Q&A

66 double -barreled and clip -loaded, it never needs reloading, it stays loaded with pin -proofing

It stays loaded like Noah sippin' that grape juice, swervin' in a boat full of dinosaurs in no traffic

Seen devils with more eyes than Seraphim, I could tear a limb off your dead body with no grabbin'

Nine Romans to blunt chosen for eyes open, only the elect get an eye pokin', no goat grabbin'

The devil is a liar and he wears pajamas with feet on them, he feminist, punk, genderless, coke -addict

He got booted for pride issues and world walks in it, dressed in high -heeled shoes, so I'm hippo -Catholic

Ain't no dope addicts goin' to God for the dope, we gospel -affiliated, you walk past the schools with those who tune in and listen to us.

My name is Jeff Rice. I am the pastor of Covenant Reformed Baptist Church.

We meet in Tallahoma, Tennessee, and I am here with my good friend, Brayden.

Brayden, would you introduce yourself and pass it to Haps? Yeah, I'm Brayden Patterson from Valley Baptist Church.

I have the privilege of being the pastor there. If you live in the southern Idaho area and would like to come to church this

Sunday, I would really encourage you to, where we come and worship one and only Triune God, and just love on each other, encourage each other in those ways, and sing worship to God.

You can also find me at Reformed Ex -Mormon, where we just continue to seek to advance

God's kingdom and to glorify Him and preach Him crucified. And from that, I'll pass it over to Haps.

Brother Haps. Well, I'm Pastor Happy with Olive Branch Ministries, and we're out of southern

California. We're in the lower deserts, and we're having a blast.

All right. I see that we have a guest with us today. Happy, do you want to introduce him to us?

Yes. This is my right -hand man right here. This is my little brother.

That's what me and Pastor Seth call him. This is our baby brother right here. His name is Hannes Dadard, and he is my head deacon in Olive Branch Ministries.

And he helps me with the counseling and the mentally ill. All right.

All right. So as you can probably tell from the post that we did, so Hannes is on here tonight, and he's going to ask questions.

Now, we've been trying to get some of our listeners to write in questions, to type us out questions for us to answer.

But guess what? No one wants to play alone. Hannes has decided to come on, be live with us, and to ask questions.

And then we will provide, hopefully we're able to provide him biblical, straight biblical answers.

So Hannes, won't you say hello? Hello, everybody. All right.

Short but sweet. So I know that you probably already have questions written out or whatever, and that's fine.

And then Haps said that you had some that you just want to shoot from the hip also, depending on how our answers go.

So we just want to leave the floor open to you. You can, if you feel more comfortable, we're going to Haps first, since he's your pastor, asking him.

That's fine. Just whoever you want to ask first, feel free and ask.

Yes, sir. So my first question is for Pastor Happy, my pastor. What is sonship?

And my questions for each of you pastors is followed with the subsequent question.

Why does it matter or why is it important? And so my first question is for Pastor Happy again.

What is sonship and why is it important? Well, I can tell you this, you're going under church discipline.

It was supposed to be Jeff first, then me. All right. Okay, no, I don't want discipline, Pastor Jeff.

No more, no more. You're fine, you're fine. You know what? This is like one of my favorite subjects right here.

And I was just so excited because, you know, here at our house, this is a big part of our ministry.

It's the gospel and the core of the gospel is adoption.

That's at the very, very core of the gospel of Jesus Christ. And I was sitting back today, you know, and I was just sitting here and I was just, you know,

I was just thinking and I was like, you know, you know, and I don't, I'm not going to come at this like just all scripture right now.

I want to come at it with the heart and everything. You know, when you look all throughout scripture and it's always, you know,

Addie, son of or Jacob, the son of, you know, you know, it's always the son of.

There's always this title and, you know, my last name is Addison. I'm very, very proud of my last name.

That's my family are Scottish and everything like this. But to be the son, to be a child of God, a son of God is awesome.

And so I just, you know, I just want to read a couple things just real fast.

And I want to go to the London Baptist confession of faith, actually. And I'm going to pull from some other resources, but under seven of the

London Baptist confession of faith, it should you guys all have it, right? It's of adoption.

And it says this, it says all those that are justified. God vouch vouch.

I can't even say that word. Vouch the pit. I can't even say it.

What chapter are you in? I'm in the London Baptist confession of faith of adoption.

Number seven. Seven is a covenant.

No, mine's after justification is of adoption.

You on page 30? No, I'm adoption is chapter 12. Adoption is chapter 12.

Okay. So not in here. It's not. Yeah. Yeah. So you need to know how to read Roman numeral, but it says, it says, um, uh, and, and for the sake of his only son,

Jesus Christ to make partakers of the grace of adoption by which they are taken into the number.

And enjoy the liberties and privileges of children of God have the name put upon them, receive the spirit of adoption, have access to the throne of grace with boldness and enabled to cry

ABBA father are pity protected provided for and chastened by him.

As by a father yet never cast off, but sealed the day of redemption and inherit the promises as heirs of everlasting salvation.

And you know that, that, that here as, as sons of God, we, we have what the world doesn't have.

We have reconciliation with God and now we are children of God. We, we bear his name upon us as children of God.

And, um, what that, what comes not only a responsibility, but, um, uh, blessings.

I mean, just the promises are given to us that he shall never leave us nor forsake us that if we're in the father and the son's hands, nobody can pluck us from his arm, his hands.

We are his, his, um, uh, he, he loves us.

We have, he's long suffering with us. Um, we have this, it's not like, it's like, you know,

I, I, Hannes, when we were, we were breaking down, um, to us has been given the keys to the kingdom.

