousness in politics now I realized that man back in the 1920s and and there there's been rough times in the past too but Nothing like what we have today

02:42

Just just amazing and illustration of this Just saw this the libs of tick -tock

02:52

New York City Paid out $350 ,000 To a man who identifies as a woman

03:02

After he was put in a men's jail for a month Dylan Miles was found guilty of multiple crimes in Democrat run

03:14

New York City violent men who identify as women get payouts for being sent to the correct prison $350 ,000 what do you even say?

03:29

What do you say about the judges, I mean I've seen a bunch of stuff today Remember Calvin's wise statement when

03:39

God wants to judge a people he gives them wicked judges and That is exactly what we are seeing

03:49

There is this judge down in Houston that literally blamed

03:59

Donald Trump for the rape and murder of that young girl Jocelyn Who was raped and murdered by people that the

04:15

Biden Regime have invited. They've opened the border said come and invade us

04:20

It's what the bit that I we are living in the the days of the largest

04:26

Public act of treason That I can I can think of in any

04:32

Historical situation. I cannot think of anyone Who more boldly openly and on a grand scale we're talking

04:41

Facilitating the invasion of millions of people You just wait till the day

04:51

Make make a mark of this make a mark of the time time frame here you wait for the day when there is a string of terrorist attacks in the

05:01

United States that make 9 -11 look like child's play and I'm gonna tell you right now.

05:07

They got here Do the border opened up? by the

05:12

Biden regime to fundamentally change the nature of the United States of America Just mark it down.

05:20

It's gonna happen It's inevitable but right now they're just murdering and raping and pillaging and That's exactly what the regime wants

05:32

Exactly what they want. They want the disruption. They want the fear. They want people clamoring for solutions from government

05:41

Because they grabbed hold the education system have created an entire generation the younger generation

05:48

That looks to government for everything They have no concept of self -sufficiency they have no concept of What's required for liberty and freedom and So you just make conditions so bad that they will voluntarily

06:09

Enslave themselves The whole climate fraud all of it it's all

06:17

The same thing it's all the same So, yeah, there you go

06:26

Just posted some nice pictures, man. You know what they they look a lot better Once I posted them then when

06:31

I initially took them this morning Got some nice sunrise pictures Down in South Mountain Park.

06:38

I went ahead and got up at 320 this morning So if I fall asleep during the middle of program just don't hold against me

06:46

But and this is where everybody laughs at me I know if you live in New Orleans you live in Houston you're gonna laugh

06:54

But the monsoon has kicked in early this year really early this year and We do have a monsoon in Arizona people don't know that they understand that and I know there have been times.

07:09

I've checked it myself Where I've gone out on early morning rides where the dew point in Phoenix was higher than it was in New Orleans and So when people hear about the heat we have here, oh, but it's a dry heat it was up until about a week ago

07:28

It was very dry. It's very comfortable. No two ways about it I mean you could sweat and it would just evaporate so fast.

07:35

It was very efficient very effective. I Had to stop four times this morning on the climb to wipe my eyes out.

07:43

I it's just there's just That Nothing would nothing would evaporate.

07:49

It's just pouring all over the place It was look it was it was a lot of work, but I'm very very very very thankful To be out there doing that again.

08:00

I Have caught up to where I was prior to The issues in Texas that led to Three surgeries

08:12

So I'm thankful for that We are looking Just got word today.

08:18

It's not confirmed yet. We are working on a debate for Colorado Springs We'll see what it's gonna be on once I tell you

08:32

What the subject that has been requested is you're gonna go? What? We'll talk about it later, but we're looking at the last weekend in July in Colorado Springs so keep that in your calendar and If you're up in that area would love to I've never done a

08:56

I've spoken in Colorado Springs, but I've never done a debate Colorado Springs, I've only done debates in Denver.

09:03

I think My recollection anyways sounds sounds about right

09:10

So there you go. Happy birthday to Tom Buck the overall wearing pastor

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Actually, he the only the only pair of overalls he has I gave him It's a long story, but I man

09:24

I'm telling you I swear that when he came to the premiere of Unpopular that he was wearing overalls and he swears the only overalls he's ever owned are the ones

09:36

I gave him long after that But man, I can just I can just see it in my mind. It's just but he is from Tennessee So it may just be the persona thing.

09:45

I don't know but his his wife made some nice comments on Twitter about you know, the the white hair being

09:54

You know wisdom and all this stuff and I said no The white hair and I know is

10:01

Two things. It's just simple age And the other thing is the stress induced by the fact that when

10:09

Tom drives a car He doesn't look at the road in front of him I will never forget that first drive from Dallas to Lindale and I'm sitting there in the passenger seat and I just keep doing this number and Every time

10:26

I look over there Tom's talking and he's looking at me and I'm just sort of like dude

10:34

Yeah. Oh, yes. He is. Oh, yes. He is and I'm just I'm just like good the roads over there

10:45

Oh Yeah, yeah, yeah, and I'm not the only one who has made that comment by the way There are other people who likewise have seen their lives flashing before their eyes

10:54

As far as I know he's not had any any accidents, but I Just say he's making his guardian angel work over time big time

11:06

Tomorrow night will be the I I really hate to call any political thing like like this a debate

