Pelagian Pope, Two Part Romans Utterly Refuted

Alpha & Omega Ministries

Subscribe

Download

Share

00

00:34

Well, greetings and welcome to the Dividing Line. My name is James White. Yes, we are here. I announced last week,

00:42

I said, if we do a Dividing Line on Tuesday, that means that my surgery

00:49

Monday morning was successful on a really good level.

00:56

And it was. I'm very thankful to Dr. Jones at Banner Thunderbird.

01:04

I think I was sort of his special project. He did not seem happy after the first attempt.

01:10

This is the third attempt to fix my problem.

01:16

The first in Texas and then two here. And I really appreciate the fact that when he came in after the first attempt, he looked bummed.

01:25

He looked depressed that we had failed on that run.

01:30

And so I think I was a special project like I'm going to redeem myself. I'm going to get this thing.

01:37

And and they did. And I am very thankful for that. And I feel better than I've felt for six weeks.

01:44

I rode 22 miles this morning. I have significantly more energy than I've had for a long, long time.

01:53

It's amazing what I'm not having to take this one particular drug they give you for these issues.

02:00

And obviously, that's part of it. But your body knows when it's got stuff in it that it's not supposed to have in it. And so now

02:07

I'm feeling much better. So hoping for the best as I look forward to the next trip up to Colorado, hoping that we can arrange the debates we're trying to arrange and stuff like that up there and all the stuff that's going on.

02:23

It's it's a busy, busy time, much happening. And so I'm glad to be with you today.

02:29

Obviously, there's much to be talking about. We had the graduation speech by the

02:39

Kansas City Chiefs kicker. But Kerr, I think is the name who is a traditionalist

02:46

Roman Catholic. I haven't heard a lot of people bring that part out that is Catholic. Yes, that he's a traditionalist

02:54

Latin mass type guy. A lot of people don't understand what that's about. They don't realize that the current pope is deadly opposed to the

03:03

Latin mass. And so that would have something to do with the direction that he was going.

03:13

But there's been a lot of discussion about, you know, the number of open communist, homosexual, transgender graduation speeches that have taken place over the past number of weeks across America.

03:33

Nobody even mentions it any longer. It's irrelevant. But let one person dare talk about any type of, you know, because universities, even

03:45

Roman Catholic universities, which is what this one was. These are the temple of secularism.

03:55

And you just are not allowed to say anything or do anything that would in any way, shape or form violate the dogmas of the secular church.

04:09

And so once again, I don't know how many times

04:15

I've said this over the past number of decades, but as we are pressed into an ever smaller section of the societal experience, we will be interacting with Roman Catholicism and Roman Catholics.

04:33

And it's happening at a time of tremendous change and crisis within Roman Catholicism itself, even though it seems to me that the vast majority of Roman Catholics are intent upon completely ignoring what's going on in Rome.

04:53

Oh, sure. There have been people who have been red -pilled, so to speak, and who recognize what's, you know, how important the shifts that Francis has made.

05:08

And the problem is, what you need to understand is, you know, he was on 60

05:16

Minutes Sunday night. I have video queued up. We're going to listen to some of the important stuff.

05:22

But he holds to certain doctrines of the past.

05:30

He has to. He can't just come out and say, I'm going to do this, this, this, and this. What he's been doing since he became

05:37

Pope is a foundational shift that will allow the next steps to be taken by his successor, and then the next steps by his successor.

05:51

And when the left seeks to take over a denomination, a church, a movement, they look long -term.

06:05

They plan long -term. And that's how they're doing it. So he has made selections to all these church positions of people who will determine policy.

06:18

Look, I hate to say it, it's the same thing that's happened in the Southern Baptist Convention. You had people, one person was given extra time because of COVID to put people, you know, it's the deep state thing.

06:34

And it works for politics. It works in religion. And it's happening in Rome.

06:41

And you have all sorts of Pope -splainers running around trying to say that, no, no, no, no, this is all irrelevant, doesn't matter, nothing's going to change, blah, blah, blah, blah.

06:52

But there are a lot of Roman Catholics who are recognizing that's not true. And they're starting to see what's going on.

07:00

And so anyway, the

07:05

Butker thing just happened to be right before this interview with Pope Francis.

07:12

And so there's a couple sections that I want to play and consider, and then use that to transition into what would seem to be a very, very different topic.

07:25

And I hope to, I'm, you know, definitely gonna go the whole hour, may go longer. I do have a little bit of a sore throat.

07:33

And for those of you who have gone through the things I've gone through recently, you know why?

07:39

I was under anesthesia like 26 hours ago, 28 hours ago. And that means

07:44

I had a breathing tube down my throat and you start talking a lot and it starts feeling uncomfortable.

07:50

So I may stop and drink a little bit once in a while. Just it's not mineral water, it's electrolytes.

08:00

Some people would say, hey, since you're talking about Roman Catholicism, why don't you just take a drink? I detest the taste of alcohol, that's why.

08:09

Anyway, so with that said, let's take a look.

08:16

Hopefully this is gonna work for us here. Let's put it this way. It was working before.

08:24

Let's hope it'll be, it'll continue to be working now. Here is the first section

08:30

I want to look at. Now, this isn't where I'm gonna be going with the rest of it, but I do want to exhort the folks on my side.

08:46

When the document came out last year, right before Christmas, about defining blessings, we were accurate in our description of it and we exhorted everyone else to be accurate in their description of it as well.

09:07

But that's sort of, I'm hearing a lot of people on my side just boldly saying that Pope Francis has made it, that it's his intention to allow the church to bless same -sex unions.

09:23

That's not what that was about. Fiducia supplicants, look, you need to understand,

09:32

Tucho Fernandez and these people, they're not stupid. And they know how to change the direction of a church.

09:47

You kept looking over there. You kept looking at two.

09:54

I moved to one, so we have the shot. Hopefully those of you who constantly tell me while I'm traveling,

10:20

I need to be nicer to Rich, we'll start sending him notes that he needs to be nicer to me. I'm the guy here the day after surgery, so let's just keep that in mind.

10:36

What were we talking about? I don't know because I've been distracted. I really did lose it, so we're just gonna go back to what the

10:44

Pope said. People who are moving a movement leftward, do it carefully.

10:53

Do it carefully. They don't just do it in one big jump.

11:00

How long did it take the United Methodists to destroy themselves? How long did it take the

11:05

Presbyterians to split up into all the different Presbyterian groups and now you have the PCUSA?

11:13

The ELCA amongst the Lutherans, all that kind of stuff.

11:18

It takes time. And the first step with fiduciary supplicants last year was to allow blessings of individuals in extraordinary relationships.

11:34

So the blessing was on the person, not the relationship. Now, have we seen

11:40

Roman Catholic priests taking that and clearly blessing a homosexual union?

11:47

Yeah, there's video of that. I was going to play a video of that and never got around to it because of the other stuff going on. But yes, obviously that has taken place.

11:57

But there's plausible deniability on the part of the

12:02

Catholic Church at that point. And so we need to be careful because when we're not careful at that point, and we're not specific, then they can respond to it in such a way that you can't ever get to the real issue.

12:22

Which is the fact that fiduciary supplicants still marked a change in only like 18 months from what the dicastery had said 18 months earlier.

12:38

Nope, can't do that. 18 months earlier, yep, can do that. And what you're going to see is a continued movement that direction when this synod and synodality does its thing later this year.

12:57

You're going to see where this is going. And it's going to be consistent. And the

13:03

Pope's successor, the plan obviously is from his perspective, is going to continue these things down the road.

13:10

So anyway, this actually is a shot from when he was on the aircraft early on in his pontificate.

13:20

Basically saying on the subject of homosexuality, who am I to judge? And what this is going to get to when we get far enough into this, is that Pope Francis actually has a sub -Roman

13:37

Catholic anthropology. Again, Rome has just as wide an expression of understandings.

13:49

People don't understand that, they think, well, they all believe the same thing. No they don't. And there's always been the differences between the

13:59

Jesuits and the Franciscans and the Dominicans and the Augustinians and all the rest of this kind of stuff. But he has literally a semi -Pelagian anthropology.

14:16

Not Augustinian, not even as accurate as Thomas Aquinas. It's very much humanism, it's very much secularism.

14:29

And he will express that. But, so first, the correction on the first issue right here.

14:36

And he did not stop there. Last year you decided to allow Catholic priests to bless same -sex couples.

