February 23, 2017 Show with Jeremy Walker on “Passing Through: Pilgrim Life in the Wilderness”

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Good afternoon, Cumberland County, Pennsylvania Lake City, Florida and the rest of humanity living on the planet Earth who are listening via live streaming. This is Chris Arns and your host of iron sharpens iron wishing you all a happy Thursday.

On this 23rd day of February 2017 I'm delighted to have back on the program as my guest Jeremy Walker Who is pastor of Maiden Bower Baptist Church of Crawley in West Sussex, England? He is an author and blogger at Reformation 21 and the Wanderer.

He's addressing his book Passing through pilgrim life in the wilderness. It's my honor and privilege to have you back on iron sharpens iron. Jeremy Walker. And we have in studio once again. My co-host the Reverend buzz Taylor, it's great to have you back in the studio buzz.

Bad penny you seem to be more like a sack of counterfeit money.

This is because I go to the Presbyterian Church he says these things.

Pilgrim Life as Christian Identity in the World

But I am delighted as I said to have you back let me read a description of This book that we are going to be discussing today. I think it might be helpful to our listeners. As 21st century Christians, we must relate to the world.

But the question is how do we relate to it? Some Christians are scared others are simply bewildered and still others capitulate to the spirit of the age in passing through pilgrim life in the wilderness.

Pastor Jeremy Walker presents the biblical perspective that Christians are pilgrims passing through this fallen world. Who must cultivate the spirit of holy? Separation alongside holy Engagement as they serve Christ and all their interactions.

Unless we embrace this identity We will lose our way. Reminding us that we need the Word of God as our map and the Spirit of Christ as our compass. Pastor Walker clearly presents principles for holy engagement with the world and separation from it for pilgrims on their way home.

Seeking to glorify the God of their salvation every step of the way. This description that the publisher Reformation Heritage Books provides Reminds me very much of a sermon that my my very first pastor is a born-again Christian Mike Gadosh who is now the founder of and president of solid ground Christian books one of the key sponsors of this program.

Years ago back in the 1980s or 1990s. He preached a powerful message titled Jesus Christ friend of sinners yet separate from sinners. This seems to be the heart of what you're addressing in this book.

Is it not? In the world yet not of the world. And Before I even go any further I think it'd be also a good idea for our listeners who did not hear you previously because as I have mentioned off the air.

To you it seems that iron sharpens iron is gaining listeners new listeners every single week that I'm aware of. They're perhaps even gaining new listeners every day. And we also have a whole new audience of listeners who hear us on 90 .1 FM in the Lake City, Florida area because we are on a morning drive 8 to 10 a .m.

And also Evening time 8 to 10 p .m. So we have a whole new group of people listening to the station and a pre-recorded version of the program. But tell our listeners something About the church where you pastor the Maiden Bower Baptist Church of Crawley in West Sussex, England.

Hey, which is a town. A new town south of London next to Gatwick Airport and. The town is in 20 or so. Maiden Bower is meet in particular Baptist. You can use whatever label helps. 40 years. He needs a bit more breathing.

Things are going. My life in a fall.

I'll tell us something about your blog. Reformation 21 and the Wanderer.

Started that a number of years ago. Contribute from times you do by a number of different people and then the Reformation toward essays will be of use to others.

How did you come up with that title. The Wanderer? Reminiscent of Dionne and the Belmonts. I don't know if you ever remembered that song from the 50s or perhaps early 60s. The Wanderer.

Well, very good description and I'm also glad to hear that you're not affiliated with a.

Latin right traditionalist Roman Catholic newspaper of the same name the Wanderer. Although I do thank the Wanderer although they did not promote my Most recent debate for some reason that I don't know they used to Always promote the debates that I would organize.

For over a decade they promoted them every year between my friend. Dr James R. White who was a Reformed Baptist and and all of the Roman Catholic opponents that he faced in the debating arena. Every year when I would organize these in the Wanderer would always faithfully promote them, but they did not do that for me this time.

I don't know why I did what had a debate recently here in Carlisle, Pennsylvania Between a Reformed Baptist and a Roman Catholic and they did not Wish to cover it. But anyway, that's that's a far in a field from what we're talking about today.

This is an interesting topic that we have that every Christian If they are serious With about their faith and if they're not serious about their faith, they're not really a Christian. But we all face these dilemmas in our everyday lives on How to be in the world and not of the world.