I mean, we, we, we just went through all this in the catechism, but in the, the Lord's prayer, you know, our father who art in heaven, hollow be thy name.

Our father is in heaven. That's, that's specific right there. He's not our earthly father that, that is, um, uh, um, is in sin.

Uh, that is a natural center. Our God, our father that is in heaven. He's in, in the holies.

Uh, he is holy and righteous and kind and just, and, um, and, and he is without sin.

He is righteous. And, um, and that's why we, uh, cry out to him,

Abba father, that more intimate, uh, way of saying father and stuff. And, um, and, but I, I mean, there's so many scriptures guys, so many scriptures.

Uh, you have Ephesians 1 .5. In fact, let's go to Ephesians 1 .5 and that's one of my favorites right there.

Ephesians 1 .5. You know, we are no longer children of wrath, but children of God now.

And he loves us. And this, this isn't by accident. We, we didn't, it's not like we just started loving him.

So now he loves us. No, no. We love him because he first loved us. You know, that is why.

And come on, where are you? And, uh, Ephesians 1 .5 says this, you know, um, uh, no,

I got a real, I got it, man. I got it, man. I can't open up scripture like that and just pull one out, man. Uh, I'm gonna start in three.

Blessed be the God and father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who has blessed us in Christ with every spiritual blessing in the heavenly places, even as he chose us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and blameless before him.

In love. He predestined us for adoption to himself as sons through Jesus Christ, according to the purpose of his will, to the praise of his glorious grace, which with which he has blessed us in the beloved in him, we have redemption through the blood, the forgiveness of our trespasses according to the riches of his great grace, which he lavished upon us in all wisdom and insight, making known to us the mystery of his will according to his purpose, which he set forth in Christ as a plan for the fullest of time to unite all things in him, things in heaven and things on earth.

And, you know, one of my favorite pastors, uh, in fact, we were just talking about him, John Sampson of King's Church in, uh, was it

Phoenix, Arizona? Uh, the way he described, I mean, us, us as children of God, all right, this grace, this grace, this glorious grace, which he lavishes us with the riches of his grace that he lavishes with us.

It's like having a bowl of ice cream. All right. And just smothering it with chocolate syrup, lavishing us, us,

God's elect us children of God, lavishing us, lavishing us with the riches of his grace that now we can boldly come before the throne of grace as children of God that we are no longer in condemnation, you know?

And, um, and so the why, you know, why is this important? Well, you know,

I want to read at the end of our, uh, catechism. Uh, I, I, I, I really do.

I want to read at the end of that. It's not in your guys's Bibles. So I'll just read through, you know, as we were systematically breaking down, um, the

Lord's prayer and what that meant. Uh, uh, and I'm talking petition upon petition, upon petition, upon petition.

He says this for yours is the kingdom and the power.

It's just, how do we conclude this prayer for yours is the kingdom and the power and the glory forever.

This means we have made all these petitions of you because you are all powerful.

King, you are both willing and able to give us all that is good. Give us the children of God.

All that is good. And because your Holy name and not we ourselves should receive all the praise forever.

And why do we end? This is the important part. This is why this is important.

Why do we say amen? It means this shall truly and surely be.

For it is much more certain that God has heard my prayer that I, I feel in my heart.

And I desire such things from him that now that when we pray to him, he says,

I hear you and I'm listening to you. You know, remember all the promises we have now received through Christ.

And I totally left my paper in the other room, but it's, I think it's a second

Corinthians where it says all the promises were fulfilled in him with a man.

Amen. Amen. So yeah, that's it. And you're

Hannes. And you said your follow up question was, well, why does it matter?

Why is it important? And that was for myself and Brayden. Oh, no.

For all three. All. So the question was his question.

Why does it matter? Why is it important? The sonship being the sonship teaching he just taught.

And I think it's important to understand that that first of all, when you speak about Jesus, he is the son of God.

He is the second person of the Godhead. And that is Jesus, the creator of all things, entered into creation.

The infinite became finite. He did so in particularly taken on flesh by becoming a

Hebrew in order to be a high priest. So in order to take the function of high priest, he had to be made like his brothers in every way.

He had to become a Hebrew and by him becoming a Hebrew, he came to his own and his own did not receive him.

But the Bible says, but to all who did receive them, to them, he gave the right to become the child of God.

You see, before this took place, every one of us were born sons of Adam, not sons of God.

All right. We are not born children of God. We're born children of the devil, sons of Adam, the offspring of Adam, the offspring of the serpent.

Jesus comes in the likeness of human flesh, lived the perfect life, died an atoning death.

And because he came and he lived this life and he died this death and he did so on our behalf, when we receive him by faith, we are given the right to become children of God.

So basically God removes this garment of Adam that clothes us when we're born and he places upon us his righteousness.

And as we all know, Jesus Christ is his righteousness. So 1

Corinthians chapter 15 explains it as Adam being the man of dust. There will be some that come out the ground clothed in the man of dust, but some will be clothed in the man of heaven.

The man of heaven being Jesus Christ. Being clothed in Christ, the man of heaven means that we have the righteousness of Christ.

And you get the righteousness of Christ the same way Abraham received righteousness by believing, by faith.

Yeah, no, I absolutely love what you said there, Haps, and I agree with everything that you just said,

Jeff. And I think it's a really important reminder that if we are by nature children of God, then there is no such thing as adoption because you can't adopt something that was naturally born to you.

And so it's so important to remember that it is only through Jesus Christ that we can have that adoption.

And so I'm really happy that you read chapter 12 of that London Baptist Confession of Faith. And it's vitally important because it is gospel centered because it has to do with Christ being our better federal head.

He's our new federal head in those ways. And it's totally gospel centered because it all has to do with what

Jesus Christ did for us and what we received through him.