14:43

That's a big change. Why? No, what I allowed was not to bless the

14:50

Union. That cannot be done, because that is not the sacrament.

14:57

I cannot. The Lord made it that way. But to bless each person, yes. The blessing is for everyone.

15:06

Okay, so that really is the problem. Because when the person is in this irregular relationship, in other words, a same -sex marriage relationship, what is the intention and content of the blessing?

15:32

How can a blessing be separated from the call to repentance? Because I'm not hearing repentance.

15:40

I'm not hearing, this is sinful, and God does not bless sinful relationships.

15:47

This goes against the created order. The only blessing you can give to a person in that situation is to call them out of their sin.

15:56

That's the greatest blessing. So that's where the strangeness, from my perspective, of the whole concept of blessings within Roman Catholicism comes from.

16:10

It's an odd and strange thing at that point. But the first section that popped up on Twitter was this one.

16:24

There are conservative bishops in the United States that oppose your new efforts to revisit teachings and traditions.

16:33

How do you address their criticism? You used an adjective, conservative.

16:42

That is, conservative is one who clings to something and does not want to see beyond that.

16:49

It is a suicidal attitude. Because one thing is to take tradition into account, to consider situations from the past.

16:58

But quite another is to be closed up inside a dogmatic box. Okay, now,

17:08

I didn't know that's what conservative meant. Was John Paul II closed up inside a dogmatic box?

17:19

Was Benedict XVI Cardinal Ratzinger? I mean, Ratzinger was the standard of dogmatic orthodoxy for decades in the

17:32

Roman Catholic Church. Do these words refer to him too? It really makes you wonder.

17:42

And I think most Roman Catholics would say, well, the function of the papacy is to conserve

17:50

Christian truth. I mean, that's their claim. So I would imagine it's quite frightening to a lot of Roman Catholics to hear the

18:01

Pope speak this way. And properly so. This is how liberals refer, leftists refer, to people who will not buy into the newest movement.

18:18

And you would think that Roman Catholics would be not wanting to be buying into that kind of stuff.

18:27

Okay, I obviously wrote down the wrong time here.

18:36

I'm going to assume that I wrote, that I typoed one thing.

18:44

So let's see if we can, let's see if I can interpret my own typo. That is no longer the

18:50

Church of Christ. Everyone. When you look at the world, what gives you hope?

19:01

Everything. You see tragedies. But you also see so many beautiful things.

19:11

You see heroic mothers, heroic men, men who have hopes and dreams, women who look to the future.

19:20

That gives me a lot of hope. People want to live.

19:26

People forge ahead. And people are fundamentally good.

19:32

We are all fundamentally good. Yes, there are some rogues and sinners, but the heart itself is good.

19:46

That's humanism. That's not even universal catechism.

19:52

That's not Roman Catholic teaching. It's not. It's semi -Pelagianism, bordering on full -born

20:03

Pelagianism. But most importantly, that's not

20:09

Genesis. That's not the Psalter. That's not Isaiah. That's certainly not

20:15

Jeremiah. But it stretched the imagination. That's not Romans. That's not

20:20

Galatians. That's not Revelation. That is how far this man is from the authority of Scripture, forming his anthropology.

20:36

Now again, this is supposed to be the infallible vicar of Christ on earth.

20:43

And as soon as you say that, all the Pope -splainers start going, This is not a dogmatic definition!

20:48

Again, papal infallibility is the most useless waste of paper that's ever been promulgated amongst men.

20:55

It means nothing. If the Pope is right, then he's infallible.

21:01

If he's wrong, he's still infallible. He just wasn't speaking infallibly. It's a worthless doctrine. You can never know in your life whether anything he's said is infallible or not infallible.

21:12

It's contradicted by history. It's a joke. It's worthless. But, our point is, this man, whether you go,

21:22

Oh, he just seems like such a nice old man. This man bears the names of the

21:30

Trinity. He allows people to address him with the very names of the

21:35

Trinity. He's called the Holy Father. That is only the name of God the Father in the

21:40

Scripture. As a priest, he's called an Alter Christus, another Christ.

21:47

And as Pope, he is called the Vicar of Christ. The Vicar of Christ, the one who takes

21:52

Christ's place on earth, is the Holy Spirit. So he bears titles of all three of the divine persons of the

22:01

Trinity. And these are obviously unbiblical terms.

22:08

This is an unbiblical office. We've debated this. The first debate

22:14

I did on that subject was, When was that?

22:24

Probably, well, obviously in the 90s, we did a lot of those. But, probably with Mitch Pacwa, I think, on Long Island.

22:30

I'm forgetting which year that was. It was after, that was getting toward the late 90s when we did that.

22:38

But we've done papal infallibility twice. We've done the papacy a couple times.

22:45

And the historical evidence against the papacy is overwhelming. You have to start with the claims of the papacy, then redefine history on the basis of those claims, to come up with the concept of the papacy.

23:00

You really do. It's a circularity. But, the point is, if you have that view, if you have the view that mankind is just fundamentally good, the heart is fundamentally good, you are not going to understand the call of the gospel.

23:23

You're going to have a gospel that is one, and this is what the left is about, of moral reformation, rather than fundamental transformation, through regeneration.

23:38

And, people who practice sacramental forgiveness through baptism, tend to move this direction.

23:50

The forgiveness has already been taken care of in baptism, now it's just a matter of reformation. Do we have a problem?

23:55

No, we're doing great. The way you're looking at me, I'm going, the feed crashed?

24:03

It does strike me, from 60 Minutes apart, they sent somebody to interview him, who clearly is in no position to question him intelligently.

24:12

Well, you know, and just simply for translation purposes, you know that this was, all they did was, they sat there and recorded her asking the questions, and then they recorded him giving the answers that they already knew, and they cobbled it all together.

24:30

But yeah, I mean, she's obviously fawning over him, and that's, you know, that's what you expect.

24:36

I'm not overly surprised by that. But this is, we have said over and over again, the issue with Roman Catholicism is the gospel.

24:46

And when you do not have a biblical anthropology, when you start at the wrong place with man's need, you're going to read backwards from there, and change the fundamentals of the gospel.

25:01

And that is what happens with Roman Catholicism, and that's what happened with Pope Francis.

25:07

And it's sad to hear, and to see. But what's fascinating to me is that the issues raised by Francis are the same issues that we are dealing with, not blessings of priests and things like that, but this unbiblical concept of man is very much alive and well amongst, quote unquote,

25:43

Protestants. Again, that term is vague and broad, and not always that useful.

25:55

But we are encountering the need to talk about this in light of the provisionist movement.

26:08

It used to be called traditionalist, Southern Baptist traditionalist.

26:13

It's morphing as it bounces along and evolves and changes and moves farther and farther away from biblical truth.

26:24

But you might say, how do you connect the two together? Well, I think you'll see as we move into this next section, and before some of you tune out, because I'm not interested in provisionism, okay, let me make an apologetic, a defense of spending the time

26:44

I'm gonna spend today and in the future refuting a never before heard of until Jason Bretta brought it out in the debate we did in February, theory called two -part

27:06

Romans. So my phone thinks that theory sounds like another word that we won't mention right now.

27:18

That's strange. And it's even on silence, so it doesn't matter. Anyway, a theory that I discovered recently was cooked up in 2013.

27:39

And it's funny because the provisionists have jumped all over, well, original sin, that Augustine and this gap and all the rest of the stuff.

27:52

And then they're promoting something that no one had thought of until 11 years ago. If you're looking for consistency from the provisionists, don't even bother.

28:03

They can't do it. They can't do it theologically, exegetically, historically, any of that stuff.

28:11

When you've got to have something as stupid as dupede, some of you haven't been watching long enough to know what dupede is, but divine unconditional predestination of individuals' eternal destinies.

28:30

Ken Wilson and his wackadoodle Oxford stuff about Augustine, which we spent hours and hours and hours on during the lockdowns,

28:46

March, April, May of 2020, when we decided you all needed something to do to not go crazy.

28:52

So we just did dividing lines forever. Anyway, same kind of wackadoodle stuff where you just come up, you have to come up with something totally new.

29:05

Even though in this case, it wasn't totally new. People had been accusing Augustine of stuff like that for a long time, but to make it into an anti -Calvinistic apologetic, that's where things got really, really weird.

29:20

So what happened, just to remind you, for those of you who,

29:28

I'm just gonna start putting these on, like I said, every morning and just leave them there, because I can't read anything close up anymore.