Tell us Because of the fact that we do have listeners that are Some of which some of whom are brand new believers some of whom are not even Christians at all. What do you mean by pilgrim life? Of course a novice to the Christian faith or an outsider might immediately have images of people with Tall black hats with buckles on them having a meal with Native American Indians.

So what do you mean by a pilgrim life?

I Would not have instinctively thought of a piety of the.

Well, since he was an Englishman, I guess it is progress.

Scribed in the scriptures and yet we are alien life. Identity with Christ in and that means that I'll be changed to painting here witnessing here. And yet a real identity kingdom that is not of this world.

And so the the pilgrim motif. That Bunyan uses in his book and that is present there in the scriptures in various ways. Which I think has become an over lies behind the use of that language in the book.

What do you mean in your chapter by understanding the environment?

Before we even get on with with all we think. 21 killer. It might mean that in some instances. Yeah, it's fundamentally an ethic of our master described as.

And this is a very Captivating title. Know the enemy. I know that I have heard from people who are experts in the Puritans that Very often. I don't know if this was a universal truth, but very often when a Puritan was being trained for the ministry.

During his training he would sometimes be called upon without any advance notice to get up and give a convincing defense of what an enemy of Christianity believes. Because of the fact of their they put a great importance on knowing what the enemy believed in order to refute the enemy.

But anyway, if you could Continue with your explanation of what you meant by that Primarily.

And Reverend Buzz Taylor has a question if I if I'm sounding like I'm playing the devil's advocate.

Understand. I'm trying to second guess the way some of these words will be coming across to our listeners and. So it's not an attack. It's it's it's. I think people will have these kinds of questions and that first of all.

From what I'm hearing. How can you not be of the world and yet? We don't want to become over scrupulous. We don't want to become legalistic. It makes it very difficult to know. Well, what can we do? What can't we do?

Is this association good or bad? How do you determine that?

Yeah, that's that's that's a question I try and deal with in the first two chapters of the book. Use the language of the world to bear those distinctions in mind. Now you could you could split any number of hairs on that but my characterization involved there's the world in the creed by God.

There's that's language that the Apostle John often uses and the sense there is of that and everything that is in it. My point cultivate on the one and therefore we're in a feather hand. You can say right and down the hatch in that moral and ethical now going back to knowing the enemy.

The chapter on Satan. I wanted to give a quick plug that I'm sure you wouldn't mind since the book is Published by the same publisher that brought your book into print. Jeremy Reformation heritage books has an excellent little book by dr. Joe R beaky called fighting Satan Knowing his weaknesses strategies and defeat and that's not only in a paperback form, but also in an audio book.

So so anybody listening who might want to also investigate that Subject you can go to heritage books org. Heritage books org where you can also find information about passing through pilgrim life in the wilderness by our guest Jeremy Walker, but Just thought I'd bring that up because it is an excellent little book that dr. Beaky has written.

And how did you get? Affiliated to begin with with Reformation heritage books you being over there in England.

Well, the I'd known became my first. This was one that they were really that relate.

Yeah, it's interesting that you providentially mentioned a Robin Torah. His name came up yesterday because he is the editor of the in the planned seven volume series on systematic theology by Greg Nichols and We interviewed Greg yesterday on volume one of his lectures on systematic theology.

And so it was interesting that Robin Torah's name came up. Yeah, I can let you know that the church where I am a member Grace Baptist Church of Carlisle, Pennsylvania very recently was Highlighting passing through pilgrim life in the wilderness as their book of the month where they were offering a very Largely Discounted price on the book from our book room at the church.

Every month they highlight a specific title and offer a very big discount and they so that that the majority of the congregation will be able to purchase it and I just wanted to let you know that they thought that the elders thought that highly of your book that they wanted to Highlight that book.

And by the way, anybody listening who wants to hear my interview with dr Joel Beakey on fighting Satan you can go to our archive at iron sharpens iron radio .com. Iron sharpens iron radio .com. And in the far right corner of the website the top right corner there is the past programs and Podcasts that you click on and in the search engine you could type in Beakey be as in boy ee ke and that will be one of the interviews that comes up that you can hear.

Now this I recommend another book on that. Oh, yeah. Sure. Sure. Definitely. Yeah, I mean one one of I think The medicine can yes the pure and banner of truth. Yeah, you'll you'll not be able to interview him, unfortunately.

