The Blessing of Church Membership

Welcome to The Dividing Line for today. My name is Pastor John Sampson. I'm one of the elders at King's Church in Peoria, Arizona.

It's an absolute delight to come back again and guest host for James while he's away.

And we're talking about the church and membership in the church. And we covered a lot of ground last time talking about the biblical reasons why

I believe church membership is an entirely scriptural thing. And we're going to pick up from there with a quote from C .H.

Spurgeon. Once you've found a quote from Spurgeon on a subject you usually don't need to search for anymore.

He usually nails it. And he wrote this. Give yourself to the church. You that are members of the church have not found it perfect, and I hope that you feel almost glad that you have not.

If I had never joined a church till I had found one that was perfect, I would have never joined one at all.

And the moment I did join it, if I had found one, I should have spoiled it, for it would not have been a perfect church after I had become a member of it.

Still, imperfect as it is, it is the dearest place on earth to us. All who have first given themselves to the

Lord should, as speedily as possible, also give themselves to the Lord's people.

How else is there to be a church on the earth? If it is right for anyone to refrain from membership in the church, it is right for everyone.

And then the testimony for God would be lost to the world. I say amen to that.

And lead us on, Lord. Look to the good shepherd of the sheep, to find under -shepherds we can submit to.

In fact, I would like you to go in your Bibles to a verse that we covered last time. I want to just look more in -depth at it now,

Hebrews chapter 13, where Christ, through the writer to Hebrews, is speaking to us.

As we go there, think about the responsibility on the leaders, on the elders.

John Brown, in a letter of counsel to one of his pupils, newly ordained over a very small congregation, wrote this to him.

I know the vanity of your heart and that you will feel mortified that your congregation is very small in comparison with those of your brethren around you.

But assure yourself on the word of an old man that when you come to give an account of them to the

Lord Christ at his judgment seat, you will think you have had enough.

You've got a great responsibility as a leader to look after and care for the sheep under your care, knowing that you'll give an account to the

Lord for what you do with them. They are his sheep, not yours. You are under -shepherds under him.

So Hebrews chapter 13, a familiar verse, verse 17, obey your leaders and submit to them.

Oftentimes leaders speak this word and kind of come across very authoritarian, but it's a biblical concept and the sheep, the people, are to submit and obey the leaders.

But listen as to why. For, here's the reason why, for they are keeping watch over your souls as those who will have to give an account.

Let them do this with joy and not with groaning, for that would be of no advantage to you.

I remember, as I said last time, I didn't always embrace this idea of a formal kind of church membership, but biblically it's certainly very, very clear to me now.

But there's two things that emerge from this text. Without reading into the text, allowing it to speak, it's these two concepts.

First of all, the leaders know who they are responsible for and the people know who they are to obey and submit to.

There's a relationship established. It's not merely leaders who show up once in a while, but leaders who care for the flock and it's people who know who they are submitted to.

Obey your leaders, not every leader out there, your leaders and submit to them.

So those two things are not even in question. They are there born out of the text.

The people know who they're submitted to. The leaders know who they are responsible for.

I have this idea in my mind, I believe it's born out of this text, that one day

I will stand before the Lord regarding everyone under my care as a pastor. I take that very, very seriously.

And one day, should I stand before the Lord to give an account, as I will, what will happen will be names and people will be brought before my memory and I will have to give an account of them.

And the Lord might say something like this, Mary Jones, she was in your congregation for three years.

What did you do to equip her as a disciple of Christ? How did you encourage her?

How did you come alongside her? How did you care for her as a shepherd?

And hopefully on that day I can say, well, she showed up more than eight times in that time.

She was there every week and she was there and I came alongside her by praying for her regularly.

I came alongside her putting material in her hand that will encourage her at various different points. Hopefully all of that will be true rather than Mary Jones.

Hmm. No, sorry, can't, doesn't ring a bell. There should be a relationship between the shepherd and the sheep, the sheep and the shepherd.

And he is to care for each one. And whether that has been a long time, maybe he's pastored that particular person for years or just a few months.

That is something that is very dear to the heart of God. And I take very seriously and the scripture here takes it seriously.

It says, leaders are those who will have to give an account. Let them do this with joy and not with groaning for that would be of no advantage to you.

So we are not to submit to them on every occasion. If they tell us to do things that are outside the parameters of the word of God.

But if they are in line with scripture, we are to obey them. And beyond that, in doing so, we are obeying

Christ through his word to us here. A lot of Christians have a relationship with Jesus, but no real relationship to a local church.

And I would say, stop that. Get involved in a church because that's

Christ's command to us. You'll never find a perfect one, but find one that at least honors the gospel, has the sacraments in view and applies them regularly.

The Lord's Supper and baptism for those who make a profession of faith and certainly church discipline, which is in view in terms of what we talked about last time.