29:37

I was noticing the Pope had a hearing aid in, and this may not be happening at your house, but at my house, it's, what?

29:47

What? What'd you say? Yeah, yeah.

29:55

I'm starting to wonder if I shouldn't make an appointment, you know? My wife's taking care of her mom, and just so many doctor's appointments.

30:05

It's just over, and I'm like, I'm not gonna do that, and then there's nothing you can do about it. It just, it's just, what happens?

30:12

It comes and gets you. So I probably should have my hearing checked. Either that or my wife is just mumbling to try to make me feel older.

30:22

I have thought about that as a conspiracy theory. I really have. But anyway, what was

30:29

I talking about? Oh yeah, these things. Boy, they stick to something back here.

30:34

Anyway. Well, they will. That probably is gonna happen. Nothing I can do about that.

30:42

Jason Beretta, in his opening, in the debate on,

30:48

I think it was 24th of February, talked about an ambiguous antecedent.

30:55

Now I know that, well, there were two books.

31:02

There is a book that he is now, Jason is doing, has announced an eight -part video series.

31:09

Now, let me say something. Jason Beretta is really good at making videos. They're high quality, they're professional, great graphics, music, all sorts of stuff like that.

31:24

And so, let's put it this way. He is giving advertisement to Brent Leigh's books.

31:33

Here's one of them. This is the first one. This is not the one that he's really pushing. The one he's really pushing in his videos, let me see if I can throw it over here on the screen just so you can see the, oh, that's not gonna work.

31:48

I've gotta do it this way. I've gotta take this off full screen first. All right, let me throw this over here from Kindle.

31:54

Here it is. 2PR, Two -Part Romans, Resolving the

32:00

Calvinism vs. Whosoever Will Puzzle by Brent Leigh. So that's the 2017 book.

32:08

And then here is the 2015. So this is a little bit earlier book.

32:19

What? This one? Did you see it better? Whatever. This one is,

32:28

I was trying to get this to go back full screen. Calvinism, An Error of the

32:35

Ages Per New Discovery of Two -Part Romans, 2PR.

32:43

So we're not talking, it's a booklet. The actual amount of stuff that Brent Leigh has written in here is like maybe two blog articles long.

32:54

It's a booklet. It's 66 pages, but the vast majority of his quotation is from, well, actually, it's the entirety of the

33:04

Book of Romans in the King James Version of the Bible is included in here. So there you go. This is not a work of scholarship.

33:11

This is not a work of systematic theology. This is not a work of history. It is a novel theory written by a man who's trying to get around Calvinism.

33:23

I mean, he's open about it. At least he's open about it. Calvinism, An Error of the Ages. He's not trying to pretend that he just approached this and came to this conclusion.

33:35

No, he was opposed to Calvinism. And this is what hit him as he gives the specifics.

33:45

But let me just read to you because you can't see it on the screen. I should have put it on. Actually, I just realized something.

33:52

Hold on a second here. Yeah, I think

34:00

I can do it this way. Let me see if I can put up there because I want you to see this as I read it.

34:08

There we go. That's from Amazon. Notice the magnifying glass.

34:19

It says here is his proposed understanding of Romans 1 .13.

34:28

In order that I may reap some harvest among you, the Jews, as well as among the rest of the

34:35

Gentiles, those Gentiles I have yet to evangelize. Romans 1 .13b. ESV clarification in parenthesis added.

34:46

That sort of gives you the idea of what this whole thing is.

34:51

This entire theory. This entire theory. The ambiguous antecedent is you in Romans 1 .13.

35:03

In order that I may reap some harvest among you, the Jews. The whole theory is there is an ambiguous antecedent here.

35:13

Once you understand it's the Jews, then you understand the first eight chapters are written to Jewish believers.

35:22

Interestingly enough, not Jews. By the way, let me just tell you right now.

35:27

This theory shreds the Book of Romans. Tears it to shreds, turns it upside down, and makes it teach the opposite of what it actually teaches.

35:35

Not just about Calvinism, but about everything. Destroys justification, destroys unity of the church. It is so absurd.

35:41

It is hard for me to explain it. I don't know how anybody who has a scintilla of common biblical sense could buy any of this.

35:50

I really don't. I really don't. That's why nobody but these guys take it seriously.

35:57

The apologetic that I need to offer right now is then why am I wasting your time? Because anybody these days can go out and can self -publish a book like this.

36:13

Now, I had never heard of this. No one had ever raised it. No one in scholarship has a clue.

36:20

It's had zero impact. But what you do is you...

36:28

What Jason Breda is doing now is you take something like this, which is very poorly done, cheaply produced, and you put music behind it and cool graphics and spice it up.

36:45

And all of a sudden, people are like, oh, never thought about that before. And the availability of the internet and self -publication...

36:55

Back when I started writing, you actually had to convince a publisher that you could write something that would have some kind of validity to it.

37:03

You don't have to do it anymore. Anybody can just tap away at the computer and it's on Amazon and Kindle and there's no review.

37:16

I think if this had been given to people who could read

37:22

Greek, knew something about church history, it is so easy to shred.

37:30

It's so easy to refute that maybe it might not have seen the light of day, but that's not what happened.

37:40

And so the reason for you to stick through this...

37:46

I mean, we're gonna be getting into the text. A lot of you like getting into the text and looking at it carefully and closely and stuff like that.

37:53

And so hopefully you enjoy that because we're gonna be looking at that. But I want also there to be a more general this is how you evaluate claims that you've never heard of before.

38:08

Because I said in the debate, never heard this before in my life. I don't know of anyone in any serious position teaching anywhere that believes this stuff.

38:21

Like I said, it's a whopping 11 years old. It has not been peer -reviewed in any way, shape, or form.

38:31

So when you get hit with something like this, how do you respond to it?

38:39

And so that's why I asked, the first question that I asked in cross -examination was, what were you talking about?

38:47

Ambiguous antecedent. Now, the entire theory is based upon Romans 1 .13

38:59

and the word, you. Have some fruit among you also.

39:06

That that word, you, has an ambiguous antecedent and has been misunderstood until Brent Lay, on vacation in Florida, on the beach in 2011, figured it out.

39:19

Nobody has figured it out until today. You know, even he admits, you know, even he admits that that's, you know, so hey,

39:32

I don't want you to, I don't want you to, let me lay some of this out and then we'll go to the text, okay?

39:39

How does that sound? Calvinism and error of the ages per new discovery of two -part

39:45

Romans by Brent Lay. Paul's letter to the Romans has two parts, chapters one to eight, to the Jews first, and chapters nine to 16, then to the

39:52

Gentiles. This is something that Jason and here both, you know, he's, Jason's just taking this from Brent Lay, but to the

39:58

Jew first, also Gentile. That just simply means that the gospel first went to the

40:04

Jews and then to the Gentiles. That's just a historical reality. And when Paul, for example, goes into a city, he goes to synagogue first.

40:12

Why? Because that's where the scriptures are. The Old Testament scriptures that are the fulfillment is

40:19

Jesus Christ are in the synagogue. That's where he goes first. That doesn't mean that the first half of Romans is to Jews and the second half is to Gentiles.

40:29

It just amazes me that people would make this kind of argument, that they take it seriously, but they do. Okay. Yes, Augustine, Luther, Calvin, and even today

40:39

MacArthur, Piper, and Grudem interpret chapters one to eight of Romans to be written to the Gentiles. Actually, they interpret it to be written to the church at Rome, which was primarily

40:50

Gentile, but had Jews in it as well. No question Romans was written to the

40:56

Jews and the Gentiles. If you understand, however, that Paul wrote directly to the

41:02

Jews in the first eight chapters and then directly to the Gentiles in the last eight chapters. Now, just think about what this means.

41:08

Just think about what this means. Everything about justification is only about Jewish Christians.

41:16

Everything about universal sin is about Jewish Christians. The absurdity of it boggles the mind.

41:24

How anyone can... I can't even conceive of it. But think.

41:30

I mean, we may do it. Walk through all those sections. And he does. Like I said, he put all

41:35

Romans in here in the King James Version of the Bible. What he does is he'll pick one little section and cram his theory into it.

41:42

Whether the text supports it or not is irrelevant. This is eisegesis on steroids.

41:49

And the amazing thing is, Jason Breda is always the one talking about you gotta do exegesis, you gotta do historical context, everything else.

41:58

I can't even conceive of how you put those two things together. There is such a chasm in these things.