11:18

Especially I Hear that Trump's people requested that both candidates undergo an independent drug test prior to the debate rejected

11:37

By the Adderall Injected Democrat Biden's people of course rejected this this request for obvious reasons

11:50

I can't imagine what the cocktail they're gonna be given him Is actually filled with if it's even him to be perfectly honest with you

12:00

I have no earthly idea But then isn't this the one with all the CNN wackos that are that are that are quote -unquote moderating it

12:08

Oh, that's gonna be that's fair. That's gonna be real real fair Yeah, and my understanding is they're they're they're trying to teach

12:17

Biden How to trigger Trump Which I can't imagine would be all that difficult to do given the debates last time

12:28

But I doubt he'll remember any of that. Yes, so there will be no audience No live does that do that's and and it's

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Think about this if you're not speaking if it's not your turn your mic is off and I sit back go.

12:48

Okay. Why didn't they do that a long time ago a and B Who's who are they thinking that this is gonna help?

12:56

Because I don't think it's gonna help big Joe. I don't know

13:02

They this they may not want to hear Joe Rambling on about something that he wasn't supposed to be rambling on about.

13:08

I don't know Yeah it's a It really does make you think back to the original debates and I'm not talking about like Lincoln Douglas or something like that The televised debate was

13:24

Kennedy and Nixon and The blurry black and white

13:31

Images, I mean, I don't know if that I don't know if that was 320 by 180 or something like that resolution back then it was so fuzzy and Now I don't think it was even and I don't think it was

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I think that was that came later it was fuzzy fuzzy fuzzy and But at least the debates were on issues and you know votes and this is

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I I hope Trump's people keep him from doing some of the stuff he did last time.

14:04

It was embarrassing I don't know

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The whole thing the squad This type of stuff just makes you go This is this was this was once the the leading country in the free world

14:23

How utterly utterly sad all of that really is anyway, so I'm not sure if I'll be watching tomorrow night.

14:33

I don't know if I can handle it I'll be honest with you. The stress would be it's it'd probably be better to just hit the highlights or the low lights

14:41

It'll be low lights. There won't be any highlights At another point in time. Uh, I just looked over and saw this

14:49

If you could crank her down a degree or two, it's warming up in here Some of you may have seen a couple days ago.

14:59

I think it was two days ago Jeff told me that the

15:05

New York Times wanted to talk to him and I I remember when they came out and did the interview and He was he was being optimistic

15:21

Basically the people said we want to talk to you because we've talked to a bunch of pro -life folks and they don't seem to know where they're going anymore since the fall of Roe and You all have been consistent before and after the fall of Roe in Demanding equal justice for the pre -born

15:44

Abolition of abortion Everything else and they did have a

15:55

Discussion about what Jeff has said in the past about the injustice and this is something that's interesting in light of Roman Catholicism these days the justice of capital punishment and in fact end abortion now posted a

16:14

Post on Twitter today. That was really good about You know the people just go you can't be pro -life and pro capital punishment is it actually you have to be

16:27

Pro capital punishment if you're pro -life If you if you understand what what that's supposed to mean, but they did a good job on that and Jeff had gone through he had talked about his criticisms of of Donald Trump and Carrie Lake and The pro -life movement in Arizona who's scared to death of us and He had also talked about in a just world

17:02

The need for punishment for the murder of unborn children but then he also went on to say the problem is right now,

17:10

I don't think we have a Just enough legal system in the vast majority of states

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To be able to do what's right on this matter Without having innocent people

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Caught up in it So this is something you need to work toward to have a just system.

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That is consistently just by biblical standards and Then once you have that then yes, you need to be consistent and protect life by punishing those who take life

17:50

Well, that's too nuanced and So Biden HQ Biden headquarters on Twitter What I think it just said

18:03

Biden dash dash HQ. You look it up. Okay They They Grabbed hold of This New York Times interview, which

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Jeff had said Sunday night He had said he would he was really surprised how fairly they had treated him.

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They didn't They didn't try to make him look like a crazy nut nut ball and stuff like that, which you'd expect

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New York Times to do and These people picked it up they edited

18:44

The thing and they put out a I don't know. Was it a 30 45 second audio?

18:50

where they took all the you know, they described Jeff as A Trump ally head of the

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Republic Republican effort to defeat Abortion rights legislation, which is again what happened in Ohio.

19:06

They're trying to do here in Arizona and putting Abortion into the

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Constitution and we're and we're talking way past Roe v. Wade. We're talking murder a child up to the point of birth and And that may or may not be on the ballot this time,

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I'm not sure but We definitely have taken the lead in Resisting that here in the state of Arizona But they described him in ways you just like what and then they put this thing out where he's talking about capital punishment for women

19:40

Who commit abortion? without all the stuff about yeah, but yeah, it's not really possible in light of the lack of Proper biblical justice and so on and so forth and The results

19:55

Have been pretty amazing You know, I mean our our security for folks will be at high alert this coming

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Sunday because You know leftists don't tend to be

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The most restrained people on the planet And so It is amazing what people can get away with today

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I just had to look over there and See that. I guess they just did an apology or radio on getting your kids out of government schools.

20:31

Well not unusual at apology up to for that to be taking place, but But there you go.