Something that's been very much neglected in most churches. I know of churches that are very large where you can hide and people live very fraudulent lives in terms of their

Christianity. People living together and leaders don't say anything, absolutely nothing. That's not watching over the souls of the members.

In fact, there is probably no formal membership. People can come and go as they like, but that's not right.

That's not good. Discipline in the church is Jesus' idea for the protection of his sheep.

And the reformers, the Protestant reformers were very, very clear that without that there is no true church because wolves can run in and devour the flock, both in false doctrine and in fraudulent schemes.

If someone comes in and wants to harass the elderly and put them in schemes of finances that will just ruin them financially, it's up to elders to stop that, to make sure that the wolves do not have access to the sheep.

They need to repent or else leave the church and the church people need to be protected.

And Christ will not honour a so -called church that will not protect the sheep.

It's very, very clear. So moving on from there, there are other things we need to talk about as to the blessing of church membership.

What is involved in church membership? Why are we talking about it? We're talking about it because Christ has commanded it and through his apostles has really spelled out how it's to look like.

I like to call it covenant membership because it's so easy to think of membership the same way we would join a gym club or get involved in a jeep club that I talked about last time.

It's just something we can take or leave. There's no real issue if we don't show up. You know, the bucks come out of our account if we don't show up every month at the gym club, but there's no real watching over our souls going on.

Not really, not usually. There's no real call saying, we haven't seen you for three weeks. How are your biceps doing?

Not really. It's up to you to just show up and do your thing. But in a church, we are to, as leaders, look after, care for, protect the

Lord's people as undershepherds under Christ the Good Shepherd.

Many people have had a bad experience with church membership. People have been the target of frauds in the area of finances and false currency has been invented, but that doesn't mean we don't use the true, the right, the genuine.

People have forged $20 bills. That doesn't mean we don't use the right kind, the genuine kind of dollar bill.

So in the same way, I'm very deeply grieved when I hear of leaders overstepping their boundaries, leaders falling into sin and not repenting of it.

I've heard drastic stories where a leader will try to flex his spiritual muscles to see if people will submit to him and will just go around to a house and say, you know what, you need to paint your front door, which is now red.

You need to paint it green because I'm your leader and you need to submit to me. That is totally out of bounds.

If a leader is to say, you know, you've planned a vacation to Seattle this year, but I don't endorse that.

You need to go to Wisconsin. With all apologies for anyone living in Wisconsin listening to this.

That's just stepping over the boundary. Our only prerogative as leaders is to counsel people according to the

Word of God and there's absolutely nothing about either Seattle or Wisconsin in our

Bibles, believe it or not. So what's entailed in covenant membership?

It is the closest thing to a marriage in the sense of someone comes to a leader, to a pastor, more preferably to a group of leaders, elders.

Eldership, I believe, is a plural commodity in the New Testament. And they say, be my elders, be my pastor, look after, watch over my soul.

And in turn, the pastor and leaders, the elders say to that person, we'll do this knowing we'll give an account to Christ.

And so there's a solemnity about this, not a flippant thing. Oh yeah. 20 minutes talk about what the church is.

You sign up, come on in. We'll get your name on the roll. Great, great, great. We can report to headquarters that another one's been added.

I produced a very large manual. It's close to 80 pages,

I believe, 78 pages about what is involved in church membership. So everybody knows what it is that we are seeing as elders regarding what our role is, what their role is, and what our doctrine is.

So everybody's very clear. And hopefully it's a blessing to have more information than you might need, than less, rather than something coming up years from now and think, oh, you never talked about this.

No, we did. And we hammered it out. And this is a solemn thing. And I'm excited about it.

And one of the reasons for that is I believe it's entirely scriptural. In starting the church in our own living room,

King's Church, the reason it was called King's Church is we want the king to be proud of it.

We want to find out what he's regulated in the word of God. And as you probably know, that's an ongoing process.

And it's been exactly that for me, to understand what God has said. And I'm more sure of what

God has said now than I was previously, obviously. And I believe that the

Lord will continue to lead and guide his church into the truth of his word. And I'm coming back to what the church has done for centuries.

They've had these boundaries in place, and we've thrown them off thinking that we're more free in doing so.

But as a wise man once said, if you see a fence, find out why they put it there before you remove it.

And the biblical parameters of fencing in the church so that they are protected, so no wolves can get in, has been done for the benefit and the provision and the protection of the sheep.

Understand that. So there's three expressions of commitment in covenant membership.

There's the covenant that we have as Christians, all Christians in a local church.

There's more than that, the understanding that we're one body, we're one in Christ, we're members one of another.

Over and over, we see that in the New Testament and actually means something. If I were to read all of the one another scriptures in the

New Testament, Ephesians 4, 25, which, as I said last time, Paul wrote to the

Ephesian church to say, that's a reason we should not be lying to one another, because we're members of one another.