42:07

So just think of Romans 5, the two humanities, one in Christ, one in Adam.

42:15

How's that just about the Jews? Why is all this?

42:21

So that when you get to Romans 8, election and predestination is only of the

42:27

Jewish remnant. That way you can avoid... it has nothing to do with Gentiles. So when Paul tells

42:32

Timothy, I've endured all things for the sake of the elect. He was actually just talking about Jewish Christians.

42:39

Even though he's the apostle to Gentiles, he's just talking about Jewish Christians. It's like, wow!

42:46

There's a reason why no one ever thought about this. Because everyone realized how ridiculous it would be.

42:52

That's why it never suggested itself. So, anyway. A great difference in that the first eight chapters include the teaching of predestination, foreknowledge, and election, which apply only to the

43:05

Jewish believers. Now think about this. This is an overarching point. When Paul says in Romans chapter 3, for all have sinned, there is no distinction.

43:18

There is no difference. He's talking about Jews and Gentiles. He says there is no difference between Jews and Gentiles. The whole point he gets to in Romans chapter 3 is that we're all guilty before the bar of God.

43:29

So that all Jews and Gentiles, heads down, mouths closed, no one has any boast before God, and therefore we're all justified in the same way.

43:44

And that's Paul's greatest concern. His concern seen in Galatians, in Romans, in Acts, is the idea of a divided church.

43:55

A Jewish Christian church and a Gentile Christian church. And his whole point in saying there is no distinction is to avoid the very thing this results in.

44:12

This is telling the Jewish Christians, you have a special standing, that the Gentile Christians don't.

44:19

It's purely ridiculous. It's absurd on its face.

44:26

It turns the message of Romans upside down. And all to avoid predestination and election.

44:35

The lengths to which people will go. That's why I keep telling you, watch this movement. We're already seeing it.

44:43

Look at the people that are involved with this movement. Look where they're willing to go. Look at them playing footsie with the open theists and everybody else.

44:51

And then Leighton, somebody, a Turretin fan. Turretin fan responded to a

45:00

Soteriology 101 tweet and said, in essence, what

45:06

Leighton had just said was exactly what the Second Council of Orange condemned. And the

45:12

Second Council of Orange was condemning Pelagianism. And Leighton's response is, well that's not an authority for me.

45:20

So he's like, yeah, okay. And it's like, wait a minute. When I started going years ago, y 'all are heading, you're really, it sounds like you're going

45:32

Pelagius' direction. That's ridiculous. That's just, you're counting names.

45:38

And now it's like, yeah, so? There are no curbs here. There are no guardrails here.

45:46

And so you're just going to see it just keep going and going and going and going. And in the first two of these eight videos have already been posted by Jason Breda.

45:59

And in the second one, the second one he starts trying to talk to us about church history.

46:10

And again, Jason's a nice guy. He does really good videos, but he knows zippity -dippity -doo -dah about exegesis,

46:20

Greek, syntax, and church history. So it's really hard to sit there and be lectured about what allegedly was going on in church history.

46:31

Because he then goes and he starts, he gives lengthy video presentations from female church historians that are in the

46:43

Bart Ehrman category. As if this is substantiating his point.

46:52

I mean, she's written a book called Lost Christianities, which he called

46:57

Lost Christianites. Lost Christianities. What's that about?

47:03

Well, those of us who have actually debated Bart Ehrman and read Bart Ehrman's books, we know what that's about.

47:10

Everybody who contributed to the Heresy of Orthodoxy book, which Jason Breda should read, knows what that's about.

47:19

But the point is, they're willing to draw from sources that are fundamentally acidic to the supernatural truth claims of the

47:30

Christian faith to substantiate their point. And I've seen this,

47:36

I've been at this a while now, I've seen how far these people will go to get past what

47:45

Scripture teaches on this subject. There is such, it's anti -Calvinist ranger syndrome.

47:50

It really, really is. It is as if Paul is addressing both groups within the room, but speaks directly to the

48:03

Jews first, and then the Gentiles. When we interpret otherwise, we confuse and confound the wonderful Gospel message, and have to explain the obvious contradiction of election with whosoever will.

48:15

Well, it's not an obvious contradiction. The one results in the other. This man's ignorant of Reformed theology, won't accept it, and so he's going to misrepresent it, and then turn

48:24

Romans on its head to justify his rebellion against scriptural teaching. Paul was seen to explain, not mystify, this misinterpretation has been a great theological error for more than 1700 years, until I came along.

48:39

Okay, that's not in there, but that's what it's saying. No, seriously. Quote, this misinterpretation has been a great theological error for more than 1700 years.

48:48

This writing points out and confirms the abounding evidence of the Calvinism error. As the

48:55

Reformers cried, sola scriptura, or scripture alone, as the standard, this writing strives to present the evidence primarily from the scripture itself, except only in English translation.

49:10

Okay, where was, was it, it must, oh, wait a minute.

49:26

Well, there was a section, huh, I thought it was in here.

49:32

It must be in the Kindle book. Yeah, there was a section, let me check the Kindle book over here.

49:38

Just trying to give you the rest of the background here. I don't want you over there. I want you over here, and put that back up there, thank you.

49:47

Where he went through, yeah, here it is.

49:59

Let me just give you a couple quotes from the 2017 book. I contend this writing,

50:06

I don't know why, might I talk about this book or something, it's very stilted. I contend this writing represents the original and true perspective of God's word regarding salvation.

50:18

Where have we heard that before? That no one knew about until me. That everybody missed for at least 1700 years.

50:29

I don't think you can find anybody before then that viewed Romans the way he views it.

50:36

But who else says things like this? Joseph Smith, Mary Baker Eddy, Ellen G.

50:42

White, Charles Taze Russell, Victor Paul Weirwill, they all said the same thing. I have seen things in scripture that no one else has ever seen.

50:51

A little scary. My goal is to communicate this truth to lay people as well as theologians. I believe this finding, this finding, it's like it was just a discovery.

51:01

This finding of two part Romans brings resolution to the ages old issue of the traditional whosoever will versus Calvinism debate.

51:08

No it doesn't. Do you really seriously want to suggest that this gets rid of First Corinthians?

51:16

Remember First Corinthians talks about election, predestination, and talks about those who are called, whether Jews or Greeks.

51:24

So election and predestination, the called isn't just Jews. He specifically says that.

51:31

What are you going to do with Corinthians? They'll have to come up with something. I mean we've got the guy saying

51:37

Ephesians 1 is only about the apostles. John 6 is only about the Jews back then.

51:43

Now Romans is about... Pretty soon there's not going to be anything left in the New Testament that's actually relevant to us today.

51:50

It's all going to be... So here's what he says. He says, in 2013 I was diagnosed with cancer.

51:58

For the 30 years prior, I was far more a practitioner in evangelism and outreach than a student of theology.

52:09

As a word of testimony, I realize now that without this illness, I would have not taken the time to study the book of Romans so relentlessly.

52:20

Except that verse that we all go to and rely on. God causes all things to work together for the good for who?

52:29

Jewish Christians in Rome. Not for us. That's a promise to Jewish Christians in Rome, right?

52:36

First eight chapters, that's in chapter 8. That's just to Jewish Christians in Rome. Right? There are ramifications when you start messing with the

52:48

Bible like this. When I came upon this personal discovery, folks, the meaning of the text of Scripture is not your personal discovery.

53:03

And it's dangerous when you... It's dangerous when you are arrogant enough to think,

53:11

I've come up with something no one's ever thought of before. Wow. I spent several months searching for historical evidence of others who took this position.

53:22

I noticed he doesn't come up with anybody. I say discovery because I first realized this revelation.

53:31

It's his term. Jason Brett is trying to say, wait, but he's used it. Jason called it a revelation in the debate and I think in the first video.

53:40

And I think he now realizes, well, it's not a good term to use. Well, no, it's not. I say discovery because I first realized this revelation, you ready?

53:49

On Thursday, June 6, 2013. About 10, 15 in the morning while on vacation in Florida.

53:56

There you go. I'm so thankful that finally in 2013, the church has come to understand a book that has brought revival.

54:10

A book that has had more impact than almost any other book in the

54:16

New Testament. Maybe John, but I mean Romans. Central to the Reformation.

54:21

Oh, they didn't get it. They didn't get it. Central to so many of the revivals, they didn't get it.

54:29

It took one guy who just said, I really wasn't a student of theology. June 6, 2013.

