Rochadd Hendrix Interview: Why Should Lay People Study Theology? (Part 1)

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Welcome to No Compromise Radio, a ministry coming to you from Bethlehem Bible Church in West Boylston.

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No Compromise Radio is a program dedicated to the ongoing proclamation of Jesus Christ, based on the theme in Galatians 2, verse 5, where the

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Apostle Paul said, But we did not yield in subjection to them for even an hour, so that the truth of the gospel would remain with you.

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In short, if you like smooth, watered -down words to make you simply feel good, this show isn't for you.

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By purpose, we are first biblical, but we can also be controversial. Stay tuned for the next 25 minutes, as we're called by the divine trumpet to summon the troops for the honor and glory of her

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King. Here's our host, Pastor Mike Abendroth. Welcome to No Compromise Radio.

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This is Steve Cooley, the Tuesday Guy, and I've got Roshad Hendricks on the phone. How are you, brother?

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Hey, Steve. Good to talk to you, Tuesday Guy. I'm very well. Happy, blessed, healthy, well.

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Just amazed at God's grace in my life, my friend. Good. Well, I have the privilege of having met

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Roshad on a few occasions, and if you don't follow him on Facebook, you're really losing out, because I learn stuff just following him on Facebook.

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So, I thought what I would do is just ask you, because, well, let me just ask you this first.

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Are you a pastor? I am not. I'm a lay guy. Okay. Are you an ordained elder?

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I am not. Okay. Are you a deacon? I am not.

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Man, what is wrong with your church? I'm sorry. Yeah.

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Okay, because I think your level of knowledge is going to become evident as we talk here, and so I just,

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I think, man, oh, man, dude needs to be doing something. Okay. So, let me just ask you, let's start off with an easy one.

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I know that you have been to a number of Bible conferences, because I've met you at a few of them.

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Which one do you like the best, and why? Oh, man.

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Starting off with a good one. Yeah, so, I've been to Shepherd's Conferences, actually, the first two times that I went,

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I was with my father, who's also on Facebook, Rod Hendricks, he's a pastor, and he put me on to J -Mac,

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Johnny Mac, and so we went to the Shepherd's Conference twice, back -to -back years.

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That was back in, I think, 06 and 07, and then had a long layoff, and then went back again two times.

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So we've been to Shepherd's Conferences, we've been to G3, like you mentioned, last year.

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That was my first G3, wife and myself went. And then we also happened to go to Ligonier for the first time, and Ligonier was my favorite.

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And I was trying to put my finger on why, as you asked that question,

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I was like, well, why? You know, G3 was good for what it was,

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I think with G3, for me, it was too many people. Yeah, it's like 6 ,000, you know.

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Yeah, literally, and that may have been on the conservative side, at best. And I think the location with G3, too, downtown

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Atlanta, just packed and congested, you know, not a whole lot of options as far as, you know, going to eat different things or whatever down in that area.

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Well, that's no slight against my Atlanta area friends, I love all of you guys.

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But the location with G3, the amount of people, Shepherd's Conference is great. You know, lots of pastor friends out there.

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You know, the scenery out there, not so much the Texas in Southern California, as you know, but the scenery out there is fantastic.

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I'm a scenery guy, I love natural scenery, I love just looking at God's creation, my wife does as well.

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And then, of course, the content. Content at G3, content at Shepherd's Conference, content at Ligonier, you know you're going to get good, solid theological content at all of those places.

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So I think what ended up, go ahead, Steve. Well, I was just going to say, so why do you lean toward Ligonier?

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Yeah, Ligonier, I think with Ligonier, it wasn't as big.

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It was at First Baptist Orlando, I think, downtown, which I'm just guessing maybe 2 ,000 people total.

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And then, you know, you're going to get, again, the good, sound theology, solid theology, and the location there wasn't as many people.

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So I mean, if you're looking at it from the angle that I'm looking at it, theologically, doctrine -wise, everything is pretty much going to be even across the board with those conferences, you know, that we would attend anyway.

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So I would just say that the theological content at Ligonier, the location, the people, a little bit of an older crowd, older Presbyterian, you know, you've got that kind of vibe going on.

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Again, all these conferences, but I think those are probably some of the things that put

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Ligonier over the top for me. You know, it's funny, because Janet and I have been to Ligonier a number of times, and there have been occasions, it just seems like we would meet somebody on the first day or two that we're there, and then we would run into those people over and over and over again.

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It was like, we couldn't get away, not that we're trying to get away from them, but one couple we ran into, and as we talked to them, we just thought, these people just don't seem like Ligonier folks, because they didn't really, you know, they didn't know all that much in terms of theology and stuff.