That's a powerful statement. That's unusual. You think he would say we shouldn't lie because of God's character.

He's a God of truth. All that is true. But he says in this particular portion of scripture, the reason is we're members.

There's a different kind of relationship that we have with each other that we don't have with the world.

That's not true of the Jeep club or the gym. You don't say, I'm not going to lie to you because you're a fellow member of the gym club.

No, but when Paul says or writes, we're not to lie because we're members, surely it means something.

We're members. That's a reason. That's a basis for us not lying. We've got a unique relationship as brother and sister in Christ.

So the one another scriptures, they're all over the New Testament. Love one another. You can't do that by yourself.

Just as I've loved you, you also ought to love one another. Though many, we are one body in Christ and individually members, one of another.

Romans 12, 5, Romans 12, 10 outdo one another in showing honor, live in harmony with one another.

Romans 12, 16, Romans 14, 13. Therefore, let us not pass judgment on one another any longer, but rather decide never to put a stumbling block or hindrance in the way of a brother.

Romans 14, 19. So then let us pursue what makes for peace and for mutual up building, literally building up one another.

Romans 15, 5. May the God of endurance and encouragement grant you to live in such harmony with one another in accordance with Jesus Christ.

Romans 15, 7. Therefore, welcome one another as Christ has welcomed you for the glory of God.

Romans 15, 14. I myself am satisfied about you, my brothers, that you yourselves are full of goodness, filled with all knowledge and able to instruct one another.

Greet one another with a holy kiss. All the churches of Christ greet you. Romans 16, 16.

1 Corinthians 12, 25. That there may be no division in the body, but that the members may have the same care for one another.

It's not just individually we sign up, but individually we are now part of a team and we look after one another.

When one is hurting, all are hurting. When one rejoices, all rejoice. Galatians 5, 13.

For you were called to freedom, brothers. Only do not use your freedom as an opportunity for the flesh, but through love serve one another.

Who's the one another? It's the local church. Galatians 6, 2. Bear one another's burdens and so fulfill the law of Christ.

Some people might be saying, well, why don't you get to some profound things and some parsing of Greek words.

I tell you, this is very profound. The relationship we ought to have with one another.

If you actually look at it, it's powerful. It's astonishing.

The kind of relationship we should have one toward another. Ephesians 4, 2.

Colossians 3, 13. With all humility, I said humidity because I'm thinking it's pretty humid out in Phoenix right now.

It's on my mind. It's hot and humid. Those two things normally don't go together.

When it does, it's not good. With all humility and gentleness, with patience, bearing with one another in love.

Oh, it's just me and Jesus. I just got my favorite television preachers and I tune them in each week.

How convenient. How convenient. They're not going to be around when you need their help.

They're not going to be praying for you. Can you really call them at the middle of the night? If you're in a crisis, can they walk you through when one of your family members are in trouble or even die?

Are they able to do that? Will they lay hands on you and pray for you? Will they come alongside you?

Will they pastor you? A CD can't shepherd you. An MP3 can't shepherd you.

A DVD can't shepherd you. Someone who is a shepherd can give you one of those things, but those things by themselves don't shepherd you.

Christ wants to shepherd you through God -appointed leaders who are never perfect.

In fact, God has only ever had one qualified person walking and working for him through history, and that's the

Lord Jesus Christ. We're all sinners. I'm the biggest sinner I know, and I'm only doing what

I do by the grace of God. One preacher said it this way, if you knew the sin in my life that I've thought and done and said, you wouldn't be coming to listen to me, but don't get uppity.

If I knew the sin in your life, I wouldn't talk to you. It goes both ways. We need the grace of God, even for ministry.

So, submitting to one another out of reverence for Christ, Ephesians 5 .21.

Philippians 2 .3, Do nothing from selfish ambition or conceit, but in humility count others more significant than yourselves, or count or regard one another as more significant than yourself.

Do not lie to one another, seeing that you've put off the old self with its practices. There's Paul giving another reason why we shouldn't lie, because we've put off the old self.

Therefore, encourage one another with these words. Encourage one another. 1 Thessalonians 4 .18.

The previous one, Colossians 3 .9. 1 Thessalonians 5 .11. Therefore, encourage one another and build one another up, just as you are doing.

You can't do that if the only Christian you're involved with is someone who's on television.

See that no one repays anyone evil for evil, but always seek to do good to one another and to everyone.

1 Thessalonians 5 .15. There's many more, but let me give you one more.

Show hospitality to one another without grumbling. 1 Peter 4 .9.

Likewise, you who are younger, be subject to the elders. Clothe yourselves, all of you, with humility toward one another.

For God opposes the proud, but gives grace to the humble. Don't we often hear that verse quoted just out of its setting?