20:40

So Pray for us. I believe Jeff will be preaching on Sunday. I Preach I've preached the last two

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Sundays. So I'm pretty certain he's gonna be itching to finally get back in there and but there have been lots of death threats and Things like that and so we'll be we will be vigilant on On Lord's Day.

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Thanks to the Biden HQ and the stuff like Like that That we're dealing with there

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There is great discussion going on right now Amongst Roman Catholics I actually

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I watched a dialogue fairly short dialogue between Gavin Ortlund and a

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Eastern Orthodox priest That took place in Greece recently which is very very interesting and If you want to track that down I'm just put it in Gavin Ortlund and should be able to pull it up to go on the first ones comes up That was uh, that was interesting and I and I appreciate the fact that Gavin Ortlund Went ahead and and pressed on the fact that the

22:00

Eastern Orthodox priest Said yes, I I can I can accept Gavin Ortlund as a

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Christian Because the historical position of the

22:12

Eastern Orthodox Church is that we would not be Christians Not only are we anathema. We are outside the church for outside of the realm of God's grace and So it's nice to talk to Orthodox folks who don't go that far

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But the question is how how do you not go that far? It's sort of like talking to a you know, a Roman Catholic says all the anathemas are gone you know, it's sort of the

22:34

Jimmy Akin thing and and it's like On The one hand you're talking about Our tradition is 2 ,000 years old and unchanging and that other side you don't seem to mind changing those things and following people who are changing those things and It's very difficult to Figure figure all that stuff out really exactly how it works but anyway

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Um, there's big discussion right now amongst the cons the really conservative

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TLM traditional Latin mass type Roman Catholics There's a lot of scuttlebutt coming out of the

23:22

Vatican That there is a document that's already been prepared and it's just a matter of when it's going to be promulgated

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Forbidding The Latin mass now Francis has been deaf on the

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Latin mass for a long time and You know, if you offer

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Latin mass you're putting yourself right in the center of the Of the target as far as the

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Vatican is concerned but To go to the point of actually forbidding it given that that was the very

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Of Central act of Roman Catholic worship for centuries just centuries is

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Really amazing and it it really makes me wonder you what what is

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Francis's I Mean, I get it that the Latin mass people are are the people that he's talking about when he talks about conservatives

24:27

Holding on to things you see and Not looking toward the future that that's that's what in the 60 minute 60 minutes interview a couple months ago when he blasted conservatives.

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This is who he's talking about He's talking about people who go to Latin masses and will go to their grave

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Resisting The vision that Francis has of a modernized

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Socialist woke Liberation theology embracing and teaching globally

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Vaccinated 47 times making vaccination a sacrament

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I'm serious. Hey, hey, they came pretty close didn't they? I mean,

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I might not am I forget am I miss remembering? But wasn't there something where the

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Vatican was about to say you couldn't you couldn't even come into Vatican City or to the buildings or something like that if you weren't vaccinated

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I mean You know Francis pushed the vaccines just like Francis pushes all the environmental wacko stuff

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Everything out of the WFWHO Francis is all over it and Who's gonna be?

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resisting all of that The Latin mass people and Partaking in that Latin mass connects you back to a form of the

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Roman Church That is just so obviously different on a fundamental level from what

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Francis Wants you to think the Catholic Church is and should be which is just another way of saying this man is fundamentally changing the church and I Don't know how

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You folks some of you Roman Catholic folks. Don't don't see that more and more of you are

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More and more of you are getting red -pilled You you raise the microphone

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Well, I was just thinking to myself You know If I'm if I'm this kind of a Catholic and somebody goes to the old joke asking is the

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Pope Catholic I have to go Not really

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Next question. Yep. No, I there's no question about that. There's Every reason to question

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Francis's Orthodoxy and and things like that But anyway

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Why This would Create much more schism.

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I Saw a well -known Latin mass attending conservative

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Roman Catholic Putting up a poll basically going let's say

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Francis forbids the Latin mass. Where are you gonna go? and You know

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Eastern right churches in Eastern Orthodoxy, whatever, you know, but but it was like what are we gonna do?

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What would we do? and it's just as I used an illustration what was

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I what was I I forget what the context was But long long ago many many many decades ago now

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When I say long long ago, I today is the 26th of June by the way What's what's significant about today of the day after my 42nd wedding anniversary?

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26 26 of June 26 of June what happened June 26 1990

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See, I remember this because I put it in letters to a Mormon elder We set the city of Phoenix set its all -time record high at 122 degrees

28:49

Fahrenheit on June 26 1990 And if you remember it went 115 118 120 122 120 118 so it was like whoo, and it lasted a long time and It was hot, but that was 1990

29:10

So you didn't have the global warming wackadoodles You know, the 70s was coming ice age.

29:19

They were just starting to ramp up the Global warming stuff about then so you just didn't have it the level that you have it now and Isn't it weird after?

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How many billions or even trillions of tons of carbon dioxide put into the air?