54:39

Revelation. Recovering from a cancer treatment, I was confined to a condominium overlooking the beach for the week.

54:46

In reading through the book of Romans for the 28th consecutive time. And Jason Brett makes a big thing about that.

54:51

Evidently, it's not reading it as Paul originally wrote it. It's reading it in English over and over and over again.

54:59

That is the key. The 28th consecutive time on the 6th consecutive day. I realized for the first time.

55:07

Didn't get the first 27 times. I realized for the first time the reality that Paul had written

55:12

Romans in two parts. He wrote the first 8 chapters to the Jews and the later 8 chapters to the

55:19

Gentiles. And it just so happens he goes on to say the

55:25

Southern Baptist Convention was to consider a report on Calvinism the next week.

55:32

Really? There might be bias here? Maybe? Possibly?

55:38

With this controversial report being debated, I had prayed for weeks concerning this theological or soteriological standoff.

55:48

Then, I got a revelation. That's not what he says.

55:54

I came to understand that the differences in translations come about primarily because the word for word transfer from one language to another language involves subjective choices.

56:04

I would like to think that he had to take some level of Greek, but I get nothing. I get nothing.

56:10

I get nothing from any of this. That even suggests to me that the man is actually

56:15

Greek capable. That if you handed him a Greek New Testament that he'd be able to find the right books or to preach from it or read from it.

56:23

I see nothing about that at all. And then he says he talks about subjective choices in translation.

56:33

These subjective choices include the consideration of the nuances of the respective language as well as context.

56:40

This is particularly true when there is an ambiguous antecedent antecedent as we find in verse 13 of Romans chapter 1.

56:53

And he says, secondly, scholars must also use their own judgment in determining the original intent of the author.

56:59

Please keep this subjectivity in mind. Translating and interpreting God's word is not an exact science like we would prefer.

57:05

Throughout history, mistakes by men concerning translation and interpretation are well documented. Therefore, a new and valid finding such as two -part

57:13

Romans is rare but very possible. Now, I don't know where Jason Brett is going to be going.

57:22

Like I said, the second video he starts using sources that I don't think he ever would have touched just a few months ago.

57:31

But, who knows where it's going to go. And is already making all sorts of claims and Brent Ley does too about what was going on in the

57:38

Church of Rome and just theories that they just throw out there and then take that as an established fact and build the next thing on it.

57:46

But look, this entire thing is based on this ambiguous antecedent assertion.

57:55

Jason Brett could not identify an antecedent in Greek if his life depended upon it. He can't read the language.

58:01

He doesn't know the forms. He doesn't know how adjectives and adverbs are supposed to agree and how they're supposed to agree and how forms of agreement are to be recognized.

58:11

He doesn't know any of that kind of stuff. And I don't know that Brent Ley does either. You could take basic level

58:17

Greek and still not be able to deal with the text on this level. But the whole theory is based on this.

58:25

So, first thing I'm going to say right now, there is no ambiguous antecedent. The entire theory is bogus.

58:32

Bogus on its face. This is the foundation. If this is untrue, Jason is wasting his time.

58:40

And he is. So, let's take a look at it. Let's go to the big board.

58:47

I'm so glad to be able to stand. I can tell you, if you want to see something humorous, go to Apologia's page,

59:02

YouTube page. I preached. I'm going to be preaching Sunday, believe it or not. But, I preached two weekends ago.

59:15

And it was right after surgery. I had surgery Thursday and I preached on Sunday. And when you see me holding on to that four times, maybe five,

59:29

I said to the deacons in our Facebook thing, if my eyes had crossed and I had collapsed during that sermon,

59:41

I hope we monetized the video because it would have provided us enough income for a year. It really would have.

59:51

That's why people watch NASCAR. They're watching NASCAR, waiting for the next accident, and they would have been watching for me to collapse.

59:58

And it would have been a hit. It really would have been. Anyways, so, let's get the cursor over here.

01:00:12

I'm sorry, but I've got to be able to move. Paul, a slave of Christ Jesus.

01:00:20

Oh, by the way, he makes some comments about this. So all this little book is, is just little snippet claims.

01:00:35

So, verses 1 -2. Paul, a slave of Christ Jesus, called his apostle, having been set apart for the gospel of God, which he promised beforehand through his prophets in the

01:00:46

Holy Scriptures, concerning his son who was born in the seed of David. Here is the comment that Lay makes.

01:00:53

Called the apostle, set apart, which he promised beforehand through his prophets in the Holy Scriptures. By beginning with his qualifications,

01:01:00

Paul alludes to the importance of his distinctive Jewish heritage and his calling.

01:01:07

Paul sees himself as one foreknown. Really? Okay.

01:01:17

Um, actually, he sees himself as having been set apart for the gospel of God.

01:01:23

He is an apostle, so he's establishing his apostolic credentials. And he's saying that the gospel of God was what was promised beforehand through his prophets in the

01:01:35

Holy Scriptures. So what he's saying is, there is a consistency. This is very, very important. I mean, one of the key attacks upon the

01:01:44

Christian faith in the history of the church, from Gnosticism, was going to be this separation of the

01:01:53

God of the Old Testament from God the Father of the New Testament. That's the essence of Marcion and Valentinus and all the

01:02:02

Gnostics of the second and third centuries. But here, this gospel,

01:02:08

Paul is saying, he promised beforehand through his prophets in the Holy Scriptures concerning his son, who was born in the seed of David, according to the flesh, who is designated as the son of God in power, according to the spirit of holiness.

01:02:24

By the resurrection from the dead, Jesus Christ our Lord. So, I guess we obviously could stop and do much with this, but there's no commentary made on this in the book.

01:02:39

Through whom we received grace and apostleship for the obedience of faith among all the

01:02:47

Gentiles for the sake of his name, among whom you are the called of Jesus Christ.

01:02:55

So let's find the button here.

01:03:03

Alright. Now, here is so, here is

01:03:18

Lay's commentary. Note that Paul is not speaking to the

01:03:23

Gentiles in first person, but instead he begins speaking about the Gentiles.

01:03:29

This is a clear indication he begins his writing speaking to the Jewish believers. Paul did not say, we received grace and apostleship to call you to obedience.

01:03:39

Now, this is how you do eisegesis, this is how you twist the scriptures. Jesus Christ our

01:03:45

Lord, through whom we, the apostles, received grace and apostleship for the obedience of faith, and man,

01:03:55

I'd like to stop and start preaching about all this stuff, but I can't, among all the

01:04:01

Gentiles. Okay. Well, I guess

01:04:12

I should have tested this. Thank you.

01:04:19

Pen. Blue, please. Use that. Among all the

01:04:29

Gentiles. Okay. Now, you can say nations,

01:04:37

Gentiles, nations, but the point is that Paul is set apart as the apostle to the

01:04:46

Gentiles. That doesn't mean that he didn't preach to Jews. That doesn't mean he did not go into synagogues.

01:04:52

But, he was seen, we see from the book of Acts, as the one, really the missionary, the tip of the spear, going out to the nations, the

01:05:03

Gentiles, and calling them to obedience of faith.

01:05:11

The obedience of faith. There's some people that get really nervous by that phrase.

01:05:18

Sorry, Holy Spirit gave it, I'm not going to be nervous about it. Since faith is a gift of God, it comes with regeneration, obedience, new nature, that's how you balance all these things.

01:05:33

For the sake of his name, among whom, among whom, en hois.

01:05:46

Okay. Among whom, you also are the called of Jesus Christ.

01:06:00

The clay toy. Now, I could run over to 1 Corinthians, show you these are

01:06:08

Jews and Gentiles together, but who is being addressed here? Obedience of faith among all the

01:06:16

Gentiles, among whom, Gentiles, you are the called of Jesus Christ.

01:06:23

It's right there. The theory's dead. The theory's dead. It's right there.

01:06:32

Jason? Do you see it? Do you see it, Jason? Among whom, you, you are the called of Jesus Christ.

01:06:44

Among the Gentiles. Hello? That's why no one's ever accepted this, guys.

01:06:52

Because it doesn't make any sense. It's just that bad.

01:07:03

And those of you who claim to be provisionists and claim that you are standing on the shoulders of scholarship before you, you should be the first one standing up and telling these guys, hey guys, cool it.

01:07:18

That's dumb. You shouldn't be doing that. But you're not doing it. I don't see you doing it. If someone's doing it, someone show it to me.