God opposes the proud, but gives grace to the humble. What's the implication of the verse?

Well, it's part of a sentence which starts with, you who are younger, be subject to the elders.

Those older and those in the office of eldership.

Some would have us believe you can fulfill all of these things by just meeting with a group of loosely related people at Starbucks.

But no, each of these commands were actually given to local churches to be fulfilled and pursued in the context of relationship, which was constituted by a membership.

There was a formal membership in the local church in the early days of the church.

So that's what church membership is. It's a caring for one another. It's a protection for one another.

The Bible tells us to do that. It does not tell us to sanctify one another.

We can't do that. Humble one another. Scrutinize one another. Pressure one another.

Embarrass one another. Corner one another. Interrupt one another. Defeat one another. Shame another.

Judge another. Run another person's life. Confess one another's sins. Intensify one another's sufferings and point out one another's failings.

Actually, it was Ray Ortland who gave me that list and I appreciate that.

He wrote it out and found it on his blog. Excellent insight. We're not to do any of those things.

We're to do what the Bible says, love one another. So amongst other things, it's by the grace of God, we obey our responsibilities in the local church.

We don't do it perfectly. No one does. But it does mean that we acknowledge that's what God calls us to do by the power he supplies as we commit ourselves to pursuing him.

The second aspect is there's a commitment of all believers in a local church to the leadership of the elders whom

God has raised up. We dealt with that a bit last time and a little today as well.

But we want to be known and I want to be held accountable to what the

Bible says my relationship and my walk with God should be. And I want a leader to lead me.

I believe every elder is subject to the other elders and even as an extension to the church.

And if he goes astray, there are things that should be in place that will require him to come into line.

So is the case. So people have had bad experiences. But again, let's push past that and see the

Lord saying, come on, trust me, walk with me in this.

And the third expression of this commitment is on the part of the elders to the people whom God has called them to lead.

Pay careful attention, Paul said to the elders of Ephesus when they met in Acts chapter 20.

Pay careful attention to yourselves and to all the flock in which the Holy Spirit has made you overseers to care for the church of God, which he obtained with his own blood.

Interesting, that's a very much a powerful verse regarding the deity of Christ.

It was not God, the father or God, the spirit who became man, but God, the son.

And it talks of him, God, obtaining the church with his own blood.

Interesting, shepherd the church of God, the flock of God that is among you. First Peter 5, exercising oversight, not under compulsion, but willingly as God would have you, not for shameful gain, but eagerly not domineering over those in your charge, but being examples to the flock.

So what it means for us as a local church, King's Church and whichever church you're a part of, is that there should be in place a promise where these things are taking place.

We're saying we're going to care for you, we're going to look after you, we're going to stay true to the faith as much as we can by the grace of God.

Come aboard, we'll care for you. And the people then say, do that. And if I go astray,

I want to give you permission to speak into my life as an elder, as an eldership team. And if that involves church discipline,

I'm saying with a sound mind here, come, be to me what I need as a sheep so that I'm not caught in the thicket, but I'm actually able to stay in the pasture of the

Lord as a sheep. We ought to be on the guard against false teaching.

And that's why every elder is required to be apt or able to teach.

Doesn't mean that everybody as an elder has a pulpit ministry per se, but they're able to come alongside the people and say, you know what,

I've heard that you're listening to people who deny the deity of Christ or salvation by the grace of God alone.

What's this I'm hearing? Walk that through with me and then can show them the biblical text that will correct.

Paul told Timothy to preach the word and with it to rebuke and correct and bring people into the knowledge of God's word, even though it might be unpopular.

Do it in season and out of season, literally good times and hard times when they like it and when they don't.

I don't know if every sheep loves to be sheared. I don't know what goes through the mind of a sheep, but certainly it doesn't look that comfortable, but it's a healthy thing.

And if I go astray, there are people in my life who can speak into me, fellow elders and also elders across town and people nearby, elders nearby who say, what's this

I'm hearing you teach? And at times they've done and I'm grateful for that.

Then I can explain how I'm right and they're wrong. No, then I can explain and they can say, oh, I hear you.

I hear what you're saying. So that in a nutshell is what covenant membership is all about.

It's all about all of us committing ourselves to one another to be and to do for each other all that the

New Testament requires. And you and I can't do that without some kind of formal church membership.

And it's about the flock acknowledging that God has raised up shepherds to know them, to feed them, protect them.

And their commitment then is to follow that leadership when they are in agreement with scripture.

It's all about the commitment of the leaders to joyfully keep watch over their souls and their willingness to sacrifice everything for their sakes and their growth in Christ Jesus.

It's a hard thing being a leader at times. Oftentimes I've shaken literally in my boots when

I've had to get up and correct something that was out of order by someone who was not having the people's interest.