29:38

by human beings of which that's a teeny teeny tiny percentage of what's actually produced by nature and You know most of these most countries like the

29:50

UK You know that we need to go net zero. They are so tiny and produce so little that There's a big fire burning in I think it's

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Kuwait or the largest tire collection places ever is on fire that one fire

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Will put more carbon in the air than all these little nations Could spend trillions of dollars to get the net zero for I mean one volcanic eruption one and Every all the green everything the billions and billions and billions and billions of dollars that have been spent out the window irrelevant done and That's because co2 has nothing to do with the temperature of the earth

30:40

Water vapor is the primary thing and we can't get rid of that and the thermostat of the earth is called the

30:46

Sun hello earth to everybody it's called the Sun and everybody there people in the know already know that but the money is

30:57

Don't say anything about that type of stuff. So that's yeah, everybody bows down. That's that's what's going on So how in the world we gonna

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Oh June 26, yes that's And and the reason

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I got to that was July 31st Of this year will mark

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I Texted my Sister today to remind her that July 31st of this year will mark 50 years since our little family drove into Phoenix, Arizona from Harrisburg, Pennsylvania and took up residence and I can guarantee you right now whenever I see anyone visiting in July or August or Moving here in July or August.

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I just look at them and go nobody told you huh? Oh, sorry Cuz that's not when you want to move to Phoenix.

31:56

That's not when you want to visit Phoenix and If your company says hey Would you like to go on a business trip to Phoenix in July or August?

32:05

That means they're getting ready to fire you so just be aware of that because because they're and that they they want you to die

32:13

And they've got someone else already sitting in the wings So just just quit right then and do not bother coming because that's not this is not the time

32:23

For you to to come here Really isn't and if it wasn't for now and next month and a month after that and a month after that Everybody would live here because the rest of year is really nice But this is our

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December January February that the rest of you have ours is just the opposite. It's We don't have to shovel it, but sometimes the road melts

32:50

Yeah, yeah your tires yes, that's that's all there is to it so anyway all of that back to to Francis and all his wackiness

33:00

I Just I just you know keep keep telling folks. I did an interview

33:05

I did iron sharpens iron yesterday, and we talked a little bit about the interview that Chris Arnson did with Bob's and Jenna's about Jimmy Akin and I said toward the end.

33:19

I said you know I appreciate a lot of a Bob's Jenna said but you know

33:25

Bob's stuck with a system that he admits is broken and He tried to connect it to well.

33:31

There are lots of bad Israelite Kings That's not the parallel The New Covenant isn't the theocratic state of Israel with all of its unregenerate bad

33:42

Kings So you can't do that with the Popes. Sorry doesn't work that way what?

33:49

You're talkative today, and it just occurred to me that that really didn't end so well

33:55

I I wouldn't really want to write here to yeah, it's you know Yeah, they've already they've already had their

34:02

Babylonian captivity where they had three Popes and and everything else so yeah who knows so anyway

34:11

We will be keeping an eye, but believe you me if that document comes out and the

34:19

Bishop of Rome says No, Latin masses There's gonna be a lot of people that are just gonna go

34:28

Why not I understand you know Vatican to reforms in the language of the people that the

34:34

But still To actually just forbid it would demonstrate beyond all question that Francis is that war

34:50

With the history of his own church Which shouldn't shock anybody because isn't that what all of leftism is doing at war with our own history trying to demonize and Say you know

35:10

This nation was terrible ever since such -and -such a time, and you know based on racism and all this it's it's meant to demonize the past So as to disconnect a people from their past and if that's what

35:24

Francis does that's why he's doing it He's connecting disconnecting people in the past to prepare them for a very different future

35:32

But that's the end of Roman Catholicism You there's no way to sit there and go well, but yeah, you know this is this is just a development of Apostolic tradition and an application and look

35:47

I know you can explain anything You can explain anything away Sophistry is never -ending

35:55

But for the person with the slightest concern about honesty You're not to be able to go there.

36:01

I can go there. So who knows what's gonna happen there, okay? What I wanted to get to today

36:10

There was a I'm not going to Get into specifics as far as names are concerned because this particular individual has a very small number of followers a very small audience and I'm not going to help to Add to that audience

36:33

But I Saw a friend a friend responded to this and so I followed the link and Followed my used my other

36:43

Twitter account to See things because of bands and stuff like that so libs of tick -tock had posted a

36:57

Picture of that sweet little girl Jocelyn who was raped and murdered by the

37:06

Illegal alien is not descriptive enough We simply call them

37:14

Foreign invaders, that's what they are. They're they're foreign invaders foreign combatants the occupying forces of The Biden regime that's what they are.

37:25

They're occupying forces anyways Libs of tick -tock had said prosecutors revealed that Jocelyn bought her rapist leaving marks on one of the illegals accused of killing her this poor little girl was abused for two hours before being strangled to death and a little picture and I had quote tweeted that and had said

37:47

Any person voting for Biden Schumer or Schumer? Any of the socialists who have opened the borders and engaged in the treasonous assistance of the invasion of this nation?