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So I find that kind of thing very interesting when I go to conferences. Well, let me ask you this.

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What is it, you know, because I do follow you on Facebook, and you know, you post a lot of theology on Facebook, and what really was it that got you so interested in theology?

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Oh, yeah, that's a really good question. I've been in the States since about 04, somewhere about there, and you know, initially, as I was saved by the

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Lord Jesus Christ, you know, from maybe about 2004 to 2016,

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I was, maybe not 2016, but probably 04 to 2013 -ish, 12 -ish,

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I will probably have been classified as Armenian as far as my theological leaning. As far as I can remember,

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I trace it back to maybe 2013 is where I started, maybe 2012 started leaning more towards Calvinism, Doctrines of Grace, whatever you want to call it.

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I started reading more of those works, you know, as I mentioned before, my father was always very fond of J.

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Mack and everybody who was associated with him, so I started reading those guys heavy.

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And then, I will say that everything really just kicked into hyperdrive,

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Steve, and you'll remember this, back in 2016 when the whole Trinity debate started, that was kind of like a cataclysmic bomb explosion for a lot of people.

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Me, myself, personally, because that's when I really started to read about the history of our faith.

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Now, I wanted to see where these guys were really getting at, what they were talking about, you know, what's the big deal about some of these things?

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And so, I started reading heavy historical works, straight to the sources. Augustine, the

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Cappadocian Fathers, you know, some of the earlier post -Reformation guys,

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Reformation guys, Puritans, people just reading historically those guys, looking to see what they had to say about these weighty doctrines that we believe.

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And so, I will say from that point, 2015, 2016, and just continuing up to now,

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I tell people any chance I get when we're talking about this, that for all intents and purposes, Steve, it was like I went to school, and I'm still in school, you know, learning about these great doctrines of our past and looking at that thread of orthodoxy to see, you know, what was the early church for me?

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What did the forerunners in our faith believe? And so, that's what I've just been doing, really, 2015, 2016, just reading those guys, seeing what they had to say, comparing it against scripture, you know, weighing in to see if what they're saying is in fact, you know, what the

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Bible declares. And so, yeah. I hope I kind of answered what you were asking me.

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Yeah, well, let me ask you this, just a follow -up question. You know,

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I mean, you mentioned the Trinity. How do you stay motivated to do that kind of thing? And the reason

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I ask that is because, you know, a lot of people are just like, well, I understand the Trinity.

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The Father, the Son, the Holy Spirit, you know, that's the Trinity. Three persons, one

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God, you know, I don't even think they get into the essence very much. You know, one

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God, three persons, I understand it. You know, next, how do you keep motivated to keep digging, just kind of keep trying to hone and sharpen your understanding of the

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Trinity? 9 I mean, because at the end of the day, what are we trying to do?

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What is Christians' goal? Christians' goal is to know God. You know, first great commandment of God.

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I mean, it starts with God. And we see at the beginning of our Bible, and this is one, in the beginning,

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God created the heavens and the earth, so we're put in this position where, you know, we have a

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Creator who created us. He has authority, control over us. We need to understand who this being is, who is in this lofty position, in a whole different class from us.

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And so, specifically though, about the Trinity, if we're honest, you know, it's intimidating to a lot of people,

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I think. And I think that a lot of us are content with what you just said.

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Okay, well, we know one God. The Bible declares that a hero is the Lord, our

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God is one, and we know we just worship one God, yet we also see as it unfolds that one

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God is also three persons. You know, so, and that's enough for a lot of us.

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But as you continue to feel layers back from a lot of different things, you'll start to see that a lot of groups and a lot of other people who would claim to be

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Christian or, you know, look somewhat like Christians would likely say the same thing.

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And this kind of goes into, you know, a little bit of the current triple around the

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Trinity about subordinationism and submission and the Godhead. So, again, going back to history, it's important because we had debates around the nature of God historically.

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I see a Chalcedon which refers more to the nature of the Christ, but I mean, it all ties back into a some way.

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And so, it has implications for your theology in every other area.

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You know, so if you believe, well, there's different wills in God, so there's a

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God that we know is like a community of persons that kind of just cooperate and always happen to agree with one another.

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You know, but these are the same people who would say that they believe what you stated, one

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God, three persons. Right. Right. So, I mean, it becomes more, it really becomes more, you know, and we're attempting to understand a being that's infinite.

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We're finite. You know, we're never going to get to the end of Him. Peter That's right. Charles So, we can't exhaust

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Him. So, you know, continuing to, by His grace, by His power to want to know

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Him, you know, that's my prayer. Well, I'm trying to figure out, you know, what it's like.

