Street Witnessing in Tempe Arizona to 3 LDS Members

Apologia Studios

Subscribe

Download

Share

00

00:09

For example, as Christians we believe that Jesus was

00:14

God. He was God in human flesh. He is God who became a man. Who lived among us. He has been the eternal

00:20

God. But Mormonism says that Jesus was God's firstborn son.

00:27

That he literally was the literal firstborn son of God. And he literally came into being at one point in time.

00:34

He was an eternal God. And that literally... And also that him and Satan are brothers.

00:41

But the only problem is as Christians... Well here's the thing actually.

00:47

The Bible says that Jesus created all things. Including Satan. That's a problem though.

00:54

Because if Satan was... If Jesus and Satan are brothers according to Mormonism then according to actually

01:03

Colossians 1 It talks about Christ. It says all things have been created by Christ and for Christ.

01:09

Whether it be thrones, powers, principalities or powers. That Christ created all those things including

01:14

Satan. So there's another big example of a difference. And another big thing too is that the

01:22

Bible says that God is spirit. But in Doctrine and Covenants I think it's section...

01:27

Like in the quad I think. I think it's section... Do you read the Bible? Yes I have. What book?

01:33

What's that? I've never read the Doctrine and Covenants before. Great stuff. A little rusty on it though.

01:39

Do you like a religion major or something? No I just... I'm just curious like why you... I went to a school that was 95 %

01:46

LDS. What school? Heritage Academy. Oh yeah. Yeah. So I got really challenged and I had a lot of discussion.

01:54

Even for example when you talk about what salvation is. Like the terminology he was using.

02:00

In Mormonism it says that Christ died... In Christianity we say

02:05

Christ died for the unjust. For people who are sinners. But in Mormonism it says...

02:10

The Old English Church teaches that Christ died for Adam's sin. In fact there's a verse in the Book of Mormon that says...

02:16

Christ died for Adam that all men might be. What that means is that he died for universal salvation.

02:24

Which guarantees that every single person will be resurrected on the last day. But everything else...

02:31

As far as any salvation within the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter -day Saints. You have to go to either the celestial or terrestrial kingdom.

02:38

And that requires going through the rituals and temple ordinances and all those things. But the whole purpose of the

02:44

Mormon gospel isn't just about getting reconciled to God. It's about following those ordinances in order to become the

02:51

God of the day. Of your own planet. As Christians we believe in a completely different gospel. Here's the thing.

02:58

As a Christian I love LDS people. I love the LDS community. I say we're loving and caring.

03:04

But I would say that... With all my heart. Mormonism is...

03:10

They're wonderful people. I plan on going to the polls voting for Mitt Romney. For example. I think... Wonderful family.

03:16

Wonderful people. But when it comes down to... The Bible warns about certain things.

03:22

It warns about another gospel. There's false teachings.

03:28

There's false gospels. In fact there's even going to be other Jesuses. Besides the

03:33

Jesus of the Bible. In fact there's a verse in 2 Corinthians 11. That says if anyone comes unto you and preaches to you another

03:40

Jesus. Or another spirit wandering through you. You have not known. Don't speak. Don't follow after him.

03:46

And what we believe is that... The LDS church. And the LDS people.

03:51

That you guys believe in a false gospel. In a false Jesus. Because God's word is inherent.

03:59

And the way that God reveals himself in a certain way. The same way as if you...

04:08

You're married? Okay. Look at this example. In your marriage relationship.

04:14

There's certain things about your husband that you know about him. There's certain things that he knows about you. Right? So that's part of having a relationship.

04:23

You have to go by... You have to define... The relationship is based on who they are. And who they reveal themselves to be.

04:30

So in the Bible God reveals himself a certain way. For example.

04:36

You're talking about there being many gods. Or many gods versus like only being one God. There's a verse in the book of Isaiah.

04:44

Isaiah 43 times. That says hear my witnesses says the Lord. The servant whom

04:49

I have chosen. And this that I say to you now. That you may know that I am he. He says before me there was no

04:56

God formed. Neither shall there be after. That's what the God of the Bible says.