37:57

Simply joins them in their guilt so That's a political statement on my part

38:10

But it's also based upon a Recognition of the fact that Biden Harris Schumer Pelosi Obama the

38:22

Clinton the whole kit and caboodle of them Are Zealous Patriots of the culture of death

38:35

They hate The Christian heritage of this nation they hate the role that God's law played in the creation of of the very structures of this nation the

38:48

Constitution itself our common law they hate all of that and I've been very effective in banishing those things from our society

39:00

And so I'm just simply saying that You can look at these big names

39:07

But they have been assisted in gaining that power By people who voted for them and normally they voted for them so they could get

39:20

Other people's stuff. That's what socialism is about. It's it's based upon greed it's a rejection of God's Decreeing that some people are gonna be more successful than other people some people are more gifted than other people there are certain people that can make money hand over fist and then there are others who can't and lots of people are in the middle and that's what

39:47

I was talking about as well as just the gross treasonous injustice of What's taking place in our nation right now?

39:57

So as is so often the case whenever I make a comment About what's going on our on in our society what's going on in all these things and seek to speak prophetically in the sense of Here is

40:16

God's standard. Here's what's happening. This inevitably brings judgment America you're bringing judgment upon yourself.

40:25

This is the only way Repentance Rejection of the culture of death a recognition that you are made in the image of God This is the only way forward this is the only way to seek forgiveness the blood that's on your hands and When you if I do anything like that Provisionist synergists or in this case open theists of various forms will always

40:58

Do the same thing. It's the same childish mockery. It's the same same shallow foolishness the same philosophically driven blather that is

41:10

The essence of what they're about But here's here's what the tweet said here.

41:16

We see a man James White who believes God eternally decreed all this with specificity

41:23

Pretending as though this was avoidable and not something he praises God for Sadly, James is not alone as his pal

41:32

Jeff Durbin believes God decreed gang rape for his glory so You know when

41:43

I when I hear this, I know I'm talking I immediately know I'm talking about very dishonest people people who don't have

41:49

Any ability to at least even express things? with any level of Honesty integrity anything like that And this guy

42:02

I future cult leader Working out right now small little cult, but anyway, but when you think about it,

42:13

I Think it I think it is important For those who are reformed to be ready to give an answer and to speak to an issue like this

42:26

So I want you to think with me for a moment about the genealogies in Matthew and Luke you're expecting one of a

42:41

Fairly small number of very clear passages. These people do not have any exegetical response these passages.

42:46

That's obvious But and in fact that whole genre of open theism with all of its minor variations

43:00

Leads to a fundamental degradation in the view of Scripture and The reason

43:08

I say that Is in the debates have done with open theists and discussions of those open theists and it's back to in fact if you go back to The last unbelievable broadcast and I'm not sure if that was the last

43:26

Unbelievable broadcast I did I'm thinking it might have been

43:31

I'm not sure but I Was on with John Sanders who I debated at RTS.

43:38

What was that 2001? somewhere on there and a lot of that conversation had focused upon his

43:49

John Sanders attempting to demonstrate that there's there are prophecies in the

43:57

Old Testament specifically That are not fulfilled or that were not fulfilled that were that were in error and this is to establish this idea that When God says he's going to do something

44:11

Since God is like us experiencing time the time exists external to God and He experiences not an eternal now

44:24

But he experiences progression of events and they Amazingly try to use the

44:31

Incarnation as an evidence of this. It's like They're not good theologians by stretch of the imagination.

44:39

But anyway But since their God is limited in time then when he says something

44:49

He does so speaking truthfully given his current

44:58

Knowledge of events up to that point in time and So that can change

45:05

I can change over time and So when he gets a prophecy wrong

45:12

It's not that he was wrong initially It's that Things changed based upon the freewill actions of creatures that God cannot know the whole point of open theism is that to Protect The autonomous will of man

45:36

You have to deny to God a knowledge of what free creatures will do because if God knows beforehand what a free creature will do then the creatures no longer free creatures no longer autonomous and That's where open theists reject even what our minions our minions will not go so far as the open theists though.

45:54

I've said inconsistently so But at least we can be thankful for their inconsistencies and they won't go as far as the open theists and completely overthrow the entire foundation of biblical prophecy

46:09

Messianic prophecy the prophecies regarding the ministry of Christ the death of Christ resurrection all of that becomes overthrown within open theism

46:20

And so I mentioned the Genealogies because I want you to I want you to think with me for a moment

46:31

What when you when you read Matthew chapter 1 and This person was the father of that person and you've got and and and and Solomon was the father of Boaz by Rahab and Boaz was the father of Obed by Ruth and Obed was the father of Jesse and Jesse was the father of David the

46:54

King and you realize there's and there's a lot of history and actions

47:01

Boaz Ruth Naomi remember the whole story there, right? You know about that is

47:10

This is are the genealogies nothing, but a

47:17

Historical record that could have been completely different could these genealogies

47:26

Might it have been God's hope To have brought

47:32

Jesus into the world 200 years prior to when he actually came but it didn't work out and he had to go to plan

47:46

B and the plan C and then the plan D because You talked to open this could could

47:52

Paul have rejected Jesus on the road to Damascus. Well has to say yes, so what if the

48:04

Paul option fails Well, there's a plan B was

48:11

Paul a plan B plan C plan D no way of knowing

48:19

It may well have been that God Had wanted to bring

48:25

Jesus into the world far earlier But you just had to keep adjusting to the freewill actions of men because God doesn't know the future when

48:34

God created He could not have infallible knowledge that any of these people you might argue well, yeah, he had theoretical knowledge he could not have infallible knowledge that any of these people would ever exist because who is

48:52

Who is Jesse Jesse the father of David? well Who he is as a person?