And so I think Jeff had summarized why that's so important perfectly. Thank you,

Paul. Yeah, man. All right, so next question. My next question is for Pastor Brayden.

What is covenant theology and why is it important? Man, I was super excited when

I found out that that was gonna be my question. Hey, Brayden, you better answer this one correctly. I know, I'm going to go down the cut.

The Presbyterian covenant theology. Oh no, you did not. I'm not doing that.

I want to do that. Well, I think at the very surface level, we need to first define what words we're using, right?

And so when we say covenant, covenant is an agreement that's made between two or more parties.

And so to give an example of some of those kind of things is like God and Noah with flooding the world.

He made a covenant between him and Noah that said that I will not do this. And then he gave a sign. And so these signs are ways for us to remember our covenant.

And so that sign between Noah and God was the rainbow. Likewise, if you are married and anybody's watching this,

I hope you have a covenant on your ring. A sign on your ring that you made between you and your wife or your wife and your husband.

It's a covenantal sign. So that's what a covenant is.

And so I think it's important for us to remember these kind of things. So covenant theology, theology being the study and our knowing of who

God is, is that when we say we believe in covenant theology, we're saying that we see that both the

Old and New Testament are consistent in having a God that works in covenants.

And that is our systematic approach to understanding the way God deals with his people, as well as how

God works within his inner Trinitarian working. And so if I was to boil down all the covenants, if you ask different individuals, and I'll try to be as fair as I possibly can to different people that are underneath the umbrella of covenantal theology, some would say that we only have one covenant.

Some would say we have two. Some would say we have three. Some would say a lot more than that. But I think if you were to boil it down to what we could all say is true, is that we say that there's a covenant that was made before the world ever was between God the

Father and God the Son and God the Holy Spirit. And this is what's known as the eternal covenant or the covenant of redemption.

I'm really happy that Haps spoke of Ephesians chapter 2 verse 5, and I just want to read that one more time for us.

It says, He predestined us. So this is something that the Father has done. Predestined us to adoption as sons through Jesus Christ to himself according to the kind intention of his will.

Talks about the Holy Spirit a little bit later, which we won't worry about that right now. But we see that it is through the blood.

In verse 7 it says, In him we have redemption through his blood. The forgiveness of transpasses according to the riches of his grace.

So if you were to then go to, let me see here, I have another Bible open here. Hebrews chapter 13 verse 20.

Hebrews chapter 13 verse 20. It says, sorry, excuse me.

Now the God of peace who brought up from the dead the great shepherd of the sheep through the blood of the eternal covenant, even

Jesus our Lord. So now I want you to think about how that verse almost is identical to what's happening in Ephesians.

Because now God of peace, so the Father who has brought up from the dead the great shepherd,

Jesus Christ, of the sheep. Those are the ones that the Father has predestined in Ephesians chapter 2 verse 5.

Through the blood, that's verse 7, of the eternal covenant, even

Jesus our Lord. So the question at hand is any covenant that's made between man and God is not eternal.

Well, it's because there's a starting point with it. The eternal covenant is something that's taken place between the inter -trinitarian economic view of the

Trinity. So how God works. And so the Father made a covenant with, the

Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit made a covenant that the Father would predestine, the Son would become incarnate and redeemed through his blood.

And the Holy Spirit would apply the purpose of the blood into the believers or those that would be predestined to be in Jesus Christ.

Those who the Father predestined, the Holy Spirit would apply that saving grace to, that blood to.

And within that, if then if you were to draw a line that goes down, we then would say that there's two other covenants that we need to talk about that's found within the covenant of redemption or the eternal covenant.

And that is the covenant of works and the covenant of grace. Now, depending on the person that you're talking to with this, they will place their different understandings of how these different covenants have worked in the

New Testament. But just to look at this real quick, it would be, it's important to realize that the covenant of works was started or instituted in the garden.

Of every tree of the garden you can eat, but this one, unless you die, is what

God says to Adam, right? So there's this covenant made between them. And as long as Adam's able to keep these things, he's able to be in constant fellowship with God in the garden.

Well, he's quick to violate that covenant of works. And therefore, he is cast out.

He'd be our federal head. Now we partake in his nature. And if we look at the other covenants that God has done throughout the

Old Testament, we see that man has continually failed to continue to keep these covenants

God has made between him and whoever it is that is speaking of in the Old Testament.

So we see this covenant of works that is expounded upon through different incidences, events, and times throughout the

Old Testament. Now, the covenant of grace, this one specifically, we will find different wording with how different people will take this, but the covenant of grace, some would say is instituted in the garden.

Some would say it's instituted at the cross. There would be different wording on how you want to define those words and where you place the institution of those things.

I, how I would do my best to explain it is that the covenant of works was instituted in the garden and it was fulfilled in Christ.

Christ was made under the law. He was made obedient to the Father. He obeyed that which

I cannot do. He was, he lived a life I cannot live. He completed the covenant of works, which is then accredited to you in my account.

So that's why the eternal covenant is so important. So Christ fulfilled the covenant of works and those covenant works was instituted in the garden.

Now the covenant of grace, how I would do my best to word this is that it was extended in the garden through shadows, types, and promises made to Adam and other individuals.

But it was realized in the better Adam, Christ, our Lord and Savior. Once again, it is not through the blood of Adam I'm saved.

It is through the blood of our great shepherd that I'm saved, through the blood of the eternal covenant I'm saved. It is his unmerited favor, his grace that I receive that that is that covenant that I am then partaking of.

So the, some of the examples of the shadows that I would say that we see specifically in the garden and why

I say it was, was realized or not realized, but extended to the garden is there's many shadows that we see in there.