I've had to do that. It's a hard thing at times, you know, church history wise, but even in our day, there are some countries could actually happen here in the

U .S. at times as we look down the corridors of time, so to speak, where leaders especially will be imprisoned for their faith and for their diligence in standing for the

Word of God. I've been to foreign lands. I've been to China. I've been to Mongolia.

I've been to India where many people are imprisoned for their faith.

But it starts usually with the leaders. It starts with the pastors. I'm aware of pastors who've spent at least 15 years behind bars just because they are a leader in the

Church of Jesus Christ. It's not a thing that is known about too much in the

West. Thank God we've had a lot of freedom. I don't know how long those freedoms will continue to exist, but we should not go into ministry for fame and adulation and for financial gain, but because of the call of God and because we love people.

We love God and we love people, and that's the case. So here's some practical reasons why it's important.

This word commitment, it's something that it's almost a cuss word in some religious circles, and a lot of people say,

I'm not into organized religion. Well, do you want the disorganized kind? I don't believe Jesus would be proud of that either, but what we're doing as leaders and elders and people is to look through the

New Testament and say, how does God want this thing called His church to function?

Jesus said, I will build my church, and as such, He's the owner of it.

He's a sustainer of it, and He has that certain things take place there so that when we come together, we're not scratching our heads as to what happens, but we do things according to His will.

So we prefer to date the church rather than marry her.

We prefer to have her around for special events, take her out, and when life feels lonely, keep her around for a rainy day, and membership is one of the ways to stop dating churches and actually marry one.

That's Kevin DeYoung who said that, but more than that, it defies the temptation most of us feel to be totally independent.

We have an independent streak running through our nature, and I think in the Western world, America leads the way in being independent.

We actually celebrate a day of the year, July 4th every year, celebrating.

Independence happens to be from the country I'm from when

America shook off the tyranny of the British Empire all those years ago, but we like to celebrate the fact we're independent.

We do our own thing. We serve no sovereign here. One of the placards that were raised before the war with the

Jesus kingdom is a kingdom. God's kingdom is a kingdom, and that word kingdom means king and dom, dom short for domain.

It's the domain of the king where the king reigns, and the church is an expression of the kingdom of God.

It's not everything in the kingdom, but it's an expression of the king and his kingdom, and he rules by the scepter of his word, and so covenant membership facilitates that accountability as few other things can.

When we join a church, we're offering ourselves to one another to be encouraged, rebuked, corrected, and served.

We're saying, I'm here to stay. I want to help you grow in godliness. Will you help me do the same?

We're placing ourselves under leaders, submitting to their authority, and both ways there's a commitment going on.

Why do people resist this idea? I think because we love our independence. Why would we love our independence?

It's just human nature. We want to do things our way. People have had a bad experience perhaps.

I'm very sympathetic to those who have, but that does not negate what Jesus is saying to us now if we take the

Bible seriously. Through the writers, through the apostles,

Christ has made his will very clear. Somebody might say

I've been offended in the past by a church that had a membership drive, and all you could hear about was get members, get members, get members, numbers, growth, well

I'm put off by the exact same thing. All I can say is good for you, I agree,

I'd be offended at that too. It should be done just like a marriage with a lot of time and a lot of thought going into it.

Is this a place that honors the word of God? I look past how big the choir is and whether they have a choir.

That's not something that you see outlined in the New Testament. I'm not looking at the youth group or the children's ministry.

Again, you don't see those things in the New Testament. It's something we've added. The music, the lighting, the coldness of the room, all of these things.

You go back into the early church and they met underground because they're in fear of their lives. You just have to go to Rome and see the catacombs where many were worshipping

God with full expression beneath the ground because that's the only place they could do so safely.

Even then, it was not always clear that they would survive the night in doing so.

It feels exclusive, some people say, to have membership. I can't really understand that because we're not excluding anyone when we talk about membership.

If you are a Christian and want to follow the Lord, then be baptized and get involved in a local church.

Join a church. Anyone can do that. Whoever, whosoever will. I believe in those whosoever wills.

I just believe that God has explained that only those who are his elect will, actually will, to do that.

Membership has been used to prevent some members from serving the church. People might say, well, you need to define what you mean, serve.

We don't require membership for someone who wants to attend a house group, but shouldn't we require something of people who's going to stand up and lead a house group?

Shouldn't we know what their doctrine is? I don't think we're taking our role as leaders very seriously if we allow anyone to teach.

We need to be able to say, can you sign on the line here that you embrace this particular creed or confession of the church, which has been accepted by Christians through the centuries?

The Apostles' Creed, the Nicene Creed, the Chalcedonian Creed, the

Confessions. At our church, we embrace the New Hampshire Baptist Confession for members and also the 1689

London Baptist Confession of Faith for elders. We want to make sure that those who are teaching actually embrace what we believe the

Bible teaches. These creeds and confessions are not equivalent to Scripture, but at the same time, they are like guardrails, as I've explained on a previous dividing line.