49:00

Was determined by his parents his grandparents The context in which he lived the time in which he lived you take

49:09

Jesse and move him a hundred years one way or the other Is he the same person or is he changed by that?

49:18

You see when we think about when we look at scripture the scripture writers see in history the sovereignty of God They see his complete control over human history.

49:34

That's why I saw him 33 reads like Psalm 33 Men make their plans. God's the one who's gonna accomplish what

49:41

God's once again. He does whatever he pleases in the heavens near someone 35 Never said about man never said that man does whatever he pleases in heaven and earth

49:50

God does and when you think of All of the quote free will acts of man

50:01

That were necessary To bring about the birth of the Messiah in Bethlehem, which was another prophecy, even though And guarantee you'll fight you can find open theists that will say yeah, you know, that's

50:17

That's sort of stretching it. That's not really what but that past that's not really what Micah was talking about We don't have to worry about Those New Testament writers, they're just you know, they're just doing the best of what they can

50:32

Think about all of the free will acts of autonomous creatures unknown to God Absolutely necessary To bring about the birth of Jesus in Bethlehem at that particular point in time think think about Historians have always commented on the fact

50:57

That the gospel begins right in the middle of the

51:02

Pax Romana the peace of Rome Where Rome has established a context in which there can be travel?

51:10

there is very much a common language at least of commerce military things like that that happens to be the same language the

51:20

New Testament ends up being written in and Hence the gospel can go

51:27

Throughout the Roman Empire and then outside of the Roman Empire think about What all of that means as far as the

51:40

Thousands Oh No hundreds of thousands. Oh, no millions getting closer hundreds of millions billions of free will autonomous choices

51:55

Made by hundreds of thousands to millions of people and at any point

52:05

Any one of those people that does what's not expected Which they have to have the freedom to do to establish this kind of Theological philosophy or philosophical theology or whatever you want to call open theism

52:25

It is impossible God did not know

52:33

Paul would exist when he created God could not know

52:42

The 12 Apostles when he created and hence

52:47

God could not possibly have known The existence of the Roman Empire the

52:53

Roman Empire could have fallen Prior to the birth of Christ, maybe

52:59

God's plan was to use the Empire to Allow for the gospel to be spread.

53:06

But hey maybe there was another empire that's supposed to be there a hundred years earlier, but maybe he wanted

53:12

Alexander to live longer, but Again, there's no decree There's no decree so it's it's the wild wild west of autonomous human action and God doing his best to respond and Juggle stuff and make stuff work

53:31

But God couldn't know these things so when I look at when I look at the genealogies and I think of the fact that All of these individuals had to live a certain amount of time

53:49

They had to interact in a certain way to bring about Certain results and you know what you you think about?

53:59

Well, look and Jesse was the father of David the king and David was the father of Solomon by the wife of Uriah Uriah You mean when

54:12

David committed? adultery and murder See from the open theist perspective, this is just a historical narrative.

54:22

That's just how it worked out. That wasn't God's purpose That wasn't

54:28

God's purpose so I mean when you think about that way of The Solomon line

54:34

Wow, what a mess God could never have intended that because that would be sinful

54:41

I include murder open theism turns the

54:50

Bible into a mishmash of Wow, isn't that lucky?

54:58

Wow, how did that happen and God had no idea he couldn't have that's the price

55:05

When you strip God of his autonomy and Attribute it to his creatures

55:12

That's the price. That's what you're stuck with. That's what you've got There's there's no other way around it

55:20

So What these men hate? What these open theists hate is?

55:29

That God is not like us his thoughts are not our thoughts he is not limited to time as we are and What God does in time he holds us responsible for We are not just puppets

55:47

He's not doesn't have a gun to our head and we're these wonderful good creatures and actually he's restraining our evil all the time

55:54

Which is a violation of our autonomous will but you better be thankful for it every single day

55:59

And they can't thank God for that. They cannot thank God for his

56:07

Restraining of evil because that is a violation of Man's autonomy, but what where it really comes down to is they'll look at something like this they'll look at a horrific event and They'll go.

56:24

Oh we can use that We can use that's what George Bryson was doing and the Bible answer him broadcast and it

56:32

Boomeranged on him because in that moment With so many people listening.

56:39

I cannot tell you how many people I've met Over the past 21 years because that was 21 years ago 2003 21 years ago that took place who were listening.

56:52

They were yelling at me they didn't like me, but they were forced to hear what I was saying and What I was saying was

57:01

God knew that you were going to exist Because he decreed your existence

57:09

And God knew everything that was going to happen in time including all the good stuff all the stuff and all the really bad stuff and You may be more comfortable with the

57:25

God who's like you Stuck in time doesn't know the future But that also means

57:36

That every time something horrible does happen such as this horrific Rape and murder of this young girl.

57:44

You can either say That there is a purpose There was a purpose in her life.