The London Baptist confession of faith actually says that it, it's first made mention of in the seed, the promise that the

God says to, to the serpent that the seed of the woman will crush your head.

And that seed is then also talked about by Abraham's seed that through his seed, that there'll be this, this great and large number of prosperity that will be greater than the stars.

And so then we would see in Galatians chapter three, verse six, even so Abraham believed in God reckoned him as righteous reckoned to him as righteousness.

And then verse, I'm just going to read a couple in here. I love Galatians chapter three.

Let's see, where is that? Verse 16 Galatians three 16. Now the promises were spoken to Abraham and his seed.

He does not say and to seeds as referring to Matt and many, but rather to one and to your seed that is

Christ. Now, I do agree that that's the first promise that we see from God speaking to a person or an individual such as the serpent as promising this covenant of grace.

But as we would see in Ephesians chapter four, that the marriage, both the husband and the wife represent

Christ and the church. We see that the first marriage took place in the garden,

Adam and Eve. So even before there was a fall, there was a promise of a covenant of grace between Christ and the church,

Adam and Eve. You would also see that it is through the fall of them, not obedient to the tree that then

Christ has to be crucified on the cursed tree. So we see these shadows and types that take place all throughout the

Old Testament. There's far too many to even make mention of. But once again, it is realized both the covenant of works and the covenants of grace are completely realized, completed, made factual.

I don't know what other wording you want to say, but that was alone in Jesus Christ. Now, the important thing that we need to take note of is that covenantal theology is not held by all

Christians. And so the other popular view is what's called dispensational dispensationalism.

And so some of the biggest differences between dispensationalism and covenantal theology is that dispensationalists would say that they would view the

Old Testament and the New Testament as being God working with different groups of people in different time periods differently.

Now, they would also say that the church age that we're in right now, the first church started in Acts chapter 2.

They would also say that there's going to be a future day that there will be a physical

Israel that is redeemed. Some of these kind of wordings. But some of the biggest differences between covenantal theology and dispensationalism is that covenantal theology people would say that the church began actually in the garden because the church is a group of believers.

And that that was carried out throughout the true Israel, the remnant, the daughters of Zion, the sons of Abraham. And that the true

Israel is all those that believe, Galatians chapter 3, verse 16, like we just saw. And that the Holy Spirit has always indwelt people, but has made himself specially manifest in the way of showing that a new revelation was valid by God.

But that the Holy Spirit was indwelling people in a regeneration way prior than Acts chapter 2.

Dispensationalists would say indwelling only happened in Acts chapter 2. And it wasn't ever like that prior where I'm saying it's always been like that.

And God has validated himself through different ways of the administration of gifts through the times.

Can I ask the question Pastor Brady? So the indwelling of the

Holy Spirit prior to Christ, his ministry, crucifixion, and then

Acts chapter 2, you have the church, all who are believing. So it's not like a retroactive salvific work on the part.

Okay, for instance, the Jewish people that died, that were saved, where did they go?

To heaven? I believe that they were worshiping God wherever that place was. That blood of the eternal covenant covered them.

And the way I would try my best to describe this in analogy terms is one is paid on credit where the other is paid on debit.

The blood was extended. That's why I chose that word. It was extended back to the garden, but it was realized in Jesus.

And that's the best way I would do my best. Because how Abraham was reckoned righteousness in Genesis chapter 15, that is many, many years before the cross.

How could he be reckoned righteousness when Jesus Christ had not yet been born and lived the life that he could not live?

It had to have been through a extending of that future reality of Jesus Christ becoming incarnate.

I hope that helps. It helps perfectly. Thank you so much. Yeah, just to chime in on that for a second because covenant theology is my thing.

I think I would have said things just a little bit different personally.

Like I would point out that in Genesis 315, the promise to us, but the curse to the serpent, that it was only a promise.

Yes. So it was only a promise. The promise was that an offspring would come from the woman and that he would bruise the head of the serpent while only bruising his heel.

So the fulfillment would be bruising the head of the serpent. So if this is the covenant of grace, all 15 is as a promise.

And the inauguration takes place when the offspring that comes from the woman bruises the head of the serpent while only bruising his heel.

So this would have been at the crucifixion. And so all types and shadows, I would not say that they are a part of the covenant of grace, but that they are pointing to something that's coming.

So when Abraham was saved, he was saved because of what

Christ did on the cross. That the blood of Christ was sufficient past, present at his time and future past our time.

However long time exists for anyone that's saved, they're saved because of what Christ has done on the cross by believing

God. Abraham believed God and what he believed about God was pointing to a land and an offspring that would bless the nations.

Jesus kept the law, earned the land, and it's through him that the nations are blessed through Abraham.

So everything is about Jesus, but the new covenant is the covenant of grace is how

I would say it. The covenant of grace is not in the old covenant, and that's where I would differ with the

Presbyterians. Yeah, yes, absolutely. Absolutely. And I was going to talk a little bit more about that in Romans chapter three.

It says that was Romans chapter three or Romans chapter four. Excuse me, Romans chapter four, verse 10 on previously in verse two, it says,

For if Abraham was justified by works, he has something to boast about.

And the works that are being spoke of in here is circumcision. He has something to boast about, but not before God.

For what does the scripture say? And Abraham believed God and it was reckoned to him as righteousness.

And then down in verse 10, how then is it? Was it reckoned while he was circumcised or uncircumcised?

Not while circumcised, but while uncircumcised. And he received the sign of circumcision, a seal for the righteousness of faith, which he had while uncircumcised, that he might be the father of all who believe without being circumcised, that righteousness might be reckoned to them.

And so once again, righteousness comes through Christ living the life that I cannot live and having faith in what he has done, the finished work of him on the cross.