They're like guardrails that the church has said, this is what we believe the Bible teaches.

You see, every cult member says they believe the Bible, well, a lot of them, but then they give very erroneous views as to what the

Bible teaches. They deny the deity of Christ, deny the Trinity, deny justification by grace alone, through faith alone, in Christ alone.

It feels too formal and too structured, some people might say. Well, I believe in being relaxed and organic in that sense of having fun, but your body needs structure.

And if your skeleton's in trouble, so is your body. You break a bone and your muscles feel it.

So it is in the body of Christ, there should be some structure that allows for growth. Lazy, sloppy unity isn't going to last.

I believe in being informal, but there are certain times when we say, you know what, this is what the

Word of God says, and we're going to do it because God says it, just because he says it.

It feels tough for me because I was deeply hurt by membership. Again, I'm sure that's true.

Let's just commit to not doing that at the church where we're functioning. Let's make sure that we are loving one another, putting people before ourselves.

Somebody might say, I'm fearful of being controlled. Good. I don't want that as much as anyone else.

So find a place where you can feel that the elders aren't wishing to control you, lead you, guide you, protect you, feed you, nourish you.

Yes, yes, yes, but control, no. Someone might say, well, I'm a member of the universal church.

Why do I need a local church? Without being too blunt, because the Bible says, moving right along.

I'm not trying to be harsh. I just believe what I'm telling you. You mean you actually believe what you said on the last

Yes, I do. People might say, it's not in my spiritual

DNA to have formal membership. Never had it before. Well, adjust.

It's in the spiritual DNA of your relationship with God, because God is the one who's behind membership.

I believe that. I actually believe that. That's why I'm talking about this. People say,

I don't like boundaries. Really? Man -made barriers, man -made boundaries. I can agree.

But when God says there should be a difference between those inside the church and outside the church, as we looked at the scriptures last time, who are we to say,

I'm not going to, I'm not going to do that. I'm not going to be involved in that. One elder in a church that was moving towards formal membership wrote this, and I'm just going to quote him.

It was in an email he'd written after going through the scriptures. He says, I've realized that this isn't a way to stop people going out the back door.

This is wanting to know who's going to stand at your shoulder when you're taking fire instead of throwing down their weapon and running away.

This is a commitment to stay, even if it means sometimes hearing hard words from friends, even when flatterers are waiting outside, ever willing to tell us what we want to hear.

This is a recognition that our self -perception is about as accurate as a carnival mirror. So we dare not cut ourselves out of the pack or we risk being ridden down by the wolves of our own self -deception and cocky pride.

This is a promise that prepares the way for us to pour our lives out for each other without constantly wondering if a whim or flit of fancy will blow us out of each other's lives into another local expression of the church that we've found to be more convenient, where we can hide more comfortably.

This is a commitment, a promise between friends, a bond between brothers and sisters.

This is a commitment to yourself to choose Christian community on the basis of the Holy Spirit's leading instead of your own capricious convenience.

This is a sacred trust that declares we're not interested in ecclesiological buffet, we're building a family.

This is an acknowledgement that Christian community is not something we create, it's given to us by God.

We are entrusted into one another's care, we will not abandon that trust when it becomes inconvenient. In an age of transience, isolation and selfishness, we're taking a stand for intentional, humble, sacrificial community with Christ at the center who bids us come and die, to die to our transient, isolated, proud selves in order to be reborn into a community created to proclaim the excellences of him who called us out of darkness into his glorious light.

Again, quote from Charles Spurgeon, I know there are some who say, well I've given myself to the

Lord but I do not intend to give myself to any church. Now why not? Because I can be a

Christian without it. Are you quite clear about that? You can be as good a

Christian by disobedience to your Lord's command as by being obedient? There is a brick, what is it made for?

To help build a house. It is of no use for that brick to tell you that it's just as good a brick while it's kicking about on the ground as it would be in the house.

It is a good for nothing brick. So you Rolling Stone Christians, I do not believe that you are answering your purpose.

You are living contrary to the life which Christ would have you live and you are much to blame for the injury you do.

End of quote. Why should I join this church, my church,

King's Church? I'm not assuming you should. Very, very aware that the church

I pastor is not for everyone. Certainly if you live in another state it's going to be hard to commute every

Wednesday and Sunday and that's going to be difficult. But find a place where you can serve.

Find a place that has the biblical gospel going forth regularly, where the people are protected by church discipline and the sacraments are administrated properly.

What's your thought on this? Do you react with joy to this or do you resist this?

Let's go through the scriptures. Let's walk through the scriptures. Let's find out what Jesus said.