01:07:25

Could someone send me where other provisionists who maybe actually paid attention in seminary or something like that realize this is ridiculous and they're going, yeah guys, this is bad news.

01:07:42

Okay. But we're not done yet. Come on. Thank you.

01:07:49

Let's use a different color here. Because I like colors. I like Coogee sweaters. Among whom you also are the called of Jesus Christ among the

01:08:00

Gentiles to all who are beloved of God in Rome.

01:08:08

Who's this written to? To Jewish believers. No! It's to all who are beloved of God in Rome.

01:08:17

You take this wacko theory and you're now saying that the Jewish believers have a special place.

01:08:25

They are especially beloved of God in Rome, right? You're creating the very division the book is meant to preclude.

01:08:35

You're turning it upside down. What are you doing? Well, we've got to get around.

01:08:40

You know what? By the way, I want to mention this. I'm not even looking at the clock. I don't care. I wanted to mention this.

01:08:48

By the way, I really appreciate the t -shirt, Christ is King, from a brother I had lunch with in San Antonio?

01:08:56

Pastor there. Good folks. Just happened to see that over there.

01:09:05

And that distracted me. This theory, this perspective by making the

01:09:14

Jews the subject of everything here gives them a special standing that would have caused jealousy from the

01:09:25

Gentile. So it would have... There's this whole theory that they're developing and I'm sure it will be started in the second video and stuff like that about this division in Rome.

01:09:39

And what they're talking about is they're talking about in 8049 Claudius kicked the

01:09:45

Jews out of Rome. Now it's interesting. Was it in this one?

01:09:50

I think it's in the Kindle. Yeah, it's in the

01:09:59

Kindle one. There was an expulsion and it's in the

01:10:05

Kindle one where it says that Claudius did it because of divisions in the

01:10:11

Christian Church. Which is so absurd. It's not even funny.

01:10:18

There is no evidence whatsoever that it was divisions in the

01:10:23

Christian Church. As if the Christian Church was even large enough for Claudius to have cared about what divisions they had going on in the house churches in Rome.

01:10:35

It was because there was debates going on between the Christians and the

01:10:40

Jews who weren't believers. And he got tired of all the argumentation. We see it in Paul's life.

01:10:46

And so he kicks the Jews out. Now would that have included Jewish Christians? Did the

01:10:52

Romans know the difference? Could they tell the difference? Would it have included some?

01:10:59

Maybe not others? Yeah, maybe. But this theory says that there's this church split.

01:11:06

And Jason Bretta has this in the second video. There was a church split. No there wasn't.

01:11:12

That's just... What's a church split? Sadly, we all know what they are. One of the toughest things to ever have to walk through.

01:11:21

Church splits. But that's division within the fellowship. That's where you have separation of fellowship.

01:11:29

You have one group goes over here and one group goes over there. And some of the elders go here and some of the elders go there. And that's a church split.

01:11:36

When the emperor kicks Jews out of Rome, that's not a church split. If some of the people in the church have to leave, that's not a church split.

01:11:46

I mean, let's just use language in a meaningful fashion here, shall we? That's not a church split.

01:11:53

That's not... A church split is what you have when Clement and again that's a traditional name attached to it.

01:12:02

But when you have 1st Clement, when you have the letter of the church at Rome to the church at Corinth, and they are remonstrating with the church at Corinth because the church at Corinth has kicked their elders out.

01:12:16

That's a church split. That's internal. That's something that has been caused by rebels within the church.

01:12:22

Not by the emperor kicking an ethnic group out of Rome. So again, just...

01:12:30

The... People handling subjects that they simply haven't taken the time to learn.

01:12:38

To study. It takes time. And they haven't done it. But they don't care because it provides them a way to deny

01:12:48

Calvinism. Well, okay. So just mess with history all you want.

01:12:54

Alright. To all... Does all mean all here?

01:13:01

Sorry. You guys are into the all stuff, right? To all the agape tois theu.

01:13:09

Beloved of God. Isn't that just the Jews? No! That denies the message of Romans.

01:13:18

That denies the message of New Testament. It's not just the Jews. But it includes the

01:13:24

Jewish believers. Whether Jew or Gentile. Called. 1st Corinthians 1 and 2. Look it up.

01:13:31

To all who are beloved claytois, haigiois

01:13:36

Let me ask you something. Haigiois, saints. Are all believers saints? Or are

01:13:42

Jewish Christians more saints than Gentile Christians?

01:13:49

This theory says this is Jewish believers. They're called saints. But the

01:13:54

Gentiles aren't called saints. They have a higher standing, right? No. The absurdity is absolutely patent.

01:14:03

That's why you won't find it in the commentaries. It's not because they're just blindly following some tradition.

01:14:11

That's absurd. The text doesn't substantiate what's being forced upon it by this theory.

01:14:19

Now. Get rid of that.

01:14:27

Roll her up here. Grace to you and peace from God our

01:14:32

Father and the Lord Jesus Christ that grace to you is to whom?

01:14:39

All who are at Rome. All who are at Rome. That's who's being addressed. This is to the church at Rome.

01:14:46

This is not disputable. This is not debatable. It's not even debatable.

01:14:51

It would be a waste of time. It's... Okay. Grace to you and peace.

01:14:58

There's the you. There's the you. Okay? Grace to you.

01:15:05

I don't have it up right now. There. To you. Kades Kairene Our Lord Jesus Christ.

01:15:15

Not just the Jews. Everybody in the church. There's one church.

01:15:21

Primarily Gentile but there's Jews and Christians in one. Alright? First I thank my

01:15:30

God through Jesus Christ for you all. You all.

01:15:36

Not just the Jewish believers. Because your faith, was it just the Jewish believers faith?

01:15:42

Is being proclaimed throughout the whole world. Again. I'm going to demand that you be consistent because in the debate,

01:15:51

I haven't seen any of this stuff. Nobody has. It's a novel one -off, self -published stuff out here.

01:16:04

I'm sitting here trying to figure out what in the world is going on. What in the world is being said. I'm like so so everything in the first eight chapters is only about, so I just pointed out some passages that are so clearly universal to all

01:16:27

Christians. And Jason's like, well, no, I mean sure I mean there's certain things. Okay.

01:16:32

Give us the standard, Jason. Brent, whoever give us the standard.

01:16:38

How do we know? Here's what you're going to find out. Because when you encounter stuff like this, obviously your faith is the faith of all the believers in Rome.

01:16:52

I mean, you just have to sacrifice your brain on the altar to come up with anything else.

01:16:59

And so what they're going to say is, well, yeah, certainly some things are addressed to both groups. What's the objective standard?

01:17:05

And guess what's going to happen? All of this is to get around Romans 8 and the golden chain.

01:17:13

That's what they're trying to do. The elect is just the Jews. So they're going to allow this to refer to Gentiles and that to refer to Gentiles and that refers to Jews and Gentiles together until you get there.

01:17:29

Because that's the only reason anyone has ever thought of something this ridiculous is that it's an admission on their part.

01:17:38

This is an admission on Jason Brent's part that Romans 8 teaches divine predestination and election and they can't get around it.

01:17:47

So they have to change who it's about. It can't be about us today. So we've got to change what that's about.

01:17:55

That's an admission. Yeah, that's what those texts say. And if we don't change the audience, that sounds like Calvinism.

01:18:03

Exactly. Exactly. That's the whole purpose of the whole thing. First, I thank my

01:18:13

God through Jesus Christ for you all because your faith is being proclaimed throughout the whole world. For God whom

01:18:18

I serve in my spirit and the gospel of his son is my witness as to how without ceasing I make mention of you.

01:18:24

Always in my prayers earnestly asking. So Paul was only praying for the Jewish Christians, right? Got to be consistent.

01:18:32

Got to be consistent. So Paul would pray, oh I pray for the Jewish Christians in Rome, but I'm not praying for the

01:18:38

Gentile Christians in Rome. How encouraging the Gentile Christians. The majority of the people. Yeah, that's great. That's wonderful. I'm sorry.

01:18:45

I have no respect for this. You shouldn't. There's no reason to respect any of this. Is my witness as to how without ceasing

01:18:51

I make mention of you. Always in my prayers earnestly asking. Perhaps now at last, by the will of God, I may succeed in coming to you.

01:18:59

So he was only going to meet with the Jewish Christians? He wasn't going to meet with the Gentile Christians? I know.

01:19:06

I know. I didn't write it. I just have to read it, unfortunately.