And that was extended even to Abraham who believed God and was reckoned righteousness.

And the New Testament is absolutely the covenant of grace. We see Christ everywhere on that text.

That is through him alone that we have that access, that unmerited favor of God. I hope that clarifies some stuff for you.

Yes, it did. Thank you so much. Also, I would also add, like when you were talking, it made me think about this because some denominations believe that, again, our

Presbyterian brothers believe that the covenant of works was only with Adam in the garden and that the covenant of grace began at Genesis 315 and that all other covenants are an administration of the covenant of grace.

But if the covenant of grace ended at Genesis 315, then how did

Christ come and fulfill the covenant of works if it ended? If the covenant of works ended in Genesis 315, how did

Christ come and fulfill the covenant of works? It makes no sense. It makes no sense.

Anyways, I won't get harping on that right now. Speaking on that, that's where we start dividing between Presbyterians and Baptists, Reformed Baptists specifically.

I just recently read a book by Pastor Happy Gummy, The Mystery of Christ by Samuel Renahan.

And that more or less, Pastor Rice, yeah, I just finished that book and more or less holds to what you're talking about,

Pastor Rice, of the covenant of works. You got the covenant of creation, the kingdom, the king and his creation.

Then you have the kingdom of Israel and then you have the kingdom of Christ.

But the covenant of works goes from Adam all the way through David. And then

Christ comes and fulfills all the types, the shadows, the illusions, all those types.

The covenant of grace had always extended back towards Israel.

And each of the old covenants, I think that's how you would say it. There was always something that was pronounced for them to accomplish that them and themselves in their flesh could not accomplish.

Jesus at his coming accomplishes what they could not accomplish. He is the greater

Adam. He is the greater Abraham, the greater Moses, the greater

David, the greater Solomon. He fulfilled where they failed. And that's why

I was really trying to use my wording carefully in there when I said that. It's tough. It is tough. So in the

Old Testament in the garden is where I say that covenant of works was instituted.

Complete at the cross, complete in Christ. That's where it meets its completion was in Christ.

The covenant of grace was extended. If you had to look at the cross, it was extended back to those that are in the

Old Testament that die, having faith in the work of what Christ is going to do. Now we have the better Adam.

We have the more sure word today that we can now look and see Jesus Christ in those ways.

Okay, I got a technical question for any one of you. Okay, so I'm really glad you brought up Galatians.

What was it, three? Yes. Okay, so I'm not trying to be a heretic and I'm not trying to be...

No one tries to be a heretic. Okay, it might sound at least a hyper historical grammatical or what have you, and not redemptive historical in terms of perspective.

But okay, so look Galatians chapter 3, 19.

Oh, pardon. Okay, no, in the inheritance comes 18 by the law.

It no longer comes by promise, but God gave it to Abraham by a promise. Why then the law?

Okay, what is it? Oh, I'm sorry, verse 15. To give a human example, brothers, even with a man -made covenant, no one annuls it or adds to it once it has been ratified.

Now the promises were made to Abraham and to his offspring. Okay, this is apostolic interpretation of the

Old Testament. He says, it does not say to offsprings, referring to many, but referring to one, and to your offspring who is

Christ. And so I looked at that Old Testament verse. I'm having a hard time seeing how

Paul gets that because I think it's 15 .6. Genesis 15 .6.

Yeah, I just preached on this not long ago. Let me get there. Am I reading this wrong?

But to me, if I'm taking this literally, he's talking about Canaan, and he's talking about multiplicity of offspring.

And I'm not trying to be like – No, it's a good question. And I think he talks about it in Romans too, doesn't he?

Or no, I think I'm wrong. Oh, no, no, 15.

This man shall be – 15 what?

I can't find it. Okay, yeah. And he believed. Yeah, so it's 15 .5,

I believe. Let me check mine. So shall your offspring be –

It's whichever verse that is that he's referencing. Let me find my concordance or my reference thing.

Please. It's Genesis 15, verse 5.

Genesis 12 .7 is the quotation, right?

Yes, sir. To your offspring I will give this land. Yeah, yeah, okay. So what we were talking about earlier with Genesis 3 .15,

there was an offspring that would come from the woman. This offspring is passed through the line of Abraham.

So ultimately, the offspring is Christ. Jesus is

Israel. He is the greater Israel. They had to keep the law to live in the land.

A part of Jesus fulfilling the law was that he earned the land.

That's why the Bible can correctly say, the meek shall inherit the earth. All right, so the covenant of works, if Adam would have kept the covenant, he would have earned eternal life for himself by eating of the tree of life and for his posterity.

Okay. Correct? Correct. He did not keep it, so he was removed from the garden.

He was removed from the tree of life. His dying is not a lightning bolt coming down and striking him, but it's removing him from the thing that will cause him to live forever, the tree of life.

Oh. All right. Makes sense. All right. The Jews were told to live in the land, keep the law.

Adam was told, keep the law, live forever.

Jews were told, keep the law, live in the land. Jesus comes. He keeps the covenant of works. He earns eternal life for all those who put their faith in him.

Jesus comes, keeps the law, and he earns the land. The meek shall inherit the earth.

He is the greater Israel. He is the offspring by whom all the nations of the world will be blessed.

You and I today, we're blessed. Why? Because the Jews kept the law? No. No, sir. Because AG, the greater

Jew, Jesus Christ, kept the law. He is the ultimate fulfillment.

See, Abraham received his promise according to Genesis chapter,

I mean, Hebrews chapter, well, don't get me thinking.

But Abraham received his promise. His promise was Isaac was a fulfillment of the promise that God gave him.