When we talk about the church, when we talk about eldership, two things emerge quite clearly and that is that it is plural.

Eldership is plural and male. Just on the subject of plurality of eldership, there's a book that is available here from Alpha and Omega Ministries that James White has written a chapter on.

Chapter five is called The Plural Elder -Led Church. I just want to recommend the book to you. It's called

Perspectives on Church Government and there Dr. White goes into much more detail than I'm able to in this broadcast to go through the biblical teaching on plurality of elders.

Sufficient as established, the plurality of elders as Christ -ordained means of church governance.

Every word is significant there. It's Christ -ordained means of governing the church.

We're not to play at this, make up our own ideas. We're not to look to the world and say, what does

McDonald's do? What does Best Buy do? What does Apple do?

We're to find out what God has instructed us to do and that's why the searching of the scriptures is so vital and essential.

Every tradition we have should be examined in the light of scripture. We believe strongly in sola scriptura.

The Bible alone is the word of God. We not only believe in the necessity of the

Bible, but the key word is the sufficiency of the

Bible. I heard what one man say because he was influenced by the culture rather than the word of God.

If Jesus was with us now and starting the church, six of the twelve apostles would be women and I thought, really?

How dare you? How dare you say that? Well, what's wrong with saying that?

Well, Jesus was anything but politically correct.

He didn't do things because the culture around him wanted him to do things.

He did things because by his own testament he said, I see the Father saying this, doing this.

I hear him say this. I see him do this. That's how he functioned.

Again, in the Old Testament, did Moses go around the tents of the Canaanites knocking on the sheet and saying, excuse me, what kind of church service would you come to?

What kind of leaders would you allow us to put in place? How many?

Can we just find a compromise here? You might have your ideas, I've got mine. No, we are not to seek to improve upon divine wisdom.

All tradition should be examined in the light of scripture. We seek to improve on it at our peril and to do so is to trespass into unauthorised territory.

We have no right to tweak things for the sake of pragmatism, whatever seems to work.

Because Christ is building his church, he provides all that's necessary for the building and for the project, including the people to form each local church's government.

For there to be a church, there must be government. Can I say that again? For there to be a church, there must be government.

Some people say, I meet with a couple of Christians every week on a Tuesday night. Okay, that's great, but that's not a church.

A church can only be a church when there is a government structure in place for an ecclesia to be in place.

A church, there must be government and eldership is an essential feature of government.

Three descriptive words regarding eldership. There should be a qualification for them.

1st Timothy 3, Titus chapter 1. It implies a maturity of someone who knows the scripture rather than someone opening up the

Bible, reading a passage and just saying, well, what does that mean to you? That's the teaching, really? No, it should be someone who knows something of the

Bible and knows the context of the verses that we're looking at. I've looked into the words.

I've actually done some research. The task of an elder is to oversee.

The Greek word used often is episkopos and it's two words sandwiched together, which means to see and to see over.

It means to be an overseer. It's like a foreman. A foreman on a project doesn't do all the work, but he makes sure all the work gets done.

That's really the task of an overseer. He's looking over the people and making sure everybody's needs are covered, that people are getting a right diet of the word of God and being cared for practically as well.

These words in the New Testament are very good, very clear. One of the words is the word shepherd.

It's found 18 times in the New Testament, in the original language, 17 times.

It's actually translated shepherd one time and one time only. It's referred to as pastor.

You find that in Ephesians 4 .11. God has given, Christ has given gifts to the church, apostles, prophets, evangelists, pastors and teachers.

If we look at the New Testament, we'll see that when Paul established churches, first on his first missionary journey, he went in and evangelized.

As he came back, he ordained elders. I'd like us just to go to a passage in Acts 14 for a moment.

It's significant. Chapter 14 of the book of Acts, we're teaching verse by verse through the book of Acts as a church on Sundays at King's Church.

Acts chapter 14, verse 23, and it says, And when they had appointed elders for them in every church with prayer and fasting, they committed them to the

Lord in whom they had believed. Again, just a side reference, elders, the word there is plural rather than singular, appointed elders in every church.

And you see, there was a plurality of elders when Paul established churches.

And that was typical for all later cases. In Titus 1, verse 5,

Paul instructed Titus, appoint elders in every town. That same rule applied until elders are appointed.

Something's been left unfinished in the birthing of a church. Now, in many situations, it's hard to appoint two elders straight away for the simple reason that there isn't the maturity in the congregation yet to have two elders.

And so I've been in, for instance, I mentioned Mongolia. I went there and 15 years previously, there was only one known

Christian in the entire country. God had been doing much in that particular country.

And it was just thrilling to see this young church emerge in this town that I still cannot pronounce even a decade or so later while working on it.

It's an amazing language over there. But this one church had about 150 now in this little village church.