01:19:13

For I long to see you. So he wants to come to you.

01:19:20

And we've been following the context down, right? These are everyone in the

01:19:27

Roman Church, right? This is all. All called saints in the

01:19:33

Roman Church. Is what we're looking at here. For I long to see you, all of them, that I may impart some spiritual gift to you.

01:19:40

Well, according to the lay Breda theory, Paul only wants to impart a spiritual gift to some of the people in the church.

01:19:50

You see how this would create such absolute havoc? It's just amazing. Imparts a spiritual gift to you that you may be strengthened.

01:20:00

Jewish Christians need to be strengthened. Gentile Christians don't need to be strengthened. That is to be mutually encouraged while among you by each other's faith.

01:20:13

So evidently, Paul wants to come to Rome and he wants to be amongst the

01:20:19

Jewish Christians. Sort of like when Peter and the people from Jerusalem withdrew from table fellowship.

01:20:26

Oh, and Paul rebuked him. Oh, hmm. That doesn't fit, does it? No, it doesn't. No, it doesn't.

01:20:35

Maybe on the 29th reading through, Brother Lay would have caught some of these contradictions. I don't know.

01:20:41

That is to be mutually encouraged while among you by each other's faith. Plainly, Paul wants to be in the congregation there in Rome, encouraged by their faith,

01:20:57

Jews and Gentiles, and they by his faith. That's how it works at my church.

01:21:04

You know, we had the Lord's Supper the night before last. And I was feeling horrible.

01:21:11

That was the night before surgery. I could barely stand up. But, you know, I went with my wife and my family.

01:21:19

We got in line and we walked down and received the supper. And there's all these people and I'm looking at one of our deacons, a former black

01:21:27

Hebrew Israelite. And we're all one at the table. That's what it's all about. Oh, no, no, no, no, no.

01:21:34

That's not what Paul's talking about. He's only talking to Jews. This should be condemned by every person with a scintilla of Biblical sense.

01:21:46

Jason, you should stop right where you are right now. Don't even put number three up. Don't even do it.

01:21:54

It's disrespectful to the Word of God. Disrespectful, the Word of God. To be mutually encouraged while among you, do

01:22:04

I need to show you these words, you, so that you can see that, you know, among you, by each other's faith, both yours and mine.

01:22:15

This is mutuality. Whole church. Mutuality. Whole church. This has nothing to do with Jews.

01:22:24

So, finally, and I'll bring up the thing here. So, let's see here.

01:22:29

I'll just put it right here so I can bring up the, okay, do it now.

01:22:38

Thank you. It's being somewhat disagreeable today.

01:22:48

Alright, so, let's, here comes the ambiguous antecedent.

01:22:57

So, let's go to verse 12. To be mutually encouraged while among you, we have established already, reading from the beginning, is this a problem?

01:23:15

Because provisionists don't believe that you should read it this way. You can just bop all over the place. You don't have to start at the beginning.

01:23:21

You don't have to start with Paul's progression of thought. You can just go anywhere. That's how this works.

01:23:27

We can do it in Ephesians 1, we can do it in John 6, just boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, all over the place.

01:23:33

Okay. While among you, by each other's faith, yours and mine.

01:23:43

So, yours and mine. So, we've got one group in view here. I do not want you to be ignorant, unaware,

01:23:54

Agnein. I do not want you, people he's addressing, to be ignorant,

01:24:01

Adelphoi. Are the Gentiles Adelphoi? Are they brothers? Because that's who he's addressing.

01:24:10

So, only the Jewish Christians are brothers, right? Be consistent. Bite the bullet.

01:24:16

If you're going to promote this kind of foolishness, then be consistent. Only Jewish believers in Rome in the first century were brothers.

01:24:23

Don't call anybody a brother. Don't call anybody a brother. I do not want you to be unaware, brothers, that often

01:24:32

I have planned to come pros humos, to you.

01:24:40

Did he plan only to come to the Jewish believers? That's what we're being told. That's what we're being told.

01:24:47

Come to you and have been prevented so far. It's once and twice.

01:24:55

It's an idiomatic phrase. So that I may have some fruit in order that some fruit,

01:25:05

I might have amongst you there is the ambiguous antecedent.

01:25:18

You know what Jason did? I don't know how many minutes he did this, but in the first video he quoted, had some female voice quoting.

01:25:28

I'm not sure if it was a computer thing or what. His whole discussion of ambiguous antecedents was from a book on English style.

01:25:42

Antecedents is determined by context, grammar, and form in Greek.

01:25:49

Not by citing an English style book. So here is your antecedents.

01:26:03

It goes all the way back. It goes all the way back. But there's even more.

01:26:11

This was a particularly poor verse for Brent Lay to choose for this.

01:26:20

Because that I may have some fruit among you also.

01:26:28

So the whole theory, the whole thing is that this is

01:26:33

Jewish Christians. Because it has an ambiguous antecedent. It doesn't. It's antecedent is not ambiguous.

01:26:41

But what's even worse is, let me use a different color here.

01:26:55

Probably some stupid telemarketer. But it's making the thing go meep meep meep meep.

01:27:01

Let's see if I got a different color here. Kathos.

01:27:09

Kathos. Just as also amongst the other

01:27:21

Gentile. You see, there is a term.

01:27:31

Loipon. Loipon is the neuter.

01:27:37

Loipos is the masculine. It's a very interesting term.

01:27:43

It can be used idiomatically in a number of different ways in Greek. So someone like Jason, who can't read

01:27:52

Greek, would look at the blue line Bible and wouldn't catch the idiomatic uses of the term.

01:28:01

So sometimes it's very frequently used by apologists and finally brothers. But when it has a noun like this.

01:28:11

Other Gentiles. Consistently, it's talking about a class of which you were just referring to a part.

01:28:22

Now you want to see how that works? I think I need to establish that. Because if this is true, then the entire theory is done and Jason needs to stop wasting his time.

01:28:37

But let me show you. Just go ahead and put accordance up here because I'm going to be going over to a different screen here.

01:28:49

So that's probably a little bit small. Let me blow it up for video purposes.

01:28:57

Here is our use of Loipos right here.

01:29:04

And you have just as amongst the other Gentiles.

01:29:10

The rest of the Gentiles. The LSV tries to be consistent and render it the rest of the

01:29:18

Gentiles. Okay. Now you can see for example, and the rest were hardened.

01:29:28

But you don't have a noun right next to it. But there are other places where you have that use.

01:29:36

So for example, 1 Corinthians 9 .5. Do we not have authority to take along a believing wife even as Hoi Loipoi Apostoloi.

01:29:46

So notice the noun follows right after Loipos here the plural Loipoi. The other

01:29:53

Apostles. So is he saying we're not amongst the

01:29:59

Apostles? We're a different group than the Apostles? No. He's saying the rest of the Apostles of which I am one of them.

01:30:06

Right? His whole point is I am one of the Apostles. I'm part of that group. Just as in 1 .13,

01:30:14

fruit amongst you as amongst the other Gentiles. You're Gentiles. You're Gentiles.

01:30:21

I'm addressing Gentiles. The antecedent is not ambiguous. In fact, it's specifically defined.

01:30:28

But if you can't read Greek, and I don't think either of these guys can, then you don't know what

01:30:33

Loipos means. And how it's used. Let's look at some other examples here.

01:30:42

2 Corinthians 12 .13 For in what respect were you treated as less than tas loipos ecclesias?

01:30:52

So you notice now we're looking at the feminine form because ecclesia is feminine.

01:30:59

So Greek has other ways of demonstrating antecedents and relationship.

01:31:09

Specifically gender very often. Gender and number. There are differences depending upon context and specific uses and things like that.

01:31:19

But that's what was so humorous, sadly, Jason, in quoting an

01:31:25

English style guide because English can't do that. English does not have the specificity that Greek does.

01:31:35

And so here you'll notice the noun is following right afterwards. So as less than the rest of the churches.

01:31:45

So the group is the churches and you is a subcategory of the churches.

01:31:56

Romans 1 .13 Gentiles big category, you the part of that big category.

01:32:04

Consistent usage. Did Brent Lay not know that? Probably not. Slept through that part of Greek?

01:32:10

I don't know. But any critical commentary that even comments that.

01:32:16

Most critical commentaries will not. I've already provided Jason with certain quotations from commentaries.

01:32:22

From people who actually know the language. Brent Lay says for 30 years I was a student of theology.