But there was a greater promise that the whole world will be blessed through him. And that seed, that offspring that the whole world will be blessed through is through Christ.

And actually, Joshua could not give them rest, Hebrews tells us.

They were supposed to enter the land of Canaan. They didn't because of the disobedience. God crushes them, raises up their children, sends them into the land.

But they did not receive rest because it was a greater rest to come. It was a greater

Sabbath to come. And this is where Jesus Christ is. So all things are pointing to Christ.

There's nothing in Scripture that doesn't, these promises, these blessings that don't point to Christ.

So the offspring is the fact that it passed from the woman to Abraham.

And notice the contrast to it. The serpent has offsprings. And this is what we would call the children of Adam.

This is what we are, right? Before we come to Christ, we are children of Adam.

We are offspring of the serpent. Sons of hell. Children of wrath.

Yeah. And that's why when you asked earlier, sonship was so important.

That we go from being clothed in Adam's unrighteousness to being clothed in the righteousness of Christ.

There's so much typology in the Old Testament. I mean, the land points to Christ.

The person pointed to Christ. The promise pointed to Christ. It all is fulfilled in Jesus Christ.

It is all fulfilled in Him. If you don't see Jesus Christ on your Old Testament page, you're not reading it. And you know what?

And also Jesus said it in Luke 24. He said everything written in the

Psalms, the prophets, and the law must be fulfilled. And then He opened up their minds to understand the

Scriptures. They were speaking about Him. Yeah, everything. One of the things we really love to do out here is to go through and see all these typologies and all these foreshadows.

And it's this crisis. The Old Testament is so saturated in Christ.

You just see it. I think one of my favorite things is that I've ever seen.

Can I just say it real fast? Am I interrupting something? No, go ahead. We're just coming up on 47 minutes.

I just want to make everybody aware of how long people are able to stay. You only get two minutes to be able to answer your question,

Jeff. Yeah, but it's fine. Let's hear it. Come on, Pastor House.

So it was, you know, here they take

Christ and they put Him in the tomb. The soldiers come.

They seal it. We know that the children of Israel are wanting

Him. They wanted Him dead. They're accusing Him of all kinds of stuff. According to the law, not only to their law, but also towards Caesar.

Because he's saying that He is Lord. And then you go into, I think, what is it? It's in Daniel where He gets thrown into the lion's den.

And they come and they put a seal on it. And, you know, as you know, throughout history and everything, what happened to Israel is that they were broken and scattered.

And the same thing happened when He came out of the lion's den that was sealed with the king's signature stuff.

I mean, the signet ring. Where He came out and here He breaks them and scatters them abroad.

And then He sends a letter out. All right. He sends a letter out to all the nations speaking of giving glory to God's kingdom and everything.

And then we see that all happening in the book of Acts where these letters go out. And I just think that I find that fascinating, you know, just absolutely fascinating.

It's all over the place, man. That's my favorite one though. That's a good one. That's a good one.

Yeah. Thanks for sharing, brother. My last question would be for Pastor Rice.

And I kind of already asked you this before, but for a better or fuller explanation, what is partial preterism?

Why is it important? Well, I mean, just give me the hard one.

Well, so if you just look at preterism, you know, the word preter, it's

Latin for past. And so every Christian, in one sense, is a preterist.

And I believe every true Christian is a futurist, right?

So we all believe that there's parts of the Bible that have been fulfilled.

There's prophecy. So the Old Testament prophesied about the coming of Jesus, the first coming.

Well, he has already come. Like, you know, this is a past event.

So if you believe in the incarnation of the Son of God, Jesus Christ, his death, burial, and resurrection, like if you believe in that, well, then you are a preterist.

You believe something that's been fulfilled in our past, correct?

Yes, sir. And if you believe in a future coming of Jesus Christ, like I do, then you are a futurist.

So if you believe that there is an appointed day when the

Lord Jesus Christ will put his two feet on the earth again, Hebrews 9 tells us not to deal with sin.

You know, this will be what the Bible calls the last day, the resurrection of the dead.

Then you are a futurist. So every Christian is a partial preterist and a futurist.

So there's a lot of people that claim the name of Christ who don't believe in a future coming of Christ.

They believe that all the events in the Bible took place, and the culmination of this happened in 70

A .D. So this is what you would call a full preterist or a hyper preterist.

And I have friends, you know, a lot of, not all, but a lot of churches of Christ have fallen into this idea of full preterism.

Now, I would call myself a partial preterist, but I would say that I'm a lot more preterist than other

Christian brothers of mine because you also have what's called an idealist.

And my good brother, my all -male friend here, Brayden, Brayden is a futurist, he's a preterist, and he's an idealist.

Like he's all three of those things. Is he a partial preterist or a full preterist? Well, yeah, he's a futurist also.

So if he's a futurist, he can't be a full preterist. Thank goodness. I want to be a Christian if I was a full preterist.

Oh, yes. I was waiting for that one. And so, like,

I think the big thing with it, you know, like, you know, with Christians today, it's kind of like Matthew 24, 25, 26, and all this stuff, and then the book of Revelation, like I believe that my brother

Brayden here, he's a partial preterist in Matthew 24 to a certain point. Like we haven't got to walk through it together yet, and I haven't got to, you know, show him what's up yet.

But, I mean, that's something that we do plan to take place, because me and Brayden, we love to debate.

We love each other, but we love to, you know, have a friendly debate also. I love being right.

I love being right. You're so humble. You're so humble. You know, you know, in your head.

I also like being corrected, though, so I won't say that. Yeah, you're spiritually, you know, in your head, correct?

Yeah, that's right. That's right. But I think in Revelation, the book of Revelation gives us a good idea of what's taking place here in this book.