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Like, let's just say I show up at your church on Sunday morning, and I happen to sit next to you, and you know, we greet one another and whatever, and the sermon's over, and the singing's over, and everything's done, and you know, you just turn to me and you say, hey, what was your first name?

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And I say, Steve. And you go, yeah, why don't you explain the Trinity to me? I mean, you know, in other words, do you ever, like, talk to lay people, you know, that you're near at your church and just, you know, encourage them to learn theology, or do you just, like, intimidate people yourself, you know, just because you're so well read?

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You know, do people, like, run away from you as soon as you start talking about, you know, different councils, or, you know, you start citing the

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Athanasian Creed, or whatever you're doing, you know? I mean, does that just, like, what do people think?

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Yeah. So, I'm blessed to be a member of the Church of Wyomack Grace Community Church here at Jackson.

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My pastor is Dr. Peter, and we also have a seminary that we're a campus of.

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And so, you have some of the guys who are in seminary. So, they're already, you know, thinking about some of these things, and it trickles down, you know, to the rest of the congregation.

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So, as far as, you know, if people kind of just maybe shy away from it, maybe, you know,

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I'm not naive enough to think that everybody, you know, is going to have a certain level of interest with it, you know.

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But, by God's grace, again, being where I'm at, being where we're at as members, you know, you get the questions, and you get the opportunity to have discussions about it.

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And one of the good things about it is, you know, that people ask questions, and, you know, you have these discussions, these very fruitful discussions, and it's like you can kind of start seeing, you know,

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God open their eyes to it. And that's what gives me great joy.

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You know, I always tell people, anytime I talk to them, I say, hey, you know, we'd be crazy to think that we're going to be able to sell, for lack of a better word, everybody on what we're saying, you know, or what we believe the

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Bible to be saying. You know, if just one person sees God rightly,

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I am so grateful, you know, to God, and by His grace,

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I've been able to see that occur. And one of the things that I like to do when I'm in conversations with some of the brothers from church, you know,

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I like to keep, you know, copies of John Owen's book, The Glory of Christ, and that is the one book that I recommend first and foremost to anyone who, you know, hey, what's your reading?

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What's going on with this? You know, how did you come to believe what you believe here? It sounds like what this person here is saying is right about the

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Trinity. Well, why don't you see that? You know, and I'm able to, again, have discussions like you said, but I'm also able to give them something.

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You know, that little volume, that's like a hundred pages, and say, hey, read this.

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That was the book that God used, you know, of course I'm assuming scripture, you know, that God used to, you know, light that fire underneath to want to know

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Him more. And the way it's laid out and explained, how

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God used Owen to explain Christ and His two natures. It's...

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Nations united in one person and how, you know, Trinity is, you know, it's something that, you know, it's, for lack of a better word, it's just fire blowing amazing.

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It's so interesting to me that, you know, the people just, there are so many people, even teachers, pastors, who seemingly have little regard, you know, for anyone, you know, before the 20th century, you know, any

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Christian author before the 20th century. So, you know, you mentioned John Owen, you know,

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Puritan, older writer, you know, solid, but it's like, people don't want to struggle and read that kind of material these days.

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You know, I was just talking to Mike the other day, and he said he was reading 10 pages a day of Owen, which, you know,

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I mean, 10 pages a day of anybody doesn't sound like that much until you read Owen, and then you go, yeah, 10 pages a day is pretty good.

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You know, because it's not, you know, he doesn't write like, let's see, who's a really breezy kind of, well,

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I mean, like I can read Sproul, you know, I mean, it's just easy to read him, you know, because he kind of writes like I think.

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And some of these older guys don't do that because they're older, right? I mean, they wrote hundreds of years ago.

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Well, let me ask you this. Well, another easy question. I mean, actually, I'm going to dial it down and give you an easier one.

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How do you, what do you do in your local church? How are you serving in your local church? Yeah, so we do, well, right now, we do, we work with the welcome team as one function that we do, my wife and I.

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I like to have couples that work with the welcome team, welcoming new people, you know, functioning in that capacity.

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You know, we're getting ready to change our Sunday school curriculum, now moving to a different Sunday school curriculum.

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So, specifically for the children's church portion of it. So, working on changing the curriculum there with the elders there who are overseeing that and get ready to work more in that area.

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Okay, so do you think you'll be teaching in Sunday school? Is that? Yes, yes.

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And that's, again, a joint thing that we have. It's a really smaller kid. The youth in there from sixth grade to 12th grade, the youth pastor will teach them on Sundays separately.

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And then you have the kids who are fifth grade to kindergarten separated out into classes.