And the pastor of the church was six months old as a Christian. Why? Because there was very few that had more than eight months under their belts as Christians.

And he was just the man who was anointed by God. Everyone could see it, that he studied the word as much as he could.

He had a Bible in the Mongolian language and he was studying and it was basically one week ahead of the congregation and telling them what they knew.

And in that situation, there are no books that you could refer them to, very little in other words.

There were just a few Christian books in the Mongolian dialect, the tongue, the language.

You couldn't just say, pick up R .C. Sproul's Holiness of God book in Mongolian. You can try, but it's just not available.

And so when we were able to come as a team and just teach the word of God, they were just writing, writing, writing with just meticulous proficiency to say, let me record everything you're telling me, because they just didn't know.

And it would have been improper to appoint a second man at that point because they were just so young in the faith.

But as time went on, I'm sure that's what happened. More and more leaders emerged over time.

Many were telling me that in six or eight months, they wanted to start their own church in another village where the rest of their family were.

And it was just a wonderful thing to see. But it's certainly the case, like it was in the book of Acts, where there's just new ground or a new church is starting and you've only got the one elder to work with.

But quickly, there should be something in place for the training of people so that elders can emerge in the plural.

Again, in James chapter five, do you remember when someone's sick, let him call for the elders of the church and let them pray over him, anointing him with oil in the name of the

Lord and the prayer of faith shall save the sick. So it goes on. We've read first Peter chapter five, verse one.

Again, Paul writes to other elders as a fellow elder. And almost every reference in the

New Testament, the term for elders is plural. And the only exceptions are when you might just absolutely think that's right, that it's only singular because he's talking about an accusation against an elder.

If some of you have an accusation against an elder, let it be by the fact of two or three witnesses.

You wouldn't expect to see the word elders plural there. In fact, in verse 17 of that same chapter, first Timothy five, it clearly mentions a plurality of elders there in the

Ephesian church. Second John one, third John one. Again, another exception taking place, two exceptions taking place when, again, we're talking about the elder.

It's a title, it's a personal designation, and you wouldn't expect to see that word in the plural.

So again, similar to first Peter five one, where Peter is called a fellow elder.

And I would say that leadership is male. This has been controversial in the past, but I think it's very clear.

People often point to Galatians 3 .28 that says, no, no, no, there's neither male nor female.

Now we're in Christ Jesus. That, I believe, in its context is talking about our vertical relationship with God.

God does not treat daughters differently than sons in the faith. Brothers and sisters in Christ have the same inheritance.

That's what Romans eight talks about. We're heirs of God, joint heirs with Jesus Christ. There's no difference in that sense, but that does not negate that male and female have different roles in the church.

That's why in Ephesians it says, husbands love your wives as Christ loves the church.

God has instructions for the women. One of them is controversial.

First Timothy chapter two, where it's very, very clear what God is saying there.

Let me say very quickly, I believe in the political realm and every other realm, women can do not only everything men can do.

Oftentimes they do it better. I remember growing up in England where from 1979 to 1990, the political head of the nation was

Margaret Thatcher, and she had more backbone than just about every other political man I've ever met.

Her and Ronald Reagan between them dismantled the regime of the

Soviet empire. I think you could make a case for that. So I grew up with a woman as the political head and so no problem.

I'm just talking in the church. You look at first Timothy two, 11 and 12, and I don't believe it's talking about a cultural mandate there where he says,

I don't permit a woman to teach or exercise authority over a man. And then his appeal is not to culture, but to creation because the man was created first.

He goes back to Genesis and says, this is true according to the created order.

Adam was created first, then Eve. The apostolic argument is not based on culture there, but creation.

I do not permit, and I believe that cannot mean I do permit.

You have a look at that text and I think it will bear it out. We're out of time for today, but thank you so much for watching.

Let me just mention one other thing before we close. Chris Arnson is known to many listeners and viewers of the dividing line.

He's organized many of Dr. White's debates in the past and in recent weeks has started again his weekly radio program for every weekday called

Iron Sharpens Iron. First guest recently was a man called Dr. James White and I followed him.

I've done another one since and I think I'm back on July 7th. But I'd like you to, if you enjoy the dividing line,

I think you'll enjoy very much Chris Arnson's program after a four year hiatus. He's back on the air.

I just want to recommend the show. Pray for Chris. Check out his show at ironsharpensironradio .com.

It airs each weekday from 4 to 5 p .m. That's Eastern Standard Time.

That's ironsharpensironradio .com. I believe Dr. White will be another guest again very soon, as I will.

It's a joy to come to you and pray for Dr. James White. He's doing some important things in another state right now.

Pray for him. Pray for his family. Pray for his safety. It's a joy to come to you. My name is

Pastor John Sampson, King's Church in Peoria. God bless you as you walk in the light of his word.