And let me get a sip of water real quick. Now, I know a lot of people will go to chapter 1, verses 1 through 3, and they'll look at the time indicators soon, quickly, and stuff like that.

But since we're just talking about preterism, like, you know, it being the word preter for past, the

Latin word for past, Revelation chapter 1, verse 19 says this. So this is the angel.

This is John is being told what's right.

So verse 19, I'm going to try to stay in verse 19 and not read anywhere else for right now. It says, right.

Therefore, so he's been told what's right, right. Therefore, the things that you have seen.

So this is past. Those that are present.

So those that those that you have seen, you know, this is in your past. This would have been a preter to him.

Those that are this would have been in his present tense. And those that are to take place.

So this would have been that those that are to take place is his future tense. So they sort of write down three things.

Those that have those that you have seen. So his past. OK, those that are his present, which would be our past.

So there's two things that are in our past that we know for sure. The things that were in his past and the things that were in his present are our past.

Correct? Yes. So on those two things, we have to say that we're preterist. There should be any argument.

All right. And it gives one thing right here. And it says and and those that are to take place.

Now, the question is, is how much of the stuff that were to take place in his future has already taken place?

OK, I would say probably a whole lot, in my opinion.

OK. And so when I read Scripture, I don't

I don't read Scripture with, you know, back in the 90s, 80s and 90s.

It'd be like with a newspaper in my hand. But I read Scripture using the

Old Testament and the whole Bible to make my interpretations. You see what

I'm saying? So when I read in chapter, let's say chapter one verse.

Well, you know, just to get some people excited, let's go to a prophecy.

So when I read in Revelation chapter 11, so Revelation chapter 11, it talks about the two witnesses that are prophesying at the temple.

All right. So right here is prophesying at the temple. So I'm taking it as this is the temple that was then standing.

Now, was this his past, those things that were or was this his present or was this his future?

All right. Now, now, now, in here and in verse, let's see, verse four, it says, well, hold on.

Okay. Verse three, it says, and I will grant authority to my two witnesses and they will prophesy for one thousand two hundred and sixty days clothed in sackcloth.

How many witnesses? Two. Two. All right. Now, listen, verse four.

These are the two olive trees and the two lampstands. Hold up. I thought it said it was two witnesses.

Because now two then became four. Okay. The two witnesses are two olive trees and two lampstands.

Well, is it two or is it four? All right. So right here, we get a good sense that this is symbolic.

I know Brandon's smiling now. He said, yeah, that's my kind of language. I like it.

But notice what it says. I mean, I mean, if you read Zachariah, you're pretty key to understand that the olive tree normally represents

Israel. All right. But but then right here in chapter I mean, chapter 11.

Excuse me. Chapter 11, verse four. It's it. It it says.

And the two lamp says that these these are the two olive trees and the two lampstands that stand before the

Lord of the earth. All right. Well, all you got to do is go back to chapter one. The very last verse.

Verse 20. It says for the mystery of the seven stars that are that you saw in my right hand and the mystery of the seven golden lampstands.

The seven stars are the seven angels of the church and the seven lampstands are the seven churches.

So the book of Revelation is calling the church's lampstands. And right here in chapter 11, we have two witnesses and they are the two olive trees and the two lampstands.

And so I would see this as being the Jewish church. And we know that the

Jewish church was in Jerusalem. Right. And you read the book of Acts.

What were they doing? Prophesying. What happened to them? They got persecuted.

They died. You see what I'm saying? And so and so I'm reading this and just using the

Bible and when they give me the interpretation, I already know that it's speaking super hyperbole. Two.

Comes to four real quick. The two witnesses are the two lampstands, which are four. You see what

I'm saying? Yes. And so I'm just using the Bible to interpret the Bible. So when I see this, I see the

Jewish church there that I believe would have been in his past.

I don't believe that this is speaking of his future. I believe that this would have been in his past. OK. And so, again, we can go to all different kind of text.

When it's when it's dealing with, you know, the the coming of the son of man, was that future or or was that speaking of his his literal future second coming?

Or is that speaking of something else? And I would say that speaking of something else, because he's in their presence, that they have the physical

Jesus in their presence. And they asked him, when can we expect your your presence?

Well, he's already there with him, but they're asking him, when can they expect his presence?

Could I say something? Oh, excuse me. Hold on. Meaning that even in their mind, this the second coming that they're talking about is not his physical coming, that it's something else.

Yeah, go ahead. So, you know, another thing, Hannes, you know, when it comes to partial and full preterism, what the full preterists really like to do is so they they will go to Daniel chapter 12, where God is.

I mean, Daniel's asking God, hey, you know, when when's the end? It's about the time of the end.

All right. And he starts asking him, you know, like, when are these things going to happen?

And in 12 for he says, but you, Daniel, shut up the words and seal this book until the time of the end.

Many shall run to and fro and knowledge will increase. Well, they'll take this passage and they'll go to the very end of Revelation.

All right. And the very end of Revelation in 20 to 10, as it's describing all these events and everything.

And they'll say. And he said to me, do not seal up the words of the prophecy of this book for the time is near.

It's at hand. All right. Yes. So to chime in, I would say that the book of Daniel is completely fulfilled.

Oh, yeah. And as I would say with that. But but I think what the full preterists mess up is when it talks about the resurrection of the dead in the book of Daniel is not the resurrection of the dead that we see in First Corinthians.

But it's more or less the the the resurrection of our spiritual adoptions.

As Ephesians tells us that that, you know, we were dead in our trespasses and sins.

But now we have been. Let me let me find the verse. I don't want to. Would that more like explain the two resurrections that I mentioned in Revelation associated one with.