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And so, you have individuals in each of those classes, adults in those classes, going over the lessons that we have.

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Okay, okay. Now, how, I guess this is somewhat related to things

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I've asked you before, but let me see if we can bring something else out of it. When you study these kind of things,

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I mean, I'm just thinking about, you know, you're on the welcome team, which is great, right? I mean, one of the things that we hear about with Calvinistic kind of reformed churches is that, you know, they're just not friendly or, you know,

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I just didn't get a friendly vibe. Of course, I get the opposite too. I get people who tell us all the time, this happens a lot.

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I can't believe how friendly the church was. I can't, you know, all these kind of things. But when you're on the welcoming team, and you've been reading, you know,

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John Owen or, I don't know, who have you been reading lately? Who are some people that you've been reading lately?

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Oh, goodness, man. Steve, I'm, man, there's so many people,

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I'm in and out of books. I, at this point, I'm not, honestly,

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I don't look to complete books, per se. I go and read different sections of books.

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I'm always in the systematic. So I got a church and sitting on my table now, history volume, and I'm in and out of that.

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I'm going through Henry Law's book, Messy, and some stuff about that. Henry Law's book, Crisis All, where he's kind of like a devotional, where he's going through the

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Pentateuch. It's like 500 -something pages. So going through that, reading what he had to say.

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I was just in Glenn Button's book, the book that he just made, or that he just wrote, what's it called?

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Trinitarian Dogmatics. Yeah, which you forced me to buy. Oh, yeah.

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Hey, good. I'm glad that you did. And then I just came out of Biblical Reasoning by Whitman and Johnson, I think.

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I don't know, but if I go over near my office, I can pick it up because you also forced me to buy that one.

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Yeah, to me, that's the best book I've read this year. I did go through that one. I'm on the Rashad bandwagon right now.

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Rashad says... That's one of the most... You say buy something, and I go, okay. Man, listen,

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I get recommendations from everybody, and we just pass it around. That's what the body does.

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Because we're going to bump up for this episode, we're going to bump up against the clock here in a minute or two.

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I'll let you know. But if you would, just for our audience here, if you would just kind of briefly explain the gospel, what would you say, like, let's say

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I was a visitor at church, you know, and you were on the welcome team and you wanted to give me the gospel, what would you say to me?

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Yeah, good question, man. That is the quintessential question that everybody has to ask and answer.

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So we talked about... Oh, I brought it up earlier. Genesis 1 -1, in the beginning, God created the heavens and the earth.

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Then we get to Genesis chapter 2, you know, God made man, a foreign man from the dust of the ground to breathe the breath of life into his nostrils, and man became a living being.

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Automatically, from the very beginning of the existence of man, man is put in a servant position to a higher authority.

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Somebody has created man, and because somebody has created man, the one who created man has authority, dominion, power, ownership, rulership over man.

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And that means that man is accountable to the one who has created him. So what happens as we go into the biblical narrative as it continues to unfold?

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Well, God gave man these laws, okay? In command, you know, honor your mother and father, and so on and so forth, by stealing, coveting, murdering, lying.

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You know, these are what man are expected to abide by and abide by without fail from this creator, from this one who created.

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And so we see Jesus come. Jesus comes and he explains it in greater detail.

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It's not so much that you do these things, but you even think these things, you're in trouble.

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You have sinned against the one who created you. You have sinned against God. Okay, we've only got 20 seconds.

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Oh, I'm sorry. It's okay. Now you're in trouble. Well, wait a minute. If the wages of sin is death as it stands in the book of Romans, then what are you going to do?

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How are you going to stand before God if you have sinned against God? You've broken this commandment. Thought, action, deed, however, well then that's the purpose for Jesus' coming.

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You know, repent of your sins, you trust in Christ, you believe in his finished work on the cross, and he has atoned for your sins if that is you.

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If you repent of your cross, believe in him, trust in him, cling to him, hold to him, trust in the work that he has done, and he will save you from eternal torment.

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Pete Preach it. So it's based on his life, death, and resurrection. Amen. Period. Okay. No Compromise Radio.

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No Compromise Radio. We'll be right back. No Compromise Radio with Pastor Mike Abendroth is a production of Bethlehem Bible Church in West Boylston.

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Bethlehem Bible Church is a Bible teaching church firmly committed to unleashing the life -transforming power of God's word through verse -by -verse exposition of the sacred text.

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Please come and join us. Our service times are Sunday morning at 1015 and in the evening at 6. We're right on Route 110 in West Boylston.

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You can check us out online at bbchurch .org or by phone at 508 -835 -3400.