05:02

There's one of the teachings that Joseph Smith had. It's called the King Follett funeral discourse. And you can look this up online.

05:08

This is one of the teachings that Joseph Smith taught. He said that you have said. Ismael said to you that there is only one

05:17

God. He goes I would refute that idea. So you may know. I'm going to pull back the curtains that you may see.

05:23

And he says that there are many. He says I'm going to preach. I'm paraphrasing it too.

05:29

He says I'm going to preach in the plurality of gods. And he goes on to attack the Christian faith. Saying that they're completely wrong.

05:35

And that there's numerous gods. In fact there's one of the four man prophets. Lorenzo Stone.

05:41

He had a quote that says as God once was. As God is man once was. And as God is man may become.

05:49

So here's the thing. When God reveals himself in scripture. And the whole idea with the

05:54

Christian gospel. It's about having. It's being separated from God. Because of your sin. But the whole purpose of the gospel.

06:01

Isn't just about having your sins forgiven. It's about getting to God. And having a relationship with him.

06:06

But God reveals himself in a certain way. That says I'm the

06:12

Lord. And there's only one God. God says is there another God besides me? I know not any.

06:17

So when all of a sudden someone comes. And claims to be from God. Like a prophet.

06:23

For example the bible actually gives. An actual test for a prophet. I don't know if you know this.

06:31

But it's in Deuteronomy. God says that if there arises among you a prophet.

06:37

Or a dreamer of dreams. And even if he prophesies stuff. Even if he gets them right. I know there's like prophecies that Joseph Smith gave.

06:47

Obama bro. Speaking of politics. Where was

06:55

I? The prophet Deuteronomy. Yeah. So he says that even if he comes by.

07:04

And he predicts the future. And he gets stuff right. But he says okay. Now let's go after other gods.

07:11

It says do not go after him. For he is the holy prophet. So when I was talking about the idea of relationship.

07:18

That if your husband said. You know about who he is. He goes I'm this this this. And you go no.

07:25

No you're not. When you start saying about things that weren't true about him. It wouldn't be consistent with having a good relationship.

07:33

And the idea is that. God reveals himself in a certain way.

07:39

And so when you look at. Like I said going back to. Battery. That's okay.

07:44

Keep on going. So Joseph Smith comes out and says those things. Then we look at what the bible says.

07:52

In response to how God reveals himself. It's something completely different. It's something completely different.

07:58

So as Christians we have to say. We love you guys. One of the. What's important is that.

08:03

The first commandment. One of the ten commandments. One of the first ones is that. You should not have any gods before me.

08:11

But it also says you should not make a graven image. You should not make something. You should not make any idols.

08:17

But. Well if you don't realize. It's not just like before me. Like an idol or a statue. Like that'd be kind of weird.

08:24

If we all started doing that right now. We might be finding it out. We're not going to make it a whole lot. But. The idea is that like when.

08:31

You. At the same time. When we come up with an idea of God. That's not who he is in the bible.

08:38

That's. It's basically his ideology. And I would say this to you guys. Like it's holy life.

08:44

It's sincerity. That. What the mormon church believes about God. And believes about Jesus.

08:50

One of the moral people. But it's a knowledge. Because God reveals himself in a very specific way.

08:56

In the scripture. But the mormon church does not. Does not believe that. They preach something that's completely different.

09:05

Have you been to mormon church? Yes. Have you? How many times? Like the whole thing? I've been to. Yeah. I've been to some of the mormon churches.

09:12

Yeah. I've been down to. I've been down to the temple. I've been. To the visitor center.

09:18

Yes. Any of the. Huh? Yeah. Have you watched like the Joseph Smith video? Or like the ones about Christ?

09:25

Yeah. Have you been there at Christmas time? Hm? Do you watch like the birth and whatnot? Um. I watch.

09:31

Or like baby. Like the birth and Christ. I usually don't go in there. Usually as a church we actually go there. Within the church.

09:37

Are you protesting? No. Not protesting. Yeah. Yeah. Having discussions like we are now. Come let's reason together.

09:43

Okay. And let me make this point too. Is that. Something that came to mind too. Is that the whole.