Precious remedies against Satan's devices. Yes, that's an excellent. He takes up that language from devices or devices that Satan has to Undermine and then for each side that that book if you're wrestling with like a medicine cabinet You can go in you can write medicine.

It is yes, that was one of the I.

Can remember the earliest books as a new Christian that my pastor at the time strongly recommended to the congregation. Precious remedies against Satan's devices. By banner of truth and you can get that through one of our sponsors Cumberland Valley Bible book service CV for Cumberland Valley BBS for Bible book service calm CV bbs .com and they have Quite a vast selection of banner of truth titles and that is one of them that I typically see in there.

Even when I walk in to browse to see what's available. But we're gonna be going to a break right now if you have a question for pastor Jeremy Walker on passing through pilgrim life in the wilderness. Our Email address is Chris Arnzen at gmail .com.

Chris Arnzen at gmail .com. And please give us your first name. Your city and state in your country of residence. If you live outside of the USA, and I think I'll ask you this question before we go to the break.

So you have time to mill it over? Or mull it over in your mind pastor Jeremy, but I wanted to know why you think it is that we who are reformed. Tend to shy away from in-depth discussions about Satan we may mention him and may refer to things as being from Satan and being Satanic and things like that, but it is I almost sense a fear of reform people to be Too much involved with the discussion on Satan fearing that they will be too much.

Resembling the Pentecostal and charismatic world who bring up Satan with quite regularity with regularity and frequency. But anyway, we're going to a break right now. And if you could answer that when we return that'd be great.

Our email address is Chris Arnzen at gmail .com. Chris Arnzen at gmail .com. Don't go away. We'll be right back after these messages from our sponsors.

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Hi, I'm pastor Bill Shishko inviting you to tune in to a visit to the pastor's study every Saturday from 12 noon to 1 p .m Eastern Time on WLIE radio www .wlie .org www .wlie40am .com. We bring biblically faithful pastoral ministry to you and we invite you to visit the pastor's study by calling in with your questions.

Our time will be lively Useful and I assure you never dull join us this Saturday at 12 noon Eastern Time For a visit to the pastor's study because everyone needs a pastor. Welcome back.

This is Chris Arnzen if you just tuned us in our guest today for the full two hours with about 90 minutes to go is Pastor Jeff Jeremy Walker and we were discussing his book passing through pilgrim life in the wilderness.

If you'd like to join us on the air with a question for pastor Jeremy Walker. Our email address is Chris Arnzen at gmail .com. Chris Arnzen at gmail .com. CHRISARNZEN at gmail .com. And please give us at least your first name.

City and state and country of residence if you live outside of the USA as does a pastor Jeremy Walker Who lives in the UK? And if you need to remain anonymous for some particular reason Perhaps you're disagreeing with your own pastor on something we understand and we will grant Your request to remain anonymous, but before the break.

Pastor Jeremy in light of a chapter of your book on knowing the enemy referring to Satan himself. We or should I say I brought up the Question as to why you think many reformed Christians shy away from the subject of Satan Although he may be brought up very briefly in terms of saying that Something is from Satan or something is satanic and that kind of a thing.

But there is not really a lot of discussion. It seems where he is being Viewed as a real entity at an actual real entity That is roaming about wherever we are and so on not that he's omnipresent like our Lord, but there's there seems to be a dearth of Discussion and preaching regarding Satan and perhaps you have experienced something different.

But that's what I've experienced. If you could explain your thoughts on that. I.

Can Pentecostal Christians.

Yeah, I mean, I think it's a relatively novel problem historically. If you certainly go back Certainly pre and on you've got Understanding of this but then even if I'm not right supernaturally I should say they they have either claimed a monopoly on this kind of language.

And there are there are some oh, yeah in a couple of books on this topic That's also a banner of truth. I believe. Correct. Yeah good. And and it's something to the white space and life and what?

Level of power. Do you believe Satan actually has in this earth? Obviously? We know that there were quite a number of things that Satan was able to do to Job And the account in the Old Testament, but every single step of the way everything he did he needed Permission from God to do it, but if you could explain what you think Satan can actually do in on this earth today.

Yeah, well, he seems that his power I think we could say is is substantial but limited he is the undoubtedly mighty sized by adversary. But as you've made very mighty, but not the the example of Job Satan had to come before God main permissionivity captive.