Well, the first resurrection in Revelation is Jesus's resurrection. And my and my understanding in the second resurrection will take place at the last day when

Christ comes back. But the resurrection that's speaking of and Daniel, it's basically speaking of because at this time, only the

Jews. I mean, like the Jews weren't weren't children of God, but they were

God's earthly chosen covenant people. All right. Jesus came to his earthly chosen covenant people.

He took on the flesh, the ethnicity of his chosen ethic, earthly covenant people.

Right. All right. We as Gentiles, we had no part in that.

And so and then so and so. And so my understanding would be that. Let me.

Do y 'all know what verse I'm talking about? Where someone sitting in the sentence in heavenlies, I believe it's. Yeah.

Yeah. OK, I got right here. So let's just go to verse. You know,

I'm going to read chapter two all the way to chapter seven. I mean, chapter two.

Well, one through seven. OK, we're doing it. All right. This is all night.

And you are dead in your trespasses and sins in which you once walked following the course of this world, following the prince and the power of the air.

This the spirit that is now at work in the sons of disobedience, among whom we all once lived in the passions of our flesh, carrying out the desires of the body.

And the mind, we were by nature children of wrath like the rest of mankind.

But God being rich in mercy because of the great love in which he loved us, even when we were dead in our trespasses, made us alive together with Christ.

By grace, you have been saved and right here and raised us up with him and sit at us with him in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus, so that in the coming ages we might be the the immeasurable riches.

It was grace and kindness toward us in Christ Jesus. So. Whenever Daniel chapter 12 starts talking about a resurrection, this is what

I believe it's speaking about, that whenever you and I hear the gospel, we're given faith to believe we're granted repentance.

We have been reborn. We have been born again. We are seated.

We have been we were dead in our trespasses and sins. We were made alive and we are seated with him in the heavenlies.

Like this is something that's happened to us in a way that we cannot see.

But that visual, the reality of what's happened, spiritual will take place at the final resurrection.

Second resurrection. Does that make sense? And so it's kind of like an already, but not yet.

Yeah. Yeah. If you guys ever think, you know, that maybe Gary DeMar, Gary DeMar is like a closet full preterist, sounds like it sometimes.

Well, I believe he might be going that way. I'm not for sure. I know him somewhat.

Well, I haven't really talked to him personally. I know he does have a lot of friends that are full preterist.

And I know that he does. He would not. He wouldn't say that a full preterist is committing heresy.

Yeah. So I think a lot has to do with it for me because I have some full preterist friends.

And every full preterist I know personally is from the

Church of Christ. All right. And 99 % of them, all churches of Christ, 99 % of those churches of Christ wouldn't consider us brothers.

I do have some Church of Christ friends that would consider us brothers. But for the most part, churches of Christ would not consider us

Christians. That's really interesting. I didn't know that. I didn't know that either. I know of one

Church of Christ that I attended one Sunday, and they didn't hold firmly to a baptismal regeneration.

And they, from my understanding, are dispensational premillennialists as far as the people

I've talked to individually there. So that's really interesting. Well, it's not over the board because I have a

Church of Christ friend that I grew up with. He's a Church of Christ pastor now, and he's definitely premillennial dispensational.

But for the most part, full preterism, it's in the Church of Christ denomination.

And it's kind of taken on a life of itself also, like they don't even claim a church.

They're just kind of like people that read the Bible and argue with folks online. Yeah. That's it.

Well, we live in the new heavens and new earth today, baby. We're good to go then. Well, I mean, again, I would agree with that part.

Because like in Matthew chapter 5, it talks about the new heavens and the heaven and earth passing away.

And I understand that to be from Revelation chapter 21, Israel, the

Jerusalem, and then the new heaven and the new earth is the bride of Christ. You and I, we're the bride of Christ.

The church is the bride of Christ. The bride of Christ is on earth. So we are the new Jerusalem. But we are in our infancy.

So the new heavens and the new earth, although they're here through the church, it hasn't been fully consummated, if that makes sense.

No, no, I know what you mean. I was given full prejudice. It's just a hard time with that.

Yeah, but they believe that it's consummated. Oh, yeah. Like it's done. Yeah. That's what

I was making fun of. So what's here is what's here. And it will always be this way.

That sucks. Ain't no hope there. Any follow up questions about that?

No, thank you. That was wonderful. Thank you so much. You know, it's getting late,

Jeff and Abs and Hannes. I think it would be cool if we did this again with you, Hannes. And we had him come back and ask those more open questions, not necessarily formatted questions.

You know what I mean? So then you can still get those individual questions out that you were wanting to ask. Because I really enjoyed this.

I like the shooting from the hip. Yeah. That's what I told him. I go, shoot from the hip, dude. I definitely have more questions for you guys.

If you're willing to come back on and ask some more questions, we'd love to have you next week if you want to do that. Yes, please.

Please, please, and please. All right. And again, for all those that watch us and if you have any questions or maybe you want to jump on here one evening and ask your questions personally and dialogue with us, we'd love to do that.

We're open for stuff like that. So just contact either Brayden, myself, or Haps, and we'll make it happen.

Boom. Thank you all for your time. All right. Any last words from you guys?

Glorify God and enjoy him forever. Yeah. What a great day to look at God's word and just see him so clearly described.

Yeah. Amen. Amen. Well, as always, I like to close it out like this.

If you're not a part of a biblical church, I pray that you will find a biblical church in your area.

And if there is no biblical church in your area, that you will either move to Brayden's area, you will move to my area, you will move to Haps' area, and we'd love to plug you in.

That's right. We love nothing more than a fellowship. Let me just hand rest this beat out.

I'ma find it. It's a Bible song for him. Peace. Peace.