57:52

There was a purpose in her creation There is a purpose in the life and creation of these men in the demonstration of Eventually God's justice

58:03

Because they will receive justice eventually whether in this life or Not in this life

58:12

To the condemnation of this society Point out as well So you can either recognize that there's purpose and meaning and value

58:26

Or you can come up with a God Who never knew she was gonna exist had no purpose of what happened

58:34

At least the open theist goes. Yeah. God was up there in heaven going. Oh, no.

58:40

Oh, oh He must be doing that constantly every day every second

58:47

Looking or looking at this creation going. Oh, wow. Oh, oh, oh,

58:52

I Can't believe that and Then it's like okay Hurry up now and try to make something good come out of it because there is no purpose to it

59:03

It's not a part of Anything that will eventually glorify God. Oh No, no, no

59:12

Have man is the autonomous creature We have to go and since where the

59:19

Armenian, you know, the open theist goes the Armenian goes. Wait a minute You say

59:24

God knew this was gonna happen God create the universe so that it would happen

59:30

But he had no purpose in it. At least the open theists are going. Hey That but that that God's too big we need to make

59:40

God much more like us and he had no idea and There was wasn't anything you do about because that's just how he created things

59:49

Nothing you do about it. He's doing the best he can Doing the best he can

59:56

No one reading the Bible ever came up with this these men cherry -pick something over here cherry -pick it's always a

01:00:03

Kayla Kayla Kayla God learned about Abraham. They've got their couple little texts

01:00:12

That they pull out but no one reading the Bible as a whole ever came up with the idea that God's just Bumbling and stumbling through time

01:00:24

And he's just he's just doing the best he can Because they never would have written psalm 135 six.

01:00:31

They wouldn't have they wouldn't have recorded Nebuchadnezzar's words about Who resists his will who resists his hand who can even talk back to God?

01:00:41

This is what the pagan the pagan king Knew much more than open theists do

01:00:47

When he received his reason back from him, which they've lost In their attempt to create a

01:00:53

God that keeps them comfortable Now one last thing and I'll try to keep it brief here.

01:01:00

I know I just went over time and rich is busy with Air conditioning issues right now

01:01:06

The brand new air conditioner we had installed what two weeks ago Three weeks ago, maybe a month at most

01:01:13

Stopped working today Hopefully it's just you know new new warranty stuff that It happens

01:01:22

I get it anyway someone responding to this open theist

01:01:31

Pointed out that on a webcast not too long ago. He had specifically said that his father

01:01:43

Had cheated on his mother and had claimed that God had decreed for it to happen and That's why it happened and that was his excuse now you may remember

01:02:02

John Sanders one of the sort of modern pioneers of the open theist movement

01:02:10

At least he was honest in his books and articles his brother was killed in a motorcycle accident and He simply could not accept the idea

01:02:24

That God had decreed that Happen he had to come up with a

01:02:29

God who was just as stunned and shocked as hurt as he was Because he can't have a

01:02:36

God that's above us can't have a God that's ontologically completely different Which by the way is why term classical theism was coined by the open theists

01:02:45

They reject that concept so it's not unusual at all for people to have a personal experience

01:02:55

That then determines the entire not only arc of their theology, but in this case the very focus of their theology and So just on a lark because I had never heard

01:03:08

Anyone ever say anything like that in my entire life. I have never heard.

01:03:13

I've heard people on Twitter mockingly say things but someone who is actually

01:03:21

Allegedly a knowledgeable Proponent of reformed theology

01:03:29

I've never heard anybody say. Oh, I cheated on my wife I Did this did that because God decreed it and therefore

01:03:40

I just did what I was decreed to do. I've never heard anybody say that and So I asked my fellow pastors

01:03:49

Who do more of the counseling than I do by a long shot Have you ever heard

01:03:58

Anyone say that to you? Have you ever had in any counseling situation anybody? Say well, yeah,

01:04:05

I did something terrible and horrible, but it's because God decreed that I do it and so that's just how it works and they said no heard anybody do that and So I'm not saying that it's impossible that someone could be that foolish as To make that kind of a statement

01:04:25

But the argument was hey, if you believe in God's decree, then it's the greatest excuse in the world

01:04:30

We're all just a bunch of puppets Tell that to everybody in the genealogy of Jesus.

01:04:39

Yeah, we could go on to all the key texts the ones where in context that's what this is saying

01:04:44

Genesis 50 20 Isaiah 10 acts where we get all of them and any fulfillment

01:04:53

In the New Testament of Old Testament prophecy and go to all of them and go hey Look at this scripture is very clear.

01:05:00

It's functioning on the fundamental foundation of the assumption of the sovereign decree of God that forms the very essence of time and That's what makes the events in time

01:05:17

Not some puppet show But just like the incarnation

01:05:24

The vital demonstration of God's nature and attributes.

01:05:29

That's how we know who he is is how he reveals himself Not how he stumbles and bumbles through time

01:05:37

You've got to stumble and bumble God I'm sorry, that's not the

01:05:43

God of Scripture It's not so when someone

01:05:49

And it happens every single time And if and if I do it, and I don't see it it's because the people doing it.

01:05:58

I've already blocked or muted Because they can't stop themselves Layton does all time which is why he is a functional open theist even if he hasn't gotten there yet.