That he is conch and that he is now by God's grace in a movie. Bye-bye, but you know, it's interesting that you spoke very truthful biblical and wise words there.

But it's interesting how I saw those very things that you said twisted and misused in my opinion. Years ago back in I think it was the 1990s the There was a church on Long Island, New York where I lived a very large church charismatic well known for Well known amongst biblically sound churches as being a theologically dangerous place who would have the worst of the worst of false preachers there and charlatan televangelists and so on word of faith Preachers and so on and Rodney Howard Brown was speaking there Rodney Howard Brown who is most famous for the laughing revival the Toronto blessing who I think is originally from South Africa if I'm not mistaken and My general manager of a radio station that I worked for at the time called me up and he said Chris I want you to come with me to see face-to-face in person Rodney Howard Brown because I really want to know Directly from the source what this guy is all about because they've been trying to purchase airtime from us and I want to know and when I went there Rodney Howard Brown Took a different tactic than I've ever seen from a Pentecostal or charismatic preacher before he came out on the stage and he said I'm so sick and tired of Pentecostals and charismatics trying to pray demons out the room when I am preaching at a church I don't need them praying demons out the room because when I walk into a room the demons scatter and if you're Worried that you're gonna be demon possessed.

Don't don't you worry about it at all because God's people can't be demon possessed and he was going on and on and on about That and you know, that is true what you said Jeremy but he was speaking to an audience of thousands of people get letting them Rest and relax with the safety in thinking that they could not be demon possessed and yet there could have been hundreds and hundreds of lost people there and then he started to Manifest what he would call this gift of the spirit of laughter or whatever he was calling it where he was laughing hysterically and so was the Musical band on stage.

It was almost as if he was letting people or Convincing people to be at ease and open themselves up to demonic activity if you follow what I'm saying. Did that make sense to you that he was perhaps? Trying to get them to be not afraid of any kind of supernatural occurrence that may occur when it could very well have been demonic.

I've never been exposed to that particular. I would be very. Overdue. I'm not trying to make a like-for-like equivalence, but I do think of the Sun might to cast out be. It's yeah, this is. Yeah, we're not looking.

Yeah, we're not looking. And anything that there might and then malevolence me and under the influence been by Martin Lloyd-Jones again. About his time. And there was a woman in I can't remember whether what you that she recognized.

Clean. Think we have to wreck. Oh, maybe.

Susan in Newville, Pennsylvania wants to know if your guest believes in Do modern-day demonic possession?

That's a huge question. I.

Know people who are thoroughly Orthodox and reformed and Calvinistic. I know John MacArthur believes in modern-day demon possession and there are other Folks that I know who are reformed. I know John is a dispensationalist, but he's a thoroughgoing Calvinist.

I interviewed a Lutheran who believes in demonic possession who is not a Sensationalist. He doesn't use the topic like many in the charismatic community might Sensationalize those kinds of things. But anyway, if you could at least give us as much of an answer as you care to on that question.

Yeah, I think it's a fine and a valid question. I have a number of it very care I don't and operative against them places and at different times. Yes, I think that there may be and have been indications.

Interpretation of not any longer the case. Yes, there is. I don't know if you know of the.

The ministry called to every tribe But they are a Calvinistic ministry that seeks to bring the gospel to Regions on the globe that are unevangelized who have had very little or no Communication with evangelists and missionaries in any significant way prior to their arriving on the scene.

And The brother David Sitton who runs that ministry who is a thoroughgoing Calvinist. He believes with certainty that demonic possession is occurring especially in areas like I just mentioned where there is a Superstition on steroids if you will and pagan worship and idolatry and all those kinds of things going on.

Yeah, I I think again, I think that the biblical data suggests that in such an environment that those kinds of to the modern West is the most with that would bloody and. So, you know the paganism and again that's think I can give chapters and evangelists in I.

And in fact if anybody wants to look up David Sitton's website, it's to every tribe.

Org to every tribe. Org. We're going to a station break right now and we're going to allow our guests to Jeremy Walker to switch phone lines since he's calling from overseas and. We would welcome your emails at.

Chris Arnson at gmail .com. Chris Arnson at gmail .com if you have a question for pastor Jeremy Walker. And please give us your first name. City and state and country of residence. Don't go away. We will be right back after these messages from our sponsors and we hope to hear from you soon.

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