01:32:28

Okay. From people who were students of theology for 30 years that demonstrate that what

01:32:34

I'm telling you here is true. Alright. So the rest of the churches or how about Galatians 2 .13

01:32:46

Galatians 2 .13 and Hoy Loypoy Udayoy and the rest of the

01:32:56

Jews joined him in hypocrisy. Was Barnabas a Jew? Was Barnabas a

01:33:03

Jew? So the rest of the Jews So Loypoy Udayoy.

01:33:09

Large group. Barnabas. Part of that group. The rest of the Jews. See how it works. Right there.

01:33:16

I didn't make this up. It's Ah Um Now here in Ephesians 2 .3

01:33:26

you don't have anything but even as the rest or the others But here you've seen you know enough enough examples that when we go back here to Romans chapter 1 verse 13 that I may have some fruit among you also even as among the rest of the

01:33:49

Gentiles you also we've already established going all the way back to the beginning this is the entire church at Rome.

01:34:01

Jews and Gentiles together all who are called in Christ Jesus this is the you even as among the rest of the

01:34:10

Gentiles Gentiles big group you part of the big group so yes

01:34:16

Paul is identifying the church at Rome as a primarily Gentile church and he wants to have fruit amongst them.

01:34:24

He is the apostle to the Gentiles So let's go past it

01:34:31

Um I am under obligation both to Greeks and to Barbarians both to wise and to the foolish

01:34:40

Sounds familiar I've heard wise foolish Oh! 1st Corinthians chapter 1 which likewise identifies the called as Jews and Gentiles Interesting I am under obligation both to Greeks and the barbarians the wise and the foolish in this way for my part

01:34:57

I am eager to proclaim the gospel to you also who are in Rome. To you also

01:35:02

So the theory that they're putting forward how does it even if these are

01:35:08

Jewish believers they've already been evangelized right? So what does it mean to that in this for my part

01:35:18

I am eager to proclaim the gospel to you also who are in Rome. Well thankfully we proclaim the gospel to everyone in our church service every

01:35:26

Sunday Proclaim the gospel does not mean evangelize for the first time when you open the word of God when you make application of the gospel the word of God to your people you are proclaiming the gospel to them

01:35:42

Not a fly in here that's pretty cool Um and that's what Paul wants to do

01:35:47

I am eager so are you going to tell me that he was only going to proclaim the gospel to the Jewish believers?

01:35:55

There is not a scintilla of this theory that has has any value whatsoever

01:36:04

That's why it was never thought up until 2013 and it should have been forgotten the day after in 2013

01:36:12

It really should have So there is no ambiguous antecedent we know what the you is it's defined by loipos kathos is right there you can't get around it it's done it's dead put a stake in it it's done it's dead put a stake in it

01:36:29

Do you think that will happen? No It won't happen

01:36:35

Um Let me address one other thing here and I don't see here

01:36:46

Wow I've gone long haven't I Let me just do one other thing and maybe

01:36:54

I'm doing a little bit better than the last time you saw me coming out of the hospital yeah I'm very thankful to Dr.

01:37:00

Jones He's a very very good doctor Um I am very thankful to the lord for that as well

01:37:09

Let me address one thing really quickly and then we'll wrap up because I know I've taken plenty of your time there's a lot of you sitting there

01:37:16

Alright it's dead already It's not that's the problem

01:37:22

It doesn't matter how clear this is Calvinist Arrangement Syndrome can get past anything and like I said the very the whole reason why they would even glom onto such an absurd theory is because what they're doing is they're admitting yes that is what the golden chain would teach if it's about all believers and it is and it is and you can see that just go to Romans 8 are you telling me are you telling me that the

01:37:56

Holy Spirit only intercedes for Jewish believers with groanings that cannot be uttered It's blasphemy!

01:38:02

Stop it! Stop it! It's absurd! Ah But Dr.

01:38:13

Al Garza Now I haven't heard whether Dr. Garza I hope

01:38:20

Oh my goodness Dr. Garza knows biblical languages He knows

01:38:26

He knows he couldn't argue with anything He really knows But what he's done in some of his stuff is to say

01:38:37

Ah but look at Romans 7 Or do you not know brothers for I am speaking to those who know the law that the law is master over a person as long as he lives

01:38:46

So here's a place he goes look at this So He'll use Torah Or do you not know

01:38:53

Adel Foy Now didn't we already identify Adel Foy? Yeah we did back in the beginning I am speaking to those who know the

01:39:03

Torah And see He goes see there it is Paul says

01:39:08

I'm only speaking to Jews here Ah I had a quote

01:39:15

Actually Chris pulled it up Who was it from? Was it?

01:39:22

Oh it was Hodge I think it was Hodge One of the things that he said

01:39:27

The Gentile believers in Rome can certainly be credited with the knowledge of the Old Testament Because what in the world are they reading?

01:39:35

What was the church service at this point in time What did they have?

01:39:41

They had the Greek Septuagint Greek Septuagint of what? The Tanakh The Torah Nevim and Ketuvim They're reading the

01:39:48

Greek Septuagint And that means they're reading Moses So all Paul is saying here is not

01:39:54

I'm only talking to Jews here He says I'm going to give you an example about how the law binds until death takes place

01:40:04

And he's going to use that as his example If you died the law then you have freedom and so on and so forth That's what the rest of the chapter is going to be about And so all he's saying is

01:40:12

Parathetically, I am speaking to those who know the law If you have read

01:40:17

Moses and that's what's being read in the church service then you know the application

01:40:24

I'm going to be making He's not limiting himself to just writing to Jews here I mean are you really going to insult the

01:40:32

Gentile Christians? They've just been sitting there in the church service and oh they're just reading from the Old Testament now

01:40:37

I guess I better not listen It's just At times

01:40:44

I I just shake my head What are you all thinking? But again, every one of these individuals adamantly detests

01:40:56

Reformed Theology Adamantly detests Reformed Theology And so they'll do whatever they need to do

01:41:04

Alright so There's so much more I mean there really is

01:41:10

There's Yeah Okay I found it

01:41:17

It was in There's a agree or disagree section in the beginning of this book

01:41:27

Agree or disagree Historical evidence indicates that the Jewish believers had been expelled from Rome by Emperor Claudius because of a disruption within the church

01:41:39

Really? What historical evidence is that? The historical evidence that I have read was that the

01:41:49

Jews were being troublemakers in Rome and that most people do theorize that part of that was disagreements over the claims of Jesus the

01:41:56

Messiah But that would not be disruption within the church at all

01:42:03

At least a portion of the Jews had returned upon the death of Claudius by the time of Paul's writing the church at Rome including

01:42:08

Aquila and Brazil True, but the idea of this being a church split is again absurd on its face

01:42:17

Let's just play with church history while we're at it Well guys, guess what? The professor of church history at Grace Bible Theological Seminary ain't gonna let you get away with it

01:42:30

So, there you go The foundations are gone and if these guys press on with this they are doing so By doing so they are demonstrating what their real motivations are

01:42:46

It's not to be honest with history, honest with scripture or to honor the scripture It's to dishonor the scripture so as to avoid the dreaded, horrible

01:42:55

Calvinism Which to me, again, I'm very thankful You guys are admitting

01:43:01

You are admitting all the arguments we've had in the past about what foreknowledge means or anything else, you're now admitting

01:43:09

No, actually, we get it Romans 8 does say what Romans 8 says and we've got to find a way around it

01:43:16

The fact of the matter is, you can't deal with the text and when you think about even with this you cannot deal with what

01:43:26

Romans 8 says about Christ's intercessory work Are you seriously gonna tell me that what

01:43:32

Paul was telling the church at Rome is that Jesus Christ is at the right hand of the Father interceding for the

01:43:37

Jewish believers only That's heresy That's heresy Can't you see what you're doing?

01:43:45

Stop Amazing, but I thank you for at least admitting that that is what it teaches and therefore you have to try to get around it

01:43:56

Ah Pent up energy What?

01:44:03

What? I'm... yes All 10 millimeters of it

01:44:10

Yeah Until the next one pops out and then we get to do it all over again

01:44:15

But anyways I'm glad to be back I hope you can put up with how long we went today and with a little bit of passion but I hope you hear what

01:44:23

I'm saying When you start When you get imbalanced and you start trying to mess with the scriptures so you don't have to believe what they're teaching in one area, it's going to impact all of it

01:44:39

It's going to impact all of it It really is Alright, thanks for watching the program