09:49

The central story. Of the LDS church. Is that. In the 1800s. There's a boy named

09:55

Joseph Smith. He saw all the churches arguing. They weren't sure which church was true. Right? They weren't sure which church was true.

10:02

He went out to pray. And then. Got beaten down. And said. All the other churches.

10:08

Are wrong. We need to form. The true church. And so the central piece.

10:13

Uh. Here's the thing. Is that we're. Christians aren't necessarily. I mean. Of course. There's people that are going to be out there.

10:19

That are unloving. And will say. I've seen them out there. Who say like hateful things. About the Mormon church.

10:25

I don't. I don't think that at all. Right? But. At the same time.

10:31

Um. The whole. Premise. Christians going out. Like reaching out. To the LDS community.

10:37

And standing up. And like. Pointing these things out. Isn't so much more an attack. Than more of like a response.

10:44

To what the LDS church has said. About other churches. The whole. The whole foundation. Of the LDS church.

10:50

Is that. All the other Christian churches. And everything else. I mean. God tells

10:55

Joseph Smith. According to Mormonism. That all the creeds are corrupt. That all. Their creeds are an abomination.

11:01

Not alive in my sight. All. All of them are corrupt. And don't go after any of them. Because they're going to do wrong.

11:07

So can I ask you. Like why. Yeah. When you come and you protest. Like what are you. Trying.

11:12

Are you trying to convince people. Not to be Mormon? Are you. Like what. I'm just wondering what your point is. The whole purpose.

11:17

Is. We don't. Like. When we go out there. To talk to anyone. And we're not talking. We're not going out there.

11:24

To say hey. You're wrong. I'm right. You're wrong. End of conversation. That's not. That's not the purpose of it.

11:30

The whole. The purpose of it. Is that. That God. That we want.

11:36

People to understand. What the real gospel is. That. That. We are completely.

11:41

Separated from God. And that. We're sinners. And we. It's not just about. We're like. We need to be reconciled.

11:47

Because we're. In God's shape. Because we're broken. God's commandments. But. Only. Only. In John 17.

11:56

There's a story. When Christ is praying to the Father. There's a verse. Where Christ says. Oh. He says.

12:02

This is the eternal life. He goes. This is the eternal life. To know. The only true God. In Christ.

12:08

Whom you have sent. So it's not. Just. The fact. That. Um. It's not just.

12:15

We want to say. Hey. You know. You're wrong or whatever. But. We want. The LDS people to say.

12:20

No. Only. A false Christ. Can't save you from your sins. You need to be reconciled to God.

12:26

As he reveals himself. In scripture. Because the Mormon gospel. Can't save you. And. I'll tell you this.

12:32

Like we know. Tons of people. Who we've had. Great conversations with. And this is the thing.

12:37

As a Christian. Like what I believe. Is that. Each. Every single person. Apart from the grace of God.

12:43

Is completely dead in their sins. So. In no way. Am I. Do I have the ability. To convince anyone.

12:49

Or anybody of anything. All we do is. We preach the gospel out. And. God sometimes.

12:55

Will move. And he'll. Work in the spirit. And he'll choose to save some. And to others. You know.

13:00

Their hearts get parted. But. But to answer your question. The purpose of it. Is to.

13:07

Lovingly. Tell the LDS people. To say listen. This is who Christ. Is. This is who

13:12

Christ. Really is. This is who God. Reveals himself to be. And. We need to come.

13:18

We need to get reconciled. To him. Because the ability to get reconciled. To God. Is not. There's not.

13:24

Within. Within the framework. Of the doctrine. Of the LDS church. There's no way possible. That's not. Because the

13:29

LDS church. Teaches. A different God. Than is revealed. In scripture. In Christ.

13:35

That's revealed. That Joseph Smith taught. And the other prophets. All the other prophets. Repeated the prophets.

13:41

Day and time. Is different. Than the Christ. The Bible says. Christ has been eternally

13:46

God. The Mormonism says. That Christ was God's son. And came into being. At one point in time.

13:52

And there's numerous scriptures. Where you can. Where I can. I can point you to. But. And also.

13:58

The idea of. The idea of salvation. It's not. The idea. With. It's not about.