01:06:10

He will eventually Eventually it won't cost him anything to do it and I think he's already functionally there anyways

01:06:19

But he does it all the time He's another one of those go. Oh, yeah, you don't have any reason to complain about this because God decreed it blah blah blah blah

01:06:26

Man, I do not want to be responsible before God someday Can you imagine standing before God and having to answer for that kind of mockery?

01:06:36

When you find out that his thoughts are above your thoughts that he's not just a big version of you

01:06:44

Hmm Wow, but keep these things in mind Just just think of what it means to actually hold a position that says

01:06:55

When God created the heavens and the earth he had no idea I would exist when

01:07:02

Jesus Christ died Father son and spirit had no idea you would exist none none

01:07:11

You know, well possibility about every any

01:07:16

Human being is a possibility. There's an unlimited number of possible human being but an individual with my specific genetics background context where I was born where I grew up, you know 50 years now in Phoenix, Arizona All that kind of stuff could not be known to God.

01:07:40

It was only a mere possibility there were tens of thousands of other possible

01:07:46

James Whites and So there there could be no union of the elect with Christ That's why this same guy, you know multiple theories of penal substitutionary atonement and all the rest that kind of Blather you get from these folks and that's why

01:08:06

Eventually, you know, maybe not in one individual but in their their students or their kids or whoever it goes

01:08:13

Eventually this stuff leads to a fundamental degradation of the faith view of Scripture the

01:08:20

Orthodox Definitions of the Trinity and stuff like that. I mean once you start using the kind of hermeneutics

01:08:28

That's necessary to substantiate open theism. There's no reason to believe in the Trinity There's a reason to believe in the

01:08:34

Trinity. The Trinity requires far too high and consistent a reading of Scripture Then is sustainable on open theistic ground

01:08:44

Which actually reminds me one thing we do need to get to I don't know when I will get to it but There is a

01:08:55

New book out relatively new book by Mike Lycona Jesus contradicted and You know years and years ago we we would listen to fairly carefully

01:09:12

Mike Lycona's debates at Bart Ehrman and go through them and respond to Bart Ehrman and Mike Lycona In the process and I was listening to Tim Stratton interviewing

01:09:25

Mike Lycona Remember I debated Tim Stratton a Molinism in Houston and Stratton mentioned in passing that he had sent his opening statement to Lycona for his review before the debate and when you think about what that opening statement was like And they start talking about Molinism a a

01:09:55

Molinistic understanding of inspiration Oh, yeah.

01:10:01

Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, because remember like cone is the one we did do He came out with an article.

01:10:08

I don't know six seven years ago Basically saying that Mark was wrong At a particular point in the

01:10:15

Gospels, but we don't need to worry about it And we went through and said well, no actually there's no reason to believe that but and That's what this book evidently is all about so I Think it will be important to at least familiarize ourselves with the theory so that You know most of the people in this audience are actively involved and should be actively involved in local churches and Most of you are teachers

01:10:44

You know at least doing Sunday school type teaching, you know small group type stuff and one of the things

01:10:51

I want this program to be able to help you to do is to When all sudden something comes out of left field in the middle of a

01:10:59

Bible study class Hopefully we help to provide you with a foundation to be able to handle that and believe me somebody coming up with something like this and using a

01:11:10

Lycona like Presentation can leave everybody going what what did he just say what just happened here?

01:11:18

I don't even know So that's one of the reasons to cover such things it's not if we were in some competition

01:11:27

Trying to get the biggest audience. These were not the topics we would be talking about But we do have a big audience and the reason we have a big audience is because a lot of folks go

01:11:40

I always know where I can go for reliable information about these types of things.

01:11:45

So we will be doing something along those lines, especially a Molinistic theory of inspiration

01:11:56

Whoo, that should be really interesting Anyways, okay. There we go.

01:12:01

We've run through most of everything that I've got there. Just reminder Why are we did why did we have a program on Monday now program

01:12:08

Wednesday because we're gonna have a program on Friday We're gonna have three dividing lines this week and on Friday what?

01:12:17

Yes Five o 'clock Eastern two o 'clock here in Phoenix and on The West Coast which it shouldn't be but because we don't do daylight savings time and no one else should either because it's stupid

01:12:33

Um I'm just get off the grass and let me take my nap.

01:12:39

Um Just just get into that point, you know get off my lawn taking a nap

01:12:49

Sort of how you feel sometimes on Friday We will be joined by Jason Wallace from Christ Presbyterian Church up in Magna, Utah, and we're gonna be looking at and I've linked to it twice already

01:13:06

So if you and I gave a excuses we're gonna be looking at the what was it 37 minutes something like that video that they've put out on Cyril Lucaris the ecumenical patriarch of Constantinople who was a

01:13:25

Calvinist and And what that means and its importance and Stuff like that, so we'll be looking at that on Friday Five o 'clock

01:13:38

Eastern Daylight Time is when we will get around to that. So we appreciate you listening to the dividing line today

01:13:46

Hopefully it has been of use to you. We will see you on Friday. Oh Only Four days left for the layered cross and the

01:13:59

ESV creeds and confessions Isaiah line from Jeffrey Rice. The raffle tickets are at a omen org and We'll have one other item

01:14:11

For a future raffle as well, and that's all to help with the travel fund and everything We're doing there just need to remind you about that.