14:10

I mean. The idea. The idea of salvation. Is not about. Trying to find. Kelsey for example. Mormonism. Being. Southern Tampa.

14:17

Hopefully. You'll call out your name. On the last day. And you can become a God. If you're on a planet. That's the Mormon gospel.

14:24

The biblical gospel says. No. This is. This is us. We are. We're dead in our trespasses.

14:31

And sins. And we need God. To make us alive. And if we weren't. Great. We were not. God. And there's.

14:38

Back to the book of Isaiah. There's a verse. Where God says. He says.

14:43

Bring my sons and daughters. From afar. For my glory. For my creed. For my faith. So. We're all created.

14:49

For the purpose. We're created. To love God. Know him. And treasure him. And be in relationship.

14:54

With him forever. But that's. That's what we are created for. That's what we long for. And that's what the whole idea.

15:01

Of God being Trinity. But we don't believe. That we're going to become God. If we're on a planet. Yeah. If you.

15:07

We're becoming God. Right. Because you have to be God like. To live with God. Right.

15:12

So you can't live. With God. Unless you yourself. Are God. Because you're not holy. So you're becoming

15:18

God. To be able to live with him. Uh huh. So we're not becoming God. On our own planet.

15:25

We're just becoming God. So we can live with God. You should go to Mormon church again. Yeah. I would. I would. When you read the book of Mormon.

15:30

Did you take the challenge. At the end. To pray about him. Well. The thing is. The book of Mormon. I know it's your verse. You're referring to.

15:36

At the end of. At the end of your writing. So you didn't say that. But. I said I'm praying. And if you feel the spirit. Then you know it's true.

15:42

But here. But here's the thing. Here's the thing though. Is that. Just real. Just real quickly. Is that.

15:48

The test that. God. That God gives. Is that. Again. God's standard for truth.

15:54

Is. What his word says. In the bible. And everything. Everything that. Every standard of truth. Has to be held against them.

16:00

Remember Christ said. Sanctify them by thy truth. Thy word is true. So even if.

16:06

So here's the thing. Even if. I supposedly. Had a spirit testifying to me.

16:13

I'll. I'll. I'll. I'll phrase it this way. In Galatians. Paul says. Paul says it this way. He is talking about false teachers.

16:20

That are coming to the church. And I'll. I'm sure you gotta get going somewhere. So. Okay. Okay. No.

16:25

But he. He says this. He says if you. Or. He says if you. He's talking to the church there.

16:31

He goes. But if even we. Or. I'll phrase it from the beginning. He goes. I'm astonished that you.

16:37

Are so quickly. Going to. Going to. Only after another gospel.

16:43

A different gospel. He goes. Listen to me. Let me say this. He goes. But if even us. Or even an angel comes.

16:49

From heaven. Comes preaching another gospel. Let it be. Eternally condemned. Or not.

16:55

So here's the thing. Even if. Even if you get some sort of spirit testifying. That for example.

17:01

Joseph Smith is true. That Joseph Smith was a prophet of God. In the book of Mormon. If. But the scripture says.

17:09

Something completely different. That Joseph Smith. Fails. The test of a prophet. Which. He did.

17:15

If you look. At what scripture reveals to me. About who God is. Or what Joseph Smith said. Then that spirit.

17:21

That testified to you. Is not. The spirit of God. Because the bible says. Specifically. That there are.

17:27

False spirits. It says to test the spirits. It says to test the spirits. And I'll end it on this.

17:32

Is that. I would strongly urge you guys. I would strongly urge you guys. I've read the book of Mormon. I've read a lot. A lot of Mormon literature.

17:38

But. Here's the thing. I've known numerous. Mormons. People who have come out of Mormonism. Who have come to a saving relationship.

17:45

With Christ. And. I would say. Take. I would say. Look at what. Look at.

17:51

Look at. That God. Who he really. Reveals himself to be in the bible. You're going to see.

17:56

Only one God. I've read the bible. Well. We have to go. We have to go.

18:02

We appreciate. Your lovely way. Of doing it. Thank you so much. I will probably always be Mormon. Not probably. For sure I'll always be Mormon. But I appreciate.